Calling all Hadrurus arizonensis keepers or better yet... experts

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no kidding i wanna hear an update as well. very curious and excited

 

Good to see you back m8 and glad to hear a few survived..

I was just wondering had the scorps who were eaten just molted?

Thanks, Gavin.

 

cheers...
Gav.

 

Awesome post and pictures! Thanks a ton! I hope someday to own and attempt to breed some of these guys.

~Fred

 

Great pics bro.
I currently have 3 little H. arizonensis 2I and i'm trying to raise m together i have m all in a 5 gal tank everything is going ok so far i try to keep food in the tank all the time just in case they get hungry . I also have a gravid H. spadix she can barely move, she looks like if she's about to pop.
Hopefuly very soon.

 

Good job with the Hadrurus. I'm interested in this thread because I have spent quite a bit of time investigating Urodacus yaschenkoi, a similar desert obligate burrower and a hell difficult species to keep.

I notice you have mentioned quite a bit about spraying water onto the sand surface etc, but you have not mentioned I dont think..apologies if wrong...you havent mentioned how much water was in the soil. If possible go to where these scorpions live and dig down to the depth of soil where they terminate the burrow. Take a soil sample and take it back home....weigh it and then heat it to remove water. Weigh again to discover the water content. It will be somewhere around 1-1.5% by mass, most likely. Bury a hygrometer at burrow base depth in a container in which air can pass and leave it over night in this soil. Dig it up the next day and you will see it reading 99%..most likely. What this means is that this scorpion lives in a subterranean environment where the soil is all but dry, but the atmosphere is nearly saturated. As the scorpion comes up the burrow, the temperature will increase (during the day) and humidity will change. Scorpions adopt different positions within the burrow to regulate water loss via dehydration and control metabolism. So, in your tank, if the soil is very dry underground the scorpions will be losing water via evaporative water loss and this needs to be replenished. Blocking the burrow serves to trap water.

The problem is maintaining the correct water levels in the soil and as sand loses water easily this is not an easy thing to acheve. One possible way I have thought of, but not used as yet is to create a false top rather than a false bottom. Fill the tank with sand to the depth required and mix in 1.5% water by mass, then cover the sand with glass or wood so it fits tightly in the tank. The wood should have a hole or two for a burrow entrance. Cover the wood with sand for looks etc and allow to dry to make it hard/stable. Have something poked into the soil through the hole so it can be located easily. Once dry, dig it out a little to allow the scorpion to find the right place to dig, clearly it wont be able to construct a burrow elsewhere. This method should trap water in the soil at the right levels and disallow water loss via evaporation. Meaning your Hadrurus will burrow into an environment similar to its natural environment. Your next concern will be temp to control metabolism. Underground at their depth probably 20-25C. I havent tried the above method yet, but I feel it will work. You could also include a false base to add water, but probably wont be needed as the rate of water loss via the one burrow hole should be minimal. Keep the tank as an open system so a humidity gradient can be created inside the burrow.

Any thoughts on that?

 

That sounds like quite a good idea Mark...definetly worth an investigation.

A couple of questions.
You mention a water content of 1.5% which i'm assuming is the mean average water content from your own area, or is this a general desert average?

Would you not have to add more than 1.5% water if you wanted a water content of 1.5% when the soil was dry.?

Many of your previous pictures show a heavily oxidated soil/sand. Heavily oxidated soil is warmer at depth (slightly) than other soil types because of the moisture reacting with the oxide (rusting). Maybe australian scorpions dont' experience such a large temperature gradient when moving up their burows towards the opening.
Have you ever researched anything along those lines.?

I think your false top system might be worth setting up for my O.wahlbergii. Although i imagine it'll take quite a while to dry out before the scorpion can be introduced.............................

Good idea though :clap:

/Bryan.

 

This is from my own area, you would need to establish some idea for each species, although with sand in general this figure should easily give rise to a good humidity gradient and have it feel nearly dry. It doesnt take much water to create humidity.

The idea is not to dry the soil out, you want the soil to have around 1.5% finished. If you pack the soil down hard and use a false top it will hold a burrow easily...at least the desert sands I use do.

I'm not sure why you would want to dry the soil out. 1.5% is virtually dry as it is. How are you going to generate humidity if the soil is dry? I use 1.5% because that is the water content of the soil at the maximum burrow depth, above this it is drier in summer and wetter in winter. After rain it reaches about 4% at the surface. I would say I could easily get away with 1% to generate the humidity.

I'm thinking even using cling wrap plastic across the soil might do the trick, at least as a preliminary experiment.


Here is a graph of temp readings from U yaschenkoi habitat.
The soil becomes cooler the farther down you go, at least in summer, in winter this may be reversed to some degree.

 

Alright, i'm with you.
It hadn't actually sunk in how little 1.5% water content was...but of course 15 ml of water in 1 kilo of sand isn't going to turn it into a slush den.

It would be interesting to get hold of other temperature graphs like yours for comparison.
It's interesting to note that there's a 50 degree flucuation in surface temperature but that from 20cm's down to 50cm's the fluctuation isn't more than a few degrees.
Have you a similar graph for the colder months?