# Tarantulas in AZ



## Purpleorange8 (Sep 9, 2009)

I have been given the assignment to go camping anywhere in AZ. Anybody know some good spots where I can maybe see alot of tarantulas? Thanks  GPS Coordinates would be awesome


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## UrbanJungles (Sep 9, 2009)

I hope that if you do encounter some tarantulas they won't end up on the classifieds section like all the other native AZ animals you've encountered?!

http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=160868


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## Purpleorange8 (Sep 9, 2009)

UrbanJungles said:


> I hope that if you do encounter some tarantulas they won't end up on the classifieds section like all the other native AZ animals you've encountered?!
> 
> http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=160868


DEF NOT! I absolutely LOVE Tarantulas, so far the only thing I have sold is pesky bark scorpions in my neighborhood and some AZ desert hairies which I have successfully mated  (Besides the toad got out )


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## scottyk (Sep 9, 2009)

Purpleorange8 said:


> I have been given the assignment to go camping anywhere in AZ.


Who assigned you to go camping and why? Just curious as I've never heard that one before...


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## Purpleorange8 (Sep 10, 2009)

scottyk said:


> Who assigned you to go camping and why? Just curious as I've never heard that one before...


My teacher, I have to document wild life for biology and get pictures for extra credit. Lol. I want to get some tarantulas in the pictures too  My step dad thinks it sounds fun because he is one of the many photographers for arizona highways


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## JimM (Sep 10, 2009)

Stay a few nights in the 4 corners area....there's some interesting critters walking around there...tarantulas and otherwise.


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## josh_r (Sep 10, 2009)

this purpleorange person keeps changing their story all the time to get people to tell them localities for things. this person was PMing me claiming that their dad wants pictures of dwarf tarantulas for arizona highways so i should tell them where to go find them. i told them that i do not believe their story and i wont give them any information. i simply do not trust this person. i truely believe that if this person learns how to find tarantulas, they will be up for sale as those "pesky" bark scorpions and "captive bred" hadrurus. this person is this new to the hobby and hardly knows anything and is already successfully breeding hadrurus??? some of us long term dedicated hobbyists havent even accomplished that after several failed attempts. i suggest no one give this person locality info. check this PM

"My step dad is a photographer, he has tons of pictures in the Arizona Highways magazines. He thought it would be interesting to maybe take some pictures of the dwarf tarantulas, if not he says any tarantula would be great. If you have any locations let me know. We want to go camping and look around  Thanks!"

i simply dont buy it.

-josh


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## Zebo777 (Sep 10, 2009)

Sounds like the same story as the post I would be most worried at the ads he posted as that is the proof that he has no problem selling off his states wildlife


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## UrbanJungles (Sep 10, 2009)

This is precisely why I called him on this. I have seen this person post about keeping a Colorado river toad he just caught together with a desert tortoise (both AZ natives) then post the toad for sale in the classifieds section practically the same evening. All I can say is "Poacher".

I know this poster is young but it's never to soon to learn proper wildlife ettiquette.


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## mickey66 (Sep 10, 2009)

JimM said:


> Stay a few nights in the 4 corners area....there's some interesting critters walking around there...tarantulas and otherwise.


The 4 corners area is a heck of a long drive from the  Phoenix area for your info.


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## JimM (Sep 10, 2009)

mickey66 said:


> The 4 corners area is a heck of a long drive from the  Phoenix area for your info.


LOL
Well he seems to have time on his hands.


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## mickey66 (Sep 10, 2009)

josh_r said:


> this purpleorange person keeps changing their story all the time to get people to tell them localities for things. this person was PMing me claiming that their dad wants pictures of dwarf tarantulas for arizona highways so i should tell them where to go find them. i told them that i do not believe their story and i wont give them any information. i simply do not trust this person. i truely believe that if this person learns how to find tarantulas, they will be up for sale as those "pesky" bark scorpions and "captive bred" hadrurus. this person is this new to the hobby and hardly knows anything and is already successfully breeding hadrurus??? some of us long term dedicated hobbyists havent even accomplished that after several failed attempts. i suggest no one give this person locality info. check this PM
> 
> "My step dad is a photographer, he has tons of pictures in the Arizona Highways magazines. He thought it would be interesting to maybe take some pictures of the dwarf tarantulas, if not he says any tarantula would be great. If you have any locations let me know. We want to go camping and look around  Thanks!"
> 
> i simply dont buy it.


 photographer's that shoot for  Az highways and it takes years to become an Az highways photographer BTW....they know where to go for great photo's.....poster is full of <edit>....you are correct I think.


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## Sunset (Sep 10, 2009)

I don't see whats the problem in collecting wild Ts. How do you think we have Cb T's today. You think they came out of thin air. Don't think so. People have to catch the first T's and then breed them. They way i Look at it is if you catch a new T and its not Cb and you cant Fine Cb T's out there. catch them and try to breed them. The More T's people breed the lest people well catch in the wild. I catch wild T's all the time. But i don't sell them. Maybe im in the wrong But that's just my two cents. 

Is there cb az Dwarf T out there. I would love to have couple of them. They seem really cool.


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## Purpleorange8 (Sep 10, 2009)

UrbanJungles said:


> This is precisely why I called him on this. I have seen this person post about keeping a Colorado river toad he just caught together with a desert tortoise (both AZ natives) then post the toad for sale in the classifieds section practically the same evening. All I can say is "Poacher".
> 
> I know this poster is young but it's never to soon to learn proper wildlife ettiquette.


*African* Sulcata tortoises. NOT AZ NATIVE <edit>. I bought from a breeder down in Apache junction, right now I currently have an A in biology and there is an assignment for extra credit to take pictures of Native Wildlife. My step dad is a photographer and takes pictures all over Arizona, so he said I can come with him this week and I can pick the spot. Oh yeah and Josh_R, I go dirt biking in the state trust lands with my step dad while he ATVs and he wanted to take pictures out there too. As for the Colorado River Toad I found that down the street at the school. He is now in the desert behind my house.

He has been a photographer for a long time.... Here is his website, http://marklarsonphotography.com/ I have bought a fish and game license to wild collect. And so far I don't see any laws forbidding the collection/capturing of wild inesects so it is pointless for me to have one...


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## Zebo777 (Sep 10, 2009)

Think people were upset about the selling although I can't understand why everyone assumes his stepdad being a photographer is a lie. Can't see why that even helps or matters to anything


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## Purpleorange8 (Sep 10, 2009)

mickey66 said:


> photographer's that shoot for  Az highways and it takes years to become an Az highways photographer BTW....they know where to go for great photo's.....poster is full of <edit>....you are correct I think.


You sir must be a <EDIT> photographer, Arizona Highways is landscape, not tarantulas. He wants shot of tarantulas.


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## Purpleorange8 (Sep 10, 2009)

Zebo777 said:


> Think people were upset about the selling although I can't understand why everyone assumes his stepdad being a photographer is a lie. Can't see why that even helps or matters to anything


Thanks, he honestly is and it is for extra credit. Honestly the only thing I have sold are pesky bark scorpions around the neighborhood and a few Hadrurus Arizonesis. The toad hopped away, and the lizard my friend bred.


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## josh_r (Sep 10, 2009)

offroad537 said:


> I don't see whats the problem in collecting wild Ts. How do you think we have Cb T's today. You think they came out of thin air. Don't think so. People have to catch the first T's and then breed them. They way i Look at it is if you catch a new T and its not Cb and you cant Fine Cb T's out there. catch them and try to breed them. The More T's people breed the lest people well catch in the wild. I catch wild T's all the time. But i don't sell them. Maybe im in the wrong But that's just my two cents.
> 
> Is there cb az Dwarf T out there. I would love to have couple of them. They seem really cool.


yes, there are a few different AZ dwarfs out there that are CB. give it some time and more will pop up.


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## josh_r (Sep 10, 2009)

purpleorange, quite frankly, none of your stories really make any sense. you always seem to have an excuse. i do not think there is anything in collecting wild inverts. i just dont think you are ready for it because i think you will go overboard and collect everything you find. you will then post it up for sale. i know what it is like to be young and want something so badly. i remember when i first moved there and found my first tarantulas. i made the mistake of over collecting things and quickly learned it was very wrong to take so much. this is something you need to learn before people start giving you any information on localities. one day you will understand what i am saying.

-josh


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## Dark241993 (Sep 10, 2009)

josh_r said:


> purpleorange, quite frankly, none of your stories really make any sense. you always seem to have an excuse.


if he was telling the truth then there would BE an excuse...im not saying ur wrong. but im not saying ur right. but u cant just say "hey your stories dont make sense. you always have an excuse" thats not a valid point. what IF his excuses are true? then again what if they arnt. the thing is u cant know for sure


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## Noexcuse4you (Sep 10, 2009)

Dude, seriously, if you can't find T burrows in AZ, there's something wrong with you.  At the ATS Conference, we stopped at a gas station to fill up and decided to blacklight around the store.  There were dozens of Ts just sitting outside their burrows.  This wasn't in the middle of nowhere either.  It was right off the freeway in a developed town.

Have you even done any research of your own?


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## Kirk (Sep 10, 2009)

josh_r said:


> purpleorange, quite frankly, none of your stories really make any sense. you always seem to have an excuse. i do not think there is anything in collecting wild inverts. i just dont think you are ready for it because i think you will go overboard and collect everything you find. you will then post it up for sale. i know what it is like to be young and want something so badly. i remember when i first moved there and found my first tarantulas. i made the mistake of over collecting things and quickly learned it was very wrong to take so much. this is something you need to learn before people start giving you any information on localities. one day you will understand what i am saying.
> 
> -josh


Do you know the OP personally, such that your insinuations have any credibility? He said he wants to look at tarantulas in the wild, he didn't say he was going out to collect in some irresponsible manner because he has some compulsion to do so.

The kid asked a simple question, and several of you have taken it upon yourselves to be judge and jury and brand him a liar. I think your overzealous desire to 'save' populations of tarantulas that you've provided no data as to actual distributions to warrant your concern to be simply juvenile.


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## Purpleorange8 (Sep 10, 2009)

Kirk said:


> Do you know the OP personally, such that your insinuations have any credibility? He said he wants to look at tarantulas in the wild, he didn't say he was going out to collect in some irresponsible manner because he has some compulsion to do so.
> 
> The kid asked a simple question, and several of you have taken it upon yourselves to be judge and jury and brand him a liar. I think your overzealous desire to 'save' populations of tarantulas that you've provided no data as to actual distributions to warrant your concern to be simply juvenile.


Thanks I think, and sorry I am in the middle of phoenix and there isn't many tarantulas over here.


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## UrbanJungles (Sep 10, 2009)

Purpleorange8 said:


> *African* Sulcata tortoises. NOT AZ NATIVE <edit>. I bought from a breeder down in Apache junction,


I know you are young so I'll let the insults slide...but you should have been more specific when you stated this in your post, where you instead listed your toirtoises as "Desert Tortoises" and given your penchant for eying up natives it's an easy mistake.

http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=160868



Noexcuse4you said:


> Dude, seriously, if you can't find T burrows in AZ, there's something wrong with you.....Have you even done any research of your own?


Just like JoshR mentions in another post, if you are serious about finding wildlife then you have to put in the time.  You will not get much info from dedicated wildlife observers who know better than to talk about known populations.  In Arizona, you don't have to put in much time to find T's.  I head out to AZ about twice a year and there are few places if any where you won't find T's or scorps if you are patient and look around carefully.



Kirk said:


> He said he wants to look at tarantulas in the wild, he didn't say he was going out to collect in some irresponsible manner because he has some compulsion to do so.
> 
> The kid asked a simple question, and several of you have taken it upon yourselves to be judge and jury and brand him a liar. I think your overzealous desire to 'save' populations of tarantulas that you've provided no data as to actual distributions to warrant your concern to be simply juvenile.


I'm not trying to "save" any populations, but judging from some actions by the OP in the very recent past this is not a person I would trust with any info on a population I hope to go back and see soon!


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## Purpleorange8 (Sep 10, 2009)

josh_r said:


> i do not think there is anything in collecting wild inverts. i just dont think you are ready for it because i think you will go overboard and collect everything you find. you will then post it up for sale. i know what it is like to be young and want something so badly. i remember when i first moved there and found my first tarantulas. i made the mistake of over collecting things and quickly learned it was very wrong to take so much. this is something you need to learn before people start giving you any information on localities. one day you will understand what i am saying.
> 
> -josh


I don't give away any of my localities for scorpions, infact I release half of what I catch each night.


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## Kirk (Sep 10, 2009)

UrbanJungles said:


> I'm not trying to "save" any populations, but judging from some actions by the OP in the very recent past this is not a person I would trust with any info on a population I hope to go back and see soon!


You honestly think a 16-year old is going to rape a population? In a region the size of AZ? Are you serious?

I can only surmise that you must have grand mal seizures every time you hear of a new housing development, shopping center, WalMart Super Store, road construction, or all the other events of habitat destruction.


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## Purpleorange8 (Sep 10, 2009)

Kirk said:


> You honestly think a 16-year old is going to rape a population? In a region the size of AZ? Are you serious?
> 
> I can only surmise that you must have grand mal seizures every time you hear of a new housing development, shopping center, WalMart Super Store, road construction, or all the other events of habitat destruction.


There is alot of that where I live  I usually catch them and release half of them in my desert behind my house


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## UrbanJungles (Sep 10, 2009)

Kirk said:


> You honestly think a 16-year old is going to rape a population? In a region the size of AZ? Are you serious?
> 
> I can only surmise that you must have grand mal seizures every time you hear of a new housing development, shopping center, WalMart Super Store, road construction, or all the other events of habitat destruction.


You'll be suprised what a 16 year old is capable of...why add to the pressure?
It's not so much a kid collecting everything in sight but a kid collecting everything just to sell.....not right, regardless of the population size.


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## Kirk (Sep 10, 2009)

UrbanJungles said:


> You'll be suprised what a 16 year old is capable of...why add to the pressure?
> It's not so much a kid collecting everything in sight but a kid collecting everything just to sell.....not right, regardless of the population size.


And again, you've made an unfounded accusation, which makes this thread all the more worthless.


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## UrbanJungles (Sep 10, 2009)

Kirk said:


> You honestly think a 16-year old is going to rape a population? In a region the size of AZ? Are you serious?
> 
> I can only surmise that you must have grand mal seizures every time you hear of a new housing development, shopping center, WalMart Super Store, road construction, or all the other events of habitat destruction.





Kirk said:


> And again, you've made an unfounded accusation, which makes this thread all the more worthless.


How is it unfounded?  Just last month I visited a site in the Huachuca Mts of AZ which always provided plenty of T's and Vinegaroons to photograph.  I returned this year only to find flipped rocks which were out of place exposing dry empty burrows...obviously someone over-collected the area and didn't' even have to courtesy to replace flipped rocks (where they found T's or Vinegaroons) over burrows.  There was once a thriving population of inverts in this area but due to someone overcollecting the site there was nothing to find this season.  I' ve seen it first hand...have you?

This thread is not useless if it keeps just one person from accidentally divulging a thriving population to a collector or at least thinking twice....


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## Purpleorange8 (Sep 10, 2009)

I will never sell a T, besides the slings my female chalcodes/new river create. I currently have TONS of pet scorpions, thankyou very much. I don't sell everything I see. Like rocks, nobody buys rocks. I don't flip rocks so I don't have to flip them back. Besides what makes you say whoever flipped all your rocks over was 16, he/she flipped the rocks over, that's what you were going to do right?


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## Kirk (Sep 10, 2009)

UrbanJungles said:


> How is it unfounded?  Just last month I visited a site in the Huachuca Mts of AZ which always provided plenty of T's and Vinegaroons to photograph.  I returned this year only to find flipped rocks which were out of place exposing dry empty burrows...obviously someone over-collected the area and didn't' even have to courtesy to replace flipped rocks (where they found T's or Vinegaroons) over burrows.  There was once a thriving population of inverts in this area but due to someone overcollecting the site there was nothing to find this season.


How do you know it was just one person who collected everything? Over what span of time? Once again, you're tendency to engage in hyperbole makes me suspect your motives.

In fact, I'm going to assume, as you've done with the OP, that your tale of woe about not finding anything in an area where you claim you just wanted to take photos is itself a lie, and you were out to collect specimens.



UrbanJungles said:


> I' ve seen it first hand...have you?


In my career as a systematist, I've traveled to over 20 countries. For instance, I did field work around coral reefs in the Philippines that were dynamited for the fish to be sold to into the pet trade. The sea grass beds are depauperate of almost all fish. I've seen whole sections of reef covered over to expand an airport in the British Virgin Islands. I've seen dredging operations on all US coasts that in an instant wipe out massive regions of marine benthic fauna. Just off Los Angeles CA, we have one of the largest DDT contaminated marine habitats in the world, with bottom fishes regularly showing tumors.

So in answer to your question, yeah, I'm very familiar with the actions of humans. But in the scheme of things, your unfounded rant against a kid is just that, an unfounded rant. You've provided no evidence that the OP is going to do anything you've claimed.


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## Purpleorange8 (Sep 10, 2009)

Kirk said:


> In fact, I'm going to assume, as you've done with the OP, that your tale of woe about not finding anything in an area where you claim you just wanted to take photos is itself a lie, and you were out to collect specimens.
> QUOTE]
> 
> I will be catching and releasing, I wont be taking any home if that is what you are saying. But I will be taking many photos


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## UrbanJungles (Sep 10, 2009)

Kirk said:


> How do you know it was just one person who collected everything? Over what span of time? Once again, you're tendency to engage in hyperbole makes me suspect your motives.
> 
> In fact, I'm going to assume, as you've done with the OP, that your tale of woe about not finding anything in an area where you claim you just wanted to take photos is itself a lie, and you were out to collect specimens.
> 
> ...



Yes, because you've seen me selling so many native T's on the arachnobaoards classifieds....Unlike the OP.

Your logic is flawed, try again.

Having been to so many ecologically sensitive areas, I guess it was a waste if you can't see the impact a single human can make.


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## Purpleorange8 (Sep 10, 2009)

UrbanJungles said:


> Yes, because you've seen me selling so many native T's on the arachnobaoards classifieds....Unlike the OP.
> 
> Your logic is flawed, try again.
> 
> Having been to so many ecologically sensitive areas, I guess it was a waste if you can't see the impact a single human can make.


Yes, because you've seen me selling so many native T's on the arachnobaoards classifieds.

You wont find one post of me selling T's, but you will find a few of me BUYING T's.


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## Kirk (Sep 10, 2009)

UrbanJungles said:


> Yes, because you've seen me selling so many native T's on the arachnobaoards classifieds....Unlike the OP.
> 
> Your logic is flawed, try again.
> 
> Having been to so many ecologically sensitive areas, I guess it was a waste if you can't see the impact a single human can make.


I've never seen the OP selling any spiders here. You really don't want to engage me in any topic dealing with logic, I assure you. Just look at my posts in TWH.

You provided nothing to indicate that a 'single human' was responsible for what you claimed. Plus, we only have your word as to the size of the region you're referring to, and your credibility has dropped to zero as far as I'm concerned.


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## AzJohn (Sep 10, 2009)

He sells adult C sculps at $2 each, with a limit of 10. Do you think they are CB. It would take more than $2 in feeders just to raise them to adult. I hope the OP is legit, but he does sell a lot of adult scorpions. It always says that he must sell these scorpions, but he allways has more to sell. He's sent me PMs telling me he breeds his animals, then why sell your adults and lose your breeders.


John


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## Noexcuse4you (Sep 10, 2009)

UrbanJungles said:


> How is it unfounded?  Just last month I visited a site in the Huachuca Mts of AZ which always provided plenty of T's and Vinegaroons to photograph.  I returned this year only to find flipped rocks which were out of place exposing dry empty burrows...obviously someone over-collected the area and didn't' even have to courtesy to replace flipped rocks (where they found T's or Vinegaroons) over burrows.  There was once a thriving population of inverts in this area but due to someone overcollecting the site there was nothing to find this season.  I've seen it first hand...have you?
> 
> This thread is not useless if it keeps just one person from accidentally divulging a thriving population to a collector or at least thinking twice....


Flipped rocks?  Sounds like herpers.  A lot of people from around the country come to AZ every monsoon season for herps.  Many of them don't care about the habitat because they don't live there.


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## Purpleorange8 (Sep 10, 2009)

AzJohn said:


> He sells adult C sculps at $2 each, with a limit of 10. Do you think they are CB. It would take more than $2 in feeders just to raise them to adult. I hope the OP is legit, but he does sell a lot of adult scorpions. It always says that he must sell these scorpions, but he allways has more to sell. He's sent me PMs telling me he breeds his animals, then why sell your adults and lose your breeders.
> 
> 
> John


Because I have 2 50 gallon aquariums with about 100 each. and I go around my neighborhood walls with a blacklight and catch scorpions. My neighbors don't like them and I do so I catch them. My crickets (feeders) I buy from petco.


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## Exo (Sep 10, 2009)

Purpleorange8 said:


> Because I have 2 50 gallon aquariums with about 100 each. and I go around my neighborhood walls with a blacklight and catch scorpions. My neighbors don't like them and I do so I catch them. My crickets (feeders) I buy from petco.


So your just catching scorps that your neighbors would probably kill on sight anyway, I see no problem with that.


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## JimM (Sep 10, 2009)

I wonder why I never see so much concern over wild collecting and human impact when it's Malaysia, India...or Africa. :?


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## Exo (Sep 10, 2009)

JimM said:


> I wonder why I never see so much concern over wild collecting and human impact when it's Malaysia, India...or Africa. :?


Because most AB members don't live there.


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## JimM (Sep 10, 2009)

Exo said:


> Because most AB members don't live there.


Exactly.......


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## josh_r (Sep 11, 2009)

purpleorange has not posted any tarantulas for sale or any other inverts because he/she does not know how to find them. that is why this person is constantly asking for information and localities to find them. judging from the previous posts and sales from this person, i would not trust them with information. that is my decision and i am entitled to it. i simply do not trust the kid. now, i could be wrong, but i am not going to take that risk until i feel this person can be trusted. i have gotten too many PMs from this person asking for locality info and it is always for a project or for his dad to take pictures or so he/she can start a breeding project or whatever... there have been too many excuses. i just dont buy it.

i have lived in arizona for many years and have known some of the big time collectors in arizona. and i can say, YES, one or 2 individuals can damn near whipe out a population in a given area. most species do have very large ranges so they are not at any risk of extinction from collecting, but populations within an area can get wiped out fairly quickly. i too used to see LOTS of tarantulas in many localities that no longer produce specimens. oh, and all those rocks being flipped in the huachucas and every other sky island and every other mountain range and valley are being flipped every bit as much by tarantula hunters as herpers. many herpers are also taantula hunters. MANY species of tarantula are mostly found by flipping well seated rocks as they prefer to create burrows that skirt them and end in a pocket directly underneath the rock. i do not even like flipping rocks anymore. it is annoying to see so many rocks flipped and i just dont want to take part in it anymore. 

-josh


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## josh_r (Sep 11, 2009)

JimM said:


> I wonder why I never see so much concern over wild collecting and human impact when it's Malaysia, India...or Africa. :?


we do not live there, true, so there is a high demand for some of these exotic species. if we did live there, i wonder if these species would still be as fascinating to us?? 

besides, i think it has been established already that wild collecting is not neccessarily a threat to aphonopelma, but rather the destruction of the habitat, the continuing lack of rain, and other factors. i am not saying the kid cant sell stuff. i am saying i dont want to help him. if he wants to sell stuff, then i think he should go do the field time to find his own spots and learn how to find them himself. i dont trust him with my localities.


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## John Apple (Sep 11, 2009)

well up here in Michigan we have that Maize n blue tarantula if he wannts that local

I am with Josh on this


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## Kirk (Sep 11, 2009)

josh_r said:


> we do not live there, true, so there is a high demand for some of these exotic species. if we did live there, i wonder if these species would still be as fascinating to us??
> 
> besides, i think it has been established already that wild collecting is not neccessarily a threat to aphonopelma, but rather the destruction of the habitat, the continuing lack of rain, and other factors. i am not saying the kid cant sell stuff. i am saying i dont want to help him. if he wants to sell stuff, then i think he should go do the field time to find his own spots and learn how to find them himself. i dont trust him with my localities.


"Lord, may I recognize pettiness for what it is and move on so that my imagination doesn't take over and give pettiness more value than it deserves."
-- Author Unknown


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## Purpleorange8 (Sep 11, 2009)

I am sorry I am interested in Tarantulas and being able to see them in the wild then cooped up in a cage. MY BAD! I have a good spot to see some and I will see about 100+ tomorrow.


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## Noexcuse4you (Sep 11, 2009)

Purpleorange8 said:


> I am sorry I am interested in Tarantulas and being able to see them in the wild then cooped up in a cage. MY BAD! I have a good spot to see some and I will see about 100+ tomorrow.


Oh ok

..............


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## josh_r (Sep 11, 2009)

Purpleorange8 said:


> I am sorry I am interested in Tarantulas and being able to see them in the wild then cooped up in a cage. MY BAD! I have a good spot to see some and I will see about 100+ tomorrow.


so then why are you constantly asking for localities and saying you cant find any???? i dont get it!!!!!!

just look at the posts this kid has made
http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/search.php?searchid=1900564

instead of asking questions and learning about the animals, he has been trying to get locality information and has been posting classified ads for everything he finds. selling arizona native herps is very illegal and not knowing his states laws will not save him when F&W comes knocking.


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## AzJohn (Sep 11, 2009)

Purpleorange8 said:


> Because I have 2 50 gallon aquariums with about 100 each. and I go around my neighborhood walls with a blacklight and catch scorpions. My neighbors don't like them and I do so I catch them. My crickets (feeders) I buy from petco.



So you have 200 WC scorpions. That says it all. Do you think your neigbors are really bothered by scorpions that only come out at night. Most of your neigbors don't even know that there were that many. Do you realize you might have collected the entire population from that area. If you cared about the animals you would have tried educating yout neighbors and not just taking and selling the scorpions.


John


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## AzJohn (Sep 11, 2009)

I know comertial collecting is bad in other parts of the world as well. That's why the hobby needs to stay with captive bred individuals. I haven't purchased a WC invert in years. I do collect a few but generally, you won't see them for sell. 

John


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## Mister Internet (Sep 11, 2009)

Huh... and here I thought *I* was too harsh on n00bs.

I suggest everyone take a deep breath.


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## campj (Sep 11, 2009)

AzJohn said:


> So you have 200 WC scorpions. That says it all. Do you think your neigbors are really bothered by scorpions that only come out at night. Most of your neigbors don't even know that there were that many. Do you realize you might have collected the entire population from that area. If you cared about the animals you would have tried educating yout neighbors and not just taking and selling the scorpions.
> 
> 
> John


I spotted an AZ bark scorp in my back yard in the daytime and will not let my two year old play out there anymore. The last thing we need is my daughter to come close to dying because she was stung by a highly venomous scorpion. Let the vaejovis take care of insect control... AZ bark scorps are either captured or killed on site when on my property.


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## AzJohn (Sep 11, 2009)

campj said:


> I spotted an AZ bark scorp in my back yard in the daytime and will not let my two year old play out there anymore. The last thing we need is my daughter to come close to dying because she was stung by a highly venomous scorpion. Let the vaejovis take care of insect control... AZ bark scorps are either captured or killed on site when on my property.



That is kind of making my point. When was the last fatality resulting from a scorpion sting in Arizona. How many people are hospialized yearly. Of those how many are sent home with nothing more than a mild pain killer. Instead of killing them all maybe you should learn about them. The fact that they only come out at night and are very secretive makes contact with very unlikely. The only time I've seen any scorpion is if I'm looking.


John


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## Exo (Sep 11, 2009)

AzJohn said:


> That is kind of making my point. When was the last fatality resulting from a scorpion sting in Arizona. How many people are hospialized yearly. Of those how many are sent home with nothing more than a mild pain killer. Instead of killing them all maybe you should learn about them. The fact that they only come out at night and are very secretive makes contact with very unlikely. The only time I've seen any scorpion is if I'm looking.
> 
> 
> John


Keep in mind that most people hate bugs, and don't want to learn about them. We are in the minority, and most people find it easier to kill than to learn.


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## Zebo777 (Sep 11, 2009)

I agree most people will kill on site any scorpion or spider and then get the area sprayed killing everything


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## Sunset (Sep 13, 2009)

campj said:


> I spotted an AZ bark scorp in my back yard in the daytime and will not let my two year old play out there anymore. The last thing we need is my daughter to come close to dying because she was stung by a highly venomous scorpion. Let the vaejovis take care of insect control... AZ bark scorps are either captured or killed on site when on my property.




I never see T's or Scorpions in less im out there looking. Why not just catch it and move it out of the area. If your that worry about your daughter getting sting i would move out of az and move some where that doesn't have scorpions or anything that could hurt your kid. You should move to Iowa or Maine. Or lock your kid up in her room and not let her out if your so worry about it. You worry to much and need to chill out.


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## campj (Sep 15, 2009)

offroad537 said:


> I never see T's or Scorpions in less im out there looking. Why not just catch it and move it out of the area. If your that worry about your daughter getting sting i would move out of az and move some where that doesn't have scorpions or anything that could hurt your kid. You should move to Iowa or Maine. Or lock your kid up in her room and not let her out if your so worry about it. You worry to much and need to chill out.


Being in the military kind of restricts our ability to just move on a whim (in fact, I didn't ever plan on living in AZ in the first place... not that I'm too disappointed). Take a look at this article published by the UofA this year. 

http://uanews.org/node/25453

Also this one (John, a kid died from a scorp sting in 2002):

http://www.tucsoncitizen.com/ss/byauthor/116453

Not sure if the folks who posted saying it's nothing to worry about have kids or not, but the thought of my daughter dying is pretty excruciating, especially if it's something that we could have prevented. If she were stung, we would of course get her to the ER immediately, but why even risk it?

And by the way, I haven't killed any scorps yet. If I see them in my yard on my property though and I can't catch them, then yeah, I'll kill them... it is a last resort in other words.


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## josh_r (Sep 16, 2009)

eh, i wouldnt worry about it too much


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## dtknow (Sep 16, 2009)

I can see Josh's concerns. I think a few commercial collectors have sold WC cheaply on this website even. And their are people who would happily buy them.

Btw, I look at T's different from scorpions(which mature faster), and also from imported t's expect G. rosea and similar(most of the African/Asian species grow fast so are likely not too much affected by collecting pressure so long it is not intensive).

I guess it is the difference between cutting down a mulberry vs an oak tree.

I also see a big difference between people taking only a few for their own personal enjoyment/distribution to a few friends vs wholesale collecting and selling. Extensive commercialization should not be encouraged. After all, look at the green sea turtle. People were eating them for years and all was doing fine until commerce came in.


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## campj (Sep 16, 2009)

Ether Imp said:


> *popcorn*
> 
> nom nom nom


LOL

The funny thing is that most of us live in AZ and we could have this conversation in real life.


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## Franklin (Sep 19, 2009)

..Utah :-/


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## David_F (Sep 19, 2009)

campj said:


> LOL
> 
> The funny thing is that most of us live in AZ and we could have this conversation in real life.


Someone mentioned educating the neighbors about scorpions.  Good idea but I doubt it would be very effective.

Instead, how about some of you folks who live near enough to the OP take the time to educate him?  Set up a local group.  Organize field trips so that you can teach him and others how to find inverts.  Show him how to collect responsibly.

This thread isn't doing anyone a bit of good.  I understand not wanting to give out localities to someone you don't know.  But there's a lot you could do to help him out.


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## Webbly (Sep 19, 2009)

David_F said:


> Someone mentioned educating the neighbors about scorpions.  Good idea but I doubt it would be very effective.
> 
> Instead, how about some of you folks who live near enough to the OP take the time to educate him?  Set up a local group.  Organize field trips so that you can teach him and others how to find inverts.  Show him how to collect responsibly.
> 
> This thread isn't doing anyone a bit of good.  I understand not wanting to give out localities to someone you don't know.  But there's a lot you could do to help him out.


What should "the neighbors" know about scorpions? I prefer to sleep on the floor. Do you think if I sleep with a few mealworms the scorpions will leave me alone? :?


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## David_F (Sep 19, 2009)

Webbly said:


> What should "the neighbors" know about scorpions? I prefer to sleep on the floor. Do you think if I sleep with a few mealworms the scorpions will leave me alone? :?


Well, the first thing they should know is that if you're gonna live in AZ you're gonna live with scorpions.  Not too many ways around it.  Sleep on the floor if you'd like but don't whine when you're stung.

But that wasn't the point of my post, was it?  My point, since it seemed to elude you, was that the best way for people to handle someone that they perceive to be a detriment to the hobby or the environment is to offer to help the OP become responsible when it comes to observing/collecting inverts in the wild.  They're not going to deter him by ganging up on him on a message board.  He's young and could learn a lot with help from those more experienced.


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## campj (Sep 20, 2009)

josh_r said:


> that just means i like prescott arizona and would consider living there. its a very cool little town. other than that, i think i would try texas or colorado. i dunno. we will have to see what happens. all i know is ill be moving somewhere other than washington. prescott is a VERY good option however.


I was born and raised in CO, lived in West TX for almost four years, and currently live in AZ. IMO, you should choose CO.


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## BrettG (Sep 20, 2009)

At least Prescott has Whiskey Row going for it. And Jerome is just up the road......


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## revoltkid (Sep 20, 2009)

i really wish i lived in the dessert. honestly. if i did, i wont collect any Ts or anything that i find in the wild. i just think it will be so neat to see them in their natural habitat, and the same with scorpions. it just sounds cool.


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## Bill S (Sep 20, 2009)

revoltkid said:


> i really wish i lived in the dessert. honestly. if i did, i wont collect any Ts or anything that i find in the wild. i just think it will be so neat to see them in their natural habitat, and the same with scorpions. it just sounds cool.


I live in the desert southeast of Tucson, Arizona, and I love it.  (Living out at the end of a two mile dirt road helps, as does having a nature preserve "next door".)  We can find six species of scorpions pretty much within sight of the house, and the local species of tarantula is abundant.  It's really cool to go outside and see these things and get to observe them on their home turf "acting natural".  (It's a little less cool to find bark scorpions in the house, and especially uncool to get stung by them while trying to sleep in our own bed - but that's the price you pay, and it's worth it.)  We also have a couple species of "recluse" spiders here, and giant centipedes (_Scolopendra heros_) sometimes show up in and around the house.  Yup, it's a cool place to live.


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## josh_r (Sep 20, 2009)

revoltkid said:


> i really wish i lived in the dessert. honestly. if i did, i wont collect any Ts or anything that i find in the wild. i just think it will be so neat to see them in their natural habitat, and the same with scorpions. it just sounds cool.


thats what you say until you actually find one and then its such a rush taht you take them home with you. 

so does colorado have any laws against keeping venomous snakes??


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## skinheaddave (Sep 21, 2009)

Apparently nobody wanted to take that deep breath.  I've deleted some posts, handed out some infractions and closed the thread.


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