# Respiratory infection



## Zarathustra (Oct 14, 2006)

I need to cure a respiratory infection on a snake. Does anybody know what kind of store would carry Eucalyptus oil? I read that applying some of this to the cage will help the recovery process. Thanks.


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## MindUtopia (Oct 14, 2006)

I have no idea if that would work, but you should be able to find it in any natural food or vitamin store.  What kind of snake is it?


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## sick4x4 (Oct 14, 2006)

yeah i dont know who told you to do that but here is a link that should help... http://www.anapsid.org/rti.html


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## Kriegan (Oct 14, 2006)

<edit>!!!What temperature and humidity are you keeping? I know for a fact preventing respiratory infections is best done if you mantain a proper temperature and humidity levels for the specific species. I'd always keep a temperature and humidity gauge within the enclosure to ensure that. And since I'm a crazy clean freak I'd always keep everything really clean to prevent the growth and spread of infectious bacteria. Also respiratory infections tend to be contagious so I'd advice you to quarantine your snake in another enclosure if it's sharing a tank with others. One of my first snakes was a ball python that I had bought from a friend really cheap 'cause it was dying and was very skinny and he was going to shoot it so I thought i could save him and took him to the vet and was diagnosed with lung infection, and eventhough he was administered antibiotics for several weeks it died shortly after that  I would advice you to take your snake to a vet ASAP before it's too late. Some make it with treatment, while others never recover:evil: 
 How long has it been since you noticed the respiratory infection? What symptomps have you observed so far?


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## Kriegan (Oct 14, 2006)

Oh yes before I forget I've never heard of eucalyptus oil curing respiratory infections before. What type of snake is it? If it's a pricey snake that I've spent big bucks on it, I wouldn't risk it. I would go to the vet ASAP for some antibiotics. Good luck and keep us posted


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## Zarathustra (Oct 15, 2006)

The eucalyptus remedy comes from “Boas & Pythons: Breeding and Care,” by Erik D. Stoops and Annette T. Wright. The book says to put a couple drops into a dish and place it into the snakes home, and to also administer injections of ampicillin or some kind of antibiotic. Supposedly the eucalyptus will help alleviate some of the symptoms. Unfortunately, I can’t find a vet that treats snakes that is open today, so the antibiotics will have to wait until Monday.

The affected snakes are my brand new spotted pythons. I think they picked up the infection on the day I got them, during the trip home. The same night I got them, I thought that I heard a “pop,” but I did not trust my instincts. I thought I imagined it. Too late now, they both have it. 

I assure you that the pythons are warm enough. I am a veteran snake keeper, but these things sometimes happen. The problem may lick itself, but I don’t want to take any chances. 

Thanks for all of your input.


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## Kriegan (Oct 15, 2006)

Zarathustra said:


> The eucalyptus remedy comes from “Boas & Pythons: Breeding and Care,” by Erik D. Stoops and Annette T. Wright. The book says to put a couple drops into a dish and place it into the snakes home, and to also administer injections of ampicillin or some kind of antibiotic. Supposedly the eucalyptus will help alleviate some of the symptoms. Unfortunately, I can’t find a vet that treats snakes that is open today, so the antibiotics will have to wait until Monday.
> 
> The affected snakes are my brand new spotted pythons. I think they picked up the infection on the day I got them, during the trip home. The same night I got them, I thought that I heard a “pop,” but I did not trust my instincts. I thought I imagined it. Too late now, they both have it.
> 
> ...



If the book recommends it you might as well try it, while it may alleviate some symptoms it will not cure them but in the meantime i think it's worth a try until you can get them to the vet on monday. Since this all sounds very recent I think your pythons have a good chance of making it if the infection just started to develop. I know what you mean when you say these things sometimes happen I have lost 4 snakes in all the years I kept them, 1 was that ball python I tried to save from execution but it was too sick and too late, the other was killed by rat poison when I broke up with my lunatic ex gf and still had my apt keys,and the other 2 rattlesnakes died from unknown reasons  I had their environment almost perfect and they just died for no apparent reason so I know this sometimes happen no matter how good you keep them. I really wish you the best of luck and hope it's nothing that serious


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## Zarathustra (Oct 15, 2006)

Kriegan said:


> the other was killed by rat poison when I broke up with my lunatic ex gf and still had my apt keys


What kind of snake was this, and did you punch the girl’s lights out? 

One time I had to leave town for a couple weeks, so I left my snakes at a friend’s house for babysitting. (He’s a snake keeper too.) Then one day he turns on his washing machine and it begins to make weird noises, so he opens one of the access panels to see what its about. Lo and behold, one of my Black Milk snakes is wrapped around the pulley or something. My poor little liebchen was mortally wounded. What a bizarre death.


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## Kriegan (Oct 15, 2006)

Zarathustra said:


> What kind of snake was this, and did you punch the girl’s lights out?
> 
> One time I had to leave town for a couple weeks, so I left my snakes at a friend’s house for babysitting. (He’s a snake keeper too.) Then one day he turns on his washing machine and it begins to make weird noises, so he opens one of the access panels to see what its about. Lo and behold, one of my Black Milk snakes is wrapped around the pulley or something. My poor little liebchen was mortally wounded. What a bizarre death.


Sadly it was my baby gaboon viper :evil: hands down my favorite by then:evil:  At the time I was still part of the luftwaffe so I had friends in the polizei that helped me track her down, found her and arrested her because that was not the only damage done to my apt, so I had to change my locks and file a restraining order from this wacko:wall: but my favorite baby was already dead  But I can tell you this, if she would've been a male and not a girl I wouldn't have even bothered to get him arrested at all, LMAO I won't even write what I would've done   let's just say he would've gotten what he deserved and would not have seen the sunlight the next day  And that sucks man, your black milk snake dying in the washing machine like that  that poor baby what an awful death you have my condolescences man, sometimes <edit> happens!


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## Dom (Oct 15, 2006)

I've found snakes will often respond quite well without antibiotics if you do the following: 
1. Have a hot spot hotter than you think they would be comfortable with. 
2 Make sure humidity is at or higher than the recommended levels for the species. 
3. Make sure they have clean fresh water. 
4. Have a few hides or deep substrate so that they can feel comfortable hiding out at the temp they want. It's no good having a hot-spot at one end of the cage and 1 hide at the other if the species is shy. It'll often just stay in it's box and not sit at the temp it wants. At least with several hides it can choose where it wants to be.
4. Leave them alone so they can just put all their energy into recovering instead of getting stressed out with human interaction.
I know most people will tell you to take it to a vet but IME they often do as much harm as good. Many of the antibiotics are fairly toxic and the animals get stressed greatly when you have to inject them or shove a tube down their throat. Not to mention the continual trips to the vet if they insist on giving the treatments themselves.
I've treated several animals with the above method and it works well if you start treatment before the animal starts going downhill. If it starts going downhill with this treatment then take it to the vet.


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## boidaddic (Oct 15, 2006)

If it doesnt seem to go away, you might want to call some of your herp friends and see if they have any left over baytril. Works miracles with respiratory infections.
Regards,
Eric


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## Zarathustra (Oct 16, 2006)

Dom said:


> I've found snakes will often respond quite well without antibiotics if you do the following:
> 1. Have a hot spot hotter than you think they would be comfortable with.
> 2 Make sure humidity is at or higher than the recommended levels for the species.
> 3. Make sure they have clean fresh water.
> ...



I have all of that done, except the humidity. According to a book I have, it says to keep the enclosure dry. I'm not sure which to do now. I will have to play it by ear. Thanks for the advice.


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## Zarathustra (Oct 16, 2006)

boidaddic said:


> If it doesnt seem to go away, you might want to call some of your herp friends and see if they have any left over baytril. Works miracles with respiratory infections.
> Regards,
> Eric


Baytril, ok. I don't know anyone that would have that, so I will have to see if I can get it from the vet. Hopefully, he/she will be able to prescribe it without seeing the snake. I would rather not stress the snakes anymore by taking them out of the house. Thanks for the tip.


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## Kriegan (Oct 16, 2006)

Zarathustra said:


> Baytril, ok. I don't know anyone that would have that, so I will have to see if I can get it from the vet. Hopefully, he/she will be able to prescribe it without seeing the snake. I would rather not stress the snakes anymore by taking them out of the house. Thanks for the tip.


 I agree with all the posted tips and I know you don't want to stress your snakes more by physically taking them to the vet, but I must insist you take them so the vet may evaluate and run some tests on them to give an accurate diagnosis and prescribe the proper antibiotics. Just my two cents


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## ErikH (Oct 16, 2006)

Kriegan is right; you must take the snake to the vet.  The other remedies will likely help alleviate the symptoms, but you'll never cure a RI without Baytril or a similar antibiotic.


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## Zarathustra (Oct 16, 2006)

I went to the vet with Olive (the snake) and got some Baytril, so we should be on the road to recovery.


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## Kriegan (Oct 16, 2006)

Zarathustra said:


> I went to the vet with Olive (the snake) and got some Baytril, so we should be on the road to recovery.


:clap: :clap: Excellent dude, It's good to hear that!!! Keep us posted on Olive and good luck


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## Dom (Oct 16, 2006)

ErikH said:


> Kriegan is right; you must take the snake to the vet.  The other remedies will likely help alleviate the symptoms, but you'll never cure a RI without Baytril or a similar antibiotic.


Sure you must do the right thing for the animal but the above statement is incorrect. I've imported/ bought locally a couple of hundred snakes over a couple of decades. The odd one will arrive with an RI and I've done quite well without antibiotics. In fact I imported 10 tropical vipers with RI. I treated 5 with antibiotics and 5 without and they all recovered nicely.
But again do what you feel is right for the animal.


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## Zarathustra (Oct 16, 2006)

Dom said:


> Sure you must do the right thing for the animal but the above statement is incorrect. I've imported/ bought locally a couple of hundred snakes over a couple of decades. The odd one will arrive with an RI and I've done quite well without antibiotics. In fact I imported 10 tropical vipers with RI. I treated 5 with antibiotics and 5 without and they all recovered nicely.
> But again do what you feel is right for the animal.



Yes, I believe you are correct about recovery without treatment. I had a boa constrictor that had a RI, and he recovered without any antibiotics. In this case though, the symptoms seemed a little more severe, and I think treatment was necessary. I also hold the opinion that boas, and burmese pythons are a bit more hardy than spotted pythons, and carpet pythons, etc. (This is just an opinion based on my experience.) So, I opted for treatment. Thanks for your input though.


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## Kriegan (Oct 16, 2006)

Dom said:


> Sure you must do the right thing for the animal but the above statement is incorrect. I've imported/ bought locally a couple of hundred snakes over a couple of decades. The odd one will arrive with an RI and I've done quite well without antibiotics. In fact I imported 10 tropical vipers with RI. I treated 5 with antibiotics and 5 without and they all recovered nicely.
> But again do what you feel is right for the animal.



Hallo Dom,

While I fully understand your perspective and point of view, I have to respectfully disagree in part and I'll explain why. Just because you have had good luck and done quite well without providing antibiotics to your snakes doesn't mean we can generalize and think RI in snakes are not that serious and will just dissapear if you make some modifications to its' environment because sometimes is not that simple. I don't tend to take RI lightly because there are different types of RI and different bacterial infections and some may be mild while others can be severe and deadly, and the sooner you identify them the sooner you can treat it with success and erradicate it from the snake's body. Another problem that I find with respiratory infections is that they are recurrent, I have several friends in Berlin that will modify the snake's temp and humidity and "think" they have solved the problem because there's no more symptoms and they're happy they didn't have to spend $ on a vet and then a month later eventhough they have mantained consistency on its' environment, the snake starts with the odd cycle all over again because the symptoms were alleviated but the infection was never treated only now it's a bit worse:wall: The purpose of taking the snake to the vet is so that it can run some tests that can identify EXACTLY what type of bacterial infection we are dealing with, and therefore recommend the proper treatment and antibiotics before it gets ugly and too late. IME Baytril is a mild antibiotic that works miracles on common RI just like boidaddic sugested and without much side effects, so the RI Olive has is not that bad and can be treated with this. I know of cases that the infection has already done a lot of damage and Baytril has not been enough to treat the infection and they've had to inject far more potent and extra strength antibiotics to attack the infection and in some cases the snake has in fact died. So I like to be safe than sorry with RI in snakes, I've seen this happen too many times in the hobby with my friends and from the years that I kept them. I wouldn't want to feel guilty because I thought RI wasn't that serious and would go away without any antibiotics. I don't like to take any chances or risks especially if i'm fond of my babies Just my two cents and my opinion 

My best regards,
Ulrich


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## Dom (Oct 16, 2006)

Hello Ulrich,

If you re-read my initial post I suggested that he try to see if the snake responds without intervention but if the snake deteriorate to seek out a vet. However in my experience if the animals are given the right environmental conditions and left alone (not continually subjected to stress) they tend to recover quite well.
I'm a bit old school and my faith in vets isn't too strong. I could tell you several stories of mal-practice and misdiagnosis from "specialist" vets in my area.
I've been through what you're describing in your previous post and agree with you for the most part. 
As you mention RI's should be taken very seriously.

All the best,
Dominic


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