# What is the difference between HIGHLAND and LOWLAND p. subfusca?



## OxDionysus (May 14, 2009)

Seen some for sale but the lowland were more expensive?


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## Miss Bianca (May 14, 2009)

I wanna know too, I have no clue


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## jesters22 (May 14, 2009)

me 3... the difference in price is rele noticeable. id hope theirs a substancial amount of difference.


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## BrynWilliams (May 14, 2009)

Here is a good example of the differences.

*This photo is not my own so I've shamelessly downloaded it from another forum but forgot where. So credit to whomever credit is due to  
Photobucket is broken currently so I'll hotlink it until I can upload my own copy

Hope it's helpful 

http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/5701/shl1tt2xd2.jpg


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## DanHalen (May 14, 2009)

To be honest, I think that picture can be a bit misleading, as I am very sure from seeing the same spiders from different angles, that one is male and the other female - as such, a case of sexual dimorphism.

The whole highland and lowland thing is a bit misleading. They are all highland spiders. It would be more appropriate to refer to them in terms of colour "forms". I have examples of both, and you'll find that the lighter coloured subfuscas tend to grow larger than the darker coloured ones.

That's pretty much it.

Reactions: Clarification Please 1


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## Paramite (May 14, 2009)

DanHalen said:


> The whole highland and lowland thing is a bit misleading. They are all highland spiders. It would be more appropriate to refer to them in terms of colour "forms". I have examples of both, and you'll find that the lighter coloured subfuscas tend to grow larger than the darker coloured ones.
> 
> That's pretty much it.


Are you sure about this? Germans are still selling and breeding them as 2 separate species. And the lowland form used to be called Poecilotheria bara (atleast in the hobby).

Edit: Ah, you meant they are all highland SPIDERS, not subfusca "highlands". 

Edit2: And yes, that picture IS misleading. I have a highland female and it's nowhere near that dark. In fact, it's lighter than both of them, so the pictures are bad too...


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## BrynWilliams (May 14, 2009)

for those not seeing the pic it was removed by mods.

Sry guys.


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## Miss Bianca (May 14, 2009)

isn't that the link to the pic there??
 right by 'hope/helpful'.... >>??





BrynWilliams said:


> for those not seeing the pic it was removed by mods.
> 
> Sry guys.


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## Alex080 (May 14, 2009)

Well i own both forms and really the only Notable difference is the Highland Has Much Darker Tones and more purple where as the Lowland has Lighter Cream Tones and much more Black Patches


       Forgot to add P Subfusca Lowland cost more as they aren't as common as the Highland


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## OxDionysus (May 14, 2009)

Alex080 said:


> Well i own both forms and really the only Notable difference is the Highland Has Much Darker Tones and more purple where as the Lowland has Lighter Cream Tones and much more Black Patches
> 
> 
> Forgot to add P Subfusca Lowland cost more as they aren't as common as the Highland


then why were the lowland more exp?:?


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## codykrr (May 14, 2009)

ok, well here is another question...how come sme p. subfusca breeders have noted that both for came rom the same sac? and this has happened more han once, also only diffrence i have ever seen is one is oneis darker than the other.  and the reason i was told there labeled "highland" and "lowland" is because  one comes from a higher elevation of mountains that the other. hence why subfuscas like cooler temps like mid 50's to high 60's (farenhieght) to me its all about color and personally i prefer the dark form, as do so many others hence why here more expensive.


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## UrbanJungles (May 14, 2009)

Both types have also been found in the same habitat.


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## Paramite (May 14, 2009)

codykrr said:


> ok, well here is another question...how come sme p. subfusca breeders have noted that both for came rom the same sac? and this has happened more han once, also only diffrence i have ever seen is one is oneis darker than the other.  and the reason i was told there labeled "highland" and "lowland" is because  one comes from a higher elevation of mountains that the other. hence why subfuscas like cooler temps like mid 50's to high 60's (farenhieght) to me its all about color and personally i prefer the dark form, as do so many others hence why here more expensive.


I doubt one who claims they come from the same sac, has waited for them to mature, before giving this information. And no, the coloration isn't the only difference. The "lowland form" grows much larger. 

The prices got nothing to do with the coloration. It's all about how they've been bred. Lowland form is slightly more expensive in europe than highland, these days. That's because recently there were few succesful breedings.

Edit: And if you believe they come from the same sac, why do you still say, one comes from higher elevation than the other?


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## DanHalen (May 14, 2009)

I forgot to mention that both cost pretty much the same in europe - only around £20 - £25 a sling.


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## Paramite (May 14, 2009)

To be more accurate, highland slings cost around 35 euros, when lowland slings are 40 or so.


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## DanHalen (May 14, 2009)

Paramite said:


> To be more accurate, highland slings cost around 35 euros, when lowland slings are 40 or so.


It completely depends who is selling them. For example, I got 3 "highlands" and 2 "lowlands" for free quite recently


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## Paramite (May 14, 2009)

Of course. I was talking about the average prices in germany. 

Edit: I paid 100 euros for a highland female and I really don't think that's too much.


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## DanHalen (May 14, 2009)

Paramite said:


> Of course. I was talking about the average prices in germany.


I know it's off topic, but alot of german prices have been quite high this year for some reason :? For example, the average P. metallica sling price last year was as low as 50 euros, and now they've rocketed back up to around 90 or so. 

You can get darker coloured subfusca juvies from Thomas Froik in Denmark for only 45 euros.


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## Paramite (May 14, 2009)

DanHalen said:


> I know it's off topic, but alot of german prices have been quite high this year for some reason :? For example, the average P. metallica sling price last year was as low as 50 euros, and now they've rocketed back up to around 90 or so.


I can't say a lot of them have been high, but when it comes to P. metallica, I totally agree with you. I mean, they cost the same 2 years ago... 

But I wouldn't sell them cheaper either, because people are willing to pay ridiculous amounts of money of them.


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## Alex080 (May 15, 2009)

OxDionysus said:


> then why were the lowland more exp?:?


Umm I don't know why really personally i find them a little more Beautiful with the lighter tones

I have 25 Lowland

and 17 Highland i am planning on breeding them they are all unrelated so i wanna see what they look like crossed well i know what it looks like i just wanna do it myself


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## Paramite (May 15, 2009)

To be honest, highland females don't look that amazing. Most of the pictures on the internet are photoshopped etc.


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## 4tec84 (May 15, 2009)

So it has been finalized that there are two sub species? 

I always thought they were the same.


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## Paramite (May 15, 2009)

I'm not sure if it's official, but if they really come from the same sac, it's weird that one of them gets so much bigger... Like few inches.


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## DanHalen (May 15, 2009)

Paramite said:


> I'm not sure if it's official, but if they really come from the same sac, it's weird that one of them gets so much bigger... Like few inches.


Maybe people have been crossing the variants?



4tec84 said:


> So it has been finalized that there are two sub species?
> 
> I always thought they were the same.


No. They are different coloured variants of the same species.


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## Kevin Schneider (May 15, 2009)

A guy who know the actual situation told me, that some P. subfusca "lowlands" are P. bara in real and so they are a bit more expensive at the moment.

But the price will fall fast, cause they are easier to mate than the most poecies.

greetz,


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## Paramite (May 15, 2009)

Kevin Schneider said:


> A guy who know the actual situation told me, that some P. subfusca "lowlands" are P. bara in real and so they are a bit more expensive at the moment.
> 
> But the price will fall fast, cause they are easier to mate than the most poecies.
> 
> greetz,


No, they used to be called P. bara in the hobby. Not anymore, so that information is old. 

By the way, lowland form was cheaper in europe last summer.

Edit: Easier to mate than most Pokies? What the hell?


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## Kevin Schneider (May 15, 2009)

Paramite said:


> No, they used to be called P. bara in the hobby. Not anymore, so that information is old.


Tell me that again when the information is out, that "lowland" is P. bara :} 

greetz,


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## DanHalen (May 15, 2009)

Kevin Schneider said:


> Tell me that again when the information is out, that "lowland" is P. bara :}
> 
> greetz,


P. Bara has been a junior synonym of subfusca since 1996. Some people are referring to the larger variant as P. bara purely to differentiate between the two. There has been no official name change, and anyone that says otherwise is ill informed.


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## Protectyaaaneck (May 15, 2009)

I am raising a few of each type and it will be interesting to see what the differences are as adults.  Either way they are gorgeous and just might be my favorite pokie.  My lowland female just molted and is about 5" now and totally gorgeous


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## Paramite (Jun 26, 2009)

So I'm getting a lowland female next to my highland. Let's see how different they are. 

BTW, germans are still selling and even breeding them as 2 separate species. I really doubt these forms come from the same sac. I'm guessing someone had a lighter and slighlty larger subfusca "highland" and thought it's the typical lowland form.


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## DeTwan (Jun 26, 2009)

I don't know if anyone even answered the question. I think the most concise belief... since we can only speculate without extensive DNA research is that these are the same speices just from different regions. The "lowland", which lives in the lower regions of Sir Lanka grows larger, much larger than the "highland" version. IMO, the lowland variety is much more muted in color and lacks the purple shine that is refracted when viewed in light. This purple shean refracts off the black portions, which is more evident in the highland type. I recently sold my female Highland type for $650. I wouldnt pay $200 for a mature female lowland variety, I'd rather spend the extra $$$ for a real p. Subfusca which is the HIGHLAND subfusca. The only reason the lowland is higher is b/c there are alot of stupid ppl in this hobby that just go with whatever trend is happening....


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## Protectyaaaneck (Jun 26, 2009)

DeTwan said:


> The only reason the lowland is higher is b/c there are alot of stupid ppl in this hobby that just go with whatever trend is happening....


Yep, that's what it is...


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## Paramite (Jun 26, 2009)

DeTwan said:


> The only reason the lowland is higher is b/c there are alot of stupid ppl in this hobby that just go with whatever trend is happening....


Lol. So the fact that they are less common got nothing to do with the prices?  I like highland form more, but lowland isn't bad looking either and gets much bigger, so explain to me: Why am I stupid to buy it?


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