How do you all remember tarantula names when everyone always shortens the genus?

[Andrea82]

@Leila @D Sherlod
For help with pronunciation, petkokc ( The Dark Den) has a series on them:

 

[BishopiMaster]

@Leila @D Sherlod
For help with pronunciation, petkokc ( The Dark Den) has a series on them:

thats no fun

 

[mconnachan]

Here comes the common name rant. It's really not a big deal peeps. We use common names for tons of other things.

One of my irks is when people say I'm away to "Hoover" umm don't you mean vacuum........

 

[Vermis]

For me I think it helped that I was interested in dinosaurs (andotherprehistoricanimals) and never grew out of it.

Grant liked kids - it was impossible not to like any group so openly enthusiastic about dinosaurs. Grant used to watch kids in museums as they stared open-mouthed at the big skeletons rising above them. He wondered what their fascination really represented. He finally decided that children liked dinosaurs because these giant creatures personified the uncontrollable force of looming authority. They were symbolic parents. Fascinating and frightening, like parents. And kids loved them, as they loved their parents.
Grant also suspected that was why even young children learned the names of dinosaurs. It never failed to amaze him when a three-year-old shrieked: 'Stegosaurus!' Saying these complicated names was a way of exerting power over the giants, a way of being in control.

- Michael Crichton, Jurassic Park

Switch 'exerting power over parental authority' with something along the lines of 'familiarising with intimidating nature', and that'd be something like my take on it. For both dinosaurs and tarantulas: creatures bigger and presumably more dangerous than normally encountered in our usual modern, first-world situation, but by that token far removed from us, and given an air of the exotic or even semi-mythical because of it. We get to know more about them and the 'monstrous' impression gives way to to the view of fascinating, complex animals. We use their scientific names for identification first, but I think it comes easier because we love them!

About Poecilotheria - when I got into tarantula keeping it reminded me of the name Coelophysis (Seel-o-fie-sis) - sibilant c, 'oe' as phonetic i:, etc. But then I saw keepers referring to 'pokies', and that got stamped into my head.

If they're not pokies anymore, are they peecies?

One of my irks is when people say I'm away to "Hoover" umm don't you mean vacuum........

'Raptor' and 'Teerex' niggle me. The latter not so much because of the same identification problems as the OP*, but because 'Tyrannosaurus' rolls off the tongue so satisfyingly. Try it. Walk around today saying Tyrannosaurus. Tyrannosaurus. Tyrrrranosaurus. Ignore the funny looks.

* On that note, the usage of scientific binomials that I learned was to write the full name on it's first mention - e.g. Avicularia minatrix - and then use the abbreviation - A. minatrix - for the rest of the write-up. I figure it could sort out any lingering doubts in online forum topics, too.

 

[Andrea82]

For me I think it helped that I was interested in dinosaurs (andotherprehistoricanimals) and never grew out of it.


- Michael Crichton, Jurassic Park

Switch 'exerting power over parental authority' with something along the lines of 'familiarising with intimidating nature', and that'd be something like my take on it. For both dinosaurs and tarantulas: creatures bigger and presumably more dangerous than normally encountered in - but far removed from - our usual modern, first-world situation, and with an air of the exotic or even semi-mythical because of that. We get to know more about them and the 'monstrous' impression gives way to to the view of fascinating, complex animals. We use their scientific names for identification first, but I think it comes easier because we love them!

About Poecilotheria - when I got into tarantula keeping it reminded me of the name Coelophysis (Seel-o-fie-sis) - sibilant c, 'oe' as phonetic i:, etc. But then I saw keepers referring to 'pokies', and that got stamped into my head.

If they're not pokies anymore, are they peecies?



'Raptor' and 'Teerex' niggle me. The latter not so much because of the same identification problems as the OP*, but because 'Tyrannosaurus' rolls off the tongue so satisfyingly. Try it. Walk around today saying Tyrannosaurus. Tyrannosaurus. Tyrrrranosaurus. Ignore the funny looks.

* On that note, the usage of scientific binomials that I learned was to write the full name first - e.g. Avicularia minatrix - and then use the abbreviation - A. minatrix - for the rest of the write-up. I figure it could sort out any lingering doubts in online forum topics, too.

Absolutely awesome post, I enjoyed reading it
I have been wondering the same about 'pokies'...

 

[Leila]

"If they're not pokies anymore, are they peecies?"

@Vermis, it would make more sense, but it sounds all wrong ...my brain is throwing a tantrum right now. Ha

 

[JoshDM020]

As a total newbie, only even here for a couple of months and had never even heard a tarantulas scientific name before joining, i have had no problem picking up new full names, the shortened versions (Avic. avic) or fun little nicknames (pokie). I understand why some people may have a problem with this, as learning styles differ greatly from person to person. I DONT understand why a war has initiated over it. Nobody is intentionally being disrespectful to anyone, here. I understand what @Trenor is getting at perfectly fine and hes really not all that wrong (why can we call an oak tree an oak tree, but cant call a rose hair a rose hair). Although i also understand how scientific names are more useful because ive gotten pictures of several different spiders when i type "brazilian giant white knee tarantula" looking for Acanthoscurria geniculata. It also makes sense that language barriers prevent some common names from being understood. But honestly, most o the people here who dont speak English as a first language have likely been here long enough to figure it out for themselves by now. There are a loooottttttt of smart people here. The point I'm getting at, different people have different outlooks based on what their experiences are and where theyre from. So lets all just chill out. Because theres nothing any of us can do to make anybody change what they do anyways. Call that rose hair whatever you want.

 

[Andrea82]

As a total newbie, only even here for a couple of months and had never even heard a tarantulas scientific name before joining, i have had no problem picking up new full names, the shortened versions (Avic. avic) or fun little nicknames (pokie). I understand why some people may have a problem with this, as learning styles differ greatly from person to person. I DONT understand why a war has initiated over it. Nobody is intentionally being disrespectful to anyone, here. I understand what @Trenor is getting at perfectly fine and hes really not all that wrong (why can we call an oak tree an oak tree, but cant call a rose hair a rose hair). Although i also understand how scientific names are more useful because ive gotten pictures of several different spiders when i type "brazilian giant white knee tarantula" looking for Acanthoscurria geniculata. It also makes sense that language barriers prevent some common names from being understood. But honestly, most o the people here who dont speak English as a first language have likely been here long enough to figure it out for themselves by now. There are a loooottttttt of smart people here. The point I'm getting at, different people have different outlooks based on what their experiences are and where theyre from. So lets all just chill out. Because theres nothing any of us can do to make anybody change what they do anyways. Call that rose hair whatever you want.

I don't see a war...discussion, yes. War? No.
I don't have 'to figure out common names' for myself because someone else doesn't know the scientific name, that's the world upside down. But it's simple though...want advice from Europeans? Use the scientific name.

 

[OliverWhatever]

I... I think I am just gonna continue mispronouncing these names...
I don't want to be that annoying smartass that always goes "Actually, it's pronounced pee-suh-luh-THI-ree-uh!, the oe is a Latin dipthong pronounced with a long "e" sound"
What about "Metallica"? Am I pronouncing that one wrong as well?
My world is falling apart...

 

[JoshDM020]

I don't see a war...discussion, yes. War? No.
I don't have 'to figure out common names' for myself because someone else doesn't know the scientific name, that's the world upside down. But it's simple though...want advice from Europeans? Use the scientific name.

Thats what im getting at and i mentioned that. Language barriers are a good reason to use scientific names. But if someone doesnt KNOW the scientific name, it wouldnt be difficult. Thats what i was meaning. And war was a little over-exaggerated. But it has gotten a tad bit heated a couple times.

 

[Vermis]

@Andrea82 @Leila

i have had no problem picking up new full names, the shortened versions (Avic. avic) or fun little nicknames (pokie)... I understand what @Trenor is getting at perfectly fine and hes really not all that wrong (why can we call an oak tree an oak tree, but cant call a rose hair a rose hair). Although i also understand how scientific names are more useful because ive gotten pictures of several different spiders when i type "brazilian giant white knee tarantula" looking for Acanthoscurria geniculata.

You have a point. I think the common name matter varies from species to species. It's easier when the common name unmistakably refers to a precise genus or species - using pokies again, that refers to the genus Poecilotheria, however much we've been mispronouncing it. 'Indian ornamental' refers to Poecilotheria regalis as opposed to the other species in the genus. 'Avic' is also more defined and descriptive than the simple 'A' that Oliver complained about, at least until you become familiar with specific names. And it still wouldn't hurt to roll out the bit in italics, especially - as folk have said - when discussing things with non-native english speakers.

But on the other hand... well, there's an online article poking fun at 90s comic artist Rob Liefeld (I'd have to refresh my memory about AB's rules on linking to strong language, but it's easy enough to find), that describes his gritty-superhero naming convention: "couple a negatively connotative word (blood, die, death) with a second but completely unrelated negatively connotative word (shot, hard, blow)".
I think the same thing applies to too many new world tarantulas. Couple a colour or reference to fire (red, white, golden, fire, flame) with a reference to legs, backsides, or countries (leg, knee, rump, brazilian, chilean, mexican). Personally, I can't keep up. It's actually easier for me to remember the double-barrelled multisyllabic latinised names, not least because they provide a handy mental phylogenetic tree, like a set of mnemonic files and folders. Just to scratch the surface, Acanthoscurria geniculata is in the same Theraphosinae subfamily, but a different genus than Brachypelma smithi and B. boehmi; but is a brazilian white-knee closer to or further from a mexican red-knee than a mexican flame-leg?
Scientific names can be subject to some flux, but after a few years away from the hobby it hasn't been difficult to pick up on what happened to the likes of Avicularia versicolor or Cithariscius crawshayi. In that time I haven't begun - or could be bothered - to decipher the entire muddle of colour-knees, whatsit-hairs, and thingummy-baboons.

Pokies yet again... I dunno if it'll ever fall out of favour as shorthand for Poecilotheria. I think at this point it's like T. rex (or... choke... T-rex) - it's derived from an abbreviation of the scientific name, but it's become a common name in it's own right.

 

[JoshDM020]

@Andrea82 @Leila



You have a point. I think the common name matter varies from species to species. It's easier when the common name unmistakably refers to a precise genus or species - using pokies again, that refers to the genus Poecilotheria, however much we've been mispronouncing it. 'Indian ornamental' refers to Poecilotheria regalis as opposed to the other species in the genus. 'Avic' is also more defined and descriptive than the 'A' the OP complained about, at least until you become familiar with specific names. And it still wouldn't hurt to roll out the bit in italics, especially - as folk have said - when discussing things with non-native english speakers.

But on the other hand... well, there's an online article poking fun at 90s comic artist Rob Liefeld (I'd have to refresh my memory about AB's rules on linking to strong language, but it's easy enough to find), that describes his gritty-superhero naming convention: "couple a negatively connotative word (blood, die, death) with a second but completely unrelated negatively connotative word (shot, hard, blow)".
I think the same thing applies to too many new world tarantulas. Couple a colour or reference to fire (red, white, golden, fire, flame) with a reference to legs, backsides, or countries (leg, knee, rump, brazilian, chilean, mexican). Personally, I can't keep up. It's actually easier for me to remember the double-barrelled multisyllabic latinised names, not least because they provide a handy mental phylogenetic tree, like a set of mnemonic files and folders. Just to scratch the surface, Acanthoscurria geniculata is in the same Theraphosinae subfamily, but a different genus than Brachypelma smithi and B. boehmi; but is a brazilian white-knee closer to or further from a mexican red-knee than a mexican flame-leg?
Scientific names can be subject to some flux, but after a few years away from the hobby it hasn't been difficult to pick up on what happened to the likes of Avicularia versicolor or Cithariscius crawshayi. In that time I haven't begun - or could be bothered - to decipher the entire muddle of colour-knees, whatsit-hairs, and thingummy-baboons.

Pokies yet again... I dunno if it'll ever fall out of favour as shorthand for Poecilotheria. I think at this point it's like T. rex (or... choke... T-rex) - it's derived from an abbreviation of the scientific name, but it's become a common name in it's own right.

Exactly. Sometimes the common name is spot on and could be acceptable, until you start crossing language barriers and suddenly the translations for words get weird. Somebody already mentioned that some words have multiple meanings and the words they use for one thing mean something completely in english. Thats kinda the point i was trying to really focus on. Pokie seems ok to me because everyone knows it. On this forum, i doubt someone would think you were talking about a cactus if you used it.

 

[DubiaW]

The longer I pronounce a scientific name wrong the harder it is to correct it. There are a whole bunch of reptile names I have been pronouncing wrong for at least 25 years and I don't plan on correcting it. The Poecilotheria thing has messed me all up, no need to drag old skeletons out of the closet like Rhinocheilus lecontei except to laugh at myself. It messes with the whole phonetic memorization process all over again.

 

[Patherophis]

Hello everybody, I am new here so I hope it will be ok to join this interesting discussion:

Here is a link to a site that tells you how to pronounce the the names of arachnids. Now we can correct everyone in the trade! Bwah ha ha!

http://www.atshq.org/articles/beechwp1.html

There are many ways to pronounciate latin, but the one in this link has nothing to do with latin at all ...

@Leila @D Sherlod
For help with pronunciation, petkokc ( The Dark Den) has a series on them:

Really nice video, his pronunciation is almost perfect .

It would be possible to talk (or argue ? ) about latin for very long time, so there is just one thing for english speaking colleagues to think about today. In latin there is the same sound for ch as in greek for x (chi), it is sound of spanich j or german ch. So lets now try chalcodes or Chromatopelma with that.
Have a nice day.

 

[Andrea82]

Hello everybody, I am new here so I hope it will be ok to join this interesting discussion:


There are many ways to pronounciate latin, but the one in this link has nothing to do with latin at all ...


Really nice video, his pronunciation is almost perfect .

It would be possible to talk (or argue ? ) about latin for very long time, so there is just one thing for english speaking colleagues to think about today. In latin there is the same sound for ch as in greek for x (chi), it is sound of spanich j or german ch. So lets now try chalcodes or Chromatopelma with that.
Have a nice day.

careful man, you'll break English speaking peoples' tongues and throats.....
As a Dutch person, no trouble at all
Edit: realized mentioning US only wasn't very nice of me so changed to English

 

[Leila]

Hello everybody, I am new here so I hope it will be ok to join this interesting discussion:


There are many ways to pronounciate latin, but the one in this link has nothing to do with latin at all ...


Really nice video, his pronunciation is almost perfect .

It would be possible to talk (or argue ? ) about latin for very long time, so there is just one thing for english speaking colleagues to think about today. In latin there is the same sound for ch as in greek for x (chi), it is sound of spanich j or german ch. So lets now try chalcodes or Chromatopelma with that.
Have a nice day.

Spanich? Lol. Jk jk, I know that is a typo.

I do not mean this to be rude at all, but your suggestions for pronunciation comparisons at the end of your comment make zero sense to me.

 

[Andrea82]

Spanich? Lol. Jk jk, I know that is a typo.

I do not mean this to be rude at all, but your suggestions for pronunciation comparisons at the end of your comment make zero sense to me.

The 'ch' in Chromatopelma is pronounced 'k' in English. But the original pronunciation is different and a sound English (or French) people cannot easily produce. There is no equivalent to it in English. It sounds a little like the Mexican j in 'jalapeno'.

This is why I posted about breaking tongues and throats of you people

 

[Patherophis]

Spanich? Lol. Jk jk, I know that is a typo.

I do not mean this to be rude at all, but your suggestions for pronunciation comparisons at the end of your comment make zero sense to me.

My fault, too many ch in one sentence .
I am sorry for that comparisons, as that sound does not exist in english, I did not get better idea how to describe it . But as long as You would read it as k and not as /ch/ in "chat" or "choice", it is ok .

That nickname has been has been killing me too. But what if I told you that "oe" is a Latin dipthong pronounced with a long "e" sound? Yeah, I know. How Pedantic. As in the word Foetus or amoeba.

Yes, oe (same as ae) changes to long /eː/, but it should be more "bear" or "fair" sound, not "weed" sound .

 

[Vermis]

The 'ch' in Chromatopelma is pronounced 'k' in English. But the original pronunciation is different and a sound English (or French) people cannot easily produce. There is no equivalent to it in English. It sounds a little like the Mexican j in 'jalapeno'.

Might depend on how you pronounce lough/loch.

 

[Andrea82]

Might depend on how you pronounce lough/loch.

That still doesn't sound like the 'ch' pronounced in original way.
The 'gh' is the sound of 'f'. 'laughing' sounds like 'lehfing' in US, and laowfing in UK.
Sigh...very hard to get a point across when missing the vocabulary....