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I think these are the 2 commonly called "daddy long legs"
MOST venomous?
- Thread starter Gillian
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Originally posted by steve055
I think these are the 2 commonly called "daddy long legs"
The top one looks what they call a wandering harvestman and the bottom one looks to be the true silk-dwelling "Daddy Longlegs." Can't say I know enough about either species to be adamant.
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Interesting info on those pages, Occitanus. I hadn't known much about Sicarius; if they were really all that bad. Now I will have to do even more research for curiosity's sake. I'll let you know if I find any LD50 or lethality stats. Oh, and I did some linking, and found an interesting page on Cheiracanthium sp. bites. And those we DO have in the US.
Here is the page :
http://www.museums.org.za/bio/spiderweb/bites.htm
Here is the page :
http://www.museums.org.za/bio/spiderweb/bites.htm
Yeah, the Yellow (Golden) Sac Spider inhabits both Old and New World countries. Definitely a spider of medical significance.
A couple of other medically important species worth mentioning would be the Hobo Spider (Tegenaria agrastis) that inhabits northwestern areas of the United States; and the White-Tail Spider (Lampona cylindrata) of Australia. Both possessing toxins that also encourage potential necrosis.
A couple of other medically important species worth mentioning would be the Hobo Spider (Tegenaria agrastis) that inhabits northwestern areas of the United States; and the White-Tail Spider (Lampona cylindrata) of Australia. Both possessing toxins that also encourage potential necrosis.
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It may not be the most venomous, but from what I've heard/read the most dangerous spider to man would have to be the Phoneutria fera, just because of it's incredible speed and the likelyness of being bitten.
One guy I talked to was too scared to open it's lid to take a picture of it for me because he said it was so aggressive and he's been a dealer for over 20 years.
But, I've had no first hand experience and won't until maybe later this year.
Jim B.
One guy I talked to was too scared to open it's lid to take a picture of it for me because he said it was so aggressive and he's been a dealer for over 20 years.
But, I've had no first hand experience and won't until maybe later this year.
Jim B.
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Phoneutria got the largest venom glands of all spiders, very keen to bite and few drybites, multipel strikes and a aggressive nature and a potent neurotoxin makes them highly dangerous.
Transfer these spiders are.. a nightmare.
/Lelle
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Well, then why do you take the risk to keep one? (or more, don't know how many you have)
Dennis
If you actually want to split hairs the same can be said of the L.quinquestriatus and A.australis. One possessing neurocardiotoxin-like venom and the other possessing a venomous cocktail with two highly specialized toxins adapted to be specifically virulent to mammalian animals (including humans). But if you are a responsible and mature arachoenthusiasists then there shouldn't be a problem. And thus far, the hobby has enjoyed smashing success in this particular area.
My personal vote would have to go with Six-eyed Sand-crab Spider (Sicarius sp.) because unlike all the other medically important Araneae, this is the only sole one not possessing an antivenom. The cytotoxin it possesses is highly toxic, at it's destructive worse can cause massive internal bleeding and hemorraging. Luckily, it is a very shy reclusive spider with great temperment. The words aggressive and Sicarius don't even belong in the same vocabulary.
As for Sicarius - they might have a potent venom but the size and the behavoiur (digged down and not around humans) makes them not that big of a threat.
Venomous is one thing - dangerous another.
Atrax robustus and Phoneutria are my vote, both are venomous and highly aggressive, and close to human settlements.
/Lelle
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I have several pokies and a very high strung H. maculata. She will run and jump at the nearest object, and is (in my experience) the worst to transfer.
Are Phonuetria much worse than a mac? Just trying to get an idea of what I'm getting into.
Jim B.
Much worse. Very irrational in behaviour, and pretty good eyesight (atleast it seems that way) makes them very aware of your prescence. Theraphosids can easily (well easy is maybe the wrong word but in lack of a better one) be manipulated into a tube or just put a box over it to secure them. Its very difficult to do that with Phoneuria. They go from zero to 100 in a split second. And they jump too.
Adding a potent venom to that makes it a bit more nervwrecking.
What species are you getting?
/Lelle
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Most venomous is relatively simple to determine - venom potency.
Most dangerous depends on more factors than sheer potency alone. The spider's size, temperament, speed, agility, amount of venom, habitat, and potency all have to be considered. I wouldn't consider the amount of people in the spider's habitat to be part of this equation, since that would be measuring how much of a threat a particular spider is to mankind as a WHOLE, and I am considering how dangerous a particular spider is to one person if they encounter it. The only way it could enter into consideration, is as the likelyhood of an individual to encounter the dangerous spider, in which case you are talking in terms of the threat to the person over an extent of time, not the degree of danger at one encounter. So there are really three kinds of "dangerous" :
threat to humanity ( or population center ) / time
threat to individual / time ( danger of spider X probability of encounter )
threat to individual once encountered
At least that's my view on it.
Most dangerous depends on more factors than sheer potency alone. The spider's size, temperament, speed, agility, amount of venom, habitat, and potency all have to be considered. I wouldn't consider the amount of people in the spider's habitat to be part of this equation, since that would be measuring how much of a threat a particular spider is to mankind as a WHOLE, and I am considering how dangerous a particular spider is to one person if they encounter it. The only way it could enter into consideration, is as the likelyhood of an individual to encounter the dangerous spider, in which case you are talking in terms of the threat to the person over an extent of time, not the degree of danger at one encounter. So there are really three kinds of "dangerous" :
threat to humanity ( or population center ) / time
threat to individual / time ( danger of spider X probability of encounter )
threat to individual once encountered
At least that's my view on it.
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Jeez, Phoneutria? Now theres something I wouldn't understand keeping, just plain dangerous...
Steve
Steve
I cant aggree that arachnids, no matter how venomous, are a threat to humanity - after all they are no weapon of massdestruction.
How dangerous a species are in my opinion are venom potency, venom yield in a bite, how aggressive they are and likely to bite, how many individuals of the species that can be found in a area, and closeness to humans.
/Lelle
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I know, but its a huge risk if anyone were to be bitten. There isn't any antivenom in the u.s. I called up poisen control here and they said they had no idea about what I was talking about. How long would you last after a bite from one?
Steve
Steve
Poison control? Dont know what that is but here its called Giftinformationscentralen, translated to Venom Information Central. They sad no serum was needed...
I hope I wont have to find out. People dont die at 100% ratio from a bite but there are a great risk. The time and effect of a bite depends alot (as for any venom) on health and age and offcourse the location of the bite.
/Lelle
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Sounds fun
I was reading on the net that when they go into their defensive posture they'll actually turn and watch you as you move around. And that they are one of the only species that 'wants' to bite you. Talk about evil ;P
The one I may be getting is said to be in the Ctenidae genus, and he's pretty sure it's a Phoneutria sp., but not possitive on the species. Still researching, haven't decided if it's a good idea yet.
Jim B.
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My understanding of the matter has always been that the harvestman was the so called "daddy long legs", and that the true spider that usurped that nick name was a European cellar spider, and the rumor was that this cellar spiders venom is the most potent true spider venom per volume, or at least very high on the list, however this spiders fangs are not large enough to penitrate human skin. How much of this is accurate in regard to fact, or even accurate in regard to what version of this rumor is most popular, I couldn't say.
I have been "bit" (or perhaps pinched?) by the harvestman and it hurt a little at the instant it occurred, but not much, and there were absolutely no ill effects afterward. I've never experienced a bite (that I am aware of) from the cellar spider, though I have several of them in my house. I welcome their presence as it is also my understanding that they displace the black widows by taking up the widows prefferred habitat. I'm much happier seeing a cellar spider web in a corner of the kitchen than with a widow web.
I have been "bit" (or perhaps pinched?) by the harvestman and it hurt a little at the instant it occurred, but not much, and there were absolutely no ill effects afterward. I've never experienced a bite (that I am aware of) from the cellar spider, though I have several of them in my house. I welcome their presence as it is also my understanding that they displace the black widows by taking up the widows prefferred habitat. I'm much happier seeing a cellar spider web in a corner of the kitchen than with a widow web.