# My Boa constrictor is regurgitating.



## Kaimetsu (Jun 28, 2010)

I've got some pictures of the regurgitations i'll post them later when i get a chance.  At first i wasnt sure if it was regurgitation or feces but i've realized the feces is a chalky white substance so now i'm sure it's heavily digested regurgitation.  I'm worried that it may be regurgitation syndrome, something i only just became aware of.

http://www.boa-constrictors.com/com/Faq/faq.htm#regurgitation

I've been feeding my baby boa every seven days, based on this website i think i should double that time period.  Hes regurgitated at least three meals so far out of the eight i've given him since i got him, around three days after eating each time.  It wasnt the last 3 it's more like every other meal.

As for temperature i think i've done a good job of maintaining the high '80s on one end, low '80s on the other with a hotspot under his lamp thats in the low '90s, with the temp dropping to the '70s at night.  That said theres bound to be alot of fluctuations, it's been very hot lately but i do my best to keep the temps in the right ballpark.  I know husbandry issues are the usual causes of health problems, my guess is i've just been feeding him too often.


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## Kaimetsu (Jun 28, 2010)

Here are the pictures just in case they can provide some insight into what the problem is.  I only feed frozen/thawed to my snake.

These are pictures of the regurgitation from about three weeks ago, this one came out about two and a half days after feeding.  I had handled him several hours before the regurgitation because everything i had read said that handling 48 hours after feeding was ok, that might have been what caused the problem.













a week later i fed him again and he digested it without any problem.  Then a week after that(last monday) i fed him again and he regurgitated it three or four days later (either last thursday or last friday) as you can see this one has been digested quite a bit more.


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## pitbulllady (Jun 28, 2010)

Hmmm....the temps are right, and I actually feed my baby Boas TWICE a week.  What size food items are you feeding it?  Sometimes if the item is too large the snake will regurg, so going with the next smallest size of mouse might help.  Make sure that the mice you are feeding are fresh frozen and don't have freezer burn, since sometimes if food has been frozen for too long snakes will regurg it, too.  Do you handle the snake after it eats?  That usually is less of a problem for Boas than it is for Colubrids, but sometimes you do see one that will regurg if handled within a few days of eating.
Is the snake a captive-bred baby or an "farmed" import?  If it came from a pet shop, especially a chain pet store, it's just about 99% likely that it is an import from one of the large "snake farms" in Central America or Colombia, which means it probably has a heavy intestinal parasite load.  It would be a really good idea to have a vet do a fecal exam the next time the snake poops; even if the vet isn't a reptile vet, snakes get many of the same internal parasites, or at least similar ones, to those seen in dogs and cats, so a vet should be able to recognize things like round worms or Coccidia under a microscope.  You might actually want to LOWER the basking temp a bit, since I've noticed that this time of year all of my Boas are gravitating towards the cooler end, and it is possible that the little guy could be getting too hot.  If you try all of that, and the snake is still regurging, I'd really, really recommend having a vet run a fecal on it.

Snake feces, by the way, are NOT a "chalky white substance".  THOSE would be urates, which are concentrated uric acid.  In Boas, urates are often produced separate from bowel movements.  Boa feces look basically like small dog feces and are composed mostly of compacted, undigested hair from their prey.

But yes, just saw the photos-those are regurged mice.  The first two are still clearly recognizable as mice, while the others have at least been mostly digested and absorbed.  I'd give him at least three days after eating before handling, and try smaller items.  If that doesn't work, a trip to the vet is in order.

pitbulllady


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## Kaimetsu (Jun 28, 2010)

pitbulllady said:


> Hmmm....the temps are right, and I actually feed my baby Boas TWICE a week.  What size food items are you feeding it?  Sometimes if the item is too large the snake will regurg, so going with the next smallest size of mouse might help.  Make sure that the mice you are feeding are fresh frozen and don't have freezer burn, since sometimes if food has been frozen for too long snakes will regurg it, too.  Do you handle the snake after it eats?  That usually is less of a problem for Boas than it is for Colubrids, but sometimes you do see one that will regurg if handled within a few days of eating.
> Is the snake a captive-bred baby or an "farmed" import?  If it came from a pet shop, especially a chain pet store, it's just about 99% likely that it is an import from one of the large "snake farms" in Central America or Colombia, which means it probably has a heavy intestinal parasite load.  It would be a really good idea to have a vet do a fecal exam the next time the snake poops; even if the vet isn't a reptile vet, snakes get many of the same internal parasites, or at least similar ones, to those seen in dogs and cats, so a vet should be able to recognize things like round worms or Coccidia under a microscope.  You might actually want to LOWER the basking temp a bit, since I've noticed that this time of year all of my Boas are gravitating towards the cooler end, and it is possible that the little guy could be getting too hot.  If you try all of that, and the snake is still regurging, I'd really, really recommend having a vet run a fecal on it.
> 
> Snake feces, by the way, are NOT a "chalky white substance".  THOSE would be urates, which are concentrated uric acid.  In Boas, urates are often produced separate from bowel movements.  Boa feces look basically like small dog feces and are composed mostly of compacted, undigested hair from their prey.
> ...



I'm feeding him a size the petstore refers to as small mice, you can see the size of my snake in this thread.
http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=181280

Maybe i should try going down a size to fuzzy mice.  I fed my snake today and took some pictures i'll post them in a little while so you'll be able to tell if the mice i'm giving him are too big.

I did buy him from a local petstore, the owner told me he bought the snake from a local breeder although it's possible he wasnt telling the truth.

Also those pictures i posted are of the same two regurged mice from different angles, not four different regurged mice.

One of the times he regurged it was shortly after i handled him, two and a half days after he ate.  The last time he regurged though it was after three or four days and i didnt handle him in that time at all.

Thank you for the help.


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## Crysta (Jun 28, 2010)

Maybe he is regurging because he can't process the harder stuff to poop it out? (just a thought)


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## pitbulllady (Jun 28, 2010)

I remember the little snake now.  That's a really young baby, and I'd be feeding it "hopper" mice, possibly even fuzzies.  Try the smaller mice for awhile and see how they work, even if you have to feed him two at a time.  With really young Boas, you are more likely to see a regurg problem due to too-large prey.

pitbulllady


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## Kaimetsu (Jun 28, 2010)

pitbulllady said:


> I remember the little snake now.  That's a really young baby, and I'd be feeding it "hopper" mice, possibly even fuzzies.  Try the smaller mice for awhile and see how they work, even if you have to feed him two at a time.  With really young Boas, you are more likely to see a regurg problem due to too-large prey.
> 
> pitbulllady


OK I'll feed him either fuzzies or hoppers.  I took alot of pictures when i fed him today because i thought it was interesting so i guess i'll share them.

When i first got him i would dangle the food over him until he grabbed it, but i know there are several problems with this.  For one thing theres the possability of him tagging me instead of the mouse accidently.  Theres also the risk of him swallowing a piece of the substrate, although i always watch him eat carefully to make sure it doesnt happen.  The two solutions i always hear are either feed him in a separate container or use paper towel substrate, but i don't like the idea of moving him back to his tank while hes still in feeding mode, and i like the naturalistic look of loose substrate.

So my simple feeding method is to leave the mouse on a paper plate and let the snake follow the smell.  It was kind of fun watching him slowly approach the mouse as though he were stalking it.  It was something like twenty minutes from when he first started moving to when he finally started eating.

Also please let me know if you think this mouse is too big.


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## pitbulllady (Jun 28, 2010)

I do think that the mouse is a bit too large.  Most of the time, with my babies, if they had that large a bulge right after eating, that would not be the last I saw of that particular meal!  With the young ones, smaller and more-frequent meals work best, so instead of one weanling mouse per week, try two fuzzy or hopper mice about four-five days apart.  My little Hypo Harlequin female will be a year old this coming September, and she will still regurg if she eats too much at a time.  The other two youngsters I'm raising have just turned a year old, and they can handle much larger meals now without problems, but just a few months ago the Albino female would also regurg if her meal was too large.  Another thing I've found is that true Red-Tails, BCC's, can't handle as large a meal at a time as the Colombians can, at any age.

pitbulllady


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## Kaimetsu (Jun 29, 2010)

pitbulllady said:


> I do think that the mouse is a bit too large.  Most of the time, with my babies, if they had that large a bulge right after eating, that would not be the last I saw of that particular meal!  With the young ones, smaller and more-frequent meals work best, so instead of one weanling mouse per week, try two fuzzy or hopper mice about four-five days apart.  My little Hypo Harlequin female will be a year old this coming September, and she will still regurg if she eats too much at a time.  The other two youngsters I'm raising have just turned a year old, and they can handle much larger meals now without problems, but just a few months ago the Albino female would also regurg if her meal was too large.  Another thing I've found is that true Red-Tails, BCC's, can't handle as large a meal at a time as the Colombians can, at any age.
> 
> pitbulllady


Thanks for this information you've made me feel alot better about things, i will definitely start feeding fuzzies or hoppers.


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## Kaimetsu (Jul 9, 2010)

Gonna bring my thread back from the dead for a quick update.  The small mouse that my snake ate in the above pictures was regurgitated a few days later mostly digested.  Since then i've been feeding him only fuzzy mice and hes been fine so far, confirming the assessment that he was only regurgitating because the food was too large.  I just need to feed him more often now, hes out looking for food within three days of eating now, and i've been feeding him around every 4 days.  How often should i feed him the fuzzies and is it ok to give him two at a time?


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## pitbulllady (Jul 9, 2010)

Kaimetsu said:


> Gonna bring my thread back from the dead for a quick update.  The small mouse that my snake ate in the above pictures was regurgitated a few days later mostly digested.  Since then i've been feeding him only fuzzy mice and hes been fine so far, confirming the assessment that he was only regurgitating because the food was too large.  I just need to feed him more often now, hes out looking for food within three days of eating now, and i've been feeding him around every 4 days.  How often should i feed him the fuzzies and is it ok to give him two at a time?


I'd give him a fuzzy about every 5 days.  Start out with one at a time, and then if there is no problem, increase ONE of the feedings to two fuzzies, and only one the next, to avoid overfeeding.

pitbulllady


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## Kaimetsu (Jul 9, 2010)

pitbulllady said:


> I'd give him a fuzzy about every 5 days.  Start out with one at a time, and then if there is no problem, increase ONE of the feedings to two fuzzies, and only one the next, to avoid overfeeding.
> 
> pitbulllady


Thanks i'll stick with that schedule.  Do Boas have heat sensors?  I know vipers and pythons do and colubrids don't, I'm guessing Boas do since they are more closely related to pythons than they are to colubrids, but i could be wrong.  The reason i ask is that i usually put my mice under a heatlamp for a few minutes before giving it to my snake, and i want to know if i'm actually benefitting from the practice.  I didnt use a heat lamp today and my Boa wouldnt take the mouse, i had to dangle it in front of him for him to take it.  My guess is Boas need two separate indicators that something is food before they grab it, either smell and heat or smell and movement.


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## pitbulllady (Jul 10, 2010)

Kaimetsu said:


> Thanks i'll stick with that schedule.  Do Boas have heat sensors?  I know vipers and pythons do and colubrids don't, I'm guessing Boas do since they are more closely related to pythons than they are to colubrids, but i could be wrong.  The reason i ask is that i usually put my mice under a heatlamp for a few minutes before giving it to my snake, and i want to know if i'm actually benefitting from the practice.  I didnt use a heat lamp today and my Boa wouldnt take the mouse, i had to dangle it in front of him for him to take it.  My guess is Boas need two separate indicators that something is food before they grab it, either smell and heat or smell and movement.


Snakes in the _Boa constrictor sp._ group do NOT have heat sensors, actually.  However, they probably are able to better digest warm prey items, so it won't hurt to warm up the mice.

pitbulllady


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## Zman181 (Jul 10, 2010)

That's definitely a regurge...


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## Jaymz Bedell (Jul 10, 2010)

pitbulllady said:


> Snakes in the _Boa constrictor sp._ group do NOT have heat sensors, actually.  However, they probably are able to better digest warm prey items, so it won't hurt to warm up the mice.
> 
> pitbulllady


glad to hear the baby has been keeping down his mice! 

this discussion prompted me to do some research, as i recalled reading something about Boa constrictor and anacondas having thermoreceptors while lacking heat pits. i'll post a link at the end of this. in my research i found this statement, taken from the pdf i will link to...

  "Crotaline snakes such as the rattlesnake, cottonmouth, and copperheads possess two pits (facial pits) located on either side of the face placed between the eye and nostril. Boids, such as the python, possess as many as 13 pairs of labial pits located on their upper and lower jaws (Barrett et al., 1970; Newman and Hartline, 1982; Molenaar, 1992). Other Boids such as Boa constrictor and anaconda (Eunectes muniras) lack pit organs. However, they do possess IR-sensitive receptors in their labial scales (Barrett et al., 1970)."

copied and pasted from the article. 

i find this very interesting. in truth i am a python guy through and through so im glad reading this spurred me onto learn more about B. constrictors. im not placing much faith in that article, but if it holds true than warming your boas prey to a more natural rodent like body temperature might be worthwhile. in truth all of the boas i kept quite a few years ago took thawed pretty quickly once they learned it was food, regardless of how much i warmed it up once it was thawed. i hope your little one continues to improve.

and the link to the article (in pdf format):
http://web.neurobio.arizona.edu/gronenberg/nrsc581/thermo/biologicalinfraredsenses.pdf


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## venomous.com (Jul 10, 2010)

Rule of thumb when feeding any snake is for the prey item to be no thicker than the thickest part of the snake.

It's served me well for 20+ years.


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## Kaimetsu (Jul 10, 2010)

Jaymz Bedell said:


> glad to hear the baby has been keeping down his mice!
> 
> this discussion prompted me to do some research, as i recalled reading something about Boa constrictor and anacondas having thermoreceptors while lacking heat pits. i'll post a link at the end of this. in my research i found this statement, taken from the pdf i will link to...
> 
> ...


That article is fascinating. Incidently i live in hopewell too, on 376 between frankies and the railroad tracks.


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## Jaymz Bedell (Jul 10, 2010)

HA! thats really hillarious, im on Palen rd! so you're my neighbor, thats very cool. im glad you enjoyed the article, as i myself found it quite interesting. i haven't had my own boa of any sort in atleast a decade, tho i have bred them in the past. i switched over to carpet, scrub and blood pythons...with the occasional white lipped python. scrubs have completely captured my heart. if theres anything i can do to help feel free to ask away. is the little one still holding down its meals?


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## Kaimetsu (Jul 10, 2010)

Jaymz Bedell said:


> HA! thats really hillarious, im on Palen rd! so you're my neighbor, thats very cool. im glad you enjoyed the article, as i myself found it quite interesting. i haven't had my own boa of any sort in atleast a decade, tho i have bred them in the past. i switched over to carpet, scrub and blood pythons...with the occasional white lipped python. scrubs have completely captured my heart. if theres anything i can do to help feel free to ask away. is the little one still holding down its meals?


Cool my grandmother lives in that trailer park on palen road and i used to drive down it every day when i worked at IBM.  Hard to believe theres been such a diversity of snakes so close to where i live.  My little boas been doing fine so far with the fuzzy mice, no regurg's so far.


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## Jaymz Bedell (Jul 10, 2010)

great news...i know that park well! and at times i think i might have been the only person fueling the uncommon python trade in the area. there were a couple of times i cleaned the white plains show out of scrub pythons! glad the little one seems to be improving! keep in touch.


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