# Dog breeders in nj?--- Help please.



## SandDeku (May 2, 2011)

Hello guys. After trying to use petfinder and the shelters. When we find the dog we want(mainly my mom wants), we call the next day to find it got adopted. This happened several times already. We're pretty tired of going through that process. Plus the whole housing procedures they do is kinda a drag. It's way too annoying to go through that process just to find out someone else got to it first.

So I'm saying screw shelters and now Iam going to the next step of finding a suitable dog. Breeders. My mom wants something she finds cute. But I want something I can "bond" with and easily train-able. She likes frufru looking dogs if that makes sense. Think of cockapoos. Maltipoos. Anything that looks adorable like a button. She's not a fan of chihuahuas(I actually am--- she's very hard to deal with when it comes to this especially since chihuahuas are easy to find even for adoption.) I like bully breeds. Especially english bulldogs. But only thing she will "accept" is a frenchie. So idk if you guys know any french bulldog breeders. As well as a cockapoo/maltipoo breeders.

She doesn't like:
Dauchshounds
Chihuahuas
Almost all bulldogs
Pitbulls(terrified)
Rottweilers
Anything that's large. She prefers something fluffy. But not like a carpet. Like she doesn't like the look of a lhasa apso(neither do I), or the look of a peckagnese, etc. She likes yorkies(but we decided we're not getting into them since I dislike them).

She's very very very picky. which makes it harder finding a dog. I just want a god dang dog. I have experience with dogs since I used to take in strays and rehome them back in puertorico--- I don't do this now since there's no strays where I live--- obv. She wants something small/medium sized. Not too small but not too large. :S

I myself just don't want anything that's overly excited at night time hours. anything that's a hunting breed or may torment my rabbit.


So does anyone know of breeders in nj? I live in flanders, nj.

Sorry for the long post. Hope you guys understand.


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## pitbulllady (May 3, 2011)

To be honest, MOST breeds of dogs are going to have some degree of territorialality and aggression if not properly trained and socialized, especially.  There is no "perfect" dog.  I have a friend who breeds French Bulldogs, and they are tough little dogs; in fact, personality-wise, they remind me a LOT of small APBT's, so if your mom doesn't like "pit bulls", she won't like a Frenchie, either.  Most of the medium-sized breeds I know of are either going to have that high prey drive, which means they're likely to go after YOUR pets, or will be high energy and require a lot of training, or will be naturally territorial.  Your best bet would probably be an adult mix of some Retriever breed, which has already been socialized around small animals, and I'd suggest Craigs List rather than a shelter, unless your shelter will "test" animals like ours does to see if they're compatible with rabbits, cats, etc.

pitbulllady


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## SandDeku (May 3, 2011)

pitbulllady said:


> To be honest, MOST breeds of dogs are going to have some degree of territorialality and aggression if not properly trained and socialized, especially.  There is no "perfect" dog.  I have a friend who breeds French Bulldogs, and they are tough little dogs; in fact, personality-wise, they remind me a LOT of small APBT's, so if your mom doesn't like "pit bulls", she won't like a Frenchie, either.  Most of the medium-sized breeds I know of are either going to have that high prey drive, which means they're likely to go after YOUR pets, or will be high energy and require a lot of training, or will be naturally territorial.  Your best bet would probably be an adult mix of some Retriever breed, which has already been socialized around small animals, and I'd suggest Craigs List rather than a shelter, unless your shelter will "test" animals like ours does to see if they're compatible with rabbits, cats, etc.
> 
> pitbulllady


Hmm and smaller dogs?


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## RoachGirlRen (May 4, 2011)

> As well as a cockapoo/maltipoo breeders


All of these -poo and other cutesy named "designer" dogs are not breeds, they are mutts. I wouldn't go near one of the so-called "breeders" that produces these, because the sole reason these cutesy named crosses exist is to turn a quick buck (and before anyone whines, I realize that in Australia there is a reason they're producing Labradoodles. I'm talking about the typical person on craigslist selling his F2 MUTT). Sure, they might raise their dogs humanely and care for them, but it's highly unlikely that the dogs have had any sort of genetic testing or the other responsible breeding measures that well bred purebreds are subject to. And contrary to popular belief, mixing breeds DOES NOT automatically result in a healthier dog. If you breed two poorly bred purebreds, you'll probably wind up with a mutt with the same issues, especially for common conditions that transcend breeds like any number of joint and skin issues. 

What's more, most of them are not more than a few generations mixed, many just plain mixes of two purebreds, so there is rarely consistency in what you get in terms of looks, temperament, grooming needs, etc. There is a world of difference between the behavior, grooming, adult size, etc. of some of these breeds, and you have no idea what you'll be getting in the puppy. I can tell you that NO responsible breeder of dogs deliberately creates MUTTS. The whole point of dog breeding is to produce breeds with consistent traits in appearence, temperament, quality, etc. 

If she wants a small dog, and is too impatient for shelters (have you guys gone in person or just used petfinder?), find a responsible breeder of a _breed_ of dog. While I don't like a few things about the AKC, they do have some very good breeders IF you know what you're looking for; use their website to locate one. Seek someone whose dogs are registered and preferably titled, who has lineages that go back several generations, who does health testing, who is a member of a breed organization, who demonstrates a wealth of knowledge on the breed and is enthusiastic to share that knowledge so that you have a good match, etc. This should be someone who LOVES the breed passionately, not someone who just happened to have two unfixed dogs and figured "eh, why not?"

Basically, when it comes to deliberately bred dogs: do it right or not at all. And if she is going by "cute!" make sure she READS UP on each breed she considers at length first; if she has unrealistic expectations about some cute little fuzzball she buys being the perfect dog, she will wind up with a dog that has behavioral issues, and it will probably become one of _many_ purebred dogs in shelters. 


Personally, I believe PBL is on the money on this one though; get an adult mixed breed dog that you can determine your compatability with & how well it works for your household. Your mom could look into a private individual trying to rehome their dog if you find shelters involve jumping through too many hoops. While you have to be leery of people trying to dump dogs with bad temperaments or health conditions, there are a TON of dogs out there that people are getting rid of simply due to changes in their life (finances, moving, new baby, etc.). The benefit of these dogs is that they are usually adults with defined temperaments - so you know what you are getting. And the original owner, if the love the dog, will probably let you visit a few times to ensure compatability. 

The other reason I suggest this is that it really does come down to the individual dog. Breed has a lot of influence in what you can expect to get, but it isn't the be-all, end-all either. I have a dog right now who is a beagle/chow mix. If I saw a breed of that mix at a shelter, I would probably walk past it without a second glance to be totally honest, based on some of the personality/behavioral pitfalls of each breed. _She is the gentlest, most obedient, calmest, best behaved dog I have._ One huge benefit of meeting adult dogs before adopting is that you know what you're getting, not what you're hoping to get based on the breed.


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## apopli (May 4, 2011)

A vast majority of the purebred dogs I've trained professionally are dogs people got because they wanted a big dog, or a non shedding dog, or a cute dog, and they get a dog with the awesome look they wanted, and end up with a breed they're completely incompatible with. The apartment dwellers who were gone a total of 11 hours a day most days who got a border collie come to mind. Or the soft spoken, quiet couple who thought a bulldog would arrive as a gentle couch potato who wouldn't require discipline or leadership.

Most important thing to determine is your lifestyle and expectations of the dog, then center around breeds that fit into that, rather than simply looking for an image. There are a lot of dog breed selection quizzes that can start pointing you in the right direction like *this one* or *this one*. They're all over the net. I wouldn't take something like that for gospel, but they can help start narrowing the search.

There are flukes. One guy I worked with had a German Shorthaired Pointer, and if this dog were any more laid back he'd be dead. Dragged his feet on walks, enjoyed spending his days laying in the sun, or cuddled on the couch. Had maybe 1 or 2 good bursts of energy tearing around the yard for a couple minutes and he was good all day, absolutely no prey drive. But that's not the norm, and you can't count on finding that one hunting dog that won't hunt, so you really need to know what you (or your mother) are looking for.

The akc website has a lot of good resources *here* on registered breeders, online classifieds, and the website has a lot of info on breeds of dogs recognized as well.

And, as stated, there's a lot to be said for the "what you see is what you get" aspect of adopting an adult dog from a rescue/shelter. It can be frustrating dealing with websites and listings that are out of date, but if you can get a better idea of what your mother is looking for in a dog (temperament/activity level first, then looks) you can also try breed specific rescues, they often do a little more to match the dogs to the owners.


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## pitbulllady (May 4, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> Hmm and smaller dogs?


The most prey-driven dogs I've ever had were Chinese Cresteds.  Those little dogs were no joke when it came to killing things; in fact, THAT was why I quit breeding them!  They would actually injure themselves trying to get to my snakes, even though they'd been raised in the house around snakes from day one, and if they saw an animal outside, they were like four-legged bullets fired from a gun.  You absolutely could NOT stop them from going after it and killing it if it was their size or smaller.  Many Toy breeds started out as ratters and other vermin killers, and that instinct to chase and kill other animals is still very strong in many.  Small breeds like Lhasa Apsos, Shih Tzus, Cockers and Chihuahuas also lead bite statistics in many cities and have been responsible for some really severe bites.  It's not because they're naturally aggressive, but because people who get them often fail to properly train them and treat them as though they were human, which they're not.  That results in a spoiled, dominant-aggressive dog.  As RoachGirlRen said, many times people get dogs like this and have unrealistic expectations of dog behavior, which results in BAD behavior on the part of the dog.  One of the biggest causes of those unrealistic expectations is stereotyping of breed behavior, i.e. assuming that "Breed A" is inherently vicious, and "Breed B" is inherently nice and sweet by default.  It's been my own personal experience that 75% of a dog's behavior, insofar as aggression towards people goes, is due to training and socialization and its place in its "pack", NOT its breed.  You can control the natural territorial aggression and dog aggression in most dogs IF you are an experienced "dog person", but if you're afraid of certain kinds of dogs simply because of negative media publicity, this shows that you're already insecure and lack knowledge where dogs are concerned, so there's not going to be any dog, really, that likely won't be a problem down the line.

pitbulllady


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## Pssh (May 6, 2011)

I do not support the purchasing of dogs (especially when you do not research the breeder/kennel.) I have found nothing but the best of dogs from my local spca. My aunt takes in stray dogs and with proper training, exercise, and care there has not been a single dog that she could not find a home for almost immediately.

Dont expect the "perfect" dog. If you want a dog that lives up to your expectations, get an adult dog with an established personality and be prepared to care for it and train it properly. That means walks every day, high quality food, exercise, stimulation, etc. Of course the amount of work you have to put into it will depend on the individual dog. (My dog gets fat if we miss more than two or three walks for example. She is always on a diet as she likes to find people food. That means that every member of the family has to remember to take proper precautions regarding food.) A dog is work. Fun just comes with the effort.


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## SandDeku (May 6, 2011)

RoachGirlRen said:


> All of these -poo and other cutesy named "designer" dogs are not breeds, they are mutts. I wouldn't go near one of the so-called "breeders" that produces these, because the sole reason these cutesy named crosses exist is to turn a quick buck (and before anyone whines, I realize that in Australia there is a reason they're producing Labradoodles. I'm talking about the typical person on craigslist selling his F2 MUTT). Sure, they might raise their dogs humanely and care for them, but it's highly unlikely that the dogs have had any sort of genetic testing or the other responsible breeding measures that well bred purebreds are subject to. And contrary to popular belief, mixing breeds DOES NOT automatically result in a healthier dog. If you breed two poorly bred purebreds, you'll probably wind up with a mutt with the same issues, especially for common conditions that transcend breeds like any number of joint and skin issues.
> 
> What's more, most of them are not more than a few generations mixed, many just plain mixes of two purebreds, so there is rarely consistency in what you get in terms of looks, temperament, grooming needs, etc. There is a world of difference between the behavior, grooming, adult size, etc. of some of these breeds, and you have no idea what you'll be getting in the puppy. I can tell you that NO responsible breeder of dogs deliberately creates MUTTS. The whole point of dog breeding is to produce breeds with consistent traits in appearence, temperament, quality, etc.
> 
> ...


I understand. I guess my mother is too hard headed in a sense. Personally I like jack russels(cute and hyper is good enough for me--- idc how obnoxious it is to others. To me--- myself is a  type of breed I'd like.), german shepherds (majestic dog with a calm and docile temperament. Good as a walking partner and possible pluses are possible body guard should a stranger go by--- the most will happen is the dog will bark and the stranger will leave. lol). There's pitbulls(gentle giants, not really what people make them seem to be--- plus those eyes. So cute. I honestly have alot of respect for them. I looked them in the eye before. Nothing happens. It's bs when people say they go crazy). There's also bulldogs, chihuahuas, wired hair fox terrier, airdale terrier, mini pincher, chow chows(Huge teddy bears, though I keep getting told they are nasty and ferocious and is too hard to train--etc). 

I'm selective about dogs. But not too much. I just don't like the retrievers, collies, etc. Those annoy the living crap out of me soo badly. My neighbors one won't shut the heck up everytime I go into MY own god dang yard. It's MY yard. I shouldn't have to deal with that barking. :c

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apopli said:


> A vast majority of the purebred dogs I've trained professionally are dogs people got because they wanted a big dog, or a non shedding dog, or a cute dog, and they get a dog with the awesome look they wanted, and end up with a breed they're completely incompatible with. The apartment dwellers who were gone a total of 11 hours a day most days who got a border collie come to mind. Or the soft spoken, quiet couple who thought a bulldog would arrive as a gentle couch potato who wouldn't require discipline or leadership.
> 
> Most important thing to determine is your lifestyle and expectations of the dog, then center around breeds that fit into that, rather than simply looking for an image. There are a lot of dog breed selection quizzes that can start pointing you in the right direction like *this one* or *this one*. They're all over the net. I wouldn't take something like that for gospel, but they can help start narrowing the search.
> 
> ...


My life style is: 

--- Normally lazy, yet I do like to go outside here and there. When I do end up going outside I go for very very long walks(I like to explore). But I don't do that too often. and when I do. I'm ussually just herping.
---I'm hyper, but easily irritable. I do like to give attention but not soo much that every single second is spent on JUST that. 
---I like taking them for walks. But I also like small breeds because they fit in my backpack(hole open--- long story don't ask. I did this with my rabbit. She liked it. but Im not sure a dog will. lolol)
---I have bad sleep patterns and when I sleep and I get abruptly woken up I tend to get aggressive(that's my only aggression. ). Meaning no night time barking!!
---I guess ill play with the dog. But would rather have it sit with me watching tv. Or such. lol.

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Pssh said:


> I do not support the purchasing of dogs (especially when you do not research the breeder/kennel.) I have found nothing but the best of dogs from my local spca. My aunt takes in stray dogs and with proper training, exercise, and care there has not been a single dog that she could not find a home for almost immediately.
> 
> Dont expect the "perfect" dog. If you want a dog that lives up to your expectations, get an adult dog with an established personality and be prepared to care for it and train it properly. That means walks every day, high quality food, exercise, stimulation, etc. Of course the amount of work you have to put into it will depend on the individual dog. (My dog gets fat if we miss more than two or three walks for example. She is always on a diet as she likes to find people food. That means that every member of the family has to remember to take proper precautions regarding food.) A dog is work. Fun just comes with the effort.


Well a dog obv. is work. Some are less work than others.  Like a small CALM dog is less of a pain than a super hyper and large dog that can be out for hours daily and needs tons of excersice. 

I'm a couch potato. I rather take it for a walk but not more than an hour if anything. my other family m embers will take it for a walk but yeah. Lol maybe I should get a treadmill and get the dog to walk in the treadmill. XDDD lolol(joke). 

I get the whole shelter thing. But not every shelter is the best. Some shelters are actually bad. Not all breeders are bad either. That means by knowing the parent's lineage you can tell what your dog ---MOST LIKELY--- will end up being.


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## pitbulllady (May 6, 2011)

"Gentle giant" isn't a term I'd apply to a real American Pit Bull Terrier.  The breed standard calls for a dog that weighs between 35-60 pounds and stands 18 1/2 inches at the shoulder.  If you get out a yardstick, you will see that's NOT a big dog.  This is one of the reasons why so many hate/fear "pit bulls", that assumption that they are these huge monsters.  There are many, many dogs out there that are being called "pit bulls"(which is NOT a breed, by the way), which have absolutely no APBT genes in them at all, or very little, which have been deliberately bred to be aggressive and territorial.  I'm 5' 2", and I can pick up a fully-grown real American Pit Bull Terrier.  

The problem here is that dogs your mother would like are going to be dogs that are likely to be problematic for YOU, since you keep a small mammal pet.  What I'd suggest is to check with breeders in  your state and see if any have adult dogs, perhaps retired show dogs/breeders, that have been socialized and are used to small animals.  Obviously, Sporting, Hound and Terrier breeds are going to have the highest prey drives, as are primitive breeds like Huskies.  That doesnt' leave many breeds, and most of the dogs that do best with small animals are livestock guarding dogs that are usually really BIG.  Retriever breeds usually do well with small animals IF they are raised with them, but again, they are large dogs, with the exception of the fairly rare Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retriever, a medium-sized dog that will probably be pretty expensive.  I agree with you that not all shelters are good, but the only way to know is to actually visit them.  You can also check with breed rescuers in your area; a lot of breed rescues have a national "network" of people which can help get a particular dog to you if it's in a different part of the country, so you're not limited to a dog from NJ, necessarily.  Most "test" dogs to determine their compatibility with other animals, too.

pitbulllady


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## SandDeku (May 7, 2011)

pitbulllady said:


> "Gentle giant" isn't a term I'd apply to a real American Pit Bull Terrier.  The breed standard calls for a dog that weighs between 35-60 pounds and stands 18 1/2 inches at the shoulder.  If you get out a yardstick, you will see that's NOT a big dog.  This is one of the reasons why so many hate/fear "pit bulls", that assumption that they are these huge monsters.  There are many, many dogs out there that are being called "pit bulls"(which is NOT a breed, by the way), which have absolutely no APBT genes in them at all, or very little, which have been deliberately bred to be aggressive and territorial.  I'm 5' 2", and I can pick up a fully-grown real American Pit Bull Terrier.
> 
> The problem here is that dogs your mother would like are going to be dogs that are likely to be problematic for YOU, since you keep a small mammal pet.  What I'd suggest is to check with breeders in  your state and see if any have adult dogs, perhaps retired show dogs/breeders, that have been socialized and are used to small animals.  Obviously, Sporting, Hound and Terrier breeds are going to have the highest prey drives, as are primitive breeds like Huskies.  That doesnt' leave many breeds, and most of the dogs that do best with small animals are livestock guarding dogs that are usually really BIG.  Retriever breeds usually do well with small animals IF they are raised with them, but again, they are large dogs, with the exception of the fairly rare Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retriever, a medium-sized dog that will probably be pretty expensive.  I agree with you that not all shelters are good, but the only way to know is to actually visit them.  You can also check with breed rescuers in your area; a lot of breed rescues have a national "network" of people which can help get a particular dog to you if it's in a different part of the country, so you're not limited to a dog from NJ, necessarily.  Most "test" dogs to determine their compatibility with other animals, too.
> 
> pitbulllady


I understand what you mean. But to our family we only have kept small dogs. So of course a pitbull will appear to be a "large" dog. Especially to my mother. The dogs I seen called "pitbulls" were actual pitbulls. Paperwork and everything according to my sibling.

Anywho--- my mother got her dog. She's well happy--- I myself am not pleased. The dog is an indoor dog which is fine. I like indoor dogs. In fact I want one of my own. But. I rather have a dog that can rough it out everyonce in a while. Not alone---god no that's horrible to do. But like say if I wanna go hiking. I wanna be able to take it with me--- mind you I don't hike often and what I call "hiking" is just a stroll around the woods. 

Now I came to an agreement with my parents and they will let me keep my OWN dog as long as I can pay for it and care for it on my own--- with little assistance of theirs. As well as we came to an agreement that since Iam going to be working soon to start off ill help my mom with her dog as much as I can and when I can when I work. But when my dog comes in months later that she will help out with mine whenever it's necessary. 


Now I'm looking for a low energy dog because that would mean that all it would require before I go to work is a stroll along the block and let it poop outside and change the food and water and give it toys to play as well as let it play with the other dog(its a cockapoo they got it either way-- its a pup. my dad said they got papers for the parents who were a cocker spaniel and a poodle and that both are akc or something--- not my dog, not my prob. thats what they told me and got it anyways). Well what Iam hoping is that the dog is a good loyal companion that I can relax with. I'm extremely emotionally sensitive and a calm dog, that is loyal, friendly, and obedient is good for me. Sure dogs have their flaws. Like health issues. But atleast I can work with that. Ummm. Any bully dog owners out there? 


I'd like to know their experiences on these. I'm thinking of an english bulldog. 

I took a personality match up quiz. Like someone on here told me to. It pointed me to a bulldog. lol. I'm not a fan of the slobber--- but I can deal with it. I guess ill get a hanky for it. XDDD 

I'd like to know good bull dog breeders in new jersey. I rather opt. for a breeder because since I rather have something that is certified. I wont mind if its slightly different but yeah. I also like it if its a good travel companion. Idk what my actual career will be. But i'd like something that can cope with land travel. Not air. I'm talking about cars and such. 

Idk if that's my only option as a dog. But Iam quite fond of bully dogs. I'd like a smaller dog right now because--- well my parents will have a better time dealing with that should I need them to take the dog for a walk while Iam at work. A big dog--- very strong pull. I'm not planning on rushing into it. I rather get a number of a good certified veterinarian first. Which I maybe the vet if I end up studying to be one.  But for now I guess Id like to know if anyone on here knows good dog vets that charge fairly(price isn't that bad as long as say there's two vets, with equal equipment, knowledge, experience, etc. But one is charging more than the other-- obv. ill go for the one charging less. or the one more convenient to drive to).

I like english bulldogs, french bulldogs, chihuahuas, mini pinscher, boston terrier. Though I want something mellow, small and allergy friendly( i dont have bad allergies-- but just in case), and with a low prey drive. 

My rabbit will be living in with me in the basement so theres no worry of the other dog. But my dog I wanna make sure I can be away without the dog harrassing the crud out of my bunny. She's very calm and shy bunny so she doesn't need that stress. Maybe I can keep them hidden from each other through a wooden fence style thing. Like the rabbit will be in the cage but the dog won't be able to see the rabbit you know? 
I also wanna be able to let the dog wander around without tearing up my stuff. I guess ill "doggy" proof it. By putting all cords through a pvc pipe to prevent them from getting electrocuted.  And put a child pen on all the areas I want them to stay away from. But still have his room and space and be able to do what he wants or she wants. As well as if he wants playtime with the other dog that'd be fine. 

her dog seems to be subdominant. kinda shy. 


Any opinions on this? I strongly feel that an english bulldog would be the best route for me to go.


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## Pssh (May 7, 2011)

Pure breds are much more likely to have health issues. English bull dogs have a TON of possible problems that you may have to deal with (very expensive.)

You will not be able to find what you are looking for in a small puppy. An adult dog is the only way you will get the personality you want. 

I feel very strongly that you should look into adoption rather than a breeder. They do have breed specific shelters you know. We have a few sled dog and pyranese shelters around here for example.


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## jt39565 (May 7, 2011)

An english bulldog is NOT a hiking dog! Not even a stroll through the woods. Get a cat and be happy.


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## Formerphobe (May 7, 2011)

> I like english bulldogs, french bulldogs, chihuahuas, mini pinscher, boston terrier. Though I want something mellow, small and allergy friendly( i dont have bad allergies-- but just in case), and with a low prey drive.


You might find individuals of the above breeds that are mellow, probably more the Eng Bull than any of the others. NONE of the above are allergy friendly.  Allergy friendly breeds include: Poodle, Shih Tzu, Havanese, Bichon Frise.  Any of the 'haired' breeds.
Min Pins were bred to be ratters. VERY HIGH prey drive.  Frenchies and Bostons aren't far behind in the prey drive department.

You will need very deep pockets for an English Bull, above and beyond the initial cost which could run from $600 to $3000.  Rarely do they come without multiple issues: prolapsed nictitating membranes, entropion, stenotic nares, collapsing trachea, elongated soft palate, demodicosis, hemi-vertebrae, tail fold/facial fold issues, chronic malassezia, seasonal allergies, environmental allergies, food allergies..... to name a few.  Nor are Eng Bulls considered 'small', though that may depend on your definition of small.  They average 40 to 50 pounds, and I have seen some into the 70s and 80s.



> obv. ill go for the one charging less. or the one more convenient to drive to).


Sometimes you get what you pay for...



> My rabbit will be living in with me in the basement so theres no worry of the other dog. But my dog I wanna make sure I can be away without the dog harrassing the crud out of my bunny.


Some carnivores will get along with prey animals...  More likely, you will come home one day to find no bunny and a dog with a full belly.



> her dog seems to be subdominant


Huh?  Do you mean submissive?



> I have bad sleep patterns and when I sleep and I get abruptly woken up I tend to get aggressive


You definitely do not need a puppy.  



> I like jack russels(cute and hyper is good enough for me--- idc how obnoxious it is to others. To me--- myself is a type of breed I'd like.), german shepherds (majestic dog with a calm and docile temperament. Good as a walking partner and possible pluses are possible body guard should a stranger go by--- the most will happen is the dog will bark and the stranger will leave. lol). There's pitbulls(gentle giants, not really what people make them seem to be--- plus those eyes. So cute. I honestly have alot of respect for them. I looked them in the eye before. Nothing happens. It's bs when people say they go crazy). There's also bulldogs, chihuahuas, wired hair fox terrier, airdale terrier, mini pincher, chow chows(Huge teddy bears, though I keep getting told they are nasty and ferocious and is too hard to train--etc).


Wow... you need to do a lot of research before you consider getting a dog of any kind.


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## SandDeku (May 8, 2011)

Pssh said:


> Pure breds are much more likely to have health issues. English bull dogs have a TON of possible problems that you may have to deal with (very expensive.)
> 
> You will not be able to find what you are looking for in a small puppy. An adult dog is the only way you will get the personality you want.
> 
> I feel very strongly that you should look into adoption rather than a breeder. They do have breed specific shelters you know. We have a few sled dog and pyranese shelters around here for example.


Hmm okay ill look into it. Thanks. any suggestions for dogs?  I keep reading about dogs and all seems to keep pointing mainly at the chihuahua. Keypoints:
1)Loyal---normally bonding to one person. 2)High energy but needs only 30mins of excersice. Though i'd give it an hour or two if necessarry. I wouldn't mind
3)Low prey drive. 4)Small/compact size(easy for travelling as well--though its more of a plus) 5)Intelligence(plus than a necessity)

@Jt: Okay thanks!. Though I hate cats. Well more of like "dislike".

---------- Post added at 01:24 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:02 AM ----------




Formerphobe said:


> You might find individuals of the above breeds that are mellow, probably more the Eng Bull than any of the others. NONE of the above are allergy friendly.  Allergy friendly breeds include: Poodle, Shih Tzu, Havanese, Bichon Frise.  Any of the 'haired' breeds.
> Min Pins were bred to be ratters. VERY HIGH prey drive.  Frenchies and Bostons aren't far behind in the prey drive department.
> 
> You will need very deep pockets for an English Bull, above and beyond the initial cost which could run from $600 to $3000.  Rarely do they come without multiple issues: prolapsed nictitating membranes, entropion, stenotic nares, collapsing trachea, elongated soft palate, demodicosis, hemi-vertebrae, tail fold/facial fold issues, chronic malassezia, seasonal allergies, environmental allergies, food allergies..... to name a few.  Nor are Eng Bulls considered 'small', though that may depend on your definition of small.  They average 40 to 50 pounds, and I have seen some into the 70s and 80s.
> ...


Jesus man talk about being a prick! Ima cut to the chase, pretty much all that was placed into the post you have just made is offensive. I get what you are saying: no dog is perfect. Which is true-- but there's atleast one dog that is fit for a persons lifestyle and wants. There's over a 100 breeds of dogs. I'm pretty sure there is atleast 2-3 breeds that are good for what I want. A puppy is not a necessity, i'd like one but yeah. I'm okay with atleast a year old dog. 

An english bulldog to me is small. I have a weird perception of size. For example a pitbull is large to me. But a bulldog and anything of that sort is small to medium.  Of course I need to do alot of research. Which is why I posted the original thread. This is to get a roughage of what is good for my needs and lifestyle. 


Basically what I asked is what dog I could have for myself that would be a "buddy" to myself, won't tear up my bunny(itll be inside of its cage but some dogs have a stronger persistence and higher prey drive than others. obviously all dogs are predators. But some are less harmfull than others. ) As well as I wanna be able to go to work and not have to worry about the dog being depressed or something. I mean how do people who live on their own keep a dog then if they have work and can't have someone look after it while they aren't there? My mom will be there to care for it while Iam away--- but I like thinking of the possible case scenarios which may ever occur. A dog is a responsibility--- but I nor anyone else can lie and say they have all the time in the world to give the dog unlimited attention. It's what Iam saying. People have to go to work to bring in the bacon. But how do you make sure the pooch is okay and fine?

Sure you get what you pay for. But sometimes it doesn't work like that. Many times I'ved bought higher priced stuff like say.... There's a higher priced fish food for goldfish. but that fish food is actually not even good for them. While a cheaper one is actually better. It's an example. 
So how is that getting what you payed for? I'm all bout love, care, devotion, and spending on your pet making sure its groomed and pampered. But there's a difference between doing that, and spending money on something it doesn't need or it's completely the same. 

another example is--- go to a petstore and look at those small 1.5 gallon fish tank kits. Costs like 50-100dollars for those small desk top fish tanks. Complete garbage which you could be using that money to get a tank thats like 20g-30g or even 40g. You payed alot of money for that small kit--- but in the end it was crap. That happens A LOT of the times with things pet related. When I'm more awake ill post up more examples. So that whole rule isn't really a good rule of thumb. It's more of learning the value of the dollar.

and no I mean subdominant. Here's the defenition:
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/subdominant

She's shy, but she's also bold. I consider her to be sub-dominant. I mean her whole personality screams out "sub-dominant".  


Telling me "Wow... you need to do a lot of research before you consider getting a dog of any kind." isn't really helpful at all. Since its not really giving anything that's really going to contribute to it. Instead of making that comment you could have just suggested on what to read and such.


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## jt39565 (May 8, 2011)

On second thought, get a teddy bear - stay away from ANYTHING that is living.


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## SandDeku (May 8, 2011)

jt39565 said:


> On second thought, get a teddy bear - stay away from ANYTHING that is living.


Too late.  I keep alot of live things. Toads, spideys, fish, etc. Stuff has lived for longer than 5years for me. Except the spideys which were newer.  I'ved had dogs before. In all honesty though-- in that other post where that other guy said people tend to act like experts on here and such. I'm starting to think he was right. I mean you and every other person making rude comments could be more tactful. In the end, acting like a show off and pushing people away from the pet hobby is not beneficial to YOUR and THEIR cause. Because now you will have ignorant people who will fail to listen to anything you-- or anyone else says and possibly ban all pets from the hobby. Just because some kid thought he's cool to  put other people down on a forum by trying to patronize him/her when he/she is only asking a question. This happens very often to many people. 

Don't believe me though about the banning of pets? Go look into it then. But when the time comes and theres that new law that's going to be comming out and trying to pass and you need people to sign against it-- and nobody listens to you except the ones already in the hobby all I can say is say good bye to your hobby just because of your actions. 

I'm saying this because this is a very true and serious matter that is going to be going down. As the saying goes "more flies are caught with honey than vinegar". Then anything "exotic" and labeled as so will become illegal should that law pass. So right now--- you and everyone else being a prick on this forum think hard and long about your attitude towards others. Because most people who keep exotics have some sort of attitude problem. You know who you are--- don't deny it. In the end it won't help you.  Do as you want but know this when the hobby of exotics becomes illegal please know its your fault and please kick yourself in the butt. 

You may think your post is not offensive--- but telling someone they cannot care for an animal is not only an insult that's just a doosh bag thing to do. No matter what you or anyone else out there says-- there are plenty of people keeping pets in other different methods than YOU or anyone else keeps them. Everyone has their own methods. It works for them and their pets and if the pets are alive, thriving and content you should respect that. 

Oh and if you got mad because I say I dislike cats--- I can't help it that I do dislike cats. I'm not a cat person--- I know nothing about them nor do they appeal to me in any shape or form. If I wanted a cat I would have asked about a cat.

this goes for anyone and everyone out there thinking they are the best of the best out there. 

Here's a wake up call for you--- you're not a professional, you don't work in a zoo with the said animal, you're not a legit akc registered breeder even then it still wouldn't matter, because you don't have any degree or paperwork saying you are. Therefore as you have no physical proof you are not a professional or an expert. 

That goes for anyone keeping whatever type of animal. I said it before that I wanted an animal that gives extreme levels of affection and obviously a dog is my only option for doing so. If I wanted human affection I would go over to my girlfriends and hug her. Point is a dog's affection is irreplaceable to me and is something I'm serious about.


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## jt39565 (May 8, 2011)

You just solidified my case, thank you.


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## Pssh (May 8, 2011)

All of my cats were basically puppies. They followed me around, begged for attention, did tricks, etc. Plus they burried their poop! 

Anywho, chihuahuas can be very rewarding dogs if you train them correctly. They are usually very willing to please, but they are not always the fastest of learners. Again, if you want a dog with a certain personality, you will want a dog that is at least 1 year old but 2 would be better. They can live for a really long time. They can be nippy and bark-crazy. Shelter chihuahuas are abundant. They are often a one person kind of dog and can actually get quite aggressive if not trained well. They cannot hold their little bladders as long as some other dogs, so frequent trips outside are needed.

My boyfriend has an adorable little chihuahua mix (looks like a chi-pug) who loves everyone. He likes me best though (why? I have no idea,) and he began to get very possesive of me but with a bit of training he got over it. He's a little bundle of energy then calms down into a couch potato (even when he isn't walked.) He spends a good part of the day out in the yard under the patio where he hangs out with his kitty friends and cuddles up with them in his small-medium bed. He was a stray that they took in when they found him with his brother. They were already at least a year old and had established personalities so they knew they wanted them. The other dog went to their cousin.

I really believe that you should just visit the shelters around you until you find a dog you want. Dont have a particular look/size/etc in mind, just look for the personality you want. We visited the shelter over 4 times to find my little girl and we have not regretted it one bit. She is a super-cuddler and is always trying to curl up right next to you (which is exactly what I wanted.) She's mellow, a good watch dog, undemanding, and smart. The fact that she is smaller and is an adorable black and tan color is just a plus!


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## Formerphobe (May 8, 2011)

> On second thought, get a teddy bear - stay away from ANYTHING that is living.


Agreed



> You just solidified my case, thank you.


Indeed.



> An english bulldog to me is small. I have a weird perception of size. For example a pitbull is large to me.


40 - 50 pounds = 40 - 50 pounds
You must be going by height... pits do tend to be taller...



> So how is that getting what you payed for?


You were referencing veterinary medicine.  There is a notable difference between going to low cost clinics versus developing a patient/client/doctor relationship with a reputable veterinarian.  Many people end up spending extra at at reputable animal hospital after inappropriate services at a cheap clinic.

In that same vein, if searching for a purebred animal, paying more for a puppy from a reputable breeder will be better in the long run than paying less for an animal that is mill-bred or 'backyard' bred.



> I mean subdominant. Here's the defenition:
> http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/subdominant


Better re-read that definition.  It does not apply to dogs.



> Just because some kid thought he's cool to put other people down


Yo, Junior, I have grandkids older than you, and some of them are parents. I've been in veterinary medicine, including shelter medicine and other aspects of animal care and rescue for more than forty years.  I've seen first hand the results of _"I want, I want, I want"_, then the people are unable or unwilling to appropriately care for what they got.  Many, many  people live lifestyles that are not conducive to being good dog owners.  That's why so many dogs end up with behavioral problems and/or surrendered to rescues or shelters.  Dogs are a 24/7 responsibility.

Posting on an arachnid forum about _"What kind of dog should I get..."_ is *not* research or gaining experience.  Try reading some books on dog behavior.  Authors like Patricia McConnell (The Other End of the Leash) and Jean Donaldson (Culture Clash)would be a good start to learning dog/human interaction and responsibility.  Volunteer at an animal shelter or with a local rescue group.  Get a job at a local animal hospital. There is only so much you can learn sitting at the computer.

I, and most others who posted, were giving you straight forward information, no sugar coating.  Maybe with maturity you will learn to handle reality.  Some do, some don't.  If you need a sugar-titty, this is not the place to look for it.


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## NikiP (May 8, 2011)

I think what others are trying to say, somewhere deep , is that if you aren't home & someone lets the dog into your room without thinking, you could have just some tufts of fur left. Simply because you may be going for a lower prey drive, but when the human is removed from the situation, all bets are off 

If you can get past the hair, you should look into an Australian shepard or sheltie. Not saying one wouldn't eat a pet rabbit, but herding breeds are bred to guard livestock & can be trained to accept a wider range of animals that others might accept as prey. 

Now I don't know how hard it would be to train any dog to accept a rabbit. I just know there are plenty of dogs that are capable of being trained to watch chickens, despite the number of dogs that would just rather eat them.

Now a mix might still be a good idea, depending on the other half. Sometimes it can dull down what a breed has been bred for. Although it might not 

 I myself have a dachshund x australian shepard mix. He's actually alot like what you seem to want, minus my dog does have a high prey drive. It is feasible to find a couch potato & good hiking dog all rolled into one. Mine's passed right now, but all I need to say is "ball" & he'll be on his feet as a different creature from the one passed out.


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## pitbulllady (May 8, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> Hmm okay ill look into it. Thanks. any suggestions for dogs?  I keep reading about dogs and all seems to keep pointing mainly at the chihuahua. Keypoints:
> 1)Loyal---normally bonding to one person. 2)High energy but needs only 30mins of excersice. Though i'd give it an hour or two if necessarry. I wouldn't mind
> 3)Low prey drive. 4)Small/compact size(easy for travelling as well--though its more of a plus) 5)Intelligence(plus than a necessity)
> 
> ...


The typical English Bulldog actually weighs more than a real APBT, so in spite of having shorter legs, it's really a larger dog.  Other posters have gone into the topic of the multitude of health issues with that breed, so I won't bother.  Frenchies are only slightly less typically dog-aggressive than APBT's, but otherwise have the same disposition and are much more active than an English, much less prone to health issues, too, but like all "bully" breeds, they shed and they produce a lot of dander, the latter of which is a source of allergins.  There really is no such thing as a "hypo-allerginic dog", as some folks are allergic even to hairless breeds.  Dogs like Poodles have reduced allergenic effects on most people because their coats keep the dander down next to their skin, but the trade-off is frequent grooming, which often must be done professionally, so there's that expense.  The same goes for any fo the "Poo" mutts, and they ARE mutts.  CKC(Continental Kennel Club)"papers" are not worth the paper they are printed on as this company will literally register a dog you pick up off the street and it was formed to cater to real "puppy mills" who'd been kicked out of legitimate registries for animal cruelty violations.  Again, even many legit registeries nowadays are rife with fraud; the "Razor's Edge" line of "pit bull" is a case in point, as these dogs are a mixture of APBT, Cane Corso, Neopolitan Mastiff, American Bulldog and English Bulldog-MUTTS, in other words, yet many have UKC or ADBA "papers" because of dishonestly on the part of breeders.

I shudder at  your comment that you "get aggressive" when awakened suddenly.  Animals have a tendency to do just that-wake people up, unless you keep the animal confined to a cage and it's a species that doesn't make noise, and dogs are not included in that category.  So, just what would this "aggression" include, should your dog jump in bed with you, or bark or whine because it needed to go out and relieve itself?

pitbulllady

---------- Post added at 12:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:48 PM ----------




Formerphobe said:


> Agreed
> 
> 
> Indeed.
> ...


Thank you for stating everying that I believe here.  This is someone who really does NOT need a dog, period.  A typical teen who believes that adults with many decades of experience are stupid and no nothing because they don't work in a zoo or don't breed dogs "professionally"(i.e., run a "puppy mill" to sell puppies commercially).  We've had them on here before.  They ask questions, but they don't want the answers because they've already made up their minds and the answers go against what the want to believe.

pitbulllady


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## pouchedrat (May 8, 2011)

We're actually planning on adding a french bulldog to our family in the distant future.  I've done a million of those breed quizzes (frenchies area always one of the very top on the list they give me), done the research, found a vet who's familiar with brachycephalic dogs, and found a great looking breeder (granted, in another state, but within driving distance) who's worked with and shown the breed for 17 years, and another similar breed for 30.  She also served on council for rewriting dog breeding laws in her state.  We plan on after our move to pack up the family and drive there to meet her dogs and see if a frenchie is in fact what would fit in with our family and if my kids are OK around one or not. 

Our plan, though, isn't to get one until next year, or later, when we're settled and completely ready for it.  Someone's ALWAYS home in our house, both my man and I work opposite shifts.  We have a rather relaxed lifestyle though, nothing strenuous.   There's a good dog park nearby, miles of paved trail in the woods (I know this breed's not good with strenuous excercize or in extreme temperatures)  dog training courses available nearby, etc.   The biggest fear I have is that this is my first dog, EVER, and the ONLY dog experience I have is around aggressive black labs that belonged to distant family members (protective farm dogs and strictly hunting dogs who were very territorial, and never allowed indoors) or being bitten by a golden retriever and a dalmatian.  I also have a slight fear of dogs... thanks to my mom.  Yeah, I keep and love rats, tarantulas, cockroaches, small snakes, and have had and held all kinds of 'creepy crawlies" but dogs?  I dont' have any positive experience with dogs in my life.  I recognize it's not the dogs' fault  many cases.  So I'm hoping that the breeder visit will help me ultimately decide whether or not this is a good match at all. ESPECIALLY since I'm the one who'll be home during the daytime, so I'll be the primary caregiver.  

I know the whole "adopt instead of buy" thing, MOST of my pets past and present have been rescues.  But since this is the first dog in my life and I'm 30?  I want to do as much research as possible and wait as long as possible... and go with the best breeder for the best breed match I can find within driving distance (I don't really feel comfortable flying a dog to me) and yeah i recognize there are exceptions to all breeds, but going with a general rule, I feel more comfortable this way.  

Sorry, was reading the post and because it was about the same dog breed that we've been looking into getting, it felt like I was reading an indirect attack to anyone who wanted a breeder dog or a french bulldog, heh.  I appologize.   Without derailing this thread too horribly much, what would a new dog owner look for in getting a dog?  I'm familiar mostly with exotics, herps, rodents, prairie dogs, and we have two cats..   never owned anything dog like, unless you count our rats, who probably won't be around next year when the dog would come (they're getting up there in age)


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## LeilaNami (May 8, 2011)

SandDeku is well aware that posting on a forum isn't research.  I've talked to this person quite a bit recently and this is a thread asking to get some guidance to help narrow down the search for an appropriate breed and trying to reconcile _their_ needs with their mother's penchant for appearances.  As they said, there are 100s of breeds and having some knowledgable person help narrow it down would be incredibly helpful.  SandDeku is smart enough to not go out and buy a dog simply because someone on the forum suggested a breed.  

I suggest instead of reprimanding this person for trying to get help, be thankful that they aren't going out and buying a random dog at a pet store and not putting any thought into it at all. I'm just asking that you guys lighten up.  SandDeku is reacting to being put on the defensive by some less-than-polite comments on here.

Pouchedrat's method of research helps a lot.  Talking to vets and even talking to reputable breeders helps in finding a breed.  A good breeder will flat out tell you that the dog you're asking about will not be right for you household.


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## apopli (May 8, 2011)

I'm not gonna touch anything else going on here, but this stuck out at me:



SandDeku said:


> 2)High energy but needs only 30mins of excersice. Though i'd give it an hour or two if necessarry. I wouldn't mind


This doesn't exist. A high energy, intelligent dog that only gets 30min-an hour or 2's worth of exercise and stimulation a day will become destructive and develop many unwanted behaviours (some potentially severe and dangerous) out of boredom.

It sounds to me like you're looking for something very LOW energy and laid back that can entertain itself for most of the day most of the time.


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## Formerphobe (May 8, 2011)

> We're actually planning on adding a french bulldog to our family in the distant future. I've done a million of those breed quizzes (frenchies area always one of the very top on the list they give me), done the research, found a vet who's familiar with brachycephalic dogs, and found a great looking breeder (granted, in another state, but within driving distance) who's worked with and shown the breed for 17 years, and another similar breed for 30. She also served on council for rewriting dog breeding laws in her state. We plan on after our move to pack up the family and drive there to meet her dogs and see if a frenchie is in fact what would fit in with our family and if my kids are OK around one or not.


Yes!  :worship::clap::worship::clap::worship::clap:

You are on the right track.  I wish even half of my clients were like you!  You can also contact Frenchie Rescue groups, go to dog shows, find a local breed club, pet expos, etc to see and find out info on the breed.  There are always people willing to talk about their breed... sometimes to excess.  LOL  As with anything, you may sometimes have to weed out the facts from the BS.  There will be some aficionados reporting their breed leaping tall buildings in a single bound, stopping speeding locomotives, ending hunger in third world countries, and decreasing the national deficit...

With any new dog of any breed I recommend the whole family attend obedience classes with the pup/dog.  Look for a trainer that teaches/trains by positive reinforcement.  (If any recommend choke chains, dominance rolls, staring the dog down, physical punishment, etc, then grab your dog and run quickly in the other direction.)  Obed classes teach the humans how to teach the dog and gets everyone in the family on the same page as far as commands, strategy, etc.  Obed classes also promote confidence in both the owner(s) and the dog making for a healthy relationship.

Frenchies tend to be a bit hard headed but, any individual of any breed will take a mile if you give them an inch (just like a human child...).  Be firm, consistent, fair.  Set them up to succeed.

Frenchies aren't as 'severe' as some of the other brachycephalic breeds.  Most can tolerate more exercise than the average Pug or Eng Bull.  Within reason, a tired dog is a good dog.   The most well-behaved dogs I see are those who get lots of daily exercise and spend lots of quality time with their human family (their pack).

Good luck with your move and your search for a canine family member.


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## LeilaNami (May 8, 2011)

Formerphobe said:


> Yes!  :worship::clap::worship::clap::worship::clap:
> 
> You are on the right track.  I wish even half of my clients were like you!  You can also contact Frenchie Rescue groups, go to dog shows, find a local breed club, pet expos, etc to see and find out info on the breed.  There are always people willing to talk about their breed... sometimes to excess.  LOL  As with anything, you may sometimes have to weed out the facts from the BS.  There will be some aficionados reporting their breed leaping tall buildings in a single bound, stopping speeding locomotives, ending hunger in third world countries, and decreasing the national deficit...
> 
> ...


Frenchies are so much fun.  At a vet practice where I would assist and observe, one of the techs had a white deaf male.  Poor dog had three different names .  His favorite toy was the plastic container oral syringes came in.  Every time someone's animal was out he would bulldoze it (hence one of his names being Dozer) and sit on it. They certainly are hard-headed.


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## Formerphobe (May 9, 2011)

> Every time someone's animal was out he would bulldoze it (hence one of his names being Dozer) and sit on it. They certainly are hard-headed.


LOL They have that bulldozer build, too!


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## SandDeku (May 9, 2011)

jt39565 said:


> You just solidified my case, thank you.


Yeah. You solified my case. Just because you have knowledge doesn't give you the right to be a prick. But in all honesty like I said. Keep acting like a jerk(many people on pet forums do that--- just take a good look) and see how far that gets you. I mean right now you may think its nothing to worry about. But when you start reading laws being passed down on ban about exotic pets, and you try to get people to go against that law---- and those people recall back to how people were in that said forum, and that was how they ended up loosing interest. Due to being extremely discouraged--- then don't go getting all riled up. 

There isn't any reason to be a doosh bag online just because you think you know everything. Nobody knows everything and people start somewhere. I don't know what you guys are thinking that I just want a dog on an impulse buy. But think about it---- if I was going to do it on an impulse buy or for any of the wrong reasons; why would I go on here and ask questions? As well as why would I even post about it? 

Word to the wise--- you catch more flies with honey than vinegar. And I'm pretty sure there is always someone with more knowledge than that person acting like a smug prick. I.e. being you right now as well that other guy. 
Intelligence doesn't excuse rudeness.

---------- Post added at 01:53 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:23 AM ----------




Formerphobe said:


> Agreed
> 
> 
> Indeed.
> ...


"Sub dominant: something partly but incompletely dominant; especially : an ecologically important life form subordinate in influence to the dominants of a community " This DOES apply to dogs. For dogs think like "wolves" in the sense they are a pack animal. There's Dominant, sub dominant, and the complete submissive. It's usually determined during weaning the last to feed are usually the submissive ones. The first to feed are the dominant ones, and the rest tend to be sub dominant. Or so I been informed before. 

My brother worked in a dog/cat rescue. Not a fan of shelters. Yes a "reputable" vet is a good option obviously. But if there is more than ONE reputable vet and one goes for less then that's okay to go for that. It doesn't make a person a "Bad" person just because they won't pay extra for something that is basically the same thing and heck--- if it has a good reputation then how is it a bad thing? 

So say if I turn out to be a vet--- which you don't know me personally so you wouldn't know who Iam. Then I decided to charge an extra hundred dollars for a procedure like checking for parasites. While the vet down the street has a legit good reputation and goes a bit cheaper so you're saying people will go straight to me just because I charge more? Therefore must be a better vet? I mean you did say "you get what you pay for". 

As well as I never said I'd buy from a cheaper breeder. Just talked about vets. Nothing is set in stone.



I worked at a petstore, I know about responsibility and such. I'm no expert by any means; but I do know my share of information--- yet I try to seek more info. Everyone who owns an animal "wants" it. You wouldn't be owning a dog if you had no interest in owning one or wanted one for whatever reason. 

Also going on and reading books may not be the best idea. Books tend to get outdated very fast. The internet can be updated in just the click of a button in just 5seconds or less. While a book takes a long time for someone to publish a new book. Nobody has a say on the book. Nobody can "post" on the book and correct any errors. 

I tried books before infact i have some books at home that are pretty much outdated and incorrect--- even when I bought them. They were about turtles. When I first got it I thought that was correct information. Turns out it was bs. Like I said earlier in the post--- nothing is set in stone.

Going on a forum even for arachnids is not a bad idea to get information. People everywhere whether its a cat forum, frog forum, fish forum, reptile forum, avian forum, arachnid forum, whatever you can think up. Doesn't matter. People always have an interest in dogs--- sure not EVERYONE but there is USUALLY a great deal of people that are knowledgeable. 


YOU can't determine who is unfit to care for an animal--- nor anyone on here. Because you don't know the person. For all you know the person could be trying to get a thought across but instead a different thought is being thrown across which is not the actual thought of the person. The internet is a cold cold place in the sense of--- if I say good morning you can't say if I'm happy or not. Or if I said Hello. It's just stupid. 

I never asked to sugar coated. I just asked not to be a douche bag about it. I mean it's basically like me saying "hey you're doing it wrong re-turd. You're supposed to put the battery the other way in". Sure I'm giving the information that is needed, but I'm also being a jerk at the process if I had done something like that. 

Just because you or anyone else have knowledge doesn't give you the right to be a dick to everyone on here. 

You're 40ish? If you're 40--- here's a tip.  Grow up and act like one. People are giving me answers, which I'm grateful for. But I don't go online just to be disrespected by someone. It's called being tactful. 

Many people can go to work and still have a dog. I mean I'm pretty sure you go to work and have yourself a dog. If work stopped you from having a dog--- then why would there be countless of breeds? If people can't own a dog because they need to go to work, then why keep breeding the dogs? Sure there are families--- but children(talking about ages 1-14ish) are usually not fit to care for a dog alone. 
Dogs can live up to 9-18years(chihuahuas are the long living ones I believe), that would mean the gap that a person could own a dog is like what a few years? In their teens? Then what becomes of the dog? 

If you're a vet(not saying you are or aren't) and you have people coming in saying that they "Want, want, want" a dog wouldn't it be your job to teach them the basic needs of the dog? Therefore wouldn't that correct many of the issues? 

Many people who have pets and properly don't care for them correctly usually are because they seek knowledge only to be shot down by people like you. Then where do they turn to? They'll turn to the person who is willing to help but isn't knowledgeable to do so. 

I myself want a dog for myself---- I'm not talking about that I'll buy one right off the bat. I mean if I was going to rush into that sort of thing---- why would I go post a thread about dogs? Why would I be trying to seek information? There's many information online that is false. So googling is not usually the best option. Pet store employees on the norm have little to no knowledge about animals--ironic. Books can be out dated. Going to a vet just to ask some questions is just going to waste the vets time where he could be saving the lives of other animals. 

So where does one turn to? A breeder? Not all breeders are knowledgeable you even stated that yourself. A shelter? Working in a shelter doesn't mean you know everything there is to know. They're just employees. So again who do they turn to? The internet? But where? A forum? How can you turn to a forum where people constantly criticize everyone for anything said or asked? It's not even over exaggerated. Go look at some threads by other people and look how many arguments are done.

Arachnoboards doesn't really differentiate from a forum for dogs or cats. Dogs and cats are very common pets and for the most part people owning exotics tend to have a dog or a cat(not always). So it wouldn't really matter.

---------- Post added at 01:59 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:53 AM ----------




apopli said:


> I'm not gonna touch anything else going on here, but this stuck out at me:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


No I was reading online and that's why I thought of it. In reality I'm just looking for answers--- I'm not out to make a hasty decision. I just wanna know if I can keep a dog with the living conditions I'll be in. I mean how do people keep both a job and a dog? I'm pretty sure that people can do both. But that's what Iam trying to ask. How do you do that without the dog getting bored or destructive? I figured I could hire a doggy sitter or something. I'm not going to get that dog now. I already have a dog--- well not my dog. It's my mothers dog--- she's a stay-at-home wife so she can give it full undivided attention for more hours. 

But I'm asking for when I decide to get my own place. I like to think ahead and plan ahead. I don't like rushing into things that big.

---------- Post added at 02:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:59 AM ----------




NikiP said:


> I think what others are trying to say, somewhere deep , is that if you aren't home & someone lets the dog into your room without thinking, you could have just some tufts of fur left. Simply because you may be going for a lower prey drive, but when the human is removed from the situation, all bets are off
> 
> If you can get past the hair, you should look into an Australian shepard or sheltie. Not saying one wouldn't eat a pet rabbit, but herding breeds are bred to guard livestock & can be trained to accept a wider range of animals that others might accept as prey.
> 
> ...


Ehh I'm getting my rabbit a hutch. She's in a large cage right now. But I figured a wooden hutch would be better. Because I'ved seen those things and they are quite sturdy and ventilated like a cage is so. The dog won't be able to reach it. But I just don't want it to constantly bark at it because that would scare it. 


I'm worried about it being harassed more now, than it being eaten. Since I should be getting a rabbit hutch in a month. The cage is in my room now---nobody ever dares to go into my room, that and its ussually locked by key. See I just wanna see what my options are. I guess a couch potato may just be a better idea. Because the more I think about it. I would like to take a dog with me wherever I go. But if that would be the case, I rather I could carry it if I have to travel with it. I love traveling to places like other states. So carrying a small dog isn't that bad. Some dogs are actually quite comfortable with that. 

But what I been asking and trying to learn is--- how do you go to work and have a dog yourself? I mean its not like the dog could come with you to work.

---------- Post added at 02:10 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:06 AM ----------




pitbulllady said:


> The typical English Bulldog actually weighs more than a real APBT, so in spite of having shorter legs, it's really a larger dog.  Other posters have gone into the topic of the multitude of health issues with that breed, so I won't bother.  Frenchies are only slightly less typically dog-aggressive than APBT's, but otherwise have the same disposition and are much more active than an English, much less prone to health issues, too, but like all "bully" breeds, they shed and they produce a lot of dander, the latter of which is a source of allergins.  There really is no such thing as a "hypo-allerginic dog", as some folks are allergic even to hairless breeds.  Dogs like Poodles have reduced allergenic effects on most people because their coats keep the dander down next to their skin, but the trade-off is frequent grooming, which often must be done professionally, so there's that expense.  The same goes for any fo the "Poo" mutts, and they ARE mutts.  CKC(Continental Kennel Club)"papers" are not worth the paper they are printed on as this company will literally register a dog you pick up off the street and it was formed to cater to real "puppy mills" who'd been kicked out of legitimate registries for animal cruelty violations.  Again, even many legit registeries nowadays are rife with fraud; the "Razor's Edge" line of "pit bull" is a case in point, as these dogs are a mixture of APBT, Cane Corso, Neopolitan Mastiff, American Bulldog and English Bulldog-MUTTS, in other words, yet many have UKC or ADBA "papers" because of dishonestly on the part of breeders.
> 
> I shudder at  your comment that you "get aggressive" when awakened suddenly.  Animals have a tendency to do just that-wake people up, unless you keep the animal confined to a cage and it's a species that doesn't make noise, and dogs are not included in that category.  So, just what would this "aggression" include, should your dog jump in bed with you, or bark or whine because it needed to go out and relieve itself?
> 
> ...


Actually I'm not here to make a hasty decission. If In the end keeping a dog is not the best idea for me then I won't. But I rather look around and see the options. When I say I get aggressive when I wake up I mean I'm vocal or grumpy. Don't take things overly serious.


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## SandDeku (May 9, 2011)

pouchedrat said:


> We're actually planning on adding a french bulldog to our family in the distant future.  I've done a million of those breed quizzes (frenchies area always one of the very top on the list they give me), done the research, found a vet who's familiar with brachycephalic dogs, and found a great looking breeder (granted, in another state, but within driving distance) who's worked with and shown the breed for 17 years, and another similar breed for 30.  She also served on council for rewriting dog breeding laws in her state.  We plan on after our move to pack up the family and drive there to meet her dogs and see if a frenchie is in fact what would fit in with our family and if my kids are OK around one or not.
> 
> Our plan, though, isn't to get one until next year, or later, when we're settled and completely ready for it.  Someone's ALWAYS home in our house, both my man and I work opposite shifts.  We have a rather relaxed lifestyle though, nothing strenuous.   There's a good dog park nearby, miles of paved trail in the woods (I know this breed's not good with strenuous excercize or in extreme temperatures)  dog training courses available nearby, etc.   The biggest fear I have is that this is my first dog, EVER, and the ONLY dog experience I have is around aggressive black labs that belonged to distant family members (protective farm dogs and strictly hunting dogs who were very territorial, and never allowed indoors) or being bitten by a golden retriever and a dalmatian.  I also have a slight fear of dogs... thanks to my mom.  Yeah, I keep and love rats, tarantulas, cockroaches, small snakes, and have had and held all kinds of 'creepy crawlies" but dogs?  I dont' have any positive experience with dogs in my life.  I recognize it's not the dogs' fault  many cases.  So I'm hoping that the breeder visit will help me ultimately decide whether or not this is a good match at all. ESPECIALLY since I'm the one who'll be home during the daytime, so I'll be the primary caregiver.
> 
> ...


We're somewhat in the same page. I'm just trying to gain knowledge before I act. I mean at first I thought I could get a dog in half a year. But then I realized I should wait longer for it. But that's the thing. I can't forsee if I'm going to get married or not. I mean this isn't about the main topic--- but I'm pretty shy so I maybe single for a while. So that was what I'm trying to get at. How does someone have a dog and a job and be able to satisfy both? 

I started to figure out that I could just hire a dog sitter to  play with the dog for a few hours and make sure it gets to take care of its necessities when I'm not physically there. I'm just not good at wording things out. Anywho. I like frenchies myself too. But I'm not going to get one just by how they look or just personality. I'm just wanting a dog that I can personally keep and will satisfy my personal needs regarding on what I'm looking for a dog, and that I myself can satisfy its need--- even while I'm not there. What makes me scared though is if I worked an 8-12hour shift and I had a doggy sitter wouldn't the dog become more attached to the sitter? Maybe ill look into a stay-at-home job. I mean I'm not even sure what I wanna do yet. But in the mean time I'm just planning out the rest in different case scenarios. 

I keep turtles, toads, a spider, some huge 3-4year old goldfish(12inches for the commons and 8inch for the ryuukins). 
My mother has her dog--- which I help her take care of. I know the doggy basics on training and care. I'ved done that part of the research--- atleast for what she has. But I'm thinking about my own dog and I figured a dog is a big responsibility and something that should be thought hard upon. I would adopt if I find a good reputable shelter. If I end up buying--- I'd buy from a reputable breeder and make sure its top of the line. 

As for a vet that's where I'm stumped. I have a reptile vet that only deals with exotics. So that's what Im going to look more info. But before i look for that I need to know what breed Im looking into keeping because then I can look for specific vets that have dealt with such illness and complications that may occur on that said breed. You know?


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## NikiP (May 9, 2011)

A crate is your best friend  if you are worried about a dog being loose while you're at work, teach them to stay in a crate. One of the best tools ones can ever teach a dog.


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## SandDeku (May 9, 2011)

NikiP said:


> A crate is your best friend  if you are worried about a dog being loose while you're at work, teach them to stay in a crate. One of the best tools ones can ever teach a dog.


Oh I know about that. But I'm talking about--- it feels cruel to just keep it in a crate. Is it possible to teach it to be on its own room and have fun on its own while I'm at work? And won't get too destructive or "doggy depression"? I mean I know some dogs are extremely attached to their owners. Which is what I like because I want to have a dog that will bond mainly with me(and tolerate other people--- for obvious reasons) but won't become depressed or anything when I'm gone. Cause somebody has to bring home the bacon. 

I mean eventually I may get married. But its a long way from now---especially since I'm too shy and way too picky(personality wise lol) of people.

I may hire a doggy sitter or something. But I want it to be able to be alone for periods of time and be happy.  Is that possible? It's not like ill leave it for a day alone. Its more of like 8-hours or so(a normal workday) and I'd walk it before and after work for atleast an hour or two on both terms.

A friend suggested a shiba inu maybe good for me if I just walk it for atleast 2-3hours daily. which I'm okay with as well. It'll give me a chance to get some fresh air and relax.

They have a high prey drive. But I figure I found away on how to get around this. Ill give my rabbit a seperate room that the dog will never be able to get into. Ill make sure it has "noise canceling" walls. So if the dog barks or something it won't scare the shiz out of my bun bun. Ill also try to socialize them together in their own terms while the dog is leashed.


So far from reading what a few pages say about them. It sounds good for me. Independance may prove troublesome because it may mean they may have a mind of its own in a sense where if you wanna train it to not poop on the floor-- it maybe stubborn. lol.


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## Pssh (May 9, 2011)

My terrier mix loves my guinea pigs. She cuddles with them. They dont really share the feeling though!

how are you going to give your bunny free range time?


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## SandDeku (May 9, 2011)

Pssh said:


> My terrier mix loves my guinea pigs. She cuddles with them. They dont really share the feeling though!
> 
> how are you going to give your bunny free range time?


We have many rooms in this house so I can give her a roam of a room. And when I move out--- ill move out when I already bought a house. I don't want an apt. 

The dog will have a roam of his own room as well. Since at most if I get married I'm not planning for kids--- I don't like em.  So I should have enough room for them. MAybe ill get another bunny playmate for my bunbun. 

I guess I'm now just trying to figure out what dog I would and will have. I plan on having a one story house, basement, double garage or single(idrc about garage just for the car and that's it). A medium sized yard with a tool shed. 4-5rooms and 2bathrooms, a medium sized kitchen and a large living room. I like to plan ahead and well. That's what I'm going for. If anything changes to a smaller house then that's fine. 

Right now I'm looking at rabbit hutches. Where my rabbit can stay in there untill I can take her out and get her some playtime. I may even just put in a kid fence(the ones for stairs) and make it like 4ft tall atleast and so the rabbit can have time outside of the cage when I'm not there.


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## Pssh (May 9, 2011)

guineapigcages.com has a forum with tons of people who keep rabbits. they have a lot of neat and inexpensive ways to make cages that actually look okay and still satisfy the needs of the animals in it. They can also teach you how to rabbit proof the room so that the rabbit can have the room to himself when you aren't around.


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## SandDeku (May 9, 2011)

Pssh said:


> guineapigcages.com has a forum with tons of people who keep rabbits. they have a lot of neat and inexpensive ways to make cages that actually look okay and still satisfy the needs of the animals in it. They can also teach you how to rabbit proof the room so that the rabbit can have the room to himself when you aren't around.


Herself. And Ill look into it. My mom wanted me to get rid of her to make room for the pup. but I said no firmly. I love her and I want her to stay. So they're okay with it but I'm hoping to get a better cage. Some cages look ridiculous and look a pain in the arse to clean. Cleaning this rabbit cage is a pain. The stuff clumps. I have to pick it up by hand-- which feels gross on my hands but I deal with it.

I hope to find an easy to clean, sturdy, big and well ventilated cage. I heard you can put news papers  under the bedding and when you need to clean it just to roll it and that makes cleaning easier because the bedding on top of it most of it will come out easily.

--------------------------
I may just buy myself a god damned vacuum cleaner JUST for cleaning the cage. But by god I saw the cages in there. Those are HUGEEEEEEE. I was told that they only needed a 5ft long cage. lol. Oh well i guess nows the time for improving. Just wondering how to clean that without taking it appart. Seems like a pain to take appart and put together. Plus doing that weekly-- think about it. lol. I guess a vaccuum cleaner that is extremely sturdy and powerfull will do the trick of sucking up all the crud. Then Ill just wipe it down heavily with a bleach/water solution to kill any germs. Then let it dry. Then wipe it with water and vinegar. Then wipe it down with a cage deoderizer for odor. I wonder I have a litterbox and my rabbit once was litter trained but when I moved her out of my room(space needs) she lost that litter training she knew. She uses the litterbox as her sleeping area..... She poops by the hay. :c She poops soo much that my mom co nstantly scolds me thinking I didn't clean the cage when I JUST cleaned it a day ago. LOL. Spot cleaning would help alot if the rabbit didn't scatter her poo pellets. :x I was told that my rabbit didn't need a playmate cause shes submissive and fearful. But I remember putting her with my friends guinea pigs(I was testing it out--- I know I know I shouldnt mix species but hey they didn't bit each other). 

I don't like guinea pigs anymore as I used to. Not a fan of the squeeling and squirming whenever one holds one. A rabbit is calmer and generally more friendlier(least in my eyes and perspective). My friend is the guinea pig fan, I'm the rabbit fan. 

I give her carrots every couple of days. Shes obsessed with them. lol
--------------------------------

Woooooooooooooooooooooooooooow they seem so god dang easy to make! but you sure my rabbit wont eat the coroplast? If it does is it safe? She likes to chew. she never chews on the cage but I worry.


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## Crysta (May 9, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> I hope to find an easy to clean, sturdy, big and well ventilated cage. I heard you can put news papers  under the bedding and when you need to clean it just to roll it and that makes cleaning easier because the bedding on top of it most of it will come out easily.


I would recommend finding one of those cages with a slide out bottom, just make sure some areas are covered with bored if the little squares are too big, so she doesn't molest her feet (if it has a cage grate, some don't)



SandDeku said:


> --------------------------
> I may just buy myself a god damned vacuum cleaner JUST for cleaning the cage. But by god I saw the cages in there. Those are HUGEEEEEEE. I was told that they only needed a 5ft long cage. lol. Oh well i guess nows the time for improving. Just wondering how to clean that without taking it appart. Seems like a pain to take appart and put together. Plus doing that weekly-- think about it. lol. I guess a vaccuum cleaner that is extremely sturdy and powerfull will do the trick of sucking up all the crud. Then Ill just wipe it down heavily with a bleach/water solution to kill any germs. Then let it dry. Then wipe it with water and vinegar. Then wipe it down with a cage deoderizer for odor. I wonder I have a litterbox and my rabbit once was litter trained but when I moved her out of my room(space needs) she lost that litter training she knew. She uses the litterbox as her sleeping area..... She poops by the hay. :c She poops soo much that my mom co nstantly scolds me thinking I didn't clean the cage when I JUST cleaned it a day ago. LOL. Spot cleaning would help alot if the rabbit didn't scatter her poo pellets. :x I was told that my rabbit didn't need a playmate cause shes submissive and fearful. But I remember putting her with my friends guinea pigs(I was testing it out--- I know I know I shouldnt mix species but hey they didn't bit each other).


Um, you clean too deeply? 
I only use dish soap to clean out my bunnies cage and it doesnt stink. (or pet friendly toilet cleaner with aminty scent) and scrub it with a toilet brush.
She just has a green bottom thats basically her litter box.

Rabbits are smart, and they like to ignore you. My girl (flemish giant) is litter trained, and a rabbit of constant routine. If she starts chewing the carpet, or digging in it, or pooping/peeing in an inappropriate location, I  say NO and chase her to her cage, or raise my voice and say 'get to the kitchen' she actually stops what she is doing and goes to her cage... she knows better, but is just being a little honky pankey trying to get my attention. But you need to keep up with this or they will 'forget' ... lol 



SandDeku said:


> I give her carrots every couple of days. Shes obsessed with them. lol


My rabbit gets 1 1/2 carrots, greens and lots of hay, and 1 1/2 bowl of pellets every day(probably 1cup total). Every second day she gets a banana (half) and an apple or two, and what ever else i may have eaten that day.

shes 11 pounds though...


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## Bigboy (May 9, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> Hello guys. After trying to use petfinder and the shelters. When we find the dog we want(mainly my mom wants), we call the next day to find it got adopted. This happened several times already. We're pretty tired of going through that process. Plus the whole housing procedures they do is kinda a drag. It's way too annoying to go through that process just to find out someone else got to it first.
> 
> So I'm saying screw shelters and now Iam going to the next step of finding a suitable dog. Breeders. My mom wants something she finds cute. But I want something I can "bond" with and easily train-able. She likes frufru looking dogs if that makes sense. Think of cockapoos. Maltipoos. Anything that looks adorable like a button. She's not a fan of chihuahuas(I actually am--- she's very hard to deal with when it comes to this especially since chihuahuas are easy to find even for adoption.) I like bully breeds. Especially english bulldogs. But only thing she will "accept" is a frenchie. So idk if you guys know any french bulldog breeders. As well as a cockapoo/maltipoo breeders.
> 
> ...


Why do you and your mother want a dog.  Specifically, why?  That should really help you narrow down the breed/type. As an aside, never choose a dog based on looks.  Dogs are functioning animals, they need purpose and if you don't have a job they are suited for you are going to have a new pain in the arse for the next 9-14 years.  And as to your rabbit, you never know if the dog you get will be okay with rabbits or not, you will just need to always supervise their interactions.


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## LeilaNami (May 9, 2011)

Crysta said:


> I would recommend finding one of those cages with a slide out bottom, just make sure some areas are covered with bored if the little squares are too big, so she doesn't molest her feet (if it has a cage grate, some don't)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Flemish giants are one of the few rabbits I like. :clap:  I second the intelligence.  We would be clipping the English lop's nails and Hugh Bunny (the flemish) would take the nail clippers and run off with them because he probably knew he was next.   They spray like a fire hose when not neutered though.


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## SandDeku (May 10, 2011)

Crysta said:


> I would recommend finding one of those cages with a slide out bottom, just make sure some areas are covered with bored if the little squares are too big, so she doesn't molest her feet (if it has a cage grate, some don't)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 staple diet is hay. I rarely give her any pellets. I read alot of web pages online said pellets shouldn't be a staple. I rarely feed pellets. Maybe every few days if anything. I feed all sorts of types of hay. I heard THATS what she actually needs in her diet to be happy and healthy. I give her whatever I can find that is natural that would be normally eaten by bun buns. I occassionally give her a couple of blue berries(rarely), I give her carrots  tri-weekly. I heard feeding too many veggies a day could give her dia-re-uh. lol. Or wet tail or something. that it should only a few times a week. 

I give her as a staple diet of hay:
-Orchard Grass hay
-Timothy Hay
-Western Timothy hay
-Bermuda Grass
-Oat hay
-Botanical Grass

I avoid feeding alfalfa. Infact I NEVER use alfalfa hay. As for pellets I go for the "oxbow" brand. A fellow coworker---this woman was deranged and completely obsessed with bun buns. I took her word more than anyone elses because well. Obsession. lol. She said oxbow is the best brand for rabbits/guinea pigs because it is the healthiest to feed them.

---------- Post added at 02:23 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:22 AM ----------




LeilaNami said:


> Flemish giants are one of the few rabbits I like. :clap:  I second the intelligence.  We would be clipping the English lop's nails and Hugh Bunny (the flemish) would take the nail clippers and run off with them because he probably knew he was next.   They spray like a fire hose when not neutered though.


Spray? Mines not neutered. my coworker kept insisting to me NOT to neuter her because it'd make her "stale" in personality wise. Or something. I don't know if its true.

---------- Post added at 02:36 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:23 AM ----------




Bigboy said:


> Why do you and your mother want a dog.  Specifically, why?  That should really help you narrow down the breed/type. As an aside, never choose a dog based on looks.  Dogs are functioning animals, they need purpose and if you don't have a job they are suited for you are going to have a new pain in the arse for the next 9-14 years.  And as to your rabbit, you never know if the dog you get will be okay with rabbits or not, you will just need to always supervise their interactions.


I took care of the what if scenario about the bun bun. She'll be safe and proof from harrassment. She's having a room for her where she won't be bothered by the poochies. 

I myself want a dog that is for companion. As silly as it sounds but I kinda like the idea of carrying around with me a dog to new places and such as well. I guess its like I feel more secure. Even if the dog is tiny and puny. lol. I try not to say my real reason for wanting a dog because I'd get called a "fag" by people. xD I just think that's how I bond. Or atleast someone I can sit and watch t.v. and will be warm to the touch. I have reptiles and amphibians. I can't do that with them. As for the bunny. She likes to play more than watch t.v. She's calm but she's overly playfull so I just play with her. I just want a dog I can carry around with me to places(traveling buddy basically. but not meaning airplane. Say if I'm going on a roadtrip or something---sorry I'm bad at explaining). Also other reasons for wanting a dog is well guess I feel "lonely" sometimes and amphibians and reptiles are look-but-not-touch pets. And my bun bun well. I just play with her but I don't cuddle with her too often. I'm weird like that I guess. :S As for my mom--- her reasons: Unknown. 

I guess since I owned dogs since I was a kid it just "Feels right" for me as a pet. It's what I'm more accustomed to. We took in strays sheltered them, and found them new homes. I myself never had the change to have a dog of my very own choosing and well thought i'd give it a try. I trained my friends dog or at least helped quite a lot on some stuff(training wise). 

Well to sum it all up:
1)Loyal companion.
2)Travel companion(not really a "need" just would be a plus if I could do that.  its not my major reason for owning one.)
3)T.v. buddy(will be near me but I won't have to constantly pay too much attention to it. Just the prescense of it near me or on the floor next to the couch where Iam sitting at is enough---heck even on the couch)
4)"play" mate. Whenever I'm bored I guess i'd like to play with it. 


Plus wouldn't be a bad idea to own a dog because I'd have to walk it daily no matter how lazy the dog is or energy needs. it would still be good for me to get in a bit of daily excersice.  If its low energy would be okay cause I'm not a fan of walking for hours(daily---over 3hours takes the cake. comfortable with 1-2hrs if anything.)


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## Bigboy (May 10, 2011)

Okay, that makes sense.  What you seem to be looking for is a low energy dog that isn't going to demand hours of physical exercise each day from you or a new couch to destroy weekly.  Have you considered english bulldogs or english bulldog mixes?  They aren't pretty but they are some of the sweetest dogs I've ever known.  The only real problem, and it is a big one, is the high occurrence of diseases and disorders the breed experiences.  They have the temperament you are looking for and the activity level but they've been bred to the point of being at the physiological and genetic limit for dogs.

Additionally you could get an older dog or even a senior dog from a shelter that has its intensely hyper puppy years well behind it.


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## Crysta (May 10, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> I heard feeding too many veggies a day could give her dia-re-uh. lol. Or wet tail or something. that it should only a few times a week.
> 
> I give her as a staple diet of hay:
> -Orchard Grass hay
> ...


If bunny's could get that much dry hay in the wild they be great. hehe wild bunnys rarely need to drink since their hay is already full of water (grass, etc) Im always throwing handfulls of grass to buns, she loved it. (however u need to watch for lawn parasites etc, but im always like what the hell with that stuff... my brocoli i eat daily probably holds more bugs haha)



SandDeku said:


> I avoid feeding alfalfa. Infact I NEVER use alfalfa hay. As for pellets I go for the "oxbow" brand. A fellow coworker---this woman was deranged and completely obsessed with bun buns. I took her word more than anyone elses because well. Obsession. lol. She said oxbow is the best brand for rabbits/guinea pigs because it is the healthiest to feed them.



alphalfa is for younger rabbits that require the calcium for their quick growth rate in their bones (from what im lead to believe) exess feeding of alphalfa, or anything rich in calcium will lead to lots of pee. 

Oxbow bran is good I heard as well, but anything with the right percentage of protein and _something_ that slipped my mind right now.. ill edit later when I get off the plane.. that isnt based on corn meal is good for rabbits. your pretty much looking for compressed timothy hay pellets with nothing else, well maybe some extra vitamins, etc, it states on the package. 




SandDeku said:


> Spray? Mines not neutered. my coworker kept insisting to me NOT to neuter her because it'd make her "stale" in personality wise. Or something. I don't know if its true.


Spraying/pooping and neutering/spaying plays a big factor in the bunnys personality such as the following -
Rabbit poop containers markers and scent.(if you notice some poop smells compared to others they release) this is fixed, when they are fixed. 
Litter training is easier
They want to use less dominant behavior on your carpets and other furniture. 
They won't run around your feet and may not be as 'loving' towards you, this loving is usually the rabbit making itself boss and marking you with its scent glands.. my rabbit doesnt mark me, dont let her. (tell her to go to the kitchen.. lol)
They won't spray your carpet/wood floors as much when they are out of the enclosure. (doesnt matter if its male or female, females are also very territorial)
They get lazy
They can be accompanied easier and safer with other rabbits, MOST of the time. Sometimes female/female relationships dont work. And if the female rabbits are not spayed they _may _get fight and claw at eachother. However that can happen with a fixed bunny to, spaying just reduces the chances. 
Fixed male/male relationships from what i read work great, most of the time, but as it is male/female are better. But if I had no gonads, I dont think I would care lol..

all in all, the bunny will keep its personality, however, it wont be run on hormones anymore. 

Just like how a male cat gets fixed that was once rowdy is now the laziest loving thing there is... lol(thats what happened to my cat)

However, each fix/spay outcome depends on the rabbit itself.

(someone feel free to correct me if im wrong, but im pretty sure i got my facts ok.)




SandDeku said:


> I took care of the what if scenario about the bun bun. She'll be safe and proof from harrassment. She's having a room for her where she won't be bothered by the poochies.


becareful with how long you leave the bunny alone, it can get destructive of your walls, etc if its bored. Sometimes when people get a dog they kinda forget their other pets. Rabbits need a lot of supervised time to be happy, (imo) especially if its alone.



SandDeku said:


> Or atleast someone I can sit and watch t.v. and will be warm to the touch. I have reptiles and amphibians. I can't do that with them. As for the bunny. She likes to play more than watch t.v. She's calm but she's overly playfull so I just play with her.


my rabbit sits on the bed with me while she makes me pet her, my girls not fixed yet so i can only imagine the couch potato shes gonna be.. lol however she might end up not being one lol never know.


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## apopli (May 10, 2011)

SandDeku said:


> No I was reading online and that's why I thought of it. In reality I'm just looking for answers--- I'm not out to make a hasty decision. I just wanna know if I can keep a dog with the living conditions I'll be in. I mean how do people keep both a job and a dog? I'm pretty sure that people can do both. But that's what Iam trying to ask. How do you do that without the dog getting bored or destructive? I figured I could hire a doggy sitter or something. I'm not going to get that dog now. I already have a dog--- well not my dog. It's my mothers dog--- she's a stay-at-home wife so she can give it full undivided attention for more hours.
> 
> But I'm asking for when I decide to get my own place. I like to think ahead and plan ahead. I don't like rushing into things that big.




With a puppy it's hard. For the first 6mos I had my dog (got her at 8wks) I would come home from work at lunch to let her out to pee because leaving her for more than 4hrs or so will just cause her to eliminate in the house and make housebreaking difficult.

Crate training is essential if the puppy is going to be left alone, I think. Puppies learn from their mums (or at least ideally if the mum is housebroken and the pups left with her long enough) where to eliminate and know on instinct that you don't pee/poop where you sleep. It's not cruel (even though they cry and whine at first), it's setting the expectation. While you're alone, this is where I want you. It also keeps puppy safe - nothing to get stuck on, nothing to hurt themselves on, and nothing inappropriate to eat/chew.

At first you'd want to keep the pup in his/her crate every time they're unsupervised, including overnight, then as they start asking for out and learning what's good vs unacceptable behaviour start phasing out the crate. Or not. My dog's 2 and she still goes in her crate when nobody's home (she's an extremely high energy working dog and to her crate time means she can relax and doesn't have to be on guard or constantly watching me even if things are going on). Even when we are home she'll often go in there on her own to nap (overnight she likes to sleep in there but "patrols" the bedrooms every now and then make sure everybody's safe lol). It's her space and she knows nothing will bug her there. It's also where I feed her when she's not eating outside because she eats raw and I don't want her dragging meat all over the house.

I worked in an office 8hrs/day, but I was lucky with her in that I was also training dogs almost fulltime hours before/after my other job so she'd come with me to my training appointments, which served to help her training, get her a ton of exercise and socialization, and it helped the same with the dogs I worked with. Any cases where I didn't want her around the dog I was working with (aggressive cases, mostly, especially because she was just a puppy - my other dog, who's now passed, worked those cases) I'd leave her in the truck for that appt and it helped to teach her patience and how to behave in a vehicle.

Walks and playtime before and after work and at least one other good walk along with playtime when they're up for it and choosing a lower energy breed are the best ways to be successful.

I keep reading your expectations and I wonder if you've ever heard of Clumber Spaniels. They're a bit goofy looking in a cute sort of way, but they're fluffy and a manageable size (medium sized dog, but stocky and thick). I've been around a few and see them at the dog shows. I worked with one who LOVED playing fetch, but when you threw the ball, he'd WALK after it, then WALK back and drop the ball, and wiggle all excited for you to throw it again lol. As puppies they're pretty active, but quickly slow down and mellow out. The handlers and breeders at the dog shows have told me one of the challenges as they get older is getting them off the couch, but once you get them going they'll go willingly enough. They're technically a hunting dog but do well with small animals they're raised with and seem to be a bit low in the prey drive department. Definitely not a jogging partner.

Just a thought, anyhow, I know you're still considering options.


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## Pssh (May 10, 2011)

If I remember correctly, the females are more likely to get a certain cancer/disease if they are not spayed. Veggies are great for the bunnies but they need to be introduced slowly and gently. 


I use old towels covered by fleece as bedding so that I can just vaccum up the poops when I need to and change the towels once a week. Mine have a hay loft that is dedicated to hay only so they go up there to eat hay.


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## SandDeku (May 10, 2011)

Bigboy said:


> Okay, that makes sense.  What you seem to be looking for is a low energy dog that isn't going to demand hours of physical exercise each day from you or a new couch to destroy weekly.  Have you considered english bulldogs or english bulldog mixes?  They aren't pretty but they are some of the sweetest dogs I've ever known.  The only real problem, and it is a big one, is the high occurrence of diseases and disorders the breed experiences.  They have the temperament you are looking for and the activity level but they've been bred to the point of being at the physiological and genetic limit for dogs.
> 
> Additionally you could get an older dog or even a senior dog from a shelter that has its intensely hyper puppy years well behind it.


I don't like really old dogs. it's not that I just "don't like them" as I say I don't. But as my first very own dog. Of my own. Because I owned "family" dogs. But they were never really my "own". I kinda wanted ATLEAST a young dog. Doesn't have to be a pup. Atleast a year or two old is fine. I like english bulldogs. But someone told me not to get them. I love english bulldogs are you friggin kidding me? lol almost every dog personality test tells me I match more with a bulldog, chihuahua, min pinscher(answers vary sometimes). 


Yeah a NEW ruined couch would anger the heck out of me. :x But I heard you can train dogs NOT to ruin anything. lol.

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Crysta said:


> If bunny's could get that much dry hay in the wild they be great. hehe wild bunnys rarely need to drink since their hay is already full of water (grass, etc) Im always throwing handfulls of grass to buns, she loved it. (however u need to watch for lawn parasites etc, but im always like what the hell with that stuff... my brocoli i eat daily probably holds more bugs haha)
> 
> 
> alphalfa is for younger rabbits that require the calcium for their quick growth rate in their bones (from what im lead to believe) exess feeding of alphalfa, or anything rich in calcium will lead to lots of pee.
> ...


Okay i will spay/neuter her.  thanks! That lady was a liar! D: < Argh! so much frustration for nothing. ;-;  A lot of her poops smell terrible. Not as bad as ferret but yeah. She poops ALOT I wish she would take the dump in the litter box. As for scenting I guess it's better that it doesn't. lol. 

I never forget my other pets. Because I keep em in my room. If they were outside my room--- I most likely would forget. Dog or no dog. lol. I am routine needy. As in I go by routines specific. 

I supervise her alot when shes out. But yeah.


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## pouchedrat (May 11, 2011)

get that bunny spayed!  if for anything, it stops the poop marking and it prevents cancer!


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## SandDeku (May 11, 2011)

pouchedrat said:


> get that bunny spayed!  if for anything, it stops the poop marking and it prevents cancer!


I'm going to soon. I'm trying to find the best bunny doc. around here and set an apointment for the month. I found out prices. It goes for like 303dollars! yikes! oh well all for my bun bun.


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## Crysta (May 11, 2011)

You can ask rabbit shelters as well to see if they will do it for cheaper.


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## SandDeku (May 11, 2011)

Crysta said:


> You can ask rabbit shelters as well to see if they will do it for cheaper.


rabbit shelters? They'd do that?


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