Poecilotheria

Cronoss

Arachnoknight
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Nov 6, 2002
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211
My 2 cents

I just wanna say:

I agree with Branden.I do not think Pokies are as dangerous as some people have been saying.
A P. regalis was my 3rd spider 7 years ago.Looking back,I did'nt know crap about T's then. I just liked the way it looked.
I have never been bit by her or anything eles in the last 7 years.
If you give them the respect they deserve,you won't have a problem.

What really bugs me is How some people use scare tatics
to talk other people out of buying them(You know who you are)
If you are too scared to own one thats fine.Don't.
But let other people make there own choice.
I don't think posting "Don't get one for youu and your family's sake...." is apropiate. It is not going to get out at night and hunt you and your family down in your sleep.


Bryan
 

genious_gr

Arachnoangel
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Jan 23, 2003
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955
The :confused: on my previous post was cause I didn't understand why I looked to have a "confident godlike attitute" I just said I'd take all precautions, and cause the rest of your comment's quoted, I didn't understand.....

Another thing that disturbed me and I orgot to mention before is that when Brandon expressed his opinion, people rather than just saying they don't agree, commented on his age. I guess if he was older, noone would say sth like" you don't have much Xperience".Since everyone says he respects him/his opinion, why does everyone comment it???

The normal conversation whould be:
A: That's my opinion
B: I disagree, I believe that..... cause.....
A: Yes but........
B: you are wrong, I still think.....

not:
A: that's my opinion
B: Your opinion is wrong, but it's expected cause you're only 16 and you don't have much experience.
 
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Nixy

Arachnoprince
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Cronos no one said anything about them hunting down a family in their sleep.
The family comments were because Kids do not understand a great many things and get into all sorts of situations in a heartbeat.
because their kids.

The hell with it.

The only damn thing that's being seen is attacks on age and fear of pokes and anything else is being disregarded.

I give up.

It's not like my opinion is worth two cents here any damn way.
 

genious_gr

Arachnoangel
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Jan 23, 2003
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955
Originally posted by Nixy
It's not like my opinion is worth two cents here any damn way.
Who said that? I didn't mean to make you feel that way, if it's me....
 

Code Monkey

Arachnoemperor
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@genius_gr - The only reason Brandon's age was made a part of the argument was *he* brought it up pre-emptively assuming that no one would take him seriously because of his age. In the absence of him spotlighting his age as an issue I would have never said diddly (since I didn't know). Since he did, right or wrong, I pointed out that a 17 y.o. doesn't have much credibility on making decision's for an even younger teen's parents.

@Cronoss, et al - Nixy is right, everyone seems blinded by thinking the naysayers are motivated by irrational fear when we have gone our of our way to point out that isn't the case. My feeling is that James is at this time too inexperienced for a pokie even if their venom was liquid bubble gum; too large, too fast, too soon.

To me, anyone recommending it is really short sighted in that you are failing to take James' age and experience into account, and you're really failing to take James' parents' (lack of) experience into account. Whether anyone could die from a poke bite doesn't really mean jack if you're the parent of a adolescent who's layed up for 24 hours and experiences persistent cramps over the coming months - you're going to be pissed off righteously that you weren't fully informed of the possibilities in all their unhyped reality. Is this the sort of reputation you want for the hobby: that we *recommend* inexperienced adolescents should just go ahead and jump into keeping the most challenging, most medically potent species just because the odds aren't very high that anyone will be bitten? Some of you seem to be echoing Bob Breene's assinine attitude about venom: if it doesn't kill you or leave your permanently disfigured and/or crippled it's not significant, when many people may consider even a few days of shooting pains to be far beyond what they're willing to risk for their children.
 

Nixy

Arachnoprince
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Thank you Code.
Sincerely. I think you pretty much said it best.
 

Lycanthrope

Arachnolord
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Oct 10, 2002
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624
I guess im forced onto Brandons side by default here, but thats where id be by choice anyway. Im 20 years old, living with my fiance and her two children ages 3 and 6. We also have a baby on the way. I have a P. formosa, as well as an H. maculata, with plans on getting more in the future. I have my T.room set up so that if there is an escape, the t is stuck in just that small room. Argue all you want about cracks and crevices, fact of the matter is, i can contain a tarantula in that room without fear of it getting out. i dont feel the slightest bit guilty about having these t's, because i dont think they are a risk to anyone in this household. the cottonmouth i got rid of wasnt even a risk, but bridget wanted him gone so he is. when i look at her children and point to something and say "poison" it registers. so between the security measures i take, and the warnings i give those children, and the fact that anything dangerous goes on the highest shelf of the t room, im more worried they will fall down the stairs or drink the bathroom cleaner than i am of them being bitten by my t's.
 

pamandron

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Sep 23, 2002
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Well, I posted my opinion in the other thread about this. But I agree with Chip, and Kelly and Nixy and the others who were against it. Brandon, I am sorry that you feel the way you do. I have talked with you in the chat room and I had no idea you were 17 years old. Please don't get so down, because you do seem to know alot about t's and you can help people. As far as people answering your post, I read alot and don't answer. I haven't started very many, but the few I have, there aren't many replies. It is the youth of today that is going to keep this great hobby going when all of us old people get older. :) Pam
 

Devildoll

Arachnoknight
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Jul 19, 2002
Messages
267
Age has nothing to do w/ maturity.
There are plenty of kids James age i think are more mature than many 40 year olds i know.

I think james could handle a pokie no problem...

I would in fact support him.

However... I think his parents should be highly involved in the purchase decision....

If they understand the dangers, and James explains how he would react to bad hypothetical situations.... than go for it.

there is only one way to get experiance.

Just know the dangers James... and let your parents know the dangers.

I personally think the dangers are pretty small....

at least compared to letting him drive his siblings around on Orchard lake when he's sixteen.... (It's one of the most dangerous roads in the country right where James lives)
 

Gillian

Arachnoblessed
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Originally posted by Code Monkey
The most significant thing you realise as you get older is how little you knew when you were younger.

* Admittedly, you start to get your head screwed on straight by 22 or so, but you're still far off of realising what a truly ignorant putz you've been ;)
Amen to that, code..Hell...it took me until I was close to 30, to realize how stupid I'd been..
Peace,
Gillian
 

Gillian

Arachnoblessed
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Originally posted by Buspirone
I was around when we used 5-1/4" disks, beleived if a modem was to exceed 9600 baud the phone wires would melt and we used BBS's to exchange information.
Ooopps...guess I'm not the only "dinosaur"..:D
Peace,
Gillian
 

Nixy

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Lycanthrope, please think about what you said.
You have all the precautions in place as a parent knows to have.
You take the time to 'kid safe" the environment because you KNow how fast kids are and how they have that magic trick of getting into darn near anything they set their minds too.
The average shmoo doesn't have a seperate room for their collections to lock them down.
They are right in their living rooms, dining rooms, or in the bedroom where they sleep.
James aside.
How many teenager with younger siblings growl a dozen times a week about the squirt getting into their stuff?
And adult Parent that takes all needed precautions is a Completly different critter then a teenager, or even another adult with no kids.
You KNOW it's a whole other universe.
The bottom Line is if you have little kids in the house the danger levels increase for ANYTHING.
That bottle of cleaner.
That set of stairs.
The vacume cleaner.
A button.
The big pretty tarantula kitty kitty bug bug.
Your old enough and your a parent and have the time under your belt to make a judgement call about what Your capable of keeping in the environment you've constructed.
The bottom line it's Not the T thats the danger issue in an of itself. It's the OTHER factors, the human factors that no one without the experience in preventing them Can honestly say they can prevent.
 

LunarFaery

ArachnoDiva
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Mar 20, 2003
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[The bottom line it's Not the T thats the danger issue in an of itself. It's the OTHER factors, the human factors that no one without the experience in preventing them Can honestly say they can prevent. [/B][/QUOTE]

Well the ONLY true way to prevent a t problem is not to have ts. With that being said, Nixy is right...its not the ts that pose the biggest danger. Its the children in the mix.
Jen
 

Tangled WWWeb

Arachnodemon
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For Instance- I met J.P Version 1.0 (Jon) at the MRS and Bryan Cronoss, you guys tell them my dad is cautious about the t's i get. Thanks for putting me in the spotlight! :} ;P =D ;) :)


James [/B][/QUOTE]


I met James and his father at the Michigan Reptile Show a few months back. His father was very concerned about James getting any "aggressive" species. He asked my opinion on an Usumbara and I told him that it was fast and not shy about striking/biting. I made sure not to portray the spider as a monster. He still wanted no part of it. They left with Aphonopelmas and Avicularias.

Since then, I have noticed that his list of spiders has grown to include some OW species. I assume that his father has been kept informed, and now feels more comfortable with James and his spider husbandry. I also assume that his father will be the one who ultimately makes this decision as well.

I feel that both pro and con camps make some compelling arguments. I have kept many Pokies in the past, and currently have a decent sized female P. ornata. I have a few Grammostolas that would surely bite me before my Pokie. Can I say that she wouldn't bite me if given the chance? No. Can I say what the outcome of a bite would be? Not with any certainty. Would the effects be more severe for a child? Probably.

That being said, I don't know what James and his father's proposed keeping arrangements are. I don't know how much assistance his parents plan on giving him. I don't know what level of accessibility his younger siblings will be given. Without this information it is difficult to vote either way.

John
 

Nixy

Arachnoprince
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I'm past Jame. :D
Sorry but Mommabird is titsy.

What I keep seeing is. ' All you people saying no are just afraid and attempting to restrain experience and demonise a lovely species.'
I see 'experts' stating 10, 20, 30 years experience of not getting bitten.
Woo hoo, good for you.
But saying you have twnty years experience and saying it's ok for someone with little experience to get something demanding greater experience is like saying.
"I have twenty years experience sky diving mi lad. I see you've read some books and Own a parachute. I think you should grab your little sister and jump out of a plane tomarrow."

Or

"I have one. That makes me an expert. Screw experience do it anyway! Don't let the old farts bring you down, they don't know that we know everything yet."

Oooooh, time for me to just Shut up now and recage my opinions.

I think it's time to reinsate my lurkers status now.
 

Tarantula Lover

Psalmopoeus Lover
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I guess i will have a talk with my dad on a pokie! see what he thinks, but either way, i am patient and will wait! Thanks,

James
 

Code Monkey

Arachnoemperor
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Originally posted by Nixy
But saying you have twnty years experience and saying it's ok for someone with little experience to get something demanding greater experience is like saying.
"I have twenty years experience sky diving mi lad. I see you've read some books and Own a parachute. I think you should grab your little sister and jump out of a plane tomarrow."
=D
Too true. This really sums up the crux of it. Some people passed the baptism of fire when they got a pokie (or other feisty T) early on in their T keeping, and suddenly that gives them the knowledge to be recommending what James' parents should be making the decision on.

I hear you all, I started with a P. cancerides of all inappropriate starter Ts, that still doesn't mean I'm going to do more than say what I have: this is a decision for James and his parents to study and make up their mind about without a bunch of, "Just do it, I never got bit" crap.
 

Nixy

Arachnoprince
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Thank you Code.
I truely belive that encouraging lack of caution and lack of proper education before hand belittles the hobby on a whole.
Is that what we want the Future of the hobby to learn?
If anything that kind of attitude will reburry it and send it screaming back into the fogs of misunderstanding.
 

LunarFaery

ArachnoDiva
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Mar 20, 2003
Messages
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Originally posted by Tarantula Lover
I guess i will have a talk with my dad on a pokie! see what he thinks, but either way, i am patient and will wait! Thanks,

James
James I realize you didnt start this whole thread, but good for you for not taking this desicion lightly and having the maturity to TALK with your dad before you make it.

Good for you and good luck ;)
Jen
 

Valael

Arachnodemon
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Jul 19, 2002
Messages
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Originally posted by Code Monkey
bunch of, "Just do it, I never got bit" crap.


It's not a bunch of "Just do it, I never got bit" crap. If it was, I specificly would have said that.


It's a "If you want it, get it, but use your head" thing. I think getting bit is a completely avoidable occurance if you're using your head, especially around a Poecilotheria.

If you're smart about it, you can care for one just as well as anyone else without ever putting your hand near it.

I agree, parents should have some say -- but don't act as though someone supporting him getting one is supporting it just because "I've never gotten bitten" That's just a lame blanket statement.


Like I said, I firmly believe that getting bitten is entirely avoidable with a little common sense and care.
 
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