# Feeding tarantulas mice



## Haksilence (Apr 3, 2016)

Someone please explain this too me? As far as I know there is zero quantifiable reason to feed mice to tarantulas.

The calcium is potentially hazardous to them. 
Mice can actually bite them.
It's gonna stress the hell out of the tarantula. 

So why do people do it, and defend doing it?


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## arachnidsGrip (Apr 3, 2016)

IMO: full grown mice: no go. 
Pinky mice: okay on RARE occasions (and only for bigger species, ie T. Blondi/Stirmi).


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## ArachnaeEsoterica (Apr 3, 2016)

I have never fed my Ts a rodent and its something I'm uncomfortable with on the T's diet. I keep plenty on hand for my scaleys but I doubt I'd feed even a Blondi or Stirmi a tiny mouse but once in a blue moon.


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## Haksilence (Apr 3, 2016)

I'm talking full grown live feeder mice.
Pinky's aren't bad, but still unnecessary, they aren't anymore nutritious to a t than a mix of dubias and super worms.


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## Sana (Apr 4, 2016)

Okay folks the calcium thing is a myth.  I don't feed mammals because they make horrible screaming noises while the venom is doing it's work.  Crickets, roaches, worms, no noise.  Also I hear that rodent boluses smell pretty awful.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 5


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## Exoskeleton Invertebrates (Apr 4, 2016)

It's more than a myth, I feed my Pelinobius muticus, Acanthoscurria sp. "Brocklehursti" etc. adult size nice, pinky mice and pinky rats. Being feeding my tarantulas for many years this type of food. My old Xenesthis sp. "Blue" ate lots of mice and pinky rats with no problems as well. Over 20 years of feeding to any of my tarantulas mice and rats with no problem. 
Have fun with this topic.

Reactions: Like 1 | Dislike 1 | Informative 1


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## Exoskeleton Invertebrates (Apr 4, 2016)

Nice and fatty. She is either fat from eating rat pups, adult mice or she's gravid.


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## cold blood (Apr 4, 2016)

Sana said:


> Okay folks the calcium thing is a myth.  I don't feed mammals because they make horrible screaming noises while the venom is doing it's work.  Crickets, roaches, worms, no noise.  Also I hear that rodent boluses smell pretty awful.


I agree, and its not the boli, it takes so long to consume that it starts to rot while its still being consumed...just horrible.

I agree with Jose though, for certain large ts, especially after molt when they're slender, it can be an acceptable meal, although one could certainly argue about putting a mammal through that...even pinkies scream.  Not my cup of tea, but I only know that because I have fed them.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 4


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## Haksilence (Apr 4, 2016)

I get all that, but why not just toss 2 super worms their way? If they are hungry enough to take a mouse surely they will have no trouble taking back to back supers.


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## Walter1 (Apr 4, 2016)

Perhaps, feeding frozen/thaweds is easier and more economical. They will take them that way.


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## Exoskeleton Invertebrates (Apr 4, 2016)

My tarantulas eat what ever they want to eat at the present time. It doesn't matter wether is super worms or not or frozen rats, mice etc.

If a person is afraid that a mice could hurt a tarantula than you shouldn't feed a mice. Depending on the size of a baby tarantula and the size of a cricket can also injure a tarantula, crickets can bite as well. I don't worry about those things happening tarantulas are a natural predator for those type of insects or animals.

I made this video months ago she loves earthworms. Since the video she has molted.






And this is her today after eating earthworms and a few crickets.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Chris LXXIX (Apr 4, 2016)

Without entering the debate about the supposed benefits (or not) i consider the 'cruelty' part. A cricket in the fangs of a _P.murinus_ (example) is more or less like a man hit by a truck at full speed. With a mouse that's another story. I don't want to put my T's at risk nor to see animals suffer.

Don't want to sound hypocrite, it's not that a mouse life is better or more important than a cricket, but i have a certain "respect" even for violence.

Never offered one to my T's in 25 years, and never will.






Probably there's people who enjoy "poop" like this, not me.

Reactions: Like 4


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## Haksilence (Apr 4, 2016)

Chris LXXIX said:


> Without entering the debate about the supposed benefits (or not) i consider the 'cruelty' part. A cricket in the fangs of a _P.murinus_ (example) is more or less like a man hit by a truck at full speed. With a mouse that's another story. I don't want to put my T's at risk nor to see animals suffer.
> 
> Don't want to sound hypocrite, it's not that a mouse life is better or more important than a cricket, but i have a certain "respect" even for violence.
> 
> ...


Yeah I can see that for sure. In videos it seems like mice take up to a minute or so to stop screaming, that has to be pure agony. For crickets or superworms just the mechanical damage has to put them out almost immediately

That's an aspect that I didn't think of

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Exoskeleton Invertebrates (Apr 4, 2016)

Chris LXXIX said:


> Without entering the debate about the supposed benefits (or not) i consider the 'cruelty' part. A cricket in the fangs of a _P.murinus_ (example) is more or less like a man hit by a truck at full speed. With a mouse that's another story. I don't want to put my T's at risk nor to see animals suffer.
> 
> Don't want to sound hypocrite, it's not that a mouse life is better or more important than a cricket, but i have a certain "respect" even for violence.
> 
> ...


 Hey man! How are you? The difference with my feeding I keep it close doors. My kids love mice/rats, I don't let them watch or even know that I have a mouse/rat for my tarantula to eat.

That was a large mouse/rat for the P. murinus. The only problem that I have about a spider eating a large prey like the one in the video is the P. murinus will not consume all its food. So the reality is the owner of the P. murinus should have giving it a smaller prey. To me that was a waste of life.

Now I would like to see someone holding that tarantula. He! He!

Reactions: Like 2


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## petkokc (Apr 4, 2016)

I don't enjoy animal (or any ones) suffering and since there is no benefit of feeding Tarantulas with rodents I never did or never will use them as feeders. Plain and simple.

Reactions: Agree 5


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## Chris LXXIX (Apr 4, 2016)

Exoskeleton Invertebrates said:


> Hey man! How are you? The difference with my feeding I keep it close doors. My kids love mice/rats, I don't let them watch or even know that I have a mouse/rat for my tarantula to eat.
> 
> That was a large mouse/rat for the P. murinus. The only problem that I have about a spider eating a large prey like the one in the video is the P. murinus will not consume all its food. So the reality is the owner of the P. murinus should have giving it a smaller prey. To me that was a waste of life.
> 
> Now I would like to see someone holding that tarantula. He! He!



I wasn't talking about you, Jose, but in general. Those people aren't like you. You know what you are doing, those people not. They just enjoy cruelty, and (combining their voyeuristic feelings with YT) those are a very bad example for other people, including (especially) those in good faith who wants to move their first steps in the hobby.

Take care Jose, man

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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## Scott C. (Apr 4, 2016)

Haksilence said:


> So why do people do it, and defend doing it?


Because they're available as feeders, and further vary the diet of their pets. They defend doing it because some folks feel the need to tell them they shouldn't for an assortment of bogus and/or self righteous reasons.

Personally, it's rare if at all. Too messy.


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## Exoskeleton Invertebrates (Apr 4, 2016)

Chris LXXIX said:


> I wasn't talking about you, Jose, but in general. Those people aren't like you. You know what you are doing, those people not. They just enjoy cruelty, and (combining their voyeuristic feelings with YT) those are a very bad example for other people, including (especially) those in good faith who wants to move their first steps in the hobby.
> 
> Take care Jose, man


 Oh I know you weren't talking about me. I do understand where your coming from since I do know how aggressive the kill can be. My Acanthoscurria sp. "Brocklehursti" went nuts over her mice it was a violent kill, it was the worse I ever seen. The best part about though she is over 7" inches and she consumed everything.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Chris LXXIX (Apr 4, 2016)

Another point of view i want to discuss with you people, involving this issue.

So, here a lovely Spring is arrived... there's more or less 64 F outside. I have noticed, among the others, my 0.1 _P.murinus _busy with "Spring" cleaning, she kicked out a molt, bulldozing everything (i expect a molt soon, she's in pre molt).

She looks "happy", meaning... master at her home. *Secure*. Don't consider the premolt status nor the ethic part for a moment; well, the last thing i want is to put a mouse in her enclosure, and put her into a "life or death territory battle" like happens in the wild.

Reactions: Like 3


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## louise f (Apr 4, 2016)

Chris LXXIX said:


> Another point of view i want to discuss with you people, involving this issue.
> 
> So, here a lovely Spring is arrived... there's more or less 64 F outside. I have noticed, among the others, my 0.1 _P.murinus _busy with "Spring" cleaning, she kicked out a molt, bulldozing everything (i expect a molt soon, she's in pre molt).
> 
> She looks "happy", meaning... master at her home. *Secure*. Don't consider the premolt status nor the ethic part for a moment; well, the last thing i want is to put a mouse in her enclosure, and put her into a "life or death territory battle" like happens in the wild.



Ohh Christian my friend,have you not heard that the Ts hormons are going crazy at the spring just like us people

haha

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Trenor (Apr 4, 2016)

I don't feed any of my Ts mice (they are too small) and I don't really think I will when they are bigger. I prefer the feeding regimen I currently have. 

As far as using mice/rats for feeders I don't have a problem with it ether way. I know its not a T, but I have a ball python that is pretty old and was fed live mice since he was bought from the pet store. (They didn't have the frozen back then.) Fred will not switch to frozen and we have tried several time to do so. It is a bit irritating to go get him food at the pet store and have people comment on the ethics of live feeders. It is a life cycle and they eat like everything else in nature. 

Anyway I know that last part isn't T related but I thought it might help with the feeder discussion.


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## Haksilence (Apr 4, 2016)

Trenor said:


> I don't feed any of my Ts mice (they are too small) and I don't really think I will when they are bigger. I prefer the feeding regimen I currently have.
> 
> As far as using mice/rats for feeders I don't have a problem with it ether way. I know its not a T, but I have a ball python that is pretty old and was fed live mice since he was bought from the pet store. (They didn't have the frozen back then.) Fred will not switch to frozen and we have tried several time to do so. It is a bit irritating to go get him food at the pet store and have people comment on the ethics of live feeders. It is a life cycle and they eat like everything else in nature.
> 
> Anyway I know that last part isn't T related but I thought it might help with the feeder discussion.


Yeah I never had a problem with the ethicality of mice feeders, it is the circle of life after all, but as others have mentioned with tarantulas there is a lot extra going on.


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## Exoskeleton Invertebrates (Apr 4, 2016)

Well here is my point of view:

Let's just say you have a couple of large females Acanthoscurria geniculata or sp. "Brocklehursti" you acquire a couple of mature males of both species for mating/breeding purposes. Before pairing your females with the males would you feed your females only roaches and crickets or would you feed them a larger yummier prey like a pup rat, mice or even a lizard?

I know what I would do to fatten those hungry females that are notorious of killing the males. I would feed them as much as possible larger prey before pairing them with any of my females.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Haksilence (Apr 4, 2016)

Exoskeleton Invertebrates said:


> Well here is my point of view:
> 
> Let's just say you have a large females Acanthoscurria geniculata or sp. "Brocklehursti" you acquire a couple of mature males for mating/breeding purposes. Before pairing your females with the males would you feed your females only roaches and crickets or would you feed them a larger yummier prey like a pup rat, mice or even a lizard?
> 
> I know what I would do to fatten those hungry females that are notorious of killing the males. I would feed them as much as possible larger prey before pairing them.



Yeah that definitely makes sense.

An a tangent what's with the A. SP "brocklehursti"
I thought brocklehursti was already defined? Did something change?


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## matypants (Apr 4, 2016)

This is a question I have asked myself. I had a corn snake, Elaphe guttata guttata, for 12 years that required mice as food. In that case I fed freshly thawed frozen mice. For a T there are a number of different options they will readily take. So outside of the fact that it *can* be done, are there reasons mice *need* to be fed to tarantulas?


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## Haksilence (Apr 4, 2016)

matypants said:


> This is a question I have asked myself. I had a corn snake, Elaphe guttata guttata, for 12 years that required mice as food. In that case I fed freshly thawed frozen mice. For a T there are a number of different options they will readily take. So outside of the fact that it *can* be done, are there reasons mice *need* to be fed to tarantulas?


Basically Jose covered it as there are few things better to stuff a big female like a plump mouse.


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## Exoskeleton Invertebrates (Apr 4, 2016)

Haksilence said:


> Yeah that definitely makes sense.
> 
> An a tangent what's with the A. SP "brocklehursti"
> I thought brocklehursti was already defined? Did something change?


 So we thought, the name no longer applies to our hobby "Brocklehursti". We have to consider it as Acanthoscurria sp. "Brocklehursti".


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## matypants (Apr 4, 2016)

It can be an attractive option in some situations, but not a requirement. That's what I was wondering. Since it's just an option, there will be different views and feelings on it. In the case of animals that require mammals for food, ethical considerations are superseded by food requirements. In the case of tarantulas, mammals are not required so emotional and ethical views will vary. Personally, I'm not going to feed mine mammals since it isn't a required food.


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## Haksilence (Apr 4, 2016)

Exoskeleton Invertebrates said:


> So we thought, the name no longer applies to our hobby "Brocklehursti". We have to consider it as Acanthoscurria sp. "Brocklehursti".


Oh wow. When did that change? Do they think it's a morph of genic?


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## Haksilence (Apr 4, 2016)

matypants said:


> It can be an attractive option in some situations, but not a requirement. That's what I was wondering. Since it's just an option, there will be different views and feelings on it. In the case of animals that require mammals for food, ethical considerations are superseded by food requirements. In the case of tarantulas, mammals are not required so emotional and ethical views will vary. Personally, I'm not going to feed mine mammals since it isn't a required food.


I probably never will, but I can see some justification

Reactions: Like 1


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## Exoskeleton Invertebrates (Apr 4, 2016)

Haksilence said:


> Oh wow. When did that change? Do they think it's a morph of genic?


 Some say they're the same but they're not. The mature males are different, males emboli are different and the females are different. Definitely taxonomist needs to do more research on them in my opinion. It's best to still keep them seperate as seperate species.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Chris LXXIX (Apr 4, 2016)

I never owned a snake, one reason is, here in Italy you can't own anymore venomous snakes (they banned those in the last part of the '80 if i'm not wrong, i was a children) and, save for few exceptions, i don't like that much pythons etc the ones you can legally own (basically every non venomous snake, save for Anaconda i think lol)

But i would feed a live mouse to one of those without ethic issues of all sorts. It's the law of _equilibrium_. You can't offer a dubia or a cricket to a snake. From my point of view, then, a live mouse for a snake is like a cricket, or roaches, for T's.

But with T's IMO is different, there's a lot of alternative. IMO there's cons % and they are more than the pro


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## matypants (Apr 4, 2016)

On the subject of "brocklehursti"-

These link to a white paper on Acanthoscurria sp. http://www.scielo.br/pdf/zool/v31n1/08.pdf

http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?scr...1984-46702014000100008&lng=en&nrm=iso&tlng=en

Basically, from the Google search this is what I've found out-

A new species, A. belterrensis is described.
A. transamazonica is no longer a valid species but a junior synonym of A. geniculata.
A. ferina & A. brocklehursti are no longer valid species but junior synonyms of A. theraphosoides.
A. xinguensis is no longer a valid species but a junior synonym of A. juruenicola.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Haksilence (Apr 4, 2016)

Exoskeleton Invertebrates said:


> Some say they're the same but they're not. The mature males are different, males emboli are different and the females are different. Definitely taxonomist needs to do more research on them in my opinion. It's best to still keep them seperate as seperate species.


Yeah isn't there differences in the banding between the two as well? And I thought the red setea and such was different between the two


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## Exoskeleton Invertebrates (Apr 4, 2016)

matypants said:


> On the subject of "brocklehursti"-
> 
> These link to a white paper on Acanthoscurria sp. http://www.scielo.br/pdf/zool/v31n1/08.pdf
> 
> ...


 Yeah it has been posted before. But it's good that you post it again for other new or even old members that have not seen it.


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## matypants (Apr 4, 2016)

Chris LXXIX said:


> I never owned a snake, one reason is, here in Italy you can't own anymore venomous snakes (they banned those in the last part of the '80 if i'm not wrong, i was a children) and, save for few exceptions, i don't like that much pythons etc the ones you can legally own (basically every non venomous snake, save for Anaconda i think lol)
> 
> But i would feed a live mouse to one of those without ethic issues of all sorts. It's the law of _equilibrium_. You can't offer a dubia or a cricket to a snake. From my point of view, then, a live mouse for a snake is like a cricket, or roaches, for T's.
> 
> But with T's IMO is different, there's a lot of alternative. IMO there's cons % and they are more than the pro


Great minds think alike and all that.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Exoskeleton Invertebrates (Apr 4, 2016)

Of course! The bandings are the biggest difference.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Poec54 (Apr 4, 2016)

Haksilence said:


> The calcium is potentially hazardous to them.
> Mice can actually bite them.
> It's gonna stress the hell out of the tarantula.


1.  Calcium* is not* hazardous to tarantulas, and has no impact on their molting.  It's a myth that keeps getting perpetuated; please don't keep the myth going yourself.  Tarantulas eat a certain amount of vertebrates in the wild.

2.  It is true that mice can bite and kill tarantulas.  I had a young mouse kill a young forest cobra.  Mice are tough animals, especially when cornered. 

3.  People feed mice to tarantulas for the effect and thrill of it.  Tarantulas don't require mice or any other vertebrates in their diet.  It's not a humane practice. 

4.  Feed a large mouse to a large spider, and it won't finish it (even a Theraphosa).  What you will have the next day is half of a mouse, discarded, that will be one of the most vile & putrid smells you'll encounter in your life.

Reactions: Agree 4


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## BorisTheSpider (Apr 4, 2016)

Poec54 said:


> I had a young mouse kill a young forest cobra.


I lost a young puff adder to a mouse once . Don't feed Ts mice .


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## Haksilence (Apr 4, 2016)

Exoskeleton Invertebrates said:


> Of course! The bandings are the biggest difference.


Are those both females? Yeah they are very clearly separate. Definitely not the same species or at least same color form if it looks like that's where SP "Brocklehursti" is going


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## Exoskeleton Invertebrates (Apr 4, 2016)

Haksilence said:


> Are those both females? Yeah they are very clearly separate. Definitely not the same species or at least same color form if it looks like that's where SP "Brocklehursti" is going


 Both females, both over 7" inches and and both practically the same size. This is as close as you can get for two different adult females two compare from one or the other.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Haksilence (Apr 4, 2016)

As usual beautiful specimens. The top is the brocklehursti and the bottom is the genic?


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## Exoskeleton Invertebrates (Apr 4, 2016)

Haksilence said:


> As usual beautiful specimens. The top is the brocklehursti and the bottom is the genic?


 Edit your post to:

A. geniculata top
A. sp. "Brocklehursti" bottom.


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## Haksilence (Apr 4, 2016)

Okay I wasn't sure, I couldn't remember which one had the more prominent banding. Been a while since this topic came up

Honestly should have guessed.
Brocklehursti = less prominent banding and colors = lower cost. 
Should have pieced that together


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## Tim Benzedrine (Apr 4, 2016)

Those two photos illustrate why I am so ga-ga over the species. For me the genic has a slight edge over brocklehursti, but they are both stunning.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## viper69 (Apr 4, 2016)

Quite honestly most people do it I THINK because they see a perceived lower form of life taking out a higher form of life.


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## Tim Benzedrine (Apr 4, 2016)

Hmm. That could explain why there are people who want to see trump win...

Reactions: Dislike 3


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## Haksilence (Apr 4, 2016)

Tim Benzedrine said:


> Hmm. That could explain why there are people who want to see trump win...


Let's not bring politics into this forum

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Tim Benzedrine (Apr 4, 2016)

Haksilence said:


> Let's not bring politics into this forum



Eh, I just picked the first political figure that came to mind for the purpose of the gag... I don't even vote.  Allows everybody to be fair game for me.

Reactions: Disagree 1 | Funny 1


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## gottarantulas (Apr 4, 2016)

Personally, I think that there are so many varied types of food items to feed your Ts among outfits such as Aaron Pauling, Rainbow Mealworms, etc. that I see no real significant nutritional values over other prey items. I could see some justification or merit for example of feeding pinkies to gravid female Ts.


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