# Aquatic Scorpion



## Acro (Jun 11, 2012)

There are many aquatic and semiaquatic insects and some arachnids.  
There are aquatic beetles, spiders and a semiaquatic roach, to name a few.  
Are there any scorpions that are considered aquatic or semiaquatic?


----------



## Michiel (Jun 11, 2012)

No, they are terrestrial arthropds... 

Verstuurd van mijn GT-I9001 met Tapatalk


----------



## catfishrod69 (Jun 11, 2012)

There are invertibrates called "water scorpions", but they are not real scorpions. Here-->http://bugguide.net/node/view/31114


----------



## Acro (Jun 11, 2012)

I have kept a few Giant Waterscorpions (Nepa sp.), they are amazing animals!

As for my question, I was just thinking of all the adaptions that inverts have developed.  So many have taken to water, yet I have never heard of a true scorpion being aquatic or semi aquatic.  

Thought there may be one out there that I had not heard of.  One that somebody had info on.  Are we sure that none have been discovered?


----------



## Michiel (Jun 12, 2012)

I am sure...none have been discovered....is not a ver big chance...their ancestors where aquatic, then they came to land, with adapted breathing apparatus, book lungs, and why would evolution make two different lineages, one with book lungs, one with normal lungs or gills....Same reason there are no underwater giraffes or flying rhino's...adaptation is not always the case....there is no need for scorpions to become aquatic and thas been the case since they started living on land...

Verstuurd van mijn GT-I9001 met Tapatalk


----------



## Greenjewls (Jun 12, 2012)

Michiel said:


> I am sure...none have been discovered....is not a ver big chance...their ancestors where aquatic, then they came to land, with adapted breathing apparatus, book lungs, and why would evolution make two different lineages, one with book lungs, one with normal lungs or gills....Same reason there are no underwater giraffes or flying rhino's...adaptation is not always the case....there is no need for scorpions to become aquatic and thas been the case since they started living on land...
> 
> Verstuurd van mijn GT-I9001 met Tapatalk



There are whales and dolphins, ie underwater rhinos. they evolved into land animals long ago and then returned to the sea.  maybe lobsters are underwater scorpions?


----------



## Michiel (Jun 12, 2012)

No...crustacea are close related but no arachnids....whales and dolphins are aquatic mammals are not sea rhino's, what are you smoking?

Verstuurd van mijn GT-I9001 met Tapatalk


----------



## 2nscorpx (Jun 12, 2012)

I'm not getting all "what if" here, or pointing to a single resource, but in Rubio's book, he mentions littoral scorpions that live in the inter-tidal zone. What are those...?


----------



## AzJohn (Jun 12, 2012)

2nscorpx said:


> I'm not getting all "what if" here, or pointing to a single resource, but in Rubio's book, he mentions littoral scorpions that live in the inter-tidal zone. What are those...?


Euscorpius carpathicus is probably the species. I've seen it mentioned that they can be found in tidal caves. I've seen it mentioned in a few places, none of which I would take too seriously.


----------



## AbraxasComplex (Jun 13, 2012)

The biology of Vaejovis littoralis Williams, an intertidal scorpion from Baja California, Mexico


----------



## Michiel (Jun 13, 2012)

I don't think that scorpions living in these intertidal zones would considered as semi-aquatic....but it woukd be interesting to know what binds them to these zones...Why don't they go landinwards...Maybe because the humidity?
I know that the whip spider Phrynus marginemaculatus also lives in zones that are flooded every now and then, and these.guys can breath through plastron respiration and can stay submerged for hours, because they can breath like this...
Question seems, what makes an animal semi-aquatic and how does this pertain to scorpions living in intertidal zones....Learn me something for a change  Who is going to dig into this?

Verstuurd van mijn GT-I9001 met Tapatalk


----------



## Acro (Jun 13, 2012)

When Greenjewls mentioned "whales and dolphins", what was meant (I think) is that whales and dolphins evolved from land based animals who then evolved into "aquatic mammals".

As for animals leaving one way of life and returning to it, just look at the snakes.  They evolved from animals that had limbs and lived on the land, then they moved underground and lost the limbs.  When conditions became favorable, they came back to land as they are today.  Look it up, true stuff, it took a while and a lot of evolution but it happened.  Sea snakes took it a step further.

Looking at the big picture, all land animals evolved from water based animals.  Now we have fishing spiders and diving spiders, one arachnid that has returned to water. They still breath air, but they depend on the water to live.

As for the intertidal scorpions mentioned (and thanks for mentioning them everyone!) the ammount of time they spend in the water and the adaptions that have developed would determin if they were infact aquatic or semi-aquatic animals.  I wonder if they just hang on the ceiling of tidal caves, then pick through any food that remains when the tide goes out.  Maybe they scamper up the beach every time a wave crashes in.  Maybe they dive under and snag a dead fish.  Anybody have more info?


----------



## Wadew (Jun 13, 2012)

Michiel said:


> I am sure...none have been discovered....is not a ver big chance...their ancestors where aquatic, then they came to land, with adapted breathing apparatus, book lungs, and why would evolution make two different lineages, one with book lungs, one with normal lungs or gills....Same reason there are no underwater giraffes or flying rhino's...adaptation is not always the case....there is no need for scorpions to become aquatic and thas been the case since they started living on land...
> .................................................................................................................................................................
> Michiel,
> You are aware of beta splendens or betta  fish that have a labyrinth organ and gills like a fish. Both allow the fish to breath air.
> -Wade


----------



## Michiel (Jun 13, 2012)

Yes, I have heard  of those. There are several fish that have "alternative ways of breathing besides  gills" btw, like eels, lung fish, chinese snakeheads etc.. But remember, we're talking scorpions here....

Verstuurd van mijn GT-I9001 met Tapatalk


----------



## Eclectix (Jun 16, 2012)

To my knowledge, there are no true aquatic scorpions alive today, but your common crayfish or lobster is really not terribly different once you get right down to it.








The creature illustrated above doesn't actually exist, but is a "what if" illustration which I created.  This sort of written or illustrated fiction is referred to as "speculative evolution."  

My description to go with the image:  The trench scorpion is distantly related to terrestrial scorpions. While most of the eurypterid sea scorpions of the Ordovician either went extinct or evolved to live on land, one species has remained in the inky blackness of the Mariana Trench where it has eluded scientific discovery until recently. This sea scorpion uses a bioluminous lure which grows on one of a pair of sensory "antennae". When the trench scorpion senses movement near the lure, it strikes with its venomous stinger and grabs its prey with formidable pincers. The creature has the peculiar habit of walking backwards on the trench floor, and since it has long ago lost its eyes in the black abyss, it looks very much as though its "tail" is actually its "head."


----------



## 2nscorpx (Jun 16, 2012)

Michiel said:


> No...crustacea are close related but no arachnids...


They do look the same, and are both arthropods, but as Michiel stated, they are not arachnids. Cool picture. I would wonder, however, how large the scorpion would be, and why it would need to live in the sea...


----------



## Eclectix (Jun 16, 2012)

No reason why they would need to live in the sea other than the fact that they originally evolved there.  It would be interesting if some vestige of them remained behind (although there is no evidence that this is the case, it's fun to speculate).  Anciently, sea scorpions came in a staggering variety of sizes, from tiny little things to giants that were more than 8 feet long.


----------



## Acro (Jun 18, 2012)

Eclectix, Cool illustration!  Do you have others?

And guess what...I think I found a semi aquatic scorpion.
Chactas raymondhandsi  http://aecphotos.com/thirtysixarticlesfile.html
What do you think?


----------



## 2nscorpx (Jun 18, 2012)

Interesting, but I am not sure of the credibility of the source. Rhopalurus junceus, for example, often is found in bromeliads, and although I am not sure of the changes in the micro-habitat, it might have problems with water as well...Michiel would probably be a better help, he's knowledgeable about Chactids...


----------



## Acro (Jun 27, 2012)

So what does everyone think of Chactas raymondhandsi?  Is it semi aquatic?  Is there even enough info out there to determine if it is?


----------



## Travis K (Jun 27, 2012)

Acro said:


> And guess what...I think I found a semi aquatic scorpion.
> Chactas raymondhandsi  http://aecphotos.com/thirtysixarticlesfile.html
> What do you think?


I would need to see an invert hobbyist or professional back this up with documentation before I bought into it.  I don't think it is unbelievable though.


----------



## AzJohn (Jun 27, 2012)

For anyone interested, this is the article sited in the above website. I'm not sure if Chactas raymondhandsi is semiaquatic or just has some cool adaptations.
http://www.americanarachnology.org/JoA_free/JoA_v14_n1/JoA_v14_p15_grey.pdf


----------



## 2nscorpx (Jun 27, 2012)

Hey, I've got that article! Thanks John!

Acro, it is probably not too well documented, and it may be an assumption that they are able to do this...I'd have to see a publication first.


----------



## DubiaW (Apr 21, 2017)

Michiel said:


> No...crustacea are close related but no arachnids....whales and dolphins are aquatic mammals are not sea rhino's, what are you smoking?
> 
> Verstuurd van mijn GT-I9001 met Tapatalk


Actually Whales share an ancestor with hippos. There is a unique bone structure, the double pulley joint, that is present in both lineages in the fossil record. http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibrary/article/evograms_03


----------

