# Found an unfamiliar scorpion species!ID?



## neubii18 (Nov 10, 2010)

So I was looking around the field across from my house,and happened upon 2 scorpions of a species I am unfamiliar with:clap:.They are about an inch long,maybe shorter.I found them under separate cement blocks.I'm really excited.I've lived in this house for 3-4 years without a trace of scorpions,and now I found some!I'm probably going to black light tonight to see if I can find more!Anyways,here's a picture.I'm obviously not keeping them in these deli cups,they are just what I caught them in.


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## kevin88 (Nov 10, 2010)

Hmmm thats an interesting one!  You can narrow it down using this. 

http://sparkless.net/matt/SanDiego.htm

Good luck 

Kevin


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## neubii18 (Nov 10, 2010)

Definately got me stumped!Can't even get an idea on the species...


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## gromgrom (Nov 10, 2010)

Paruroctonus sp.


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## neubii18 (Nov 11, 2010)

gromgrom said:


> Paruroctonus sp.


What makes you think that?


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## H. laoticus (Nov 11, 2010)

Sweet find 

I actually think it's some sort of Vaejovis sp.
spinigerus, maybe?


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## neubii18 (Nov 11, 2010)

I was thinking vaejavous(spelling?) or seradigitus.I don't think spingerus though.They are teeny tiny though.I thought the first was just a baby,but then I found another of the exact same size,so I figure they are probably at adult size.I'm excited either way!


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## kevin88 (Nov 11, 2010)

Looks to big to be a serridigitus, claws are way to big as well. 

Kevin


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## neubii18 (Nov 11, 2010)

So you think maybe vaejavous?


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## Michiel (Nov 11, 2010)

Definetly not Serradigitus, these are much smaller and whole different habitus. It looks like a Vaejovid to me, but Paruroctonus could also be correct. I am not into US scorps and I just can say that it is not Serradigitus....


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## Malhavoc's (Nov 11, 2010)

Vaejovis waueri 
just a guess.


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## gromgrom (Nov 11, 2010)

asn1234 said:


> What makes you think that?


educated guess? it looks like previous pics i've seen.


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## Treynok (Nov 11, 2010)

Vaejovis intermedius is my guess, could you get a picture from a slight side angle, a close up of the claw, and maybe a ventral/pectine shot?

These are listed for Texas and Mexico but Southern California isn't a long shot to think they could be there.  They match the area.

Send me a few and I'll give a positive ID :}


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## John Apple (Nov 11, 2010)

U. mordax  ?


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## neubii18 (Nov 11, 2010)

It looks very similar to Vaejovis waueri,except they lack the stripes that I've seen in pictures.The description of Vaejovis Intermedius seams to fit,except that I've read they are a very "stingy" species,which mine are not.Maybe they were just cold when I found them or something.I found them under rocks,and the rocks they were under were only about a foot apart.Also,if they are Vaejovis,they should be communal,correct?


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## telow (Nov 11, 2010)

thats not Vaejovis Intermedius ive had a few of those and they are alot different ane the claws are thiner and they are different in color
http://bugguide.net/node/view/439189/bgimage


pseudouroctonus sp. is what i think you have

http://www.vaejovidae.com/Genus Pseudouroctonus.htm
check that out its a bit of reading but it will be worth it


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## H. laoticus (Nov 11, 2010)

telow said:


> thats not Vaejovis Intermedius ive had a few of those and they are alot different ane the claws are thiner and they are different in color
> http://bugguide.net/node/view/439189/bgimage
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, I was going to guess reddelli next as well, but I'm not sure if these guys are distributed in CA, too.


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## telow (Nov 11, 2010)

reddelli i think is just in texas but im not sure
im not realy to fond of vaejovidae realy they are ok but ill stick to centruroides haha man wheres luc when you need him haha


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## neubii18 (Nov 11, 2010)

I'm gonna take those pictures right after I post this.I put them together in a tub just to see how they reacted together,and suprisingly,they didn't even seem to aknowledge each others presense.They would run into each other(and on each other),and not react at all.This was much different from the Anuroctonus pocki and paruroctonus silvestrii I'm used to finding,who when I did the same thing,instantly raised up in position and stung when they made contact.I am now keeping them together in a 6" diameter delicup with cocoa fibre,bark,and flat rocks like what I found them in.I will monitor them,and try to spot any agression towards each other.I would love to find 10-15 of them and have a large communal colony setup going.We'll see what I can do!Thanks for everyones attempt to ID!Hopefully we can figure out what I've got.I would love to breed them and get them into the hobby,as they are a small species that would be really cool to have as a "desk pet",or in a huge communal setup.


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## neubii18 (Nov 11, 2010)

Okay,here are some more pictures.These are the best I could get with my camera:


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## kevin88 (Nov 11, 2010)

Did you happen to look at the link I posted for all of the local scorps in your county? 

It looks like a Pseudouroctonus sp.....of which there are 4 in your area lol.

Kevin


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## Nomadinexile (Nov 11, 2010)

Not a V. waueri nor V. intermedius nor P. reddelli.

However, I do think it has a similar look to the P. reddelli.   I would look into the Psuedouroctonus species in your area.

http://www.angelfire.com/tx4/scorpiones/index.html      ~great distribution 

http://www.ntnu.no/ub/scorpion-files/     ~great gallery


http://desert-scorpions.com/main.html      ~focused on Chihuahuan desert, but can be used to compare to many of the species/genus' already guessed.

http://eycb.pagesperso-orange.fr/scorpions/GamNord.htm    ~this is the N.A. gallery.   I don't think your species is there, but you may get some ideas from pictures of its relative

Good luck!     

You may want to look for SCABIES too, some of its members may know.


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## neubii18 (Nov 13, 2010)

Still can't decide.I definately agree that is most likely pseudoroctonus,but I have no clue when it comes to the species.The angelfire site has names but not many pictures of this genus.I'm thinking it's vajavous or Pseudoroctonus.hmmm...and Cacoseraph hasn't been online for almost a month.He's local,and he's part of scabies.

Oh,and I found another one.Now I have 3!


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## telow (Nov 13, 2010)

pseudouroctonus iviei or pseudouroctonus minimus    

you could always send me a male and female and i can tell you then


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## neubii18 (Nov 13, 2010)

Still can't decide.I definately agree that is most likely pseudoroctonus,but I have no clue when it comes to the species.The angelfire site has names but not many pictures of this genus.I'm thinking it's vajavous or Pseudoroctonus.hmmm...and Cacoseraph hasn't been online for almost a month.He's local,and he's part of scabies.

Oh,and I found another one.Now I have 3!


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## neubii18 (Nov 13, 2010)

Sorry,double posted 

Does any one have some pictures of the 2 species you mentioned above,or other species that they might be?


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## telow (Nov 13, 2010)

Pseudouroctonus iviei

http://bugguide.net/images/cache/DK...06QRSVQDKAQZS4KLSMKF0BQRS6QHSNQY0XKJ09QA0.jpg

http://bugguide.net/images/raw/1H7H...Z2HYH7LRREHRR7LYHNHHRGHEZKLVZML9ZMLNZNHYH.jpg

http://bugguide.net/images/raw/0L2Z...L5ZMHGZHLGZ5H1HXH3H7LRRPHHR8LFH6HYHMLNZIL.jpg


Pseudouroctonus minimus

http://bugguide.net/images/cache/BK...KGKZSNQOKIKDKAQC0LKUK4QD04QA0EQUKLKPKEQEK.jpg


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## Nomadinexile (Nov 14, 2010)

pictures can often get you an I.D. if you are in an area with very few specimens.   Generally though, you have to look at the specimen under magnification and confer with the species description to be sure.   

For example, in Austin Texas, there are two species.   I can tell you in the dark with a black light from 10 feet away what I'm looking at. 

Another Texas location I am familiar with has 5 species.   I can tell you two of them under black light, and the other three with a decent white light.   

Then there is another location that I have only been once, I know a few of the species in light there, but most I can't I.D. without the help of others.   (because my morphology knowledge is limited right now).

So unless there are only a few in the area, and you are sure of this, consider getting really good macro pics to post, or send them out to one of our experts, or you will have to learn morphology and look at them under magnification and compare with specie descriptions.

Good luck!   

Ps.   I would still try getting info from what you have and reading online, it's not like it's going to hurt.   Get to know what species are in your area.  You might just figure it out yet.


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## neubii18 (Nov 14, 2010)

Thank you everyone who posted suggestions!I really appreciate it!

They are definately Psuedoroctonus,a the metadoma looks identical to almost evey pic of the genus I've seen.I think they really look like Iviei,but the pic of the other one wasn't very good,and looked kinda similar as well.are both those species in So Cal?Who could I send one to that could give me a positive ID?


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## telow (Nov 14, 2010)

yeah pictures are ok in some cases but to get a positive id on alot of species
you have to go by granulation patterns on this area or that area 
and you would have to have the know how on that stuff to do it right
and these ive never kept so it would take me a while because i would
have alot of reading to do and all that fun stuff that you have to findout before you can be sure your correct on your work and being this is not a species i have kept it would take me more time and i would have to break out my microscope for that but its in use for some centruriodes stuff im working on right now 

but i sent you a pm contact him he will help you out.

hahahahaha funny enough now i want  1.1 of these hahahaha
and i normaly only keep centruroides and other buthids but hey i love scorps


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## H. laoticus (Nov 14, 2010)

Yup, they are small, but very nice looking


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## telow (Nov 14, 2010)

i wish those pics were bigger and closer it would be easier
but im still betting on Pseudouroctonus iviei


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## neubii18 (Nov 14, 2010)

I can try to get better pictures.I'll post them tomorrow.I would agree with Iviei though.Any ideas on how I would go about sexing them?


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## telow (Nov 15, 2010)

adult sizes
males about 25 mm 
females about 30 mm

pectinal tooth count 
females 10
males 11

bla bla bla haha

if you can get a close up of the claws on each one i thing we would be able to tell the sexes i believe the males have a bolder ridge on the claw and are nor a smooth as the females but to tell that you may need to have both sexes but who knows maybe we can tell by that

haha these are getting more and more intresting to me now


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## neubii18 (Nov 15, 2010)

They are waaay to small to count the pectines  ,but I did notice that the most recent one(3rd) that I caught is about 7 mm longer than the first 2 I caught,which leads me to believe I have 2 males and a female.the suspected female is also a little darker,and has a slightly different genital opening at the base of the pectines.I'm near positive it's the same species.I'll post pics tomorrow or Wednesday.Thanks for the help!

Also,I would just like to say that these are some sweet scorpions.They have a funny personality.They are also very mysterious,as I knowso little about them(neither does anyone else).There is kittle to know info that I have found on them.They're really cool.They look really cool as well.I'm very happy that I found them!


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## telow (Nov 16, 2010)

its possable that coule be a way to tell but with the little known stuff
on these but hey who knows maybe it is 1 way to tell

very intresting little scorps (i like that)


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## H. laoticus (Nov 16, 2010)

telow said:


> its possable that coule be a way to tell but with the little known stuff
> on these but hey who knows maybe it is 1 way to tell
> 
> very intresting little scorps (i like that)


Will someone Please sent Telow  a pair of these!?  (and me too) 
During a school break in the near future I am gonna take a road trip near your area asn to see if I can find any--I'm pretty close to you already


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## telow (Nov 16, 2010)

hahahahahhaahaha your silly bro hahaha


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## neubii18 (Nov 16, 2010)

H. laoticus said:


> Will someone Please sent Telow  a pair of these!?  (and me too)
> During a school break in the near future I am gonna take a road trip near your area asn to see if I can find any--I'm pretty close to you already


I could probably take you to the area where I found them.I only go every now and then,as there is a homeless guy that often sleeps up there on cold days,and I don't like to disturb him.They were pretty easy to find.


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## telow (Nov 16, 2010)

what kind of habbitat were these found in ?


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## neubii18 (Nov 17, 2010)

'm not quite sure how to profile the habitat.I'll get some pictures of where I found them tomorrow.I live in oceanside,CA.


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## H. laoticus (Nov 17, 2010)

asn1234 said:


> 'm not quite sure how to profile the habitat.I'll get some pictures of where I found them tomorrow.I live in oceanside,CA.


Sweet, habitat pics would be great


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## neubii18 (Nov 17, 2010)

I just found what I think is a baby of the same species.It's a little longer than a centimeter.I think it has just molted,and that's why it's that kinda golden white color.Tell me what you guys think!

It's in a 2oz deli cup:


Here is a size reference to my pinky finger:

And here's the habitat:

Here is the 3rd one that I found.It's like 7 mm longer than the first 2.It's also quite a bit darker.Do you think this is a different sp.,colorform,or a sexual dimorphism?:




Thanks everybody!


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## telow (Nov 18, 2010)

the pic with the adults on the rules i see a male and a female

the last pic shows 2 males 1 females based on this

i can see a little size difference in the claws shape and ridges ext.
the color is a bit darker on females and that is showing in those pics
the females body is a bit wider that the males (just my input guys)

i believe you have 1 female and 2 males and 1 youngin

the little guy looks to be the same species 

go find some more haha


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## H. laoticus (Nov 18, 2010)

The more I look at them the more attractive they are.  Very nice thick tails, bulky bodies, and fat claws--Yes, find some more and start breeding them native species


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## neubii18 (Nov 18, 2010)

I will definately be finding more so we can get these in the hobby.The only thing is that I have no experience with breeding scorpions,so I will be looking for experienced breeders to breed them for the most part.


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## the toe cutter (Nov 18, 2010)

Those are a really awesome NA species! There are plenty of people I'm sure who would love to get a few, including myself!


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## telow (Nov 18, 2010)

i would for sure there cool and i could do some stuff with them
like getting the info out to people how to id these under rated little guys
 any time for sure


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## neubii18 (Nov 19, 2010)

Sorry,didn't have time to get better habitat pictures.I went up and forgot the camera.I will try to get out and get some and post tomorrow before I leave for week to Montana.


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## neubii18 (Mar 12, 2011)

Just thought I'd bump this thread up to see if anyone wanted to take a crack at IDing them?The baby I found has almost doubled in size.I still have the same 4 specimens.It's started to warm up,so I should be able to go find more soon.


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## telow (Mar 14, 2011)

im still on the same id on these but from a pic its gonna be a guess
let me know when you get a couple more and ill get you a id asap after that


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## neubii18 (Mar 16, 2011)

It's starting to warm up a lot,so I reckon they'll be out soon.I've already found 2 other species that I found a lot of last year,but the spot is different than where I found these guys.


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