# Keeping wild spiders.



## SandDeku (Apr 5, 2011)

Okay. SO I decided to make a new thread so people would more or less know what Iam asking. I already got my question answered for the ID.  But now my question is. What spiders from new jersey are possible to keep in captivity? I like spiders that do not hide/burrow. I rather look at it. Even if its not active. 

Would you guys be able to provide pictures and actual places where I can physically find them? Can you find them at this time of year? If so how long would they live? Can you get them to breed so you can have an offspring so you can start from birth to death.?


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## The Spider Faery (Apr 5, 2011)

Just keep a Parasteatoda tepidariorum or a Steatoda triangulosa the next time you find one.  You won't have to worry about necrotoxic venomous bites and they stay out in the open

I can totally vouch for my S. triangulosa.  She hangs upside down on a web thread all the time.  And can they breed?  Oh yes!  Lol....10 sacs later I've got lots of babies to choose from to, as you say "have offspring from birth to death". 

Or just post us a pic of the next spider you find and we'll give you the lowdown.


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## SandDeku (Apr 5, 2011)

cyanocean said:


> Just keep a Parasteatoda tepidariorum or a Steatoda triangulosa the next time you find one.  You won't have to worry about necrotoxic venomous bites and they stay out in the open
> 
> I can totally vouch for my S. triangulosa.  She hangs upside down on a web thread all the time.  And can they breed?  Oh yes!  Lol....10 sacs later I've got lots of babies to choose from to, as you say "have offspring from birth to death".
> 
> Or just post us a pic of the next spider you find and we'll give you the lowdown.


Wow I just went outside to my backyard. Flipped some rocks. First found a few centipedes, woodlouse/roleypoley and then I flipp my last rock and I found a spider! all insects were sluggish. I kept the spider. Its in a container. Ill take a picture soon.


Actually.... I can't take a picture because only cam I have is my moms. She wont lend it to me. but ill describe it. Its an inch long from eye view(not exact measurement) Its  dark brown, and has a tan brown stripe running along from the head to the rump. I think it maybe a female. Since the rump is slighlty bigger than the head.

It looks exactly like this:
http://www.iknowaguypestcontrol.com/images/grass spider.jpg

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...=1t:429,r:2,s:17&tx=95&ty=48&biw=1024&bih=566

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cyanocean said:


> Just keep a Parasteatoda tepidariorum or a Steatoda triangulosa the next time you find one.  You won't have to worry about necrotoxic venomous bites and they stay out in the open
> 
> I can totally vouch for my S. triangulosa.  She hangs upside down on a web thread all the time.  And can they breed?  Oh yes!  Lol....10 sacs later I've got lots of babies to choose from to, as you say "have offspring from birth to death".
> 
> Or just post us a pic of the next spider you find and we'll give you the lowdown.


Wow I just went outside to my backyard. Flipped some rocks. First found a few centipedes, woodlouse/roleypoley and then I flipp my last rock and I found a spider! all insects were sluggish. I kept the spider. Its in a container. Ill take a picture soon.


Actually.... I can't take a picture because only cam I have is my moms. She wont lend it to me. but ill describe it. Its an inch long from eye view(not exact measurement) Its  dark brown, and has a tan brown stripe running along from the head to the rump. I think it maybe a female. Since the rump is slighlty bigger than the head.

It looks exactly like this:
http://www.iknowaguypestcontrol.com/images/grass spider.jpg

http://www.entomology.wisc.edu/insectid/images/id_full/grass-spider.jpg 

---------- Post added at 06:00 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:58 PM ----------

 http://www.dpughphoto.com/images/grass spider durham 42207.JPG

So i highly think its a high spider. It was hiding under some rock/gravel site. 
It was hiding under something like this(but red) http://i.ehow.co.uk/images/a07/8a/0e/design-small-backyard-gravel-800X800.jpg 

---------- Post added at 06:07 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:00 PM ----------


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## malevolentrobot (Apr 5, 2011)

cyanocean said:


> Just keep a Parasteatoda tepidariorum or a Steatoda triangulosa the next time you find one.  You won't have to worry about necrotoxic venomous bites and they stay out in the open
> 
> I can totally vouch for my S. triangulosa.  She hangs upside down on a web thread all the time.  And can they breed?  Oh yes!  Lol....10 sacs later I've got lots of babies to choose from to, as you say "have offspring from birth to death".


true that, my triangulosa is a baby makiing MACHINE. dropped a sac, and dropped another one just recently before the first even hatched out. its absolutley ridiculous.

they are very cool to look at (and mine doesn't hide unless you count chilling directly under the lid of the vial sometimes), especially if you like how widows look, but don't want the potentially dangerous bite. i just wish they'd get bigger, but there are other steatoda that do i believe.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 5, 2011)

i would say it is more likely for a Steatoda to mess you up than a Cheiracanthum... they are widow cousins.


it cracks me up when ppl are piss scared of sac spiders and think all Steatoda are totally harmless.


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## SandDeku (Apr 5, 2011)

Mk so anyone got a caresheet for grass spiders? And I'm thinking of acquiring another different species later on. One that lives a bit older.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 5, 2011)

grass spiders are really easy


to make sure you get the neatest web possible include a prebuilt hole and some structure for the spider to spin on.   it'll probably ignore the prebuilt hole, but sometimes they do take to them. to see a full web with aerial trip lines you need a fairly tall tank with a lot of vertical elements to it, but that is not necessary.  treat them like a dry arboreal tarantula spiderling, more or less.  they need to eat a bit more often but smaller meals than an equivalent sized tarantula


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## spider pest (Apr 5, 2011)

Honestly, the best advice I can offer is, no matter what you keep, don't go too crazy on setup details, and resist the urge to overfeed. give your spiders a basic setup, don't rearrange it, and let them settle in.


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## SandDeku (Apr 5, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> grass spiders are really easy
> 
> 
> to make sure you get the neatest web possible include a prebuilt hole and some structure for the spider to spin on.   it'll probably ignore the prebuilt hole, but sometimes they do take to them. to see a full web with aerial trip lines you need a fairly tall tank with a lot of vertical elements to it, but that is not necessary.  treat them like a dry arboreal tarantula spiderling, more or less.  they need to eat a bit more often but smaller meals than an equivalent sized tarantula


Uhh what do I feed em? Ima get some of the moss on one of my terrariums. ill use that as the substrait. Since you said they are arboreal. 

I have large crickets, earthworms at home right now.


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## The Spider Faery (Apr 5, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> i would say it is more likely for a Steatoda to mess you up than a Cheiracanthum... they are widow cousins.
> 
> 
> it cracks me up when ppl are piss scared of sac spiders and think all Steatoda are totally harmless.


Well yes Steatoda as a genus has some _potentially_ dangerous venom, but not S. triangulosa.  They're the most innocent of the bunch.   Plus, all venom aside, Steatoda are slower than sac spiders and far easier to deal with in captivity.  A person is not likely to easily get bitten by one.  They're not challenging to keep from escaping like a sac spider would be.


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## SandDeku (Apr 5, 2011)

spider pest said:


> Honestly, the best advice I can offer is, no matter what you keep, don't go too crazy on setup details, and resist the urge to overfeed. give your spiders a basic setup, don't rearrange it, and let them settle in.


Ehh Iam making it simple  j ust to test it out.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 5, 2011)

yep. nope. still boggling me.


triangles almost certainly are not nearly as bad as grossa can be.  but to totally dismiss them in the same thread you steer someone (assuming the necro ref is for Cheira's) away from spiders that, you know, lack the possiblity of human effective neurotoxins just seems... well, dumb.


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## SandDeku (Apr 5, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> yep. nope. still boggling me.
> 
> 
> triangles almost certainly are not nearly as bad as grossa can be.  but to totally dismiss them in the same thread you steer someone (assuming the necro ref is for Cheira's) away from spiders that, you know, lack the possiblity of human effective neurotoxins just seems... well, dumb.


Do spiders need a water dish?


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## cacoseraph (Apr 5, 2011)

some do, some don't.


grass spider's really don't at all.  just spray the cage every once in a while so that it doesn't totally dry out and they will get all the moisture they need from food


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## The Spider Faery (Apr 5, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> yep. nope. still boggling me.
> 
> 
> triangles almost certainly are not nearly as bad as grossa can be.  but to totally dismiss them in the same thread you steer someone (assuming the necro ref is for Cheira's) away from spiders that, you know, lack the possiblity of human effective neurotoxins just seems... well, dumb.


No the reference was to Parasteatoda tepidariorum or a Steatoda triangulosa not being necrotoxic (not comparing them to any spider in particular), just meaning they're a safe bet to keep, not comparing to the yellow sac spider, which is cytotoxic.  I don't appreciate being called dumb, by the way.  Sorry if my post didn't connect logically to you.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 5, 2011)

i didn't call you dumb, that would be against the rules. that was a dumb mistake of you to make 



ok, but they are neurotoxic.  you know what, i give up.  you don't win, i just give up.  cheers


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## grayhound (Apr 5, 2011)

I suggest a Phiddipus audax.  I caught mine in my kitchen about 7 months ago.  I built it a nice terrarium, and it thrives in there.  It is gorgeous, roams around all of the time, and is a cricket hunting machine!!!!  I THINK you can find them around there...... they're pretty prevalent all over the USA....


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## Pssh (Apr 5, 2011)

I have some S. grossa if you want them. I've tons around the house. I dont think I've ever been bitten, though they are the only spiders I see in the house except daddy long legs spiders, so maybe. They aren't aggressive and would rather run (at least mine are like that.) 

The woodlouse spiders like to burrow near the sides of the enclosure so you can pretty much always see them.  It lets you get a nice close up look at their giant fangs that fold over.


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## The Spider Faery (Apr 5, 2011)

And then greyhound's siggy says "Never give up!"  Too funny.

Yellow sac spider's venom can cause destruction of skin cells, so yes it is cytotoxic.  cyto=cell   toxic=well we all know what that means.  It can destroy skin cells.  It can cause a necrosis of sorts.

Winners...losers...We're just posting to try and help people, it's not a contest.

And we all love those arachnids.


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## SandDeku (Apr 5, 2011)

grayhound said:


> I suggest a Phiddipus audax.  I caught mine in my kitchen about 7 months ago.  I built it a nice terrarium, and it thrives in there.  It is gorgeous, roams around all of the time, and is a cricket hunting machine!!!!  I THINK you can find them around there...... they're pretty prevalent all over the USA....


YOU just made my effin day man. Iam sorry for the outburst now. But that there just made me giddy.  That's exactly the type of spider Iam looking for. Active hunter(not a necessity, BUT a plus), voracious eater(preferance), and the look! Its so snappin' gorgeous!

I mean sure its small but still. One thing I gotta ask. I just set up the small enclosure for my grass spider its in a what I think is 3gallons. I cant even see it. . . It blends in with the dirt so well its hard to see and  its hiding. D: it's an invisible pet....


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## cacoseraph (Apr 5, 2011)

cyano, no offense, but is english not your primary?


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## The Spider Faery (Apr 5, 2011)

It's one of my best subjects.  I achieve in the 90's at the advanced level.  But why are you attacking me in this way?  By the way, I'm glad you found the type of spider you were looking for, SandDeku.


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## SandDeku (Apr 5, 2011)

cyanocean said:


> And then greyhound's siggy says "Never give up!"  Too funny.
> 
> Yellow sac spider's venom can cause destruction of skin cells, so yes it is cytotoxic.  cyto=cell   toxic=well we all know what that means.  It can destroy skin cells.  It can cause a necrosis of sorts.
> 
> ...


Ehh tbh. Iam not a spider expert. SOOO.... I couldn't keep up with all the arguements. I got lost and ended up ignoring that part. Though I must say theres alot of competition on here. 

As for spider set ups. Can I use a terrarium made by zoomed? Its 12x12x12 big. OR is it too big?
Any other substraits I can use? Can I use gravel? So I can buy white gravel for better looking? (i have slight eye sight issue... its why I said I wanted something that doesnt hide alot)

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cyanocean said:


> It's one of my best subjects.  I achieve in the 90's at the advanced level.  But why are you attacking me in this way?  By the way, I'm glad you found the type of spider you were looking for, SandDeku.


Ehh its competition I guess---or so I think. Iam keeping out of it for my sake. since Iam quite stubborn and well highly persistent. Not really the best person to argue with. xD I don't let go at all. And I think that would be a good spider species. but Iam also wondering what other spiders are similar to that and if anyone knows if I can buy spiders online as well?


Though I may have just been won over solely on his photography. sometimes animals aren't as they appear to be on the photos. xD I learnt that the hard way.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 5, 2011)

i'm not attacking you, i am questioning some fairly inconsistent advice given to someone who could possibly be put in danger from following it


silly me, of course


you turned someone away from a genus of little consequence to one of possibly much greater... and then keep giving totally inappropriate, non-cogent definitions of stuff as replies.    i'm just trying to establish your actual competency is all


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## The Spider Faery (Apr 5, 2011)

I think you're right, SandDeku.  He does see it as a competition.  Questioning my competency in arachnid knowledge, I can take.  I've only been in the hobby since April of '09, so it's probably likely you're more knowledgeable in that area, cacoseraph.  I can't take questioning my competency in English grammar.  Seriously, my classmates in college wanted to make me a T-shirt that said 'grammar queen', just because I had the highest marks in English class.  Silly you, indeed.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 5, 2011)

touting your english abilities doesn't make you look smarter, that was kind of my point.  sad i had to, you know, actually go and say it




ok, well then, hows about you don't suggest anymore kinda possibly dangerous genera in lieu of kinda not really dangerous genera and then we can call it even?

you learned something, i had a laugh.




see, i honestly don't understand where the confusion is.  you swapped out a spider that can't really do anything to a person for one that possibly can.  simple as that.  lol, thought i


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## The Spider Faery (Apr 5, 2011)

My English abilities are better than yours. :}  Just looking at your sentence structure, use of commas and lack of capitalization where there should be a capital proves that.

And again, you're misunderstanding.  I said that S. triangulosa and Parasteatoda tepidariorum are safer than Cheiracanthium, which they are!

By the way, I'm a shy girl and all this attention to me is making me blush.  I'm not used to being 'called out' without cause.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 6, 2011)

it's really tough to say which is safer.  the risks from both are rather small. the point is that you suggested like, the one genus (yes, triangulosa is not as strong as grossa for humans in the average case. but only idiots only consider the average case in neurotoxins) that is not an improvement out of dozens that are.  an araneus is fine.  nothing in them is markedly neurotoxic with regards to humans.


so, the point, in small words, slowly typed, is this:  don't knock one mildly dangerous spider for another, that's all


i'm not calling you out.  i'm pointing out that if someone is already ascared of sacs then telling him another spider that is pretty much just as reasonably dangerous, and yes, i'm talking about triangles, not the genus in general.... probably not the nicest thing you can do


but i'm the roosterhole, aren't i?

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SandDeku said:


> Uhh what do I feed em? Ima get some of the moss on one of my terrariums. ill use that as the substrait. Since you said they are arboreal.
> 
> I have large crickets, earthworms at home right now.




well, they aren't exactly arboreal.  i mean, they make a big sheetweb with a funnel at one end and some genera/species make aerial triplines above the sheet, if they can.  sometimes all this is above ground level. sometimes the sheet is above ground level (generally on grass...) but the spider's funnel actually goes into a hole or under a rock or something like that.  pretty much, if the cage is small the spider will cover it in webbing. if it is bigger it will do it's best to.  unless something is totally off or it's MM or something.

the biggest grass spiders can probably tackle adult crickets, but it would be better to rip the jumping legs off.  otherwise, they can pretty much eat anything a bit smaller than them.  they will scrap wth stuff, but if it looks like too much of an even contest or if they are relatively well fed they won't really fight their food much.  most bugs are like, inherently conservative, in a sense


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## SandDeku (Apr 6, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> it's really tough to say which is safer.  the risks from both are rather small. the point is that you suggested like, the one genus (yes, triangulosa is not as strong as grossa for humans in the average case. but only idiots only consider the average case in neurotoxins) that is not an improvement out of dozens that are.  an araneus is fine.  nothing in them is markedly neurotoxic with regards to humans.
> 
> 
> so, the point, in small words, slowly typed, is this:  don't knock one mildly dangerous spider for another, that's all
> ...


Rather than use the word "idiot" just not use it at all? It may be taken as less mean. food for thought...

As for MM I don't know what that is. Iam going to take out all the ornaments in there and leave one hidey hole. since I cant even see it.


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## The Spider Faery (Apr 6, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> ascared of sacs


See, now this is where the latent English teacher in me really comes out, because that word (that isn't really a word) just makes me cringe!  Ascared?  Lol...you meant that to be funny, right?

By the way, I appreciate this last post.  You worded it more respectfully towards me.  Please try and understand, I'm not intending to wrong the guy but offering what I perceive to be advice.  I'm not looking for trouble or arguments.  In fact, SandDeku pmed and to say hi.  I am sure he is not offended by what I said.


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## SandDeku (Apr 6, 2011)

cyanocean said:


> See, now this is where the latent English teacher in me really comes out, because that word (that isn't really a word) just makes me cringe!  Ascared?  Lol...you meant that to be funny, right?
> 
> By the way, I appreciate this last post.  You worded it more respectfully towards me.  Please try and understand, I'm not intending to wrong the guy but offering what I perceive to be advice.  I'm not looking for trouble or arguments.  In fact, SandDeku pmed and to say hi.  I am sure he is not offended by what I said.


No I'm not. I'm more offended when someone displays information to me in a nasty way I suppose. My english is horrible. I am not american persay(legally yes--but cultural no).


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## cacoseraph (Apr 6, 2011)

because it is fun to use the word idiot


and if miss english actually reads my posts without some silly bias and actually reads what i wrote she will find i never really talked about her at all.  and her idea is... dumb.  it's no big deal, i do dumb stuff all the time. i just try not to suggest dumb things that might get other ppl hurt on accident.



you can not imagine how boring it could get answering the same things hundreds of times. sometimes i got to spice it up.   btw, you know what i am doing this weekend?  working at a bug show for 2 or 3 days, 8 hours straight answering the same questions hundreds of times. i will likely be hoarse by the end.  i'll try to make a video if it will be glorious enough =P

---------- Post added at 10:22 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:17 PM ----------




cyanocean said:


> See, now this is where the latent English teacher in me really comes out, because that word (that isn't really a word) just makes me cringe!  Ascared?  Lol...you meant that to be funny, right?
> 
> By the way, I appreciate this last post.  You worded it more respectfully towards me.  Please try and understand, I'm not intending to wrong the guy but offering what I perceive to be advice.  I'm not looking for trouble or arguments.  In fact, SandDeku pmed and to say hi.  I am sure he is not offended by what I said.


yes,  because you started saying how great you are at the english and yet said i called you dumb or an idiot when i most certainly did not.  so i decided to tease you, by having like... better ideas than you couched in worse english. i thought it was funny a heck, and at the end of the day, that's all that really matters

and tbh, all of them are about equally "insulting". they are how i would talk to a small child to whom i want to make sure to get my point across to. sorry =P  i either have to keep simplifying or just give up.  given that it's not just a potential bug injury we are looking at but a human i thought i should try again a few more times.  plus, it really is quite funny


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## The Spider Faery (Apr 6, 2011)

I was actually enjoying reading your posts until you started with the name calling, cacoseraph.  Isn't it possible to get your ideas across without degrading a person?

There are many, many people on here who truly do not speak English as their primary language and it shows.  So why are you picking on me?  You're the one with the bias.  It's like people can sense I'm just a nice person and try to get their jollies out on the nice one.

Well spew off all the arachnid facts you want.  In the end, kindness and manners are always the higher wisdom.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 6, 2011)

now see, here's were i got to say that is a dumb thing to say


i'm trying to tell the person the spider you suggested as harmless is not and is direct generic cousin to species that can really bring on the hurt.


to me, that trumps some sort of insipid sugar coating.  but i guess that is the er, evil in me





also, my posts are almost always informative AND funny.  you should read more of them.  don't take it personal if you were wrong or whatever. it happens


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## The Spider Faery (Apr 6, 2011)

Some may disagree as to whether or not I was wrong.

A sac spider is more likely to bite than the two I suggested...that's the way I see it!  So maybe now you can understand where I was coming from.

And there's no sugar coating here.  I mean what I say.  I'm authentic and genuine.  If I give someone a compliment, I mean it.  I speak from the heart.  It comes naturally.

Even if I was wrong in my facts, you were wrong in your name calling and the way you went about trying to degrade me.  THAT was personal and not sticking strickly to the facts.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 6, 2011)

sheesh.  are you *sure* e is your p?
read what i wrote. i never called you anything.  like, seriously.




not really.... i've only ever been bit by P. tep of all the spiders we've talked about.   i've had steatoda look to nibble me before.  it's almost like... i have experience and know what i'm talking about or something.  shocking!


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## jsloan (Apr 6, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> (yes, triangulosa is not as strong as grossa for humans in the average case.


Can you point me to some peer-reviewed papers so I can read up on the venom of this genus?


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## Silberrücken (Apr 6, 2011)

jsloan said:


> Can you point me to some peer-reviewed papers so I can read up on the venom of this genus?


I would like to see those papers also.


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## Pssh (Apr 6, 2011)

http://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&q=steatoda+venom&btnG=Search&as_sdt=0,5&as_ylo=&as_vis=1


There you go! Steatoda papers!


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## grayhound (Apr 6, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> YOU just made my effin day man. Iam sorry for the outburst now. But that there just made me giddy.  That's exactly the type of spider Iam looking for. Active hunter(not a necessity, BUT a plus), voracious eater(preferance), and the look! Its so snappin' gorgeous!
> 
> I mean sure its small but still. One thing I gotta ask. I just set up the small enclosure for my grass spider its in a what I think is 3gallons. I cant even see it. . . It blends in with the dirt so well its hard to see and  its hiding. D: it's an invisible pet....


I really don't know much about grass spiders......  With my audax though, I made a custom all acrylic enclosure with a front opening door and a custom robc style backdrop.  It is 12 x 12 x 12.  I think that is around 3 -4 gallons.  That is probably considered too large for such a small spider, but in the wild these jumping spiders can attack with a 10 - 20 foot jump onto their prey, so i wanted to give it plenty of room to "pounce" on its prey..... which it does!!...  It is REALLY cool to watch!   My audax is always active and roaming during the day..... they are daytime hunters!  It has a few small web retreats that it hides in once in a while, but even those are against the acrylic and still allow you to see the spider.

Please forgive me for hijacking this post back to its original topic.....


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## The Spider Faery (Apr 6, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> sheesh.  are you *sure* e is your p?


Are _you_ sure?  Your slang is horrible, with this being an ironic example.

Here's the bottom line.  Somewhere along the lines you confused an entire genus with one species.  I suggested the OP get a Steatoda triangulosa, not any other Steatoda.

This is what the Wikipedia definition says about this species in relation to why I suggested it:



> They are not aggressive. Other, larger members of the Steatoda genus do have medically significant bites, but there are no recorded bites or envenomations by this spider. (Steatoda triangulosa).


Did you read that?  No recorded bites or envenomations by this spider!

Here's the rest of the page, if you want to read it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triangulate_cobweb_spider


And I have experience with all three of the species we're discussing: S. triangulosa, P.  tepidariorum, and Cheiracanthium species, so I'm not just reading information on the net, but also have the firsthand experience to back what I'm claiming.

That's all for me.  Have a good day everyone.


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## grayhound (Apr 6, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> because it is fun to use the word idiot
> 
> 
> It's FUN to use that word???  I always thought it was fun to do stuff like playing video games, shooting pool, camping, etc.  Man, If i knew it was fun to use that word, i could've saved myself a lot of time, and money over the past years doing the things i always thought were fun.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 6, 2011)

blue:  i don't care what wiki says.  it's an ok resource if you follow all the links, but other than that you have no idea where that info is coming from.   edit: yeah, see that article sucks.  it has no inline citations so you don't know where their info is coming from.   that bite statement is not backed up by anything so it's pretty much valueless.  don't they teach you how to use wiki in school these days?


 i have read hundreds of papers and am almost positive it has in fact been implicated in bites with greater than zero effect.   no spider in the genus can really said to be harmless in the way that something like an Argiope orb weaver is.  so, suggesting one as a better, safer alternative than a sac spider is stupid.   i've said it six times in six different ways.  apparently i've lost my touch.  and i used to think i could teach monkeys calculus.  woe is me.

also, learn what ironic means. that isn't it.




gray: stick to what you're good at. this ain't it.   there is no exclusivity implied, so all those other things can still be fun   also, please try to remain on topic and not crap it up with worthless drivel.  or if you *are* going to insert worthless drivel, please try to make it funny, at least.


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## grayhound (Apr 6, 2011)

QUOTE : gray: stick to what you're good at. this ain't it. there is no exclusivity implied, so all those other things can still be fun  also, please try to remain on topic and not crap it up with worthless drivel. or if you *are* going to insert worthless drivel, please try to make it funny, at least. 


Stick to what I'm good at, and this AIN'T it????  What's that supposed to mean?  Also.... I personally thought the comment i made was pretty funny.  I just don't see where saying that word is "fun"

Anyway.... i'm not on here to argue and bicker.... so .... you win, i lose!:worship:  I take back everything i said, and will no longer post on this thread!


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## cacoseraph (Apr 6, 2011)

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=welcome+to+the+internet

i'm not telling you to click on the second hit... but you might want to consider it


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## SandDeku (Apr 6, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> because it is fun to use the word idiot
> 
> 
> and if miss english actually reads my posts without some silly bias and actually reads what i wrote she will find i never really talked about her at all.  and her idea is... dumb.  it's no big deal, i do dumb stuff all the time. i just try not to suggest dumb things that might get other ppl hurt on accident.
> ...


Pfft. That is insulting all over. Even if its not even directed at me. You can work at a bug show. You can be an expert. Just don't be mean about it. It only makes people go away and not learn and do mistakes. Why do you think so many people give bad care to animals? Because for one they ask a professional and the professional acts so smug about it and rudely they just decide to do it on their own. when the professional didn't learn it on his own. He/she had used a book, or the internet, or another professional. But not him/herself. 

Just wanted to put it out there. It probably is dangerous what she told me. But doesn't mean I'd go out there and get it. I'm very patient about things and I wait for everyones replies before I make a decission. And even then Iam still too paranoid to physically handle a spider so I would wear gloves or catch it with some tool of a sort.

---------- Post added at 10:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:27 PM ----------




grayhound said:


> I really don't know much about grass spiders......  With my audax though, I made a custom all acrylic enclosure with a front opening door and a custom robc style backdrop.  It is 12 x 12 x 12.  I think that is around 3 -4 gallons.  That is probably considered too large for such a small spider, but in the wild these jumping spiders can attack with a 10 - 20 foot jump onto their prey, so i wanted to give it plenty of room to "pounce" on its prey..... which it does!!...  It is REALLY cool to watch!   My audax is always active and roaming during the day..... they are daytime hunters!  It has a few small web retreats that it hides in once in a while, but even those are against the acrylic and still allow you to see the spider.
> 
> Please forgive me for hijacking this post back to its original topic.....


Lol that's okay!  I would like to learn to be very honest. I learn easier with kindness if it makes sense. Kinda leaves my mind more open--rather than it closing up. Anywho. I figured they could be a potential threat of a sort. Due to their jumping. How would you deal with that to be able to clean the tank without touching the spider or arachnid?

---------- Post added at 10:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:33 PM ----------




grayhound said:


> cacoseraph said:
> 
> 
> > because it is fun to use the word idiot
> ...


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## Pssh (Apr 6, 2011)

Have you seen his post count? I doubt he would still be here if he was trollin' all over the place. I sort of agree with him. People need to read the words and not put untyped ones in the sentence. The tone of the text is what you want it to be. You might think it sounds incredibly rude while it was written with a very different intention. No need to make stuff up because your brain wanted it to be rude.


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## SandDeku (Apr 6, 2011)

Pssh said:


> Have you seen his post count? I doubt he would still be here if he was trollin' all over the place. I sort of agree with him. People need to read the words and not put untyped ones in the sentence. The tone of the text is what you want it to be. You might think it sounds incredibly rude while it was written with a very different intention. No need to make stuff up because your brain wanted it to be rude.


That's why I told him he should avoid using the word dumb. but he disregarded it. I never wanted it to be rude. why would I want it to be rude?


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## spider pest (Apr 6, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> That's why I told him he should avoid using the word dumb. but he disregarded it. I never wanted it to be rude. why would I want it to be rude?


I think you should try to chill out a bit. You seem to be all over the boards asking questions and stirring things up. I know you want the advice of the people who post here, but you might want to try searching around a bit first. Enthusiasm is great, but I think it will be better served by trying to absorb some of the information and pictures here first. Read some of the older threads here about spiders and insects you're interested in, and get out into your backyard and neighborhood and local parks. That's the fun part. I live in NJ as well, and the outdoors is beginning to come alive. There is much to see!


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## SandDeku (Apr 7, 2011)

spider pest said:


> I think you should try to chill out a bit. You seem to be all over the boards asking questions and stirring things up. I know you want the advice of the people who post here, but you might want to try searching around a bit first. Enthusiasm is great, but I think it will be better served by trying to absorb some of the information and pictures here first. Read some of the older threads here about spiders and insects you're interested in, and get out into your backyard and neighborhood and local parks. That's the fun part. I live in NJ as well, and the outdoors is beginning to come alive. There is much to see!


Iam not trying to stir anything up. I was merely defending someone I thought wasn't doing anything wrong to begin with. I was nice about it; I don't wanna go online just to see someone be smug about something---I could go to school for that. Or a job, where Iam actually getting paid. Not saying you're being smug. Just making a general statement to clarify stuff up. Iam posting specific questions. Because almost always my questions are very specific. I never seem to find what Iam looking for. Plus as stupid as it sounds. I don't know h ow to use a forums search engine. Well this ones at least.  

I understand that caco may have been right. But towards the other poster he would have done better by going the nicer way out. You yourself saw how he reacted to not just 1 person, but 2. He's intelligent, no doubt. But things should be approached diplomatic. If I'm looking just for the facts I could just pick up a book and read it. No, Iam looking for personal experience/advice. Stuff in new jersey has come to life. But I don't know where to search without getting in trouble. Most places where Iam it's either tresspassing or just plain dangerous. 

I don't know what's the best place for finding stuff like frogs, toads, beetles, spiders, millipedes, etc. I mean there are woodlands. But I almost never find anything. I only find toads, snakes, frogs every now and then. and more so at the "muskellunge reservoir"  I think thats how its spelled. Its in morris town. 

I'm literary a newbie to insects asides the very very basics. There is no bug species list for new jersey. You can google it. You can try finding it. I'ved tried soooooooooo many times now its not even funny. And when I do end up finding basic information---never tells me how to keep it or how long it lives or whatever.

Ps: I myself am easily offended; due to the fact Iam highly sensitive and emotional. But, I do try to help people out if I feel they're getting picked on. Iam not trying to stir anything up. But its not like if I told someone "stop being mean" which I think I did if I recall, they would do it. 

I have a totally different view of things than you or alot of people. SOOOO I -may- be wrong on what I said regarding the problematic behavior. I do ask a lot of questions. I just don't know how to make or come up with a topic to answer everyone of them.

It's because spring is here I'm trying to learn the most I can. So when I go out into the field Iam equiped not only with physical tools, but with knowledge and wisdom. So when I see a yellow spider I know not to come near it. Or if I see a brown recluse to immedietly stomp on it. 

Idk. I apologize if Iam comming off as a jerk, or if Iam comming off as a trouble maker. Those are not my intentions though--believe me on that.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 7, 2011)

i think some of the ppl here don't really get how forums work



sure, i'm talking to you all right now... but i'm also writing for posterity.  the problem is that potentially you aren't just giving sandy advice of a highly dubious nature... but anyone else that searches up this thread.


sandy has qualified for me not caring what happens to it.  but even i am not sociopathic enough to fire a gun into a crowd like you are doing, blue.  well, sure, some crowds happily.  but not randomly


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## SandDeku (Apr 7, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> i think some of the ppl here don't really get how forums work
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Question the name "blue" keeps appearing... Who is blue? 

-Iam going to bed now as Iam getting cranky and more emotionally drained have a good night everyone.-

Ps: I do get how forums work; just rather not have that feeling like I'm being pecked at(figurative speech meaning sorta like feeling bullied). Nor like to see it happen to others. Iam sure if it happened to you- you can take care of yourself. Still would be rather upset to see it happen. Even if its to you--since I have nothing against you. Sure, you may have come off rude but it's not too bad. Still though.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 7, 2011)

cyan    = blue



so, for the record, you would rather have me be polite and get you bit by a neurotoxic spider.  got it.


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## Silberrücken (Apr 7, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> Okay. SO I decided to make a new thread so people would more or less know what Iam asking. I already got my question answered for the ID.  But now my question is. What spiders from new jersey are possible to keep in captivity? I like spiders that do not hide/burrow. I rather look at it. Even if its not active.
> 
> Would you guys be able to provide pictures and actual places where I can physically find them? Can you find them at this time of year? If so how long would they live? Can you get them to breed so you can have an offspring so you can start from birth to death.?


Shall we get back on track? :wall:


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## malevolentrobot (Apr 7, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> Because almost always my questions are very specific. I never seem to find what Iam looking for. Plus as stupid as it sounds. I don't know h ow to use a forums search engine. Well this ones at least.


stolen from joe's (xhexdx) sig - nifty search function tutorial. now you're a real AB member, you've already been told to "search moar".



spider pest said:


> I think you should try to chill out a bit. You seem to be all over the boards asking questions and stirring things up. I know you want the advice of the people who post here, but you might want to try searching around a bit first. Enthusiasm is great, but I think it will be better served by trying to absorb some of the information and pictures here first. Read some of the older threads here about spiders and insects you're interested in, and get out into your backyard and neighborhood and local parks. That's the fun part. I live in NJ as well, and the outdoors is beginning to come alive. There is much to see!


sanddeku, please do this.

honestly, i haven't found your questions to be particularly unique, they have been asked before (and will be asked again) and i have a vague feeling you want the hobby to hand you all of it's information on a silver platter. beware of trusting just one source of information, or even just the search function on this site.

and that is not a shot at anyone in this thread. i have learned a fair amount from posts by both main contributing members, and understand what caco means. pull up an old thread from early 2000's with outdated (sometimes laughably so) advice and you'll see where caco is coming from and is trying to accomplish.

maybe you'll get it once you check out the tutorial.


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## What (Apr 7, 2011)

cyanocean said:
			
		

> blah





			
				cacoseraph said:
			
		

> counter blah





			
				cyanocean said:
			
		

> retort





			
				cacoseraph said:
			
		

> counter retort


Please stow it, both of you, there is dispute even among arachnologists as to the nature of these fun little spiders venom... If you get bitten show due diligence and clean the bite to prevent infection and watch for an allergic reaction, then sit back and enjoy the mild tingle or slight ache. 

The spiders wont kill you, they might make your fingertip a little unpleasant or not... Do we really need however many posts back and forth about this? :?


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## spider pest (Apr 7, 2011)

SandDeku,

In case you didn't see it before, check out this page and click around on the "Spider Fact Sheets" links on the right to see some pictures and habitat information. This is for Pennsylvania spiders, but most if not all of them are also found in NJ.

Guide to Commonly Found PA Spiders
http://ento.psu.edu/extension/factsheets/commonly-encountered-pennsylvania-spiders

Also, here is a link to pictures taken in New Jersey on BugGuide.net:
http://bugguide.net/adv_search/bgse...dult=&immature=&male=&female=&representative=


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## SandDeku (Apr 7, 2011)

spider pest said:


> SandDeku,
> 
> In case you didn't see it before, check out this page and click around on the "Spider Fact Sheets" links on the right to see some pictures and habitat information. This is for Pennsylvania spiders, but most if not all of them are also found in NJ.
> 
> ...


But I never seen them in my parts.... Iam in north NJ  round morris town. :/ I find nothing there except the common yellow sacs, occassional wolfs, and grass spiders.

I dont know exactly where to look for them.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 7, 2011)

What said:


> Please stow it, both of you, there is dispute even among arachnologists as to the nature of these fun little spiders venom... If you get bitten show due diligence and clean the bite to prevent infection and watch for an allergic reaction, then sit back and enjoy the mild tingle or slight ache.
> 
> The spiders wont kill you, they might make your fingertip a little unpleasant or not... Do we really need however many posts back and forth about this? :?


what what what.   i am so disappoint in you.  the point is that the OP is piss scared of sac spiders and triangles are no better suggestion than them.   blue is giving blithe, bad advice and i won't stand for it.   

it's not that i think triangles or Cheira can really mess someone up. far from it. i'm the guy who plays with them all.   it's the fact that blue didn't even bother to tell that Steatoda genus is a near cousin to the widow genus (and are called false widows)  and that triangles could regionally or human specifically have a potent bite.   i'm glad she spent 5 seconds wiki'ing it. but i have spent years and years reading as many medical journals and other sources of literature that i can.... and i am almost positive triangles HAVE been implicated in bites at least as bad as sac spiders.   


i am honestly confused by this thread.  cuz normally when i am the safety police ppl thank me.   now.... heck, i'm gonna laugh my macadamias off if sandy ever gets a surprise


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## Pssh (Apr 7, 2011)

When I said "your mind" I didn't mean any specific person. And besides, "your" mind gives the words a tone. If you read it as rude, then your mind is choosing to make it sound that way (consciously or not and for whatever reason.)


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## zonbonzovi (Apr 7, 2011)

I'm with What on this, Caco, you can correct someone w/o being a douche.  Why not provide a link to one of those numerous med. journals that you mentioned?  Despite what certain folks that come here think, couching your info. in pomposity does not make it easier to digest.  If you are indeed the "safety police", you have your work cut out for you as there are many threads old & new that lend themselves to much more negligible safety issues.  I respect your knowledge and what you have given to this community, but I am tired of reading through initially fascinating threads that devolve into cyber boxing matches.   

Sandeku...no one link, tread, etc. is going to give you what you desire.  You must take details from one source & apply them to another back & forth until you have what you seek.  Sometimes it doesn't come at all.  In the bug hobby, the journey will be much more revealing than the destination in many cases.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 7, 2011)

lol            idk



and thanks for the life lessons. in all my 31 years of being a highly social genius i never realized all that. glad some random person on the internet could explain it to me!


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## jsloan (Apr 7, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> i am almost positive triangles HAVE been implicated in bites at least as bad as sac spiders.


Do you know of any peer-reviewed reports on the bite of _S. triangulosa_?  If so, could you name them, as I'd like to read them.  The spider will have to have been properly identified by an arachnologist, and known without a doubt to be responsible for the bite (not just "implicated" from being nearby), and the symptoms must have been properly documented and confirmed by a physician.  Thanks.


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## What (Apr 7, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> blue is giving blithe, bad advice and i won't stand for it.


He is doing exactly what Venom has done for years (overstating the danger of Cheriacanthium), and yes, its annoying, but not worth this thread.


> it's not that i think triangles or Cheira can really mess someone up. far from it. ...but i have spent years and years reading as many medical journals and other sources of literature that i can.... and i am almost positive triangles HAVE been implicated in bites at least as bad as sac spiders.


I agree with you that neither are dangerous and both have exceptional cases that were kinda bad...but that they arent to be worried about in general (unless you have personal experience suggesting spider bites may be a problem for you)... I just dont understand why this whole thread had to happen.


SandDeku said:


> I dont know exactly where to look for them.


Fun fact about looking for bugs (or things in general), you never know exactly where to look for them until you actually look and try to find them...eventually you will, then you will know where to find them again. Thats the point.


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## cacoseraph (Apr 7, 2011)

zomg, this took me about three minutes to google. and one minute of that was spent watching mary poppins


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17159734

"identification Steatoda triangulosa) bit him. Clinical manifestations included local signs together with systemic neurological symptoms resembling low-grade latrodectism (black widow envenomation)."



jeez, i'm right again.  it's like i know what i am doing

---------- Post added at 01:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:20 PM ----------

so


now


can you possibly maybe see why i have a bit of problem with blue selling triangles as perfectly safe and harmless?



if not, holy gods


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## SandDeku (Apr 7, 2011)

zonbonzovi said:


> I'm with What on this, Caco, you can correct someone w/o being a douche.  Why not provide a link to one of those numerous med. journals that you mentioned?  Despite what certain folks that come here think, couching your info. in pomposity does not make it easier to digest.  If you are indeed the "safety police", you have your work cut out for you as there are many threads old & new that lend themselves to much more negligible safety issues.  I respect your knowledge and what you have given to this community, but I am tired of reading through initially fascinating threads that devolve into cyber boxing matches.
> 
> Sandeku...no one link, tread, etc. is going to give you what you desire.  You must take details from one source & apply them to another back & forth until you have what you seek.  Sometimes it doesn't come at all.  In the bug hobby, the journey will be much more revealing than the destination in many cases.


Thank you. I just wanted to hear opinions from people to know the ins and out. As well as know if anyone had recomendations on which places to look/books and everything. It's sorta confusing to take informations from different places. :/ because you never know which is right and which is wrong by doing that.

---------- Post added at 05:16 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:15 PM ----------




What said:


> He is doing exactly what Venom has done for years (overstating the danger of Cheriacanthium), and yes, its annoying, but not worth this thread.
> 
> I agree with you that neither are dangerous and both have exceptional cases that were kinda bad...but that they arent to be worried about in general (unless you have personal experience suggesting spider bites may be a problem for you)... I just dont understand why this whole thread had to happen.
> 
> Fun fact about looking for bugs (or things in general), you never know exactly where to look for them until you actually look and try to find them...eventually you will, then you will know where to find them again. Thats the point.


:[ but I been looking for years! I never find anything except those black little beetles and slugs. As well as those small centipedes and small spiders. :c


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## What (Apr 7, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> can you possibly maybe see why i have a bit of problem with blue selling triangles as perfectly safe and harmless?
> 
> if not, holy gods


Why does one case of a severe reaction mean we should view a generally harmless spider as anything other than that? I dont even know how many times I have been bitten by S. triangulosa, I have also been bitten a few times by Cheriacanthium sp... Both species hurt a little, the triangulosa make your fingertips tingly, the sac spiders leave a little black dot...harmless. I do not have an allergy to spider venom, I also do not have any special conditions that would lead to an interaction such as that exceptional case...so yes, they are harmless.

I have more of a problem with the fear mongering about venoms (on cyanocean's side initially, more yours now) than anyone saying a harmless spider is harmless... :?


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## zonbonzovi (Apr 7, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> Thank you. I just wanted to hear opinions from people to know the ins and out. As well as know if anyone had recomendations on which places to look/books and everything. It's sorta confusing to take informations from different places. :/ because you never know which is right and which is wrong by doing


I'll definitely concede that.  Generally, comprehensive lists are hard to come by.  If I'm looking for something in particular, I'll search until I can get a rough ID, family or scientific name.  Look up the creature via bugguide & click on the tabs above the picture(taxonomy, browse, info, images, etc.).  In the books & links tab, you'll find print/web resources devoted to the creature you're searching, often in much greater detail.  Your local library will not have most of these obscure books but can get them via interlibrary loan.  I've personally found some ridiculously hard to get stuff this way.  Happy hunting!


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## cacoseraph (Apr 7, 2011)

uh no, i've never fear mongered.  my only position, ever, has been that Steatoda and Cheiracanthum are roughly equivalent is potential danger.  to suggest one after someone has vocally been afraid of the other is irresponsible


to suggest that either is utterly harmless is irresponsible.  to say that all species in either genera are unqualified dangerous is irresponsble.



all the stupid stuff that doesn't make sense has been donated by other ppl.


to make it as clear as i can:  if someone is at all concerned about the toxic effects of spider bites than neither genus is good to suggest.  if they have a more reasonable fear, both genera can make sweet pets/observational organisms.  a good bite from a lot of the OW genera of tarantulas is going to be way worse than a good bite from either genera.    

personally, i have kept all the spiders talked about in this thread, and widows, and lots of other stuff and have read tons about them all.  what i say is based on a synthesis of my own experiences and everything i have read.  is it guaranteed to be gospel truth? of course not.  but, i mean, i was right here and i am generally right when i argue vociferously for points i consider worth being clear on. a lot of times ppl imperfectly process what i write.  because i tease a bit and can't help but assume ppl have at least an 8th grade (USA) reading comprehension level sometimes ppl go off on these crazy tangents.  i probably could help it, but my caconess, it is funny so i don't think i will


plus... everyone should always google/research the heck out of everything so they can't get suckered on accident.   i am quite sure cyano only meant the best... but she just plain didn't know what she was talking about and wasn't familiar with my abilities and proclivities.  irony is, unless she is ghosting this thread or someone tells her, she won't even learn anything useful from this experience.  oh well. can't win 'em all







oh, and to all the ppl who whined about me... please, by the grace of the cruel gods that are.... tell me you see what i was getting at now!





edit:
and as i said, i do recall seeing much more than one case of a triangle bite with more than zero effects.  i googled one in about two minutes and stopped looking cuz, damn, this thread has been half a joke already and i can't be bothered.   but, well, if you still don't believe me, that's cool. i don't care. reasonable ppl will take what i want them to from this thread and that is all i care about


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## spider pest (Apr 7, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> But I never seen them in my parts.... Iam in north NJ  round morris town. :/ I find nothing there except the common yellow sacs, occassional wolfs, and grass spiders.
> 
> I dont know exactly where to look for them.


If you read the link/PDF or search the board for threads on spiders that interest you, you will find habitat descriptions and tons of information. You can then visit local areas which sound similar. Or, you can just wing it and go find some nearby woods or fields or parks to investigate. If you don't have a desire to do that, I'm not really sure why you're here! :?


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## cacoseraph (Apr 7, 2011)

spider pest said:


> If you read the link/PDF or search the board for threads on spiders that interest you, you will find habitat descriptions and tons of information. You can then visit local areas which sound similar. Or, you can just wing it and go find some nearby woods or fields or parks to investigate. If you don't have a desire to do that, I'm not really sure why you're here! :?


that is pretty much how i do it


i spend far more time reading and researching than in the field actually looking for bugs


http://www.google.com/search?q=site...&ct=mode&cd=2&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=925&bih=617
here is a google search to help you out.  it searches the site www.bugguide.net for any pictures of spiders that have the words "new jersey" by them.  you can look through there, find pics that interest you, and then immediately learn more about them from bugguide.  BG is one of the most useful tools i have for bug stuff

Reactions: Like 1


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## What (Apr 7, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> uh no, i've never fear mongered.  my only position, ever, has been that Steatoda and Cheiracanthum are roughly equivalent is potential danger.  to suggest one after someone has vocally been afraid of the other is irresponsible
> 
> to suggest that either is utterly harmless is irresponsible.  to say that all species in either genera are unqualified dangerous is irresponsble.


Your posting about and insisting about the S. triangulosa bite having major systemic effects reads, as a casual observer, as a bit of fear mongering, no offense was intended.

And I agree that they are of equal danger to the average person, harmless...hence my totally not understanding why the both of you felt the need to make so many posts about it, it doesnt matter which one has more potential danger in the 1 case in a million unless you are that 1 case. 


cacoseraph said:


> you can look through there, find pics that interest you, and then immediately learn more about them from bugguide.  BG is one of the most useful tools i have for bug stuff


Or you can use BugGuide's Advanced Search and bring up the spiders of New Jersey listed on BugGuide.


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## jsloan (Apr 7, 2011)

cacoseraph said:


> "identification Steatoda triangulosa) bit him. Clinical manifestations included local signs together with systemic neurological symptoms resembling low-grade latrodectism (black widow envenomation)."


Yeah, I'd already found that.  Nothing there to support your claim that this species is dangerous: "mild symptoms resolved quickly without hospital care."


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## cacoseraph (Apr 7, 2011)

holy crap.   quote where i say triangulosa have major effects?  i have said greather than zero. i would hesitate to say that is "major effects" unless your scale is integer and runs from zero to one.  i've said Steatoda and Cheiracanthum are about equal dangerousness and that triangles HAS been implicated in human reactive bites.




you know what? (not you what).  i actually give up.  i obviously have lost the ability to communicate in english and apparently can't understand the written rules to this site


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## SandDeku (Apr 7, 2011)

spider pest said:


> If you read the link/PDF or search the board for threads on spiders that interest you, you will find habitat descriptions and tons of information. You can then visit local areas which sound similar. Or, you can just wing it and go find some nearby woods or fields or parks to investigate. If you don't have a desire to do that, I'm not really sure why you're here! :?


I'm here to get myself familiar. I don't want to go out on the field. find a pretty spider. Bring it home having it bite me then me dying. D;


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## buthus (Apr 8, 2011)

IMO ...Caco is fighting a long lasting and constant battle against allowing the hobby(and its often not so scientific nature) to overwhelm the little bit of good scientific info on the internet. Problem is (again..only mo) this thread? ...eh.. probably not the most logical place to try and fight this battle    ...well...beyond stating that.. there really is no good evidence that sac spiders are more dangerous than other common "house" spider that one would pick up and put in a jar. 

The danger with handling sac spiders is that they always get away! 
The danger with handling triangulosa is that its easy to accidentally squish em!


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## Tresta (Apr 9, 2011)

*Help with Steatoda triangulosa*

I have an adult female Steatoda triangulosa, which I haven't had more than a couple of months. Today I noticed some liquid at the bottom of her enclosure. It's not from any of her kills, and not anything I've put in there. Any ideas what this could be? Unfortunately I have calcium sand in the bottom so it has absorbed and altered the substance. It looks clear, and there is alot more of it than she is big. Any help or suggestions would be awesome


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## What (Apr 10, 2011)

Tresta said:


> Any help or suggestions would be awesome


Its probably excrement.


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## Pssh (Apr 10, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> I'm here to get myself familiar. I don't want to go out on the field. find a pretty spider. Bring it home having it bite me then me dying. D;


Just treat every spider you find as if it is dangerous. Contain it, bring it home, and ID it. If you don't want it after you figure it out, put it back where you found it. That's what I do with all inverts that I cannot immediately ID as harmless.


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## buthus (Apr 10, 2011)

What said:


> Its probably excrement.


Maybe... or a botched egg sac.


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## Silberrücken (Apr 10, 2011)

My Yellow Sac spider. Here they are called Ghost Spiders, and with good reason. 

[youtube]Xl65mRfV3B4[/youtube]

[youtube]uvOfVWgBcLM[/youtube]

[youtube]zVf6KM4kSls[/youtube]

S.


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## Tresta (Apr 10, 2011)

I'd believe the botched egg sac more than the excrement. I've seen her droppings before, they are very small. It's still gooey 4 days after I discovered it. I'm new to spiders so figured this would be the place to ask. Only got about 8 months of spider keeping.


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## What (Apr 10, 2011)

Silberrücken said:


> My Yellow Sac spider. Here they are called Ghost Spiders, and with good reason.


Arent sac spiders...sac spiders and Anyphaenids ghost spiders?


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## Silberrücken (Apr 10, 2011)

What said:


> Arent sac spiders...sac spiders and Anyphaenids ghost spiders?


Look at the dark brown chelicerae of my spider. That alone should tell you what it is. 

S.


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## What (Apr 10, 2011)

Silberrücken said:


> Look at the dark brown chelicerae of my spider. That alone should tell you what it is.
> 
> S.


I couldnt stand more than 1/4 second of the music and I really dont want to try to distinguish similar families from a somewhat blurry youtube video, if its a "yellow sac spider" then that common name almost always applies to Cheiracanthium sp.... If its an anyphaenid why call it a sac spider with the first sentence, and if its not one why call it a ghost spider? :?


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## Silberrücken (Apr 11, 2011)

What said:


> I couldnt stand more than 1/4 second of the music and I really dont want to try to distinguish similar families from a somewhat blurry youtube video, if its a "yellow sac spider" then that common name almost always applies to Cheiracanthium sp.... If its an anyphaenid why call it a sac spider with the first sentence, and if its not one why call it a ghost spider? :?


Well, excuse me...  OK...  Anyphaenidae is correct for Ghost Spiders. I intended to be a little sarcastic with the "here is my Yellow Sac...  called Ghost Spiders blah blah" remark.

Thank you for the kind comments of the vids, BTW. :clap: Very nice. Those vids are for educational purposes, no need to trash them.


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## SandDeku (Apr 12, 2011)

Pssh said:


> Just treat every spider you find as if it is dangerous. Contain it, bring it home, and ID it. If you don't want it after you figure it out, put it back where you found it. That's what I do with all inverts that I cannot immediately ID as harmless.


Thanks! will do! as of lately I haven't found anything sides the common grass spiders and common house spiders. But ill keep looking and hope to id


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## spider pest (Apr 12, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> as of lately I haven't found anything sides the common grass spiders and common house spiders. But ill keep looking and hope to id


I haven't seen much yet this year either. NJ had a harsh winter, and spring is taking its time. Within the next 1-3 weeks that will begin to change though, so keep it up. Check out the walls outside your home that get a lot of sun during the day, because the jumping spiders are starting to emerge.


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## Irene B. Smithi (Apr 14, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> Thanks! will do! as of lately I haven't found anything sides the common grass spiders and common house spiders. But ill keep looking and hope to id


You need to move out to the desert.  In no time you'll have Brown recluses (okay, the L. Deserti-whatchamacalit lol) black widows and their aunts and uncles, scorpion and tarantulas... oh and for good measure... I'm waiting to hunt some sun spiders and vinegaroons at a friends place of business when they're back from vacation.  Lots of fun stuff here.... oh and the snakes...  

And in reference to the debate of the possibility of your little spider having a nasty bite or not... just don't give it a good-nite kiss and you should be fine  

Edit:  to my above comment really... if you don't know what it is, don't mess with it.  Better to enjoy watching them in nature then risk getting hurt... even if it's minimal...


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## SandDeku (Apr 15, 2011)

spider pest said:


> I haven't seen much yet this year either. NJ had a harsh winter, and spring is taking its time. Within the next 1-3 weeks that will begin to change though, so keep it up. Check out the walls outside your home that get a lot of sun during the day, because the jumping spiders are starting to emerge.


I am. I found so far... A sort of aquatic beetle or toe biter I can't tell yet. It looks like a mix of em. I found a large house centipede. Which is currently in a container with no soil or anything just cause Iam doing more research on it. They seem pretty easy to care for as far I am reading. Lots of moisture. Foods: crickets work fine. Longevity:3-7yrs. Its in a critter keeper. lol

I'm going to try going to bear lake sometime tommorrow or sunday.

As for the p. auddax I don't know if they are where I live. My house is like "no-bug's land" xD I try putting bricks, and planks in the yard to get stuff going. But I find nothing. Everything we have here seems small and boring. D: 


Spiders are small, millipedes are small, centipedes are small, beetles are small. It seems everything in our area is generally small or extremely short lived. 

I like cicada nymphs, I don't think I could find one or keep one. The nymphs live along time.
Spiders I never see interesting spiders in nj. Maybe Iam going about it the wrong way. Maybe Iam not searching the good areas. :x

---------- Post added at 05:19 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:18 PM ----------




Irene B. Smithi said:


> You need to move out to the desert.  In no time you'll have Brown recluses (okay, the L. Deserti-whatchamacalit lol) black widows and their aunts and uncles, scorpion and tarantulas... oh and for good measure... I'm waiting to hunt some sun spiders and vinegaroons at a friends place of business when they're back from vacation.  Lots of fun stuff here.... oh and the snakes...
> 
> And in reference to the debate of the possibility of your little spider having a nasty bite or not... just don't give it a good-nite kiss and you should be fine
> 
> Edit:  to my above comment really... if you don't know what it is, don't mess with it.  Better to enjoy watching them in nature then risk getting hurt... even if it's minimal...


iam not a fan of desert. ;x I sorta like cool, and damp weather at most.


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## spider pest (Apr 15, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> As for the p. auddax I don't know if they are where I live. My house is like "no-bug's land" xD I try putting bricks, and planks in the yard to get stuff going. But I find nothing.


It is extremely likely that P. audax are in your area. I'd even go as far as to say that they definitely are. They are common but not abundant. I have found 5 P. audax (2 were together - a male and a female) in the past 2 years or so, and on only one of those occasions was I actually looking for one. I found one randomly on a fence in my yard and haven't seen another around the house since. Look at walls that get a lot of sun, as well as fences and leaves. You're basically looking for a little moving black blob. That said, the male and female I found together were under a rock. You'll see smaller jumping spiders as well. Last weekend I saw 4 very different small jumpers on the walls of my house. They're out there, you just need to look often, and get used to detecting the movement of small things.

Edited to add: The one time I was actually looking for one, I was looking at a wall for a moving black blob and happened to see one.

Bricks and planks in your yard is a good idea! Give it some time. Like I said, it's been a cold spring. As it gets warmer, you'll see the spiders emerge.


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## jsloan (Apr 15, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> Everything we have here seems small and boring. D:


A magnifying glass will fix that. 



SandDeku said:


> Spiders I never see interesting spiders in nj. Maybe Iam going about it the wrong way. Maybe Iam not searching the good areas.


Could be.  There are probably several hundred or more different species of spiders in NJ, if the numbers in nearby states are any indication.  Look everywhere, especially in potential hiding places - cracks in fences, under boards and rocks, under bark, rolled up in leaves, on the side of your house, in your basement, in abandoned bird nests, in leaf litter, inside of garden ornaments, under the siding on the house, behind porch lights, under piles of stuff in the garage, etc.  Spiders are more abundant than you may think.  With a little practice you'll catch on to where they are.


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## SandDeku (Apr 17, 2011)

spider pest said:


> It is extremely likely that P. audax are in your area. I'd even go as far as to say that they definitely are. They are common but not abundant. I have found 5 P. audax (2 were together - a male and a female) in the past 2 years or so, and on only one of those occasions was I actually looking for one. I found one randomly on a fence in my yard and haven't seen another around the house since. Look at walls that get a lot of sun, as well as fences and leaves. You're basically looking for a little moving black blob. That said, the male and female I found together were under a rock. You'll see smaller jumping spiders as well. Last weekend I saw 4 very different small jumpers on the walls of my house. They're out there, you just need to look often, and get used to detecting the movement of small things.
> 
> Edited to add: The one time I was actually looking for one, I was looking at a wall for a moving black blob and happened to see one.
> 
> Bricks and planks in your yard is a good idea! Give it some time. Like I said, it's been a cold spring. As it gets warmer, you'll see the spiders emerge.


Yes it has. But things are starting to come to life. As well as I would like to ask since you live in nj as well. Do you happen to know the laws of what you can catch and cannot catch in nj? Not just insects itself. Stuff like Insects(that includes arachnids--imo), reptiles, amphibians, fish, etc. 

Would you happen to know? I keep looking online but all I find is pdf files. Iam not too good with comps so idk how to open one.

---------- Post added at 02:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:04 AM ----------




jsloan said:


> A magnifying glass will fix that.
> 
> 
> 
> Could be.  There are probably several hundred or more different species of spiders in NJ, if the numbers in nearby states are any indication.  Look everywhere, especially in potential hiding places - cracks in fences, under boards and rocks, under bark, rolled up in leaves, on the side of your house, in your basement, in abandoned bird nests, in leaf litter, inside of garden ornaments, under the siding on the house, behind porch lights, under piles of stuff in the garage, etc.  Spiders are more abundant than you may think.  With a little practice you'll catch on to where they are.


You're right. :]


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## Venom (Apr 17, 2011)

jsloan said:


> A magnifying glass will fix that.


LOL. Do you mean...that they won't be as small....or they won't be as boring? Because, ahem, I could think of a way to make small bugs fun with a magnifying glass....other than making them look larger.


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## The Spider Faery (Apr 17, 2011)

Venom said:


> LOL. Do you mean...that they won't be as small....or they won't be as boring? Because, ahem, I could think of a way to make small bugs fun with a magnifying glass....other than making them look larger.


Ahem...We want to promote keeping the little creatures alive and unharmed while we look at them on this board, Venom.   (no frying them!)


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## Tresta (Apr 17, 2011)

Does anyone know how to care for an egg sac? My eastern parson spider just laid her eggs and webbed them up. She put them up in the corner of her container. Do I need to keep it a certain humidity, or temperature or anything? I know she's going to guard it until they hatch, but is there anything I need to do to prevent them all from perishing? Any advice would be appreciated. (I caught her recently and this was not planned, so I'm totally not prepared. I don't wanna kill the poor things because I don't know what to to :-()


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## Irene B. Smithi (Apr 21, 2011)

Venom said:


> LOL. Do you mean...that they won't be as small....or they won't be as boring? Because, ahem, I could think of a way to make small bugs fun with a magnifying glass....other than making them look larger.


lol... now that's funny.... hmmm, I mean, bad Vemon, BAD lol...


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## SandDeku (Apr 22, 2011)

Tresta said:


> Does anyone know how to care for an egg sac? My eastern parson spider just laid her eggs and webbed them up. She put them up in the corner of her container. Do I need to keep it a certain humidity, or temperature or anything? I know she's going to guard it until they hatch, but is there anything I need to do to prevent them all from perishing? Any advice would be appreciated. (I caught her recently and this was not planned, so I'm totally not prepared. I don't wanna kill the poor things because I don't know what to to :-()


Try posting this into a seperate thread. You may yield more answers than you currently may have.


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