Best Psalmopoeus for a beginner keeper (poll)

[ScorpionEvo687]

I think Avics are terrible starter tarantulas, too much involved in setting them up properly for the beginner. Especially the slings. So long as you don’t expect an animal you can hold, and you respect the animals space and capability during your rehousing, you will be fine. My first Ts after I caught a wild female Aphonopelma, were literally Pamphos and Pokies. I did fine.

I'm steering clear of Pokies just cause of the venom potency, but I think Psalmos are pretty cool. I kinda view em' as the NW Pokies with less medically significant venom. Are they the best for beginners? Probably not. Something like a Mexican Red-knee or a Curly Hair would admittedly probably be better. That said, it's not an OBT or H. mac or S. cal or something like that. Spiders that really should be left to only the most advanced of keepers.

 

[curtisgiganteus]

I'm steering clear of Pokies just cause of the venom potency, but I think Psalmos are pretty cool. I kinda view em' as the NW Pokies with less medically significant venom. Are they the best for beginners? Probably not. Something like a Mexican Red-knee or a Curly Hair would admittedly probably be better. That said, it's not an OBT or H. mac or S. cal or something like that. Spiders that really should be left to only the most advanced of keepers.

I think OBTs are a great intro to Old Worlds once you have had a Psalmo for a little while. No one expects you to raise an Aphonopelma from sling to adult before moving up the ladder. And if they do, they are idiots. Just don’t be an idiot yourself. So long as you do your research and not only know, but UNDERSTAND everything required of you as an owner of a defensive tarantula, you will be fine.

 

[viper69]

Okay but why? Just cause it can be speedy and has more potent venom than your average NW? (though not as much as most OWs).

I heard they're pretty hardy too. Definitely more so than a lot of Avics.

Avics are hardy too if you keep them properly!

Some people can’t handle a T that is fast, and utilizes all 3 dimensions regularly unlike NW terrestrials

I think OBTs are a great intro to Old Worlds once you have had a Psalmo for a little while. No one expects you to raise an Aphonopelma from sling to adult before moving up the ladder. And if they do, they are idiots. Just don’t be an idiot yourself. So long as you do your research and not only know, but UNDERSTAND everything required of you as an owner of a defensive tarantula, you will be fine.

But Ceratogyrus is even better

 

[ScorpionEvo687]

But Ceratogyrus is even better

Yeah I have heard darlingi & marshalli are decent for a "beginner" OW. I stated that the OBT is "advanced" due to their notoriously bad temper (of most specimens) & their more potent than average venom. Heard they are stupidly hard to kill though. Very easy husbandry.

I'm thinking I'll probably go w/ 2 P. cam slings and 1 irminia. Idk. More variety. Then maybe after a year or so of letting the slings grow maybe I'll consider a C. darlingi/marshalli if I feel like I'm up to it or maybe an A. ezendami. Some sorta good "beginner" old world.

I think Avics are terrible starter tarantulas, too much involved in setting them up properly for the beginner. Especially the slings. So long as you don’t expect an animal you can hold, and you respect the animals space and capability during your rehousing, you will be fine. My first Ts after I caught a wild female Aphonopelma, were literally Pamphos and Pokies. I did fine.

What is the temperament like on the Pamphobeteus sp.? I'm guessing probably feisty NW, though they're terrestrial & do have urticating hairs unlike the Psalmos. I've done very little to no research on Pamphos since as far as large NW terrestrial is concerned I've been more interested in species like A. geniculata & L. parahybana but now that I've seen images of a few of them I think P. sp. machala (Purple Bloom Tarantula) is absolutely GORGEOUS.

 

[jay444]

Are Psalmos really that bad temperament wise though? I mean yeah, I know they can definitely be VERY fast if startled, and have seen at least one video of it being very skittish during handling (which I do not intend to do) and have seen a short like 20 second clip on some dude's wall, but I've watched a few rehouse vids and they didn't really seem that nutty to me. I think part of it is just being careful and not startling the spider w/ constant poking and prodding or sudden jolting movements. And would it not still be better for a beginner at the very least due to having less potent venom than a Poecilotheria (even if more so than your average NW)? Sounds like a bite might kinda ruin your day (or 2) but probably won't land you in the hospital like a Pokie.

Yes they are more defensive and have a venom more potent than your usual NW, but it is not what makes them not suitable for beginner IMO. They are really bolty and nervous, which makes them very unpredictable. Most beginners would be more nervous around a spider with a behaviour that is so hard to read and predict, making them prone to doing mistakes. A more advanced keeper would know how to react against a threat posture, a random bolt or in choosing an appropriate rehousing technique. That being said, everybody has a different learning curve. If you make the jump when you feel that you are ready, you most likely are.

It’s a good transition genus for sure if you’re looking to make your way to keeping pokies.

 

[egyptiancrow]

not one less qualified than p imrinia to me. the apperance is beautiful when still but i imagine it will spook a new keeper with their speed and their fangs when they decide to run out the enclosure...

best starters will never be a psalmos. heres a list of "intermediate" t's to get before a hellion.

 

[ladyratri]

So... I'll preface this by saying, I only have 2 psalmos in my extensive collection of five (5) T's lol, and they are both irminia.

I had thought the P. irminia was the best looking, but the P. cambridgei is very quickly growing on me and sounds like it'd probably be easier to manage for a beginner.

I haven't seen a cambridgei in person, but in photos, their looks have not inspired me. My irminia however, I cannot get over how gorgeous she is.

Irminias are, in general, pretty reclusive spiders.

Individuals vary, as always. Somehow, I got a prima donna who literally poses for the camera (when she's isn't feeling too fat for photos i.e. premolt)

Allowing me to get like 3 inches away with the macro lens (and the enclosure lid open):


Posing for the camera the same day I rehoused her out of the sad pet store bin:

Are Psalmos really that bad temperament wise though?

If they have nowhere to hide? Yeah. Same gorgeous girl IN the sad pet store bin, after being carried from the car into the house:

Being carried from downstairs to upstairs:

I think Avics are terrible starter tarantulas, too much involved in setting them up properly for the beginner.

My first T was a 3/4 inch DLS A. purpurea. I made mistakes. I learned. It is thriving.

 

[Cmac2111]

What is the temperament like on the Pamphobeteus sp.? I'm guessing probably feisty NW,

Huge and hungry, Pamphos absolutely demolish food. Feisty? Maybe... IME they are more nervous than defensive, I have never had a threat posture from any of my Pamphos (albeit these are just my individuals, though I do have quite a few)... For comparison, my Phormictopus sp. (which are similar in both size and husbandry requirements with many Pamphobeteus) are extremely feisty... sometimes downright nasty. I'd rather deal with Pamphos than Phormics 100% Pamphos do kick hairs readily but so long as one is careful with them then that's not a big issue, they can move surprisingly quickly, and they get pretty MASSIVE. Their husbandry is similar to most other big tropical NW species. IMO, Pamphobeteus are some of the best spiders out there... might be in the minority with this statement but I HUGELY prefer them to the likes of LP/Geniculata. Note that the bright colors you're seeing were likely younger individuals or males, most females eventually lose the bright purples you see on juveniles (Pamhobeteus ultramarinus is an exception to this rule... they are a smaller Pampho species). Male Pamphos are some of the most spectacular looking spiders in the hobby, particularly when they mature.

My Largest. Over 9" DLS Pamphobeteus sp. Costa

 

[curtisgiganteus]

But Ceratogyrus is even better

I would say Ceratogyrus is better than psalmo lol

 

[ScorpionEvo687]

So... I'll preface this by saying, I only have 2 psalmos in my extensive collection of five (5) T's lol, and they are both irminia.



I haven't seen a cambridgei in person, but grin photos, their looks have not inspired me. My irminia however, I cannot get over how gorgeous she is.



Individuals vary, as always. Somehow, I got a prima donna who literally poses for the camera (when she's isn't feeling too fat for photos i.e. premolt)

Allowing me to get like 3 inches away with the macro lens (and the enclosure lid open):
View attachment 438193

Posing for the camera the same day I rehoused her out of the sad pet store bin:
View attachment 438194



If they have nowhere to hide? Yeah. Same gorgeous girl IN the sad pet store bin, after being carried from the car into the house:
View attachment 438196
Being carried from downstairs to upstairs:
View attachment 438197



My first T was a 3/4 inch DLS A. purpurea. I made mistakes. I learned. It is thriving.
View attachment 438199

I'll definitely make sure they have places to hide in their enclosures. I want to keep em' happy as possible.

Yes they are more defensive and have a venom more potent than your usual NW, but it is not what makes them not suitable for beginner IMO. They are really bolty and nervous, which makes them very unpredictable. Most beginners would be more nervous around a spider with a behaviour that is so hard to read and predict, making them prone to doing mistakes. A more advanced keeper would know how to react against a threat posture, a random bolt or in choosing an appropriate rehousing technique. That being said, everybody has a different learning curve. If you make the jump when you feel that you are ready, you most likely are.

It’s a good transition genus for sure if you’re looking to make your way to keeping pokies.

I should add that I'll probably get 3 slings either 3 P. cams or 2 P. cams and 1 irminia. Was originally thinking of going for a 5"-6" female P. cam for $175 & them maybe a sling of something else (Psalmo or otherwise) but have since changed my mind. I've been talking to a very experienced keeper here on Arachnoboards and he thinks it'd be best if I got a few slings instead cause it'd be a lot cheaper and getting 3 or so I'd still probably end up with at least 1 mature female once grown & also my experience level would grow w/ the spiderlings (slings). He thinks a MF Psalmo right off the bat might be "too much spider" for a new keeper, and I've never even owned a T at all (just 2 scorps which I got fairly recently and are stupidly easy to care for and can't even climb glass). He has 2nd instar P. cams for $9 and 2nd instar irminia for $14.

I would say Ceratogyrus is better than psalmo lol

Perhaps. Would you say they're generally calmer than Psalmos even the ones that are a little more mild tempered (such as the P. cams, generally speaking)? And I know they're terrestrial (or fossorial, though I'm not really sure) so probably won't be moving in 3 dimensions most of the time.

 

[curtisgiganteus]

I'll definitely make sure they have places to hide in their enclosures. I want to keep em' happy as possible.
I should add that I'll probably get 3 slings either 3 P. cams or 2 P. cams and 1 irminia. Was originally thinking of going for a 5"-6" female P. cam for $175 & them maybe a sling of something else (Psalmo or otherwise) but have since changed my mind. I've been talking to a very experienced keeper here on Arachnoboards and he thinks it'd be best if I got a few slings instead cause it'd be a lot cheaper and getting 3 or so I'd still probably end up with at least 1 mature female once grown & also my experience level would grow w/ the spiderlings (slings). He thinks a MF Psalmo right off the bat might be "too much spider" for a new keeper, and I've never even owned a T at all (just 2 scorps which I got fairly recently and are stupidly easy to care for and can't even climb glass). He has 2nd instar P. cams for $9 and 2nd instar irminia for $14.


Perhaps. Would you say they're generally calmer than Psalmos even the ones that are a little more mild tempered (such as the P. cams, generally speaking)? And I know they're terrestrial (or fossorial, though I'm not really sure) so probably won't be moving in 3 dimensions most of the time.

My 6” female P camb is evil. She threat poses at feeders. My I mira just shuffles along quickly during rehouses lol

 

[ScorpionEvo687]

My 6” female P camb is evil. She threat poses at feeders. My I mira just shuffles along quickly during rehouses lol

Just looked up pics of I. mira. Quite pretty. I like their blue feet.

My 6” female P camb is evil.

Who's feistier your P. cam or your Cyriopagopus sp. Hati Hati? Lol. I could get a sling as a freebie if I spend over $100 at this one in-state dealer of mine. I know C. lividus is known to have a nasty temper and I doubt the Hati Hati is much different. Tarantula Collective ranked C. lividus #1 on his "most defensive tarantulas" list.

 

[coolnweird]

P. reduncus was my second tarantula and first ever sling, I would highly recommend! Mine is pretty laid back and I've had very little issues with her speed. I also have a P. Cambridgei sling, and it's been more skittish and bolty than my reduncus was as a sling. That said, temperament can vary greatly between different specimens. I think psalmos can be a bit intimidating for beginners, but if you're careful, calm, and do lots of research, I think any of them would be great!

 

[ScorpionEvo687]

P. reduncus was my second tarantula and first ever sling, I would highly recommend! Mine is pretty laid back and I've had very little issues with her speed. I also have a P. Cambridgei sling, and it's been more skittish and bolty than my reduncus was as a sling. That said, temperament can vary greatly between different specimens. I think psalmos can be a bit intimidating for beginners, but if you're careful, calm, and do lots of research, I think any of them would be great!

A lot of people would consider them to not really be "advanced" but more "intermediate". Their venom isn't as strong as that of a Pokie or an arboreal baboon but they have the speed. Heard they're quite hardy though. I don't think they'd be terrible for a beginner, and Tom Moran (Tom's Big Spiders) mentioned in his Psalmopoeus Genus Review video that he thinks reduncus could make a decent introduction to the genus for a beginner.

 

[curtisgiganteus]

Who's feistier your P. cam or your Cyriopagopus sp. Hati Hati? Lol. I could get a sling as a freebie if I spend over $100 at this one in-state dealer of mine. I know C. lividus is known to have a nasty temper and I doubt the Hati Hati is much different. Tarantula Collective ranked C. lividus #1 on his "most defensive tarantulas" list.

Who's feistier your P. cam or your Cyriopagopus sp. Hati Hati? Lol. I could get a sling as a freebie if I spend over $100 at this one in-state dealer of mine. I know C. lividus is known to have a nasty temper and I doubt the Hati Hati is much different. Tarantula Collective ranked C. lividus #1 on his "most defensive tarantulas" list.

My Hati Hati have character. I get threat poses from my 1” slings and my big females.




My C lividus is just shy. She may give me a slap but then she just bolts for her hole. I personally don’t like how Tarantula Collective keeps a lot of his tarantulas tbh. If you give a C lividus 10” - 12” of substrate you will never get a threat pose unless you dig her out. Same for an OBT. Give em enough sub and they will make intricate tunnel systems and are less likely to get defensive. I keep primarily Asian arboreals and a few baboon species. My C lividus and Hati Hati are far from the most defensive Ts I own. My L nigerrimum lives in a threat pose.

 

[lindale450]

Okay but why? Just cause it can be speedy and has more potent venom than your average NW? (though not as much as most OWs).

I heard they're pretty hardy too. Definitely more so than a lot of Avics.

I would say it’s completely possible to keep this species as a beginner but not for everyone and if you have never rehoused a spider before this is a poor species to start with, once you wet your feet you will know fairly soon if you’re ready for more spider or if you need more time. Again I really think some of the dwarf species can make great stepping stones to see what your comfortable with, pick up a Neoholothele incei and if there speed doesn’t bother you when rehousing a couple times then look at a Psalmopoeus, these spiders can hit 4-5” in a year and may exceed your comfort level to perform calm rehousings. I only have the irminia so maybe my opinion is biased but I just find them to be unpredictable, one rehousing they’re fairly easy to deal with and then the next they are very apt to bolt or be defensive.

 

[ScorpionEvo687]

I would say it’s completely possible to keep this species as a beginner but not for everyone and if you have never rehoused a spider before this is a poor species to start with, once you wet your feet you will know fairly soon if you’re ready for more spider or if you need more time. Again I really think some of the dwarf species can make great stepping stones to see what your comfortable with, pick up a Neoholothele incei and if there speed doesn’t bother you when rehousing a couple times then look at a Psalmopoeus, these spiders can hit 4-5” in a year and may exceed your comfort level to perform calm rehousings. I only have the irminia so maybe my opinion is biased but I just find them to be unpredictable, one rehousing they’re fairly easy to deal with and then the next they are very apt to bolt or be defensive.

I'll consider it. An N. incei could be an option. One of the dealers I'm looking at has a 2" female N. incei for $95 and 2" female N. incei gold color form for $110 & also has N. incei olive 1.5" slings for $35.

 

[curtisgiganteus]

I'll consider it. An N. incei could be an option. One of the dealers I'm looking at has a 2" female N. incei for $95 and 2" female N. incei gold color form for $110 & also has N. incei olive 1.5" slings for $35.

I’ve never had an incei or any ceratogyrus, but I can’t reccomend I Mira enough. Smoothest rehousing I had ever done for an old world

 

[viper69]

Yeah I have heard darlingi & marshalli are decent for a "beginner" OW. I stated that the OBT is "advanced" due to their notoriously bad temper (of most specimens) & their more potent than average venom. Heard they are stupidly hard to kill though. Very easy husbandry.

I'm thinking I'll probably go w/ 2 P. cam slings and 1 irminia. Idk. More variety. Then maybe after a year or so of letting the slings grow maybe I'll consider a C. darlingi/marshalli if I feel like I'm up to it or maybe an A. ezendami. Some sorta good "beginner" old world.


What is the temperament like on the Pamphobeteus sp.? I'm guessing probably feisty NW, though they're terrestrial & do have urticating hairs unlike the Psalmos. I've done very little to no research on Pamphos since as far as large NW terrestrial is concerned I've been more interested in species like A. geniculata & L. parahybana but now that I've seen images of a few of them I think P. sp. machala (Purple Bloom Tarantula) is absolutely GORGEOUS.

they are tough as nails

like an OW GBB re killing

 

[Pillenslikker]

I'll consider it. An N. incei could be an option. One of the dealers I'm looking at has a 2" female N. incei for $95 and 2" female N. incei gold color form for $110 & also has N. incei olive 1.5" slings for $35.

Maybe a Heterothele villosella or Heterothele gabonensis are T's you can consider, these are small tarantulas from Africa and are normally very docile.