The Grammostola pulchra myth

[x Mr Awesome x]

Funny you should correct an error in my post - I'll go ahead and turn yours red. Also, while we're correcting...it's spelled Grammostola.

Let me know when you get Talon's poop off your nose, and we can talk like adults.

Thanks for the correction. it's the biggest contribution to this thread you've made so far. I only highlighted yours so that it would make sense in the way I felt you intended it to. And that last comment is a priceless contradiction. Kudos. Funny how you can't seem to address any of my actual points Joe, go figure.


Steve's records prove that it can be done. That's all. Lots of people on here probably don't realize that because of the reputation of the Grammostola pulchra. How the heck anyone is managing to try to deny him sharing that is nuts to me.

 

[xhexdx]

You made no valid points, and your post correcting me was your biggest contribution as well.

Let me know when you have something to say that makes sense.

 

[Shell]

Steve's records prove that it can be done. That's all. Lots of people on here probably don't realize that because of the reputation of the Grammostola pulchra. How the heck anyone is managing to try to deny him sharing that is nuts to me.

Sharing is one thing, going as far as saying that pulchras aren't slow growers because of this one spider, is a totally different thing. He said it himself, that he kept it warm and fed it a lot. Unless you are totally new to this hobby, then we are all familiar that keeping them like that can speed up growth, regardless of the species, it's hardly a new bit of information.

 

[Mack&Cass]

I think myth was the wrong word to choose...it would be appropriate to call it a myth if they grew faster than that pokie example you posted...but they didn't, so relative to that, they're still slow growers.

I agree with Joe and Shelley, yeah you got them to grow freakishly fast, but that's not reason enough to go around saying they're not slow growers. If you could do an experiment with the pulchra against several fast growers and get the pulchra to grow quicker (with all specimens being given the same conditions and same amount of food and heat) then you could go around calling it a myth, but until then I suggest you reword your statements.

Cass

 

[Sleazoid]

This thread is a shining example as to why you should never get into a debate with Joe, you will lose.

 

[x Mr Awesome x]

You made no valid points, and your post correcting me was your biggest contribution as well.

Let me know when you have something to say that makes sense.

Joe, I suggest rereading my post. What I stated was simple. You're turning this whole thing into an argument about what to call the pulchra, slow growing or not. My point was who cares? You've turned the thread into something that it never was! Steve was stating that for him it wasn't a slow grower because of ideal conditions that instigated growth. That should have been the end of it. People would have maybe realized that the tarantula they were counting on growing slowly for them could potentially be induced to these circumstances for better results. I'd doubt everyone in the hobby would have called them fast growers like a P. murinus but maybe they'd have soaked in the realization that it's possible to have faster than normal growth rates. i don't understand what's not to appreciate about that! Anyone that isn't contributing positively to this thread needs to take a hard look at the fact that they're literally arguing semantics!

Should Steve have chosen his words more carefully? I don't think so. For him it makes perfect sense. If you don't like it, don't board it. Simple as that.

 

[B8709]

This thread is a shining example as to why you should never get into a debate with Joe, you will lose.

All men are fallible sooner or later. I don't know who's right in this case because I don't wanna read through this long & ridiculous debate.
Stop arguing. Kiss and make up.

 

[Shell]

maybe they'd have soaked in the realization that it's possible to have faster than normal growth rates. i don't understand what's not to appreciate about that!

As already stated, unless you are totally new to this hobby, then this really isn't new information. Not that it isn't appreciated, but what everyone is talking about is the choice of words. Saying that pulchras aren't slow growers because one happened to grow faster then others under "ideal" conditions, is what started this. The "argument" makes perfect sense to me.

Anyone that isn't contributing positively to this thread needs to take a hard look at the fact that they're literally arguing semantics!

I see it quite the opposite, the people that you feel are not "contributing positively," are simply pointing out the flaws of the initial statement, and those points of view are very valid to this discussion.

 

[TalonAWD]

Sometimes people do not read the entire thread but rather focus their comments on specific posts of the thread.

Let me spell it out for everyone once more.

Grammostola pulchra is just the one I chose to focus on for this thread. Many people say they are slow growers. Only a handful of people say otherwise. I made this thread to show that it can be done faster than what people state.

Reason is because I was asked many times. Theres no secret, just a reality. Growth rate regardless of species can be sped up if conditions are optimum. And buy Optimum I mean alot warmer temps and alot of food. Temps that are 85F or higher. (In my case sometimes alot higher)

It can be done so it shall be done. Just not many choose this route. And then theres those that just plain don't know or didn't know. That is my point.
Fast grower or slow grower....Plain and simple, theres always another way and the way I do it exceeds the speeds of the norm regardless of which species it is. To me it was worth noting and sharing for those that do not know.

And if your grew slow...I explained that with me and with my experience, with so many different species over the course of many years, Mine never grow SLOW or as slow as other claim theirs to be. And as always with me being anal about record keeping, I can whip out a molt record and pics to prove it.

Don't like the info? Step aside. Like the info, tag along for the ride.

And last, this was not an experiement. ALL my specimens have the same results. Maybe its the way I keep them:?

I'll quote again joes own words that shows he admits my methods goes with my reputation.

I am not saying Talon's spiders don't grow faster than an average keeper's spiders......... as I said, he does have a knack for growing them quickly.

 

[x Mr Awesome x]

Shell take a look at 80% of the threads in Q&D and TC section and it will be obvious that a huge portion of members are not so experienced and obviously don't know how to use a search function. While you may not have learned anything because you are astute with experience there are plenty of people that would have. I too was already aware that tarantulas in warmer temps with high feeding regimens would grow faster. I don't document it like Talon though. So I got on and showed some support. There are tons of worthless threads that dumb down the hobby and I'd rather see those scrutinized than something of some value or merit like this one.

 

[xhexdx]

I made this thread to show that it can be done faster than what people state.

The thread subject is...'The Grammostola pulchra myth'

First post:

I feel I should educate or shall I say Break this urban legend with proof with this species.

I say this with documented proof that the Grammostola pulchra is not a slow grower as many have you beleive. In fact after seeing this hopefully many will now see that its quite the opposite.

...and the myth of them being a slow grower is just that......A Myth.

Back to what you just said:

I made this thread to show that it can be done faster than what people state.

So why not just say that in the first place and save this entire debate? Because it was originally to debunk a myth, not to show that it can be done faster than what people state.

Shell take a look at 80% of the threads in Q&D and TC section and it will be obvious that a huge portion of members are not so experienced and obviously don't know how to use a search function. While you may not have learned anything because you are astute with experience there are plenty of people that would have. I too was already aware that tarantulas in warmer temps with high feeding regimens would grow faster. I don't document it like Talon though. So I got on and showed some support. There are tons of worthless threads that dumb down the hobby and I'd rather see those scrutinized than something of some value or merit like this one.

So what you're saying is by posting a thread about it, people who aren't experienced and don't know how to search will see it and read it, right?

Hmm...Talon isn't the only one who can toot his own horn:

http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=145454

Just because something was posted (or even stickied) doesn't mean people will read it and not ask the same questions.

 

[Anastasia]

Sometimes people do not read the entire thread but rather focus their comments on specific posts of the thread.

Let me spell it out for everyone once more.

Grammostola pulchra is just the one I chose to focus on for this thread. Many people say they are slow growers. Only a handful of people say otherwise. I made this thread to show that it can be done faster than what people state.

Reason is because I was asked many times. Theres no secret, just a reality. Growth rate regardless of species can be sped up if conditions are optimum. And buy Optimum I mean alot warmer temps and alot of food. Temps that are 85F or higher. (In my case sometimes alot higher)

It can be done so it shall be done. Just not many choose this route. And then theres those that just plain don't know or didn't know. That is my point.
Fast grower or slow grower....Plain and simple, theres always another way and the way I do it exceeds the speeds of the norm regardless of which species it is. To me it was worth noting and sharing for those that do not know.

And if your grew slow...I explained that with me and with my experience, with so many different species over the course of many years, Mine never grow SLOW or as slow as other claim theirs to be. And as always with me being anal about record keeping, I can whip out a molt record and pics to prove it.

Don't like the info? Step aside. Like the info, tag along for the ride.

And last, this was not an experiement. ALL my specimens have the same results. Maybe its the way I keep them:?

I'll quote again joes own words that shows he admits my methods goes with my reputation.

Steve,
may I ask how much higher over 85?
I happened to loose tarantulas to warmer temperatures

 

[Shell]

Shell take a look at 80% of the threads in Q&D and TC section and it will be obvious that a huge portion of members are not so experienced and obviously don't know how to use a search function. While you may not have learned anything because you are astute with experience there are plenty of people that would have. I too was already aware that tarantulas in warmer temps with high feeding regimens would grow faster. I don't document it like Talon though. So I got on and showed some support. There are tons of worthless threads that dumb down the hobby and I'd rather see those scrutinized than something of some value or merit like this one.

Trust me, I am forever noticing the "worthless" threads being posted.

I think the reason people (myself included) spoke up here, is because of the misleading way the initial post was worded (and the title of the thread.)

Maybe new people haven't yet learned what temps and lots of food can do, and that info is valuable, but it would have been much better to word the initial post better. Then when a new person is reading and looking for info, they would clearly see, that yes it is possible to speed up growth. However, they would also see (which they will now, thanks to the discussion being had) both sides to this, and that the pulchra is not typically a fast grower, and that there really is no "myth" to disprove.

 

[TalonAWD]

Steve,
may I ask how much higher over 85?
I happened to loose tarantulas to warmer temperatures

Up to 97F. If you lose tarantulas, maybe its something you are doing wrong. Slings and adults get the same temps. If I find a pic i'll post it, if not I'll take a pic and post it on a very hot day to prove it. After all I love proving stuff

 

[esotericman]

What species are we talking about Ana? P. subfusca would fold and die at "high" temps, where P. murinus (sloppy use of the binomials, I know) would not have an issue at all.

It'd be nice if we could stay focused on G. pulchra, but if it's just temperature we're talking about here, why bother? Warm tarantulas are physiologically "faster" up to a point. It's not a shocker.

 

[TalonAWD]

The thread subject is...'The Grammostola pulchra myth'

So why not just say that in the first place and save this entire debate? Because it was originally to debunk a myth, not to show that it can be done faster than what people state.

To me its still a myth even if you do not agree. Thats my view and I stick to it. For so long it has held that reputation. I prove otherwise and not just with this one species.

So what you're saying is by posting a thread about it, people who aren't experienced and don't know how to search will see it and read it, right?

Yes thats what I'm saying. Unfortunately most people do not search for this info because if they did, then they would see my countless post over the 3+ yrs being a member stating this same fact over and over again.

Just because something was posted (or even stickied) doesn't mean people will read it and not ask the same questions.

Right, hence why I post this thread. Obviously people are still asking me via PM how i do it.

 

[Anastasia]

Up to 97F. If you lose tarantulas, maybe its something you are doing wrong. Slings and adults get the same temps. If I find a pic i'll post it, if not I'll take a pic and post it on a very hot day to prove it. After all I love proving stuff

Really? you mean any tarantulas could be kept at temps is high as 97 and be happy and healthy in your care
oppose me possibly doing something wrong
Am not even sure if I got that right

 

[Draiman]

To me its still a myth even if you do not agree.

You can't accurately call it a "myth", because there is no common variable in your "experiment". If I kept a (normally fast-growing) P. murinus or a Psalmopoeus in the same conditions as you did with your pulchra, it would grow even faster than it normally would, and it would then make your "fast-growing" pulchra look a slow grower again. I don't think you ever understood what Joe was trying to put across. For a comparison to be fair you have to have a common variable.

Therefore, under the SAME living conditions, G. pulchra is a slow grower compared to the likes of P. murinus, Poecilotheria and Psalmopoeus. Your experiment did nothing to prove otherwise.

 

[TalonAWD]

Really? you mean any tarantulas could be kept at temps is high as 97 and be happy and healthy in your care
oppose me possibly doing something wrong
Am not even sure if I got that right

Its more maintenace to keep them at high temps yes, but I was adressing your statement directly. No T in my care dies through heat exhaustion. Period. If you would like proof, i will be happy to get a pic of the temp guage reading on a hot day.

Why debate against me if I'm telling you that I, me, do it and do it successfully. I do it and I do it successfully, if you can't doit thats ok. Just stating a fact. This does not make you any less of a keeper. I like strawberry icecream and if you don't thats ok. No judgement is passed upon you.

 

[Anastasia]

What species are we talking about Ana? P. subfusca would fold and die at "high" temps, where P. murinus (sloppy use of the binomials, I know) would not have an issue at all.

It'd be nice if we could stay focused on G. pulchra, but if it's just temperature we're talking about here, why bother? Warm tarantulas are physiologically "faster" up to a point. It's not a shocker.

Yes, that is correct
P subfusca is one of them so is Megaphobema mesomelas and many others