# Ball Python vs. Corn Snake - First Time Keeper



## BugToxin

Ok, help me out a bit.  I have lots of experience with tarantula's and pedes, but zippo with reptiles.  A while back I was at a reptile show looking for spiders and saw the most goregous yellow/green snake I had ever seen.  I wanted it.  Not being the type to buy an animal without doing some research I held off at the show and asked my friendly neighborhood exotic pet dealer (Bridgebane) what it was and if it would be a good pet.  He told me that it was likely a green tree python and probably would not really make a good pet if I was interested in holding it at all.  Well, bummer!!!  

Anyway, can't quit thinking about snakes.  I want one.  I know that corns are quite docile and prety, but so are ball pythons, and kings.  I want to be able to hold this animal somewhat frequently throughout it's entire life (not just while it is small).  I love the shape of a ball python's head, but also love the bright red coloration of some of the corns.  I can probably afford whatever (within reason, say >$500), but would like something small enough to keep in a non-humongous tank (say 40 gal or smaller).  What should I get?  Am I missing anything great that I don't know about yet?


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## Bekky

Either or!  All of the snakes you mentioned (corns, balls, kings) will fit forever in a 40 breeder type enclosure.  Ball Pythons can be a bit picky about their temperature requirements, but both kingsnakes and cornsnakes are a lot more forgiving as far as temperature goes.  Ball pythons are shy, corns and kings more inquisitive.  If I could do "it" all over again, I would start with a corn or king.  I learned the hard way (okay, it wasn't really that hard) starting with a ball.  PLease let me know if you have any questions or concerns!  Good Luck!  Bekk

Don't gret me wrong, Balls are easy if their temperature requirements are met, and you are willing to be patient.  As far as an impressive pet snake goes, there are many wonderful color morphs of all the snakes you listed!


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## Daisey_Boo222

I've been with corns since I was seven so obviously they are easy to care for. But I've also been pushing for a ball python as well. 

What really matters is what your comfortable with handling. Ball pythons (I've heard) can get nervous and will periodically stop eating. Trust me, I've had no problem feeding my corn . BPs also get pretty bigger than most corns, So if your comfortable holding a bigger snake as a first time handler than go for it!  Corns also go for quite a bit cheeper 


I hope your happy with whatever you choose!!

wishing you good luck,
em


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## Midnightrdr456

I prefer balls.  I feel if your only getting one snake thats the one to get.  They get large so its impressive but nothing unmanagable like a Burm or even a Boa for some people.  On average they will be about 4', captive bred ones are usually docile, and also better eaters than wild caught.  Aquarium type enclosures can be tough to keep the humidity up in, but not too bad, you can easily with a good under tank heater, a light for basking, and covering up a good percentage of the screen top.  This will get you good temps and humidity if you work it out right.

I recommend getting a Ball from a breeder rather than a pet store.  Normals go as low as $75, but if your willing to spend a bit more like $250-300 or so you can get a nice looking morph.  Some of the morphs easily go for $1000+ but you can still get some nice ones for the low hundreds.

Ball python is my next snake, (i have 2 boas though, and a king and a corn).  Im just saving up to get a really nice one, so it might be a year or two.


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## P.jasonius

If you're looking for something that stays small (relatively) and can have some decent coloration, hognose snakes are pretty interesting.  They can have color variations looking like coral snakes, the red and albinistic morphs of course, and I've seen an all black morph as well.  Neat snakes, they feign death when agitated, and are capable of fanning its head and neck.  Rear fanged, not medically significant.  
I might get one at the reptile expo tomorrow if I can get the wife on board.  I convinced my 6year old daughter she wants one!


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## Thoth

I wouldn't suggest hognose as a first time snake for someone who wants to handle their snake. They can be nippy and their threat displays can be off putting to beginners.  A second snake perhaps.

Besides corns there is kenyan sand boa, small and very docile.


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## skinheaddave

I would recommend a corn snake.  My wife would recommend a ball python.  Both are easy to start with and have a high probability of success.  It all comes down to what you like.  Regardless of what you chose, be sure to continue doing research.  Ball pythons can be problematic in the feeding department, but they are usually pretty easy to sort out if you know what you're doing.

Cheers,
Dave


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## P.jasonius

Thoth said:


> I wouldn't suggest hognose as a first time snake... A second snake perhaps.


Funny you should say that, if I do get the hognose I'm looking at, it will be my second snake!


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## AviculariaLover

Aside from garters and redbellies and the occaisional nasty watersnake, my first "real" pet snake was a corn snake. And six months later, I got a ball python. They're both wonderful snakes, yet they've both had their issues. The corn snake was from a bad pet store and had mites and some scale rot, which took a lot of time to cure. But since then, he's never refused a meal, and even takes the mice right out of my hand! Just a fantastic snake all around. I agree that ball pythons are a bit tricker, but you could luck out with a good one. Mine started out on live mice, and would get finicky on and off, but once I got her onto f/t she's been wonderful. A few episodes of being finicky in the beginning, but I havent had any problems with any of my snakes in a long time. I would also recommend a milk or king snake... I have two wildcaught eastern milk snakes and they are eating machines! They won't be as pretty as the kinds of milks you can get from a breeder, I hope to get my hands on some other varieties sometime.

Why must you decide between two? Get both! If its a matter of which one to get first, I'd say the cornsnake. But if you're only going to get one (which I doubt, its so hard to stop at just one!)... I'd say the ball python. Though I disagree that a 40 gallon tank will be large enough for a full grown adult, however that will take some time, and is up to what you think is suitable, I guess. 

Whichever you choose, good luck! And do your homework.


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## Midnightrdr456

both a 40 gallon long and a 40 gallon breeder are big enough for most adult balls  General rule of thumb is the tank's length x width should be at least as long (if not longer) than the size of the snake.

So 40 gallon long = 4'x1' which is 4' (about as long as a ball python)
40 gallon breeder = 36"x18" which is 4.5' (bit bigger)

So either one of those can work.  So long as its setup properly (which isnt too hard for a ball, needs a water dish to soak, a hide, and if you want, a branch to climb on)


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## Mushroom Spore

Midnightrdr456 said:


> (which isnt too hard for a ball, needs a water dish to soak, a hide, and if you want, a branch to climb on)


Actually, ball pythons aren't arboreal, and not terribly good climbers either. Don't bother with a branch, they'd MUCH rather burrow and burrow and then burrow some more.


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## AviculariaLover

I dunno, mine likes to climb! She has a chunk of mangled driftwood that she loves to climb up and wrap aruond to bask, or just when she's roaming the tank.

So... they need a bit of both I'd say. Enough substrate to burrow in and get cozy, and a varied terrian to climb around. Nothing tall is needed, but she seems to appreciate things to wrap around.

And balls can get over four feet, up to six really, so... it depends how big it gets in the end. Mine is in a 40gallon right now and it seems fine (she's 2 1/2 feet long) but, well, my boyfriend and I are getting a bit obsessed about wanting to provide really natural habitats and are going to build her something nice and big. But that's just us being overprotective parents to our lil girl


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## Midnightrdr456

i find that with balls (all the ones ive been around) they like to dig into the aspen bedding (if you use that) but will also enjoy the branches since they are low to the ground, not up in a tree.  It isn't necessary but they seem to enjoy it when they are young, same with boas, they seem to enjoy it when they are younger, once they are large it's tough to provide them with enough room/strong branch, plus they tend to avoid them more then.

Also yea they can get up to 6 feet, but thats VERY rare.  Thats like saying regular boas can get 12-14 feet.  It happens but mostly they stay 7-10 feet.

Yea natural enclosures are nice, but when you have 2 snakes that are going to get 6 feet and 8 feet most likely (if not bigger than 8 for my girl).  Its hard to have that much room so you go for the standard enclosure.  They seem to do fine in them also.


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## Taceas

Go for the corn. They're super easy for a first time snake keeper. They tolerate a lot of the first time owners' mistakes, and everyone makes them a time or two, a lot better than Balls. And if anything unfortunate should happen, not saying its going to...but corns aren't going to break the bank if it should die. 

Balls are known to be timid, easily stressed, and notoriously hard to feed and/or picky in general. Most in petstores are wild caught, so they're parasite infested not socialized and in general poor health all around. 

I have one adult male BP and based on him alone, I would never own another. I find them boring, always hiding in the hide, and a struggle to establish a logical feeding pattern. Whereas my corns are out a lot, active, and eat when its feeding day (provided they aren't in shed or during mating season when a lot of male corns ignore food in favor of searching for ladies).

And corns come in a rainbow of colors, most of which are highly affordable. A 40 gallon tank might not be suitable for a baby cornsnake initially, but could comfortably hold one for the rest of its adult life. 

As for kings, their care is exactly the same as the corns, but they are more food oriented and I've found mine are more apt to bite thinking everything that moves is food. Mine also musk when they're restrained or when trying to remove them from your hand.


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## Meaningless End

i say go for the green tree.. after you start keeping snakes for a little bit your going to want something more interesting then a corn anyway... think of the chondro like you would a pokie and the corn snake like you would a rose hair.... because thats exactly how it is.  I have two green trees and one is as tame as any other snake out there.. he has only bit me once and it was over a year ago... my other one is a total B!+ch but i love her anyway.

here is a pic of my male.


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## Taceas

Why would you recommend such a elaborate to care for AND expensive snake for a first time snake owner? Not to mention its a rare Chondro that tolerates handling, and if I'm not mistaken they wanted a handleable pet. :? 

I've got a few friends who I consider advanced keepers of Chondro's and even they have had their share of deaths, mostly from poor-health imported stock. 

One of these days I'd like a Chondro, but even after several years of caring for corns, BP's, and a boa I don't feel ready enough to go for that yet.


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## Midnightrdr456

yea i agree horrible suggestion.  Think if a Chondro like a pokie that needs super specific care, and is AGGRESSIVE.  Chondro's are look but dont touch pets.

My recommendations still are either Corn or Ball.  Ball requires a little more care but its not too hard.  If you like the look of bigger snakes like pythons and boas, but dont want the size, the ball is for you.  If you want a very hardy easy going snake then go for the Corn.  Both can be handled easily too.


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## AviculariaLover

Yeah I definitely agree with midnight. Though I think a lot depends on whether you're going to only get one, or end up getting other snakes in the future.

If it's just one, and you want something a bit more impressive, I would go with the ball python. Though a really nice corn morph can be just as impressive as an adult (Im dying for a bloodred someday). 

However if you know you won't be able to stop at just one (not many people can!), I'd start with the corn, get some experience with a snake thats a bit easier, and then go for the ball, and who knows what else! 

Thats how I did it, and it was a good progression. Corn to ball python to milk snakes to a solomon island boa to a kenyan sand boa (also a great easy snake, but likes to burrow so you don't see it often and gets about two feet long)


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## Midnightrdr456

Honestly, the best possible pet snake IMO is a boa, if you can take care of something 6' - 7' in size, they are tame usually, and hardy.  Thats the only downside to them.  Thats why i like Balls for first snakes, corns are gorgeous, but the look of balls encompases the beautiful pythons/boas while staying small and managable.

Dont get me wrong though, Corns are incredible snakes too, I have a corn, and i love it to death.

Ultimately if you go Corn or Ball you wont be dissapointed, but i find when more often when people get Corns, they really still love and want the "python-y" like snakes.  Like was said, if your getting JUST one, go Ball, but if you just want a good beginner, and plan to eventually add to your collection, Corns are great.

Also Kings are good.  My first snake was actually a California Banded King snake.  I got it in 2nd grade, Im currently a senior in college, and i still have it and love it.


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## BugToxin

Excellent information everyone.  The picture posted by Meaningless End is indeed the snake I was thinking of, and am definately not going to get (at least not for my first  ).  I do want a snake that can be held and handled frequently.  I'm leaning towards the ball python, just because I love the python look so much.  The feeding issues don't worry me too much, and I'm sure that my exotic pet friends could help me through those if need be.  I'm wondering though, just how tame can the balls get compared to the corns?  Are they about the same, or are the corns a bit more "friendly"?  If there is a big difference there, I might be swayed the other way.  I only intend to have one for now, perhaps two at most some day.  Thanks again for the good advice.


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## Mushroom Spore

If there's a snake "friendlier" (no snake is genuinely friendly, but they can come close!) than the average ball python, I haven't heard of it yet.  They're very chill, and will happily latch onto you and sleep for a few hours.


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## Midnightrdr456

personally like i said before, i find boas more "tame".  For only one reason, the ball is a naturally nervous snake, so it gets scared easily.  Thats why the curl up into the infamous ball for their nick name (they are really called Royal Pythons, but everyone jsut calls them balls).  

But other than being scared they are wonderful.  I find corns to be worse for handling (though not bad at all).  B/c they are faster.   Balls will love to just nestle in and latch onto your hand with their tails.


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## BugToxin

Ok, so tell me more about boa's.  I know very little about snakes, and the only boa's that come to mind are the red tailed boa and the amazon tree boa.  I thought that red tailed boa's got huge and would need about a 120 gal. tank or more as an adult.  I know even less about the amazon tree boa, but have read that they are similar in temperment to the green tree python which we already ruled out.  Are there other, smaller varieties of boa that I should consider?  Could any live happily as an adult in say a 40-60 galon tank?  I'm not the least bit afraid of handling a bigger snake, I just want to make sure that I can properly care for the animal before I buy.


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## Mushroom Spore

Midnightrdr456 said:


> Balls will love to just nestle in and latch onto your hand with their tails.


This is so true. The one time my boy ever had to go to the vet while I've had him, early this spring, was to get shots to clear up the start of a respiratory infection. After the first time (we had to go back like three times to finish the full round of medication), the vet couldn't even pry his tail off me. It was like a toddler clinging to your fingers while getting a shot. So cute, though I obviously felt pretty bad, you could tell Rorschach did NOT like what they were doing to him, even though he never bit.


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## Joe

You can't really go wrong with either a corn or a ball. If you go with a ball, make sure it's CB. In addition to parasites and whatnot, WC balls are notoriously stubborn feeders. As far as corns go, in my opinion, nothing beats a normal phase/Okeetee. Morphs are for the birds. Rosy boas are another good choice if you're leaning towards a boid, although some of them can be a little finicky when it comes to feeding, as well.


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## Midnightrdr456

Boas get large, and need proper humidity/temps (same kind as balls).  Some boas stay on the smaller scale like a male hogg island (though they arent as tame as red tails).

Male BCI's get about 5' on average, and 6' though 7' can happen.  Females get about 6-7' and can hit 8-9' pretty often, 10'+ can happen but is rare.

True redtail boas are BCC and those get larger, males get about 7' on average and females get 10-12' with the largest on record is 14 or 15'.

If you want a boa you would need to get a better cage than an aquarium, i personally use Boaphiles b/c they are lightweight, nice looking, heat built in, and holds humidity perfectly.

A male BCI will cost you about $100-200 for a nice one, if you get a hatchling it will be about 3' at the end of 1 year, and in the next two years reach about 5'.  Then with moderate feeding stay around 5' (moderate being a small-medium rat every 10 days or so, which is normal).

Stay away from females if you were to get a boa, females often grow large enough to eat jumbo rats and even rabbits when full grown.

Now, if you can handle the size in terms of cages then they are probably the best snake IMO.  They get large so its impressive, they are tame with good handling (tame being in respect that they are a snake, always keep an eye on them).  I also personally think boa's are much more attractive than balls, plus you can get boa morphs much cheaper than balls, (until y ou start to get into the really nice morphs like Pearlescent and Bloods).  

One thing you need to realize is both balls and boas like to feel secure, so if your holding them they will wrap around your arm alot, this can freak people out thinking the snake is constricting them.  Both balls and boas are usually very calm.  Balls are nippier than boas usually, only since they are smaller, adults are usually fine.  The only time ive witnessed a boa bite was when i was cleaning my snake tanks with my father, he then fed my corn and king, and came to my room to check on the boa with me, i washed my hands, he didnt.  The smell of mice made Mitch (my boa) bite his hand, and then instantly let go.

But again, if you cant properly house a large snake, you shouldnt get one obviously.   A full grown male boa, would need a tank thats at least as large as he is lengthxwidth.  So a 48"x24" tank would be good for a male boa thats about 5-7' anything past 7' should really be in a larger enclosure.


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## xgrafcorex

sounds like many have already made good points for both, but i just wanted to chime in with a vote for corn snakes!  ;P


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## ErikH

Either one should be fine.  Balls have more rigid temperature and humidity requirements, so if you are at all worried about husbandry, go with the corn.  Corns tend to be squirmier when you handle them than ball pythons, in my experience.  Both are fairly docile, and don't get too awfully big.


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## BugToxin

You have all been very helpful.  Two more questions:

1)  What about jungle carpet pythons?  I looked these up and some caresheets say that they are wonderful first snakes.  Others say that they are not very nice.  They are almost as pretty as the green tree python IMO.  What is your opinion on these as a reasonable size snake to be handled?

2)  My wife has a cat.  What is the likelyhood that either a ball python or jungle carpet will kill and/or eat the cat if it gets loose.  It is a big cat (about 13 LBS).


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## ErikH

BugToxin said:


> You have all been very helpful.  Two more questions:
> 
> 1)  What about jungle carpet pythons?  I looked these up and some caresheets say that they are wonderful first snakes.  Others say that they are not very nice.  They are almost as pretty as the green tree python IMO.  What is your opinion on these as a reasonable size snake to be handled?
> 
> 2)  My wife has a cat.  What is the likelyhood that either a ball python or jungle carpet will kill and/or eat the cat if it gets loose.  It is a big cat (about 13 LBS).


I don't own a carpet python, but from what I understand, they are kind of nippy when young, but tend to mellow out as they get older, and can be handled.  They get larger than Ball pythons, up to 6 or 7 feet I believe.

There is no way a ball python would be a threat to a cat, quite the opposite, I believe.  Can't speak for the carpet, but again, I doubt it.


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## Mushroom Spore

BugToxin said:


> 2)  My wife has a cat.  What is the likelyhood that either a ball python or jungle carpet will kill and/or eat the cat if it gets loose.  It is a big cat (about 13 LBS).


This is beyond hilarious. Unless the cat is the size of a mouse or rat, the only danger it's in is choking to death on the snake.

A ball might have a heart attack and die if a cat started pawing at it.


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## BugToxin

Mushroom Spore said:


> This is beyond hilarious. Unless the cat is the size of a mouse or rat, the only danger it's in is choking to death on the snake.
> 
> A ball might have a heart attack and die if a cat started pawing at it.


That's what I thought, but I had to ask.  My wife might become iritable if I let something happen to kitty.


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## Midnightrdr456

a boa or a carpet could easily kill a cat.  The ball no threat, but if your worried about that, most of the good enclosures for boas/large pythons, have locks so it wont get out.

BUT there is always a possibility.  If a boa or carpet python hit 7 feed and got out, it could kill your cat and could theoretically try to eat it (possibly would regurge it though).

If you got a Male BCI boa that is on the smaller side from feeding and only hits 5 feet, it would probably not be a threat to your cat, but you never know, it could still kill one easily, but wouldnt want to eat it.

Corn - No
Ball - No
Boa - Most likely, larger ones definately
Carpet - Most likely


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## OneSickPuppy

BugToxin said:


> He told me that it was likely a green tree python and probably would not really make a good pet if I was interested in holding it at all.  Well, bummer!!!


That depends on what you want in a snake. Youd be amazed at the amount of people that get a ball, corn, king or boa and never spend time handling it. For people that want a snake they just look at and never touch, a tree boa makes an awesome pet. They prefer to be left alone, and you know theyll be visible on a branch for all to see nearly all of the time. For those of us that do handle them, we get little round specks of blood lightly protruding from our fingers from the little pissy things.


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## JonathanF

If you want something beautiful and easy-to-care-for you can always get a kingsnake.. 
There are the regular ones- Cali and Florida kings, but there are the more special and attractive ones like the alterna (Gray-banded kingsnake) and the mexicans (L. mexicana mexicana/thayeri/greeri)


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## Mina

It would be a hard call for me to pick between them.  I have, and love, both.  Yes, ball pythons have a little more you have to do in the care department, but it isn't difficult.  My ball python is a real sweetheart!!  Very gentle.  He is shy and if you move to fast and startle him he sticks his head under the nearest coil of his body.  However, I haven't had any problems with him eating, shedding or anything else.
My cornsnake is 5 months old and is the word curiosity put into a living being.  Whatever it is, he must examine it.  He never stops moving, and when you hold him, you never stop moving!!
They are both wonderful snakes, it depends on what you want in temperment.  Ball pythons are very quiet, shy, and just like to hang out on/with you.  Mine is a wrist snake.  Corns are always moving, even if its just to do the "head dance".  Corns don't get as big around as balls, and they come in hundreds of colors.  You really can't go wrong with either one.


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## secular

how about a hognose (like a red or a green morph) or perhaps a tricolor..?  i didn't think i saw those mentioned so i thought i'd add to the confusion.


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## Mina

secular said:


> how about a hognose (like a red or a green morph) or perhaps a tricolor..?  i didn't think i saw those mentioned so i thought i'd add to the confusion.


Well, Secular, if you want to add to the confusion, how about a rosy boa?  I've personally never had one, but I got to hold one at the big NRBA show in Tinley Park, Il, in October and fell in love!!!!  Definitely my next snake!!!!!


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## secular

> Well, Secular, if you want to add to the confusion, how about a rosy boa? I've personally never had one, but I got to hold one at the big NRBA show in Tinley Park, Il, in October and fell in love!!!! Definitely my next snake!!!!!


i'd love to add that to the confusion as well, the rosy boa would be a great pet.  i don't have one currently but i did just pick up a sand boa a few weeks ago.     i think you'd have great fun with a rosy!

i would mention that the sand boa does like to spend most of it's free time just under the substrate, so if you are looking for something to be visible much of the time it might not be a good fit.  it's a great snake though that is easy to care for and won't get big enough to eat the cat.   

my hognose spends most of her days sitting there waiting to be picked up (they are diurnal).


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## arrowhd

*They don't call them Kings for nothing.*

I've handled most of the snakes mentioned in this thread.  I would highly recommend a kingsnake as a first buy.  I've had mine for the past 10 years.  She is easy to care for and 99% of the time docile.  The 1% is when shedding and this is normal for any snake.  Bought her when she was about 12 inches.  She is around 5 ft as an adult.  California kings are easy to find and usually moderately priced.  It's also cool to think your pet is capable of killing and consuming a rattlesnake!


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## Midnightrdr456

i have a cali king too, that i had since i was in 2nd grade.  Mine is only about 4 feet though and very thin.  I find it hard to believe they can eat rattlesnakes (though i know it is true).  But the rattle snakes i have seen have always been ALOT bigger than my king.

Maybe i just got a runt.

King, Corn, Ball are all great choices.


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## BugToxin

The kings I've seen are quite attractive (like the one in the picture here :drool: ).  I like the looks of these better than the corns, but the corns seem more popular.  I wonder why?  I'll still probably get the ball first though.  I like the fatness of the adults, and the python head shape.   We are getting another reptile show here in late Janruary, so I may wait untill then so I will have lots of choices.


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## Midnightrdr456

yea just dont get a ball from a pet store.  Kings and Corns from pet stores arent good either but dont lead to anywhere near as many problems as balls from pet stores.


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## arrowhd

*Good point*

Buying reptiles from a pet store is always questionable depending on the store.  Some are great, others well not so much.  Take a look at how the animals are cared for and ask questions.  A good store will have clean cages, well fed livestock and knowledgeable staff.  I bought my kingsnake from a local dealer.  This is always a great alternative.  They usually have a better selection and price.  Either way good luck with your purchase.


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## Midnightrdr456

only reason i say get a ball from a breeder always is balls from petstores seem to more often have feeding problems


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## TNeal

I have kept several snake species and loved them all.  For a newbie to the snake lovers club I would suggest either a milk or a corn snake.  Both of these are easy to keep in most instances.

The ptoblem with ball pythons is that, as mentioned before, they can go off feeding.  And even when feeding they can be very fussy about taking non-living items.  I had a ball that refused all non-living prey and would only eat live mice.  A practice I don't recommend for the health of the snake.  I once had a ball that went 8 months without eating.  Scared me to death.  But he did eventually start eating.

Whatever you do, don't start with the harder to keep, more exotic species.  Stick with the animals that are proven good pets for beginners.  This will save you money and great dissapointment if the more exotic fails to make it.

A good first experience is essential to staying in this wonderful hobby.

I hope this helps,

Tom


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## BugToxin

*What about a Hogg Island Boa?*

Ok, so Im still doing research.  I was pretty dead set on a ball python, but then I found some information on the hogg island boa.  The adult size of this snake looks about the same as that of a ball python, yet most of the care sheets I have found suggest a larger enclosure (like 60 gal size).  For you experienced snake people, what is the size difference here?  Is the hogg island boa too good to be true?  Would this be a good choice?


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## BugToxin

*I got him.  One handling question thoguh.*

Well, I made a decision and got a baby ball python.  I did a little more research on the Corn Island Boa and discovered that they can get a little larger than I would like.  Someday I may get one of these, but not today.  Besides, my baby ball is the cutest little snake on the planet!!!   I'll try to post some pictures later once he's had a chance to settle in and come out of his hide.

One thing though for those of you with some snake experience.  My little boy took a tiny swipe at the petstore owner as he was ringing me up.  The petstore owner (a personal friend) offered to let me pick another snake, but I decided to take this one anyway.  I figured that the little guy had just arrived that day, had been transfered from a sack/box to a strange cage, then held by me for about 20 minutes as I discussed bugs and stuff, then held by the petsore owner for a bit, so he probably had a good excuse to be crabby.

My question is will he get a lot more docile with more handling?  Should I worry about his little tantrum?  I want him to be as docile as possible and a pet that can be held frequently.  I've been told to wait a week before handling him at all by nearly everybody I ask so this is what I intend to do.  I also know not to handle for a few days after feeding, but once I start handling him how much time should I spend with him?  Should I hold him 15 minutes a day or 15 minutes a week?  More or less?  Does it matter?  Let me know what you think.


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## green_bottle_04

BugToxin said:


> Well, I made a decision and got a baby ball python.  I did a little more research on the Corn Island Boa and discovered that they can get a little larger than I would like.  Someday I may get one of these, but not today.  Besides, my baby ball is the cutest little snake on the planet!!!   I'll try to post some pictures later once he's had a chance to settle in and come out of his hide.
> 
> One thing though for those of you with some snake experience.  My little boy took a tiny swipe at the petstore owner as he was ringing me up.  The petstore owner (a personal friend) offered to let me pick another snake, but I decided to take this one anyway.  I figured that the little guy had just arrived that day, had been transfered from a sack/box to a strange cage, then held by me for about 20 minutes as I discussed bugs and stuff, then held by the petsore owner for a bit, so he probably had a good excuse to be crabby.
> 
> My question is will he get a lot more docile with more handling?  Should I worry about his little tantrum?  I want him to be as docile as possible and a pet that can be held frequently.  I've been told to wait a week before handling him at all by nearly everybody I ask so this is what I intend to do.  I also know not to handle for a few days after feeding, but once I start handling him how much time should I spend with him?  Should I hold him 15 minutes a day or 15 minutes a week?  More or less?  Does it matter?  Let me know what you think.




i agree with what you have already been told. leave him be for a week or so. also remember that snakes tend to be a little more nippy as babies. but balls for the most part are very docile and shy snakes. id hold him 3 times a week or so for about 15 minutes at a time.


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## Mushroom Spore

BugToxin said:


> My question is will he get a lot more docile with more handling...but once I start handling him how much time should I spend with him?  Should I hold him 15 minutes a day or 15 minutes a week?


If it's due to stress and "oh god I'm a tiny baby don't eat me," then absolutely yes he'll calm down with time.  He also might have just been hungry, though there's always the possibility that even a docile snake species might produce an asshole now and then.

Start off small, and learn to read his mood (as much as humans can read a snake, anyway). One thing you DON'T want to do is be hesitant or have your hand hover awkwardly over him, because this is the scariest thing in the world and makes you look like a predator. Don't remove him from inside a hide if you can help it, you want them to feel safe in there and they won't associate it with security if things keep "finding" them all the time. But if he's out and about, usually in the evenings, go ahead and scoop him up, just grab him around that pudgy midsection. 

At first I only did it for a couple minutes a day, barring the day of and days following feeding, once he'd settled in. Then you can go a bit longer as you feel comfortable, also keep in mind the temperature of the room itself--if it's less than 75, you probably don't want to keep him out too long. Good ways to bond (they don't really bond, but they can tell people apart by smell) include wearing a long-sleeved shirt tucked into your pants so you don't get any escapes down there, and letting him hide in there while you read/watch tv/play video games.

It's best to do this without a bunch of other people around, because that's just scarier. Plus you don't want the additional fear factor of strangers who will inevitably want to paw at him--I once went off on some idiot who snuck up behind me and started touching the snake around my neck without asking my permission. Scared the snake, it flinched hard, and I told the guy it would have served him right if he'd been bitten in the face. Rorschach wouldn't hurt a fly, but the guy didn't know that.  If you have friends you trust to interact with the snake, make sure they have good handling etiquette, know what to do, and aren't going to start going HOOOO SCARY and flinging the snake around or some stupid crap like that. That's a good way to get a terrified and/or bitey animal.

My concern is that you got him from a petstore, and that always gives me a sinking feeling in my gut to hear that. Was it a big chain petstore or a smaller one? Did they give ANY indication whether this was a wild-caught/captive-hatched or a captive bred animal? Are you sure he's eating--and if so, is he eating prekilled prey yet or still on live? Any signs of old skin stuck to it? Is the skin wrinkly at all? Are the eyes a nice shiny clear black or do they have a hazy, glazed look? Are the eyes perfectly round or are they indented at all? Have you examined it for mites or ticks? Can you make out the line of the backbone at ALL or is he nice and round? Is there any sign of discharge from mouth or nose, can you ever hear his breathing at all?

Gah, I worry about these guys. They always get such nasty abuse in petshops, and most of those WC/CH babies have never eaten a single meal in their lives and will never start, you can't help them.  I'd take him to the vet after he's pooped for you, OP, so you can get a fecal check for parasites and a general looking-over. Just be warned that vet trips are totally traumatic and he might need to be left alone for a week or two afterward.  

Best of luck, these are great snakes even when they drive us nuts.


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## BugToxin

Mushroom Spore said:


> Was it a big chain petstore or a smaller one? Did they give ANY indication whether this was a wild-caught/captive-hatched or a captive bred animal?


Hey MS,
No need to worry about the source on this one.  He came from my friends exotic petstore, and is definately captive bred.  Checked him out for all the things you mentioned too before buying and he looks really healthy.  I'm obviously a major noob when it comes to snakes, but my friend who sold me this cute baby boy is an expert who has been in the busines for some time now.

Anyway, good advice on the handling stuff.  I'm one of those older bug/snake people and I don't have any friends that are as stupd/irresponsible as what you mentioned.  Unfortunately though, I suspect that it is fairly common to have people like that around exotic pets in other households so it is still good advice.  I just want to make sure that I'm handling my BP in a way that is most likely to produce a pet that is safe and pleasant to interact with (hardly ever bites  ).  I do have a giant dog, and will keep him out of the room when handling the baby snake.  Fifteen minutes at a time, three times a week to start sounds good as well so I will start with that.  Hopefully the little swipe he made was an environmental rather than a personality issue and I will raise him up to be an upstanding member of snake society. 

Thanks Again.


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## Midnightrdr456

i would give it about a week or so to settle in and have its first meal, then let it digest a little.  Then I would start handling it, basically just as stress free as possible.

Balls are gorgeous snakes, most likely Im going to get a nice ball morph once i save up money.


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## Mushroom Spore

BugToxin said:


> I do have a giant dog, and will keep him out of the room when handling the baby snake.


Sounds like you're well on your way.  I just also want to note that he WILL be able to smell the dog, and you'll want to wash your hands extra good before you handle him, so your hands won't smell like dog. It probably won't be a problem, but he might be afraid of it, much like a human that smells like a rodent tends to get mistaken for a rodent.  

I'd keep the dog out of the snake's room period unless it's supervised, personally. You never know when a big dog might decide to investigate something, and you'll have to be twice as vigilant as anyone else against the possibility of your snake escaping its enclosure. I don't want to think what the dog would do if he found the snakey first.  Balls are complete sissies even against something as small as a rat, and that's even when they're ADULT snakes. Eek, indeed. 

You could even pre-emptively start escape-proofing the snake's room in general, if you want to be extra safe about it. Get a rubber liner or something put along the bottom of the door so that there is NO space to get into the rest of the house, tape some screen over any low air vents, that kind of thing. That way if the snake DOES somehow get out (and I think they all do, mine even had his one token escape last year), it won't be able to leave the room and will be much easier to find. 

I got lucky, mine just ended up in my bed before I even knew he was out.


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## arrowhd

Most snakes will let you know if they are willing to be handled or not.  Just avoid it when he is hungry, recently been fed, or opaque.  I personaly don't handle my California kingsnake really frequently.  Maybe once or twice a month.  This is just my own preference.  Remember, reptiles aren't like a pet dog that requires a high level of socialization.  They learn to tolerate our handling of them.  I think you will enjoy your ball python for many years to come.  Just remember, respect him and he will respect you.


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