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Pandinus Gregoryi or Pandinus Smithii

Discussion in 'Scorpions' started by Lennie Collins, Jun 30, 2008.

  1. tabor

    tabor Arachnoprince Old Timer

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    Some comments from an article I dug up about Pandinus: "I am convinced that P. gregoryi, based on a female holotype, is a synonym of P. exitialis."
     
  2. tabor

    tabor Arachnoprince Old Timer

    OK so this is a P. exitialis which according to the most RECENT research is the same as P. gregoryi (ie they will eventually be synonymously unified in to one species because they are the same thing)
     

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  3. tabor

    tabor Arachnoprince Old Timer

    To make a final call on Galpo's pictures I would need my Pandinus ID guide which I lost when I got a new computer. From what I have seen/know I would say that is definitely not an Opistophthalmus ssp. So I'm leaning towards smithii. I will try to get the guy to resend the photos I once had.

    It would help if I knew where you got them from Galpo (PM me)
     
  4. tabor

    tabor Arachnoprince Old Timer

    Ok I borrowed the attached pic from your thread. THAT is not a P. smithii unless I'm completely off my mark here.
     

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  5. tabor

    tabor Arachnoprince Old Timer

    DISCLAIMER: Again I'm not standing behind any of my statements until I get my ID guide back ;P
     
  6. bigtyler1025

    bigtyler1025 Arachnoknight

  7. tabor

    tabor Arachnoprince Old Timer

    OK after talking to bigtyler, I have decided to post a final summation:

    I have yet to see a proper ID guide or "on location" photo of a P. smithii. Only what is being marketed as P. smithii. Tyler says his looks more yellow in normal lighting, almost identical to Galpo's pics. What my conclusion is this: there is indeed a yellow/brown Pandinus ssp. being marketed and sold as P. smithii but until we get a definitive ID guide (one including granulation markings and such) we will never know for certain.

    In the mean time I would refer to them simply as Pandinus ssp. because after hours of searing I cannot find one single REAL picture of a smithii (i.e. one from a scorpiologist) and all the papers that mention the species do not have pictures and only mention the species in passing, no description what so ever.

    Until a definitive, DEATAILED guide surfaces there is no way of knowing.
     
  8. tabor

    tabor Arachnoprince Old Timer

    Exactly, this is what is being marketed as a P. smithii. Is it actually a P. smithii? I can honestly say that I doubt anyone in the US would be able to ID it properly.
     
  9. Lennie Collins

    Lennie Collins Arachnobaron

    I have seen both a Pandinus Smithii and Pandinus Gregoryi. They both look like Pandinus Imperator EXCEPT smaller. The Pandinus Smithii is Golden in color and the Pandinus Greygoryi is brown/tan in color. After seeing Galapoheroes picture of the Pandinus Smithii and Tabor's picture of what looks like a Pandinus Greygoryi I am leaning more towards the Pandinus Smithii.
     
  10. GartenSpinnen

    GartenSpinnen Arachnoprince Old Timer

    Aw.... CRAP! According to what you guys are saying i got P. gregoryi. Someone better tell the dealers...hehehe...

    But who knows? Do we really know for certain? Could they not just be different localities of the same species or something along those lines? I mean they do look very similar.... i have to admit whatever mine is, it is very pinchy :).
    Cheers
    [​IMG]
     
  11. tabor

    tabor Arachnoprince Old Timer

    Basically dealer's are just slapping name's on things, so your could be smithii, something unknown (most likely). One thing is certain though P. exitialis is the same as P. gregoryi. :)
     
  12. Lennie Collins

    Lennie Collins Arachnobaron

    I might just say forget it and get both of 'em!
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2008
  13. GartenSpinnen

    GartenSpinnen Arachnoprince Old Timer

    How will you know your getting both of them when no one can figure out what they have, or if its even what everyone thinks it is? Until someone can dig up some papers, or something along those lines, lets for the sake of it find out where they are collected from and say "Pandinus sp. "Bla bla bla"".
     
  14. Lennie Collins

    Lennie Collins Arachnobaron

    Jadespider1985...a dealer in Wisconsin is selling the brown/tan one has Pandinus Gregoryi and a dealer in Arizona is selling the gold one has Pandinus Smithii. I guess buy from two different dealers? I probably want get the genus names right BUT I will get two different scorpions!
     
  15. tabor

    tabor Arachnoprince Old Timer

    By the way I sent bigtyler the ID guide I have on Pandinus exitialis, and I'm pretty sure that's what he has, which is the same thing as P. Gregoryi.
     
  16. Lennie Collins

    Lennie Collins Arachnobaron

    Hey fellas...you probably been in the hobby longer than I have and you know species are given new or different names alot. Some species look alike with very small differences BUT it's enough to put 'em in another family!
     
  17. tabor

    tabor Arachnoprince Old Timer

    Not a different family. At MOST a different species, more than likely a different subspecies. I get your point though. They LOOK different enough that its worth keeping a few of each type, regardless of what they are "officially".

    remember: family -> genus -> species -> subspecies

    takes an act of god to change families or establish new ones, or at least or research. new subspecies pop up all the time though.
     
  18. Lennie Collins

    Lennie Collins Arachnobaron

    Family, Genus, Species, etc, etc. I personsonally think that Pandinus Gregoryi and Pandinus Smithii are beautiful. Have any of you seen a picture of a Pandinus Dictator? I have had 4 Pandinus Imperator and they have all died. I keep my Pandinus Caveminus the same as I did them and he is still going strong. He is very docile compared to the care sheet reports.
     
  19. tabor

    tabor Arachnoprince Old Timer

    Keep what you like Lennie, that's all that matters. Keep what you find attractive and enjoyable. and yes I have seen the pics :)
     
  20. tabor

    tabor Arachnoprince Old Timer

    I'm working on my own rough draft of a Pandinus ID guide, since no one else seems to be doing it:

    [​IMG]

    Hope this helps :)
     
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