# Found some tadpoles...



## lizardminion (Apr 4, 2012)

Sorry, no pic. 
Not yet, anyway. 
So, I found a creek within our neighborhood, and to my surprise, contained some tadpoles! (yay!) Being an opportunistic little turd, I took our dog back home, got a jar, and within thirty minutes, I was heading back home with a jar containing about five tadpoles, give or take a few. Of course, I left it outside on the sidewalk as to wait for mom to finish yard-work. Then I'll "smuggle" it inside and put 'em in a vacant fishbowl. Oh yeah, and I also collected a rock with some algae on it so the algae can propagate and provide nutrition for the tads.  I'm smart. 
So anyway, I'm trying to find what kind of toads live in Bexar County, Texas. I'm almost sure they're toads. That's the only amphibian I've seen in the wild around here. Not to mention toad's tads grow faster... Speaking of which, the creek is very shallow. It probably dries up in the summer, acting as a vernal pool. Maybe that's a better term for it instead of creek. The water only slowly flows during and shortly after some rain. Oh yeah, and there are diving beetles in it. From what I recall, diving beetles only reside usually in temporary pools of water. That said, the tadpoles must grow fast... but I digress. What kind of toads tend to subside in Bexar County?


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## Galapoheros (Apr 5, 2012)

It will probably be the gulf coast toad  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_Coast_toad   I don't live too far away from Bexar county and I'm a little familiar with frog and toad ranges around here, not as familiar with frog ranges though.  I've been hearing a lot of GC toads around here lately.  I caught some green tree frogs, they sound kind of like a duck.  They went to a neighbors backyard pond and I could see that neighbor looking up in the tree, "What IS that?"  haha.  Your tads will eat fishflakes also.  It will grow more algae if the bowl gets a little sun.


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## lizardminion (Apr 5, 2012)

Sad news everybody.

I think someone threw the left-over fish flakes out. D: Anything I substitute to get some protein in their diet? I want 'em growin' big! The largest one is maybe almost 1 cm long... But I'd say they're fairly young. (and considering I caught them in a vernal creek too, it comes as no surprise- the water area was small)
Maybe I'll ask my biology teacher or my friend for some fish flakes...


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## Tarac (Apr 5, 2012)

Algae and small aquatic inverts are ideal, like Daphnia, etc.  I wouldn't use flakes, you'll just foul the water.  Algae rock was a perfect idea.  You can keep a separate container in the sun somewhere (like an empty 2 liter soda bottle or something) with a single piece of fish food or some other nutrient source to get algae growing and then just periodically add a little of the "green water" to the tad tank.  Some muck or leaves from the bottom of that creek will likely have lots of micro inverts and other detritus they will like.  THat's the easiest way to provide a quick meal.  Once you have a little culture of that muck going with the algae you already smartly collected they'll be golden.

I wouldn't be so certain about the identity of the tads though.  They could easily be frogs.  I have a small pond near 1000 gallons in my front yard that I made.  We have lots of toads here but the vast majority of tads that show up are frogs.  Different area than you of course, lots more water here in general.  But as far as trying to figure out what they are, probably easiest to just grow them up since I don't think you can confidently narrow your search parameters.  

My favorite that I get is a narrow-mouthed toad.  It's tiny and apparently uncommon but it loves that pond:

http://ufwildlife.ifas.ufl.edu/frogs/easternnarrowmouthedtoad.shtml

I love the way the describe frog/toad calls in text, BTW- this one goes "_waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa_" lol.


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## Chicken Farmer (Apr 5, 2012)

When I used to have tadpoles I would use those reptile/amphibian pellets from walmart.   Make sure to change the water 
Often. They release I think pheromones.  In the water that slow the others from growing.

When they get front legs put a rock they can get onto mostly out of the water

Good luck!!


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## dtknow (Apr 5, 2012)

Best thing to do is go online and look up photos. I am not familiar with gulf coast toads but generally "toadpoles" are dark color-frequently black.


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## Entomancer (Apr 5, 2012)

When I raise tadpoles, I typically use pellets. 

Flakes are fine as a food source, but as someone else said, they tend to decompose rather quickly. I raised a Rana sphenocephalus tadpole earlier this year, and I gave it algae wafers and sinking catfish wafers. It ate them pretty quickly and pelleted food tends to decompose more slowly.

For the algae part, you could also get some spinach or collard greens (the greens would be a better choice, as they probably contain less oxalic acid) and boil them or microwave them to make them mushy enough for the tadpoles. I used to feed tadpoles this way and I still use it to feed some herbivorous catfish, and the leaves usually disappear by morning.

EDIT: Be careful about your water source too. You might already know this, but plain city water is usually no good for 'phibs unless it is allowed to sit outside for a day. If you can, I would go to a pet store and purchase some water conditioner. That stuff usually does a good job of eliminating chlorine and other things from water that would harm your tadpoles. Good luck!


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## Galapoheros (Apr 5, 2012)

Tarac said:


> Algae and small aquatic inverts are ideal, like Daphnia, etc.  I wouldn't use flakes, you'll just foul the water.  Algae rock was a perfect idea.  You can keep a separate container in the sun somewhere (like an empty 2 liter soda bottle or something) with a single piece of fish food or some other nutrient source to get algae growing and then just periodically add a little of the "green water" to the tad tank.  Some muck or leaves from the bottom of that creek will likely have lots of micro inverts and other detritus they will like.  THat's the easiest way to provide a quick meal.  Once you have a little culture of that muck going with the algae you already smartly collected they'll be golden.
> 
> I wouldn't be so certain about the identity of the tads though.  They could easily be frogs.  I have a small pond near 1000 gallons in my front yard that I made.  We have lots of toads here but the vast majority of tads that show up are frogs.  Different area than you of course, lots more water here in general.  But as far as trying to figure out what they are, probably easiest to just grow them up since I don't think you can confidently narrow your search parameters.
> 
> ...


We have narrow-mouth toads here in tx also, mostly east, basically the same call, kind of like a sheep.  There is a very short high pitched noise at the start that is hard to notice unless you really listen for it.  nmouth toad tads are kind of weird looking, easy to ID.  Do you still plan on taking a pic Ryan?


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## lizardminion (Apr 5, 2012)

Some updates!
Today, I brink home with me, a good inch-long frog tadpole after chasing those little turds around for hours! Good heavens... 
I have yet to place it in the fish bowl. My biology teacher gave me a few fish flakes. I, though, would like to somehow introduce protein in their diet, preferably from home. Hence why I got the pellets. I would like to mention though- the fish flakes turned into fish flake crumbs on the way home. Most of them, anyway.
ANYWAY, how would I go about finding anything in my pantry or fridge that they'll eat that has protein in it? After reading this thread, I'm wanting to include some meat in it's diet.


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## Galapoheros (Apr 5, 2012)

They will eat on dead decaying inverts like little caterpillars, small piece of an earthworm, small smashed cricket but make sure that kind of stuff sinks to the bottom and you don't want things to get too fouled up and smelly though tads can usually put up with some smelly stuff, your mom might not like it though.


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## arachnidsrva (Apr 5, 2012)

you should do growth photos - that would be cool to see week 1, 2, 3, 4 frog etc...


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## lizardminion (Apr 6, 2012)

arachnidsrva said:


> you should do growth photos - that would be cool to see week 1, 2, 3, 4 frog etc...


Wished I could, but I don't have a cell phone that'll send pics to my computer, much less a camera...
Maybe I can use my mom's phone or my friend's phone.


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## HoboAustin (Apr 8, 2012)

Too bad many of the little creeks and ponds around her are in closed off or gated communities.I would really like to do some crayfish/tadpole catching. It would be cool to watch them grow. Well good luck with getting them into adulthood!


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## lizardminion (Apr 8, 2012)

Well, two days ago, I went back down to the creek- this time, with one of those baskets which are basically like a net. And let me tell, I caught so many tadpoles that the closest thing to a number I have to the amount is "at least half the creek." (Not literally, but you get the idea)
I have discovered that they all are probably the same species, just the bigger ones are older individuals and have back legs as compared to the smaller individuals whom lack legs. But other than that, they all look almost exactly the same with some individuals greener while others are either more transparent and a lighter creamy color. Then there's the malformed one who've I have come to calling Ed- his body is a little flatter than usual, his eyes are on the side of his head as compared to the top, and sometimes he'll just float to the top. All well, let's see how he'll turn out as an adult toad.
The largest tad is about 2.5 cm long and has legs. I haven't visited the creek since capturing the tads, but when I did, it had dried quite an immense amount- several inches even!- and the rocks I had piled in the creek before to walk on were completely dry. It had split into two puddles- one still a few inches deep, the other an inch or two. The creek has/had been drying out fast. And remember- that was two days ago! I'm curious if there is any water left and I may be going back today to collect a few rocks if they still harbor algae on them.


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## myrmecophile (Apr 8, 2012)

I hope by "fishbowl" you actually mean an appropriate sized aquarium with adequate filtration etc. I also hope you did not keep all the tads you caught on your most recent visit.


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## lizardminion (Apr 8, 2012)

myrmecophile said:


> I hope by "fishbowl" you actually mean an appropriate sized aquarium with adequate filtration etc. I also hope you did not keep all the tads you caught on your most recent visit.


Well, I'm taking most of them to school tomorrow and keeping a few. The ones I'm taking to school I'm going to give to my biology teacher. (who is also a herper and even let me have two madagascan roaches) I believe she's got something in mind. (I do know she has several vivariums) And as far as I know, amphibian breeders don't always need to keep tads in a tank, a few sensitive species yes, but not all. (One guy, I believe, kept poison dart tads in a tilted kritter keeper) Remember, they aren't fish... Luckily for you, these are small toad tads.
They are growing under my care. None of the ones I caught had front legs, however two tads have developed them today so I'm very excited. 
I'm going to move these to a much larger half water half land bin setup, so we'll see how that goes. I guess it's worth noting I basically saved the tads lives... the creek is dried up. They'd all be dead.

They're doing fine on algae and fish flakes. (Must I mention I'm require to manually sink the flakes by twirling them around in water until they fall to the bottom.)


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## myrmecophile (Apr 8, 2012)

Just because they can be kept in less than optimum conditions does not mean they should be. Them not being fish is absolutely irrelevant. Dart tadpole can be kept in small containers because that is what they are generally adapted to live in. Consider, they breed in bromeliads. However in a captive situation they need an almost 100% water change every day.

Reactions: Like 1


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## lizardminion (Apr 8, 2012)

myrmecophile said:


> Just because they can be kept in less than optimum conditions does not mean they should be. Them not being fish is absolutely irrelevant. Dart tadpole can be kept in small containers because that is what they are generally adapted to live in. Consider, they breed in bromeliads. However in a captive situation they need an almost 100% water change every day.


I'm dealing with toadpoles that I found in small, 2 inch deep puddles though, so...
Oh yes, and I do believe you have to let the dart's water alone as to let algae flourish so they can feed on that. Other tadpoles have successfully been reared in cups and jars. Sure, certain tads need a tank, but my tads seem to be growing exceptionally well under my conditions.
And mind you, it's not like I can spawn a hundred bucks or two to set up a whole aquarium only to have them outgrow it a week later.

I have moved the tadpoles with forelimbs into a plastic bin with an old, up turned rock dish to provide land when they start deciding to switch to terrestrial life. Along the way, it seems one had a rough transition and lost his left arm as a result. It'll grow back, right?


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## lizardminion (Apr 10, 2012)

Well, some updates already! It only took one night for the little tadpole to grow his arm back, and I couldn't identify him from the rest. In fact, those little buggers have grown so fast, this'll bring me up to my next update.
Some of the tadpole have officially grown into toadlets, and have even managed to climb out of the container! (which lead me to find two on the floor and forcing me to revive them- both were revived successfully, much to my relief) They are busy absorbing their tails, and I should have them in a new (temporary) critter container until I can get around to getting an actual tank. I'm predicting they'll fully absorb their tails within two days, so they'll need fruit flies or pinhead crix. Let's see how far I can convince my mom to buy them some stuff...
Meanwhile, I will work on IDing this species. Maybe I can get some pics uploaded this afternoon.
I must say, I have fallen in love with these little toads.


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## lizardminion (Apr 11, 2012)

Well, I have identified them as _Bufo speciosus_, although I am not entirely sure. The new toadlets haven't eaten yet, but instead, tend to shake off and away the fruit flies. They are small. No measurements as of yet.
Also, 2 more toadlets are land roaming and stored with the current toadlets. They love to climb. They have just recently finished absorbing their tails. I am expecting three more toadlets to emerge tonight or tomorrow. I have two or three more tads who are big and may spout front limbs soon. (they have their hind legs already)
the rest are smaller tads who will be weeks before they get big and spout hind legs. Although they are growing.

When they are bigger, can they do fine off of local armadillo isopods? (also called pillbugs)


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## lizardminion (Apr 13, 2012)

Can anyone tell me how often I should feed the baby toads? Quite frankly, they refuse everything I try to give them.


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## bugmankeith (Apr 14, 2012)

I've raised tadpoles on a mix of crushed goldfish flakes but only a tiny bit or it will cloud water, sinking algae wafers, frozen bloodworms/daphnia, and there favorite, boiled romaine lettuce! Boil pieces for about 10 minutes until they have a mushy feeling, let cool, then feed to tadpoles you'll know there eating when you see holes in the lettuce.


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## lizardminion (Apr 14, 2012)

bugmankeith said:


> I've raised tadpoles on a mix of crushed goldfish flakes but only a tiny bit or it will cloud water, sinking algae wafers, frozen bloodworms/daphnia, and there favorite, boiled romaine lettuce! Boil pieces for about 10 minutes until they have a mushy feeling, let cool, then feed to tadpoles you'll know there eating when you see holes in the lettuce.


What I meant by baby toads is that they had already passed their tadpole stage. Thanks for the advice anyway! 
The tadpoles eat like swimming pigs- nibbling on algae and fighting over fresh dead bugs I throw in there. They seem to prefer pill bugs I dig up from my backyard than smashed cricket, but we'll see. However, with the addition of two more metamorphosed toads- totaling in to 11- I have a growing concern over their odd eating habits. They refuse to eat anything I give them and I have to see them eat. They shake off fruit flies and ignore two of the smallest crickets I threw in there. (although a little smaller than the toads themselves. Gee, thanks petco...) Yet, they are all still alive. I'm beginning to blame my poor husbandry tactic, although I still lack a proper container to place them in. Once again, I'll see into that today. I do have peat moss though, although it's still in package, just waiting to be settled down in a 10 gal... I'm hoping to go to the store today and buy some fruit flies and a vivarium. I plan to set it up with 1/3 water, a water dish, peat moss substrata, and a few rocks. Later, I'll see into planting some pothos if our two plants don't die. (Thanks dad for bringing them home but not taking care of them... hmm...)


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## ZergFront (Apr 14, 2012)

Pellets in warm water worked good with my bullfrog tad in getting him fat. He also enjoyed lightly boiled spinach. You don't want to boil it too much or it will lose much of it's nutrients and be messy. You just want it to be easy to tear for the tadpole.

 Oh, you got toadlets now! LOL! Can you order stuff online, like do you have a credit card? You can try pinhead crickets. That's the smallest you can get. 

 Maybe they just enjoy crunchy stuff. You said they like pillbugs? They might like Gammarus, also called scuds. Popular crustacean with fishing. I used to have a colony for my pufferfish. I kept them in a 6 gallon with a light air pump with some calcium supplement coating the bottom. Unfortunately with how big the colony was, they didn't survive a black out when the air pump stopped. I was fast asleep.


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## lizardminion (Apr 15, 2012)

Well, 2 just died, and I saved 3 more from dying by dunking them in water. Added peat moss to the jar. I'll nag the Hell out of my parents to get me some proper equipment to care for them to avoid situations like this in the future.
Really upset over the loss...

Alternatively, I release them after a good rain.


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## lizardminion (Apr 15, 2012)

Got one bugger to sit still long enough for a good pic.





From the previous post, the two I accidentally released last night were actually alive. They just needed some water or humidity. Lucky for them, it drizzled, got super humid later, then rained. Now, they have vanished. All well, they're local, at least. (Lucky for me, I still have 29 tadpoles.)


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## lizardminion (Apr 19, 2012)

For some odd reason, another toad has died off. It was plump and healthy, but somehow managed to die anyways. I suspect a disease, and has made me resume my thought on the previous 2 toads I thought survived. I actually do believe they died and were carried away by ants.
What can I do as far as this disease? I have no clue as to what it is, although I do suspect _Bb_. They are WC as tadpoles so I'm not too surprised as it being a disease, if true. I don't have all the money to get them inspected by the vet. One body had excessive skin attached to it, as if it was overly molting. The others just died. When they die, they lay in a position with their hind legs sticking straight out behind them. Please share advice as to what I should do!


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## myrmecophile (Apr 19, 2012)

I have no idea what is killing them, and veterinary intervention is likely to be very costly. But what ever it is DO NOT discard the bodies outdoors or release the toadlets


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## lizardminion (Apr 20, 2012)

myrmecophile said:


> I have no idea what is killing them, and veterinary intervention is likely to be very costly. But what ever it is DO NOT discard the bodies outdoors or release the toadlets


I'm considering euthanizing them. Alternatively, I plan on treating them for the chytrid fungus and seeing if that'll work. If not, I'll consider the former option., or other options. I'd never think they'd be so much trouble. After this dilemma, I'm just going to stick with CB stock!


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## Galapoheros (Apr 20, 2012)

Fruit flies are good.  I bet it's the Gulf Coast toad simply going by odds here.  You'd have to get your parents to take you to Petsmart or something like that and get you some wingless fruit flies.  Releasing them should be a non-issue imo, even if some of them appear sick.  There have been a lot of environmental scare tactics in this area in the last 15 to 20 years imo, environmentalism is on a rampage right now.  Even this sounded radical to me thinking back to when I was a kid, I agree with the non-native talk about it though. http://exoticpets.about.com/od/frogsandtoads/a/tadpoles.htm


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## jayefbe (Apr 20, 2012)

I'm guessing you're missing some kind of nutrient in the diet, or there is something insufficient about the setup that is leading to all the deaths. I would avoid jumping to the conclusion that it's chytrid or some kind of disease. The more likely answer is that the husbandry is missing something.


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## lizardminion (Apr 21, 2012)

jayefbe said:


> I'm guessing you're missing some kind of nutrient in the diet, or there is something insufficient about the setup that is leading to all the deaths. I would avoid jumping to the conclusion that it's chytrid or some kind of disease. The more likely answer is that the husbandry is missing something.


Yeah, probably. I'm looking into it.

Edit: Checked on the little guys (metamorphosed toads) this morning. They're all dead. A little pissed off knowing I've done a s----y job. I'll learn from this and let it not repeat. Now I've got time to work up a proper terrarium, seek out some future homes, as well as let the fruit flies populate. All the tadpoles are still doing exceptionally well.
Time to get serious...


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## Arianji (Apr 21, 2012)

if you're looking for something you might have in your cabinet to feed them, spirulina is always a good choice. Its just dried blue-green algae, its almost always organic and its quite healthy. I supplement my birds and inverts with it occasionally to add some variety to their diet. Last I had tadpoles I did not have any spirulina and mainly fed them shrimp pellets (which they grew fine on but I didn't give them much, plus they were bullfrog tadpoles so they more readily accepted larger food sources. But for your little toad tads I would give spirulina a try. Their diet is mainly comprised of algae anyways, plus spirulina is a complete protein. So dietary it seems like it will fill your gap quite nicely. Plus it comes in tablets, flakes, or powder, convenient for feeding any size animal. It's good for you too, so if it is an issue of your parents don't want to buy animal food, just explain its a healthy dietary supplement for y'all, you wont be lying. Then everyone eats healthy and your tads get fed.


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## Louise E. Rothstein (Apr 24, 2012)

Very small insectivores may prefer tiny springtails to either fruit flies or pinhead crix.
Since springtails feed on moist organic debris in most of the United States studying them online before you try to acquire any might improve your chances to culture enough of them to grow your toadlets to sizes that can actually eat the foods you tried.


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