# Wild Tarantulas In Canada



## JacenBeers

Many times since I have lived here in the desert I have heard of people claiming to have seen massive spiders while on walks out in the drylands all around the city. Kamloops is very deserty and dry and we even have cactuses. It is extremely warm here and we only get snow for about 1 month of the year, if that.  Well this year two people have captured wild tarantulas here and last year a whole bunch of scorpions were caught that were two inches long.  One tarantula was captured by a student near my university in an area I commonly walk around in and another was caught by the guy that runs a local exotics store.  This was caught down near Kamloops Lake.  I havent seen them yet but I will be checking out both sometime this week.  I am excited.


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## Fungii

Sounds cool Jacen, can you get pictures? I've heard that we have one type of tarantula in Canada but I've never heard of anybody actually encountering one in the flesh. Let us know what you find!


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## JacenBeers

I still havent had a chance to see one of these illusive beasts yet but Moe assures me i will be impressed. He says his is at 4 inches and it lacks urticating hairs.  He says it is a burgundy color to almost black.


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## Buspirone

Thats interesting.....Do you think you could take some pictures and post them? Let us know what you think after you see them.


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## Steve Nunn

> _Originally posted by JacenBeers _
> *I still havent had a chance to see one of these illusive beasts yet but Moe assures me i will be impressed. He says his is at 4 inches and it lacks urticating hairs.  He says it is a burgundy color to almost black. *


Hi Jacen,
             It isn't a tarantula, as such, probably just a large mygale of some sort. All T's in the US have urticatious setae, so anything even remotely 'native' to Canada would definately have the urticatious patch. 

The other theory, although highly unlikely, is that a gravid captive old world T escaped and it's offspring survived.

Sorry to burst the bubble 

Either way it sounds like an impressive spider, please post a pic if you can.

Steve


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## JacenBeers

It is indeed a tarantula. Moe knows just as much about tarantulas as i do and the taxonomy teacher at the university I go to has the other one in his lab now and he confirmed it as well. Both were found pretty far from each other and look identical apparently. Lots of people are going out with Moe early tomorrow to find more. I will definitely post a pic as soon as I get one.  Hopefully I can do it tomorrow if I have time after work.


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## Steve Nunn

> _Originally posted by JacenBeers _
> *It is indeed a tarantula. Moe knows just as much about tarantulas as i do and the taxonomy teacher at the university I go to has the other one in his lab now and he confirmed it as well.  *


OK, so the taxonomist who has one thinks it's a T hey? What's the taxonomists field? Being that mygales are a hard to key out even for standard arachnid taxonomists I'm interested in the persons credentials. Being he knows a bit about theraphosid taxonomy how did he exlpain the geographic location of this T with no urticatious setae? I really am interested in his hypothesis. What morphological features did he use to ID it as a theraphosid. Does he know the differences between theraphosids and barychelids, or diplurids for that matter. Thing is Jacen, most people would spot a large hairy mygale and think to themselves "that's a tarantula!". This taxonomist would have to have access to rellevant published material or at last an accurate knowledge of all mygales to ID this spider as a T.

Moe knows as much as you. Can you tell me what differentiates a theraphosid from other mygales? 

I'm not meaning to come down hard on you, I would just like to hear your thoughts on why this IS a theraphosid. Because frankly, the chances are about 0% that thse sidrs are tarantulas.

Cheers,
Steve


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## Arachnopuppy

How can tarantulas survive the Canadian winters?


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## Steve Nunn

> _Originally posted by lam _
> *How can tarantulas survive the Canadian winters? *


They couldn't lam. Even one month of snow is enough to kill any T. Even a spider such as Selenocosmia himalayana (living at elevations of 6000' at the base of the Himalayas) could not survive one month of snow. The only chance of this occurring as Jacen has stated is that a bunch of old world T's either escaped or were released by some numbskull who didn't know they would die within one season. It's just not possible on so many levels....Then again, maybe Jacen is onto something that will change the beliefs of scientific kowledge regarding theraphosids, not just through ecology and behaviour(temperatures) but geography (old worlder in the far Northern Americas)as well. Dismissing two rules of the Therahosidae at once, this will be quite a tarantula.....

Cheers,
Steve


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## RugbyDave

it could just be some guy who released some old world species a couple days previous..

it could be the astro-physicist in me, but NOTHING'S fully impossible.

However, its HIGHY UNPROBABLE (i stick kind of with Steve on this one)... however, thats not to say that it isnt a morph or mimic, or some unknown species...

new species ARE always being found. Look at the crustaceans living next to the deep-sea vents.... INSANELY hot temps, and we NEVER thought anything was living down there, but..

life evolves to what it needs, right?

I'd be VERY interested to see the pics!
keep in mind, it could just be a pet-release.

stewing, waiting for pics   By the way Jacen, thats a beautiful part of canada (clearwater and cache creek areas!!)

peace
dave


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## Mister Internet

> _Originally posted by RugbyDave _
> *keep in mind, it could just be a pet-release.*


Well, the astro-physicist in you can probably also see that the mathematical probability of two unrelated old-world pet tarantula releases resulting in eventual capture in the same locale of a hostile habitat actually occuring would be.... well... astronomical... no pun intended.


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## RugbyDave

very true, Mr I!


.....

but there's still a possibility! =D

enough with the ribbing, BRING ON THE PICS, am I right?!

peace
dave


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## Kugellager

Steve,  interesting note on the maximum elevation Tarantulas can be found at.  Aphonopelma coloradanum is found as far north as central Colorado.  

I and Atrax each have several slings that were hatched from an egg sac found in the foothills north of Canon City Colorado.   Canon City is at about 5500' in elevation and the foothills to the north range from around 6000' to 9000' (they call them foothills here anyway).  The sparse vegitation is sage brush mixed with juniper and therefore fairly arid.  They do in fact get a bit of snow in the area during the winter...not just trace amounts either(wet season).   Our local Butterfly pavilion has several adults collected from the same general area and to the south where the elevation is in the 5000-7500' range and of similar vegitation...think high plains and rolling hills. 

The egg sac was found among some rocks behind a womans house and then kept in her garage for a couple of  weeks until  Jeff Owen of the U of Colorado entomology dept. came and collected it from her.   I freely admit that the exact elevation the egg sac was collected at is not known and would speculate that it was not above 8000'.  The egg sac was brought back the the Denver area( also 5000-6000 feet)  and hatched shortly after this past August.   There were 100-150 slings...he didn't bother doing a detailed count.  The slings do have urticating hairs by the way.  Nice little black fuzzy patches of them at this stage (about 1-1.5 cm).

To the west of this area is a wide high plains region called the San Luis Valley which is at an elevation of 7000-8000'.  It is reported that an Aphonopelma sp. can be found there...I don't know the details.  The areas I mentioned that they have been found still get frost frequently even at this time of year...In fact we may get snow here on Monday down to 6000'.

Anyway...I though you might find that interesting.

John
];')


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## Mojo Jojo

There are tarantulas in Missour and that place sure doesn't lack any cold weather or snow.

Jon


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## Bry

John,

I have done a little bit of searching for the Colorado native species that I've heard about. I couldn't find pics of an adult or the latin name for them. I've been interested in keeping this species. Have any idea where I could obtain some?

Bry


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## That Guy

Mybe its not a T....Mybe its just a giant spider I would love to see a giant true spider hanging from a silk strand...That would be awesome!


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## Kugellager

Bry...our casual spider group we have out here has talked about going collectiog for Colorado T's at some point in the summer.  If I or Atrax get any I'm sure we will post something here and you should ask me again then.  I have four slings of them now but the largets is just over 1/2".  They grow very slowly...these are from the ones hatched in August I mentioned above.  Pic are difficult to find of these guys.  Next time I go to the Butterfly Pavilion I need to remember to take my camera with me.

If you go here there is a picture of what may be an Aphonopelma coloradanum about half way down the page...it looks similar to a male of this species...though the ones I have seen are a bit greener.

http://www.ext.colostate.edu/pubs/insect/05512.html

John
];')


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## Fungii

> They couldn't lam. Even one month of snow is enough to kill any T. Even a spider such as Selenocosmia himalayana (living at elevations of 6000' at the base of the Himalayas) could not survive one month of snow.


I'd just like to mention how *mild* the winters can be in BC and how *arid* the interior is, almost desert-like. I don't think it's all that far-fetched that a tarantula could survive around Kamloops.

Wether it's a native species or not is another question.


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## RugbyDave

*everything you ever wanted to know about the weather in Kamloops, part 1:*

Its def. very arid up there. Some parts are _almost_ American SouthWest looking.

I've only gone as far as Cache Creek and Clearwater, but i've flown over that area...

its true, it gets very mild winters

In fact:
"The climate of the Kamloops Region is extremely diverse. Ashcroft, Cache Creek, Kamloops and the Nicola Valley are classified as *semi-arid bordering on desert* and noted for their *dry hot summers*. Winters are *mild with little precipitation*. Hillsides are grass-covered with sagebrush. Little tree growth occurs until elevations of 900+ metres (2953 ft)." The Kamloops region itself is only around 1000' asl (ish)

so there you go.... (off of travelkamloops.com i think). I also think Amarillo TX gets more snow (average) per year than Kamloops. And Amarillo doesn't get too too much snow (maybe 20" a year, average?)

now that you think about it, it sounds less and less unprobable, and more and more probable? 

peace
dave


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## Steve Nunn

> _Originally posted by Kugellager _
> *Steve,  interesting note on the maximum elevation Tarantulas can be found at. ];') *


Hi John,
            That's the highest elevation I know of for an old world tarantula. If the spider was new world, one of the Aphonopelma spp., well, anything's possible. Thanks for the elevations on the Aphonopelma though, it's food for thought. G.rosea live in some fairly cold climate too.

The thing that maks this so unbeliveable is it's not an Aphonopelma sp. AND more then one have been found.

I'd still love to know what morphological features were used to ID the spider as a tarantula. A big hairy mygale does not constitute a T, so what was used to ID this spider???? How did they determine it not to be a barychelid for example (which can be hairy, can even stridulate, depending on species and even has tarsal scopula)? 

At what temps does the collection area for this spider drop too? It may be fairly warm there at times, but what it the lowest it gets to during winter, could a T really survive that??? I doubt it still. Colorado, Utah and some of the other colder states US T's are found in are still a long way away from Canada......

I've gotta see it to believe this one.

Cheers,
Steve


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## RugbyDave

*even more crap about the weather (to answer your question, steve)*

The average low in Kamloops hovers around 20 to 25F with a mean of 23F.
average precipitation during the summer months hovers around 3-4 inches at max.

Also, the month that has the most precip (June), there's still barely 1.3 inches... 

consequently, i think the record low ever recorded in Kamloops was around -30F. The same was recorded in Denver around the turn of the century.

so go figure 

Also, record lows of -40 were recorded in Arizona, arkansas, and california. If you think about it, Flagstaff, AZ, gets more snow than Buffalo (NY) AND Rochester (NY) COMBINED. 

peace
dave


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## Henry Kane

I see some possibility in regards to the climatic conditions but what has me wondering is the apparent lack of urticating setae. Wouldn't it be more interesting to find a theraphosid in that location that wasn't Aphonopelma? To be perfectly honest here, I'm very curious to see what they found. I hope there are some pics soon.
I would also like to know more about the credentials of the taxonomist particularly of his expertise in theraphosid taxonomy. I think Steve has a good point in asking what biological features differentiate theraphosid and mygale. If the Canadian taxonomy expert can answer that then Jacen and company may be on to an amazing find.

Atrax


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## JacenBeers

UPDATE: I have seen the spiders. Both at the same time. They were discovered exactly 7 kilometers from each other.  They both appear to be adult females, although who knows. One is a little more purplish than the other. I do not see any visible urticating hairs. This is strange. Moe nor Dr Adler will allow me to take a photo of the spiders just yet because they want to look into them a bit more. Dr Adler has both in his custody now. We are going out tomorrow to look for more. 

Just to mention something about the weather here. A spider could survive here in my opinion. Scorpions which are native to somehwere in Brazil were transported here accidentally in some shipment to a courier and packing company and they escaped and bred and they now live here near the second branch of the Thompson river. I have seen a few myself.


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## Henry Kane

What would you estimate the legspan to be?


Atrax


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## Kugellager

Thanks for the update Jacen.  This is all very interesting...at least the potential is.  They sound like an interesting looking spider as well.

John
];')


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## JacenBeers

Leg span on both is 5.5 inches.


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## Bry

Thanks for the info, John. I'll be sure to check out the Butterfly Pavilion this summer. I have been there all of once shortly after they first opened. Back then, I wasn't too interested in tarantulas or inverts in general. I was more interested in the butterfly setup they have there. How similar would you say the A. coloradanum are in resemblance to the Oklahoma brown (A. hentzi, I think it was)?

Bry


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## Steve Nunn

Hey Jacen, you've seen the spiders, do you think they are tarantulas? What features were used to determine them as tarantulas?

Look, if you need help with identification, PM me if you are interested. Honestly, there's nothing better then locating a new species, I've found five new tarantulas, so I've got a rough idea of the rush that can come with it. I hope you have found something new, particularly in Canada, that would rock.

I look forward to the photos....

Steve


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## LaRiz

I would be pretty surprised if this spider turned out to be a theraphosid.  I'm not saying it's impossible, though, 'cause this field can make a fool of you.
There are 46 described species of Lycosa inside British Columbia.  This info was sourced to a person named West.  Rick West?  Regardless, being he's an authority of theraphosids and a Canadian, maybe he would be the man to ask.
This is definitely intersting.  How does a tarantula species named "jacenbeeri" sound to you all? 
john


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## Vys

Canada? Polar-bears? Ice? 
I thought it was as far north as Sweden?
*Goes off to check an map-book*

EDIT: Well, It's northern parts are as far north as sweden at any rate  
The southernmost parts...

Yes...I live at roughly 61 Degrees N, Kamloops is..at 52 or so. But we have the Golf-stream or whatever it's called! No matter; we hardly even have mygalomorphs. There are 3 different kinds of snake here. 
Sorry, don't know why I'm ranting, if I'm even.


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## Arachnopuppy

I say kill them.  Kill them all.  

On a serious note, if this is really a new species, chances are it will be fully accredited to Dr. Adler.


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## JacenBeers

Yes Dr Adler is going to get credit for it for sure. I wish I could get credit for it but I have not found one yet.

We came to the conclusion that these specimens were theraphosids based on the following points:

1. The both have two pairs of book lungs on the underside of their abdomen.

2. Their fangs are up and down moving rather than sideways moving.

3. They have two small claws adorning the end of each foot.


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## Steve Nunn

> _Originally posted by JacenBeers _
> *We came to the conclusion that these specimens were theraphosids based on the following points:
> 
> 1. The both have two pairs of book lungs on the underside of their abdomen.
> 
> 2. Their fangs are up and down moving rather than sideways moving.
> 
> 3. They have two small claws adorning the end of each foot. *


Thankyou for answering Jacen. The three morphological features you used to ID it as a theraphosid are applicable to most if not all mygales. I hate to be blunt but all you guys have concluded is the fact that you have a member of the infraorder Mygalomorphae.  Based on the features you mentioned, it could be from the Dilpuridae, Nemesiidae, Barychelidae,Cyrtaucheniidae, Hexathelidae, Idiopidae, Ctenizidae,Migidae,Atypidae, Microstigmatidae, Mecicobothriidae, Paratropididae, Theraphosidae, Actinopodidae or Antrodiaetidae families. What you guys have determined is that it's not an araneomorph, but it's a start 

The systematics of the Mygalomorphae are far more complicated then many would care to get into, I hope you guys seek out professional help for identification because if this is what Dr Adler has managed so far (no offense, I'm sure he's an expert in his field), you guys will need 'additional' help.

Good luck,
Steve


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## JacenBeers

Dr Adler knows more than me. I know it is a tarantula just by looking at it.  He has identified it as a theraphosid. I just used my own knowledge to give those three points.


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## Henry Kane

Are you guys still trying to match a scientific description or has it already been positively determined that it's undescribed?
Hate to play 20 questions but I'm actually pretty psyched to know what you guys found. I love $h1t like this! 

Atrax


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## JacenBeers

Well Dr Adler says that from his knowledge, it reminds him of the Haplopelma genus the most.  But I have no clue what to say in regards to that.


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## Henry Kane

Yeah I wouldn't know what to say either...other than "wow" or more along the lines of "Holy $h!t! That pretty much defies everything currently known about North American Theraphosids!".
YOu have to realize though that for anyone that hasn't seen the spiders, what you describe is quite a stretch for the imagination. Even still, it's often said how much there is yet to be learned.

Please keep us posted.

Atrax


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## Arachnopuppy

Here is my theory in the matter.  20 thousand years ago, people already had pets tarantula.  When a number of them decided to cross the Bering Strait, which was frozen due to the ice age, some brought the tarantulas with them.  How did the tarantulas survive the cold weather?  Basically, those nomads kept the tarantulas inside their coats.  You can pretty much guess the rest.


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## D-Man

This would be an exciting find if it indeed was a T. However, this all sounds too vague and too good to be true.


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## Rick_C_West

*Endemic theraphosid species in British Columbia, Canada*

Contrary the thread of a 'theraphosid tarantula' found living around Kamloops, BC, Canada ... it isn't so!  Theraphosids no not occur north of Susanville, California, and the Black Rock Desert, Nevada.  
We do, however, have other mygalomorph families represented in BC, but not theraphosidae.  The only theraphosid specimens found in BC would be releases or escapes from the pet trade
... I'm from Missouri, show me the specimen!
Rick C. West


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## Rick_C_West

*British Columbian theraphosid spider*

Apologies for the previous typing errors, however, I was so friggin' apoplectic about this!  Please send me Dr. Adler's email address or phone number off line to rickcwest@shaw.ca so I can get to the bottom of this allegation.
Rick C. West
Victoria, BC, Canada


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## Steve Nunn

*Re: British Columbian theraphosid spider*



> _Originally posted by Rick_C_West _
> *Apologies for the previous typing errors, however, I was so friggin' apoplectic about this!  Rick C. West
> Victoria, BC, Canada *


Howdy pardner,
                        Nice to see you here   What are the chances of _any_ theraphosid (let alone those from the old world) firstly surviving the winter period and secondly successfully producing young that survive to adulthood (being that more then one have been located)??

Any Barychelids in that location?? We have doctors in this area (Mackay, Qld) who've ID'd mygales as funnel-webs with the end result causing people to pour poison down the burrows of harmless nemesiid trap door spiders. What these people don't know is funnel-webs don't occur this far north.  

Cheers,
Steve


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## Kugellager

Steve,  here is a link for the two Colorado locations I mentioned for the Aphonopelma ssp. I mentioned earlier in this thread.

Canon City
http://www.weather.com/weather/climatology/monthly/USCO0054

Alamosa in the San Luis Valley
http://www.weather.com/weather/climatology/monthly/USCO0004

You can see that for Alamosa that it barely gets above freezing in the winter.  

John


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## Rick_C_West

*Tarantulas in the wilds of BC, Canada*

Hello Steve, 
I avoid 'tarantula boards' as I have no time for all the threads, so, you don't/won't see me here much, however, I couldn't allow this one to slip by when it was brought to my attention.
There are no barychelids living naturally in Canada.  Once I had a female Aphonopelma eutylenum escape one summer in Victoria, BC, Canada, and the police were called to a terrified woman's yard the following summer, 8 blocks away, to pick it up wander on her lawn.  Other neighborhood kids knew who owned it and I got it back but obviously it survived somewhere through the winter.  Victoria, however, is on the ocean where we get the mild Hawaiian and California ocean currents through the winters.  Kamloops, on the other hand, is in the heart of BC and gets severely cold winters.
To add suspicion to all this, no one has answered me, givn me an email address or phone number.  This won't stop me, I'll track this Dr. Adler down ... Kamloops is not a big place and I know the arachnologists in the region.
The comment that this tarantula looks like a 'Haplopelma' should give everyone a clue how ludicrous this is.  Approx. 95% of all New World theraphosids possess uticating hairs, the other app. 5% are the small Ischnocoline-like species ... but a stridulating 'Haplopelma' tarantula naturally living in Kamloops, BC.  All I can say is, don't buy a used car from these people! =D 
I will post what I find out, if anything at all ... the original posters seem to have gone quiet.
Rick C. West


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## Rick_C_West

*'Tarantulas' living in the wilds of BC, Canada*

My added opinion ... if this mygalomorph proves not to be an escapes or released theraphosid, my money is on that it's Antrodiaetus hageni (Antrodiaetidae) ... which is found in this area.
Rick C. West


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## LaRiz

> _Originally posted by Kugellager _
> *You can see that for Alamosa that it barely gets above freezing in the winter.
> John *


John,
My wife, Windie, grew up in Del Norte, which is not far at all from Alamosa.  When I was stationed in Colorado, we even went down a couple of times, so she could spend time with her family, and me looking for bugs and stuff.  I never did find any tarantulas, and Windie never seen a tarantula there.  That's not to say they don't occur there.
She says Alamosa is cold, cold, cold.


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## Kugellager

Lariz,

The Colorado Spider survey reports that there are some in the northern end of the San Luis Valley though they did not mention the species or the exact location in what I read.  They hope to have someone collect them so that they can be ID'd.

John
];')


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## That_Guy

where be the pictures:?


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## Sean

> _Originally posted by That_Guy _
> *where be the pictures:? *



I was wondering that same thing, im starting to wonder if this "story" is true or not??


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## Steve Nunn

*Re: 'Tarantulas' living in the wilds of BC, Canada*



> _Originally posted by Rick_C_West _
> *My added opinion ... if this mygalomorph proves not to be an escapes or released theraphosid, Rick C. West *


Hi Rick,
          I'd doubt it's an escapee bcause they have more then one of them and there are reports of others being seen in the area.  I'd guess that they've seen a large mygale in the area and got a little over excited.

I doubt we'll hear anymore on it either. Thanks for clearing that up.

Cheers,
Steve


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## Rick_C_West

*Tarantulas Living in the Wilds of BC, Canada*

Well, the rumor plot thickens.  

Jacenbeers will not answer my posts and provide the information needed to check this 'story' out further and Jacenbeers wishes not be emailed through this forum.  

There is no 'Dr. Adler' at any of the only University and College in Kamloops ... I just spoke to both institutions.

There never has been any escaped and establish S. American scorpion species along the Thompson river.  The only scorpion found in south central BC is Vaejovis boreus.  

The only mygalomorph spider found in the Kamloops area is Antrodiaetus hageni ... and no where near 5" in leg span.

I do not understand why anyone would initiate such a rumor  thread then quietly disappear!

There is a very competent arachnologist in Kamloops if anyone
'really' wants to know what a local spider species is ... email me
and I will give you that contact.

I suspect, however, this will be the end of this 'story'. 

Rick C. West


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## Buspirone

I had done a search online for a Dr. Adler two days ago. I couldn't find one in reference to Kamloops but I did find one from virginia that did work in plant taxonomy.


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## RugbyDave

well, i don't think he's lying or anything.. or pulling a prank..

an honest mistake, YES!
a malicious rumour, no!

 I'm still interested to see a pic though!

 and i know a couple other members who don't want to be emailed off this forum either...

 But i still want to see some pics 

peace
dave


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## Kugellager

Rugbydave...believe us..its not beneath him to do something like this at all.

John
];')


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## Arachnopuppy

I'm with rugby.  I don't think Jacen did this on purpose.  Well, then of course everyone knows about me and...


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## RugbyDave

haha, damnit.. i feel so naive sometimes... But i still wouldn't jump to conclusions without hearing a response from him...

but thanks for being honest john (seriously!) 

wouldn't that totally ruin trust in him though?

peace
dave


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## Arachnopuppy

With regard to him not answering posts and emails, I'm not saying that I know for sure, but it is possible he's got his has tied somewhere.  

Hey rugby, about the trust thing that you said, it's kinda too late for that.  This excludes me, but I think many people already lost trust in Jacen a long time ago.  I, however, remain neutral about him.


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## Kugellager

Yes that would ruin trust in him...but one must always be suspect of incredible claims...incredible claims require incredible proof...there is always someone here that will follow through on amazing claims in some part and sniff out the fabrication...eventually.

John
];')


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## kellygirl

> _Originally posted by lam _
> *Here is my theory in the matter.  20 thousand years ago, people already had pets tarantula.  When a number of them decided to cross the Bering Strait, which was frozen due to the ice age, some brought the tarantulas with them.  How did the tarantulas survive the cold weather?  Basically, those nomads kept the tarantulas inside their coats.  You can pretty much guess the rest. *



=D =D =D =D 

That cracked me up.  

kellygirl


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## RugbyDave

well i wouldn't just blindly go into that crap with no proof. I stray away from the religion thing too on that matter. Not saying that its not true, but.... I'm not all scientific, and i do believe in things that I can't neccesarily see, but.... Hey.. i've got the cure for cancer.. i just can't tell you what it is or show you =D

some people have enough faith to believe anything! Me, i'd def. need to see the T, and talk to whoever found it, described it, and possibly published it.

so don't worry about me, i won't be the sheep in the T-hunt 
i'd be right up front like "come on guys.. let's get some T's"

man, that last thing _*really*_ needed my voice inflection to come out sounding right.. whatever 

later
dave


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## Steve Nunn

*Re: Tarantulas Living in the Wilds of BC, Canada*

Earth to Jacen..... come in Jacen.........is anyone in there???

I'm waiting to hear something like "No, I said Dr Stadler!", LMAO


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## Sean

Since jacen was exposed pretty much as a liar if he will ever post here again??Or will he comeback like 6 months down the line to see if everyone forgot..lol


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## Kugellager

He always returns...kind of like the cat you keep driving further and further away...it returns eventually.

John
];')


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## Buspirone

So basically he's a troll.


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## Sean

> _Originally posted by Kugellager _
> *He always returns...kind of like the cat you keep driving further and further away...it returns eventually.
> 
> John
> ];') *


LOL so hes made up bs storys like this before?? thats hilarious


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## kellygirl

Calm down, people.  He could be telling the truth to the best of his knowledge.  And maybe he has a life outside of this board and isn't able to check it every day like some of us!   Give him a chance to defend himself before you start blasting him.

kellygirl


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## RugbyDave

i agree, although it could be a fake, i still can't just jump to conclusions without hearing from him..

unless this is what he wanted us all to do.. 

joshing...

peace
dave


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## Steve Nunn

I found a new species of potato in my underpants.....I've called Dr Adler for his opinion, who thinks it may be some kind of giant Ukranian arboreal species....

Reactions: Funny 1


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## vulpina

I agree with Steve and Kugellager, if there were such a species we would need to see a picture of the alleged "tarantula".  As for this being a true story from Jacen, I would believe Steve and Rick WAY before I would believe Jacen.  I came on this forum too late to know what Jacen did before, but obviously alot of people have alot of anger toward him.  Kellygirl is right, maybe he does have a life outside this board, BUT... if I started a thread like this you could bet I would be keeping an eye on it.  Maybe he is one of the new members or is checking out the thread as a guest seeing what he stirred up.  I would believe that he fabricated this controversial thread on purpose, maybe he is starving for attention!!

Andy


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## Sean

> _Originally posted by vulpina _
> *I agree with Steve and Kugellager, if there were such a species we would need to see a picture of the alleged "tarantula".  As for this being a true story from Jacen, I would believe Steve and Rick WAY before I would believe Jacen.  I came on this forum too late to know what Jacen did before, but obviously alot of people have alot of anger toward him.  Kellygirl is right, maybe he does have a life outside this board, BUT... if I started a thread like this you could bet I would be keeping an eye on it.  Maybe he is one of the new members or is checking out the thread as a guest seeing what he stirred up.  I would believe that he fabricated this controversial thread on purpose, maybe he is starving for attention!!
> 
> Andy *


I agree with you, i wasnt here to see what he did before either, but peopel seem to be hostile sorta toward him...i do agree with kellygirl too maybe everyone should give him a chance before we all start bashing him


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## Henry Kane

Rick West,
 Thanks very much for the information as well as going out of your way to attempt to contact an apparent phantom. 
It's good to have the experts keeping an eye out. The idea of what was described did sound pretty far fetched but to the extent of my knowledge as just a hobbyist, it may still have been possible. (minus the old world description.) In fact, thanks a ton for all the work you've done in this field, you too Steve!   

See ya.

Atrax


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## RugbyDave

> _Originally posted by vulpina _
> *I agree with Steve and Kugellager, if there were such a species we would need to see a picture of the alleged "tarantula".Andy *



uhh, i think we all said that =D ....

We *all* want to see a pic of this! thats the whole thing man 

peace
dave


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## Vayu Son

*><*

steve,

ive heard reports of those around here too. Ive seen all sorts of potatoes, and my mom knows about as much as me, and she says its one, though I was unsure previously.

Lets get collecting and get rich!

-V


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## Kugellager

Vayu,  actually where you are it would be more profitable collecting mushrooms after a nice evening FL thunderstorm. 

John
];')


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## Vayu Son

*><*

I think you have perhaps uncovered the mystery behind these hallucinations.

-V


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## Immortal_sin

We don't have the 'eye' anymore, but we still have the attention grabbing, don't we?! 
Familiar, anyone?!


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## Arachnopuppy

> _Originally posted by Immortal_sin _
> *We don't have the 'eye' anymore, but we still have the attention grabbing, don't we?!
> Familiar, anyone?! *


Huh?


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## Kugellager

Ahhhhhhh! I see 

LOL

John
()=


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## Mojo Jojo

Why am I an Arachnoangel while Rick West is an Arachnopeon?  Something needs to be done!  

Jon

(Please don't take my halo away.)


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## Mendi

Maybe Scott could give him an honorary title like the "TV Spider Guy"?
... I agree *Arachnopeon* just isn't fitting for him, even though he posts rarely. I think it is great he post even rarely or comes to read how the rest of us arachnoholics are doing


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## RugbyDave

thank god i found this.... haha

so are we officially putting this to rest, or....
i need some closure here ;P

pce
dave


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## RugbyDave

also, rick doesn't post here much.. or.. at all really.
and, i can fully understand why. I think he's said why he hasn't, also....

so thats why he's just a lowly peon 

pce
dave


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## pelo

> _Originally posted by lam _
> *Here is my theory in the matter.  20 thousand years ago, people already had pets tarantula.  When a number of them decided to cross the Bering Strait, which was frozen due to the ice age, some brought the tarantulas with them.  How did the tarantulas survive the cold weather?  Basically, those nomads kept the tarantulas inside their coats.  You can pretty much guess the rest. *


>damn...coffee came out my out my nose from laughing....thanks Iam...lol....under their coats.... in their loin cloths...couple in their mukaluks.....too funny...I want some of what you been smokin'...lol..


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## Henry Kane

I noticed you're back. Cool. Last time you were here you completely left the entire board hanging by a thread (no pun intended) about what may have been a very important discovery in the arachnid world. 
Anyhow, since you're back now, I think we'd all be very grateful if you could disclose any information about the theraphosid sp. you say were recently discovered up there. 
What have Dr. Adler's studies revealed about them as of yet. I imagine there has been (or still is) some serious studying going on indeed. (People have tried to contact Dr. adler for any possible info but he's impossible to reach, it's as if he doesn't exist. He must really like to lay low, huh?) Are they truly lacking urticating setae like you first described?
I'm sure you understand what suspense we've been in after hearing there may be an undescribed therephosid as far north as Kamloops.

Please don't leave us in the dark any longer man, it's torture.

Atrax


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## Sean

> _Originally posted by Atrax _
> *I noticed you're back. Cool. Last time you were here you completely left the entire board hanging by a thread (no pun intended) about what may have been a very important discovery in the arachnid world.
> Anyhow, since you're back now, I think we'd all be very grateful if you could disclose any information about the theraphosid sp. you say were recently discovered up there.
> What have Dr. Adler's studies revealed about them as of yet. I imagine there has been (or still is) some serious studying going on indeed. (People have tried to contact Dr. adler for any possible info but he's impossible to reach, it's as if he doesn't exist. He must really like to lay low, huh?) Are they truly lacking urticating setae like you first described?
> I'm sure you understand what suspense we've been in after hearing there may be an undescribed therephosid as far north as Kamloops.
> 
> Please don't leave us in the dark any longer man, it's torture.
> 
> Atrax *


yes id be intrested in knowing 2


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## Henry Kane

Hi Sean. It is not my intention to scare anyone off by any means. I (and I'm sure many others) really would like to know as much about this breakthrough information as possible. Heck, if it were me who had discovered a new theraphosid, especially in a place where they are not even known to exist period, people would never get me to shut up about it. 

See ya.

Atrax


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## JacenBeers

I just called Dr Adler at UCC and he has informed me that he has named the species, Amenopus Adleri and that it does indeed lack urticating setae. The species also has very potent venom. Dr adler recently went searching in the same area and he has found numerous specimens of the same species. We now have multiple males and multiple femlaes. I will keep you posted about his breeding results.


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## Phillip

*any pics?...*

Surely this mysterious species has been photographed by now. At least I would hope so. When are we going to see pics?

Phil


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## Steve Nunn

> _Originally posted by JacenBeers _
> *I just called Dr Adler at UCC and he has informed me that he has named the species, Amenopus Adleri and that it does indeed lack urticating setae.  *


Umm, Jacen, _Amenopus_ isn't a theraphosid genus. It isn't a tarantula. _Amenopus_ isn't even a mygalomorph genus. And Adler(??) named the species after himself??

Go hide again till you can come up with better stories Jacen, this one is old and boring to be frank. I was hoping you'd come back with new stories, I'm kinda let down.


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## Felkon

Why does JacenBeers's posts scream 'gullibility' ...?  ?

Seriously though, I thought this Adler guy didn't exist. If you are making this stuff up for kicks, that's pretty cruel.


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## JacenBeers

Cameras havent ben invented in Canada Yet


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## Lopez

It is not common practice to name a species after yourself.
Generally, the scientific name will be taken from a particular feature of the spider (Ephebopus cyanognathus, Brachypelma albopilosum) or after a noted taxonomist, explorer, or arachnologist (Haplopelma schmidti, Ceratogyrus marshalli)

Why bother making half-assed crap up? I don't see the point :? 

Don't forget, storytellers, there are some extremely knowledgeable members of this forum who won't hesitate to tear your tale to shreds


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## Mister Internet

I just did a search on Google for the term "Amenopus" and came up with exactly one hit that has nothing to do with any of this, as far as I can tell...

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=Amenopus

Is this even a real arachnid genus?


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## Kugellager

Is that Turkish? No wait...the addy ends with an 'nu' what country is that?...norway?

John
];')


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## Immortal_sin

> _Originally posted by Lopez _
> *)
> 
> Why bother making half-assed crap up? I don't see the point :?
> 
> Don't forget, storytellers, there are some extremely knowledgeable members of this forum who won't hesitate to tear your tale to shreds  *


because that's what he does.....that's ALL he does!

(blatently stolen line from Terminator)

Everyone should know by now there are certain people on the board that you have to completely discount pretty much everything they post. Only problem is, sometimes the people that haven't been here that long don't know which ones they are!


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## RugbyDave

thats hungarian. If you study languages or linguistics, you can tell right away by the front vowels with double accents and the accented high vowels with umlauted short vowels within the same word. There's only one language that can have one word containing a double accent, an umlaut, and an accent, with 2 front vowels and 1 back vowel  The big kicker, though, was the double accent over a vowel. Thats VERY indicative of a Central European Uralic language..... and Hungarian?? Man, that languge kicks my butt. *If you don't study languages or linguistics*, now you can confidently describe the defining features of a european uralic language! I don't know what that'll bring you in life, but.. um.. maybe it'll be on jeopardy one day 

also *noted* as one of themost difficult languages to learn based on the amount of conjugation a verb can go through (there's more than 20 different cases a verb could be translated in, combined 2 different forms of a plural, 4 different class systems, 14-15 vowels, 4 different tenses,  3 posessor cases, 15 different suffixes that have to be conjugated based on the OBJECT of the sentence, unlike english... after all that, its commonly noted by linguists (in pretty much any paper you read on hungarian or magyar) that there are about *55,000* different ways to conjugate 1 freaking verb.). Although, based on a new way the language is shifting, some people are saying there's over a million ways to conjugate... i'll stick with 55,000 which is still an amazingly large number.


and norway is .no.
Hey at least you can learn something out of this post instead of reading people yelling about jacen... either one is entertaining for me, i'll admit... =D


pce
dave


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## Maggie

We have all heard the story of "crying wolf"....thats what this reminds me of. Just my opinion.


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## nemesis6sic6

*yes*

It does remaind me of the crying wolf because there was this guy that cried out tarantula when it was "wolf" spider. 
any ways have anice day
geo


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## belewfripp

I was going to stay out of this thread, but I had to point something out.  You'll notice that the morphological features he says were used to identify this spider as a theraphosid are the exact same basic features Sam Marshall points out in his book.  Marshall of course is a professional arachnologist, and listed those three as a basic list for the novice -- not as criteria to be used for doing taxonomic analysis.  Either some folks no one can find any trace of are doing a very poor job of researching an animal most likely already known to science or someone is making stuff up out of thin air and doing a lousy job of it.

Adrian


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## RugbyDave

> _Originally posted by Sean _
> *LOL....harsh this thread will be closed soon im guessing *


im not sure how it lasted this long.. praise to jacen for that i suppose...

i mean, its now turning sour -- and linguistics? What fool posted that junk? 

im not sure..i mean, there's always a chance that its true. who can say at this point, ya know. We can say its probably fake, but theres the _possibility_ its real.

peace
dave


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## Sean

> _Originally posted by RugbyDave _
> *im not sure how it lasted this long.. praise to jacen for that i suppose...
> 
> i mean, its now turning sour -- and linguistics? What fool posted that crap?
> 
> im not sure..i mean, there's always a chance that its true. who can say at this point, ya know. We can say its probably fake, but theres the possibility its real.
> 
> peace
> dave *


Dave i agree there is a possibility but i think ur a bit more gulible then me though;P


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## Valael

I think Rick West put the nail in the coffin a couple months ago when he tried to contact this false person.


Not to mention Steve's (And Rick's) knowledge on the subject.




Jacen has proven himself to be a troll in the past.  This thread is the same.


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## WYSIWYG

> _Originally posted by Steve Nunn _
> *I found a new species of potato in my underpants.....I've called Dr Adler for his opinion, who thinks it may be some kind of giant Ukranian arboreal species.... *



Hmmm......

That would give a whole new meaning to Mr. Potatohead, wouldn't it!?!?  =D =D  =D 

As far as critters not being able to survive winter snows and such, I'm reminded of the Aphonopelma behlei which occurs in the colder parts of Arizona.  I see no reason why a tarantula couldn't survive in Canada though having no urticating hairs really seems like a bit of a joke to me.  Someone's probably pulling people's legs for his own entertainment.   Only time will tell.  

Wysi


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## WYSIWYG

> _Originally posted by Mendi _
> *Maybe Scott could give him an honorary title like the "TV Spider Guy"?
> ... I agree Arachnopeon just isn't fitting for him, even though he posts rarely. I think it is great he post even rarely or comes to read how the rest of us arachnoholics are doing *


Yeah, I remember looking at his first post thinking, Rick West and Arachnopeon don't really belong in the same sentence.  (Ok, so I managed to put them in the same sentence, but the point is...they really don't go together).  


Wysi


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## Valael

> _Originally posted by WYSIWYG _
> *That would give a whole new meaning to Mr. Potatohead, wouldn't it!?!?  =D =D  =D
> *



After reading that, I wish I could gouge my eyes out of my head.


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## Phillip

*oh come now Jacen......*

No cameras huh?   It's not as if I didn't already know this was pure BS from the 1st time you mentioned it but I would expect a liar of your skills to be able to come up with something better than no cameras.   lol

The amazing part is that you actually have the cojones to not only reappear after being busted but to even continue on with the same lie.     You are truly one of a kind.

Phil


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## Sean

*Re: oh come now Jacen......*



> _Originally posted by Phillip _
> *No cameras huh?   It's not as if I didn't already know this was pure BS from the 1st time you mentioned it but I would expect a liar of your skills to be able to come up with something better than no cameras.   lol
> 
> The amazing part is that you actually have the cojones to not only reappear after being busted but to even continue on with the same lie.     You are truly one of a kind.
> 
> Phil *


lol, man couldnt of said it better myself


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## vulpina

This thread has been very entertaining to say the least.  And I am very surprised that Jacen returned to continue on with this fallacy.  I have been on these boards a while but obviously missed whatever it was that Jacen did before, could someone be so kind as to point me to a thread where this sort of thing happened before, I'm sure it will also be an interesting read.

Thanks,
   Andy


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## Code Monkey

> _Originally posted by vulpina _
> *Tcould someone be so kind as to point me to a thread where this sort of thing happened before, I'm sure it will also be an interesting read.*


That could be kind of hard. Remember how I said many of the rules on this board were inspired by Jacen? Well, that's why we can no longer delete entire threads started by us - he would start hot threads, stir up a bunch of crap, and as soon as it was no longer fun for him delete the whole thing.

(The no multiple accounts per person is another one).


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## vulpina

Thanks for the help CM, I just wanted to see what else he has done.

Andy


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## Mister Internet

Keep it civil please....  I don't want to have to lock this, cuz then we'll never get an "answer"...


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## Weapon-X

*re*



> _Originally posted by JacenBeers _
> *I just called Dr Adler at UCC and he has informed me that he has named the species, Amenopus Adleri and that it does indeed lack urticating setae. The species also has very potent venom. Dr adler recently went searching in the same area and he has found numerous specimens of the same species. We now have multiple males and multiple femlaes. I will keep you posted about his breeding results. *


what a waste of space and time. BTW, i've discovered a new haplopelma species that burrows in snowbanks, and thrives on drunk yoopers and canadians


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## Sean

see u guys scared him off again, he comes back for 3 days and posts like 25 times now he nowhere to be found, hilarious i dont think we will ever get an answer


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## SpiderFood

I believe if I was gonna make something like this an issue of discussion I would get my "facts" straight beforehand. I would at least do some research and TRY to make it sound legit. Man, I wish we werent all such idiots. We might not fall for this kinda stuff. And Steve Nunn, clearly Jacenbeers is more of an authority than you, he said that the speciman had two pairs of book lungs, oh and dont forget that Dr. Adler knows what HE is talking about. JK Steve. lol.

dale


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## kellygirl

> _Originally posted by JacenBeers _
> *Cameras havent ben invented in Canada Yet *


Just to save Mister Internet the trouble, I will clear this one up.  No need to thank me, Tom--I gotcha covered!  You may not have caught this one, being so busy with your moderating duties and all, but when I read it, I was skeptical.  I did my research and this is in fact an Urban Legend.  There are indeed cameras in Canada, although I don't believe they were actually "invented" there.  There are even several pictures in the Watering Hole as well as this forum and Jacen's avatar itself that testify to the fact that there is at least 1 camera in Canada and he's got it!  Almost got us there, man!  You big jokester!

And on another note... has anyone taken a good look at the number of views this thread has gotten?  If Jacen did create this story for the sole purpose of getting attention, he did a pretty darn good job.  I mean, he got RICK WEST to post and when is the last time you saw him post around here?  Um, never.  That's not to say that I condone fairytales for the sake of duping people... but the game continues because we take the bait every time.

kellygirl

Edit: typos


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## JacenBeers

You summed it up completely Kelly. THank you for getting it.


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## defour

> _Originally posted by JacenBeers _
> *You summed it up completely Kelly. THank you for getting it. *


Didn't Ted Bundy say that once?  Funny guy, Ted.  Habitual nosepicker, but funny. 

Steve


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## RugbyDave

thats been said a few times in this thread already, though.. (not the Ted Bundy stuff, the "baiting" stuff) 

so go figure.

in it,
 dave


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## Henry Kane

> _Originally posted by kellygirl _
> *  That's not to say that I condone fairytales for the sake of duping people... but the game continues because we take the bait every time.
> 
> kellygirl
> 
> Edit: typos *


Actually, wouldn't it have been Jacen who took the bait this time? 

Maybe having a popularity contest in the watering hole might not be so bad. Creating false information in a forum designed for sharing/learning FACTUAL information is wrong. Also, just the fact that Jacen is lying in on-line invert forum purely for the sake of attention paints a very sad picture of his life and personality. Especially since all the attention he's getting is in a negative light (ie Liar, bull$hitter, desperate for attention, etc..) Any moron can get attention, it's not like it's an artform ot anything. Act like an ass, you'll get attention...everybody will say "Look at that dumbass!" as is the case here. Too bad Jacen lacks the intellect to get any kind of positive attention for actually knowing ANYTHING about inverts. 

Well, even though this forum is here for us to share information and help each other learn, it's just like my folks told me long ago..."There's an A-hole in ever crowd." and once again, they were right. At least this time it was easy to spot him out.

Atrax


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## vulpina

My question Jacen is why would you make up such stories?  This is a serious board about people wanting to learn more about the hobby of keeping tarantulas.  I f we wanted to read such a fallacy we could grab a copy of the National Enquirer or the Star.  It just shows a major lack of maturity on your behalf.  Is it attention you are seeking?  Is it that bad in Kamloops that you must do things like this?  I don't know what you did before but obviously you have not the brains to learn from previous endeavours in the field of lying.  My opinion and only my opinion, you should think really hard about things before doing this sort of thing again.  And what's with the dis on Atrax, why didn't you just say "I'm rubber you're glue..." would've been just as mature.  Let's just put an end to this asinine behavior once and for all.


Andy


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## Mister Internet

Well, it feels to me like this thread has run its course... those of you who truly feel the need to continue taking jabs at Jacen, feel free to do so in PMs.  Those of you who actually are interested in whether or not there is any factual basis or additional information regarding this topic, I have the feeling that a full planetary alignment is more likely.

Jacen, I must say that by you agreeing that Kelly explained it well by saying that you're just baiting us to get a response.... well, that's just sad.  I can't possibly fathom having the necessary free time to sit around and come up with stuff like this.  I don't know whether to feel sorry for you or laugh at you.  Neither would give me much pleasure at this point.  If, by some cosmic providence, there happens to actually BE any fact behind all this, please let me know and I will unlock this thread so you can post it.  As it stands, however, I have a feeling that there will never be anything more forthcoming about this, and I'm sorry you felt the need to display such juvenile antics in a serious forum.

There are forums out there that exist purely for members to post useless crap and get it out of their system... you know one of them quite well.  I suggest you visit there and get it out of your system before posting here again.

Reactions: Like 2


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