# Romanian field trips(very long post)



## LovePets

Hi guys!
These are some photos from field trips that I have made this year in Romania(most of them are near Brasov)
_*Lissotriton vulgaris*_











_*Lissotriton montandoni*_











_*Ichtyosaura alpestris*_


























*Alpestris+montandonii*






_*Bufo bufo*_




































_*Bombina variegata*_


























_*Bufo viridis*_









































_*Rana temporaria*_








































Tadpoles






_*Lacerta agilis*_







































































_*Zootoca vivipara*_




































_*Emys orbicularis*_











_*Natrix tessellata*_






























Melanistic specimen






_*Lacerta viridis*_


























_*Natrix natrix*_










Melanistic specimen






_*Pelophylax kl. esculentus*_









































_*Pelophylax ridibundus*_
















_*Pelophylax lessonae*_






The only _*podarcis tauricus*_ I have ever seen






_*Anguis fragilis*_


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## Wadew

Awsome variety of critters! If I had to choose a favorite it would be the Bufo viridis. What a sight man. great to share with us, Thank you.

                                                       Wade


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## LovePets

Thank you!Bufo viridis is my favourite too,(altough they are very common in Romania,in Brasov is the rarest toad) and the viviparous lizard(zootoca vivipara).


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## Herpetologydude

Awesome pictures! Didn't realize how diverse the native herpto-fuana was in Romania! Didn't realize you guys had the _Bombina_ genus over there either! Awesome stuff!


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## MaartenSFS

Thanks for sharing. I love the water salamanders, the Bombina species (I used to own three orientals), and the lizards. You should have some species of adders too, yes? O, and I was surprised to see turtles.


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## LovePets

Thank you guys!
We have 2 _bombina_ species:_bombina variegata_ and _bombina bombina_.In fact,_variegata_ is the most common herp in our country,you can find them everywhere from altitudes of 200 meters to 2000 meters high and they are VERY adaptable,you can find them even in the urban places from big cities.
And yes,we have some vipers too...._vipera berus_(*common adder*),_vipera ammodytes_(*nose-horned viper*),_vipera ursinii_(*orsini's viper*) and maybe _vipera renardi_(*steppe viper*).
I love the variety of herps in my country,but,unfortunately,I have found just 19 species(from a total of 43).But this year I advanced in field herping(I found 5 more species above last years).


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## Herpetologydude

That's absolutely awesome, 

I enjoy seeing how widespread some of the genre are across sea's even. Seeing all those Rana and Bufo specimens, its just very cool to me! 

Seeing the convergent evolution of the _Natrix_ genus compared to the states own _Nerodia_ is very cook in itself! 

Sorry I get all giddy about this kind of stuff! LOL


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## tarcan

excent series, nice to see your local fauna... very nice animals and great pictures, thank you for sharing them!

Martin


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## LovePets

Cheers guys,it was my pleasure to share them with you!
Today I was on field and I found lots of juvenilles...
_Bufo viridis_ 





_Bombina variegata_










_Ichtyosaura alpestris_





_Bufo bufo_ adult male















Their habitat:





I also found many sand lizards(_lacerta agilis_),a grass snake(_natrix natrix_) and few common frogs(_rana temporaria_),but I didn't take any pictures of them.
I wish you all the best,
Florin!


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## MaartenSFS

I'm so glad to hear that the environment there is good enough to support such a wide variety of species. A Bombina species being the most common is fortunate indeed. Having lived in Europe, Asia, and North America, it's interesting to see what species dominate in each. This also has to do with human impact over the centuries.

For example, turtles are fairly common here in North America whilst in China they are on the verge of extinction in the wild. Lizards are commonly found in peoples' houses there, though, and only occasionally find their way into wine. In northern North America vipers don't make it up that high due to a lack of denning sites and recent glaciation perhaps, but the common adder is found all over Europe, almost. The garter snake ranges all over north America all the way to Alaska, the furthest north of any snake, I believe. In many places skinks are the most common lizards seen but in Europe it's often cooler-looking species like those in the genus Lacerta. I could swear that I have seen anoles, common to southern North America, in China.

Anyways, sorry for the long rant. Good luck on your quest to "catch 'em all".


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## VinceG

Really nice pictures! Always fun to see the reptiles and amphibians of other countries!


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## LovePets

Thanks!
@*MaartenSFS*I like to associate the european species with north american ones...for example,I associate the aquatic _natrix spp._(_natrix tessellata,natrix maura_) with _nerodia spp._ and the semiaquatic one(_natrix natrix_) with _thamnophis spp._ due to their behaviour and also due to their appearance;european _bufo spp._(_bufo bufo,bufo viridis_ )with american _bufo spp._(_bufo americanus,bufo debilis_);european tree frogs with american ones etc.
P.S. _bufo debilis_ is now _anaxyrus debilis_(I love these small toads)???


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## zonbonzovi

Thanks for sharing the under-appreciated newts!  Lots of physical similarities with our natives on this side of the pond.


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## MaartenSFS

LovePets said:


> Thanks!
> @*MaartenSFS*I like to associate the european species with north american ones...for example,I associate the aquatic _natrix spp._(_natrix tessellata,natrix maura_) with _nerodia spp._ and the semiaquatic one(_natrix natrix_) with _thamnophis spp._ due to their behaviour and also due to their appearance;european _bufo spp._(_bufo bufo,bufo viridis_ )with american _bufo spp._(_bufo americanus,bufo debilis_);european tree frogs with american ones etc.
> P.S. _bufo debilis_ is now _anaxyrus debilis_(I love these small toads)???


I agree with you that there are similar species filling an ecological niche in most of the northern hemisphere. Strange, though, that turtles don't make it as far north in Western Europe, even with the mild climate. Did we eat them all? In China most have been eaten and I wouldn't venture to guess how far north they reach there. Snakes and, especially, lizards reach very far north there. And on the invertebrate side of things why don't scorpions reach as far north in North America as in Europe or China?

My favourite North American frog species is Hyla versicolor. In Europe Hyla arborea and others fill the role. The tree frogs in China, also including genus Hyla species, were brilliantly coloured. One specimen I found looked like the red-eyed tree frog of the Neotropics. Toads there and in Europe looked rather similar and most that I have seen were Bufo. They seemed to get A LOT bigger in South China, though.


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## LovePets

At the part with turtle eating...few years ago,on the Black Sea coast I found thousands of *european pond terrapins*(_emys orbicularis_).Now,in that places I am lucky if I can find 3 or 4/day.Why???Because some vietnamese people (nothing personal) that work on romanian coastline "adventured" in turtles habitat and catch them all;luckily some escaped,but very few(this is the case of many other herps,including *dice snakes*,*edible frogs*,*marsh frogs*).
I don't know about Northern Europe,but in Romania many people kill the herps from pleasure,or,if they see a snake they see "satan",and must kill it. :wall:
Sadly,this is the world we live in.:barf:


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## MaartenSFS

Unfortunately this is the case in many parts of the world. Asia is the worst, where most people have no respect for nature, or even each other. Luckily there terrain prohibits some of the destruction:


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## H. laoticus

For the above poster: 

You must have met at least over 1.5 billion of the people there to make such a statement.

To the OP:

Great pictures and thanks for sharing.


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## LovePets

Cheers!
I hope I will update this topic if I will have enough time to go for field herping in one of the greatest habitats in Romania next week!


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## MaartenSFS

H. laoticus said:


> For the above poster:
> 
> You must have met at least over 1.5 billion of the people there to make such a statement.
> 
> To the OP:
> 
> Great pictures and thanks for sharing.


Not necessary. Lived there for over four years and the evidence was plentiful. Also, most just means 51% or more so this is rather vague but disturbing nonetheless.


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## MaartenSFS

LovePets said:


> Cheers!
> I hope I will update this topic if I will have enough time to go for field herping in one of the greatest habitats in Romania next week!


Good luck. Waiting for more photos.. :wall:


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## H. laoticus

MaartenSFS said:


> Not necessary. Lived there for over four years and the evidence was plentiful. Also, most just means 51% or more so this is rather vague but disturbing nonetheless.


You can say most of the people you've Met are like that, but don't say most of Asia is.  There's about 4 billion people in Asia I believe, so you'd have to have met close to 2 billion to even generalize to Most.  I believe it is necessary.  It's like saying most Blacks are criminals or most Latinos are lazy.  It's not true.


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## MaartenSFS

H. laoticus said:


> You can say most of the people you've Met are like that, but don't say most of Asia is.  There's about 4 billion people in Asia I believe, so you'd have to have met close to 2 billion to even generalize to Most.  I believe it is necessary.  It's like saying most Blacks are criminals or most Latinos are lazy.  It's not true.


Have you been to Asia?? It's not a stereotype, it's a part of their culture. I'll most likely be moving back next year so it's not racism at all, just an unfortunate fact that I've pointed out. Does this mean every last one of them? No, but the percentage is high enough that I feel comfortable to use the word most. And it's not just the developing countries. The biggest markets for bushmeat are South Korea and Taiwan, both quite rich, and Japan and East China aren't far behind.


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## H. laoticus

MaartenSFS said:


> Have you been to Asia?? It's not a stereotype, it's a part of their culture. I'll most likely be moving back next year so it's not racism at all, just an unfortunate fact that I've pointed out. Does this mean every last one of them? No, but the percentage is high enough that I feel comfortable to use the word most. And it's not just the developing countries. The biggest markets for bushmeat are South Korea and Taiwan, both quite rich, and Japan and East China aren't far behind.


So you're telling me that based on the little percentage of people you've met you're going to say that the other 2 billion are just the same in thought processes?  I didn't say it was racist or stereotypical, I am staying it is unwise at best to generalize to over 2 billion people.  How is the percentage high enough to generalize to 2 billion?  What is the percentage of people you've met compared to the total population in Asia?  To automatically assume that it's a "fact" is absurd.  
Do you realize that your sample of people is extremely low?  You're also limited to location.  
Your experiences have led your opinions to be clearly biased.  

So from what I can see, you're basically saying that it is cultural for most Asians to 1) have no respect for nature and 2) have no respect for each other.  It's cultural for them to disrespect one another?  To destroy nature?
Additionally, the agendas of the big markets does not equal that of the people.  
And yes, I've been to Asia.  In order to use the word most, you have to know at least 2 billion people and that is something you can't do.  You'd have to do a heck of a lot more testing to come close to that.    

Let me put it this way:  Let's say I go to a college and from my experiences, I see that most of the people *I've* met are drunks and party people.  However, the percentage of people *I've actually met* is only 1% of the school's population.  It would be foolish for me to then say that since I've met the 1% and they seem to be drunks and party people, then it's safe to say that 51% of them are like that too--when I haven't even met close to half the number of people attending the college!  There are so many variables that I am limited to.  

What you're doing is committing the Hasty Generalization fallacy. 
A lot of the senseless crap that happens in the world is a result of this type of logic.
Sorry for this, LovePets, but it was something I felt needed defending.


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## MaartenSFS

H. laoticus said:


> So you're telling me that based on the little percentage of people you've met you're going to say that the other 2 billion are just the same in thought processes?  I didn't say it was racist or stereotypical, I am staying it is unwise at best to generalize to over 2 billion people.  How is the percentage high enough to generalize to 2 billion?  What is the percentage of people you've met compared to the total population in Asia?  To automatically assume that it's a "fact" is absurd.
> Do you realize that your sample of people is extremely low?  You're also limited to location.
> Your experiences have led your opinions to be clearly biased.
> 
> So from what I can see, you're basically saying that it is cultural for most Asians to 1) have no respect for nature and 2) have no respect for each other.  It's cultural for them to disrespect one another?  To destroy nature?
> Additionally, the agendas of the big markets does not equal that of the people.
> And yes, I've been to Asia.  In order to use the word most, you have to know at least 2 billion people and that is something you can't do.  You'd have to do a heck of a lot more testing to come close to that.
> 
> Let me put it this way:  Let's say I go to a college and from my experiences, I see that most of the people *I've* met are drunks and party people.  However, the percentage of people *I've actually met* is only 1% of the school's population.  It would be foolish for me to then say that since I've met the 1% and they seem to be drunks and party people, then it's safe to say that 51% of them are like that too--when I haven't even met close to half the number of people attending the college!  There are so many variables that I am limited to.
> 
> What you're doing is committing the Hasty Generalization fallacy.
> A lot of the senseless crap that happens in the world is a result of this type of logic.
> Sorry for this, LovePets, but it was something I felt needed defending.


I suppose you are entitled to your opinion, as am I. When I say that they have no respect for nature I mean that everything ends up on the menu, the forests are cleared/mountains mined with blind regard for the environment and the future of the local inhabitants (who, though foolish, are uneducated and taken advantage of).

When I make a generalisation like this I needn't meet every single individual but look at the bigger picture. The rate of extinctions, the amount of virgin forest remaining and the rate at which it is being cleared, the animals being offered in filled restaurants, etc. Asia is FAMOUS for wildlife consumption. I have seen a cat being roasted alive by a man in a market with a BLOWTORCH as it howled due to its flesh being smouldered off. When I queried another local she matter-of-factly told me that the more the animal suffers before it dies the better it will taste (because it released endorphines).

Do you really think that this would happen in a public place in most other areas of the world?? I think not. That being said, I love Asia (for other reasons) and plan to return ASAP and probably live there for the rest of my life. To end on a positive note, things have changed for the better in very recent years and "most" may soon decrease to "many" and then hopefully to some.

But whales and elephants are still being slaughtered by very rich, educated Japanese, Taiwanese, Koreans, and now Chinese. Why? It's part of their culture (And one of them is responsible for the Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombs it has been recently discovered). The next time you try to force your sociology lessons on someone please do your homework and actually go to the place you are preaching about. If you still feel the need to argue with me about a fact then please PM me and stop hijacking the thread.

O, and where are those photos? The autumn is fast approaching and the herps will retire for the winter.. 

Edit: O, and the thing about not respecting other people is probably somewhat of an overstatement but, re-phrasing my statement, the value of life in these overpopulated and "traditional" places in the world is very low indeed. I could tell you about some of the shocking things (even for me and I have seen people being killed with swords) I have seen around Asia, but perhaps it's better for you to go see yourself. But, I went native there and I'm used to it already.. it has become home. I still don't associate with people that torch cats and fillet humans, though. >=D

O, and people that let "big markets" run rampant and still buy their products and keep them in existance are just as guilty as the markets themselves. That's why I never buy from companies like Wal-Mart.


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## ZergFront

LovePets said:


> I don't know about Northern Europe,but in Romania many people kill the herps from pleasure,or,if they see a snake they see "satan",and must kill it. :wall:
> Sadly,this is the world we live in.:barf:


 It is very sad how poorly educated people still are. 

 Those are some gorgeous animals to the OP. :clap:


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## H. laoticus

Wow, never thought it'd be brought back up or I'd have to answer, but here I am. 

Maarten:

I don't agree with your generalizations because what large entities are able to accomplish and what they believe in does not equal the values of the majority of the continent's population.  Hitler does not represent Germany, does he?  The actions of the large corps get attention and unfortunately those who do try to fight back are overpowered and forgotten.  The success of these companies does not mean that most of the people agree with them.  They do not represent Asia.  Those who don't believe what they do are simply overshadowed because large, powerful entities get the spotlight and are able to make dramatic changes--in this case, environmental damage.  
Your cat story is weightless--I can talk about countless stories of inhumanity sprouting from pretty much every country.  

Now that you put your focus up front, I can agree that the things you mentioned about whales, elephants and especially dolphins is one part of their culture.  It's a shame that it's not sustainable living.  However, when you take in the population, the political system, and all of that mess, it gets mind boggling.  If you want the dolphin fisherman to stop, you have to provide him with another means of sustainable living or find some way to educate him to find another trade.  However, that's costly and it leads to one obstacle after another.  Who's going to do the job of helping him?  It's a tough life for many of them.  It's not as easy as pointing a finger and calling them bad people.  Maybe it's best to ask "why" they do the things they do.  

I am not trying to force any "sociology" lessons on you, merely letting you know that although there are detrimental cultural practices occurring, they reflect those practicing the culture or running the factories, not those caught in the same net because they're on the same continent.  
But either way, let's have some empathy:  if you had to work to provide for your family and to survive, what would you do if you were only provided and only knew of those things?  It's great that you yourself have been educated, but what about those who aren't, who have not been and probably will never be given that opportunity?  

I'm also not going to go so far as to judge a whole continent's "value of life," despite the horrid acts that may occur there.  That just opens ugly doorways to measuring the values of one culture over another.  Oh, and just to let you know, I was born in Asia.  My entire family is from there and grew up there.  That's my homeland and it is for the many Asian friends and relatives I have. 

And no, I'm not going to make everyone guilty for the inhumanity committed by large corporations.  When a family is dirt poor and can only afford to shop at Walmart, I'm not going to put them in the same boat as Walmart's corporate leaders.  Not to mention when you're dirt poor, you're more often than not, uneducated.  Uneducated = little or no knowledge on Walmart.  Little or no knowledge on Walmart = who cares where I shop, I'm going to shop where I can get the best value for my buck.  And oh, try guessing what Walmart's population is composed of, it's not very hard.  When you're trying to survive, right and wrong come after a full belly.


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## LovePets

First herps of the year
Habitat(13.03.2011)





_Pelophylax ridibundus_















??_Rana temporaria_??










Not a herp but I was very pleased to find it
_Pipistrellus pipistrellus_


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## GailC

Beautiful pictures, I love the toads most of all. I'd love to see more of the Romanian country side, it looks lovely.


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## Jayvis

MaartenSFS:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rfgroup/4008496348/ 
how about this ? what do you think ? its one of the example showing people from western damage the nature " no offence here". This entire world, some of the people do treat the nature badly, agree that some of asian did, but not only asian. im asian too, i love nature.


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## zonbonzovi

Well played, sir.  Your photos?


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## Rue

Wow!  Excellent photos!  More diversity than I would have guess too! Good!


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## LovePets

*24.03.2011*
*Habitat*





_Pelophylax ridibundus_










_Pelophylax kl. esculentus_





_Bufo bufo_





_Fringilla coelebs_












*25.03.2011*
*Habitat*










_Rana temporaria_

























*Eggs*




















_Lacerta agilis_




















_Bufo bufo_










_Ichtyosaura alpestris_


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## Rue

More excellent photos!  Thanks!


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## yakman

Looks like that pond is just about full to bursting with frogspawn.

Have any of your white storks turned up yet this spring?


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## mercury904

very nice!!


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## LovePets

Thank you!
@*yakman*
I don't know,I live at high altitude and here the storks never come.


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## LovePets

*30.03.2011*
*Habitat*





_Lacerta agilis_















_Bombina variegata_

























Spot the toad :razz:


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## zonbonzovi

The pupils on that Bombina variegata are unreal...haven't seen another toad with that feature before.


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## LovePets

Yes,I know,they are amazing!
*31.03.2011*
*Habitat*





_Bufo bufo_



































_Bufo bufo_ in amplexus with _pelophylax ridibundus_





_Pelophylax ridibundus _ and _pelophylax kl. esculentus_















_Rana temporaria_


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## Hudson Ensz

Beautiful pictures, the lacerta viridis reminds me a lot of the Ameiva ameiva that are everywhere here in brazil. I love the snakes.


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## LovePets

*03.04.2011*
_Rana temporaria_ eggs





_Lacerta agilis_










_Bufo bufo_





_Ichyosaura alpestris_










_Lissotriton vulgaris_




















_Lissotriton vulgaris_ and _ichyosaura alpestris_ adult females


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## LovePets

*17.04.2011*
*Habitat*





_Lacerta agilis_















_Inchtyosaura alpestris_










_Lissotriton vulgaris_





_Rana temporaria_ tadpoles





_Bufo bufo_










_Bombina variegata_ *+* _bufo viridis_





_Bombina variegata_




















_Bufo viridis_


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## fartkowski

Very cool shots


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## LovePets

Thank you!:worship:
*23.04.2011*-*01.05.2011* -*13.05.2011*
The *habitat* from 23 april





_Bombina variegata_















_Bombina variegata_ and _ichtyosaura alpestris_ saved from a manhole





_Ichtyosaura alpestris_ and _lissotriton vulgaris_ 





_Rana temporaria_










_Bufo bufo_










_Lacerta agilis_



































_Anguis fragilis_


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## LovePets

All pics except the last three are in situ shots.
*21.05.2011* (Brasov)-*22.05.2011* (Poiana Brasov)
*Habitat* from Poiana Brasov (the best reptile habitat from Brasov,I have found _anguis fragilis_,_zootoca vivipara_,_lacerta agilis_,_natrix natrix_ and I am sure there are adders-_vipera berus_- in that place).





_Inchtyosaura alpestris_ (in a 4 square metres pond were over 300 newts)





_Bombina variegata_





_Bufo bufo_





_Lacerta agilis_















_Zootoca vivipara_




















Unfortunately I couldn't photograph _natrix natrix_ and _anguis fragilis_.
I wish you all the best!


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## LovePets

*29.05.2011*
_Bombina variegata_





_Lacerta agilis_





_Natrix natrix_


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## LovePets

*05.06.2011*
*Habitat* 1





_Bombina variegata_





_Ichtyosaura alpestris_ 















_Bufo bufo_





*Habitat* 2





_Pelophylax kl. esculentus_





_Pelophylax ridibundus_





_Zootoca vivipara_





_Lacerta agilis_


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