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I think a mod/admin should post in his review thread with some of this information and a warning.
US Dealer Involved in Smuggling revealed in court documents
- Thread starter KenTheBugGuy
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I am sure there's a lot happening that isn't going to be posted on the internet. Here's where I'm coming from (and I don't mean to single Ken out but he's the only one I know of who actually seems to be doing this as his main source of income).
Ken says he knew it was going on. It's his sole income. I would think that to protect the hobby (and thus his income), if he suspected someone was doing illegal/sketchy stuff and endangering the hobby and/or messing up the market somehow, he would report them.
AND HE MAY HAVE! I know that. I'm just going off what I'm looking at here. It just looks kind of bad, is all I'm saying. If someone is that sure that something is going on, it might be nice to warn the rest of the hobby somehow.
Now I have to wonder if the stuff we bought was legal, and that sucks. One of my main things is captive breeding, and who knows now if that stuff was?
Anyway I'm not trying to start an argument, that's just my view on it. If people suspected this was going on I would have appreciated some kind of heads up.
Ken says he knew it was going on. It's his sole income. I would think that to protect the hobby (and thus his income), if he suspected someone was doing illegal/sketchy stuff and endangering the hobby and/or messing up the market somehow, he would report them.
AND HE MAY HAVE! I know that. I'm just going off what I'm looking at here. It just looks kind of bad, is all I'm saying. If someone is that sure that something is going on, it might be nice to warn the rest of the hobby somehow.
Now I have to wonder if the stuff we bought was legal, and that sucks. One of my main things is captive breeding, and who knows now if that stuff was?
Anyway I'm not trying to start an argument, that's just my view on it. If people suspected this was going on I would have appreciated some kind of heads up.
hermzxd45
Arachnopeon
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- Jun 8, 2010
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so...
so what who cares... its not like he murdered anyone. i know some of you guys will still be buying from paul. paul is a good dude. ill still be buying from him. PAUL I GOT YOUR BACK!!!
so what who cares... its not like he murdered anyone. i know some of you guys will still be buying from paul. paul is a good dude. ill still be buying from him. PAUL I GOT YOUR BACK!!!
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I have not read all the documents, but I did read some of them. While Mr. Becker may have used slightly misleading package labeling (scientific specimens), I don't see that as anything I'd beat him up over. As for his being identified as the intended recipient of a shipment that didn't have proper permits - the permitting is done at the seller's end. If I sent one of you board members a package of illegal goods - would you feel that you should be arrested for receiving it? We don't yet know that Paul knew the tarantulas were being sent without permits.
Some people may hold it against him that the feds used his e-mail address for the sting operation, but I don't think Paul had a lot of choice in this.
I do find it interesting that Rick West, in the papers I read regarding his deposition, stated that in his opinion the Mexican Brachypelmas were wild caught, but he doesn't explain why. And other legal statements indicate they were not wild caught, but captive born. Anyone have clarifications on this point?
I also noticed that Sven had public defenders representing him. I hate to say it, but I think that explains why a more rigorous of effective defence was not mounted.
Some people may hold it against him that the feds used his e-mail address for the sting operation, but I don't think Paul had a lot of choice in this.
I do find it interesting that Rick West, in the papers I read regarding his deposition, stated that in his opinion the Mexican Brachypelmas were wild caught, but he doesn't explain why. And other legal statements indicate they were not wild caught, but captive born. Anyone have clarifications on this point?
I also noticed that Sven had public defenders representing him. I hate to say it, but I think that explains why a more rigorous of effective defence was not mounted.
I don't download anything off the internet... so someone please tell me what they say. i am very cautious... with all the viruses goin around, FB being hacked and stuff... so can someone tell me? I always thought Paul was a great dealer... i don't know what to say. he held a GBB for me for weeks. I have ordered from him several times, and that is why he held it. he told me he was glad to hold it for me, that it makes this hobby all the better to see people like me get so excited over a T. That same GBB just molted and i was so excited... til i read this.
Here's how I read this, if I'm interpreting something wrong will somebody please, PLEASE correct me.
An illegal shipment of T's on it's way to P gets nabbed at a customs location. The Feds put it back together and take it themselves to make the delivery. They deliver it, P signs for it and bang! Busted. So the Feds do some leaning on P and get him to admit he's done it before and the folks who have shipped to him. They then decide to go after "bigger fish".
The bigger fish S, gets an email from P, or someone acting as P, offering to send S a plane ticket, reserve a hotel room for him and ask him to come be a guest at P's new T store grand opening. Going to give S a tour of the great state of California. Plus P or the folks acting as P say to S "Oh by the way bring a brown box full of T's with you." S accepts the invitation and when he arrives in sunny California he walks off of the airplane to be met by P instead he's met by the people acting as P and bang! Busted.
That about right?
Wonder what the Feds spent on this travesty.
An illegal shipment of T's on it's way to P gets nabbed at a customs location. The Feds put it back together and take it themselves to make the delivery. They deliver it, P signs for it and bang! Busted. So the Feds do some leaning on P and get him to admit he's done it before and the folks who have shipped to him. They then decide to go after "bigger fish".
The bigger fish S, gets an email from P, or someone acting as P, offering to send S a plane ticket, reserve a hotel room for him and ask him to come be a guest at P's new T store grand opening. Going to give S a tour of the great state of California. Plus P or the folks acting as P say to S "Oh by the way bring a brown box full of T's with you." S accepts the invitation and when he arrives in sunny California he walks off of the airplane to be met by P instead he's met by the people acting as P and bang! Busted.
That about right?
Wonder what the Feds spent on this travesty.
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Within the first documented linked to, it states "PB admitted to SA Montouri that he, PB, utilized a number of techniques to avoid detection from law enforcement. Further, PB admitted that he told his foreign suppliers to identify the packages as “scientific materials” or “teaching supplies.”
He knew what was going on.
And before that it states "In efforts to avoid prosecution, PB started providing information on individuals he bought spiders from."
In order to save himself from trouble, he ratted out his suppliers. He had a choice- get in trouble with law enforcement or cooperate with the feds.
"PB"/ Pet Center USA has an import/ export permit so he knows the rules for the importation of animals into the USA.
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post
Bill ....Really? The court documents have Paul admitting to doing it illegal on purpose? Read the earlier quote from thebugwife I can go point out all the lines if you need be....page 5 has the first of many admissions I believe.
Did I ever really say that? I did suspect this was going on but had no evidence other than he was pricing things lower than I could ever price them importing them legal. He was also busted a long time ago not just recently so you know. As to knowing he had done this I was sure he had but had no evidence so could not post it till now.
Bill ....Really? The court documents have Paul admitting to doing it illegal on purpose? Read the earlier quote from thebugwife I can go point out all the lines if you need be....page 5 has the first of many admissions I believe.
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Patrick,
not really correct, see AphonopelmaTX reply
That would be correct
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Nope he didn't murder anybody that I know of, just threw a "business" partner under the bus, to save his own ass from possible jail time.
I don't think it's fair that legit dealers have to go through the hurdles and finacial strain of doing things legally while, he gets away scott free, when he clearly broke import laws.
Thats the way i see it, but then again Im not from CA ;P
Later, Tom
You're right, I misspoke. It was Syndicate. My apologies. I don't know enough about that person to know if this is his/her "job".
I just finished reading both of the pdfs and I'm pretty much done with Paul. I would have liked to hear that you reported him if you seriously suspected him of doing this. Even if it was just "Just a reminder that the guy with the really cheap stuff was busted for X, Y years ago" or something.
I would also liked to have gotten a heads up from someone who had more info than, say, me. But I also understand that 1. making accusations on the internet is just a bad idea, and 2. if anyone DID report him to the authorities, they couldn't also tell everyone on the internet that OH HEY HE'S IMPORTING ILLEGALLY AND I JUST TOLD THE FEDS, or their case would be screwed up.
As for him not being beaten up for "mislabeling" them-come on, man. That's seriously jacked up, especially since he not only did it himself (I'm thinking about the part with the pens), but he encouraged his suppliers to do the same. I understand wanting to make a profit but you know what? If doing it legally means prices go up, that's the way it goes! Customers might complain but if they want the stuff, they have to pay for it. That includes shipping and importation fees. I looked into importation myself and decided against it because it was too costly, and because big-name dealers like Ken and Paul and James (when he was around) were doing it and I could buy from them and not deal with the hassle. If he couldn't deal with the cost, he should have made the same decision.
---------- Post added at 09:02 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:00 PM ----------
Exactly!! That says what I was trying to, only with more sense.
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Does anyone know if Sven has a website, I'm just curious since his very famous in Europe but I never heard of him before this whole thing happened. I want to know what kind of person he is.
Cuddly Cobalt
Arachnosquire
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after reading this I am very confused, is this about Sven or PB? Was Sven illegally importing Ts for Paul and now Paul snitched on Sven to protect himself from going to jail? Can somebody please clear this up for me? thanks
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Take out the trash
I saw this happening several years ago and warned the hobby. Nobody wanted to believe it. Mostly because many newbies in a bad economy don't care where Paul got his stock from as they shopped for the cheapest price not caring if the stock was legally brought into the country.
Our hobby and trade has been hurt. Legitimate importers and dealers have had their names smudged so Paul could save his own tail. The truth is now out. Thank you Ken for posting the docs. In about three months, a ton of more explosive facts will come out about this.
Anymore propaganda and lies? Nuff said. Take out the trash.
I saw this happening several years ago and warned the hobby. Nobody wanted to believe it. Mostly because many newbies in a bad economy don't care where Paul got his stock from as they shopped for the cheapest price not caring if the stock was legally brought into the country.
Our hobby and trade has been hurt. Legitimate importers and dealers have had their names smudged so Paul could save his own tail. The truth is now out. Thank you Ken for posting the docs. In about three months, a ton of more explosive facts will come out about this.
Anymore propaganda and lies? Nuff said. Take out the trash.
MrEMojo
Arachnosquire
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This thread is here to inform people of PB's involvement in this crime in my eyes.
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More power to you, I'm sure HE WONT HAVE YOUR BACK. My question to Paul is were you allow to keep all those illegal spider that you brought in, to resell to the public?
Jose Berrios
Exoskeleton Invertebrates
MrEMojo
Arachnosquire
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The documents say they resided in his mother's house.
It also states that they were "abandoned" to the officers
Come on man, that's not really fair now is it? I suspect most people new or otherwise bought from petcenter usa because he had great prices and as many positive reviews (from respected members of the hobby and new people alike) as any dealer. Saying you saw it coming is one thing but don't blame it on people that only knew what they read in reviews on this site and many others. That said I'm glad I hadn't placed an order with him yet.
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I agree Chris.
Jose Berrios
Exoskeleton Invertebrates
---------- Post added at 09:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:42 PM ----------
Thanks for the feedback.The documents say they resided in his mother's house.
Jose Berrios
Exoskeleton Invertebrates
---------- Post added at 10:02 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:45 PM ----------
I'm willing to bet that Paul will not respond to any of this and if he does I will give up one of my P. metallica females for free I'll give it to the first person that emails me with the information. You pay for the shipping cost......... As long as the moderators are willing to let the public answer back to his post so how about it Paul talk to us and explain yourself? Please Paul no propaganda..
Jose Berrios
Exoskeleton Invertebrates
hombrearania1@hotmail.com
801 809 6128
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