# More Debunking the "Pythons-Are-Destroying-the-Everglades" Myth



## pitbulllady (Feb 27, 2012)

One correction I need to mention: "Shaw Heflin" should read "Shawn Heflick", who is a biologist who has extensively studied the Burmese Pythons in Florida.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/02/24/us-usa-pythons-everglades-idUSTRE81N24120120224

Kudus for an another article that does not strive for the "National Enquirer" or "Weekly World News" style of "journalism", though I'm betting that this won't be mentioned on any major news agency or picked up by any large news outlets at all.  It simply won't sell like "KILLER SNAKES DESTROYING ALL LIFE IN FLORIDA: YOUR KIDS AND PETS ARE NEXT!!"

pitbulllady

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## the toe cutter (Feb 29, 2012)

Too bad the US Senate passed H R 511. Foot is officially in the damn door.


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## Leora22 (Feb 29, 2012)

I read this, this afternoon. It is a good article, I wish some big medi outlet would pick it up and push it (in a good way of corse) . I also read a news report somewhere today saying peta kills 95% of the animals in their care ( I think it was on the daily caller). Ah it just gets me so upset. Anyway thank you for this post pitbullady  Peace


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## pitbulllady (Feb 29, 2012)

the toe cutter said:


> Too bad the US Senate passed H R 511. Foot is officially in the damn door.


Actually, no, it has not passed the US Senate, and has not BEEN to the US Senate.  Any bill with the prefix "H R" is a HOUSE bill, not a Senate bill.  The bill DID pass out of the House's Judiciary Committee, however.  For the full and current story, please go to this site and hear Andrew Wyatt's latest news on this bill: http://www.herpnation.com/audio/bre...-committee-hearing/?simple_nav_category=audio
This is still bad news, but not as bad as passing the full House or Senate.  

pitbulllady

Reactions: Like 1


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## mmfh (Feb 29, 2012)

Someone should mail copies of that report to the representatives and senators, maybe they would actually read it.

Reactions: Like 1


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## BenjaminBoa (Mar 5, 2012)

http://articles.latimes.com/2010/jan/15/nation/la-na-super-snake15-2010jan15

The only thing you need to debunk that <edit> is this. <_____< supersnake? <edit>!? when did we gain the ability to know what will happen if two species mate and have babies... and since when do species in the wild actively decide to mate with each other when they have members of their own population they could mate with instead!?

>___>; ohhh noooooo the big snake was preggo, readers if you have ever watched a horror movie you KNOW that this is forshadowing the end times, supersnake will be born!


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## pitbulllady (Mar 5, 2012)

BenjaminBoa said:


> http://articles.latimes.com/2010/jan/15/nation/la-na-super-snake15-2010jan15
> 
> The only thing you need to debunk that <edit> is this. <_____< supersnake? <edit>!? when did we gain the ability to know what will happen if two species mate and have babies... and since when do species in the wild actively decide to mate with each other when they have members of their own population they could mate with instead!?
> 
> >___>; ohhh noooooo the big snake was preggo, readers if you have ever watched a horror movie you KNOW that this is forshadowing the end times, supersnake will be born!


Actually, we DO know what will happen when African Rock Pythons and Burmese Pythons mate, because these hybrids do exist in captivity.  It's not a common cross because the two species usually show no interest in each other, and the offspring resemble the AfRocks more than Burms, which means they have less variable patterning and coloration, which is something that snake owners are attracted to.  I keep AfRocks now, and I honestly like them better than Burms, but if you're looking for morphs, there's only one, the Patternless, available in the US.  African Rocks don't get any bigger than Burms, are just as prone to respiratory infections.  Hybrids between them are no bigger than the parents.

pitbulllady


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## BenjaminBoa (Mar 5, 2012)

Yay? Wooo? Congrats? I don't know what you want me to say Pitlady.... Of course there are hybrids in captivity, that doesn't mean this is going to happen in the wild, and that does not mean we're going to have giant snakes that can eat people lol. My point is it is ridiculous they're spreading this <edit> to make people afraid of these big snakes so that they can pass all these stupid laws.


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## mikem (Mar 6, 2012)

BenjaminBoa said:


> Yay? Wooo? Congrats? I don't know what you want me to say Pitlady.... Of course there are hybrids in captivity, that doesn't mean this is going to happen in the wild, and *that does not mean we're going to have giant snakes that can eat people *lol. My point is it is ridiculous they're spreading this <edit> to make people afraid of these big snakes so that they can pass all these stupid laws.


that's what she was saying...


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## Louise E. Rothstein (Mar 8, 2012)

If accounts of "proliferating" python populations have any foundation in fact the "proliferating" pythons are growing big enough to produce pricey snakeskin products if those stupid bounties don't prompt ignorant slaughterbugs to squander the snakeskins...AND the meat inside:which allergic dogs will not be allergic to.

These are pricey,valuable products.

If there IS a harvest-And I do mean IF-

We should take it.


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## pitbulllady (Mar 8, 2012)

Louise E. Rothstein said:


> If accounts of "proliferating" python populations have any foundation in fact the "proliferating" pythons are growing big enough to produce pricey snakeskin products if those stupid bounties don't prompt ignorant slaughterbugs to squander the snakeskins...AND the meat inside:which allergic dogs will not be allergic to.
> 
> These are pricey,valuable products.
> 
> ...


Right now, there's not much of a market for snake skins, and the Lacy Act will actually prohibit trade in skins of this species, which, if the market for exotic snakeskins DOES resurge, will put considerable pressure on wild species like the Blood Pythons and our native Rattlesnakes, since Burmese and Rock Python skins will no longer be available.

As for pet food, I REALLY don't think you would want to feed Burmese Python to your dog or cat, allergies or no allergies, and here is why:
http://www.livescience.com/8528-mercury-invasive-pythons-menu.html
As apex predators living in what is already actually a very toxic and polluted environment, these snakes have accumulated high levels of mercury in their tissues, making them toxic for humans and other carnivores to consume.

pitbulllady


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## Ziltoid (Mar 10, 2012)

I guess you guys never say the photo of a Python that ate a full grown doe? that is a small indication that we have an ecological issue. ( I can't see many people being eaten by one of these snakes) But it is surely hurting the ecosystem. I think they should do something about this perhaps make a registration of some sort. (however that will fail) There is no real way to fix the problem it seems. sadly. I also don't think your government would want to pay for monitoring Snakes when banning them all together is simple and cheap.


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## pitbulllady (Mar 10, 2012)

Ziltoid said:


> I guess you guys never say the photo of a Python that ate a full grown doe? that is a small indication that we have an ecological issue. ( I can't see many people being eaten by one of these snakes) But it is surely hurting the ecosystem. I think they should do something about this perhaps make a registration of some sort. (however that will fail) There is no real way to fix the problem it seems. sadly. I also don't think your government would want to pay for monitoring Snakes when banning them all together is simple and cheap.


Keep in mind that a full-grown White-Tail doe in south Florida is only about the size of a Labrador; the deer in question was estimated to have weighed around 75 pounds, which even in South Carolina, would be too small to legally shoot.  Yes, there is an ecological issue anytime you introduce non-native species into any environment, but in the case of the Burms, that issue has been grossly exaggerated by the media and the Animal Rights groups who are using this as ammunition to ban ALL reptiles, and eventually all animals, period.  You also have to consider the plethora of other non-native species which have made the Everglades home, many of which have been there for longer than the pythons, including one of the most destructive, most aggressive and fastest-reproducing animals aside from humans, the feral hogs.  They not only will kill and eat any animal they can catch, including deer, but actually DO physically alter the land and abiotic aspects of the environment with their constant rooting and digging.  They will uproot and girder trees, and unlike the pythons, they WILL go after humans with little provocation.  I used to hunt wild hogs, and I know how dangerous and prolific they are.  There is also a thriving feral cat population in the 'Glades, and coyotes, which are not native to any eastern state, are very common there, too.  Cats and 'yotes all eat native birds and mammals.  Another factor mentioned in the article I linked to is the native Florida Panther, or cougar, which is making a come-back from the brink of extinction, although it's debatable how pure the cats are.  The Florida Fish and Wildlife people released several TX cougars a couple of decades ago to breed with the Florida cats, so the cats there now are likely hybrids, or more accurately, intergrades.  The more cougars, the more animals they're going to eat, and I'm sure that python will be on the menu!

Florida actually did have a registration/permit system, but has since gone for an all-out ban except for snakes owned by dealers, who used to be able to sell them out-of-state, but as of March 23, no longer will be able to do so legally.  A Federal ban will have absolutely NO impact on the population of snakes already in the Everglades, none whatsoever, and is a pointless waste of time and money for enforcement.  In fact, NO Federal legislation is going to do anything about the snakes already in the Everglades.  It is a Florida issue and needs to be dealt with IN FLORIDA AND ONLY FLORIDA.

AND, while I'm on the myth-debunking, here is yet-another artical which came out recently that debunks ANOTHER popular and widely-believed myth about the Burmese Pythons in Florida, the "Pythons are There Because They Were Released By Irresponsible Pet Owners" myth:  http://axcessnews.com/index.php/articles/show/id/22357 .  ALL of the snakes captured or killed in the Everglades are very, very closely related to one another, highly inbred, which could only mean that they are all descended from a small initial group of animals, NOT a large group of genetically-diverse animals from different locale origins that were released at different times over a period of many years or decades, which is what one would expect if indeed pet owners were to blame.

pitbulllady


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## Galapoheros (Mar 10, 2012)

I'm at war with deer, counted 19 in my backyard today, they destroy the plants.  I'd love to see a bunch of snakes eat those things haha!  I gave my BB gun a workout today(I'm in the city limits), fun times haha("your meeeeeaaan")  You go P-lady! woohoo!  I'm pretty much in the same boat, the environmentalism spin gets so far out-of-hand sometimes.  I didn't read all the links, but happened to read the "high mercury" link.  I'm even suspicious of that article.  I feel we are lied to so often that it makes me wonder if there is an ulterior motive for making such a claim.  I get a gut feeling that it's not what it seems also.


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## LV-426 (Mar 11, 2012)

I live in Miami, Fl and every other week they are finding Burms. I don't think they are exaggerating when they say those things are close to being outta control.


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## pitbulllady (Mar 12, 2012)

LV-426 said:


> I live in Miami, Fl and every other week they are finding Burms. I don't think they are exaggerating when they say those things are close to being outta control.


Who are "they"?  Unless you see it yourself, or it's confirmed by the Fish and Wildlife people, I wouldn't trust the reports.  There are already a lot of urban legends growing up around this whole thing, spreading like wildfire due to the internet.  Someone finds a pic on the 'net, claims the snake in the pic was found in FL, emails it to several friends or posts it to FB, and it just takes off from there.  You have no idea how many times I've been emailed that same pic of the AfRock that was electrocuted on the elephant fence in South Africa, claiming that the snake was killed in Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, etc.  There is also, as I mentioned before, the problem of people seeing ordinary, native snakes and assuming that they're seeing some huge exotic snake.  I see this all the time, during the warm months, as do several of my aquaintances who do professional wildlife removal.  To a person who is scared of snakes and knows little about them, a four-foot Water Snake is a 12-foot Burmese Python.  I've gone to pick up several "pythons" in the past couple of years that were actually Rat Snakes.  The only exotic I've found was an unexpected Brazilian Rainbow Boa, which was in bad shape.

pitbulllady


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## LV-426 (Mar 13, 2012)

pitbulllady said:


> Who are "they"?  Unless you see it yourself, or it's confirmed by the Fish and Wildlife people, I wouldn't trust the reports.  There are already a lot of urban legends growing up around this whole thing, spreading like wildfire due to the internet.  Someone finds a pic on the 'net, claims the snake in the pic was found in FL, emails it to several friends or posts it to FB, and it just takes off from there.  You have no idea how many times I've been emailed that same pic of the AfRock that was electrocuted on the elephant fence in South Africa, claiming that the snake was killed in Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, etc.  There is also, as I mentioned before, the problem of people seeing ordinary, native snakes and assuming that they're seeing some huge exotic snake.  I see this all the time, during the warm months, as do several of my aquaintances who do professional wildlife removal.  To a person who is scared of snakes and knows little about them, a four-foot Water Snake is a 12-foot Burmese Python.  I've gone to pick up several "pythons" in the past couple of years that were actually Rat Snakes.  The only exotic I've found was an unexpected Brazilian Rainbow Boa, which was in bad shape.
> 
> pitbulllady


I watch the local news and read the newspaper. When they find a python in someone's back yard they usually show it on the 5pm news. I have seen one dead on the road goin to Key Largo. I don't doubt they are all over the place in the Everglades, but I seriously doubt they will migrate out of south Fl.


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## pitbulllady (Mar 13, 2012)

LV-426 said:


> I watch the local news and read the newspaper. When they find a python in someone's back yard they usually show it on the 5pm news. I have seen one dead on the road goin to Key Largo. I don't doubt they are all over the place in the Everglades, but I seriously doubt they will migrate out of south Fl.


But again, who are "THEY"?  Homeowners?  PeTA? Reptile breeders?  News reporters?  I know Fox News loves to bring out the SAME video of the SAME snake over and over again, each time claiming it's a recent capture.  The media loves this, loves keeping it in the spotlight, even if that means re-using the same video clips over and over and claiming it's of a different snake.  I also know that there's been more than a few cases of AR's deliberately releasing snakes in suburban areas where they'd be certainly found, to keep making their point.  It's odd that people who are actually experienced field herpers and hunters go down to the Glades and can't find any pythons, and these are people who are very familiar with finding and catching snakes, while so many other people claim to practically have pythons hanging from their ceiling fans.  Stange.  Not saying that there aren't pythons there; THAT is well-documented, but I have to call into question the numbers made by some claims.  It would be fairly easy to erradicate them if they were that easy to find, like shooting fish in the proverbial barrel.

pitbulllady

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## LV-426 (Mar 13, 2012)

Have the python hunters searched every square inch of the glades?


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## Galapoheros (Mar 13, 2012)

I think that question makes the point that they might be making assumptions about it being such a big problem.  If they haven't searched every square inch, why claim as a fact that it's such a big problem?  Pythons don't eat very often so I'm wondering if it would ever be a huge problem for the local wildlife anyway.  Basically I think it's not a good situation but whether I like it or not, there are different ways of looking at the situation.  Maybe snake skin boots will get cheaper lol.  It might open up a door for park revenue during snake hunting season.  Best to get rid of wild populations but if that never happens, things will adapt, maybe not the way we want but nature doesn't care whether we care or not.


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## The Snark (Mar 13, 2012)

*Deadly giant pythons in every yard!*

Now that I got someones attention, and please accept my apologies, I would reiterate what Pitbulllady said:


pitbulllady said:


> But again, who are "THEY"?  Homeowners?  PeTA? Reptile breeders?  News reporters?  I know Fox News loves to bring out the SAME video of the SAME snake over and over again, each time claiming it's a recent capture.  The media loves this, loves keeping it in the spotlight, even if that means re-using the same video clips over and over and claiming it's of a different snake.  I also know that there's been more than a few cases of AR's deliberately releasing snakes in suburban areas where they'd be certainly found, to keep making their point.  It's odd that people who are actually experienced field herpers and hunters go down to the Glades and can't find any pythons, and these are people who are very familiar with finding and catching snakes, while so many other people claim to practically have pythons hanging from their ceiling fans.  Stange.  Not saying that there aren't pythons there; THAT is well-documented, but I have to call into question the numbers made by some claims.  It would be fairly easy to erradicate them if they were that easy to find, like shooting fish in the proverbial barrel.
> 
> pitbulllady


In other words, PLEASE! Stop swallowing media hype bullpucks. If pythons are found, they will be reported by proper responsible agencies, not hype and tripe sensationalist news.
Meanwhile, here we have the reticulated python covering every inch of the country. In theory. A quick web search tells me that they get up to 30 feet long and can be encountered in hotel rooms. This makes me rather depressed. Living in a recovering rainforest for nearly 5 years I've seen 2. No, one. One turned out to be a ball. 
What the crap media isn't pointing out are things like the pythons deadliest enemies: highways and stupid people. While they, being highly aquatic, have certainly found a niche in the deep swamps ecosystem, pythons in general do not handle modern world at all well. 

Again, please. Check the sources of your news. Get the real facts. Please. We owe this to wildlife the world over.

A Ret caught in the chicken coop. Let's quote the top web page that comes up in a seach:
"_These snakes are very aggressive and bite at the slightest disturbance. A snake from 4 meters long and upwards poses a danger to humans, not because of its poison, but because of its sheer size._"
Notice how I am in deadly peril, some 18 inches from the ravening monster. Notice how I am being enveloped in it's massive coils and am barely able to operate the camera.


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## Louise E. Rothstein (Mar 13, 2012)

Lacy's stupid ban on sales of Everglades python skins will certainly encourage these expatriate animals to "breed outta control..."that is,if inbreeding by the Everglades animals doesn't become a controlling factor by reducing their size,wrecking their health,reducing their fertility,or every one of the above.


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## lizardminion (Mar 13, 2012)

pitbulllady said:


> But again, who are "THEY"?  Homeowners?  PeTA? Reptile breeders?  News reporters?  I know Fox News loves to bring out the SAME video of the SAME snake over and over again, each time claiming it's a recent capture.  The media loves this, loves keeping it in the spotlight, even if that means re-using the same video clips over and over and claiming it's of a different snake.  I also know that there's been more than a few cases of AR's deliberately releasing snakes in suburban areas where they'd be certainly found, to keep making their point.  It's odd that people who are actually experienced field herpers and hunters go down to the Glades and can't find any pythons, and these are people who are very familiar with finding and catching snakes, while so many other people claim to practically have pythons hanging from their ceiling fans.  Stange.  Not saying that there aren't pythons there; THAT is well-documented, but I have to call into question the numbers made by some claims.  It would be fairly easy to erradicate them if they were that easy to find, like shooting fish in the proverbial barrel.
> 
> pitbulllady


I'd say Fox News has myths of it's own- being someone who's forced to watch it all day. They they never mention anything about wildlife, except their bear alerts. They only had one (short) segment about a video in the past half year with a unspecified python in someone's pool. That was the only time they mentioned burms for a long while.
All they ever talk about now are the GOP candidates and foreign policy and the such. Sheesh, Fox News needs it's own debunking... It's not like George Soros is running them, as apposed to CNN...

I am sick of the bullcrap lies spread about the Burmese Pythons. I'm truly sick of it. You always have your brainwashed idiots who are so naive to take into word about whatever the media and someone else says. They have no clue about what they're talking about. Go hear it from a professional biologists who specializes in pythons; not the internet.

To the mainstream media, invasive pythons are old news. They've already dealt their damage. Most of the house is already burned down. Every article you see pop up is just them continuously trying to stomp the rest of the house down.


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## pitbulllady (Mar 13, 2012)

The Snark said:


> Now that I got someones attention, and please accept my apologies, I would reiterate what Pitbulllady said:
> 
> 
> In other words, PLEASE! Stop swallowing media hype bullpucks. If pythons are found, they will be reported by proper responsible agencies, not hype and tripe sensationalist news.
> ...


Cute little python, but that's a Burm, not a Retic.  
To put the threat in perspective: I've kept and lived with large constrictors since I was 12 years old, and I'm all of a whopping 5' 2".  Never been seriously injured, not once.  My sister, who is younger than me, has horses, three of 'em.  She's only kept horses for like, the past 15 years.  She has been hospitalized three times from being kicked, stomped or thrown from a horse.  No one is trying to ban horses.  No one considers the danger from horses.  No one ever says, "the only good horse is a dead horse".  There ARE quite a lot of feral horses, especially in our western states, but there are some in the East, too, and guess what?  They have Federal PROTECTION!  It is ILLEGAL to shoot them, even though the damage THEY do the ecology of the places where they live is well-documented.  Now, I don't hate horses-wouldn't have one, but I don't hate 'em, and I certainly don't want people to go around blasting the mustangs or marsh tackies or Sable Island ponies...but seriously, why the hate directed at the Burms, which are only found in ONE very limited area?  If you're going to wage all-out war on an invasive specie in the Everglades, how about starting with feral pigs and feral cats, the former of which actually alters the LAND itself, which snakes don't do...oh, wait, those are mammals, aren't they?

pitbulllady


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## lizardminion (Mar 13, 2012)

pitbulllady said:


> Cute little python, but that's a Burm, not a Retic.
> To put the threat in perspective: I've kept and lived with large constrictors since I was 12 years old, and I'm all of a whopping 5' 2".  Never been seriously injured, not once.  My sister, who is younger than me, has horses, three of 'em.  She's only kept horses for like, the past 15 years.  She has been hospitalized three times from being kicked, stomped or thrown from a horse.  No one is trying to ban horses.  No one considers the danger from horses.  No one ever says, "the only good horse is a dead horse".  There ARE quite a lot of feral horses, especially in our western states, but there are some in the East, too, and guess what?  They have Federal PROTECTION!  It is ILLEGAL to shoot them, even though the damage THEY do the ecology of the places where they live is well-documented.  Now, I don't hate horses-wouldn't have one, but I don't hate 'em, and I certainly don't want people to go around blasting the mustangs or marsh tackies or Sable Island ponies...but seriously, why the hate directed at the Burms, which are only found in ONE very limited area?  If you're going to wage all-out war on an invasive specie in the Everglades, how about starting with feral pigs and feral cats, the former of which actually alters the LAND itself, which snakes don't do...oh, wait, those are mammals, aren't they?
> 
> pitbulllady


I've actually read comments on youtube vids that say "If it doesn't cuddle you, it shouldn't be a pet and should be eradicated." and the such.
It's people's ignorance and stupidity that drives the world to hell. It's not only reason why we have the snake haters, it's also why we have idiots in politics and a crappy economy.
As time goes by, people lose a sense of what life is all about.

Now, let's not complain.

Let's talk solutions.


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## The Snark (Mar 14, 2012)

That's a Burm? Shows how much of a pro I am. :biggrin:

Okay, then grandpa is a what? I know he is highly agressive, waking up once every 2 or 3 days to glomp a chicken or two. (During that brief period you want to stay away from the end with the eyes.)

Grandpa. Maybe 150 lbs now. Maybe more.





(A couple of months ago this guy was nice enough to leave the largest part of his body sticking out so I could measure him. 29+ inches in circumference. He's still got a ways to go before he could put away a Fox News announcer.)


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## Galapoheros (Mar 14, 2012)

Ryan the Roach Guy said:


> I've actually read comments on youtube vids that say "If it doesn't cuddle you, it shouldn't be a pet and should be eradicated." and the such.
> It's people's ignorance and stupidity that drives the world to hell. It's not only reason why we have the snake haters, it's also why we have idiots in politics and a crappy economy.
> As time goes by, people lose a sense of what life is all about.
> 
> ...



Yeah I think people let words be the source of thought too much when it should be the other way around.  Haha, can get kind of confusing because it's hard not to think of words when thinking of thoughts, LOL, huh?  Anyway, I don't see 99% of the stuff talked about on this site as being pets.  I see them as things of interest or terrarium specimens for observation, well see I don't think we have a word for it, do we?  Because "pet", it doesn't really fit imo.  I've run across the same thing with people.  They say, "What for?!, that's not a pet!"  I agree with them that it's not a pet, so I think people should imagine what the interest is, then come up with a word for it.  So far I guess it's called a hobby, invertebrate hobby.  It's been discussed somewhere on this site.


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## lizardminion (Mar 14, 2012)

Galapoheros said:


> Yeah I think people let words be the source of thought too much when it should be the other way around.  Haha, can get kind of confusing because it's hard not to think of words when thinking of thoughts, LOL, huh?  Anyway, I don't see 99% of the stuff talked about on this site as being pets.  I see them as things of interest or terrarium specimens for observation, well see I don't think we have a word for it, do we?  Because "pet", it doesn't really fit imo.  I've run across the same thing with people.  They say, "What for?!, that's not a pet!"  I agree with them that it's not a pet, so I think people should imagine what the interest is, then come up with a word for it.  So far I guess it's called a hobby, invertebrate hobby.  It's been discussed somewhere on this site.


I don't get the term really.
You aren't raising it for food or convenience.
A pet is an animal kept for pleasure, rather than utility.
So I see no harm in calling them a pet. It may not be a "stereotypical" pet, but just because, say, a teenager doesn't follow the stereotype of being a hard-headed troublemaker, doesn't mean they're not a teenager, no?


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## Galapoheros (Mar 14, 2012)

I think the problem is defining the hobby with a word.  Nah, I see no harm at all in calling them pets but I also see how it doesn't fit in the minds of people.  I think at least somewhere in the minds of people they associate pets with being able to "pet" the animal, interaction.  That's how people see it so they don't see it as fitting their definition of it.  Basically the whole thing comes down to a problem of semantics.  But, maybe in another thread, I don't want to go off the tracks here, don't know what else to say about it anyway though.


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## The Snark (Mar 14, 2012)

Just so we are on the same wavelength.
Pet:
1. any domesticated or tamed animal that is kept as a companion and cared for affectionately.

So, if you keep an animal that isn't tame, or may or not be tame but you view it with indifference or strong objectivity, it probably isn't a pet, unless you pet it? But hold the phone a second. 

Cuddle:
verb (used without object)
2. to lie close and snug; nestle. 

Well well well. Pythons definitely cuddle... err snug anyway. 

"How absolute the knave is! We must speak by the card else equivocation will undo us!" -Willy-


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## pitbulllady (Mar 14, 2012)

The Snark said:


> That's a Burm? Shows how much of a pro I am. :biggrin:
> 
> Okay, then grandpa is a what? I know he is highly agressive, waking up once every 2 or 3 days to glomp a chicken or two. (During that brief period you want to stay away from the end with the eyes.)
> 
> ...


"Grandpa" is an old Burm, probably a GrandMA, since Burms that attain that size are almost always females! In Pythons and Boas, chicks rule; the females get larger than the males, often a LOT larger.

pitbulllady


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## The Snark (Mar 15, 2012)

pitbulllady said:


> "Grandpa" is an old Burm, probably a GrandMA, since Burms that attain that size are almost always females! In Pythons and Boas, chicks rule; the females get larger than the males, often a LOT larger.
> 
> pitbulllady


 Not meaning to hijack the thread, but how can you tell a male from a female? And if we are talking a close physical examination, forget it!
By the way, why are most of our rescue pythons Burms?


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## pitbulllady (Mar 15, 2012)

The Snark said:


> Not meaning to hijack the thread, but how can you tell a male from a female? And if we are talking a close physical examination, forget it!
> By the way, why are most of our rescue pythons Burms?


. 

You stated that the Burm in the pic weighed around 150 lbs.  While it's not impossible for a male to get to that size, it is uncommon.  Males also tend to be less girthy, and the snake in the pic is a really thick snake.  While it's not possible to be sure without examining the actual snake, it's a reasonable inference that the snake in your pic is a female.  
I'm not clear on whose "rescue pythons" you mean, those in Thailand or those in the US, but Burms are obviously very common wild snakes in Thailand.  Here in the US they are common pets, and of course the more popular an animal is, the more likely you are to see them wind up in rescues.  Labrador retrievers are popular dogs, for instance, but also common in rescues and animal shelters.  It simply reflects their numbers.

Pitbulllady


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## jayefbe (Mar 15, 2012)

I'm so glad this thread is here. I'm sorry I missed it earlier.

I have read the PNAS paper, "Burmese pythons have severely reduced populations of several species of formerly common mammals", that the article is mentioning. I am a PhD candidate in ecology and evolution, so I say I have a pretty well educated opinion and am VERY familiar with ecological and evolutionary scientific articles. Now, normally PNAS is one of the BEST journals in the field, and is reserved for the most interesting, most exciting, and well supported studies around. This article, however, was COMPLETE CRAP. The data was MINUTE, and the analysis did not control for MANY MANY confounding variables. Honestly, if the "killer pythons in the everglades" story wasn't a huge thing in the media, it never would have been published in that journal. It is, by far, the worst article I've ever read in PNAS, and I'm disappointed in the journal for letting it go by.


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## Louise E. Rothstein (Mar 20, 2012)

That stupid ban on "Burmese" snakeskins will probably bring "these things" closer to "being outta control."

So may the equally stupid snake slaughters that tend to prevent overcrowding and epidemic disease...especially in a population that is already inbred.

Had such "control" not been done they might have died.

---------- Post added 03-20-2012 at 09:26 PM ----------

Perhaps the next generation will kill them with kindness.
Within a few more years of fearmongering nonsense and bureaucratic stupidity the Floridian pythons will be replaced by the next sensation.
 At which point they will probably "die" on the news.
If they do multiply out of control overcrowded and inbreeding animals will die of epidemic disease.
If their breeding isn't really as "uncontrolled" as all that they will integrate into the Everglades ecosystem...
In fact,I suspect,sight unseen,that they already have.


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