# Homemade water gel...



## Quiet-1

Has anyone ever tried using the plain, non-flavored gelatin as a water source for feeder insects? It is found next to all of the "Jello" products in the store, but as far as I can tell it is just gelatin. Just experimenting with different options for my feeders. Thanks in advance for any responses/comments/suggestions!


----------



## jbrd

*non-flavored gelatin as a water source*

My old lady (jbrdsrose) says that it will virtually dry up within a day and that more than likely you will have to add water everyday.


----------



## Texas Blonde

Check local asian markets, or health food stores for Agar agar.  Its sort of expensive, but worth every penny.  It makes a gel when heated in water or fruit juice.  I personally make it with organic blueberry juice, and add pieces of banana and spirulina powder into the mix as well.  My roaches love it, its almost always gone in a couple of hours.  You have to keep it in the fridge once you have turned the agar crystals into a gel, but it will last for months if covered well.


----------



## the_frog_kid

*gel*

i will haft to try that agar agar 
i know friends who say its good for crix but i dont know about roaches 
i used gelitin and because it is a animal by product it rots very quickly  
smells terrible
that is if you use it for roaches in the right temp 
i think over 70 it will rot 
hope this helps 




thanx froggy


----------



## cacoseraph

if you are looking for something that you can leave for days and days to ensure hydration of feeders/nonpreds agar would pretty much be the opposite of the way you want to go

it is what is used to culture bacteria etc in labs....

plus, i can't imagine it is cheaper than water crystals


----------



## Jaygnar

I just use the watering crystals that are found in the plant department of most stores like home depot or lowes. The crickets get plenty of water and they cant drown themselves.


----------



## Drachenjager

watersorb sells the crystals for about $18 for 2 pounds of crystals. it takes about 1 oz to make 16 oz size when hydrated. Thats plenty cheap id say OH and the price includes shipping


----------



## ScorpDemon

There's a product the store I used to work at sells, it's called Soil-Moist. It's one of the ones mentioned that you can get in the garden department of Lowe's, Wal-Mart, K-Mart, or any farm supply store that carries a lot of gardening supplies.

If you're looking for a cheaper alternative to buying "Cricket water" type products, I used to get like 8-9 gallons worth for 8 bucks.


----------



## the_frog_kid

*water crystals*

i sell a differant type of water crystal
alot better for roaches than the soil stuff 
soil stuff is a petrolium by-product 
and is a form of rubber 
mine is the exact same but it is natural 
a by-product of the manufacting of wheat (wheat? no sure but a grain i know that)
i sell it for more but if you breed rarer specie it is worth it 
i have 20 specie of roches and they all love it




thanx froggy


----------



## ScorpDemon

I've grown up around farming all my life, and I can assure you, wheat is grown, not manufactured.
Maybe you mean it's a by-product of processing wheat?


----------



## the_frog_kid

yes thats what i meant thankx for correcting me 
i dont know how it ties in




thanx froggy


----------



## Quiet-1

*agar clarification...*

Just a quick point of clarification, although used in labs, agar itself is not used to culture bacteria, but rather to gel the culture broth and provide a solid substrate for bacterial cultures rather than a liquid one.
And since it was mentioned, this was the reason I started this post/question:  A lot of the water crystal compounds out there are synthetic polymers or by-products of some other synthesis reaction.  This is why I was asking about natural gelling compounds such as agar and gelatin.  This is a two-fold interest.  First, it should be safe for the feeder and provide the water/moisture necessary.  Second, if safe for the feeder, it should also be safe for whatever will eventually eat the feeder and any residual compound(s) within it.
Interestingly, I have also had people respond saying that they do not use crystals of any kind.  Instead, they spray/mist the enclosure and provide a source of "wet" food such as fruits, vegetables, greens, etc. as a source of water.


----------



## Texas Blonde

I provide no water source besides the agar, which I only make occationally, and water rich vegetables.  I buy large packages of precut snack carrots, and the roaches love them.  The carrots seem to mold slower than other such vegetables.  I also give them zuchini, squash, and cucumber for moisture.  

It works well, I keep 17 different species, 5 in large numbers.  Plus, I live in an extremely dry area.  If the humidity hits 20% we think its raining.


----------



## Randolph XX()

u can add in all sorts of different liquid in agar
yougurt, banana even red bull, which is said very good for expending adult beetles lifespan according to the beetle ppl


----------



## Frogsarethapoop

Agar is a solid at room temperature and doesn't turn into a liquid until near 50C. Therefore it would be a rather crappy water source. What happened to using paper towel soaked in water? It's simple and free!


----------



## Bayushi

FrogmanJ said:


> What happened to using paper towel soaked in water? It's simple and free!



it also breeds bacteria or dries out in a few hours and gets consumed by the crix/roaches


----------



## Frogsarethapoop

Bayushi said:


> it also breeds bacteria or dries out in a few hours and gets consumed by the crix/roaches


It would dry out after a few hours if you used a 1 cm by 1 cm piece of paper towel. Use a much larger piece. Anything will breed bacteria if you don't change it and let it get bad. I change my paper towel twice a week, and each time it is still damp from the previous change. Never had any problems with it, and there really isn't any simpler method! If there is I'd love to hear it.


----------



## Texas Blonde

FrogmanJ said:


> Agar is a solid at room temperature and doesn't turn into a liquid until near 50C. Therefore it would be a rather crappy water source. What happened to using paper towel soaked in water? It's simple and free!


Agar is a solid crystal at room temp, until it is heated with a liquid, and then it turns into a gel at room temp.


----------



## Frogsarethapoop

Well yeah, I work with bacteria cultures and bacteriophage on a regular basis. I fail to see how any aspect of agar is a good water source. Are you telling me that the solid crystals are a good water source? If someone could enlighten me that would be great because I have access to all the free agar and petri dishes and any laboratory equipment for free. In my years I have never found a better water source than water. Always willing to learn new things and upgrade.


----------



## Arlius

The agar isn't so much a water source as an all-in-one source (food&moisture&vitamins,etc)


----------



## Frogsarethapoop

Arlius said:


> The agar isn't so much a water source as an all-in-one source (food&moisture&vitamins,etc)


But agar isn't moist, therefore it has no moisture...


----------



## Drachenjager

*Water crystals*

I just got in 2 pounds of water crystals , i put 1 fl oz ( shot glass full) into a 16 oz Water Jell jar sole by one of the cricket companies i wont identify lol and added 16 oz of water. it absorbed all of the water and over filled the jar.. Less than 1.50 for over 16 oz of hydrated jell. I also believe it would hold much more water if i had added more i am going to test that theory in a few mins


Ok i added 16 oz more water and it absorbed it and made 2 16 oz jars of hydrated water jell... for about 1.50 worth of crystals lol i may have to sell this stuff.


----------



## Frogsarethapoop

Drachenjager said:


> I just got in 2 pounds of water crystals , i put 1 fl oz ( shot glass full) into a 16 oz Water Jell jar sole by one of the cricket companies i wont identify lol and added 16 oz of water. it absorbed all of the water and over filled the jar.. Less than 1.50 for over 16 oz of hydrated jell. I also believe it would hold much more water if i had added more i am going to test that theory in a few mins
> 
> 
> Ok i added 16 oz more water and it absorbed it and made 2 16 oz jars of hydrated water jell... for about 1.50 worth of crystals lol i may have to sell this stuff.



You need to post a link for others to get some. I can definately put up $1.50.


----------



## Texas Blonde

FrogmanJ said:


> But agar isn't moist, therefore it has no moisture...


If you had read higher in the thread you would see the directions for making it into a gel.  I add two tablespoons to about 3 cups of liquid, then bring it to a simmer.  When it cools, it forms a gel.  If you get the stuff from a health food store, the back of the package also gives directions.


----------



## HuonHengChai

Agar agar is jelly in malay 
they come cheap where i'm from, gonna try making for my roaches


----------



## Frogsarethapoop

Texas Blonde said:


> If you had read higher in the thread you would see the directions for making it into a gel.  I add two tablespoons to about 3 cups of liquid, then bring it to a simmer.  When it cools, it forms a gel.  If you get the stuff from a health food store, the back of the package also gives directions.


OK cool, thats what I was looking for. I never knew you could make it into a gel. What type of liquid do you use, water?


----------



## Thoth

FrogmanJ said:


> Well yeah, I work with bacteria cultures and bacteriophage on a regular basis. I fail to see how any aspect of agar is a good water source. Are you telling me that the solid crystals are a good water source? If someone could enlighten me that would be great because I have access to all the free agar and petri dishes and any laboratory equipment for free. In my years I have never found a better water source than water. Always willing to learn new things and upgrade.





FrogmanJ said:


> OK cool, thats what I was looking for. I never knew you could make it into a gel. What type of liquid do you use, water?


  I'm not sure how that can be unless you work with premade media.  

Agar can hold about 200 times its weight in water in a gel form, without losing structuiral integrity. You can use water, juice, broth et c. but the other liquids increase the chances of it growing mold or bacteria. If any one has had those little jelly cups from Asian markets those are made from agar. Other names I have seen it go by is conjac, conyac, and conyakku.

One advantage over gelatain is it will dry slower.


----------



## Frogsarethapoop

I am a student. We use pre-made stuff.


----------



## Frogsarethapoop

I think this would be more suited for a water source.

http://www.wormman.com/pd_cricket_crystals.cfm


----------



## Texas Blonde

FrogmanJ said:


> I think this would be more suited for a water source.
> 
> http://www.wormman.com/pd_cricket_crystals.cfm



Here is a good article on what those crystals are made of.  It explains very well why I dont use it, and dont recommend it.  

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyacrylamide


----------



## Thoth

Just to make clear the link, polyacrylamide is safe acrylamide is not. Personally I tend to avoid polyacrylamide just because of the risk of unpolymerized acrylamide, just because I work with acrylamide and don't need the additional exposure. 

Though the only way to be exposed to toxic levels of acrylamide is to work with it on a laboratory or industrial scale regularly. So any trace that maybe present is relatively harmless

http://www.inchem.org/documents/pims/chemical/pim652.htm


----------



## sithlord

Hey can you please tell me what size polymer to get for my crickets and roaches? Watersorb site has 4 choices. thanks.


----------



## Zurc

Hey guys this will sound kinda wierd but i just use a water dish for my roaches with water and some beach little rocks inside to prevent drownings, it work better them i initialy think (babies float very well) i never had a single casualty... I just add water to the dish and clean weekly...


----------

