# Cyriopagopus sp. "blue" or "singapore"



## Fierce Deity (Jun 19, 2006)

I would like to add one of these gorgeous blue arboreals to my collection.  My question is, what is the difference between Cyriopagopus sp "blue" and Cyriopagopus sp "singapore"?  Or, are they exactly the same thing?  I have heard things like they are the same thing, they are color variants, or that they are different species, and since information on these is rare, I can't find much to go on.  Thanks.  
Pictures and care would be nice too.


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## Andyn6969 (Jun 19, 2006)

Yep same thing ,Cyriopagopus.sp blue or Cyriopagopus sp singapore blue! Singapore blue is used mostly as the common unscientific name , I bought 1 of these a couple of weeks ago as a juvi, Ill try and get some pics of it at the moment its made loads of burrowed tunnels at the bottom of the cork bark haha! ive heard when they get too bout 4" they become more arboreal and get more colour so cant wait!!     
                                             Andy!!!!!


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## MindUtopia (Jun 20, 2006)

My guess would be they are probably the same if the price is about the same.  Since obviously they are undescribed, in theory a dealer could probably call them Cyriopagopus sp. "whatever they feel like" and get away with it.  However, I'd confirm before you purchase that it is in fact what we would call a "Singapore Blue".  There has been talk of the two color variants - one from Singapore and the other from Malaysia - with one being more blue-ish and one being more purple-ish (I forget which is which), but from what I've been able to gather it's probably basically the same T.  These guys seem to have different colors throughout the molt cycle and depending on your lighting, so it's easy to see how people could suspect a color variant.  Also, personally, I think it's just an excuse to charge more (and so I've been told by several dealers) if you can say you have a unique variant of this species.


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## Pennywise (Jun 20, 2006)

I got a 1 1/4 inch S'ling last week. Hard to distinguish color at this point other than it's legs are dark and abdomen is a bit lighter. Mine eats like a pig and digs lots of tunnels. Mine was sold as Cyriopagopus sp. blue "Malaysia".


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## Bearo (Jun 21, 2006)

Hi..
Yes, they all are the same, Cyriopagopus sp. "blue"/"singapore"/"blue 2" and so on..
Its the same spider just with many localities, they have a big range.. Singapore, Malaysia, Indonisia = all the same.. some say that it's another species just because they have more reddish hairs or another hue.. but we will see later this year when Volker releases his papers 

Though, the one from Borneo looks alitle bit diffrent and has been seperated from the otherones for a looong time.. so thatone might be another species, but we'll se 

They get their adult colors in about 15cm legspan (6in)


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## ghost6303 (Jun 27, 2006)

*Cyriopagopus sp*

anyone have any care info/special instructions for these guys? was looking to get one but theres almost no info out there on them yet


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## scolex (Jun 13, 2007)

ghost6303 said:


> anyone have any care info/special instructions for these guys? was looking to get one but theres almost no info out there on them yet


I just picked one up my self. I have heard they like lower temps.


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## Michael Jacobi (Jun 13, 2007)

The name "Singapore" resulted mostly because the first collection team [Alvin & Co.] was from Singapore. The spider is found on mainland Malaysia and, until described as a species, should more properly be referred to as _Cyriopagopus_ sp. 'blue', without any geographic reference. Ignore all of the other trade names.

You will find that these spiders do better at somewhat cool temperatures and moderate to moderately high humidity (70-80% RH, 70-75F].
(In fact, many people keep all of their tarantulas too warm, overlooking the fact that whether living in burrows, rock scrapes, tree holes or palm fronds these spiders inhabit microclimates significantly cooler than the ambient temperature outside their retreats).

Best regards, Michael

Reactions: Like 1


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## G. pulchra (Jun 13, 2007)

Thanks Michael, great information.


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## Mark Pennell (Aug 8, 2007)

Michael Jacobi said:


> The name "Singapore" resulted mostly because the first collection team [Alvin & Co.] was from Singapore. The spider is found on mainland Malaysia and, until described as a species, should more properly be referred to as _Cyriopagopus_ sp. 'blue', without any geographic reference. Ignore all of the other trade names.
> 
> You will find that these spiders do better at somewhat cool temperatures and moderate to moderately high humidity (70-80% RH, 70-75F].
> (In fact, many people keep all of their tarantulas too warm, overlooking the fact that whether living in burrows, rock scrapes, tree holes or palm fronds these spiders inhabit microclimates significantly cooler than the ambient temperature outside their retreats).
> ...


Interesting stuff, I just like to add to this one if I may. The first images I received of this species were sat in a tree in none other than Singapore. As I was going out to Borneo that November 2003 I arranged to see the person who found it. Incidentally it was not blue at the time but a pinkish brown. So had no idea of how it was going to turn out.

I tried to contact him from Sabah but was unable to get an outside line, so could not arrange for him to meet us at the airport.

It was not until I returned back that I received a image of the spider it had now moulted and was bright blue!... he had removed from the tree, and it died in his care.

The following year Alvin brought these to the BTS show and everyone went mad, Alvins where as far as I know from the mainland.

But the name Singapore blue had stuck by then, and was also used as a misleading locally data to deter over zealous collecting and I guess to protect a monopoly.

Myths, legends, half truths are abundant within this genus, one day we will all look back and have real good chuckle about it.

Cheers
Mark


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## Merfolk (Aug 8, 2007)

Why then aren't they described. I browsed the various spider catalogs and it's nowhere to be found yet species I never heard off are properly named and classified. The blue is one of the top spiders in the world and it's legaly nonexistent. Sadening...

If the guy who found it is named Salam, just call it Cyriopagopus salami!


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## metallica (Aug 8, 2007)

describing a spider takes time. first you have to check the other species in the genus. (look at the holotypes of each species that are deposited in musea) so you are sure it is a new species and not an extremety of an allready known species. sometimes holotypes are missing, this compicates everything! sometimes species are described under a diffrent genus because 100 years ago they valued other characteristecs then taxonomists now.
sometimes describing a new species can't be done unless you revise the whole genus..... just be patient.


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## Wadew (Aug 8, 2007)

From what I have seen the Cyriopagopus sp. "singapore blue" adults  have had a more electric blue color to them then the Cyriopagopus sp. "blue malaysian" adults but this may be another instance where " Color means nothing" lol

                          Wade


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## syndicate (Aug 8, 2007)

mabey one day they will be Cyriopagopus violaceopes


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## worm (Aug 8, 2007)

i have a singapore as well and think there great....i got it as a .25" and been keeping it up to now a amazing 2.5"   they grow fast...lol  mines actually kinda fat.

i noticed that it was hard to get info or a care sheet for this spider..hell most people dont even know what they are, i guess there still kinda new in the hobby. I have found that even for my sling as long as im like 75deg or better she's cool. i even went all out to make sure humidity was correct and it  is so far. i keep it at 65% or better but not too much honestly if you just mist your cage every other day or so then let it dry your good. Mine being a sling prefeers to lick off the side of the tank...(spiders have tongues!..lol) i dont have any amazing blue yet to report of but i do have some really cool floresent green toes on the underside.

 her hair is slowly giving a metalic blueish/grey look....but she's fast so its hard to get a good look.  Id put he/she in a good amount of substrate so she can do her burrow thing.

but if you want check out my you tube page you can see her in action and out of her burrow


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## metallica (Aug 9, 2007)

also look here for more info:http://www.arborealtarantulas.net.invisionzone.com/index.php?showtopic=365


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## JensWest (Aug 26, 2007)

Hi.
I´ve just picked up one of these my self on about 3½" in legspan.
Are you able to sex these as C. schioedtei or do you have to look for a spermathecae?


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## harrypei (Aug 26, 2007)

FlAMiNGWAfflE said:


> Hi.
> I´ve just picked up one of these my self on about 3½" in legspan.
> Are you able to sex these as C. schioedtei or do you have to look for a spermathecae?


gotta share some pics bro.


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## JensWest (Aug 26, 2007)

harrypei said:


> gotta share some pics bro.


It´ll come. Just want to feed it first though it´s quite thin right now.
Is it possible to sex it by just looking at it was question?


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## harrypei (Aug 26, 2007)

FlAMiNGWAfflE said:


> It´ll come. Just want to feed it first though it´s quite thin right now.
> Is it possible to sex it by just looking at it was question?


at 3 and 1/2 you should be but it won't be easy and won't be very accurate unless it's one of the ones that's just obvious.


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## dtknow (Dec 23, 2007)

So what is the diff between blue 1 and blue 2? Its hard to believe they are all one species...and if so at least we should try to keep different locales seperate. I've noticed some(usually "Singapore" ones) exhibit more of a turquoise blue than bright blue shown in blue 2...y or no?


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## metallica (Dec 24, 2007)

would you have read the whole post here, you would know the answer is no


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## seanbond (Dec 24, 2007)

*cyriopagopus*

Happy holidayz everyone!!
I have a big adult female (more purplish than anything else) and a ling still not showing color and mature male (quite the blonde!)
Does anyone have this sp setup in a arboreal setup that is actually mimicing how it is in the wild?? I set my female up with plenty of dirt to burrow but has yet to do so...as for the ling, it has burrowed and the male just chills and eats crix..lil webbing.......im thinking about rehousing her with less dirt more climbing space??

sb


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## dtknow (Dec 24, 2007)

metallica said:


> would you have read the whole post here, you would know the answer is no


I have read this entire thread, but still am not convinced. Perhaps turquoise is their premolt colors? Or an artifact of camera flash?


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## KenTheBugGuy (Dec 24, 2007)

*Singapoor*

I have the ones from malaysia and one bred here and they both have the same blue color and look the same. 

Did you know the males are totally brown?

I have one of those too.

Reactions: Like 1


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## dtknow (Dec 24, 2007)

http://www.spidy.goliathus.com/english/cyriopagopus-spec-blue-2-malaysie-id267.html

vs

http://www.spidy.goliathus.com/english/cyriopagopus-spec-blue-1-singapur-id286.html

But as you mentioned I've seen plenty of "Singapore blues" with the colors of the ones in the first link.


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## KenTheBugGuy (Dec 24, 2007)

*I see*

I see your point.  Well the 2 I have from malaysia look the same as the first one but I do have a Lampropelma violaceops- Singapore Violet  that kinda looks like that second picture.


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## metallica (Dec 24, 2007)

seanbond said:


> Does anyone have this sp setup in a arboreal setup that is actually mimicing how it is in the wild??
> sb


in the wild the adults are 4 meters up in the tree. my tank is not that high.


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## KenTheBugGuy (Dec 24, 2007)

*Lol*

better get a taller cage and house!


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## GartenSpinnen (Dec 24, 2007)

I didnt feel like reading all the other posts cause im kinda in a rush but heres a quick care sheet for this species.

1.Reference- Name is Cyriopagopus sp. "Blue", from what i have seen theres 2 types going around, one is blue and one is more purple. Perhaps they are the same species just different color forms but who knows at the moment? All i know is there throwing all these localities in with the name and some people are saying those localities are wrong, its so confusing! So just call it "Blue" .

2.Temperature- I keep all my tarantulas at the same temperature, room temperature. Its always worked great for me, ive even dropped down to high 60's (65,68 degrees) and had no problems ever. The highest it ever gets is about 76 degrees or so.

3.Humidity- I make sure to mist mine regularly, i keep the humidity slightly high for this species and it seems to be working well for me.

4.Housing- I find this depends. They seem to prefer to burrow while they are young and then become more and more arboreal as they grow older. So, as a sling under 2" i would say give them plenty of substrate to make a burrow and then also give them plenty of room on top and maybe some fake plants or something to web up. My younger 1.5" has made a tube web up the side of a fake plant to the top of the enclosure, all the way down to the bottom in a maze like tunnels. They seem to web a lot. As they grow older i imagine keeping them completely arboreal would be ideal.

5. Temperament- Skittish but can be defensive. Ive also seen and heard of very docile large specimens, but any and all i have seen personally including my own have been very skittish, secretive, and if bothered or cornered quick to throw a threat display.

Thats about all i have, sorry if i repeated stuff already mentioned.


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## worm (Dec 24, 2007)

i dont know if you guys had seen this thread but here is the link as mine is a sling. just a good pic of it now

http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=112069

but got some blue not alot yet...I have a 10gal or so but a vertical tank.
1'x1'x1.5'   not bad but he/she still in a burrow.


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## whitehaze2008 (Dec 25, 2007)

*hum*

these spiders in my opinion are very pretty as spiderlings and juv, but when they hit adulthood they have little hair on there legs...
making them look like a long legged sick purpurea undergoing cancer treatment.....:8o


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## metallica (Dec 25, 2007)

worm said:


> but got some blue not alot yet...I have a 10gal or so but a vertical tank.
> 1'x1'x1.5'   not bad but he/she still in a burrow.


hi, where is the snug fitting tube (corckbark/bamboo or whatever) that they utilize in nature?


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## ballpython2 (Dec 25, 2007)

KenTheBugGuy said:


> I have the ones from malaysia and one bred here and they both have the same blue color and look the same.
> 
> Did you know the males are totally brown?
> 
> I have one of those too.


Since the males are totally brown (I'm assuming as an adult) would this be an ok way to sex them (once reaching sexin age)? or do the females go through  a brown stage before reachin that lovely blue?


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## KenTheBugGuy (Dec 25, 2007)

*well*



ballpython2 said:


> Since the males are totally brown (I'm assuming as an adult) would this be an ok way to sex them (once reaching sexin age)? or do the females go through  a brown stage before reachin that lovely blue?


From my experience the slings look similiar and then when they get to a certain age the male differs from the female a lot more.  The male is thinner and a definate brown and the female is all blue.


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## PhormictopusMan (Dec 25, 2007)

ballpython2 said:


> Since the males are totally brown (I'm assuming as an adult) would this be an ok way to sex them (once reaching sexin age)? or do the females go through  a brown stage before reachin that lovely blue?


It may be that by the time this color phase has happened that it will have hooked out and will be obvious that it's male.  I was told that this is how P. irminia will show its color dimorphism as well--only at ultimate.  My C. "blue" (from Ken) is still under three inches so I haven't experienced the variations myself so don't really know.  

--Chris


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## ballpython2 (Dec 25, 2007)

PhormictopusMan said:


> It may be that by the time this color phase has happened that it will have hooked out and will be obvious that it's male.  I was told that this is how P. irminia will show its color dimorphism as well--only at ultimate.  My C. "blue" (from Ken) is still under three inches so I haven't experienced the variations myself so don't really know.
> 
> --Chris


ok well thats some good information thanks for that.


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## raptooor (May 11, 2008)

Hi!

Help!

1.
http://www.madarpokok.mlap.hu/?gallery&picture=5625121#
Lampropelma (singapure) or sp blue II (malaysia)???
Sub male!
Abdomen "sample"!!!

2.
http://www.madarpokok.mlap.hu/?gallery&picture=5625120#
Lampropelma (singapure) or sp blue II (malaysia)???
Juv male!
Abdomen "sample"!!!

I'm waiting for your answer!!!


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## phormingochilus (May 11, 2008)

What is your question?

Søren


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## raptooor (May 11, 2008)

is the spider on the picture Lampropelma (singapure) or sp blue II (malaysia)?
i need decision in the case of the first and second picture


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## KenTheBugGuy (May 12, 2008)

*hard*

Hard to be positive but those look like singapoors to me.


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## KenTheBugGuy (May 12, 2008)

*singapoor*

singapoor blues that is.


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## phormingochilus (May 12, 2008)

Both sp. Blue I (Singapore) and sp. Blue II (Malaysia) belongs to the same species: Lampropelma violaceopes. There seems to be a slight color difference in that adults of the Malaysian variety retain the pale carapace longer than adults of the Singaporean variety in which the carapace darkens earlier. However - both will get an entirely dark carapace with age and as mature adults are indistinguishable. You won't be able to tell any color difference in males of the two varieties as the pale carapace is a neotonic feature => pertains to younger stages of development => all varieties will have this feature in the younger stages of development ;-)

Regards
Søren



raptooor said:


> is the spider on the picture Lampropelma (singapure) or sp blue II (malaysia)?
> i need decision in the case of the first and second picture


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## lewisskinner (May 12, 2008)

raptooor said:


> is the spider on the picture Lampropelma (singapure) or sp blue II (malaysia)?
> i need decision in the case of the first and second picture


What are you talking about?

The spider known commonly as the "Singapore Blue" is an arboreal spider, and usually sold pseudo-scientifically as the _Cyriopagopus sp. _'blue', _C. sp. _'Malaysian blue' or _C. sp. _'Singapore Blue'.  These are all *the same species* - they may be colour forms.  Properly, it is in fact the species first described as _Lampropelma violaceopes_ Abraham (1924) although it probably isn't a Lampropelma.  At least 3 species have been sold in the past as _L. violaceopes_.

By the way, from the photos I'd say you have a _C. schioedtei_


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## lewisskinner (May 12, 2008)

or, what he said 

I learned from the best!


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## raptooor (May 12, 2008)

Hi!

Thx!!! 

this is my adult female






this is my sub adult male






if they are different varieties , can i mate them, without hibridization. I know they are the same species, i just want to ask can be any negative effect for the species?


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## lewisskinner (May 12, 2008)

Wow, she's a beaut!  I have a MM, but he seems to just hide in his tree all day and all night...


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## IdaSpida (Sep 23, 2008)

I have a Singapore Blue i bought this past spring. She has moulted twice, and is getting a lot bigger. She is now about 4" across and had become darker and more beautiful. I'm wondering how I am going to get her from one habitat to her larger habitat. She is outgrowing her home very quickly. I understand that they are very quick and quite aggressive. This worries me, as this is my first spider. I know, nice first choice. I've learned my lesson and will read up on the species first next time. Anyways, she is doing very well and is really healthy. I just don't know how to move her without hurting her or me in the process. Any tips?


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## phormingochilus (Sep 24, 2008)

Actually they get more and more docile with size and are one of the Cyriopagopus species that are easy to freehandle due to their mellow disposition. Here is a picture of me freehandling a freshly caucht female:



I wouldn't recommend doing this with any of the other Cyriopagopus species as they do reserve the reputation of being defensive.

So - in short. Don't worry too much about the transfer of the "Singapore Blue" merely prod her from one cage to another with a soft paintbrush, or into a transfer box if you are not game for actually freehandling her to her next and larger cage. They are not known for long sprints ;-)

Regards
Søren



IdaSpida said:


> I have a Singapore Blue i bought this past spring. She has moulted twice, and is getting a lot bigger. She is now about 4" across and had become darker and more beautiful. I'm wondering how I am going to get her from one habitat to her larger habitat. She is outgrowing her home very quickly. I understand that they are very quick and quite aggressive. This worries me, as this is my first spider. I know, nice first choice. I've learned my lesson and will read up on the species first next time. Anyways, she is doing very well and is really healthy. I just don't know how to move her without hurting her or me in the process. Any tips?


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## seanbond (Sep 24, 2008)

Are wild caught females that docile?? thats amazing


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## phormingochilus (Sep 24, 2008)

Juveniles can be a bit jumpy but nothing like C. schioedtei at the same size.

Regards
Søren


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## Lopez (Dec 7, 2008)

phormingochilus said:


> Actually they get more and more docile with size and are one of the Cyriopagopus species that are easy to freehandle due to their mellow disposition. Here is a picture of me freehandling a freshly caucht female:


Tell that to Claire 

In all seriousness, my adult female is very genlte, I get the occasional threat posture but she's generally slow and predictable.


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## phormingochilus (Dec 7, 2008)

LOL - I am not sure who got most surprised the spider or Claire ;-)

Søren




Lopez said:


> Tell that to Claire
> 
> In all seriousness, my adult female is very genlte, I get the occasional threat posture but she's generally slow and predictable.


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## Arachnosold1er (Dec 7, 2008)

Is it just me or does the pic at the top look just like a H. Liv??? Color and shape of the carapace screams haplo to me.


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## Singbluemymind (Dec 7, 2008)

i've never had my girl give me a threat. i free handle her all the time. and as for color she is a beautiful deep blue


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## Redapache (Dec 7, 2008)

Mine would bite 8 times before I knew it she is a 7" Female and I wish she was nice. =[


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## Taipan (Dec 7, 2008)

redapache said:


> Mine would bite 8 times before I knew it she is a 7" Female and I wish she was nice. =[


Mine isn't that bad but she'd give an OBT a run for their money. I think I'll call her a BBT.


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## Singbluemymind (Dec 7, 2008)

that seems so weird to me. i've tried poking at her just to see if she would try and bite but nothing. she's more mellow then my pinktoe


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## Lopez (Dec 7, 2008)

Arachnosold1er said:


> Is it just me or does the pic at the top look just like a H. Liv??? Color and shape of the carapace screams haplo to me.


Which pic? There are a few in the thread.


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## Drachenjager (Dec 7, 2008)

Fierce Deity said:


> I would like to add one of these gorgeous blue arboreals to my collection.  My question is, what is the difference between Cyriopagopus sp "blue" and Cyriopagopus sp "singapore"?  Or, are they exactly the same thing?  I have heard things like they are the same thing, they are color variants, or that they are different species, and since information on these is rare, I can't find much to go on.  Thanks.
> Pictures and care would be nice too.


they are both Lampropelma violaceops(sp)


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## Protectyaaaneck (Dec 7, 2008)

Singbluemymind said:


> i've never had my girl give me a threat. i free handle her all the time. and as for color she is a beautiful deep blue


HOT SPIDER! 
I cant wait till my little guys get to that size.


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## Singbluemymind (Dec 7, 2008)

thanks man. i can't wait till she matures so i can breed her


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