# Some more "user friendly" snakes



## the toe cutter (May 31, 2010)

I have seen alot of people recently who really want to get into the reptile hobby who don't end up having alot of luck with them!? Well I decided to try to get an ongoing list of great "starter" snakes that meet my criteria of being "easy" captives .
  First I want to start out with the general 2 rules I look for in a beginner snake.

1) The most important factor in ever buying any beginner reptile is where it came from. ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS buy captive bred and buy from a breeder! For this simple reason, petstores in most cases, get a price sheet from some animal distributor and have no earthly idea where the animals actually came from or the conditions in which they were kept and most of the time don't even know if the animals are eating. Farm Raised is NOT captive born and bred!!! Plus, I get price lists from a few different distributors and importers and you would not believe how much above the cost a pet store will charge you! Talking anywhere from 150% -300% increase in what the animal cost them!

2) Research! Do some research and find out the specifics about the animal you are about to buy. If you are gonna order it online please take the additional 20 minutes to find out the basics about the animal you are interested in. A general care sheet on the specific species you want is online and free!! This should tell you what to feed and how often, heating needs, and caging requirements and adult size. And check your local laws which you should be able to find on your states dept of natural resources page.

  I am not gonna mention anything about any boas or pythons as I feel ALOT of people do not realise the time and effort that is required to own these snakes, and unfortunately due to the irresponsibility of pet owners and sellers in this country, alot of legislature is attempting to get passed on mass bans of reptiles in quite a few states. While I don't agree with this, I do agree that there definately needs to be regulations put into place and would like to see something more in the way of permits for owning large reptiles.

Ok without further interruptions here is my top ten.

African House snakes, Lamprophis sp. are relatively small, readily available,  inexpensive snakes (average market price around 40$) that thrive in captivity and breed READILY! So anyone looking to try their hand at breeding these are for you! 

Beaked snakes Rhamphiophis sp. These get a bit larger the red spotteds (rubropunctatus) getting around 7ft, while the rufous beaks (oxyrhynchus) averaging around 4-5 ft. These are by far the most handleable snake I have ever seen! My male red spotted beak will literally sit in my lap, head raised lookin around for hours. They are rear fanged but mine have never once showed any aggression and everyone I have talked to has said the exact same thing, but check local laws! here is the toxicity report http://www.toxinology.com/fusebox.cfm?fuseaction=main.snakes.display&id=SN2181

Kingsnakes and Milksnakes Lampropeltis, Ah the classic! Moderate size, great feeders, and available from just about every breeder out there! And ofcourse they have a wide array of color morphs, and are relatively inexpensive as well! I would steer clear of any Mountain kings and Scarlet kings as a beginner, as sometimes the babies and adults can be a bit tricky to feed since they are normally lizard eaters.

Cornsnakes Pantherophis Guttatus, what else is there to say. Moderate size, fairly easily handled as young and tame down very well! Inexpensive and they have over 90 different phenotypes which makes them the undisputed kings/queens of the color and pattern morphs! I assure no matter how hard core and advanced the snake keeper, they probably have a few in the closet they dont tell anyone about! There is a color and pattern of cornsnake for damn near everyone. These can be a little tricky to feed as hatchlings so pay the extra 20$ or so, and pick up a yearling or older.

Bull snakes and Gopher Snakes Pituophis sp. These are the big boys and girls of the more commonly kept colubrids, and can be a little fiesty but will calm down with a little bit of handling. They are moderate in body length but make up for it in girth! They are good eaters, and also come in some outstanding color morphs and are fairly inexpensive as well.

African Mole snakes Pseudaspis sp. These fellas are on the large and in charge spectrum of colubrids and unfortunately are a little out of the price range for some beginner keepers, but I cannot say enough about them! Calm as kittens and a very impressive snake! Rear fanged as well though not apt to bite, toxicology report is pretty much the same as the Beaked snakes. Awesome, awesome snakes, atleast look them up!

Kunasir Island Ratsnakes Elaphe climacophora. These are moderately sized about 5-6ft gems of the ratsnake world! They are very cold tolerant, being from a small island that is just off the northern tip of Japan. These by far in my experience are just like corn snakes in temperment and are very beautiful reptiles.

Leopard Ratsnake Elaphe situla. Very pretty little European ratsnakes that are in the smaller end of the ratsnake spectrum and have a great attitude and similar care requirements to Corn snakes. Great snakes and on the moderate side as far as prices go, but check them out all the same!

Mexican Night snake Elaphe Flavirufa. Another awesome smaller ratsnake that is fairly priced and tames down very well though not aggressive but very shy. These guys are fantastic looking snakes with the normals or the anery morph that is phenomenal in this species! The best feature I think are the eyes, they are a very light grey/silver with a tiny little dot for a pupil. A definate must see.

  My goal here was to provide some common and a few not so common colubrids that I have worked with which I believe to be great beginner animals. Now as I have said before, this is very general, and I have seen some rather nasty corns as well as kings, but overall believe that most can and will calm down. I would also apreciate any and all additions to this list with a short synopsis as why they would be good beginner snakes. This is something I believe any snake keeper could and should comment on for the betterment of the hobby! Thanks and enjoy


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## pitbulllady (Jun 1, 2010)

I'm going to add Asian Beauty Rat Snakes, especially the Taiwan Beauties, to that list.  They are as easy to care for as a Corn, generally have a very friendly disposition, but they get HUGE for a Colubrid, rivaling some of the Boas in length, if not girth.  They are a great alternative for someone who wants a big, friendly, impressive snake but doesn't want to deal with all the heat mats and lights(these snakes really like it on the cool side), the humidity requirements and the work that can go with a tropical Boid.  I've had male Taiwans that were easily 8 feet long, and heavy-bodied, but otherwise were like giant Corns.

pitbulllady


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## the toe cutter (Jun 1, 2010)

I have had similar luck with the cave dwellers (Elaphe ridleyi) as well, but they do get a little nippy from time to time and are not the most "regular" feeders! But overall I still consider them an "intermediate" snake.


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## Elleken (Jun 1, 2010)

Now do you know breeders for all of these snakes?


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## Lorgakor (Jun 1, 2010)

the toe cutter said:


> I am not gonna mention anything about any boas or pythons as I feel ALOT of people do not realise the time and effort that is required to own these snakes, and unfortunately due to the irresponsibility of pet owners and sellers in this country, alot of legislature is attempting to get passed on mass bans of reptiles in quite a few states. While I don't agree with this, I do agree that there definately needs to be regulations put into place and would like to see something more in the way of permits for owning large reptiles.


I have to disagree with this statement. You can't lump all boas and pythons into one group like that. They aren't all giants like Burmese Pythons or Red Tail Boas. 
From my own experience, I found my Woma Python, to be a FAR better beginner snake than the corn snake I had. 
Both females, the corn snake was almost adult, around 3.5ft, and the Woma was young, around 1.5ft. Now, the woma python has been a doll from the start, never once has she attempted to bite, or hiss, or even flail during handling. She has never once missed a meal, even in shed. She lives on paper towel with a heat mat on a thermostat. The same as the corn snake. No difference in care, other than different temps. (being in Canada, the corn needed a heat mat)

Now, the corn snake never ate in my care, yet she pooped more than my woma. She was not as nice to handle, didn't have even remotely the kind of personality as the python and was just not as enjoyable as a pet. I couldn't imagine how much poop I would have had to clean up if she had been eating. Plus, their poop is runnier and stinkier, the python being more like a dog, and she goes sometimes a couple weeks between bathroom breaks.

There are lots of nice, small-medium docile easy to care for pythons. Just because a snake needs heat does not make it difficult to care for.

Same can be said for many boa species such as sand boas. My rough scales were never handled much, yet they have never once tried to bite. They too have nice slow metabolisms so are easy to clean up after. 

Anyway, that's just my opinion. I started with a Woma Python and got a corn snake right after, and I don't think I'll ever buy a colubrid again. They aren't the be all end all for all beginners, and I think it is not a good beginner list if it doesn't include at least some boas and pythons.


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## Lucas339 (Jun 1, 2010)

the toe cutter said:


> I am not gonna mention anything about any boas or pythons as I feel ALOT of people do not realise the time and effort that is required to own these snakes, and unfortunately due to the irresponsibility of pet owners and sellers in this country, alot of legislature is attempting to get passed on mass bans of reptiles in quite a few states. While I don't agree with this, I do agree that there definately needs to be regulations put into place and would like to see something more in the way of permits for owning large reptiles.


im going to disagree with this too.  my ball pythons are the easiest of all my snakes to care for.  and, as stated above, not all are giants.  the Antaresia genus of pythons tend to stay small.  i prefer pythons far to any colubrid because i hate to get pooped on everytime i pick a snake up.  and the most picky of all the sankes i ever owned were colubrids.  one was a cali king and the other is a hognose.  both are extremely picky eaters where as all of my pythons are garbage cans.


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## Crysta (Jun 1, 2010)

I think it also depends on the personality of the snake, and how it was raised. Although there is exceptions. Colubrids do poop alot.... lol
Maybe the best thing to go about it, is test at the petstore on feeding day and see if the animals actually eat, and seem active enough. (my petstore here isn't too bad at all) 
But if you are buying online all you have is the word of the breeder, so then, I would say go with a well known person for what ever you are getting, and you should be satisfied unless they rip you off too, then maybe you just have bad luck... lol


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## Obelisk (Jun 1, 2010)

Has anyone had any good/bad experiences with Western Hognose snakes? I plan on getting one of those this week. After having that one for a while I'd like to get a Pueblan Milk snake. I've been thinking about getting a snake for a long time now, and I've finally going to start with a hognose. I'm mainly looking for a snake that's relatively small and that doesn't give much trouble in the way of feeding (Western hogs are said to take pinkies and mice readily).


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## Widowman10 (Jun 1, 2010)

i've had great luck with my WHS. she eats FT pinkies like a champ. aside from just a little bit of attitude here and there, she's a great snake, i think you'll enjoy 'em.


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## the toe cutter (Jun 1, 2010)

Hmmmmm.... fantastic


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## pouchedrat (Jun 1, 2010)

Hell I've even had people try to give me their balls and corns, and I'm not a snake person (I have my ringnecks and the egg-eater, and that's it).  

What about rosy boas?  I hear lots of good things about them and keep seeing them at reptile expos....


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## the toe cutter (Jun 1, 2010)

Wonderful, I love the interactions here


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## the toe cutter (Jun 1, 2010)

Enjoy your Ball Pythons!


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## pitbulllady (Jun 1, 2010)

the toe cutter said:


> In reply to the boa/python issue, I understand that womas are great pythons for beginner but I was trying to list some reptiles that are a bit more affordable. I know the Aspidites genus has significantly decreased in "value" over the past few years but are still around 200-300$ per individual on average. And I am more well aware of certain genus' of pythons that dont exceed 2-2.5 feet in length, Antaresia for example, and are great captive pets. The issue is the people who go to a pet store one day see a 20" baby burm or retic and decide to take it back home and have no idea what they are getting themselves into and end up with dead children, themselves, or worse in my opinion, the reptile. Just here in Va in the last year a woman was feeding her pet retic by herself and it decided to go another route and killed her. And a baby was also found by its parent one morning dead in the coils of their pet python. Now while I am an avid Darwinist, and love when humans are hit in the face with the concept that we are not quite the most dominant species, MOST people are terrified of snakes and when news like that hits the headlines and it scares the crap out of people, and then we get all these ridiculous bans going around the senate hearing committee and every year it gets worse and worse. And while the issue in Fl with their invasive species acts are more specific on particular species of boas/pythons, most that go to the senate are not species specific at all! They call for the ban of ALL pythons, including little antaresia mentioned above! And I believe that the only way to reassure the public and keep boas/pythons in the market today is to impose stricter regulations and requiring people to obtain permits, not only for population reports for the DNR, but to keep alot of irresponsible pet owners and petstores from having these animals. I'm telling you, if it continues on this current trend boas and pythons are gonna be illegal in alot of states without regards to species.
> 
> Now yes there are plenty of places that captive breed all of the animals I have currently listed, I would not list any "beginner" reptiles that were not currently available as captive bred specimens. I for instance am currently breeding, Red Spotted Beak snakes, various Corn and kingsnake morphs, Leucistic Texas Ratsnakes, and some other more difficult species. I do believe that I am not allowed to advertise other websites here publicly. But you can PM me and I will let you know where to find these guys.
> 
> And on the topic of Ball Pythons, I have had more Ball Pythons given to me as rescues and heard more tales of peoples BP's dying on them than any other snake on the market. Perhaps its because of their huge popularity thus more common, or that alot are imported, heavily parasitized and housed in terrible conditions at your local petshops before you buy them! I have seen MANY petstores that will have 5-15 ball pythons in a 20-40gal enclosure and it makes me physically ill! So if one happens to have parasites, they all do. I do not recommend Ball Pythons to anyone as a beginner reptile. All I hear when people learn I own 38 snakes is oh yeah I, or someone I knew had a ball python, blah, blah and it died. I have seen more ball pythons that would regurge or just plain not eat at all, were in optimal conditions, both as hatchlings and adults and withered away. So I will have to disagree with you on the ball pythons.


Toe Cutter, the Retic incident in Virginia that you mentioned was NOT a pet python, but an animal in an accredited zoo, and the woman killed was a professional zoo keeper.  Again, this was not a pet!  Serious injuries and death of keepers from animal attacks in zoos actually occur more than the public is aware.  Pet animals, those that are privately owned, get all the negative press when something happens, and generate all sorts of knee-jerk reactions from the public and the politicians, much to the delight of the HSUS and PETA, while many zoo incidents are quietly covered up and do not make national headlines, or the event gets muddled.  As for the "baby" being "found dead in the coils of their pet python" by a parent, I believe you are referring to the case down in Sumter County, FL, from last July. If so, you REALLY need to read THIS, written by someone with inside information on this particular case:  http://boatails.wordpress.com/2010/04/14/in-response-to-the-recent-hsus-email-campaign-2/  .  In fact, EVERY member here who still believes that the snake was responsible for this child's death needs to read it.  All of us who are experienced large Boid owners have suspected from the start that somethings just did not add up, and this was a case where someone needed a convenient scapegoat to take the pressure off of their own despicable act, and I still stand by that conviction, regardless of what they lying piece of snot, Sen. Bill Nelson, and his cronies in the sensationalism-driven media and the HSUS want you to believe.  The write-up I linked to is long, but make sure to read the whole thing, especially the latter half which deals specifically with the Shiaunna Hare case.  It's bad enough when the snake-hating general public goes around spouting that a "giant killer snake did this, a giant killer snake did that", but really awful when a snake keeper doesn't know what is going on and perpetuates the "killer snake" mythos.  No, Burms and Retics aren't great first-time snakes, just like Akitas and Catahoulas aren't good for the novice dog owner, BUT armed with the right knowledge, even large snakes can be successfully kept by someone with a minimum of experience.  I got my first Boa, a North Brazilian, or true Red-Tail, when I was 12, and I've kept Boas ever since.  I did my research first, and even had a custom cage built and designed by my grandfather, complete with a built-in thermostat to keep the temperature just right, something unheard of in those days.  Then again, there are many people who will kill a Corn Snake with neglect and lack of knowledge about that animal's needs and requirements, so it really boils down to the person.  How much research and committment are they willing to put in?  How serious are they about maintaining this animal for its lifetime?  I'd recommend a Common Boa for a first-timer over several smaller Colubrids, including many in the Milk-King Snake family, if I thought that the person was serious about making that committment.

pitbulllady


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## pouchedrat (Jun 1, 2010)

yeah, pitbulllady, usually when people go on about how you shouldn't own exotic animals as pets, I usually bring up the whole fact that dogs, horses, cattle, etc. cause far more deaths and injuries per year than any exotic.  I have always trusted the exotics I've kept more than any dog I've ever come across (I do have a fear of dogs though, and have been bitten enough times to warrant that).  I always did feel if you have all the requirements, time, money, space, knowledge, etc. then go ahead, get the animal. 

It's one of those things, certain pets work for certain people. I guess the same could be said even further, certain snakes work for different people, everyone's different.  I'll personally stick to non-rodent eaters and mini-snakes, i guess (blind snakes next! weee!).  If elephant trunk snakes weren't so notoriously hard to care for, I'd probably have one of them as well. The water at our place is hard, though, I don't trust most fish in it, let alone a snake, even with treatment..  Probably why fish like cichlids are so popular around here.


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## the toe cutter (Jun 1, 2010)

I am just gonna remove this as much as possible


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## the toe cutter (Jun 1, 2010)

this is ridiculous


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## Lucas339 (Jun 2, 2010)

the toe cutter said:


> And on the topic of Ball Pythons, I have had more Ball Pythons given to me as rescues and heard more tales of peoples BP's dying on them than any other snake on the market. Perhaps its because of their huge popularity thus more common, or that alot are imported, heavily parasitized and housed in terrible conditions at your local petshops before you buy them! I have seen MANY petstores that will have 5-15 ball pythons in a 20-40gal enclosure and it makes me physically ill! So if one happens to have parasites, they all do. I do not recommend Ball Pythons to anyone as a beginner reptile. All I hear when people learn I own 38 snakes is oh yeah I, or someone I knew had a ball python, blah, blah and it died. I have seen more ball pythons that would regurge or just plain not eat at all, were in optimal conditions, both as hatchlings and adults and withered away. So I will have to disagree with you on the ball pythons.


all of my ball pythons as well as everyone i know with captive bred ball pythons have no issues with them.  many people buy them because they are easily obtained and no one really reads up on them.  they are one of the most common snakes sold at pet stores which is why you read so many problems.  i have also seen more rescues turned around a live more than those that wither away.  with proper care, and vet treatments that are sometimes required on rescues, they can be easy to turn around.  it all depends on the circles you find your information in.  i am a part of the ball python circle so i hear many ball python stories of rescues ect.  it is true that some can be picky but i have seen more picky colubirds than pythons in my time.


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## Widowman10 (Jun 2, 2010)

the toe cutter said:


> Western Hognose snakes are pretty good beginners, but they are rear fanged as well, so check your local laws. I have heard alot of good things about them, but a friend of mine had a very nice female, and though she ate very well as a hatchling and juvenile, for some reason they would stop eating and become more finicky as adults? I have heard this a few times from other people as well, including some breeder friends of mine. Perhaps the lizard/toad eating instinct became more aparent with age?


2 things- they are rear-fanged, but are mildly venomous, so they wouldn't be considered a "hot." the same rules apply (here in CO) as with other native non-venomous. 2nd thing, WH are a bit different in diet than their eastern relatives whereas the westerns feed almost exclusively on rodents. easterns are more lizard/toad specialists and will usually not feed only on rodents at all. just some thoughts.


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## the toe cutter (Jun 2, 2010)

Wow, so many angered people here.


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## Widowman10 (Jun 2, 2010)

ok, maybe i should re-phrase. western hognosed snakes are the only species of hognoses that can be fed almost exclusively rodents. they are the only ones that can take rodents their entire life without any effects. all others must be fed amphibians, lizards, etc etc. so while the westerns will sometimes take toads and such, it is not necessary to their diet like the other hognoses. that is what i meant by westerns feed on rodents. there aren't an abundance of amphibians in the dry arid places westerns are found. some, but not an abundance. anyway, carry on.


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