# How Much Are Panther Chameleons(Ambanja) in US?



## sweetmisery (Nov 19, 2007)

Just wondering, and what can you say about them?


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## REAL (Nov 19, 2007)

I can get some CB (captive bred) ones for like $100-140?

I've seen a few ppl try to sell it for twice as much so I'm not sure.

I always wanted a Jackson. Thats my favorite one. But I've never kept one before so someone please help out with the rest.


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## ZooRex (Nov 19, 2007)

Females are cheaper, males usually go around $300. They really are a nice species and although I've yet to keep them, I think I'd recomend them over a veiled. If you have the extra cash I think they'd make a better addition. FLchams is a really good place to start when thinking about getting a panther. ~ Rex


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## REAL (Nov 19, 2007)

KingRex said:


> Females are cheaper, males usually go around $300. They really are a nice species and although I've yet to keep them, I think I'd recomend them over a veiled. If you have the extra cash I think they'd make a better addition. FLchams is a really good place to start when thinking about getting a panther. ~ Rex


I see some here for good price

CLICK


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## ZooRex (Nov 19, 2007)

Yes those are some nice prices. Yet notice how they are hatchlings and not sexed individuals. Most if not all breeders wait untill their stock is older so they are sexed and healthy when sold. LLLReptile isn't a breeder, they buy whole sale animals from breeders and then sell them. In my opinon its better to just buy animals directly form the breeder, your overall expiriance will be much better. ~ Rex


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## REAL (Nov 20, 2007)

KingRex said:


> Yes those are some nice prices. Yet notice how they are hatchlings and not sexed individuals. Most if not all breeders wait untill their stock is older so they are sexed and healthy when sold. LLLReptile isn't a breeder, they buy whole sale animals from breeders and then sell them. In my opinon its better to just buy animals directly form the breeder, your overall expiriance will be much better. ~ Rex



Yeah, but hey....I would rather buy 2 for $260/ 3 for $370 than buy 1 male for $300...especially if the person doesn't care what the sex of the animal is (just saying, not referring to the poster). 

Buying from breeders is great and all but doesn't exactly means it'll be better and sometimes our wallet won't permit. My friend recently bought a show rabbit from a breeder from a rabbit show. Died 3 days later....

I bought a rabbit from a petstore nearby and it stayed alive and healthy for 3 years. Whatever your wallet allows I guess. If you got a fat wallet you have more options.


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## Nich (Nov 20, 2007)

For an Ambanja like you see in advertisements youll dish around 2-300+. The ones for 150-200 are of either poor color or not pure ambanja (a locality). Check out faunaclassifieds.com, and kingsnake.com, be carefull on both to assure that those selling are established breeders. Check out screameleons.com for true ambanja. The prices are high as the stock is reputable, but if you hunt around you can get a nice ambanja baby for around 180, no pint in getting a female unless you want to breed.


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## Nich (Nov 20, 2007)

REAL said:


> Yeah, but hey....I would rather buy 2 for $260/ 3 for $370 than buy 1 male for $300...


 Females are brown....


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## REAL (Nov 20, 2007)

I guess you do have a point about the coloring and stuff....but than again it doesn't neccessarily mean buying from a breeder will always be better than buying from one that isn't. 

Plus, its not like a win win situation. Just means you have to fork over more money for the extra special service, thats like a given in real life. If you want a used car just for commute it probably wont cost as much of course than a car that you would probably want to use to show off to your friends. However it is, you'll pay for it out of your pocket. 

When shopping for a water monitor, I got one at this reptile petstore for $100 and it had really nice coloring. My friend bought his online from a breeder whom specially listed theirs as ones that had the best color (from Sumatran). Mines and his looked exactly alike, even after 2 years. Only difference was that he got his for $250~.

Eh I'm going to go play some games now. See ya later and THANKSGIVING EVERYONE!


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## Nich (Nov 20, 2007)

I would side with the cheaper ones in most other lizards, I agree. Ambanjas have some crazy color variations and most are cb, and screened for color. WC adults are set in price by color as well,  I would cruiz faunaclassifieds for some nice chams at great prices.


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## Brad Ramsey (Nov 20, 2007)

Personally, I would never buy a chameleon from anyone other than a reputable breeder.
I have not yet encountered the pet store or reptile specialty store that cares for these animals properly.
I know of a couple of people who had good luck with chams from LLL....but I know many more who were very disapointed.
I think the cost is generally relative to the product. 
An unhealthy animal is not a deal at any price.

-Brad


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## ZooRex (Nov 20, 2007)

> Personally, I would never buy a chameleon from anyone other than a reputable breeder.
> I have not yet encountered the pet store or reptile specialty store that cares for these animals properly.
> I know of a couple of people who had good luck with chams from LLL....but I know many more who were very disapointed.
> I think the cost is generally relative to the product.
> ...


Agreed, I my self had a bad expiriance with LLL involving a leopard gecko, and have since given them any buisness.



> I guess you do have a point about the coloring and stuff....but than again it doesn't neccessarily mean buying from a breeder will always be better than buying from one that isn't.


Female panthers are smaller and show hardly any color at all. Males are what everybody wants, notice how they're priced more at LLL. You don't have to buy direct from a breeder, but don't you think its better? You gain so much more from them. If you want an example, atend your next reptile show, you'll know what I mean.



> I would side with the cheaper ones in most other lizards


Well I guess its all a matter of opinon. I feel that spending the exra cash can only help you and asure your happiness in the future. I'm not saying that a petstore animal can't become a worthwhile addition, its just that the odds are against you. Most petstore animals are wild caught, stressed out, underweght...and you know nothing about there past care, genetics or health. Also many animals bred by a breeder are cheaper than store bought ones. There are a few expetions, chams are are one of them. The reasons for an increase in price for some sp. are 
1. you know the animal is CB  
2. you know the animals past history in all forms
3. you know or get a good idea of the animals sex
4. you know the animals been cared for correctly
5.the animal has striking colors that are appealing
6.there is a high demand for the sp
~ Rex


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## UrbanJungles (Nov 20, 2007)

Animals from this bloodline will run between 200-350 depending on the age and coloration of the animals.  I got my boy from a friend who's associated with The Chameleon Co in Fl.  Jim is a good guy and is very knowledgeable.


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## Nich (Nov 20, 2007)

KingRex said:


> Well I guess its all a matter of opinon.


   I was giving an example for other herps, ones with less variation within the sp. Monitors for example, there are several variations of timor, but the pale to the variations in color and pattern of Furcifer Pardalis. 
  Urbanjungles is on point, The chameleon co. in FL is great. Beware, first you want a panther, then you want a pair, then your buying an incubator rack.....lol.


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## REAL (Nov 20, 2007)

You all have a point about breeders over petstore/nonbreeders. If you really care about colors and specific details than checking out a dealer would probably be a better choice.

However, lets say I walked in a petstore and saw a X chameleon for $50 and it had really nice colors and looked pretty healthy and then I went to a dealer whom had some X chameleons as well and they were pretty much the same quality from what I saw in the petstore (eyes point of view of course) but costed $150-$200....I'm sorry but I'm going to get the one at the petstore lol. 

You say they might be healthier coming from a breeder etc etc. Well, if you don't give either of them water for a week, both are going to die. If the X chameleon I bought in the petstore wasn't as healthy, but I brought it home and raised it well and its health improved, it would be better than if someone bought one from a breeder thats in fantastic health but raised/cared for it horribly. In the end, it'll mostly depend on the person thats keeping the animal.

Hope you guys see my point. I'm sure I wouldn't be saying this so much if I was a millionaire and money wasn't an issue, its just something that nags at you when you shop lol. Again, my point is, breeders are great but it doesn't mean breeder>nonbreeder = a definate fact and is ALWAYS a better thing.


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## ZooRex (Nov 21, 2007)

> However, lets say I walked in a petstore and saw a X chameleon for $50 and it had really nice colors and looked pretty healthy and then I went to a dealer whom had some X chameleons as well and they were pretty much the same quality from what I saw in the petstore (eyes point of view of course) but costed $150-$200....I'm sorry but I'm going to get the one at the petstore lol.


I'm sure we've all had pet shop moments when we see an amazing animal that we have to have. It might not be the best thing to do, but we've all made impuse buys. Chameleons are different. If you ever see a "really nice cham, thats looks healthy and the same quality as if it was CB by a breeder, for a decet price, buy it and tell me how it goes. I'd be very interested, and you'd be very lucky if it all works out.



> You say they might be healthier coming from a breeder etc etc. Well, if you don't give either of them water for a week, both are going to die.


You'd also be surpriesed at how strong wild caught chams are in terms of survival. Here's my personal expirience:
I was the main reptile guru at the LPC, last febuary my boss a made a huge reptile order. In it were two male (Ambilobe) panthers. Well it looked like someone had just hand picked them from Madagascar, thrown them in a cardboard box, and shipped them to Wisconsin. Because of this I wasn't surprised to find that one had died on the way, and the surviver didn't look good. As head herp man it was my job to get him better. I did all with in my power to upgrade his environment, diet and over all life, (I'll go into details later if you want me to) stoped to check on him when it wasn't my shift and left specific instructions for all other employees to follow when I wasn't around. He showed some improvement, he loved eating anoles, but was never that healthy. For months he was like this; eating to stay active, but never gaining weight, sort of half living I guess. I knew he would need vetrinary care (calcium and vitiman injections ect) and when I finally talked my boss into letting me take him home, he died. So don't be so sure that you can cure your petshop cham if need be by yourself.



> If the X chameleon I bought in the petstore wasn't as healthy, but I brought it home and raised it well and its health improved, it would be better than if someone bought one from a breeder thats in fantastic health but raised/cared for it horribly. In the end, it'll mostly depend on the person thats keeping the animal


Why would you ever by an animal that wasn't healthy? Especially a chameleon!? They are extreamly frail creatures in captivity. Why startout in a hole? You might be getting a deal on the lizard, but you'd pay the difference in vet bills, along with the stressful expirience of rehabillitating your pet. Why not just spend more money to get an animal you know is healthy, that you won't have to worry about, and can enjoy from day one? ~ Rex


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## REAL (Nov 21, 2007)

Well...I said if it wasn't AS healthy....didn't say it was severe.

Of course I wouldn't attempt to buy a half dead chameleon and try to bring it back to life....I'm not a rich person nor Jesus.

I'm saying it was slightly underfed or slightly dehydrated. Nothing serious.

Okay I'm going to attempt a weird example.....ahem...

Lets say two guys bought two of the same games. Guy A bought his used and it had some minor scratches but plays perfectly still. Guy B bought his brand new, paid twice as much, no scratches whatsoever and is flawless. However, Guy A keeps his disc extremely well and the quality of the discs never goes down. Guy B, however, treats his discs badly and they end up getting scratched up, maybe to the point where its unplayable. 

I think its important to start off with something in good shape but if you don't keep it well its going to be as if you started off with something bad. A slightly unhealthy animal can become healthy if cared for correctly thereafter, where else a healthy animal can become unhealthy if u keep it bad. So you're like "oh yay I got an animal through a breeder!"

Thats the first step, the hardest comes after. Its not the beginning that counts, its the end result. 



> If you ever see a "really nice cham, thats looks healthy and the same quality as if it was CB by a breeder, for a decet price, buy it and tell me how it goes. I'd be very interested, and you'd be very lucky if it all works out.


I'm broke as heck after Christmas shopping ( $600 down) so its going to be quite some time until I can test that out on a chameleon but I've done it with many other animals like turtles, mammals, birds....

I was in the flee market many years ago when I was a lil kid and this Chinese couple were selling some baby turtles, which are illegal but heck if I knew. It was out in direct sun and in a 0.5 gallon creature keeper container with no water. (Don't worry they got shut down) Anyway, I bought it for $5 and I had it in my fish tank for 3-4 years and died when I was away on a trip for a month and my dad took bad care of it. I can tell you, they were kept in an even worse environment than it was illegal to, but in the end he was okay. I found them in regular petstores for like $40! Just because its not from a breeder doesn't mean its not going to survive or that it'll live a shorter less happy life is what I'm saying.

But you said chameleons are different, I guess I'm mainly saying it for my experiences with OTHER animals. I also didn't get a jackson before because I heard how frail they are.


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## Nich (Nov 21, 2007)

KingRex said:


> I'm sure we've all had pet shop moments when we see an amazing animal that we have to have. It might not be the best thing to do, but we've all made impuse buys. Chameleons are different. If you ever see a "really nice cham, thats looks healthy and the same quality as if it was CB by a breeder, for a decet price, buy it and tell me how it goes. I'd be very interested, and you'd be very lucky if it all works out.
> 
> 
> You'd also be surpriesed at how strong wild caught chams are in terms of survival. Here's my personal expirience:
> ...


Try parazap....  Treat all WC chams with it regaurdless of the source. Hydration and parazap, along with an initial force feeding of baby food (not tracheal, just by mouth) go a VERy long way.


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## ZooRex (Nov 21, 2007)

> I'm not a rich person nor Jesus.


Well thats good to know, guess theres never gonna be a church for the congrication of "REAL"...to bad.



> But you said chameleons are different, I guess I'm mainly saying it for my experiences with OTHER animals.


Yes I was talking about chams, I've worked at a pet store and I'm not saying that they're terrible places to buy pets. I'm saying it can be risky when it comes to chams, and when theres a better alternative (regardless of cost) to me it seams like a no-brainer. 

As far as the whole "worse off better kept vs. healthy bad care" idea goes; yeah its true and a fine example for most animals, but I don't think it pertains much with chams. The whole thing can hardly be debated (something I don't or ever wanted to do) for it depends on way to many factors and in most cases is self explanetory. ~ Rex



> Try parazap.... Treat all WC chams with it regaurdless of the source. Hydration and parazap, along with an initial force feeding of baby food (not tracheal, just by mouth) go a VERy long way


Good to know, thanks...any idea were I can get any? ~ Rex


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## sweetmisery (Nov 22, 2007)

THANKS GUYS! Appreciate it all. Sorry wasnt online for a few days now. 

Anyway how long(of a herp owner) before you guys started with chameleons?


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## ZooRex (Nov 22, 2007)

I started with a cb male turquoise veiled chameleon last year, so I guess it was about six years after I started with exotics. There are a number of good sites on the web that will help you get started such as Chameleon News. Yet here is some info that I've learned my self:
Chameleons aren't like most other herps, they can have health problems very fast if something is wrong in their environment. 

Never underestimate how much water chams need (even for veileds which are supposedly a "desert" sp) you should mist at least twice a day, as well as one heavy shower a week.  

Supplementation is very important, I suggest using Mineral which has worked great for me, yet you must be careful not to over supplement

Be very careful with dish feeding, a chams tounge can shorten permently if it isn't exersied.

Being diurnal, they apsolutly need UVB lighting

Feed as varied a diet as you can manage, chams get bored with the same food quite easily.

If you notice anything off with your cham, you will probably need to see a reptile vet, or at very least to extensive research to find the problem, and cure it.
Hope this helps ~ Rex


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## REAL (Nov 22, 2007)

KingRex said:


> I started with a cb male turquoise veiled chameleon last year, so I guess it was about six years after I started with exotics. There are a number of good sites on the web that will help you get started such as Chameleon News. Yet here is some info that I've learned my self:
> Chameleons aren't like most other herps, they can have health problems very fast if something is wrong in their environment.
> 
> Never underestimate how much water chams need (even for veileds which are supposedly a "desert" sp) you should mist at least twice a day, as well as one heavy shower a week.
> ...


Another reason why I'm not getting chameleons yet.

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Irresponsible Side: GET THEM NOW, REGRET LATER ;P 
Responsible Side: Nahhh....


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## ZooRex (Nov 22, 2007)

I forgot to add that if you follow the guidelines, and are responsible, a chameleon will be an amazing an rewarding pet for years to come. Good Luck! ~ rex


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## Jmugleston (Nov 24, 2007)

*My 2 cents.*

I have an adult Sambava that was purchased from LLL reptile. She's doing great and actually has nice color for a girl. I chose to purchase my male from a private breeder so that I had a better chance of getting the colors I wanted. It is not guaranteed to be as colorful as the dad, but chances are better than one picked at random from various sambavas offered by wholesalers. Depends on what you want. If you want a good pet, LLL is a good choice. I picked up my male from Kammerflage creations and I paid a bit extra for the bloodlines. If you may want to breed them in the future, look to the breeders, pay a bit more, and increase our chances of getting the colors you want based off the Sires. The variation within localities can be somewhat surprising, so if you want a good chance of a blue cham, get a male from a reputable breeder.
I'm done with my rant.


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## ZooRex (Nov 24, 2007)

Glad to see that some people have had success with LLL. In my expirience its better to just steer clear of buisnesses like them. ~ Rex


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## Nich (Nov 26, 2007)

Kingrex, 
http://www.reptileauctions.com/Prot...ites-PARAZAP,itemname,80538,id,auctiondetails

          Does wonders for the majoruty of all WC herps. Most vet offices use variations of this brand.


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## Jmugleston (Nov 26, 2007)

sweetmisery said:


> THANKS GUYS! Appreciate it all. Sorry wasnt online for a few days now.
> 
> Anyway how long(of a herp owner) before you guys started with chameleons?


I've been keeping reptiles for over 16 years now. I haven't kept chams until recently mainly because I was focused on other projects.


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## Ryan123 (Jun 19, 2009)

Hi i bought a breeding pair the other day for $415. they are morphed meaning they have LOTS of color. they are so vibrant and beautiful. so far i have seen every color on them. mostly the male tho.blue, red, orange, purple, green, yellow, pink, etc....  they are ready to have their first clutch of eggs and they sould be ready for me to sell within the next eight months if you or anybody is interested.


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