Just a point on Sexing out Females for people

[KenTheBugGuy]

Ok this really bugs me. When someone has a lot of a speices many times they sell them as just unsexed. I do it often. I am not going to take the time to sex out rose hairs or OBTs and especially slings.

Now here is where the problem lies. I get request from people to sex them out a female. I always say I can't do this really. I will sex out males sometimes cause almost every one is looking for a female when they buy unsexed.

The reason I can't sex them out is because it makes unfair for all the other people that buy an unsexed tarantula thinking they had an equal chance for a female. I will not fold just to make an extra sale. So if anybody is selling unsexed spiders then tells you yah I will sex you out a female they are being dishonest to all thier other customers and realize they might do the same to you sometime. I just will not do it as I want a true 50/50 chance or chance in thier favor even if it means loosing a sale.

I sometimes will sex out all/most of a species and in that case I sale them as males and females. Also if someone request a pair there are times I will do that also.

 

[JC]

Ken I agree with you completly.

 

[paul fleming]

Agree 100% Ken.
If every spider was sexed....we would have almost no males in the hobby which would eventually lead to no spiders.
It is normally only the people breeding that need males.Most others just want females.
They still have the same sort of thing in China with human beings if memory serves right.Only they want males......who knows what happens to the females
Paul

 

[just1moreT]

i agree with you ken thats part of the hobby i think and yeah that is a fair way to do it for every one .

 

[Teal]

I agree as well! If you REALLY want a female... buy a confirmed adult female, or take your chances. I dno't see having males as a bad thing... you can loan them out or sell them when they mature, and then you have slings you can sell or trade for other Ts that you want.

Selling slings as 'unsexed' is the proper way to do it.

 

[gunslinger]

I'm glad there are people in the community like you Ken. Many people breed out spiders, sell them, and really dont care about the "buyers" or impacts on the invertebrate community. By sexing out some as females, they are most certainly skewing the ratios in the unsexed batches, but most probably just dont care if the people buying unsexed spiders are getting males.

As you pointed out, I think the only way it is fair to sex out females is if the buyer buys an equal number of males from the batch, therefore not changing the ratios available.

 

[Halfbreed]

I completely agree!!!! Besides with the diversity of Ts I actually think males can be more desireable in some species. Even though they are more short lived some males can be stunning. Also as Teal said you can sell them or loan them out. Then you have slings for little work to build up breeding stock, sell, or trade for other things you want. I have always been happy with males or females. Ken I commend you for choosing to stay honest and operate with integrity and even though I have never ordered from you before you have earned a new customer for your integrity.

 

[Xian]

I'm on board with this concept as well.
I try to always buy two slings, hoping to up the odds of getting a female.
It's always good to watch the male mature and then get to see them make a sperm web and load up too.

 

[KenTheBugGuy]

I'm glad there are people in the community like you Ken. Many people breed out spiders, sell them, and really dont care about the "buyers" or impacts on the invertebrate community. By sexing out some as females, they are most certainly skewing the ratios in the unsexed batches, but most probably just dont care if the people buying unsexed spiders are getting males.

As you pointed out, I think the only way it is fair to sex out females is if the buyer buys an equal number of males from the batch, therefore not changing the ratios available.

Totally agree with you. Don't think there is anything wrong with sexing out pairs or Males really cause as I said most of the time people buying unsexed are hoping for females cause they can usually buy males cheaper down the line.

 

[gunslinger]

True, removing the males probably wouldn't make anyone too disappointed. Either way I just think it is important for sellers to correctly represent their product. If you are selling unsexed, they should be truly unsexed. If you have pulled 20 females out of a lot.......perhaps the seller should reconsider how he advertises his unsexed.

 

[paul fleming]

Males of certain species are getting hard to come by as well.
Over here,P.fasciata males are hard to come by and probably because everyone wants to own a female and just "borrow" a male.
I found this with the males I had.There were so many 50/50 offers it was unreal.
I ended up selling pairs anyway.
The same will continue unless all breeders take the same stance as you.
Selling unsexed is the future for the majority of sales,unless it is to a known breeder of course.

 

[ArachnoYak]

I think not only should the sellers take this stance, but as a buyer it'd be a good idea to buy 2 or 3 of any given species at a time that way you're almost guaranteed to have both sexes and if you get a MM and the females you have aren't mature yet, the MMs can be bred out thus ensuring a constant supply of male Ts in the hobby.

 

[paul fleming]

This seems like the most important debate I have seen since I have been on this forum.
Everybody needs to get involved with this discussion.
Well done Ken for starting such an excellent debate.....hats off to you :clap:
Paul

 

[KenTheBugGuy]

Lol

This seems like the most important debate I have seen since I have been on this forum.
Everybody needs to get involved with this discussion.
Well done Ken for starting such an excellent debate.....hats off to you :clap:
Paul

Truthfully I brought it up cause I was tired of customers/potential customers telling me well "so and so" sexes me out females when I ask.

 

[paul fleming]

Ken,if everybody just bought females.......end of species in the hobby (don't want to go the WC route after someone over here gave the hobby a bad name).
Not really but it is starting to get to a point where males are so hard to come by.
Honestly Ken,I think all breeders need to start doing the same as you........it has to be beneficial to everybody in the end.....and to the captive spider population.
paul

 

[robc]

Totally agree with that, if you want a female buy more than 1, I like to sell 5-20 lots...you will get a pair out of that. I sell ALL my slings unsexed!! There is also another problem that needs to be pointed out, people sexing 2-3" T's and selling confirmed males as unsexed...it happens and a lot. I think if they have a 2-3" T they sell as "unsexed" they should provide a vent pic along with it in the sale add!!

 

[KenTheBugGuy]

Totally agree with that, if you want a female buy more than 1, I like to sell 5-20 lots...you will get a pair out of that. I sell ALL my slings unsexed!! There is also another problem that needs to be pointed out, people sexing 2-3" T's and selling confirmed males as unsexed...it happens and a lot. I think if they have a 2-3" T they sell as "unsexed" they should provide a vent pic along with it in the sale add!!

In some ways I agree with that Rob. The only thing is I am very guilty in selling them at that size unsexed cause I would never have the time to take a picture of all the 3 inch t's I have or even try to sex them all acurately. They would all die of starvation cause we spend all the time dong that

I also get request for pictures daily and tell people I jsut can't. Its a time issue for me though.

 

[KenTheBugGuy]

oh

Most of the time we try to sex off sheds also at that size to be very accurate and its just quicker when we see a shed to pull it out and sex. Sometimes i get spiders in that are already sexed too and double check those. I usually post those as sexed.

There are also times I just can't tell. I look at avics and just scratch my head.

 

[robc]

In some ways I agree with that Rob. The only thing is I am very guilty in selling them at that size unsexed cause I would never have the time to take a picture of all the 3 inch t's I have or even try to sex them all acurately. They would all die of starvation cause we spend all the time dong that

I also get request for pictures daily and tell people I jsut can't. Its a time issue for me though.

You are not guilty of anything, you are not sexing all of them and selling the males as unsexed, selling them unsexed without actually sexing them is fine

 

[KenTheBugGuy]

true

You are not guilty of anything, you are not sexing all of them and selling the males as unsexed, selling them unsexed without actually sexing them is fine

Oh got yah. Now I see what you were saying and yeah I have seen that before too. Selling a bunch of females and then turn around and sell a bunch of unsexed ones.