Price Isn't Everything

FryLock

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Il be getting some of these myself for sure, but when the price drops a bit (it allways does) untill then dont over look the "Poor man's" Cyriopagopus C.schioedtei, 6-10 slings/juv's of them you could have for the price of one bluey over here.
 

Mendi

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I think in the long run, I find that I'm partial to paying for quality... But, I'm also on a fixed income due to my ms. I've gotten a few great deals, gotten burned as well. Let's look at my B.smithi's for example. My 1st one Smitty, you've seen his pics, he was 3" whe I bought him, and cost me $10. I've bought -½"slings $25 each. I also bought a 4-5" female last year for $105, hmmm, donation to scam artist, bought a female from Hoke. Smitty needed a mate, and, well, B.smithi and emilia share 2 slots in my top 3 all time favorites. I know there will be some more $25 slings, as Alice will likely know many males in her life

My B.emilia's... Just saved up and went straight for a sexed female from Hoke's. She's young, so I feel there will be slings. I get the majority of my slings from Swifty, though I add a few to most all orders I get juvies, adult and sexed T orders, depending on budget. I've got a disorder that causes me to get the most out of next day shipping... $30 to send one T, feels high, but if I can add 4 slings, shipping is only $6 each. T-addiction rationalization in effect here. :eek:

I feel that others use this line of thinking too

G.pulchra... finishes all time favorite 3. I've got 3 juvies, 1st one a freebie, and from another hobbyist I bought 3 other sps from. Next 2 purchased as ½-1" slings, going rates. Latest 2 slings came from a good friend. My adult female, top quality Gearheart jewel. I'm not against a $5 though... I don't expect we'll see that price but every other blue moon. High demand and, well, Gramm's might be easy to breed, eggsac's though mpt nearly as easy

I've gotten a few bargain slings though that grew into species completely different from ordered as well. Thi dealer must have been this way often, and is no longer in business. $5 G.pulchra from someone who you don't know the name, maybe not a deal, trust reputations and that initial 1st gut feeling you get.
 
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Pheonixx

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breeding and prices

Hey all i just want to add" my $5.00" I am new to the hobby, i started in april of this year. I curently have 12 spiders 3 of which ae slings. most of my T's i have gotten from local shops being nice enough to order them for me. I purchased a A. versicolor from SSW when i first realized i wanted one. Just last month i bought 2 slings from swifty, N. chromatus, N. colloratovilosus (SP?) and got a B. vagans to replace my escapee that died. I got a good deal on the Nhandu slings and got the vagans as a freebie. I'd buy from either dealer again without a doubt. I have recently undertaken two breeding projects and am trying like hell to get the third species to mate(A. seemanni). Though the seemanni are severely uncooperative i can only gain more expirence from doing this. I dont have the capacity to handle 3 sac's but i know a few of the petshops will take some off my hands and perhaps the dealers will take an entire clutch for trade credit. Thus giving them a sweet deal and me getting a sweet deal and most likely spending more than my credit to get more T's. I have bred A. avic and G. rosea recently. I have been told many things about breeding such a common species, but how else am i going to learn? spend over $2,000 on a P. metallica pair? I would never risk losing such a fine spp to educate myself. Price attracts customers; why do you think so many people shop at Wal-Mart? when was the last time you or anyone you know went into walmart and spent $5.00? Probibaly NEVER; you buy other things too. Hobbyists like myself do it when we "shop" on dealers websites. Offering a good deal brings customers, It's the service and attention provided to the customers that keeps them comming back.
 

RichardDegville

Arachnoknight
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Just out of interest why are the Cyriopagopus sp 'blue' 400.00 USD
United States Dollars = 224.632 GBP United Kingdom Pounds when they only cost 80.00 GBP United Kingdom Pounds = 142.469 USD United States Dollars. Now I can understand some one making a few quid like selling them at £100 or even £150 each due to shipping costs ( cost me £60 from singapore ) and wanting to make a profit etc but to triple the price is a bit cheeky in my opinion.
 

Steve Nunn

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Hi Rich,
I think you'll find it like that with any species, particularly the Asian T's. They all usually start out in Europe, go through a few hands and end up in a hobbyists hands in the US at a far bigger price then anybody in Europe could get them for.

On the other hand, Aphonopelma can be bought for next to nothing in the States and I hear you guys have problems getting some of the popular US species at all.

Here's another example, how much can you get Poecilotheria subfusca for??? I bet half as much as in the States.

It's all relative!
Steve
 
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RichardDegville

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Hi Steve yeh I guess its true to a degree the only dear T's though out Europe at the mo seem to be brachys and pokies and the blues I bet the shipping charges would be well cheap for you if you could import the blues from Singapore huh lol but you never know you may find something better in the Australian jungle as its the oldest known to man then every one will go mad for them but cant have them LOL.
 

Steve Nunn

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RichardDegville said:
but you never know you may find something better in the Australian jungle as its the oldest known to man then every one will go mad for them but cant have them LOL.
Hi Rich,
mmmmhhmmm :D

Steve
 

Catherine

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I don't think someone selling cheap slings means that they are a bad dealer. I buy mine from a guy in Germany, and he is quite cheap, but every sling i have bought from him has been in excellent health. I've got some unusual spiders at a really good price.He has great knowledge too.

For me, and this is just my opinion, spiders of rarer species should be distributed as much as possible, to as many people as possible to increase chances of breeding and get more of these spiders on the market. just because someone doesn't want to buy or sell spiders for large sums of money doesn't make them less knowledgable or less dedicated to the hobby.
 

Wade

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I don't think anyone's saying that selling spiders cheaply is bad, in and of itself. The US dealers who ran into trouble were definately NOT trying to benifit the hobby by by becoming some sort of tarantula distribution service. They were out to make a quick buck by undercutting what other dealers were selling for. This is part of business, of course, but these guys cut the profit margin so narrow they were cutting corners in other areas. If you run a tight profit margin, you have to move more animals quicker. You can't afford to take time to properly sex the spider, or be sure it doesn't have mites, or even to be sure it's feeding and in reasonable health. Think of Wal-Mart again. I shop there if I'm buying a big trash can or a bag of frozen peas, but if I actually need quality or service I go elsewhere! Take packing and shipping, fewer and fewer of the orders from these dealers were being delivered sucessfully. When people complained that their spiders arrived dead, these dealers found themselves unable to replace them without going into the hole, so people got burned. Others sent money just as these guys were going under and they never saw any spiders either. This does hurt the hobby, because if I got burned the first time I ordered some spiders from an online dealer, I'd be hesitant to do it again! In this way, even the good dealers ultimately suffer. A few bad apples can spoil the bunch, as they say.

There will always be cheap spiders available, just not all species. G. rosea, B. albopilosum, A. avicularia etc. may not be bred much by the bigger dealers, but the hobbyist/breeders will fill the void and then some.

Wade
 
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Pheonixx

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Wade said:
This is part of business, of course, but these guys cut the profit margin so narrow they were cutting corners in other areas. If you run a tight profit margin, you have to move more animals quicker. You can't afford to take time to properly sex the spider, or be sure it doesn't have mites, or even to be sure it's feeding and in reasonable health. Think of Wal-Mart again. I shop there if I'm buying a big trash can or a bag of frozen peas, but if I actually need quality or service I go elsewhere! Take packing and shipping, fewer and fewer of the orders from these dealers were being delivered sucessfully. When people complained that their spiders arrived dead, these dealers found themselves unable to replace them without going into the hole, so people got burned. Others sent money just as these guys were going under and they never saw any spiders either. This does hurt the hobby, because if I got burned the first time I ordered some spiders from an online dealer, I'd be hesitant to do it again! In this way, even the good dealers ultimately suffer. A few bad apples can spoil the bunch, as they say.
Wade

Cutting corners with T's ? Yeah i'm sure some people do it but what corners can you really cut other than not feding the spiders? it's not like they need to have shots or be spayed or nutered. Caring for a tarantula has got to be the simplest thing in the world. If a dealer packs his T's poorly it will show when the buyer recieves the T. If a dealer at a show fails to feed his T's it will also show. If it has mites or nematodes a quick inspection of the T will show that too. I'm sure people who call themselves dealers have burned alot of people on T orders...you ever been to E bay? even on E bay you have like a 40% chance of getting taken for a ride. I recently got burned by a online dealer, not related to T's though. that lesson cost me 58$ but my recourse is she will be getting mail fraud charges for christmas. the statement "BUYER BEWARE" has been applied to online shopping many times. unless the site has an actual place you can visit you run that risk. most dealers have been bought from by other people in the hobby, and if one person got screwed it is not too long before people in the hobby know about it, this is a realitively small hobby. If a consumer buys a cheap T and it has nematodes, mites or is nearly dehydrated or underfed. that is their own stupidity, they should'nt be buying things at shows unless they inspect them. would you buy a car without test driving it?
I know you cant exactly check out a T when purchasing from swifty, southern spider works, or spidershoppe but they all have a reputation with the hobbyists, and upholding that reputation with us hobbyists is very important to them. If one of us makes an order from swifty for example (we all know swifty knows his stuff and is very fair about pricing and service) and gets a dead T in the mail and he did'nt replace it; how long do you think it would take to see a post about it on this website? and what do you think would happen to his buisness because of that? He would catch some serious flack from buyers and have to re establish alot of that trust with those that heard about it.
You cant blame cheap prices and stupid consumers for problems they dont look for before they make a purchase. If you dont inspect you car and it breaks down on the way home from the dealer thats your own fault for not opening the hood.
 

FryLock

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Steve Nunn said:
Hi Rich,On the other hand, Aphonopelma can be bought for next to nothing in the States and I hear you guys have problems getting some of the popular US species at all.

Here's another example, how much can you get Poecilotheria subfusca for??? I bet half as much as in the States.

It's all relative!
Steve
True and true iirc there have been very few US Aphono's on the market here, almost all the one's iv seen at shows over many years have been A.chalcodes, A.hentzi and the odd A.anax (rembering i was inactive as regards show going and buying/selling for 8-9 years someone will say there has been at least 20-30 species offered in that time :D ).

P.subfusca can sell as low as £10 (€15) for a sling over here and most iv ever paid for a spider myself was a sub adult female P.sub (£90 and i did not regret it) that said at the same year i got her sling's and juv's were still only £15 and £25 back then too

All said and done if you don’t like the prices of some of these uber hyped species or just can’t pay them just wait, this is a small hobby compared to say herp’s or bird’s and there are only so many of that number that will pay “early adopter” prices.
 

Wade

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Pheonixx said:
Cutting corners with T's ? Yeah i'm sure some people do it but what corners can you really cut other than not feding the spiders? it's not like they need to have shots or be spayed or nutered. Caring for a tarantula has got to be the simplest thing in the world.
It's true they don't need much care, but they do need SOME care. The guys that put themselves in a postition where the only way they make money is to move a lot of animals simply isn't going to have the time to even casually inspect the animals before selling. I suspect some of these dealers were pretty much selling animals right out of the box they were shipped to them in. I've seen severely dehydrated spiders being sold at shows, and I've seen soaking wet containers full of maggots with tarantulas in them. At a show, you can easily skip those, but if you're new to the hobby and you get a stressed, alost dead spider shipped, you might not recognize a poorly cared for animal when you see it. This can have the effect of turning off newer hobbyists altogether.

For the most part, this problem is self correcting. As I mentioned earlier, most of the worst offenders are already gone, killed by their own shoddy business pratices. At least one of them (who shall remain unamed) however, appears to be assuming new identities in order to rip people off.

Price IS a consideration when buying a tarantula, no doubt about it. It just shouldn't be the ONLY one.

Wade
 

tkn0spdr

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At least one of them (who shall remain unamed) however, appears to be assuming new identities in order to rip people off.
I'm not sure not naming them is a good idea unless you aren't sure about it. If you know of someone that's definatly ripping people off you should try to make people aware of who it is. I know if I did business with them and got ripped off and then you said, "Yeah, they rip everyone off." I'd be ticked at them but a little upset with you too since you knew beforehand.
 

Elizabeth

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That's why any buyer should be checking all the Seller Warnings/Inquiries here on AB and also the Dealer Reviews before they buy from an unknown.
 

JeffG

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Elizabeth said:
That's why any buyer should be checking all the Seller Warnings/Inquiries here on AB and also the Dealer Reviews before they buy from an unknown.
I agree 110%
 

xenesthis

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P. subfusca prices in the U.S.

Mr. Rourke and others:

"So, in your opinion (and anyone else's), can I expect sub-$100 subfusca in the near future, consistenly (in the US)?"

Yes, IF they are bred in the U.S.. I just can't see crazy $200 prices on subfusca if the adults were bred in the U.S. If somebody does it, they are milking it for all they can. The sad thing is they will get their buyers at that price.

When the P. metallica are bred and sold here in the U.S., I certainly hope the price will be under $200. If they aren't, well, I would not agree with that, but again, they will sell at that price too.

It's all about what hobbyists here get used to. I hate to see $2 spiderlings on the net and I hate to see $400 ones. I understand it's economics to a degree, but mixed inside is greed and the old standby truism, "there is a sucker out there for everything".

Let's hope prices come down on some of these over-hyped species soon.

Todd
 

Immortal_sin

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tkn0spdr said:
I'm not sure not naming them is a good idea unless you aren't sure about it. If you know of someone that's definatly ripping people off you should try to make people aware of who it is. I know if I did business with them and got ripped off and then you said, "Yeah, they rip everyone off." I'd be ticked at them but a little upset with you too since you knew beforehand.
This person has been named, in the appropriate forum. EVERYONE thinking about buying online should check out the 'seller inquiry' forum FIRST.
 

tkn0spdr

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This person has been named, in the appropriate forum. EVERYONE thinking about buying online should check out the 'seller inquiry' forum FIRST.
Thanks, being new to the forums myself I hadn't ever scrolled far enough down the list of rooms to even see those areas yet, I'll be sure to check them out.
 

Pheonixx

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all the more i can say is now that i want to get into a buisness breeding these things...they become a tax write-off! buisness supplies are a write off, can you even imagine somewhat FREE T's? you'd still have to pay state sales tax and such but wooo hooo. IMO all it will take is time and saturation of the market for prices to come down. the more species available the more people will have and the chances more people will breed them. In my situation i cant house thousands of slings so selling them to SSW or swifty cheap is a great deal. because i get a good deal, they get a good deal and quite likely the buyer will get a good deal because the dealer got them at a good price from the breeder.
Selling spiders cheap is the same as Wal-marts clearance aisles, overstock that needs to be sold to make room for new stock.
 
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