# P. metallica breeding in the U.S.!!



## Swifty (Jun 14, 2004)

Sorry for the poor quality photos folks, but that wasn't what was important at the moment...

Lets cross our fingers Scott!

I'm going to try to get some better shots, but this was the first encounter, and I didn't want to disturb


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## manville (Jun 14, 2004)

I dont see any picture but good luck with it


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## Jakob (Jun 14, 2004)

Oh no you didn't!  

I wish you a lot of luck and please keep us updated!

Later, 

Jake


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## webspinner (Jun 14, 2004)

Good luck Kelly, looks like you might be on your way on becoming a rich man.


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## GoTerps (Jun 14, 2004)

Congrats!  Good luck Kelly and Scott!


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## AphonopelmaTX (Jun 14, 2004)

I thought there were only one or two egg sacs brought into the states. Were there wild caught adults brought in, more sacs, or are those two related?  Either way it's very cool to see so much blue and yellow. 

-Lonnie


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## scorpio (Jun 14, 2004)

Im really anxious to see the outcome of this! (and the price of *possible* spiderlings which hopefully should be less than what weve been seeing lately.  )


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## Henry Kane (Jun 14, 2004)

AphonopelmaTX said:
			
		

> I thought there were only one or two egg sacs brought into the states. Were there wild caught adults brought in, more sacs, or are those two related?  Either way it's very cool to see so much blue and yellow.
> 
> -Lonnie


If Scott or Kelly don't mind that I answer this...

They are definitely not wild caught. They are of European c/b bloodlines. I can't remember if there are 2 or 3 bloodlines currently in the US right now (mainly because I don't have any metallica myself!   ) but  absolutely c/b none the less.

Scott and Kelly, I wish you guys the best of luck! Y'all can do it...errrr they can do it...ummm...as long as someone friggin does it!  :} 

*fingers crossed* 
 Atrax


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## FryLock (Jun 14, 2004)

IME you can get most pokes to adulthood in the same time frame males and females iv only done it with P.reg but im sure it can be done with any good luck with a sac


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## Angelo (Jun 14, 2004)

holy <poop>!!! your making history swifty!!!!


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## RazorRipley (Jun 14, 2004)

Gonna have to race Jacobi though... dont forget <edited>


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## Tony (Jun 14, 2004)

Atrax said:
			
		

> If Scott or Kelly don't mind that I answer this...
> 
> They are definitely not wild caught. They are of European c/b bloodlines. I can't remember if there are 2 or 3 bloodlines currently in the US right now (mainly because I don't have any metallica myself!   ) but  absolutely c/b none the less.
> 
> ...


Its confusing isnt it? The three I have are dated with 3 dates, so thats 3 eggsacs, plus last summers babies. Thing is, the females that are around now are being bred with males from that same time, so I hope we had 2 eggsacs back then (and people kept track of them!!!!) Plus, 3 eggsacs may have the same father...Only the origianl breeder knows for sure what's going on....
There are others doing it here too ya know 
T
(good seeing ya again gary and meeting eric...)


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## Henry Kane (Jun 15, 2004)

monantony said:
			
		

> There are others doing it here too ya know
> T
> (good seeing ya again gary and meeting eric...)



I wonder who else is breeding them? Oh well, if they wanted folks to know, they would probably have pics up too, huh? 

Yeah, good as hell to see you too Tony. Look foreward to hangin' with ya at the conference next year as well.

Later.
 Atrax


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## senor ocho (Jun 15, 2004)

Swifty you old salt!!!
Well done old boy, well done.
-chris
www.krazy8sinvertebrates.com


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## rosehaired1979 (Jun 15, 2004)

Kelly and Scott good luck I hope the egg sac is successful and yall have lots of slings to sell


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## xBurntBytheSunx (Jun 15, 2004)

were those slings you raised yourself?

i hope your female doesn't eat him!!!


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## Abraxis (Jun 15, 2004)

Best of Luck with the sac...  keep us all informed... 

Ken


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## MrDeranged (Jun 15, 2004)

Whoo Hooo Kelly.  I'm guessing that you wouldn't have bothered posting if he didn't get an insert...?  I'm sure I don't have to tell you to keep me informed...   Fingers and Toes are crossed 

@RazorRipley - Seeing as:


Michael's female isn't mature yet &
I'm pretty sure I'm the only person in the US with mature males at this time

I don't think we'll have to beat him anytime soon...

No more personal attacks or it's vacation time.....

@ Michael - You know I'll have one for you by the time she matures too 

@ Everyone else -

To my knowledge, there are currently at least 5 bloodlines of P. metallica in the states.  The first batch which came in last year had 2 bloodlines and the more recent one had at least 3 or 4.  If there were 4, the fourth came in with very very limited numbers

Thank you all for the well wishes, we hope it works out too!!!!

Scott


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## Martin H. (Jun 15, 2004)

Hi FryLock,



			
				FryLock said:
			
		

> IME you can get most pokes to adulthood in the same time frame males and females iv only done it with P.reg but im sure it can be done with any good luck with a sac


in my experience there are a lot of species of which males and females of the same eggsack, raised under the same conditions(!), often mature arround the same time (sometimes the females mature even before the males), even when you don't power feed the females and cool down the males. => females are often mature at a much smaller size than most people do assume! (e.g. last year I got an eggsack from a "smaller" Poecilotheria rufilata female: bodylength ~ 4,5-5 cm (messured without chelicera; with chelicera she had about 5,2 cm, but had been a bit skinny at that moment when I messured her. At this time her legspan has been 16 cm [diagonally and fully stretched]. The eggsack was not been really big and contained only few larvaes. About 30-40.)

all the best,
Martin


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## LaRiz (Jun 15, 2004)

For the most part, we've been taught that males mature quicker than females do.  Of course there are so many factors involved that would inhibit or speed up the process to an ultimate/sexual maturing molt, so I can't get into that.  But...like I've always said, tarantulas will make an ass out of you.
They don't follow rules, or follow what we think we know about them.  More and more, I'm starting to believe that some Poecs will breed earlier than we think.  Example:  _Poecilotheria subfusca_.  She's young and small, but she managed an eggsac (only one baby survived from a cooked eggsac).  That sac was laid only 1 month and 3 weeks after she bred.  Her second sac (only two days old now) was made only 2 months after the last male was with her.
Kelly, things are looking good for you.  The female in the pic is totally dilated (for lack of a better word) and ready to accept the males offering.  Good luck man!  
I, myself, am only an instar away (hopefully) from pairing up my biggest female.  He's ready to molt, but man they take long!
john


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## Swifty (Jun 15, 2004)

LaRiz said:
			
		

> The female in the pic is totally dilated (for lack of a better word) and ready to accept the males offering.  Good luck man!
> john


Thanks John, and I was waiting for someone to notice that myself. The male I actually left in overnight, last night, and he was making a sperm web this morning   If what I'm seeing with this species is typical, they seem very willing to breed....let's hope making an eggsac is easy too. But I've learned not to get excited till I see slings.


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## FryLock (Jun 15, 2004)

Martin thats 100% right iv found baboons where the ones you could bet on doing it with slings from allmost any given sac, but now iv got a gentic with a fold that sticks out a mile thats out striping its bothers (i still have to look for fusulae or check the last moult as soon as i sort out where my rubber gloves have gone   ) we hear a lot about old worlders and a few of the smaller new world subfamilys breeding at smaller sizes, but as any one say bred from a Brachy or other any other Theraphosinae subfamilys members females then seen them grow on the next moult  :?


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## petitegreeneyes (Jun 15, 2004)

Thanks for answering my question Martin and Lariz before I asked it. I guess they don't have to be huge to breed.


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## Zombie (Jun 15, 2004)

monantony said:
			
		

> Its confusing isnt it? The three I have are dated with 3 dates, so thats 3 eggsacs, plus last summers babies. Thing is, the females that are around now are being bred with males from that same time, so I hope we had 2 eggsacs back then (and people kept track of them!!!!) Plus, 3 eggsacs may have the same father...Only the origianl breeder knows for sure what's going on....
> There are others doing it here too ya know
> T
> (good seeing ya again gary and meeting eric...)


It was cool meeting you too Tony, next year we'll have to chug some mice and eat some beer.

Wait a sec...

Eric


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## Bearskin10 (Jun 15, 2004)

Why do I feel the need to hear a little Bruce Springsteen here?     Greg


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## ShaunHolder (Jun 15, 2004)

Good luck with an eggsack, make sure to keep us all posted!  :}


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## Michael Jacobi (Jun 15, 2004)

*Well done, Swifty! I hope all goes well. Michael*


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## Jmmarich (Jun 15, 2004)

Wow awesome!  Make sure thats succesful so I can spend too much money through you or phillip!  Beautiful spider.  

Were your nerves shot when you first introduced them? Was it hairy at all or pretty smooth.

--Josh


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## WayneT (Jun 16, 2004)

*Thanks for sharing Kelly!*

Awesome pics  Hope all goes well...guess I need to make a new spider budget!


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## kellygirl (Jun 16, 2004)

LaRiz said:
			
		

> The female in the pic is totally dilated (for lack of a better word) and ready to accept the males offering.  Good luck man!


Wow, I can so see that now that you point it out!  I didn't realize they did that... definitely something to watch for during matings.  

Best of luck everyone!  Keep the pictures and updates coming!!! 

-Kelly


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## RazorRipley (Jun 16, 2004)

mrderanged said:
			
		

> Whoo Hooo Kelly.  I'm guessing that you wouldn't have bothered posting if he didn't get an insert...?  I'm sure I don't have to tell you to keep me informed...   Fingers and Toes are crossed
> 
> @RazorRipley - Seeing as:
> 
> ...


I was referring to a local kid here in town, why Arachnopets feels the need to protect an annonymous Gallatin TN resident, whos name, or any other personal details were not even mentioned is confusing to me, but... you know how us arachnovillains are, always taking a mile when given an inch. I guess I am the real rebel of the tarantula world


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## Steve Nunn (Jun 16, 2004)

LaRiz said:
			
		

> More and more, I'm starting to believe that some Poecs will breed earlier than we think.


Hi John,
Not just _Poecilotheria spp._  either. I think this is going to apply to all subfamilies too. Time will tell, but I'm 99% sure this will be the case.

Cheers,
Steve


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## Hendriks (Jun 16, 2004)

mrderanged said:
			
		

> To my knowledge, there are currently at least 5 bloodlines of P. metallica in the states.  The first batch which came in last year had 2 bloodlines and the more recent one had at least 3 or 4.  If there were 4, the fourth came in with very very limited numbers
> 
> 
> Scott



 :?  hmmm Well the first shipment only had one bloodline .... and I am pretty sure that all the adult males and females in the US are from the same bloodline.... only one guy in Canada got from 2 different bloodlines.... 

Henrik


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## Tony (Jun 16, 2004)

monantony said:
			
		

> .Only the origianl breeder knows for sure what's going on....
> 
> 
> T


Thanks Henriks...So the second time around in the US, there were 3 eggsacs, but were they the same father?

Tony


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## pelo (Jun 16, 2004)

Hendriks said:
			
		

> :?  hmmm Well the first shipment only had one bloodline .... and I am pretty sure that all the adult males and females in the US are from the same bloodline.... only one guy in Canada got from 2 different bloodlines....
> 
> Henrik


>>and I bought one from each bloodline from him


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## Tstorm (Jun 16, 2004)

LaRiz said:
			
		

> More and more, I'm starting to believe that some Poecs will breed earlier than we think.  Example:  _Poecilotheria subfusca_.  She's young and small, but she managed an eggsac (only one baby survived from a cooked eggsac).
> john


At what size/age could a female be expected to breed?


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## Ultimate Instar (Jun 16, 2004)

Hey Scott and Kelly, congrats on the breeding.  How big are the male and female?

Karen N.


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## SkyeSpider (Jun 18, 2004)

I can't wait until some spiderlings hatch, here in the US. Maybe then I can afford one or two of these beauties! 

-Bryan


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## Ker (Jun 19, 2004)

Hmm.. sell the kid's pony.... then buy a pretty pokie.. EVEN BETTER.. sell the kids.. then I can buy more than one !!!  Good luck with the breeding.


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## RazorRipley (Jun 19, 2004)

How many blues is a red headed girl worth?


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## Hendriks (Jun 19, 2004)

monantony said:
			
		

> Thanks Henriks...So the second time around in the US, there were 3 eggsacs, but were they the same father?
> 
> Tony


None of the 4-5 bloodlines are related... all from different females and males...


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## Buspirone (Dec 24, 2004)

Are there any developments regarding the breeding attempt , Swifty or Scott??


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## David Burns (Dec 24, 2004)

Yeah, I second that interest.


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## Satanika (Dec 24, 2004)

Buspirone said:
			
		

> Are there any developments regarding the breeding attempt , Swifty or Scott??


Nothing yet, but we still have our fingers (and toes) crossed.   


Debby


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## Ultimate Instar (Dec 24, 2004)

My male metallica still hasn't matured.  He's from the original shipment and my male and female are currently about 4" or so.  When I originally got them in Aug. '03, they were molting every two months until Jan. '04; then they didn't molt until May '04 (a 5 month interval).  It's almost Jan. '05 and they still haven't molted, which puts them at least 6 months behind Scott's metallica.  BTW, Scott & Debby, is your male metallica still alive? 

Karen N.


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## Deschain (Dec 25, 2004)

I still get that "giddy" feeling every time I see a pic of these beauties. :worship: 

Merry Christmas everyone, and I hope one of the gifts is a nice crop of slings from a huge eggsac!

Best of luck!


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## Tony (Dec 25, 2004)

No word locally either...OR the word is no eggsac 
T


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## Satanika (Dec 25, 2004)

Ultimate Instar said:
			
		

> My male metallica still hasn't matured.  He's from the original shipment and my male and female are currently about 4" or so.  When I originally got them in Aug. '03, they were molting every two months until Jan. '04; then they didn't molt until May '04 (a 5 month interval).  It's almost Jan. '05 and they still haven't molted, which puts them at least 6 months behind Scott's metallica.  BTW, Scott & Debby, is your male metallica still alive?
> 
> Karen N.


As far as we know they both are. Our 3rd male from the first batch still has not molted out mature yet. But we are expecting him to with the next molt.   

Debby


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## Michael Jacobi (Dec 26, 2004)

Satanika said:
			
		

> As far as we know they both are. Our 3rd male from the first batch still has not molted out mature yet. But we are expecting him to with the next molt.
> 
> Debby


I just spoke with Kelly the other day and the male you sent him is alive and happy. My largest female is pre-molt and I hope Scott is still planning on sending that third male my way.

Cheers,

Michael


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## Satanika (Dec 26, 2004)

SpiderShoppe said:
			
		

> I just spoke with Kelly the other day and the male you sent him is alive and happy. My largest female is pre-molt and I hope Scott is still planning on sending that third male my way.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Michael


Hey Michael,

Thanks for the update. 

He will be all yours. Please work some magic.  

Regards,
Debby


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## jw73 (Dec 26, 2004)

Good luck with breeding.


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## Lochala (Dec 26, 2004)

Well, I wish everyone involved good luck with breeding.


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## Bpkid (Dec 26, 2004)

Good luck!I have a question about this...

Is this the first time they've ever bred in the U.S?


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## Michael Jacobi (Dec 27, 2004)

Bpkid said:
			
		

> Good luck!I have a question about this...
> 
> Is this the first time they've ever bred in the U.S?


Yes.... and no.

Yes, Kelly Swift had Scott & Debby Scher's male mate with his female. No, she has not produced an eggsac yet, let alone live second instars. So, it would be more accurate to call it the first mating, which we all hope will result in the first successful breeding. Then the semantics will be unnecessary.

My best,

Michael


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## Swifty (Dec 29, 2004)

*Oh yeah baby!*

Well,  She did produce a sac...here it is!
Please don't jinx it by asking how much they're going to be, because I don't want to get too excited about it until the babies are eating....but things look very good!


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## metallica (Dec 29, 2004)

congrats on the sac! and what a xmas present to get!
what is the legspan of the male and the female?

Eddy


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## Swifty (Dec 29, 2004)

metallica said:
			
		

> congrats on the sac! and what a xmas present to get!
> what is the legspan of the male and the female?
> 
> Eddy


Without actually measureing them I'd say the feamle is about 5.5", and the male is about 5"....The female is quite a bit more hefty though. I'm sure she has more to grow.
The eggs are rollig nicely inside the sac, so I'm just going to take it day by day.


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## Jakob (Dec 29, 2004)

Wow! Good work Kelly! Keep us updated!


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## brandi (Dec 29, 2004)

Congrats on the sac!   
B~


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## Lochala (Dec 29, 2004)

Congrats on the sac Mr. Swift. Maybe you could mail some to me when they hatch.    :clap:


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## Bearo (Dec 29, 2004)

congrats 
how long time between the mating and when she made the sac?


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## pandinus (Dec 29, 2004)

:clap:  :clap:  :worship:      :worship:  :clap:  :clap:
i cant even come close to affording one, but just the thought of more metallicas existing makes me happy!


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## Spider-man 2 (Dec 29, 2004)

AWESOME!!!!!  Great work guys.


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## Windchaser (Dec 29, 2004)

Swifty said:
			
		

> Well,  She did produce a sac...here it is!
> Please don't jinx it by asking how much they're going to be, because I don't want to get too excited about it until the babies are eating....but things look very good!


What, you won't be giving them away as part of your "always a freebie"?   

Seriously though, congrats on the egg sac. Good luck and keep us informed.


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## Greaper (Dec 29, 2004)

Swifty Is My Hero!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :d 

Congrats!!!!


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## Michael Jacobi (Dec 29, 2004)

:clap:

:worship: 


Best wishes, Michael


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## Sheri (Dec 29, 2004)

*Why oh why am I not an american citizen???*

Congrats, and please don't answer...


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## Ultimate Instar (Dec 29, 2004)

At the risk of being fluffy, I've got to say yippeee!  And that's great that the mature male is still going strong after 6 months.

Karen N.


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## Sheri (Dec 29, 2004)

Ultimate Instar said:
			
		

> At the risk of being fluffy, I've got to say yippeee!  And that's great that the mature male is still going strong after 6 months.
> 
> Karen N.




You've got a stronghold of unused fluff rations to last you well into the following 5 P. metallica clutches...


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## Ultimate Instar (Dec 29, 2004)

Well, if I get anywhere with trying to breed my pair of metallicas, you're going to see some major league fluff.

Karen N.


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## SkyeSpider (Dec 30, 2004)

Congrats Kelly! I'm glad to see it has progressed this far. There's not much further to go!  Good luck! 

Hopefully my girlfriend and I will be able to buy one if they hatch.

-Bryan


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## death66 (Dec 30, 2004)

wow thats great swifty!!


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## rathjinn (Dec 30, 2004)

**

:clap:  :clap:  :clap:  BRAVO! GOOD  LUCK!
 :worship:  :worship:


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## Swifty (Dec 30, 2004)

Thanks everybody! 

I'm real excited about it!


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## Swifty (Jan 23, 2005)

*Update....*

Well, they are getting close to molting! I counted 61, but I could be off one or two, my eyes go buggy trying to remember if I counted this one or that. 
When the sac "bloomed", I opened about an eraser size hole, and peeked in with a light, and could see that the eggs had molted.
I then opened it larger to see there was a bit of a problem. There were about 8 solid black eggs and 5 of them had a few nymphs stuck to each one. Some had up to four or so stuck to them. I had to try to remove them, and remember killing two slings in the process, despite being as gentle as I possibly could. 

After picking out about 25 infertle eggs (giving them ample time to bud in case they were late bloomers) plus the solid black ones, I estimate that the sac had between 90-100 eggs
Not bad for a 5.5" female.

I'll have more to report later...


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## Goliath (Jan 23, 2005)

Nice job Kelly!   :clap: 
Mike


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## BugToxin (Jan 23, 2005)

Now that most definately, truly, certifiably, *ROCKS!!!*   :clap:  :clap:  :clap: Now I am going to march myself downstairs and start explaining to my wife why she should let me buy the nice pretty blue spider from you.


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## becca81 (Jan 23, 2005)

Wow!

Congrats on the success!

How long before they will actually be mobile spiderlings?


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## jw73 (Jan 23, 2005)

Congratulation. You are rich.


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## Bort (Jan 23, 2005)

Hmm, maybe I should splurge some of my tax return this year... Rather than putting it in a boring savings account. And congrats Swift!

-Bort


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## cryptly (Jan 23, 2005)

:clap:  :clap: Way to go!  :clap:  :clap:


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## Joy (Jan 23, 2005)

Wow, what a coup, Kelly!  Awesome achievement, and awesome photo. You have my most fervent congratulations  :clap: 

Joy


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## Tony (Jan 23, 2005)

Swifty said:
			
		

> ..........When the sac "bloomed", I opened about an eraser size hole, and peeked in with a light, and could see that the eggs had molted.
> I then opened it larger to see there was a bit of a problem. There were about 8 solid black eggs and 5 of them had a few nymphs stuck to each one. Some had up to four or so stuck to them. I had to try to remove them, and remember killing two slings in the process, despite being as gentle as I possibly could.
> 
> ...


Super awesome Kelly....And I feel a bit better, hearing from a pro that the good ones stuck to the bad ones are uber-fragile...I took out some versi like that...
T


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## rosehaired1979 (Jan 24, 2005)

Congrats Kelly! I hope everything turns out ok and the sac becomes a great success!


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## Lopez (Jan 24, 2005)

Well done Kelly. Will you be writing an article on the breeding for any of the large tarantula journals? If not then you should  

Also, Andrew Smith is collecting breeding data for his forthcoming (and much awaited) Poecilotheria book - I expect he would greatly appreciate any feedback you could give.

Best of luck with the remainder of the incubation.


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## omer (Jan 24, 2005)

congratulations  :clap:


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## jdcarrel (Jan 24, 2005)

they look great.  How much are you going to sell them for?


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## rosehaired1979 (Jan 24, 2005)

He doesn't know yet he doesn't want to jinx it he is going to wait and see how many he has and let them start eating first.


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## Mattyb (Jan 24, 2005)

Hmmmmm does this mean they will eventually go down in price?



-Mattyb


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## Joe1968 (Jan 24, 2005)

Mattyb said:
			
		

> Hmmmmm does this mean they will eventually go down in price?
> 
> 
> 
> -Mattyb



I really hope and pray thateveryone will be successfull breeding. so the market get flooded and therefore decrease price.


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## Mattyb (Jan 24, 2005)

Joe1968 said:
			
		

> I really hope and pray thateveryone will be successfull breeding. so the market get flooded and therefore decrease price.



Yeah, what do they go for like $325 i think? I really hope they go down in price, cause my girlfriend keeps asking me to buy her one.... :wall: 



-Mattyb


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## Tony (Jan 24, 2005)

Mattyb said:
			
		

> Yeah, what do they go for like $325 i think? I really hope they go down in price, cause my girlfriend keeps asking me to buy her one.... :wall:
> 
> 
> 
> -Mattyb


They started around $450 in Mid 03 and were down to $275 or so at one point....List price may not always mean going price...Price almost always goes down ..almost...

T


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## Windchaser (Jan 24, 2005)

Congrats Kelly. I guess I need to start saving my pennies now.


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## Swifty (Jan 25, 2005)

*Update...*

It's happening folks!! Giddie as a school girl!!


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## David_F (Jan 25, 2005)

Great job Kelly.   :clap:  Looks like they're coming along nicely.


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## Aviculariinae (Jan 25, 2005)

Hi, 
 Whats the going rate for these, ill take 3 for $10   ! Congrats on your new batch,hope they all molt successfully and you get a nice few bucks for yourself.


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## Immortal_sin (Jan 25, 2005)

Kelly, what a success story! Congrats to you 
I sure hope I can find a female when my own male matures!


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## chris73 (Jan 25, 2005)

Very nice Kelly. Good luck with them!


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## Bearo (Jan 26, 2005)

nice  :clap: 
May I ask how many?


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## Michael Jacobi (Jan 26, 2005)

Bearo said:
			
		

> nice  :clap:
> May I ask how many?



Kelly wrote earlier in this thread - post #75 - that there are 61 +/- 2.

Cheers,

Michael


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## Bearo (Jan 26, 2005)

SpiderShoppe said:
			
		

> Kelly wrote earlier in this thread - post #75 - that there are 61 +/- 2.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Michael


aahh I must have missed that.. thanks


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## Ultimate Instar (Sep 4, 2005)

I didn't want to start up a whole new thread so I'm dredging up this one.

My mature male P. metallica makes a hell of a racket drumming at night, sometimes early in the evening but primarily late at night.  I have him in my bedroom and he woke me up and drummed on and off for an hour or more.  After a few night of this, I had to move him.  There's nothing subtle about his "announcement" that he's ready to mate.

Karen N.


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