# Feeder options. Red runners?



## Phases (Jun 28, 2017)

I had read that dubia roaches were super nutricious feeders, didn't stink climb fly or die easy,  so I grabbed a bag if 100 medium and started a colony which has grown and is doing great. But, as we know, it turns out they are a real pain to feed with regularly.

Ok so, what's next? I don't want to use crickets regularly. Red runners? Are these pretty similar in care and non-stink, etc, and colonizable? 

And, can you recommend a good place to buy?

Other feeder options, rate to feed etc, discussion would be appreciated  I was under impression one good size dubia was about 5 crickets worth, for example. Just going off what I have read people here feed. ("10 crickets or 2 roaches a week" for example.) I do realize it is different per size and specimen that you are feeding and feeding TO, of course..


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## Randomjoe (Jun 28, 2017)

I don't have red  runners (S. lateralis) but have been considering them for some time. From everything I've seen and read they can be very prolific and do have a smell, but its supposed to be much less than crickets. I've seen them kept similar to dubia but higher humidity for the Ooths can help. Also if not feed enough protein in their diet they may cannibalize. Size is similar to crickets so it sould be a 1 for 1 replacement. As for other choices are you just wanting non climbers or are climbing species ok 2?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Jones0911 (Jun 28, 2017)

Phases said:


> I had read that dubia roaches were super nutricious feeders, didn't stink climb fly or die easy,  so I grabbed a bag if 100 medium and started a colony which has grown and is doing great. But, as we know, it turns out they are a real pain to feed with regularly.
> 
> Ok so, what's next? I don't want to use crickets regularly. Red runners? Are these pretty similar in care and non-stink, etc, and colonizable?
> 
> ...


This guy has great red runners, I've brought a thousand  and they're doing fine.


https://www.aaronpauling.com/collections/non-climbing-roaches/products/1000-large-rusty-reds


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## Phases (Jun 28, 2017)

Climbing is good, fine with me. Just looking for options that are less of a pita to feed, and would prefer something that doesn't stink too bad. I've got a couple arboreals so I pity the fool that heads upward..


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## ErinM31 (Jun 28, 2017)

Red runners are great! Mine went through a period of dormancy over the winter, but outside of that they eat, grow and breed with gusto! I started my colony with a group I purchased from BugsInCyberspace last October. I do not think the roaches have an odor. Their enclosure has a bit of one just from the substrate being a bit damp and I put some greens in there -- nothing bad and I have springtails with them to keep any mold in check. They are easy to care for and propagate and all my T's love them!


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## Phases (Jun 28, 2017)

1000, wow! Do u keep them similiar to dubias?


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## Phases (Jun 28, 2017)

substrate huh? hmm. Can you post a picture or two of your setup to house them, @ErinM31  ?


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## Phases (Jun 28, 2017)

aaronpauling is out, and bugsincyberspace - are they called 'red runners' on there?


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## Jones0911 (Jun 28, 2017)

Phases said:


> 1000, wow! Do u keep them similiar to dubias?



I just feed em(cricket quencher and high calcium cricket diet food), a few places to hide and they do just fine....no real difference from dubias just a different Roach breed.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Randomjoe (Jun 28, 2017)

Should be listed under 1 of these names
Red Runner
Turkestan
Rusty Red
Shelfordella lateralis ( Blatta lateralis)
lats
they go by all these names and probly a few more lol


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## Phases (Jun 28, 2017)

wow lol ok, will check. Thanks!


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## Phases (Jun 28, 2017)

Found:

http://shop.bugsincyberspace.com/Turkistan-Roaches-25-count-bic257.htm

Three problems - 1. Wow those are pricey!! 2. Out of stock, and 3. I'm in Tennessee 

I will dig around the internets to see what I can find.


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## Randomjoe (Jun 28, 2017)

could hit up roachforum.com and put a looking for add up in classifieds or on here. could also try capecodroaches.com or roachcrossing.com. I think roachcrossing.com is clossed till july 10th thogh


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## Randomjoe (Jun 28, 2017)

MWAInverts used to sell them here and has a facebook page but not sure if he still does, but he used to have pretty good prices if he's still doing it


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## jaycied (Jun 28, 2017)

Jamie's Ts sells red runners in small quantities, not quite enough to start a colony. As far as feeders red runners are my favorites, as dubia tend to play dead. However, I think I'll stick with breeding dubia as they are more nutritious at least for my reptiles I feed them to, and they get larger.


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## Phases (Jun 28, 2017)

I have sent a message to http://capecodroaches.com/ - will let you know how it goes!


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## Trenor (Jun 28, 2017)

What feeding problems are you having with the dubias? 

I use the crumble laying mash as a base. Add in 1 gallon of the cheapest protein powder I can find on amazon and a bag of the cheap no name brand frosted flakes blinded down to powder. Makes a little over 25-27 lbs of food I store up in 5 gallon buckets to use as I need. It lasts a pretty long time even with my big colony.

From there I just have plastic food bowel (I scuff them up inside and out with rough sandpaper so they can climb it easily) and I fill it up and they eat. Once a week I put in a orange cut into 4ths and let them eat that down. They breed like crazy and eat great.


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## Phases (Jun 28, 2017)

Well, it's feeding them to the Ts I find a PITA


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## Trenor (Jun 28, 2017)

Phases said:


> Well, it's feeding them to the Ts I find a PITA


Ahhh, I thought you meant feeding them. 

I haven't had trouble on that front either. Crush the heads and throw them in somewhere. All my Ts get them and eat great.

Good luck with the runners. At their adult size they could climb out the air holes on several of my big T enclosures not to mention the potential they have for escape from the breeding box. I personally wouldn't keep them as I like my home pest free and they can breed without help in our temp zone pretty easily.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Phases (Jun 28, 2017)

Every time I've tried the crush head technique they seem to keel over in five!

Reactions: Like 1


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## Moonohol (Jun 28, 2017)

Phases said:


> Well, it's feeding them to the Ts I find a PITA


Are you crushing their heads before you give them to your Ts?


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## Trenor (Jun 28, 2017)

Stop using a hammer to crush the heads. 

I'll often still have them wiggling about on the evening of the next day if they are not eaten. I use my tongs to just crush the head and not pull it off. If you don't fully crush the head they will sometimes still do their hide by not moving normal behavior. If you press until you feel their noodle pop then your usually good.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ThisMeansWAR (Jun 28, 2017)

Trenor said:


> If you press until you feel their noodle pop then your usually good.


Haha, you sound like a serial killer

Reactions: Funny 3


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## The Grym Reaper (Jun 28, 2017)

Phases said:


> Can you post a picture or two of your setup to house them


No need for substrate, just give them:

- Cardboard/egg cartons to hide in
- Food (I use ground up dog biscuits mixed with goldfish flakes, should cost you less than $5 to make up over a kilo)
- Bug gel

You don't need several hundred to start a colony, I got roughly 150, separated the adults into one bin (breeding stock, you want roughly 1 male to every 5 females) and put the rest in another (feeders), when I clean out the breeder bin I put any oothecae into another container, I have 24 Tarantulas to feed and I still had plenty left in the feeder bin when the nymphs started hatching (I breed mealworms as well and buy superworms for my biggest Tarantulas though).

This is my bin for breeding stock




General population/feeders




Oothecae tub (I got lazy and couldn't be bothered to pick them out individually, there's a few nymphs running around in there but I don't think you can see them) 




They do smell but not as bad as crickets do and, to be honest, crickets don't smell that bad unless you don't clean their enclosure/remove any dead regularly, my only problems with crickets are that they outgrow my slings and the MMs ****ing chirp constantly (even the so-called "silent crickets" do this). 
You'll stop noticing the smell after a while anyway, I can only smell their food now and that's just because dog food stinks lol.

Takes a couple of months before you end up with any nymphs though so be patient if you try breeding them.

Climbing is not a problem, these can not climb smooth surfaces (I initially thought they could which put me off breeding them for ages), just make sure you store your bins somewhere they can't be knocked over and be careful not to lose any when cleaning them out (males are more likely to escape as they have wings, they can't fly but they are able to glide short distances).

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 3


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## Phases (Jun 28, 2017)

Ugh after several back and forths with capecoderoaches it turns out they are out of stock with red runners. But after explaining my needs and wants/dislikes, they recommended, in this particular order:

Red Goblin
Pallid
Lobster 
Red Runner

So I ordered 50 of the top three. I was really wanting to try red runners but, I'm sure I can make do. If not, I am willing to bet I'll need more one day anyway. 

@The Grym Reaper I am storing my dubias much like that, but I don't separate. I don't think I feed enough to matter. They seem to be growing. They're certainly doing fine. It's been a few weeks and none have died and they are all bigger so, I assume they'll mate too. If not, I'll work on it. So, I will do these all similar and see how it goes!

Thanks everyone for your help.

Reactions: Like 1


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## The Grym Reaper (Jun 28, 2017)

Phases said:


> Red Goblin
> Pallid
> Lobster
> Red Runner
> ...


I don't know about the top 2 but lobster roaches can climb smooth surfaces so smear a thick unbroken line of vaseline around near the top of the container to stop them from getting out and reapply as needed.

**Edit**
After a quick search on the other 2, red goblins can supposedly jump/climb and pallids can supposedly fly.


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## Phases (Jun 28, 2017)

Yah all three climb or fly.. or adult males do. I figure I'll try em as I have a couple Ts up high.


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## Randomjoe (Jun 28, 2017)

Adult and nymph lobster roaches can climb and out of the 3 I'd bet will  breed the fastest. Only adult goblin and pallid can climb smooth surfaces and pallid may be able to fly.


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