# Are P Regalis ' docile " ?



## MissyMaguire (May 19, 2015)

Yes, I know I can just "google" different information that I need but......sigh....before I do that, since most of what you read "on the intarwebz" is about    60% not true, I wanted to ask you guys first.

I just saw a GORGEOUS short 15 second home video of someone's P Regalis.  OMG, I'm Deeeeeaaaaaad LOL  <3  

PLEASE tell me this species are for beginners and are docile.  If not, it's totally ok because that just means I won't
be getting that species when the time comes.  

So I guess I wanted to see what you guys had to say first.

Thanks


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## LadyofSpiders (May 19, 2015)

I wouldn't say any Poecilotheria are for beginners or categorize them as docile. If you are looking to get into Poecilotheria then regalis is a good one to start with but I don't think that is what you are asking. 
Any Poecilotheria are quick, skittish with potent venom. I'm glad I waited before I got into them.


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## louise f (May 19, 2015)

No No NO Pokies are not for beginners. They are fast,skittish and don't hesitate with biting. + they are not docile. 
 I would recommend you to start with a Euathlus sp red/fire or Brachypelma smith They are both docile. and have some nice colors. Welcome to the hobby and good luck with finding a T

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## AnthrpicDecadnc (May 19, 2015)

They are docile, but only when they're molting

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## Poec54 (May 19, 2015)

A beginner with Poecilotheria is a high risk of bite or escape.  That means potential injury to you, the spider, the people and pets you live with, and the hobby.  These animals are to be taken seriously.  There are hundreds of species in the hobby today, many are beautiful: work your way up in stages and you'll be glad you did.

Reactions: Like 7 | Disagree 1


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## Angel Minkov (May 19, 2015)

Like with any species, there are calm individuals aswell and very defensive ones. If you hit a rock with getting the latter, you are in big trouble. Pokies are not for beginners. Fast, skittish spiders who may be reluctant to bite most of the time, but its just that 1 time they go berserk that really packs a punch. If you want an arboreal and you are not completely new, an avic would be fine.


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## BobGrill (May 19, 2015)

MissyMaguire said:


> Yes, I know I can just "google" different information that I need but......sigh....before I do that, since most of what you read "on the intarwebz" is about    60% not true, I wanted to ask you guys first.
> 
> I just saw a GORGEOUS short 15 second home video of someone's P Regalis.  OMG, I'm Deeeeeaaaaaad LOL  <3
> 
> ...


No and they have one of the worst venomous of any tarantula period.  Look at some of the bite reports here. I can tell you haven't done any research on this genus,  otherwise you wouldn't be asking this question.

---------- Post added 05-19-2015 at 06:27 AM ----------

Possible troll thread guys?

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## 14pokies (May 19, 2015)

+1 to all the above opinions except the post about pokies being docile while molting... 

If your not convinced by there advice check out IheartTs bite report on P.fasciata... P. regalis have similar venom... 

There are so many beautiful new world terrestrials available that are beginner friendly that there is no reason to rush and jump on your dream T right of the bat...  

i personally would avoid avics also until you keep a few terrestrials and get hands on experience keeping Ts.

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## awiec (May 19, 2015)

While my regalis has never tried to bite me, she has tried to escape several times, that is not something a beginner wants to deal with: agile spiders that pack some nasty venom. No one is going to sugar coat things for you here as we don't want our spiders taken away because some newbie decided not to do any research and get nailed by a potent species. There are tons of tarantulas that are suitable for your skill level and are just as pretty as any pokie, some people have already given you good options.

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## lalberts9310 (May 19, 2015)

No poecilotheria sp. Are for beginners, not metallica, and not regalis.. nor the other species, all are fast tropical aboreals with bad venom.. read the bite reports, poecis are advanced species only, you recently thought that p. Metallica is a beginners species.. note that P. Regalis and P. Metallica are from the SAME genus - poecilotheria, and no poecilotheria species are suited for beginners... like poec54 said, work your way up: start with New World terrestrials like brachypelma, grammastola, aphonopelma, eupalaestrus, euathlus, thrixopelma - these are all great beginner genera with a lot of beautiful species to choose from, get a feel for these then move on to New World tropical terrestrials such as nhandu and ephebopus, if you are comfortable with these and raised these successfully to adulthood move on to New world aboreals such as avicularia, psalmopoeus and tapinauchenius - fast, feisty, defensive and gorgeous genera.. only working your way up will prep you well for Old world Ts such as poecilotheria.. remember any T that is indigenous to countries besides north and south america are considered old world (these includes the genus poecilotheria), no OW T are suitable for beginners, they ALL possess potent venom, they all are fast, skittish and defensive and way more than a new comer can handle.. you don't want to get something and a few weeks later feel scared of it and are too afraid to do maintenance and feeding because of it's skittish, fast and defensive nature, because the spider will suffer and be neglected and it doesn't deserve that..

Also what you need to take into consideration is your experience level, the people living in and around your immediate living area, especially when animals, children and elders are present.. just one bad bite can take down the whole hobby, and with a poeci and beginner combination - bad bites and escapes are very likely to happen...

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## awiec (May 19, 2015)

Forgot to post this; this is my WC adult female Thrixopelma cyaneolum, she is a very calm and methodical spider. Note the blue body, red rump and gold stripes and high lights all over her. If you can find one then they are fantastic starter species and the genus is generally a good choice.

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## Hydrazine (May 19, 2015)

I'd spent a year (including rehousing) with a fairly grown _Psalmopoeus irminia_ before I even considered Poecs. And even then I started with slings. Well, it was intended to be ONE sling, but the container contained a second ornata sling. Yay me.

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## El Consciente (May 19, 2015)

A pokie is probably one of the _worst_ genera for a beginner.

They don't have a predilection to bite, but a beginner's error could easily put them in a situation where they would.


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## lalberts9310 (May 19, 2015)

Hydrazine said:


> I'd spent a year (including rehousing) with a fairly grown _Psalmopoeus irminia_ before I even considered Poecs. And even then I started with slings. Well, it was intended to be ONE sling, but the container contained a second ornata sling. Yay me.


+1 owning P. Irminia after having some experience with the genera I previously mentioned can prep you well for OWs, I owned P. Irminias more than a year before considering my 1st poeci..


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## TsunamiSpike (May 19, 2015)

Definitely go in stages and stay well away from pokies until you've at least experienced Psalmopoeus. They're a good half way point between avics and pokies. Not gonna lie that my first arboreals will be P. Irminia rather than avics (got two slings arriving friday) but that's only because i personally feel comfortable with the idea of owning them, but I'd never consider pokies until a while down the road.


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## Hydrazine (May 19, 2015)

El Consciente said:


> A pokie is probably one of the _worst_ genera for a beginner.
> 
> They don't have a predilection to bite, but a beginner's error could easily put them in a situation where they would.


Could be worse, could be _Pterinochilus, Heteroscodra or Stromatopelma_


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## MrsHaas (May 19, 2015)

Remember too that every t has it's own unique personality.  My regalis is a total gentleman but I have seen some not very good mannered ones as well that would put the bite on you if it had its way! If your interested in getting one maybe get a sling so u can learn it's attitude as it grows. But don't rush into it, if u don't feel ready trust your gut. They aren't going anywhere


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## awiec (May 19, 2015)

MrsHaas said:


> Remember too that every t has it's own unique personality.  My regalis is a total gentleman but I have seen some not very good mannered ones as well that would put the bite on you if it had its way! If your interested in getting one maybe get a sling so u can learn it's attitude as it grows. But don't rush into it, if u don't feel ready trust your gut. They aren't going anywhere


And what if they get a "bad attitude" one? Now they have to deal with a pissy tarantula when they could have got a good beginner species.

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## lalberts9310 (May 19, 2015)

MrsHaas said:


> Remember too that every t has it's own unique personality.  My regalis is a total gentleman but I have seen some not very good mannered ones as well that would put the bite on you if it had its way! If your interested in getting one maybe get a sling so u can learn it's attitude as it grows. But don't rush into it, if u don't feel ready trust your gut. They aren't going anywhere


How can a poeci be advised for a beginner? They are unpredictable wild animals, there's no way in learning how it's behaviour might be when it's an adult, then they end up with a T they're scared of then the T suffers, or someone gets bit.. in the end giving the hobby more of a bad rep or even the possibility of Ts getting banned, and that will affect you too.. this is beyond bad advice..

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## scott99 (May 19, 2015)

louise f said:


> No No NO Pokies are not for beginners. They are fast,skittish and don't hesitate with biting. + they are not docile.
> I would recommend you to start with a Euathlus sp red/fire or Brachypelma smith They are both docile. and have some nice colors. Welcome to the hobby and good luck with finding a T


These people are the experts. They know what their talking about; So please listen to them.

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## MrsHaas (May 19, 2015)

That's very true, but if someone is set on doing it what can we do about it? I never said theOP should get one.



--J.Haas

---------- Post added 05-19-2015 at 04:12 PM ----------

I also never said they were a beginner species



--J.Haas


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## lalberts9310 (May 19, 2015)

MrsHaas said:


> That's very true, but if someone is set on doing it what can we do about it? I never said theOP should get one.
> 
> 
> 
> --J.Haas


Well you sorta encouraged it.. some people actually do listen to advice, give them bad advice they make the wrong decisions.. which just might have inevitable results (such as bans), so it doesn't mean it should be encouraged.. rather advice against a bad decision and hope they listen..


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## MrsHaas (May 19, 2015)

My intentions were not to encourage the OP but to jus try to be neutral.  If someone is bent on doing it it doesn't matter what kind of advice they get, they'll do it anyways. So, if they MUSt have one it's probably best to get it as a sling bc you can better gauge whether or not it's becoming to over overwhelming, as it grows you may feel more uncomfortable and if find that you can't handle it and it's easier to deal with a sling than a huge pissed off pokie if you're trying to sell it or find it a new home.


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## Angel Minkov (May 19, 2015)

If she buys it from a sling and it starts getting too bad, she can always sell it or give it away.

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## lalberts9310 (May 19, 2015)

It doesn't matter if OP gets a sling or not, advising an OW especially poecis for a beginner is BAD ADVICE plain and simple.. get a poeci that grows to be moody and the spider will be on the receiving end, when rehousing comes, escapes are very much possible, what if a child, toddler or elder gets bit and ends up in hospital? Have you ever thought of the consequences that might follow?


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## MrsHaas (May 19, 2015)

My point exactly, angel.

And yes, lalberts, it is bad advice to tell a beginner they should get a pokie. But those were not my words


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## lalberts9310 (May 19, 2015)

MrsHaas said:


> My point exactly, angel.
> 
> And yes, lalberts, it is bad advice to tell a beginner they should get a pokie. But those were not my words


"If your interested in getting one maybe get a sling" - seems pretty encouraging to me


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## MrsHaas (May 19, 2015)

I guess it was misconstrued then. Let me try this again. It is not a beginner species. And if you are questioning yourself it's probably not time for you to get one. When and if u decide you're ready, it may be easier to get it as a sling. Better?


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## lalberts9310 (May 19, 2015)

MrsHaas said:


> I guess it was misconstrued then. Let me try this again. It is not a beginner species. And if you are questioning yourself it's probably not time for you to get one. When and if u decide you're ready, it may be easier to get it as a sling. Better?


 Yes. Better..


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## MrsHaas (May 19, 2015)

Ok, Good


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## Hellemose (May 19, 2015)

I wouldnt advise people to get any OW as first T, with that said i also dont see anything wrong with getting an OW as first T, as long as the person has done their research on their speed, temperament and bite aswell as how to care for it correctly.

my first T was a G. rosea, my 2nd believe it or not was an adult P. regalis, so it is possible as long as the person knows what they are dealing with, but like many others i wouldnt advise it


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## lalberts9310 (May 19, 2015)

Hellemose said:


> I wouldnt advise people to get any OW as first T, with that said i also dont see anything wrong with getting an OW as first T, as long as the person has done their research on their speed, temperament and bite aswell as how to care for it correctly.
> 
> my first T was a G. rosea, my 2nd believe it or not was an adult P. regalis, so it is possible as long as the person knows what they are dealing with, but like many others i wouldnt advise it


 remember that people differ, and no amount of reading and online research and youtube videos can prep one for an OW like a poeci, the best way to prep is to work your way up...

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## Angel Minkov (May 19, 2015)

It was quite easy to deduce that she meant "if youre hellbent on getting a poeci and disregard our advice, at least get a sling". I dont understand all the jumpiness with Ts. Not like people are buying cobras or rattlesnakes.

Also, I never worked my way up. Hadnt even owned a NW arboreal before getting my regalis sling.


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## MrsHaas (May 19, 2015)

I'm glad someone caught my drift!


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## Arachnomaniac19 (May 19, 2015)

I wouldn't say they're quick to bite. It's GENERALLY a flight then fight reaction. Not good for a beginner none the less.


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## MissyMaguire (May 19, 2015)

louise f said:


> No No NO Pokies are not for beginners. They are fast,skittish and don't hesitate with biting. + they are not docile.


**** That's what I thought but, I wanted to be sure.  I saw an experienced T-Caretaker, whose son has a pokey; and if little kids can
have them, I wondered how they were with adults.  That's what made me question that species.


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## Ellenantula (May 19, 2015)

As a beginner, I did think a T was a T was a T.
I am about a year in with T keeping now, still shocked at the speed of my Psalm cambri and tiny little Chilo fimbri sling -- I am still not ready to order a pokie.
I really don't think as a beginner with a NW terrestrial you can truly comprehend the difference between fast and FAST.  You think you get it -- 'yeah, they are faster' but when you see a teleport -- wow!

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## awiec (May 19, 2015)

MissyMaguire said:


> **** That's what I thought but, I wanted to be sure.  I saw an experienced T-Caretaker, whose son has a pokey; and if little kids can
> have them, I wondered how they were with adults.  That's what made me question that species.


T's are not kids stuff but said child has probably been supervised for a long time and the experienced adult mainly cares for it. You do not have such a luxury, these are wild animals who cannot be trained, will hate your guts and will make you pay for sloppiness. There are hundreds of species in captivity and there are many of excellent and beautiful ones to choose. With proper prep and keeping up the "ladder" you can work your way up to pokies in a few years and be comfortable when you purchase one. 

For people who play "neutral" in these threads you are playing a dangerous game and are doing people disservice to those who inquire about such topics. They need to know the truth so they aren't outclassed by an angry arachnid and I'd like to be able to keep my hobby during my lifetime.

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## cold blood (May 19, 2015)

Hellemose said:


> I wouldnt advise people to get any OW as first T, with that said i also dont see anything wrong with getting an OW as first T, as long as the person has done their research on their speed, temperament and bite aswell as how to care for it correctly.
> 
> my first T was a G. rosea, my 2nd believe it or not was an adult P. regalis, so it is possible as long as the person knows what they are dealing with, but like many others i wouldnt advise it


Research can't hold a candle to real world experience.   Research without experience will only lead to a false sense of confidence.   Read all you want, watch all the vids you want, its no replacement for experience.

I'd trust someone with a few NW for extended time to get an OW well before I would with someone with no experience but reading and watching videos, no matter how many videos and care-sheets they've read....research, while necessary, is not a replacement or substitute for experience...not even close.

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## Poec54 (May 19, 2015)

cold blood said:


> Research can't hold a candle to real world experience.   Research without experience will only lead to a false sense of confidence.   Read all you want, watch all the vids you want, its no replacement for experience.


+1.  It's totally different when that spider that dashes up YOUR and and on your back, or gets loose is in YOUR house.  Have you read bite reports?  Do you want to be writing one yourself?

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## louise f (May 20, 2015)

MissyMaguire said:


> **** That's what I thought but, I wanted to be sure.  I saw an experienced T-Caretaker, whose son has a pokey; and if little kids can
> have them, I wondered how they were with adults.  That's what made me question that species.


If a parent let a little kid have a pokie, it is bad parenting for sure, i wound not let my kids have spiders like that. Not for one second.

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## MissyMaguire (May 20, 2015)

awiec said:


> While my regalis has never tried to bite me, she has tried to escape several times,


I guess that's another question I have.....if you leave the lid on the fish tank ( which is what I will have when I get my first T,
how do they escape?  Do they try to get out when you feed them or?


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## lalberts9310 (May 20, 2015)

Angel Minkov said:


> It was quite easy to deduce that she meant "if youre hellbent on getting a poeci and disregard our advice, at least get a sling". I dont understand all the jumpiness with Ts. Not like people are buying cobras or rattlesnakes.
> 
> Also, I never worked my way up. Hadnt even owned a NW arboreal before getting my regalis sling.


Not every person is like you angel, like it or not advising an OW for a beginner is bad advice, I don't care if you started out with one, it doesn't mean everyone else should or will be able to handle it..

You don't understand the "jumpiness" because you never took any consequences into consideration.. consequences if a child, elder, toddler or someone besides the owner got bit because the T escaped from a rehouse attempt gone wrong, all because the owner had lack of experience..

---------- Post added 05-20-2015 at 10:35 AM ----------




MissyMaguire said:


> **** That's what I thought but, I wanted to be sure.  I saw an experienced T-Caretaker, whose son has a pokey; and if little kids can
> have them, I wondered how they were with adults.  That's what made me question that species.


It's irresponsible for people to allow their little kids to have a poeci, unless the parents are experienced keepers and keeps the T on lock and key, do maintenance, feeding and rehouses and only allows their little child to look at it...

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## TsunamiSpike (May 20, 2015)

Angel Minkov said:


> If she buys it from a sling and it starts getting too bad, she can always sell it or give it away.


Ts aren't video games, can't just but then and sell them if you don't like them. Plus if you use the mindset that you might be selling it even a few months down the line you'll make less of an effort.

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## lalberts9310 (May 20, 2015)

MissyMaguire said:


> I guess that's another question I have.....if you leave the lid on the fish tank ( which is what I will have when I get my first T,
> how do they escape?  Do they try to get out when you feed them or?


That's just it, beginner Ts are less prone or rarely tries to escape, where with a poeci you'll have a bolting T everytime you touch the enclosure.. they run laps around the enclosure and whenever the lid is open they easily escape from the enclosure, and this happens during maintenance, feeding and rehousing.. with poecis you always run this risk when you open the lid, it's a huge possibility due to their stamina and speed and they get startled easily by light and any kind of vibration you may cause when touching their enclosures, WHY they are NOT suited as a beginner T, and then they possess bad venom as well, you don't want a poeci escape that ends up tagging one of your animals or someone else, children, toddlers, and elders will end up in hospital and for animals it can possibly be fatal, think of the consequences, newspapers with a front page stating "child bitten by deadly tarantula, ends up in hospital", a public and community that hates spiders, anti exotic groups, government will step in and ban the species, genus or tarantulas in the whole to "protect" the public, they don't care about this hobby, they don't care about our spiders, and being irresponsible will give them a reason to do what they want.. NW terrestrials, they are much more calm, less prone to get startled or bolt, and they don't have the stamina and speed a poeci possess, they also don't have bad venom... why they are perfect for beginners

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## Angel Minkov (May 20, 2015)

I never advised getting a Poeci. If you check my first post, I advised against it. Also, Tsunami, it wont be the first case of someone selling/giving out a Poeci or OW, so its not hard to get rid of it either. Your mentality is wrong.


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## lalberts9310 (May 20, 2015)

Angel Minkov said:


> I never advised getting a Poeci. If you check my first post, I advised against it. Also, Tsunami, it wont be the first case of someone selling/giving out a Poeci or OW, so its not hard to get rid of it either. Your mentality is wrong.


 It's still not fair to the spider to have it and later decide you don't want it because your afraid of it, it will be neglected before it finds a new home

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## awiec (May 20, 2015)

MissyMaguire said:


> I guess that's another question I have.....if you leave the lid on the fish tank ( which is what I will have when I get my first T,
> how do they escape?  Do they try to get out when you feed them or?


Fish tanks make poor enclosures, unless you have a way to drill glass, as these spiders live in the trees and are used to air flow. As for escape, you do have to open the lid eventually and that movement startles the spider and it takes off. I have a P.metallica that will dash around the cage, throw threat poses and bite at the side of the cage if you even get near the cage. I still feed and water it as I have enough experience to deal with it, but it would be a disaster for a newbie. This sling started out as "nice" but turned nasty after a random molt, you can't predict personalities of spiders.

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## Poec54 (May 20, 2015)

awiec said:


> Fish tanks make poor enclosures, unless you have a way to drill glass, as these spiders live in the trees and are used to air flow. As for escape, you do have to open the lid eventually and that movement startles the spider and it takes off. I have a P.metallica that will dash around the cage, throw threat poses and bite at the side of the cage if you even get near the cage. I still feed and water it as I have enough experience to deal with it, but it would be a disaster for a newbie. This sling started out as "nice" but turned nasty after a random molt, you can't predict personalities of spiders.


You've had excellent insights throughout this thread.

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## Chris LXXIX (May 20, 2015)

MissyMaguire said:


> Yes, I know I can just "google" different information that I need but......sigh....before I do that, since most of what you read "on the intarwebz" is about    60% not true, I wanted to ask you guys first.
> 
> I just saw a GORGEOUS short 15 second home video of someone's P Regalis.  OMG, I'm Deeeeeaaaaaad LOL  <3
> 
> ...


Hello there. No way they are. I doesn't think even exists an OW arboreal "docile". With some OW obligate burrowers, if housed well in a big enclosure with at least 25 cm of substrate, since they completely disappear, (example, my Pelinobius muticus doesn't really "feel" the need to bolt out of her cage .. she love her tunnels) the whole situation of general husbandry (refill the water dish, for example) can be less "fearful" compared to deal with a fast as light, unpredictable Poecilotheria; still even them (OW obligate burrowers of my example) are not for beginners as well.
To be honest in my opinion would also not even recommend the so called "poor man's pokies" (Psalmopoeus genus) to beginners.
Beginners arboreals are Avics.

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## MrsHaas (May 20, 2015)

awiec said:


> Fish tanks make poor enclosures, unless you have a way to drill glass, as these spiders live in the trees and are used to air flow. As for escape, you do have to open the lid eventually and that movement startles the spider and it takes off. I have a P.metallica that will dash around the cage, throw threat poses and bite at the side of the cage if you even get near the cage. I still feed and water it as I have enough experience to deal with it, but it would be a disaster for a newbie. This sling started out as "nice" but turned nasty after a random molt, you can't predict personalities of spiders.


This is very true, I have had really nice Ts that have turned out to be real buttholes after a molt.


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## Poec54 (May 20, 2015)

MrsHaas said:


> This is very true, I have had really nice Ts that have turned out to be real buttholes after a molt.


That's a superficial way to look at it.  They're not domesticated animals, they're not on this planet for our amusement.  They've evolved physical features and behavior that improves their survival rate in their native habitat.  That's the playbook they go by, no matter where they are.  To expect them to be well-behaved pets in your home isn't something that was intended, nor should it be expected.  

I prefer defensive spiders.  They're usually much more interesting than the ones that just sit there like a boiled potato.  Challenging our intrusions means they feel 'at home' and are settling in.  It's their cage,* you *have the rest of the house.

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## MrsHaas (May 20, 2015)

"Superficial" or not, it's the truth. To each their own. I like mine calm. Nothing wrong with that. 



--J.Haas

---------- Post added 05-20-2015 at 12:31 PM ----------

That said... I'm not saying I don't have any meanies and that I have a problem w ts w attitudes. I love them all the same. It's unrealistic to assume ur ts have personalities u can depend on. 



--J.Haas

---------- Post added 05-20-2015 at 12:34 PM ----------

U just said they weren't here for amusement but then u say ur defensive spiders are more amusing to u. A bit of a contradiction



--J.Haas


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## Angel Minkov (May 20, 2015)

I agree with Rick. I like my spiders feisty, but not too much. I love it that I have a juvie female B. smithi which fits the "boiled potato" description perfectly. I could throw a nuke next to her an she wouldn't bat an eye.

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## MrsHaas (May 20, 2015)

Like I said it's a personal preference. 



--J.Haas

---------- Post added 05-20-2015 at 12:41 PM ----------

We need not fight ab it



--J.Haas


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## BobGrill (May 20, 2015)

Where's the OP?

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## Angel Minkov (May 20, 2015)

I wasn't refuting what you say. I agree it all comes down to individuality. People around here don't feel comfortable with jumping into OWs unless they have a lot of experience with Psalms, for example, but I only had a B. vagans and L. striatipes when I started collecting the whole genus. Now I have 8 species, 0 escapes and I feel perfectly comfortable with mine. By the way, I'd like to throw this at all the people who want to plunge into Pokies - do it from the smallest size possible. I can tell you from experience, the speed and agility of adults compared to that of juveniles and even sub-adults is phenomenal. Just my 2 cents


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## lalberts9310 (May 20, 2015)

Yep, all personal preference, and everyone has a right to it.. I'm with Rick, I also have a thing for feisty spiders 

---------- Post added 05-20-2015 at 07:53 PM ----------




MrsHaas said:


> U just said they weren't here for amusement but then u say ur defensive spiders are more amusing to u. A bit of a contradiction
> 
> 
> 
> --J.Haas


He said interesting, big difference between interesting and amusing...

Reactions: Like 1


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## MrsHaas (May 20, 2015)

There's a difference btw "interesting" and "encouraging" too.

But I really hold no hostility over this issue. I think everyone should do what their gut says.  If u don't like jumpy or agressive  stick to ur guns!



--J.Haas

Reactions: Like 1


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## lalberts9310 (May 20, 2015)

MrsHaas said:


> There's a difference btw "interesting" and "encouraging" too.
> 
> 
> --J.Haas


 I really don't know what you're actually trying to say here...


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## MrsHaas (May 20, 2015)

I'm saying that perhaps we are misinterpreting each other a bit



--J.Haas


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## lalberts9310 (May 20, 2015)

MrsHaas said:


> I'm saying that perhaps we are misinterpreting each other a bit
> 
> 
> 
> --J.Haas


Yeah, I think so too


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## vespers (May 20, 2015)

Mr Rock Bottom said:


> To be honest in my opinion would also not even recommend the so called "poor man's pokies" (Psalmopoeus genus) to beginners.


I agree they aren't for beginners, though I wouldn't consider Psalmopeus a "poor man's pokies" either. While individual temperaments vary, I've found many Psalmopoeus seemingly have more unpredictable behaviors and unforgiving dispositions than many pokies do.

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## lalberts9310 (May 20, 2015)

vespers said:


> I agree they aren't for beginners, though I wouldn't consider Psalmopeus a "poor man's pokies" either. While individual temperaments vary, I've found many Psalmopoeus seemingly have more unpredictable behaviors and unforgiving dispositions than many pokies do.


+1, I have yet to see a threat display from my SAF p. Fasciata.. but both my MM p. Irminias, especially the smaller one, is extremely defensive and skittish.. my mature female however is an odd ball when it comes to temperament..


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## Methal (May 20, 2015)

Depends on the person, and the enclosure more than the typical temperament of that given species if you ask me. 

You wanna get a P. Regalis as your first T? go right ahead. Educate yourself, and treat the T with respect, use a good enclosure that allows for easy cleaning and feeding and you'll be just fine.


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## vespers (May 20, 2015)

Methal said:


> Depends on the person, and the enclosure more than the typical temperament of that given species if you ask me.
> 
> You wanna get a P. Regalis as your first T? go right ahead. Educate yourself, and treat the T with respect, use a good enclosure that allows for easy cleaning and feeding and you'll be just fine.



...says the guy that started a thread last week asking how to get an uneaten cricket out of an unpredictable OBT's enclosure, because you got nabbed by it previously. :tongue:

Reactions: Like 4


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## Methal (May 20, 2015)

vespers said:


> ...says the guy that started a thread last week asking how to get an uneaten cricket out of an unpredictable OBT's enclosure, because you got nabbed by it previously. :tongue:


the low blows =D

Aside from blaming me, the enclosure wasnt the best, one of them little critter boxes withthe 3 inch square hinge door. They dont allow for the best access. 
I should have had it in a 10 gallon with a good latching lid and ignored the idiots who say "smaller is better"

besides, getting bit is part of the experience =) 
like having dogs and cats. they poop and kill your grass, and make your house smell. lol


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## vespers (May 20, 2015)

No worries...I was just teasing you a bit is all, lol. I wasn't trying to deal out low blows.


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## Chris LXXIX (May 20, 2015)

vespers said:


> I agree they aren't for beginners, though I wouldn't consider Psalmopeus a "poor man's pokies" either. While individual temperaments vary, I've found many Psalmopoeus seemingly have more unpredictable behaviors and unforgiving dispositions than many pokies do.


I never had nor i have today a Poecilotheria, a Stromatopelma calceatum, nor a Heteroscodra maculata (even if baboon T's are my fav. T's) or other Asian arboreals (they are indeed amazing) because, thank God, i'm not into arboreals, due to some different stuff, one of them is not having, where i live, easy access to those beauty acrylic, side open, full ventilated enclosures you USA enthusiasts have (they don't ship here)
I don't like poor ventilated, "guillottine" open, glass enclosures we have here... plus for me now space is an issue when it comes to T's.
Anyway, i have two Psalmopoeus cambridgei that i've received as freebie and you can't say no to a freebie  they grow like weed, super fast, but mine prefer to run and hide everytime i open the lid (i love to let the T "sense" my presence so they can hide in their retreat) rather than investigate and "attack" like my OBT would.
They are indeed maybe imo the only NW Tarantulas that really looks like OW T's, with a somewhat "nasty" venom too. That's why i call them "poor man's pookies", for their venom potency.
Of course i don't know (starting from the point that every individual vary, i'm probably the only one who deal with a "evil" AF Brachypelma albopilosum ) Poecilotheria behavior since i haven't deal with them but from what i've heard from keepers, if housed well with right set up, they are not a "bite in your face" like the "P.terror" of South African nations, tough their venom is a bit more potent than OBT'S if i'm not wrong.

---------- Post added 05-20-2015 at 03:28 PM ----------




lalberts9310 said:


> +1, I have yet to see a threat display from my SAF p. Fasciata.. but both my MM p. Irminias, especially the smaller one, is extremely defensive and skittish.. my mature female however is an odd ball when it comes to temperament..


I have heard here and there that Psalmopoeus irminia can be more "badass" sometime than the Psalmopoeus cambridgei. Beauty T's indeed they are. And pretty good eaters.


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## sschind (May 20, 2015)

Lots of good advice here so I'll just tell you a little story about dealing with an escaped regalis to give you an idea what it might be like. Advanced warning its a long story so quit now if you are in a hurry. 

I rehoused a really big female into a 10 gallon hexagon aquarium with a custom made screen lid and I was pretty pleased with the results (sorry no pictures it was years ago.)  A slight miscalculation of the security of the lid, or perhaps it was a gross underestimation of the desire of the tarantula to escape, led to an escape and a very large vary scary tarantula lose in my store for about 3 days.  I was working late one evening and as I walked to the front of my store to get another beer out of the fridge the motion sensor light came on as it always did and sitting right on the side of the fridge, right next to the handle, was the spider.  Had I not know it was loose I think I may have crapped myself.  Anyway, after taking a second to collect my thoughts I looked around for something to trap it in.  I emptied out a small kritter keeper I kept on the front counter with odds and ends in it and calmly :sarcasm: placed it over the spider.  The spider went nuts and bounced around inside for about a minute before it calmed down.  About a minute later I finally calmed down.  It was then that I realized I hadn't really thought my whole plan through.  Now I had a very large, very angry spider trapped inside a very small plastic container.  What was I going to do next?  I looked around for a piece of cardboard or at least a piece of paper to slide between the container and the fridge and there was absolutely nothing within reach.  Picture this if you can.  There I was holding the container to the fridge with my finger tips, stretching as much as I could to reach something to no avail as anything that would work to contain the spider was just out of my reach.  Wait, it gets better.  I looked around and my eyes fell upon a rather large scissors I keep under my front counter.  I picked up the scissors and tried to use it to drag a piece paper closer but that just succeeded in knocking the paper onto the floor.  I tried stretching out my foot to reach it but that didn't work either.  So I placed the tip of the scissors onto the plastic container and pressed very hard against it to keep it in place.  This gave me the added 12 inches or so in range I needed to grab a piece of paper to slip between the container and the fridge.  As I did so the spider went nuts again and I stood there for another minute or so to let it, and myself, calm down.  Eventually I got the thing transferred back into its cage where I had fixed the problem with the lid and I proceeded to drink my beer, rather quickly I might add.  I look back on the instance and laugh now but I was not laughing at the time.

So, what does all this have to do with beginner Ts?  Well, I just wanted to show you that with a regalis its not as simple as reaching out, plucking it off the counter and putting it back in it cage.  They are probably my fourth favorite spider (behind a G. pulchripes, G. pulchra and B. albiceps) but you will notice what those have in common, they are MELLOW.  I just rehoused my subadult P. vitatta and I was shaking like crazy just waiting for it to bolt as I stupidly lifted his cork bark out of the old cage, transferred it through open space and placed it into the new one.  Any jolt or touching of the spiders legs to the rim of the container would have sent it running up the cork and up my arm and sent me screaming and flailing my arms like I was on fire (no stop drop and roll for me in this case)  

Normally I have an opinion not unlike MrsHaas in that if what you really really want is generally not considered a "beginner" animal that does not automatically mean you should not consider it as sometimes it can make you more determined to take the steps necessary to keep them.  That has more to do with specific care requirements however (temps, humidity etc.) and not with the aggressiveness of the animal.  In this case I would agree with what the majority have posted and say pokies are not for beginners.  Heck, I've been handling T's for almost 15 years (I know, a drop in the bucket for some of you) and I still get nervous around them.  Get yourself a nice G. pulchripes or B smithi or any one of a number of NW terrestrials and get a little experience first.  The pokies will always be there when you are ready.

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## awiec (May 20, 2015)

Poec54 said:


> You've had excellent insights throughout this thread.


Well academics certainly aren't raising spiders and writing papers about how to keep them so it's up to us to observe and document what we can. I can only offer what I've seen and give advice with good points backing them up. Ultimately the OP is going to do whatever he/she wants but at least they will leave with some food for thought.


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## TsunamiSpike (May 20, 2015)

Angel Minkov said:


> I never advised getting a Poeci. If you check my first post, I advised against it. Also, Tsunami, it wont be the first case of someone selling/giving out a Poeci or OW, so its not hard to get rid of it either. Your mentality is wrong.


My mentality to actually respect and give a damn about them is wrong? Sorry if I feel they shouldn't be treated as a bad shirt at xmas that can be tossed aside without a second thought. You've got no right to tell me my mentality is wrong.

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## Angel Minkov (May 20, 2015)

Nope. The "youll even make less of an effort" mentality is wrong. If someone truly wants a Poec, they will do their research and learn about the consequences of a mistake, and actually put some effort.


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## lalberts9310 (May 20, 2015)

Angel Minkov said:


> Nope. The "youll even make less of an effort" mentality is wrong. If someone truly wants a Poec, they will do their research and learn about the consequences of a mistake, and actually put some effort.


 like I already mentioned, not everyone is the same, and there's a lot of idiots out there getting Ts like poecis for the wrong reasons, reasons like trying to "prove" masculinity... how many beginners do we see on here actually doing their research?

I don't think you have any right calling someone out about their mentality here.. I would take that very seriously and very personaly if someone said something like that to me


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## Angel Minkov (May 20, 2015)

Why would you. Its plain wrong to think that way. Its equally bad as trying to predict what someone is going to do and stating how much effort one will put. We should let the people decide for themselves if they will put any effort ot not.

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## lalberts9310 (May 20, 2015)

Angel Minkov said:


> Why would you. Its plain wrong to think that way. Its equally bad as trying to predict what someone is going to do and stating how much effort one will put. We should let the people decide for themselves if they will put any effort ot not.


 A lot of new comers join the hobby for the wrong reasons, so what? We should just leave the hobby to the mercy of irresponsible fools with bad consequences to follow? Or try to EDUCATE new comers on what's right and what's wrong, what will have a negative impact and what will have a positive impact. This hobby is much more than taking only yourself into consideration, people not involved in the hobby can be affected and they can have a negative impact on the hobby too, make the wrong decisions, educate people wrong, give them bad advice and the hobby won't live long.. it's not like dogs and cats that everyone loves and adores.. it's spiders

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## cold blood (May 20, 2015)

TsunamiSpike said:


> You've got no right to tell me my mentality is wrong.


I disagree, its his opinion, and everyone is entitled to their own, regardless as to the accuracy of the opinion.:wink:

I just don't think the opinion of other interneters (did I make up a word?) should matter to anyone personally one bit.    Some things are insignificant enough to just let them go...like opinions...ya know their like.....oh, wait, I shouldn't go any further.

Time to move on?


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## Angel Minkov (May 20, 2015)

The people we can educate dont join for the wrong reasons. They join to learn and because they like the hobby. Its the people who ee cant educate that ruin the hobby. They open topics asking if they should buy a H. maculata, three pages of people say "no" and then a single guy says "you possibly could" and that immediately means they should set their enclosure and order. We cant change that.


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## awiec (May 20, 2015)

Angel Minkov said:


> The people we can educate dont join for the wrong reasons. They join to learn and because they like the hobby. Its the people who ee cant educate that ruin the hobby. They open topics asking if they should buy a H. maculata, three pages of people say "no" and then a single guy says "you possibly could" and that immediately means they should set their enclosure and order. We cant change that.


No but there are people whom actually want to know from experienced people and those are the people who can be convinced to get a more suitable species. Which if a person is stubborn enough to want something then they will get it, consequences be damned.

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## TsunamiSpike (May 20, 2015)

Angel Minkov said:


> Nope. The "youll even make less of an effort" mentality is wrong. If someone truly wants a Poec, they will do their research and learn about the consequences of a mistake, and actually put some effort.


You say my mentality is wrong in regards to predicting/assuming a person will make less of an effort and then make the same 'mistake' of assuming anyone in the same position of wanting a pokie will do the research? Way to contradict yourself.

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## Angel Minkov (May 21, 2015)

If anyone truly wants a Pokie, they WILL do their research. Any NORMAL person will. People around this forum should stop being with the mindset that everyone who wants an OW T will definitely buy it as a first, second or third choice without doing any research. You know nothing of people who are in the hobby for the wrong reasons. In my country people with 2+ bite reports from OBTs and Pokies recommend them for a second spider, and you sweat around here.


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## Blueandbluer (May 21, 2015)

Angel Minkov said:


> If anyone truly wants a Pokie, they WILL do their research. Any NORMAL person will. People around this forum should stop being with the mindset that everyone who wants an OW T will definitely buy it as a first, second or third choice without doing any research. You know nothing of people who are in the hobby for the wrong reasons. In my country people with 2+ bite reports from OBTs and Pokies recommend them for a second spider, and you sweat around here.


Any "normal" person? What is a "normal" person? I agree a SENSIBLE, RESPONSIBLE person will, but in my nearly 40 years experience as a human I can say those qualities are rather far from "normal."

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## TsunamiSpike (May 21, 2015)

Angel Minkov said:


> If anyone truly wants a Pokie, they WILL do their research. Any NORMAL person will. People around this forum should stop being with the mindset that everyone who wants an OW T will definitely buy it as a first, second or third choice without doing any research. You know nothing of people who are in the hobby for the wrong reasons. In my country people with 2+ bite reports from OBTs and Pokies recommend them for a second spider, and you sweat around here.


And yet how many times do we hear about people getting them as firsts and getting bit? Enough to have cause for concern. Good for you that people in your country are happy to get bit and recommend them to inexperienced keepers.  By all means continue with the cavalier attitude towards OWs. Just don't moan when the impact of the minority effects the hobby as a whole and we have to give it up by law.

And normal is a questionable term, is any human truly "normal?

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## Angel Minkov (May 21, 2015)

If you had even bothered to read what I've written, you would have noticed I was against OWs as first Ts. Getting them as firsts or early? Often. Getting bit? Not that much. I've noticed that people who are more "experienced" get bit far more often that a person who is afraid to open his OWs cage.


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## theconmacieist (May 21, 2015)

Fear and respect are good things if they are weighed out properly. If a hobbyist is truly experienced they will know how dangerous it is to be complacent.

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## Angel Minkov (May 21, 2015)

lalberts9310 said:


> I think it's the other way around, people who are experienced won't get complacent.. people who are inexperienced gets complacent, they are the majority that writes bite reports...


Im basing it on read bite reports exactly on this forum.


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## lalberts9310 (May 21, 2015)

I think it's the other way around, people who are experienced won't get complacent.. people who are inexperienced gets complacent, they are the majority that writes the bite reports...

---------- Post added 05-21-2015 at 04:11 PM ----------




Angel Minkov said:


> Im basing it on read bite reports exactly on this forum.


Like already said, no amount of online research can prep you for an OW, why we advice against it.. we'll see more bite reports if we tell newcomers "go ahead, it's your 1st T, jump in the deep end and get yourself a poeci" most bite reports I have read are from inexperienced people who get complacent, you won't easily see an experienced member like poec54 writing a bite report, why? They don't get complacent

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## Poec54 (May 21, 2015)

lalberts9310 said:


> I think it's the other way around, people who are experienced won't get complacent.. people who are inexperienced gets complacent, they are the majority that writes the bite reports...
> 
> ---------- Post added 05-21-2015 at 04:11 PM ----------
> 
> ...


+1.  Bites should be rare events, and most happen to the inexperienced.  All too often they rush things and get advanced species before they're really ready for them.  2/3's of my collection is OW, and most of my NW's are tropical and high strung.  I've never been bit because I went in stages with the species I got (not necessarily by choice, but that's all that was available 40 years ago).  That prepared me for what to expect and what the do's and don't are.  Had I jumped into fast, feisty spiders too soon, it wouldn't have gone smoothly.  There's no rush.  This isn't Beat the Clock.  There's nothing to prove.  There's a very real possible of regulations and bans if we show that we can't handle the responsibility of owning spiders.  You're not doing this in a vacuum.  All of us can be impacted.

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## Methal (May 21, 2015)

Poec54 said:


> There's a very real possible of regulations and bans if we show that we can't handle the responsibility of owning spiders.  You're not doing this in a vacuum.  All of us can be impacted.


tbh how many of us would follow those stupid ignorantly implemented regulations and bans if they did make them. Nobody has died from a T bite. Very few go to the hosptial. 
There is a very real reason to ban / Regulate venomous snakes. Get a good rattler bite and you may die, even with a trip to the hospital.


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## MissyMaguire (May 21, 2015)

awiec said:


> View attachment 136707
> 
> 
> Forgot to post this; this is my WC adult female Thrixopelma cyaneolum, she is a very calm and methodical spider. Note the blue body, red rump and gold stripes and high lights all over her. If you can find one then they are fantastic starter species and the genus is generally a good choice.


OMG, she's BEAUTIFUL  <3 <3 

She's blue, almost like a Metallica.  I hope I find one just like that -- I'd get her along with my first Smithi


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## scott99 (May 21, 2015)

BobGrill said:


> No and they have one of the worst venomous of any tarantula period.  Look at some of the bite reports here. I can tell you haven't done any research on this genus,  otherwise you wouldn't be asking this question.
> 
> ---------- Post added 05-19-2015 at 06:27 AM ----------
> 
> Possible troll thread guys?


+1 to BobGrill Do your research first, then ask questions second.

Reactions: Like 1


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## lalberts9310 (May 21, 2015)

Methal said:


> tbh how many of us would follow those stupid ignorantly implemented regulations and bans if they did make them. Nobody has died from a T bite. Very few go to the hosptial.
> There is a very real reason to ban / Regulate venomous snakes. Get a good rattler bite and you may die, even with a trip to the hospital.


They don't care if they're deadly or not, if they have a reason to ban a T they'll do it, part of germany has banned poecilotheria, it can happen in your country too.. and toddlers, children and elders will very easily end up in hospital if bitten by an escaped OW

---------- Post added 05-21-2015 at 07:38 PM ----------



MissyMaguire said:


> OMG, she's BEAUTIFUL  <3 <3
> 
> She's blue, almost like a Metallica.  I hope I find one just like that -- I'd get her along with my first Smithi


Great choice, B. smithi is gorgeous and a great starter, always visible and easy to work with.. and so is thrixopelma

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## scott99 (May 21, 2015)

lalberts9310 said:


> They don't care if they're deadly or not, if they have a reason to ban a T they'll do it, part of germany has banned poecilotheria, it can happen in your country too.. and toddlers, children and elders will very easily end up in hospital if bitten by an escaped OW


+1 to lalberts9310, it only taken one idiotic person to mess it up for everybody else.

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## Poec54 (May 21, 2015)

Methal said:


> tbh how many of us would follow those stupid ignorantly implemented regulations and bans if they did make them. Nobody has died from a T bite. Very few go to the hosptial.
> There is a very real reason to ban / Regulate venomous snakes.


No valid reason is required for governments to ban tarantulas.  They have all the authority, they make the rules.  If we don't comply, they confiscate.  Let's try to keep it from getting to that point.

I used to keep venomous snakes (cobras).  The majority of venomous owners are careful and responsible.  It was a handful of show offs and idiots that ruined for everybody in Florida.  Now we have a 1,000 hours of training requirement, which is almost impossible to achieve.  That's effectively shutting down the hobby here.

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## awiec (May 21, 2015)

MissyMaguire said:


> OMG, she's BEAUTIFUL  <3 <3
> 
> She's blue, almost like a Metallica.  I hope I find one just like that -- I'd get her along with my first Smithi


They aren't the easiest to find but there is a guy in Michigan whom has imported a few (and is the person I bought mine from). He usually goes to the reptile shows in Taylor, MI and I'll see if I can dig up his contact info as he's the only person I've ran into that consistently has them. Though if you want to plan a road trip then I'd suggest coming up here and enjoy some fine Michigan food and weather and get some nice spiders. Of course Ohio has to have reptile shows so I'd suggest finding one close to you and do your shopping there. 

Also she is probably more blue than my metallica is except if the latter if fresh from a molt. Though I prefer looking at the gold striping and she has the bonus of having the colors of my Alma mater, U of M.

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## cold blood (May 21, 2015)

awiec said:


> They aren't the easiest to find but there is a guy in Michigan whom has imported a few (and is the person I bought mine from). He usually goes to the reptile shows in Taylor, MI and I'll see if I can dig up his contact info as he's the only person I've ran into that consistently has them. Though if you want to plan a road trip then I'd suggest coming up here and enjoy some fine Michigan food and weather and get some nice spiders. Of course Ohio has to have reptile shows so I'd suggest finding one close to you and do your shopping there.
> 
> Also she is probably more blue than my metallica is except if the latter if fresh from a molt. Though I prefer looking at the gold striping and she has the bonus of having the colors of my Alma mater, U of M.


Keep me posted if you find them again....I'd like more.


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## TsunamiSpike (May 21, 2015)

Methal said:


> tbh how many of us would follow those stupid ignorantly implemented regulations and bans if they did make them. Nobody has died from a T bite. Very few go to the hosptial.


If bans and regulations were in place you wouldn't be able to get tarantulas so whether we'd follow said rules is irrelevant, they'd be unobtainable without punishable risks.

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## Arachnomaniac19 (May 21, 2015)

TsunamiSpike said:


> If bans and regulations were in place you wouldn't be able to get tarantulas so whether we'd follow said rules is irrelevant, they'd be unobtainable without punishable risks.


Well marijuana's banned, but it's relatively easy to get.


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## awiec (May 21, 2015)

Arachnomaniac19 said:


> Well marijuana's banned, but it's relatively easy to get.


It's a bit easier to grow and smuggle pot, tarantulas are different as they are live animals


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## cold blood (May 21, 2015)

awiec said:


> It's a bit easier to grow and smuggle pot, tarantulas are different as they are live animals


Lol, I bet it would be a lot easier to breed and sell t's under the table than a bunch of pungent plants requiring lots of light and power.

I also think its a lot easier to grow quality t's:wink:

Reactions: Like 4 | Agree 1


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## Chris LXXIX (May 22, 2015)

Methal said:


> tbh how many of us would follow those stupid ignorantly implemented regulations and bans if they did make them. Nobody has died from a T bite. Very few go to the hosptial.
> There is a very real reason to ban / Regulate venomous snakes. Get a good rattler bite and you may die, even with a trip to the hospital.


Nobody has died from a T bite. You are right. 
But i will not put my hand in the fire, saying "Don't worry, nothing bad will happen, just badass pain" (if an OBT or a Stromatopelma, or a Poecilotheria, just for examples) bites a 5 year child in the neck, to his/her parents.
Yeah, i know.. it's almost "impossible" but not a completely impossible scenario.
I saw a video on YT - the site loved by those who love to play the bad way with their OW T's, handling them like a Nintendo 3DS, bunch of selfish, voyeuristic idiots (they will perform those "Hey, look at me!" gestures without an audience?) that can damage ALL the enthusiasts - of an Haplopelma lividum who literally bolted out of the shipping box, and went under that 15 years (probably) skate looking guy, T-shirt, while his friends started to "lol".
The T didn't bite him just for pure luck. 
Politicians and Mass Media waits like a Pelinobius muticus waits for a prey, for news like that, they can make bigger and twist as they wanna, with the general public who give a damn about T's.
I can guarantee you this... Italy BANNED ALL T's, i repeat, ALL T's, and all scorpions, in 2003, for far less (not even a serious bite). Took only one hour of their, well payed, afternoons for write a law who literally "Ground Zero" the hobby loved by few (not more than 150/200 people, more or less, in a nation of 50 millions of "arachno haters").
Enthusiasts must protect and defend the hobby, not working for undermine it with their actions.
That's the reason why there's, not valid, but vital, vital reasons if certain T's are for experienced keepers. A 18 year guy, with his brand new driving license, can't drive a Lamborghini.
Nuff Said

Reactions: Like 2


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## Angel Minkov (May 22, 2015)

Yeah, and if my ant goes inside me and eats out my liver, then I'd die, sure. Don't you think that a T biting a child on the neck is a little superficial? The kid shouldn't be around the T in the first place. And if the regalis has escaped, the sensible thing the parents should do is call the pest control immediately, or do it themselves. Responsibility and respect are the KEY factors, I'd even go as far as to say they're more important than experience. I've seen people with loads of experience pinchgrab their African spiders and get bit because of irresponsibility. Take Stan Schultz as an example - I think he has more than enough experience, but because he held his Ts he has been bit several times.


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## Chris LXXIX (May 22, 2015)

Angel Minkov said:


> Yeah, and if my ant goes inside me and eats out my liver, then I'd die, sure. Don't you think that a T biting a child on the neck is a little superficial? The kid shouldn't be around the T in the first place. And if the regalis has escaped, the sensible thing the parents should do is call the pest control immediately, or do it themselves. Responsibility and respect are the KEY factors, I'd even go as far as to say they're more important than experience. I've seen people with loads of experience pinchgrab their African spiders and get bit because of irresponsibility. Take Stan Schultz as an example - I think he has more than enough experience, but because he held his Ts he has been bit several times.


You have to ask that to parents, or others, who allow childrens and young kids to their "T rooms" while doing routine husbandry, not to me. The essence of my (long, i know) statement is valid.
However, i have, again in YT, also saw a video where a mother let her young daughter remove the egg sac from her female Psalmopoeus cambridgei enclosure. Sure, she (the mom) was present, but.. that's what i call, in all honesty, superficial, not a bite from a potent venom OW in the neck of a child.
I agree that responsability and respect are everything in this hobby, but so also experience is.

And btw, let me say this clear: in this hobby the word "end" is far to be written, so even people like Stan Schultz or other experts like Poec54 can learn something "new", year after years.

A bite is rare but "shit happens".. but if happens because "you" took the OBT (for instance) out of the enclosure, for handling, sorry.. you are an idiot, no matter if you have 50 years of experience in T's.

In sum, this is not a race against time. There isn't an "elite" who say "No!" to someone else who wanna nothing but the same T's they have.
Everyone who REALLY loves the hobby can own an OW T, just it's right to respect the "step by step" way of things. This is also respect.

Reactions: Like 2


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## MissyMaguire (May 22, 2015)

awiec said:


> They aren't the easiest to find but there is a guy in Michigan whom has imported a few (and is the person I bought mine from). He usually goes to the reptile shows in Taylor, MI and I'll see if I can dig up his contact info as he's the only person I've ran into that consistently has them.


*** Awesome, can you do that?  You can PM me anytime.  When I'm ready to get "Beginning T's", I would love to have someone reputable.  I'm in Columbus OH so, it wouldn't that far for delivery.


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