What is owning a theraphosa like?

[Fran]

You,Phoenixxaviere, are CONFUSING and MIXING stimuli and instinct with a bunch of emotions and capabilities an arachnid simply does not posses.

You are mixing some facts with your hibba habba ''science".
You can keep on yapping, but it is all that. Nonsense yapping. You might have a copy of the DSM IV, but certainly you show very little knowledge on animal behavior.

Stubborness, happyness,strong or week personality...Those are not qualities an arachnid posses. Now wether you want to comprehend it or not, its all up to you.

 

[DawgPoundSound]

As far as T. blondi, they, of course (being the largest theraposid) huge, and have horrible urticating hairs. I got in a shipment once of a dozen very large wild caught adults. I had to sex them in the bathtub as that was the easiest way to deal with them. After picking them up (all with varying degrees of resistance) and flipping them over to sex them, I moved them all to their new quarters until sale. The hairs were torture. I was itching for a half hour or more, even got in the shower it was so bad, trying to relieve the itching, but of course that didn't work, either. I had to wait for the itching to alleviate on its own. I've found that T. blondi are particular conducive to conditioning. They learn that when you open up the tank, that means either food or water, and usually its food they're hoping for. If it's not tossed directly in front of them for them to grab, they search the tank for it, which suggests memory and a certain degree of awareness. I've also bred and raised up this species, and they are very interesting to watch grow, and they start out pretty large a well, and grow quickly with a voracious appetite. One of the most interesting and pleasurable to keep tarantulas in the hobby in my opinion.

Incredible you can speak this. It is VERY true that tarantula seem to differentiate from certain vibrations. Here is my example to confirm this as well.

My B. boehmei rockets off anytime I open her enclosure. High tails it to her hide or the opposite end of the commotion. HOWEVER, my B. vagans sling used to do this early on, but now at 2" she simply sits put, or she's come over to where I opened her enclosure, and awaits the prey item. Even if it's just to remove a small embolus or refill her water dish she'll walk slowly to the area and watch closely. NEVER attacking or defending the area.

It's incredible and has me extremely attached to her moreso than my other T's. I've never tried to handle her, I simply respect her home, and it seems she respects what's being done around her. These tarantula are adapting. This is intelligence. If it's easy prey, no predator will run from it.

If they do not understand it's not danger, they will flee however, but this is dependant on the amount of interaction, and the actually temperament of that particular spider. All of their attitudes vary, which is also indicative of intellect.

Very nice and informative post. I appreciate that.:clap:

 

[Fran]

As far as T. blondi, they, of course (being the largest theraposid) huge, and have horrible urticating hairs. I got in a shipment once of a dozen very large wild caught adults. I had to sex them in the bathtub as that was the easiest way to deal with them. After picking them up (all with varying degrees of resistance) and flipping them over to sex them, I moved them all to their new quarters until sale. The hairs were torture. I was itching for a half hour or more, even got in the shower it was so bad, trying to relieve the itching, but of course that didn't work, either. I had to wait for the itching to alleviate on its own. I've found that T. blondi are particular conducive to conditioning. They learn that when you open up the tank, that means either food or water, and usually its food they're hoping for. If it's not tossed directly in front of them for them to grab, they search the tank for it, which suggests memory and a certain degree of awareness. I've also bred and raised up this species, and they are very interesting to watch grow, and they start out pretty large a well, and grow quickly with a voracious appetite.
.

First, I highly doubt they were Theraphosa blondi. But lets just leave that at rest.
Second, you can not, by any means, prove the bolded sentence.

When are you gonna understand that because you observed such behavior and interpreted it in such way, does not mean that is what in fact was?
How can you seriously tell us that you know that when you open the cage of your "T.blondi" she knows fod or water is coming???
Thats is ridiculous!!!!

I have had hundreds of different Theraphosa, all sizes and genders, so what?!
Once you open the cage a bit toO strong, and they kick hairs and hiss. Other times they just sit there. some other times react with violence towards the intrusive object....You cant possibly believe that you know what in the name of God they are "thinking"' or the nature of the particular reaction!
THERE ARE THOUSANDS OF VARIABLES THAT WILL TRIGGER ONE OR ANOTHER REACTION.

Are we serious here? Dont we really know how to differenciate what WE THINK IT IS from what IT ACTUALLY IS???????

Please seriously, if you truly think you know what are the meaning of their reactions the way you are telling as you do,
please let me contact Rick West, Steve Nunn, Dr. Bertani, Perez Miles...Help them out, because they would really apreciate it.

 

[salsalover]

First, I highly doubt they were Theraphosa blondi. But lets just leave that at rest.
Second, you can not, by any means, prove the bolded sentence.

When are you gonna understand that because you observed such behavior and interpreted it in such way, does not mean that is what in fact was?
How can you seriously tell us that you know that when you open the cage of your "T.blondi" she knows fod or water is coming???
Thats is ridiculous!!!!

I have had hundreds of different Theraphosa, all sizes and genders, so what?!
Once you open the cage a bit toO strong, and they kick hairs and hiss. Other times they just sit there. some other times react with violence towards the intrusive object....You cant possibly believe that you know what in the name of God they are "thinking"' or the nature of the particular reaction!
THERE ARE THOUSANDS OF VARIABLES THAT WILL TRIGGER ONE OR ANOTHER REACTION.

Are we serious here? Dont we really know how to differenciate what WE THINK IT IS from what IT ACTUALLY IS???????

Please seriously, if you truly think you know what are the meaning of their reactions the way you are telling as you do,
please let me contact Rick West, Steve Nunn, Dr. Bertani, Perez Miles...Help them out, because they would really apreciate it.

im fed up with you talking to us as if we're stupid just because we don't agree with your opinion you havent used any evidence at all fran so you can't lecture anyone about proving any claim at all all you've done is say "nu uh" a series of times to refute every claim we've made you want to lecture us about infantile there's nothing more infantile than being as close minded and as rude as you're being right now and it's starting to upset me i made this thread for a purpose instead all you did was make random assumptions about what the thread may have been about as opposed to what it's actually about not only that but fact is derived from opinion as well as science it doesn't matter how you try to twist and turn it you can't just negate someones personal experience

 

[DawgPoundSound]

There is far far too many opinions rampaging this site. It appears many people here claiming to be "oh so expert" on tarantula, have ZERO respect for them, or any animal for that matter. To say tarantula aren't intelligent is selfish and flat out stupid. And I'm not holding any punches with that statement. It's stupid and you are only keeping them in your homes to feel important over others who don't. You DO NOT fully understand the life or lives that you keep as pets.

Humans are egotistical, and refuse to use logic and reasoning. Using 7-10% of brain mass at any given time, that is the red flag that eludes us all, when thinking of intellect. Common sense is not what's being applied here. There are hundreds of different tarantula, all over the world. Anyone telling me that every single one of them all possess the same "lack of intellect" I'd tell you to your face, "you aren't very intelligent yourself."

I've read that tarantula brains are too small to endure any level of intellect. So with this petty logic, Dolphins and the Orca would prove THE most intelligent animals on the face of this Earth due to sheer size of brain mass and proven intellect. Also the Elephant would prove far smarter than humans.

It's this kind of illogic that damages sites like this with such a sheer volume of traffic, and people seeking to learn. There has been facts presented in this thread, only refuted with trolling and childlike behavior because one doesn't want to learn from another. They'd rather parade around like some Elitist know it all, in some website tarantula fraternity. Common people.

We can learn from anyone. And instead of holding onto rumors and opinions, why not expand your level of thinking from someone willing to teach? I've read silly bashing of people saying Honeybees effect their T's in a positive manner, to bashing someone for feeding them certain prey, to bashing people for calling a Tarantula intelligent. This is absolutely ridiculous.

Phoenixx and Salsa have presented something new for many of you to study or look into with your T's, rather than the same ole nonsense many of you carry on about of feeding them once a week, or mating them for profit, or battling who has the better enclosure for them.

RESPECT THESE ANIMALS! Learn from them, learn about them. Stop reading someone else's book and taking it as THE END ALL, when those people are simply sharing what they've learned, and are still learning as well. That was to Fran, when trying to tell someone to read a manual on tarantula. Why would he/she need to do that when they've informed to you already that they've raised, bred and cared for many T's over the years? This means they should write their OWN book. Or come on this site and share what they've learned through experience and study for themselves, which they were doing.

Is this so hard to comprehend for people? Must everything be an argument? A flame? A belittling? Must you present yourselves as "know it alls" in every single thread, just to have your names seen repeatedly?

Once again, I respect what Phoenixx and Salsa had to offer in this thread, as far as the intellect was concerned. But at the end of the day, the OP was simply asking about "Owning a Theraphosa.":wall:

 

[salsalover]

There is far far too many opinions rampaging this site. It appears many people here claiming to be "oh so expert" on tarantula, have ZERO respect for them, or any animal for that matter. To say tarantula aren't intelligent is selfish and flat out stupid. And I'm not holding any punches with that statement. It's stupid and you are only keeping them in your homes to feel important over others who don't. You DO NOT fully understand the life or lives that you keep as pets.

Humans are egotistical, and refuse to use logic and reasoning. Using 7-10% of brain mass at any given time, that is the red flag that eludes us all, when thinking of intellect. Common sense is not what's being applied here. There are hundreds of different tarantula, all over the world. Anyone telling me that every single one of them all possess the same "lack of intellect" I'd tell you to your face, "you aren't very intelligent yourself."

I've read that tarantula brains are too small to endure any level of intellect. So with this petty logic, Dolphins and the Orca would prove THE most intelligent animals on the face of this Earth due to sheer size of brain mass and proven intellect. Also the Elephant would prove far smarter than humans.

It's this kind of illogic that damages sites like this with such a sheer volume of traffic, and people seeking to learn. There has been facts presented in this thread, only refuted with trolling and childlike behavior because one doesn't want to learn from another. They'd rather parade around like some Elitist know it all, in some website tarantula fraternity. Common people.

We can learn from anyone. And instead of holding onto rumors and opinions, why not expand your level of thinking from someone willing to teach? I've read silly bashing of people saying Honeybees effect their T's in a positive manner, to bashing someone for feeding them certain prey, to bashing people for calling a Tarantula intelligent. This is absolutely ridiculous.

Phoenixx and Salsa have presented something new for many of you to study or look into with your T's, rather than the same ole nonsense many of you carry on about of feeding them once a week, or mating them for profit, or battling who has the better enclosure for them.

RESPECT THESE ANIMALS! Learn from them, learn about them. Stop reading someone else's book and taking it as THE END ALL, when those people are simply sharing what they've learned, and are still learning as well. That was to Fran, when trying to tell someone to read a manual on tarantula. Why would he/she need to do that when they've informed to you already that they've raised, bred and cared for many T's over the years? This means they should write their OWN book. Or come on this site and share what they've learned through experience and study for themselves, which they were doing.

Is this so hard to comprehend for people? Must everything be an argument? A flame? A belittling? Must you present yourselves as "know it alls" in every single thread, just to have your names seen repeatedly?

Once again, I respect what Phoenixx and Salsa had to offer in this thread, as far as the intellect was concerned. But at the end of the day, the OP was simply asking about "Owning a Theraphosa."

and i deeply appreciate all the ideas and facts you've contributed as well hun it's nice to know that at least 2 people out of this entire thread are open minded enough and sweet enough to value and respect each others opinions and respectable enough to speak the truth about what's been going on in this thread it's funny how some people think manuals and books are written in stone when really the "facts" theyre referring to are just opinions supported by evidence and published in the form of a book and then they adopt it as their own and suddenly no one elses views matter and the author has the final say it's sad to how critical thinking has gone down the drain so quick and it's a pity to see the majority doesn't feel comfortable questioning some of these scientists news flash: scientists are human they are not the be all end all and i would think you guys would have enough intelligence to respect someones opinion just because you don't see eye to eye with them

 

[micheldied]

and i deeply appreciate all the ideas and facts you've contributed as well hun it's nice to know that at least 2 people out of this entire thread are open minded enough and sweet enough to value and respect each others opinions and respectable enough to speak the truth about what's been going on in this thread it's funny how some people think manuals and books are written in stone when really the "facts" theyre referring to are just opinions supported by evidence and published in the form of a book and then they adopt it as their own and suddenly no one elses views matter and the author has the final say it's sad to how critical thinking has gone down the drain so quick and it's a pity to see the majority doesn't feel comfortable questioning some of these scientists news flash: scientists are human they are not the be all end all and i would think you guys would have enough intelligence to respect someones opinion just because you don't see eye to eye with them

You tell those who rebut your opinions that they are "ignorant, rude, etc." but so warmly welcome the comments that support your ludicrous opinions.

While I agree that Tarantulas can be conditioned, over repeated actions(I've had Scolopendra Hardwickei, centipedes, begin searching for food everytime I open their containers, since I always move them and open them in the same way), but this does not mean they have the intelligence to recognize me as an owner that feeds and keeps them.
All they realize is that there is food coming, because they sense these vibrations.
But to say they can learn, like a dog or a cat, is just plain stupid.

These animals do what they do, only to survive, not to enjoy, play, or make owners happy.

 

[salsalover]

You tell those who rebut your opinions that they are "ignorant, rude, etc." but so warmly welcome the comments that support your ludicrous opinions.

While I agree that Tarantulas can be conditioned, over repeated actions(I've had Scolopendra Hardwickei, centipedes, begin searching for food everytime I open their containers, since I always move them and open them in the same way), but this does not mean they have the intelligence to recognize me as an owner that feeds and keeps them.
All they realize is that there is food coming, because they sense these vibrations.
But to say they can learn, like a dog or a cat, is just plain stupid.

These animals do what they do, only to survive, not to enjoy, play, or make owners happy.

oh here we go another "nu uh" and yes i am going to welcome people who value my opinion and respect my point of view as opposed to people who have called me all sorts of names just because i don't agree with them if anything you're guilty of the same thing with the opposing side you're valuing their opinion over mine simply because you agree with them and they agree with you and now to move on to your pathetic excuse for a rebuttal you make it sound like they're drones but the fact is there is more to them than most people think pheonixx,maudua and i have repeated ourselves several times if you choose to limit your self to a scripted opinion go ahead but new ideas and observations are the two things that enable science theories to be updated

 

[BobGrill]

Chris, if you'd like to refute my statements, at least provide something to refute it with, instead of your mindless drivel, seeking a laugh.

Psychology deals with human AND animal behavior, so actually it has a great deal more to do with intelligence of various life forms than does geology or geography.

And I will repeat myself, intelligence is measurable in PLANTS as well as animals. What do you think is smarter? Your rhododendron or your tarantula?

It's funny you mention what you do about your tarantula, even though it's in jest as an attempt to make me appear unintelligent. This morning, MY G. rosea, a red color morph, WAS playing with a ball of peat, rolling it around, pulling it to himself, using it as something to prop his feet on for a while and eventually discarding it. His tank has a mixture of desert sand and peat, and he chooses to sit upon the sand. However, he does APPEAR to enjoy moving this ball of peat around, probably half the size of his abdomen, and does so on random (or seemingly random) occasion. I guess he's either hungry, wanting to run away but instead clutches in terror at the peat ball, or maybe he's thinking about eating it. It's likely something instinctual, right? Like maybe he thinks he's a female and is envisioning when he'll be a mother, gender confusion. Hmmm...

That does not mean it was playing.Ts will adjust their habitat to their liking on a regular basis. It's instinct not emotion. Arachnids simply do not posses complex emotions like humans.

 

[micheldied]

oh here we go another "nu uh" and yes i am going to welcome people who value my opinion and respect my point of view as opposed to people who have called me all sorts of names just because i don't agree with them if anything you're guilty of the same thing with the opposing side you're valuing their opinion over mine simply because you agree with them and they agree with you and now to move on to your pathetic excuse for a rebuttal you make it sound like they're drones but the fact is there is more to them than most people think pheonixx,maudua and i have repeated ourselves several times if you choose to limit your self to a scripted opinion go ahead but new ideas and observations are the two things that enable science theories to be updated

LOL I don't think I ever called you anything.
In fact, I don't think anyone did. All we did was say that your OPINIONS are ludicrous, and are unsupported by science.

Of course, I do not know for sure, but I definitely agree more with Fran and such, simply because it is what we know about tarantulas so far.
If in the future tarantulas learn to drive cars and play table tennis, then you have every right to call me wrong, and I will accept it.

I really wish I could believe that tarantulas could play, and recognize their owners, and that my OBT would not try to rip my head off and that I could train it like a guard dog, but I can't.

 

[DawgPoundSound]

You tell those who rebut your opinions that they are "ignorant, rude, etc." but so warmly welcome the comments that support your ludicrous opinions.

While I agree that Tarantulas can be conditioned, over repeated actions(I've had Scolopendra Hardwickei, centipedes, begin searching for food everytime I open their containers, since I always move them and open them in the same way), but this does not mean they have the intelligence to recognize me as an owner that feeds and keeps them.
All they realize is that there is food coming, because they sense these vibrations.
But to say they can learn, like a dog or a cat, is just plain stupid.

These animals do what they do, only to survive, not to enjoy, play, or make owners happy.

This is hypocritical to a cosmic level. You stated that it doesn't mean they have intelligence, yet you say in the same sentence that the T RECOGNIZES that food was coming when you open the enclosure. LMAO Are you reading what you wrote hear? You are agreeing with Salsa and proving he/she correct. Your very statement indicated the Tarantula learned and therefore reacted accordingly. That is intelligence.

The problem here is a group of you, REFUSE to accept others knowledge of tarantula outside of what you THINK you know, or CLAIM to know and it eats you up inside to the point you bash and belittle them for no reason.

If you took the time to rationalize, you'd see you are actually agreeing and presenting facts from your experience to back it up.

 

[Chris_Skeleton]

Hey my G. pulchripes is pretty smart. Maybe she could teach you a thing or two about capitalization, punctuation, run on sentences and such.

 

[micheldied]

This is hypocritical to a cosmic level. You stated that it doesn't mean they have intelligence, yet you say in the same sentence that the T RECOGNIZES that food was coming when you open the enclosure. LMAO Are you reading what you wrote hear? You are agreeing with Salsa and proving he/she correct. Your very statement indicated the Tarantula learned and therefore reacted accordingly. That is intelligence.

The problem here is a group of you, REFUSE to accept others knowledge of tarantula outside of what you THINK you know, or CLAIM to know and it eats you up inside to the point you bash and belittle them for no reason.

If you took the time to rationalize, you'd see you are actually agreeing and presenting facts from your experience to back it up.

WRONG, I never said they do not have intelligence, every animal and plant HAS intelligence. I said they do not have the intelligence to recognize individuals, nor the ability to LEARN like a dog or a cat can.

I said they could definitely be conditioned, after many repeated actions. And even so, many times they will act defensively and run. I only gave an example of conditioning, but I do not only keep one or two animals, and they do not all act the same way.

I do NOT agree that they can play with toys, or differentiate their owners from every other person.
Like I said, I wish I could accept it, but I cannot, not fully.

 

[DawgPoundSound]

That does not mean it was playing.Ts will adjust their habitat to their liking on a regular basis. It's instinct not emotion. Arachnids simply do not posses complex emotions like humans.

So according to this flawed logic, if my wife remodels the home, and I decide to move the furniture around, this is instinct correct? Since this isn't a sign of emotion. Also, this is from my wife OUTSIDE of this Forum, she asks, if tarantula doesn't have the capacity to present emotion, then how the heck can they show signs of "STRESS"? That's instinct? I can't believe I have stooped this low to ask things of such a simple nature.

So many of you are arguing with Salsa, and continue to say things that basically agree.

 

[salsalover]

LOL I don't think I ever called you anything.
In fact, I don't think anyone did. All we did was say that your OPINIONS are ludicrous, and are unsupported by science.

Of course, I do not know for sure, but I definitely agree more with Fran and such, simply because it is what we know about tarantulas so far.
If in the future tarantulas learn to drive cars and play table tennis, then you have every right to call me wrong, and I will accept it.

I really wish I could believe that tarantulas could play, and recognize their owners, and that my OBT would not try to rip my head off and that I could train it like a guard dog, but I can't.

and yet that's not the criteria we're using to define the word intelligence in this debate let's be clear about what science is before we say "it isnt science or it's not backed up by science" the whole root of science is a hypothesis without a hypothesis science cannot existt because it is soley based on a hypothesis being proved true or false pheonixx came up with a hypothesis and has observed the results science can be done outside a lab we come up with informal hypothesis everyday and we see the results people do informal experiments all the time a scientist is human just like evryone else they are not god they don't determine exactly what occurs just because they state a claim and based on the fact that pheonixx has been doing this for a long time he could write his own book so i would think that you'd be decent enough to respect his opinion but apparently decency is dead and then you mentioned what we know about tarantulas so far but how can knowledge increase when you don't open yourself up to knew ideas maybe it's all you know so far because you attack anyone that doesn't agree with you and socially rape people for expressing an unrecognized idea

 

[xhexdx]

So according to this flawed logic, if my wife remodels the home, and I decide to move the furniture around, this is instinct correct? Since this isn't a sign of emotion. Also, this is from my wife OUTSIDE of this Forum, she asks, if tarantula doesn't have the capacity to present emotion, then how the heck can they show signs of "STRESS"? That's instinct? I can't believe I have stooped this low to ask things of such a simple nature.

So many of you are arguing with Salsa, and continue to say things that basically agree.

What you're doing is called anthropomorphizing. Comparing humans to tarantulas is what's flawed.

salsa - If you want anyone to take you seriously, maybe you could start by using some punctuation? Just a friendly suggestion, as I'm not going to take the time to try and decipher your posts. Sorry.

 

[Fran]

So according to this flawed logic, if my wife remodels the home, and I decide to move the furniture around, this is instinct correct? Since this isn't a sign of emotion. Also, this is from my wife OUTSIDE of this Forum, she asks, if tarantula doesn't have the capacity to present emotion, then how the heck can they show signs of "STRESS"? That's instinct? I can't believe I have stooped this low to ask things of such a simple nature.

So many of you are arguing with Salsa, and continue to say things that basically agree.

This clearly is way over your knowledge on this subject,at least based on what you just posted here.
You clearly dont know what stress means when talking about animals.


The only problem here is that those who claim to be open minded are in fact the ones with their minds blind.

We are not dissrespecting this animals, neither we have less appreciation towards them, but we do seem to have more of a mature view of the facts and still keep them and take care of them even though we are educated enough to have a clear grasp of what an arachnid can and simply can not do.

 

[Draiman]

I can't believe I have stooped this low to ask things of such a simple nature.

Eh? Who was the one running around yelling "ELITIST" not too long ago?

:clap:

Thanks for the laugh. All of your posts are full of ignorance, stupidity, stubborness and a very conspicuous inability to appreciate irony.

 

[DawgPoundSound]

What you're doing is called anthropomorphizing. Comparing humans to tarantulas is what's flawed.

salsa - If you want anyone to take you seriously, maybe you could start by using some punctuation? Just a friendly suggestion, as I'm not going to take the time to try and decipher your posts. Sorry.

Well since you took the time to Google a big word to describe my participation, could you do the same for chris_skeleton? Or is he part of the AB Tarantula Fraternity that you must be ritualed in to garner some human level of respect? It's like a huge gang war. Elitists vs the Humble truth seekers. LOL It's crazy!

 

[xhexdx]

There you go assuming things, and insulting my intelligence in the process.

Maybe you could actually start answering some of the questions I and others have asked you in this and the lost regalis thread? All you're doing is talking smack and offering nothing of substance or value.

Troll.