# P. metallica enclosure size



## meghanbe (Jul 9, 2012)

I've literally spent over an hour searching for a straight answer to my question, to no avail. I apologize if this has been covered elsewhere. My biggest problem has been finding a consensus.

At what size would I need to worry about rehousing a _P. metallica_ from an 8x8x12 Exo Terra Nano terrarium into something larger? If I do acquire this species (I'm still in the research and decision-making phase), I would want to keep rehousing to a minimum and I know they're pretty fast growers...ideally I would love to get away with only one rehousing, two tops. This is a theoretical _P. metallica_ as this point, so initial size is unknown. I can't imagine I want to pay for anything over 2-3", though. 1-2" is more likely. I definitely want to start at sling or juvie stage to help me get used to its speed and attitude before its an adult.

Thanks in advance for your advice. I've read a lot of conflicting opinions about optimum (or even adequate) enclosure size for _P. metallicas_, which I know are one of the smaller pokies. I'll probably stick with an Exo Terra enclosure because I like the top and front opening options. One person indicated that a 8x8x12 enclosure might be adequate for an adult, but that seems smallish to me. The next size up is 12x12x18. Then again, I know T's don't exactly need a lot of room...


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## poisoned (Jul 10, 2012)

Well, it's for sure way too big for sling, pill boxes are great for slings. It's also big enough for adult, no worries.


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## Storm76 (Jul 10, 2012)

Question: Why do you want to put her into rather something too big than having to rehouse her?

Assumption: You wouldn't really feel comfortable having to "deal" (rehousing etc.) with this species, but want to own one since a lot of people have them.

Suggestion: If you don't feel fine with having to deal with a certain species - DON'T get it. 


It's better for your AND the T's safety, since accidents CAN happen, much more so if someone is overly unsure. 

Just my 2 cents...

Reactions: Like 3


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## Curious jay (Jul 10, 2012)

Storm76 said:


> Question: Why do you want to put her into rather something too big than having to rehouse her?
> 
> Assumption: You wouldn't really feel comfortable having to "deal" (rehousing etc.) with this species, but want to own one since a lot of people have them.
> 
> ...



I agree fully with this statement. I'd like to own a few Poecis and a couple of the baboons but because I own 2 very inquisitive dogs I can't buy them as I'm worried on the off chance I get a runner who comes into contact with my dogs im likely to lose a dog and a T. Not worth the risk IMO rather watch feeding videos of them instead haha.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Storm76 (Jul 10, 2012)

I'd like to point out that I don't want to offend the OP with my post above, I was in a hurry and just typed it down...however, my opinion stands as written.


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## Aviara (Jul 10, 2012)

I'd like to add, rehousing is stressful, both for the T's owner and for the animal itself. In addition, if someone does not own a lot of enclosures, it can be expensive to rehouse multiple times. There are other reasons, besides lack of confidence, that could be driving this unwillingness to rehouse tarantulas multiple times. Personally, I found it a hair-raising experience the first time I moved my Avicularia versicolor sling, not because it was particularly scary or dangerous for me, but because I was terrified the little 1/2 inch sling was going to get lost or hurt during the process. Granted, it all worked out well, but any time you are rehousing a tarantula, it is somewhat risky for the invertebrate.

If the OP is truly nervous about owning a Poecilotheria, it may be better to get more experience with slightly slower, more docile or less-venomous species. I agree that respect and confidence are needed when working with species like P. metallica. However, to answer the simple question of housing a 1" sling, I keep my 1" OBT in a 36-oz deli cup, and he has a lot of room to grow in there. The cup gives him enough room that, if he decided to live as an arboreal, as your P. metallica would, he would have plenty of room. He will likely next be rehoused into a larger cereal container, which can be found at a Container Store or most grocery stores, and then finally into an Exo Terra or similar-sized enclosure.


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## meghanbe (Jul 10, 2012)

I'm not suggesting that I keep a sling in an 8x8x12 enclosure, guys.    That would be for a juvie (around 3", I'm thinking). A sling would obviously start out in a much smaller enclosure (probably a pill vial...I have a couple spares on my shelf). My question is at what (adult) size would a _P. metallica_ need to be moved out of a 8x8x12 enclosure into something like a 12x12x18? I don't think that wanting to keep rehousings to a minimum (and doing them at the smallest size possible) is indicative of a lack of capability as far as keeping a certain species. It just means that someone wishes to minimize the risk of escape or accidents occurring as much as possible--and also minimize disruption to a tarantula who probably doesn't want to be messed with all that often.   If I _didn't_ feel that way about a hot species like a poeci, then I'd say I wasn't ready to take one on. But having done my research, I want to be as respectful/careful as possible. I'd argue that means I _am_ ready.

By the way...I try to keep rehousing to a minimum with my docile NW's, too. The fact is, once a T starts to set up their home by digging burrows, webbing, and generally claiming it as their safe space, I don't relish uprooting them and making them start over any more than necessary. I imagine that's quite stressful for the T. Rehousings are stressful for everyone, let's face it. With a potent OW, even more so. Anyone who doesn't feel that way probably isn't taking the situation very seriously.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## BiGpDaMoNsTa (Jul 10, 2012)

I think the 8x8x12 is enough space for even an adult _metallica_. My 6" _regalis_ lives in one right now, and Id' wager he is as happy as any pokie in the world. The longer I am part of the hobby, the more I gravitate to smaller enclosures. I like them better.

I understand that you don't like them better though, and that's cool. So to answer your question, a sub-adult could be kept in the Nano Tall super-comfortably until at least 5 or 5 1/2". By that point, if you feel you want to re-house (hopefully) her into the larger exo-terra, you should be much more comfortable and confident with your tarantula, and re-housing will be much less stressful for you, and therefore it as well. Might I even say it will be fun? (for you not the spider )


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## meghanbe (Jul 10, 2012)

BiGpDaMoNsTa said:


> I think the 8x8x12 is enough space for even an adult _metallica_. My 6" _regalis_ lives in one right now, and Id' wager he is as happy as any pokie in the world. The longer I am part of the hobby, the more I gravitate to smaller enclosures. I like them better.


Actually, I'd love to stick with an 8x8x12 for an adult _metallica_ if you think it's possible. I have enough T's now--and limited shelf space--that I'd much rather go smaller than larger. That was part of my confusion in doing research...some people were advocating 10 gallon tanks for even the smaller poecis, while a couple people said an 8x8x12 would be sufficient. You've totally answered my question. Thank you.


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## rockhopper (Jul 10, 2012)

The confusion is because enclosure size is mostly personal preference.  As long as the spider has room to live it doesn't seem to be much of an issue keeping them in large or small enclosures in my experience.


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## Lopez (Jul 10, 2012)

8x8x12 is more than big enough.

I keep small adult Poecs (metallica/formosa etc) in quite small tanks (4.2'' x 6.2'' x 12.4'')


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## meghanbe (Jul 10, 2012)

Storm76 said:


> Assumption: You wouldn't really feel comfortable having to "deal" (rehousing etc.) with this species, but want to own one since a lot of people have them.


By the way, I want to address this. I don't make decisions about which tarantulas I wish to keep based on what other people have. A lot of people have _G. roseas_, too, but I'm not running out to get one because they don't personally appeal to me. I also have no desire to own an OBT despite their popularity as beginner OW's. I completely appreciate your sentiment (don't get a T you're not prepared to deal with), and I know you already apologized for your tone, but I had to point out how snarky a comment like this actually is. You know nothing about me. If you did, you'd realize that following the crowd is almost never my goal. lol.

In case you're curious, one reason I'm considering a poeci is because they're one of the very few T's that my partner has really been struck by--the other is the _A. versicolor_ (which I also have). My partner has been pretty unenthusiastic about my collection (not out of fear or discomfort, as she's owned many reptiles--including some not-so-friendly ones--and even had a T as a teenager... she's just been disinterested), and so if she's excited about the prospect of a poeci, then I'm excited about that! I've been coveting the entire _Poecilitheria_ genus for a while now and think they're gorgeous (like everyone else, I suppose, but that's just because I'm not blind). When I purchased my _P. cambridgei_ slings, one thought was that they would help prepare me for an eventual poeci. My partner is aware that poecis are OW and what that means, and she's still interested. The idea of getting her more engaged in my passion is undeniably appealing. 

The reason I'm thinking about a _P. metallica_ in particular is because, despite the price, they are suggested over and over again as an ideal starter poeci. I also considered a _subfusca_, but right now the price difference isn't actually very big, and my collection size is limited, so I figured that if I do get a poeci, I'll go for the gold and get the one that appeals to me the most.

Hopefully that helps clarify my motivations.   As I said in my OP, I am still in the research and decision-making phase. I don't take the decision to get a poeci lightly and certainly wouldn't do so if I didn't think I could handle it. I'm a pretty smart girl, after all.

Reactions: Like 1


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## catfishrod69 (Jul 10, 2012)

I keep all of my adult Pokies in exo terra 12x12x18. They use every inch of it. It also gives you a little more room to work with.


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## jayefbe (Jul 10, 2012)

Aviara said:


> I'd like to add, rehousing is stressful, both for the T's owner and for the animal itself. In addition, if someone does not own a lot of enclosures, it can be expensive to rehouse multiple times. There are other reasons, besides lack of confidence, that could be driving this unwillingness to rehouse tarantulas multiple times. Personally, I found it a hair-raising experience the first time I moved my Avicularia versicolor sling, not because it was particularly scary or dangerous for me, but because I was terrified the little 1/2 inch sling was going to get lost or hurt during the process. Granted, it all worked out well, but any time you are rehousing a tarantula, it is somewhat risky for the invertebrate.


I've never spent more than $5 on a sling or juvie enclosure. You may save a few bucks, but that's it. 

And your example still is a lack of confidence. A rehousing should pose no risk to tarantula or the keeper. And it should only be minimally stressful to the tarantula. All of my tarantulas will eat the day I rehouse them, so it can't be that bad. Yes, part of that comes with some experience, but I would still argue that if you're so nervous about a tarantula that you're looking for ways to limit rehousings, then you're probably not ready for it.


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## Storm76 (Jul 10, 2012)

Although I said I didn't want to offend you, I obviously did...well that happens. I was well aware that you're not only owning a single T or the like, hence not being a completely new keeper. That wasn't my point. Also, I absolutely like the statement about not wanting to rip a T out of a just accepted enclosure again, too.

However, rehousings have to happen at some point and although some may have made other experiences, I don't see the harm coming with that. There sure is a risk of harming the T (best example would be if getting bitten flinging it by reaction through the room) - but aside that I fail to see any risk with it. Especially not, if when done in a spacey enviroment where there is no such chance as a T getting lost. It's one of the points I can't understand anyways, some people do their transfers in rooms crowded with stuff where a T can easily get lost by not being able to find it again and when it happens they get all worried. It's not THAT much trouble to do a transfer in the bathroom (as example) where there is not much space a T could hide and one wouldn't have reason to worry.

Either way, I wasn't "snarky" just posting my thoughts and it's somewhat ringing an alarm bell for me if I read things along the line of yours regarding keeping rehousings to a minimum. Just sounds for me like the possible keeper is insecure about it overall. 

Sorry for having being blunt, it was just personal thought and an advise. 

As a sidenote, I fully agree to what catfishrod69 and JFB said.

EDIT: Personally, I'd house it as juvie in a Medium Arboreal Tank and maybe transfer it to a Large Arboreal Tank from Tarantulacages.com (saying it this way, since I don't remember the measurments)


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## Tmobo (Jul 11, 2012)

I Would say a 8x8x12 would be fine if your trying to conserve on space. Maybe move the T into that size enclosure when it reaches 3" or so and see how that works out. That way you would minimalize the rehousings and stress on the T. You would also have a little time to see how it reacts to being in something of that size and adjust the needs accordingly. I don't see this being a problem as long as the T seems happy.


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## meghanbe (Jul 11, 2012)

To be honest, I'm not sure whether I will _ever_ not be just a little nervous about rehousing a fast-moving, possibly defensive OW tarantula. I don't see this as a deficiency or even a sign that I shouldn't own a fast, defensive species. I see it as a human reaction to entering into a situation that carries the risk of harm to me or my pet. At this point, I've read enough forum posts and watched enough YouTube videos to know that I am far from the only T keeper who feels this way. Many keepers approach certain tasks with a good dose of caution (tongs awkwardly snaked through barely-opened enclosures, tarantulas-in-a-bag, and more). I've read many admissions of slight anxiety during rehousings and tank maintenance. I've watched experienced keepers of potent OW's literally shake on camera after a particularly tricky rehousing or escape attempt. These are all human reactions. I am confident that despite my nerves, I can do what needs to be done. Much of that confidence springs from the fact that over the past year, I have done all kinds of things I never would've thought I could do (including keeping tarantulas in the first place). I've discovered what a capable person I really am. 

Food for thought: How does one overcome anxiety about performing certain tasks if not by doing them?


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## Storm76 (Jul 11, 2012)

meghanbe said:


> To be honest, I'm not sure whether I will _ever_ not be just a little nervous about rehousing a fast-moving, possibly defensive OW tarantula. I don't see this as a deficiency or even a sign that I shouldn't own a fast, defensive species. I see it as a human reaction to entering into a situation that carries the risk of harm to me or my pet. At this point, I've read enough forum posts and watched enough YouTube videos to know that I am far from the only T keeper who feels this way. Many keepers approach certain tasks with a good dose of caution (tongs awkwardly snaked through barely-opened enclosures, tarantulas-in-a-bag, and more). I've read many admissions of slight anxiety during rehousings and tank maintenance. I've watched experienced keepers of potent OW's literally shake on camera after a particularly tricky rehousing or escape attempt. These are all human reactions. I am confident that despite my nerves, I can do what needs to be done. Much of that confidence springs from the fact that over the past year, I have done all kinds of things I never would've thought I could do (including keeping tarantulas in the first place). I've discovered what a capable person I really am.
> 
> Food for thought: How does one overcome anxiety about performing certain tasks if not by doing them?


Admittedly, I'm slightly nervous when I do rehousings for these, too. But the longer you own them, the better you learn their behavior and reactions to interference of any type. Being cautios is always a good thing and I am sometimes maybe overly cautious myself, but I think out of respect for the animal that's just normal, like you said. However, if I'd be really uncomfortable with a species (for me, an example would be Haplopelma sp.) I wouldn't get it. 

Main thing is trying to stay as calm as possible if you have to mess with them. And I'm having that fun everytime I have to open my P. cambridgeis enclosure, she's just one of those one doesn't really want to mess with as she's simply evil and hates interference of ANY sort!  (Yeah, Steven, I know...don't mention it )


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## jayefbe (Jul 11, 2012)

My point was that anxiety to the point of deliberately trying to limit the number of rehousings may be a problem. I know a newbie will feel nervous the first time they rehouse an OBT. But it didn't take long for me to stop. 

Also, just food for thought, nearly all the best keepers I know don't post on YouTube. Many terrible keepers post on YouTube. It can be a helpful source when you start in the hobby, but overall there are much, much better sources.

Reactions: Like 1


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## meghanbe (Jul 11, 2012)

Storm76 said:


> Admittedly, I'm slightly nervous when I do rehousings for these, too. But the longer you own them, the better you learn their behavior and reactions to interference of any type. Being cautios is always a good thing and I am sometimes maybe overly cautious myself, but I think out of respect for the animal that's just normal, like you said. However, if I'd be really uncomfortable with a species (for me, an example would be Haplopelma sp.) I wouldn't get it.
> 
> Main thing is trying to stay as calm as possible if you have to mess with them. And I'm having that fun everytime I have to open my P. cambridgeis enclosure, she's just one of those one doesn't really want to mess with as she's simply evil and hates interference of ANY sort!  (Yeah, Steven, I know...don't mention it )


I'm interested to see if one or both my little _P. cambridgeis_ will become more defensive as they grow. Right now they are skittish and quite shy (I've only seen one of them a handful of times since I got them). They always run for their burrows when I go into their enclosures to feed or retrieve leftovers (or lately, uneaten prey...here's hoping for a molt in the coming days!) I did get a look at their speed when I unpacked both of them, though. That was a definite eye-opener! lol

I'm confident that I will never venture into _Haplopelma_ species, either. Not with what I've read about them!


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## Storm76 (Jul 11, 2012)

meghanbe said:


> I'm interested to see if one or both my little _P. cambridgeis_ will become more defensive as they grow. Right now they are skittish and quite shy (I've only seen one of them a handful of times since I got them). They always run for their burrows when I go into their enclosures to feed or retrieve leftovers (or lately, uneaten prey...here's hoping for a molt in the coming days!) I did get a look at their speed when I unpacked both of them, though. That was a definite eye-opener! lol
> 
> I'm confident that I will never venture into _Haplopelma_ species, either. Not with what I've read about them!


I'm pretty sure my P. cam is one of those exceptions to their general behavior. Funny enough, the breeder I got her from said she was never displaying any defensiveness, even had her run onto his hand with no incident. Since I got her, she molted twice in my care and becomes more and more evil - is always out sitting on the corkbark as well...usually they are considered the more mellow of the Psalms, but you'll never know  And yes - they're fast - though my Tappie is way worse in that regard...just a blur.

Anyways, back 2 topic and sorry for hijacking


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## catfishrod69 (Jul 11, 2012)

Once you get used to it, there are no problems. Just have faith in yourself, know what you are doing at all times, and keep 2 eyes on the tarantula, and 2 eyes on your hands lol. I just rehoused some nice ones today, ended up with a P. pederseni mm on my left arm. I just stuck the tarantula down to the enclosure, and coaxed him off. You will learn to read which ways the tarantulas are going to go when they decide to bolt or move. Doesnt always happen that way, but a good amount of the time it does.





meghanbe said:


> To be honest, I'm not sure whether I will _ever_ not be just a little nervous about rehousing a fast-moving, possibly defensive OW tarantula. I don't see this as a deficiency or even a sign that I shouldn't own a fast, defensive species. I see it as a human reaction to entering into a situation that carries the risk of harm to me or my pet. At this point, I've read enough forum posts and watched enough YouTube videos to know that I am far from the only T keeper who feels this way. Many keepers approach certain tasks with a good dose of caution (tongs awkwardly snaked through barely-opened enclosures, tarantulas-in-a-bag, and more). I've read many admissions of slight anxiety during rehousings and tank maintenance. I've watched experienced keepers of potent OW's literally shake on camera after a particularly tricky rehousing or escape attempt. These are all human reactions. I am confident that despite my nerves, I can do what needs to be done. Much of that confidence springs from the fact that over the past year, I have done all kinds of things I never would've thought I could do (including keeping tarantulas in the first place). I've discovered what a capable person I really am.
> 
> Food for thought: How does one overcome anxiety about performing certain tasks if not by doing them?


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