# Scolopendra reproduction



## tmcv (Jan 1, 2013)

I'm trying to breed Scolopendra viridicornis.
There's a few males and females here. We've aready put two animals together, they've made the hole copula process, and we've observed it until the female ate the spermatophore.

My questions is:
How long will take until I see eggs?

The copula was about 4 months ago. Can I still wait for eggs?

Thanks!


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## Galapoheros (Jan 1, 2013)

Are you 100% sure it is Sc. viridicornis?  I'm very interested in seeing more pictures of viridicornis if you can post pics.  I've seen pedes eat the spermatophore, I'm wondering if they do that when they have already mated and are just going through the motions of mating, it's pretty strange, don't know what is really going on there.  I've seen pedes breed, lay eggs, eat them after 30 days, then a month or so later without breeding, they lay eggs again and they develop.  I've seen something like it recently with what is supposedly galapagoensis, ...breed, lay eggs, then no development for 30 days, finally being eaten.  Then lay eggs and see some development after 17 days.  So, I think you should not be surprised to see eggs in the next few months or so.  I think mid to upper 70'sF is good, deep soil on the moist side.  Good luck with it.


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## khil (Jan 3, 2013)

Not sure, and the sporadic information on the reproduction of centipedes i.e. gestation dont help. I hope someone with experience can. Is the female alone, and being fed?
Either way keep us up to date.


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## Galapoheros (Jan 3, 2013)

I wonder why he hasn't popped in again, this section seems to be dying.  A problem is that you can see eggs any time but they may not develop, even after mating, they are like tarantulas this way.  But that doesn't mean the next batch won't develop even if it doesn't mate again.  It is something to keep in mind.  There is evidence of sperm retention for at least around 8 months for some centipedes(heros, some longer claims) but there is not much known about viridicornis, you have to start somewhere and I'd assume it's similar.  They seem very similar to galapagoensis, no major seasonal changes in their natural environment so imo you should keep steady temps and deep soil for the females esp.  I saw two galapagoensis mate twice within around 8 months or so.  They laid eggs about a month after each mating.  I don't think anybody knows how long viridicornis can retain sperm, good luck finding even one more report of breeding viridicornis on the internet so it may come down to limited advice.  If it's been 4 months, I'd try to mate them again if I were you.  Hookem up and give the female a good pad right after is the best strategy imo, since little seems to be known about virid breeding.


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## tmcv (Jan 3, 2013)

Hey thanks for the answers.

Galapoheros, i'm sure that's viridicornis, we have about 40 viridicornis and just now we're trying to reproduce them. 
We have a few other males and about 20 viridicornis to sexing yet. So we can repeat the copula with the same animals and with others too, so I hope to publish some paper soon about viridicornis reproduction. 

I'll keep you guys informed.

Today the female have molted, khil you have asked me if the female are being fed, yes it is. I'm trying to keep the centipede without any stressor factor, so I'm not manpulating that much. I'm just humidifying the enviroment, changing the water and offering a cockroach or cricket every 15 days. The animal did not refuse the food any time.

Lets see what happens!!

Thanks again!


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## Galapoheros (Jan 3, 2013)

OK sounds interesting.  Has every viridicornis specimen you've seen had the ridge/crest on the last segment?  Sorry, I know it's a little off topic but I don't know if you would see it in a new thread.


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## tmcv (Jan 3, 2013)

Galapoheros here a not so good photo.
This is a viridicornis female eating the spermatophore. And it's very visible the crest on the last segments.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Galapoheros (Jan 3, 2013)

Ah thank you, thank you!  So do you see the crest on "every" viridicornis specimen?  In general, going by other pictures I've seen, viridicornis seem to have thicker terminal legs than galapagoensis too, have you seen this?  She sure is plump.  I set the galapagoensis up with big flat rocks for mating, you used egg crates?  I think I see the edge of new segments under the old exo in that pic, that's the one that molted isn't it.  I'm referring to the golden/brown edges, just like you can see in some scorpions when they come close to a molt.


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## tmcv (Jan 3, 2013)

Galapoheros, actually this animal molt a few months after this photo has been taken, this coloration on the edges is seen in the viridicornis!! In this photos she's eating the spermatophore right from the anus. 
Yes, the terminal legs of the viridicornis are way thicker, they present huge power there!! Sometimes they kill the preys only with the terminal legs!

We've used egg crates and toilet paper rolls (only the final roll) for the mating ambient.


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## Galapoheros (Jan 3, 2013)

Whoa, that's interesting about the terminal legs, they do look powerful.  I've wondered for a long time if the thick terminals are a viridicornis characteristic, compared to the longer thinner ones on galapagoensis, that's good info, thanks.  I have a pic of galapagoensis taking the whole spermatophore out too, at least it looked like it took out the 'whole' thing.  Here it is if you want to see it  http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r264/galapoheros/DSCN98281.jpg  With around 15 to 20cm of substrate, the galapagoensis usually go to the bottom to lay eggs in a dug out chamber, I'm guessing the same for viridicornis.


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## tmcv (Jan 4, 2013)

Nice pic Galapoheros!!!
I'll do a special enclosure for reproduction, a deeper enclosure actually!
I'll put some other male/females together too. At least one of the females shall lay eggs!!!

The normal enclosures that we keep the Scolopendra here is a little small. I work in a arthropods laboratory/vivarium, so we don't have space enough for big terrariums. We observed here that even the centipedes that lives in deeper terrariums don't use to burrow much. I don't know why!


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## Insektzuchen (Jan 5, 2013)

tmcv said:


> Hey thanks for the answers.
> 
> Galapoheros, i'm sure that's viridicornis, we have about 40 viridicornis and just now we're trying to reproduce them.
> We have a few other males and about 20 viridicornis to sexing yet. So we can repeat the copula with the same animals and with others too, so I hope to publish some paper soon about viridicornis reproduction.
> ...




tmcv -  I'm curious about why you state that you're trying to eliminate any stressors to the female centipede yet you're only allowing it to eat one cricket every 15 days.  Continuing the female on this Spartan diet is going to create stress not alleviate it.  
It's no wonder she's eating the spermatophore.  She'll probably eat the eggs if her body is able to produce any, and the male if he can be overpowered.  Producing and incubating fertile eggs, nutritionally depletes the female's body tremendously.  If she eats the eggs it's because she's trying to recoup the nutrients her body lost producing them (They eat their exoskeleton after molting for the same reason).  There's no conceivable evolutionary advantage for an organism to eat its own offspring.  If it were a common occurrence in the wild, centipedes would've gone extinct a long time ago.  Yet, fossil evidence suggests they've been around some 400 million years.
My unsolicited advice is to power feed your centipedes with gut-loaded feeder insects, beef, and add a nutritional supplement.
Then the female will stop eating everything she gets access to.  Good luck.


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## tmcv (Jan 5, 2013)

Insektzuchen said:


> tmcv -  I'm curious about why you state that you're trying to eliminate any stressors to the female centipede yet you're only allowing it to eat one cricket every 15 days.  Continuing the female on this Spartan diet is going to create stress not alleviate it.
> It's no wonder she's eating the spermatophore.  She'll probably eat the eggs if her body is able to produce any, and the male if he can be overpowered.  Producing and incubating fertile eggs, nutritionally depletes the female's body tremendously.  If she eats the eggs it's because she's trying to recoup the nutrients her body lost producing them (They eat their exoskeleton after molting for the same reason).  There's no conceivable evolutionary advantage for an organism to eat its own offspring.  If it were a common occurrence in the wild, centipedes would've gone extinct a long time ago.  Yet, fossil evidence suggests they've been around some 400 million years.
> My unsolicited advice is to power feed your centipedes with gut-loaded feeder insects, beef, and add a nutritional supplement.
> Then the female will stop eating everything she gets access to.  Good luck.


Insektzuchen, I agree with you in some parts... I agree that centipedes ate the molt because of the energy cost of the process, and sometimes they can eat the laying eggs because of the energy cost too, but this last one, I agree in parts... What I've observed for a long time, is that centipedes eat their eggs more because of stressors that lack of food.

About the "spartan diet", all the animal receive meticulous attention about their healthy. This biweekly scheme is made with all the centipedes of various genres, all the centipedes have their weight controled. This is the first time that we try to reproduce scolopendra, but we have success in reproduce a great variety of speciments (Cryptops, Dinocryptops, Otostigmus and others).
Kept in this "Spartan diet", a Scolopendra viridicornis, for example, that I've weighed yesterday, 6 months ago was with 17,759g. Now this same animal is 24,956g, and its an adult exemplar.

We must remember that animals kept in captivity have way less activities than a animal in the wild. Excess of food led to obesity, even in arthropods, and it's the most common cause of illness in any captivity animal.

I must recognize that females that are breeding have a more elevated energy consumption, that's why the prey item offered is bigger, but the frequency of feeding is the same. In fact, when the prey item is too big, this female ate the prey, and in the next feeding time, the centiped refuse another prey. Even if I let the cockroache in the terrarium, 3 days after the insect is still walking, 4 days after too, and in the next week to.

You've said "It's no wonder she's eating the spermatophore". Yes she is, we've observed the entire copula process, and this fact, of eat the spermatophore is common in Scolopendra species. Galapoheros have posted a photo of a S. galapagoensis doing the same.


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## Insektzuchen (Jan 5, 2013)

tcmv -  In a brief reply, I know all about animals eating their offspring when exposed to stressors not found in nature.  For example, both hamsters and mink will devour their young if exposed to very loud noise (a vacuum cleaner, thunderbolt, etc).  But your contention that a life in captivity is more stressful for a 'pede than a life in the tropical rain forest is naive, at best.  The rain forest is filled with diseases, parasites, predators, and abrupt weather changes.  This is not to mention the animals' nightly forage to find food and all the dangers that presents.  Captivity provides abundant food, clean water, protection from predators, and a climate controlled environment.  
I'd hardly call that stressful.
Next, your comparison of the needs of Scolopendrids to Cryptops, Otostigmus, etc. is misplaced.  Scolopendrids are the largest centipedes on the planet,  so their caloric and nutritional requirements are going to be much greater.  I should have been more specific when I spoke in the prior post of the nutritional needs of the female breeder.  I wasn't only speaking of the caloric requirement but the nutritional needs (proteins, vitamins & minerals) required to produce a clutch of fertile eggs.  The calories come into play when the female incubates the eggs in lieu of feeding herself.  I just don't see how one cricket every 15 days is going to accomplish this.  And the fear of creating an obese centipede is, quite frankly, bizarre.   Not only have I never seen an obese centipede but by it having an exoskeleton, it would be an impossibility.  My two viridicornis eat a large dubia roach every other day and a cube of beef every ten days and are doing great.
Finally, I'm aware that most Scolopendrids remove the spermatophore after mating and eat it.  However, this is most probably after it's deposited it's load and no longer serves any purpose.

Here are two videos of a non-breeding galapagoensis eating beef, and a gecko (parental discretion is advised).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mVGuciiUK4&sns=em

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-lPOtG7vcsw&sns=em


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## tmcv (Jan 5, 2013)

I'll no argue with you Insektzuchen... you have your opinion, I have mine...
and yes... a have already seen a obese Scolopendra... actually, the animal died, and at the necropsy, all the body was compromited, with fat. This animal, days before die, was lethargic and had all the obesity simptoms like other vertebrates. But ok...

About the captivty condition, EVERY animal in captivity have stressor, being a monkey, a parrot, or wherever animal. Let me ask you something: do you know any paper (scientific one), that describes all the diet of a Scolopendra viridicornis in the wild? Do you know where you find theses animals in the wild (this question I can tell you, since I've collect 50 exemplars in the wild with a hole scientific crew). So, for this last question, the answer is termite house (sorry about the english). From this question I ask you another one: what's the humidity and the temperature inside a termite house? I can tell you that outside this envoroment, the temperature at day reach 45°C.
We know that viridicornis live well at X temperature, and X humidity, but that's the range in the wild? You can tell me for sure? 
I'm a exotic pet veterinary, and I can tell you that 75 - 80% of the illness in my patients is because of stressor. Even dogs that are VERY adapted to humans life....  

Ok the genres that I list are smaller, but the offered prays for this animal are smaller too. That was just a example.


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## khil (Jan 5, 2013)

I think you should feed it more often. If it doesn't get a lot of food its going to absorb or delay the pregnancy, that is my opinion.


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## Galapoheros (Jan 5, 2013)

My 2 cents on some things mentioned, I have seen many Scolopendra heros matings with none of them eating the spermatophore, only some grooming later around the area.  Ime, it happens much less of the time than more.  My thought at this time is that there is an abortion of the spermatophore for some reason not yet known.  I've seen heros females go through all the mating behavior and then obviously, deliberately avoid the spermatophore, lifting the last segment away from it as it goes through the web tunnel.  Maybe they have already mated enough in these cases and don't need it or want it.  So, then why mate?  I was just wondering about that coming back from the store, maybe the mating would finally stop the male from pursuing and harassing the female in a familiar territory, I guess that's one possibility, studies indicate it happens in the human world haha.  Maybe they are just following some instincts.  Also, I don't think it's necessary to load up the female with food but I don't think it's a bad idea.  It's because I've caught very lean, wild Scolopendra heros centipedes and then a few days later they would be on eggs, hard to believe they had all the eggs inside and they go on to develop with a very thin(flat) mother.  I've caught many heros centipedes and every single one looked very lean and healthy, yet they do tend to sausage up in captivity.  If viridicornis is similar to galapagoensis, it seems to me that they are very efficient with food.  They seem to excrete very little waste and stay blown up.  Well that's interesting info about the termite mounds, it would be fun to catch those things in the wild.


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## tmcv (Jan 5, 2013)

khil said:


> I think you should feed it more often. If it doesn't get a lot of food its going to absorb or delay the pregnancy, that is my opinion.


khil I agree that pregnat females of any species should be fed with hight protein and other elements during the gestation or egg production. The fact is that this female are VERY FAT!!! She dosn't accept more food than the habitual, belive me, I've already tried.

The fact is that centipedes are oportunists, in the wild we will NEVER find any predator fat, they'll aways be on with the lowest weight possible for survive. This happens with raptors, lions, tigers, every predator. For that reason, this animals spend most part of the day quiet, sleeping, and saving energy. This could last days for vertebrates, even week, months or years for arthropods (studies have already shown that a brown recluse spider can spend a year without food). When the fat levels are in the limit, they will hunt, or look for carion like centipedes. 
In capitivity this animals spend the minimun of energy, centipedes don't even need to expand a lot of toxin in their preys. The energy coast is much less than the energy intake, that's one of the reasons why an animal fed biweekly are still having a weight gain and a healthy life.
Have A LOT of physiological factors that sustain the fact that this animals don't have to eat everyday, every two days, every week, and still be healthy.

You've said that centipedes have a non stress life in capitivty. That's an human opinion, actually, thats your opinion. You've should trying a experiment: spend a year locked in a room (small or medium size) without PC, television, sound system or anything. But keep eating the best food you can eat, drinking the best water you can drink, have this room cleaned for someone daily, and the temperature and humidity controled for the best. You know what will happen in the end of a year? You'll be a mentaly insane morbid obese. With no discution, this will be the result. And that's your  perfect non stress centipede life.


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## Insektzuchen (Jan 5, 2013)

tmcv:  It was actually my quote not khil's and that's not what I meant.  I said that a centipede's daily life in the tropical rain forests of South America is much more stressful than one lived in captivity (assuming its needs for adequate food, water, shelter and cable are being met).  You countered my opinion by comparing the simple needs of a captive invertebrate to those of an incarcerated human being in solitary confinement.  Your analogy is slightly flawed mainly because you've anthropomorphized an insect.  Humans have a need for mental, physical, emotional, intellectual, spiritual and environmental stimulation because we're the highest forms of life (I may be biased).  Insects don't.  And notwithstanding these obvious human needs, many inmates are made to live for years in the conditions you've described without suffering any permanent deleterious effects. ::
If you think life in the tropical rain forests of Peru or Brazil is shangri la, spend a year living in there without any of the amenities of modern life (as an experiment) and I'll bet after two weeks you'll gladly trade it in for that room in solitary, you described.
Cheers.


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## vespers (Jan 6, 2013)

Insektzuchen said:


> I said that a centipede's daily life in the tropical rain forests of South America is much more stressful than one lived in captivity (assuming its needs for adequate food, water, shelter and cable are being met). You countered my opinion by comparing the simple needs of a captive invertebrate to those of an incarcerated human being in solitary confinement. Your analogy is slightly flawed mainly because you've anthropomorphized an insect. Humans have a need for mental, physical, emotional, intellectual, spiritual and environmental stimulation because we're the highest forms of life (I may be biased). Insects don't.


In another thread you called a tarantula (Malaysian Blue Femur) an insect. Now you're referring to a centipede as an insect. Do you think frogs are reptiles, too?


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## Galapoheros (Jan 6, 2013)

Insektzuchen said:


> If you think life in the tropical rain forests of Peru or Brazil is shangri la, spend a year living in there without any of the amenities of modern life (as an experiment) and I'll bet after two weeks you'll gladly trade it in for that room in solitary, you described.
> Cheers.



But, when you open that cage, the centipede will leave for the rain forests of Peru, Brazil.  At least it will leave the cage if it finds a way out of the cage.  It does not want the amenities, maybe you are anthropomorphizing now.  Most likely, to a centipede, it's best element is out there, what we see as stress is what it thrives on.  We are taking it out of it's home and because if it's nature, it avoids the cage, it avoids that environment.  It's not unreasonable to keep in mind that that alone is probably stressful.  Personally I think it has much to do with not being able to go in and out of micro environments when caged, it's limited that way, we don't know exactly what they do in the wild, how much do they sense "outside", the rain, the fresh air, seasonal changes, monsoons, etc.  I've seen some surprising things, they are not so "just an invertebrate".  I've seen them "think", for lack of a better word, that they are about to escape an enclosure, they barely push the top up and they notice.  I push it back down to lock it and they obviously get worked up about noticing they might have pushed up an opening and they immediately try harder.  There seems to be something a caged animal loses.  I remember catching a squirrel in a live trap, it was panicking as I approached.  Not knowing what to do, it started eating, panicked, ate some more, then flipped over into shock but lived.  The eating looked normal but in reality it was very stressed.  I think it can be hard to tell when stress occurs.


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## Insektzuchen (Jan 6, 2013)

vespers said:


> In another thread you called a tarantula (Malaysian Blue Femur) an insect. Now you're referring to a centipede as an insect. Do you think frogs are reptiles, too?


Merriam-Webster defines "insect" as:
1a:  any of numerous small invertebrate animals (as spiders or centipedes) that are more or less obviously segmented - not used technically
b:  any of a class (Insecta) of arthropods (as bugs or bees) with well-defined head, thorax, and abdomen, only three pairs of legs, and typically one or two pairs of wings
2:  a trivial or contemptible person


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## vespers (Jan 6, 2013)

"Not used technically" ...just because the cast of _"Here Comes Honey Boo Boo"_ may not know the difference, that is still no excuse to perpetuate the use of blatantly mistaken terminology.
This is Arachnoboards; people usually come here looking for information, including proper taxonomy...and most members here encourage the use of binomial nomenclature, let alone grade school biological classification.


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## zonbonzovi (Jan 6, 2013)

Sigh.  The topic is "Scolopendra reproduction", one that I'd like to see more of in this section so perhaps we can stick to the details and leave noted myriapod experts W-M out of the discussion(eye roll).  The derailing of the topic started with the contention that the centipede first pictured was not receiving sufficient nutrition.  I advise you to look again.  It is quite well known among folks that have kept gravid females that external stress can have detrimental effects on the brood, i.e., the mother eats the eggs.  Outside the terrarium centipedes hide themselves away very well to mitigate these stresses.  In the terrarium they are subject to whatever we provide as well as our invasions(this can be seen again and again in this very forum when well meaning but impetuous keepers ignore the advice of others and continually check on a centipede with eggs).  Often this involves a brood chamber without entrance or exit.  If nutrition is such a large concern, why does the female never leave the eggs during development and create a space that discourages prey from entering?  In my limited experience with successful broods I've never fed during care of eggs or while a tarantula/spider is guarding a sac or when a scorpion is carrying the newly hatched...as expected, they've done just fine 

Regarding egg production from time of mating and sperm retention: I have posted before that I have 2 S. alternans producing eggs post molt 3 years running w/o ever seeing a male in my care.  I know summer is ending when it happens it has become so regualar.  I don't know how common this is but there are quite a few instances of WC animals reproducing long after acquisition.  Obviously, we need more data.

These fascinating discussions are few and far between.  Let's not junk it up with too many hypotheticals.  Personally, I'll take Galapahero's suggestions to heart every time as I haven't seen any stateside hobbyists with his level of continued success.


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## tmcv (Jan 7, 2013)

zonbonzovi said:


> Sigh.  The topic is "Scolopendra reproduction", one that I'd like to see more of in this section so perhaps we can stick to the details and leave noted myriapod experts W-M out of the discussion(eye roll).  The derailing of the topic started with the contention that the centipede first pictured was not receiving sufficient nutrition.  I advise you to look again.  It is quite well known among folks that have kept gravid females that external stress can have detrimental effects on the brood, i.e., the mother eats the eggs.  Outside the terrarium centipedes hide themselves away very well to mitigate these stresses.  In the terrarium they are subject to whatever we provide as well as our invasions(this can be seen again and again in this very forum when well meaning but impetuous keepers ignore the advice of others and continually check on a centipede with eggs).  Often this involves a brood chamber without entrance or exit.  If nutrition is such a large concern, why does the female never leave the eggs during development and create a space that discourages prey from entering?  In my limited experience with successful broods I've never fed during care of eggs or while a tarantula/spider is guarding a sac or when a scorpion is carrying the newly hatched...as expected, they've done just fine
> 
> Regarding egg production from time of mating and sperm retention: I have posted before that I have 2 S. alternans producing eggs post molt 3 years running w/o ever seeing a male in my care.  I know summer is ending when it happens it has become so regualar.  I don't know how common this is but there are quite a few instances of WC animals reproducing long after acquisition.  Obviously, we need more data.
> 
> These fascinating discussions are few and far between.  Let's not junk it up with too many hypotheticals.  Personally, I'll take Galapahero's suggestions to heart every time as I haven't seen any stateside hobbyists with his level of continued success.


Zonbonzovi, for sure if the animals really needed this amount of food they will prey instead being keep the eggs!!! I hope that this viridircornis don't spend 3 years to lay eggs as you said with your alternans, but i know it can happen!!!!

Thanks everybody (with a few exceptions!!) for the help, I'll post the evolution!!!


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