# Keeper experience levels



## MrsHaas (Jan 19, 2015)

So, what "level" keeper would you categorize yourself in personally, and why?
And how should someone else accurately scale themselves?

Is there a certain species that upped your level.? was it sheer numbers? Or is it in the eye of the beholder?

I would like to consider myself intermediate going on advanced


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## Poec54 (Jan 19, 2015)

I was in the beginner stage for my first few years.  I think some people may be pushing the definition as to when they hit intermediate and advanced.  Getting slings doesn't count; it's working with them for a while as adults that's a better measure.

Reactions: Like 3


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## MrsHaas (Jan 19, 2015)

That is a really good way of thinking! I formally and officially retract the going on advanced part.


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## ARACHNO-SMACK48 (Jan 19, 2015)

I would say that I am intermediate and will be advanced in a few years.


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## awiec (Jan 19, 2015)

Do I have more "advanced" species? Yes. Have I raised them to maturity? No. So I don't particularly have a set "level" I consider myself. I can certainly tell just by looking that I need to re-dampen or adjust my practices to make my wards more comfortable and when I have one whom is in pre-molt and can (and have) extract them from a molt if needed. I'm still not the greatest at sexing but I have an idea what to look for when given a decent sized molt. I plan to breed my favorite spider, T.gigas, next year so I will have considered myself well learned on that species as by that point I will have raised several to adulthood and hopefully breed and rear a new generation, but I still would not consider myself an expert. There is no set formula for determining these things, I know people who have had tons of species and have raised many to adults over the years but have never bred them and then you get people who have had a few species for a short amount of time and do breed. I would consider the former more of an "expert" than the latter.


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## miss moxie (Jan 19, 2015)

Honestly I don't think number of specimens, particular species, or your view of yourself has much to do with intermediate and advanced keeping. Of course experience plays a huge part, but no two people are going to be the same. Someone could have NW Ts for five years and crash and burn with their first OW where someone picks up an OW one year after getting into the hobby and absolutely flourishes with it. 

Some people will have better skill sets that give them an edge in this hobby. For example, people who work well in stressful situations. People who can stay calm in a crisis. It's important to have good reflexes and remain calm when you're in the middle of an OW rehouse.

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## skippydude (Jan 19, 2015)

I have more tarantulas than brains. I'm a major noobie, which is 2 stages below beginner :?

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## Poec54 (Jan 19, 2015)

MrsHaas said:


> That is a really good way of thinking! I formally and officially retract the going on advanced part.


If someone's worked with OW adults (especially arboreals and Asians) for a few years, then I consider that person to be 'advanced.'  Most serious collectors also breed, if for no other reason than to offset the cost of new acquisitions and feeders.  Another sign of advanced owners is buying crickets by the thousand.  To do that means they have a lot of spiders and probably a lot of experience.  It takes years to get familiar with a variety of species and develop a feel for them.  There's a lot of things you eventually see over the years, that probably don't happen in the beginning: just what some species are capable of.  With limited experience it's easy to assume it's a breeze, but challenges will come in time.  Spiders are full of surprises.  

There's no shame in being in the 'beginner' stage for a few years.  We tend to be an instant gratification society.

---------- Post added 01-19-2015 at 12:33 PM ----------




miss moxie said:


> Some people will have better skill sets that give them an edge in this hobby. For example, people who work well in stressful situations. People who can stay calm in a crisis. It's important to have good reflexes and remain calm when you're in the middle of an OW rehouse.



Very true.  Some people develop the skills and confidence sooner than others.  Some are never ready for OBT's, nor should anyone feel they have to be.  There's beautiful species for every experience level.  People look for different things in the spiders they own.  Some want calm, slower moving species.  Others prefer them fast and feisty; most collectors are probably somewhere in between.  

---------- Post added 01-19-2015 at 12:35 PM ----------




skippydude said:


> I have more tarantulas than brains. I'm a major noobie, which is 2 stages below beginner


Refreshingly honest.  Everyone starts at the bottom and works their way up.  I was there too.  I'd rather see people more humble in the self-evaluation of their skill/experience, then over-confident.  It's easy to have things unravel before your eyes in some situations.

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## MrsHaas (Jan 19, 2015)

I must agree! I have had tarantulas for a long time and am just now starting to consider myself more than a beginner - I definitely spoke too soon saying going on advanced...
Mustn't be fooled by time or numbers I supposed.
It just has always made me curious as to how ppl or pet shops "rank" diff species - often I see "beginner" or "intermediate" on the price tags at several of my lps


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## klawfran3 (Jan 19, 2015)

I think I'm in between beginner and intermediate. I know because I still make some "basic" mistakes with a bit of poor judgement, but I know how to avoid a ton of the problems I would have had when I first started. I think that if I had more space for my collection and I kept things more organized with a bit more emphasis on husbandry, I would easily be able to bridge the gap between the two levels and move on to "advanced" in a year or two. But alas, I have barely enough room to sleep with my room filled with cages and animals in my tiny living space, hopefully that will change when I move out and get my own/shared apartment. Might be after college though so I have a few more years. :S
Having to cut some costs (reusing cages/jars, lack of room, etc) because I'm a student is definitely holding me back. I at LEAST want to get high quality matching cages for my spiders in the next year or two. Cleaned out peanut butter and mayo jars work fine, but they don't really have that clean cut "professional" look to them i always wanted.


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## miss moxie (Jan 19, 2015)

MrsHaas said:


> I must agree! I have been keeping tarantulas for over 20 years and am just now starting to consider myself more than a beginner - I definitely spoke too soon saying going on advanced...
> Mustn't be fooled by time or numbers I supposed.
> It just has always made me curious as to how ppl or pet shops "rank" diff species - often I see "beginner" or "intermediate" on the price tags at several of my lps


And we all know how accurate LPS info can be lol


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## MrsHaas (Jan 19, 2015)

Loool... Well yes of course!




--J.Haas


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## Ellenantula (Jan 19, 2015)

Beginner.  
Poll in another 5 years -- maybe I'll be intermediate, maybe still beginner. Who knows, in 5 years maybe I'll be breeding pokies and teaching everyone how it's done....but I sort of doubt that.
lol  
Beginner.  Not so bad -- like a child when all the world is new and exciting!

Reactions: Like 1


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## Tfisher (Jan 19, 2015)

I would consider myself intermediate.. I have only collected T's for a little over a year, however I have experienced more than some how have collected for years. Deff not advanced but I like challenges and it pushes me to overcome "struggles". The example I can use is simply because of a LPS. The pet department had a beautiful orange tarantula, a pink toe, skeleton leg and a rose hair. I was so attracted by the OBT I decided to ask about it. The pet manager insisted on telling me your not ready for it it's for experts... And that's when the challenge was accepted. I sure as hell wasn't going to pay 85$ for an obt so I went out and found 3 obt slings for 40$. These were my second tarantulas and honestly didn't do much research before having them. Then on day changing enclosures from deli cups had my first encounter with the little minion. Thankfully myself and the spider were not injured, but I learned to do research before anything. I basically had a crash course with a few species, and even mating. Today I'm a proud "grandpa" of 106 and can't wait to do it again. 

With resources like this site we could all be intermediate in a blink of an eye.


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## JZC (Jan 19, 2015)

I consider myself intermediate. I've done well with an adult T. stirmi and am keeping slings of several fiesty NW tropicals as well as Taps and Psalmos and an E. cyanognathus. I'll keep them for a few molts before gauging my readiness for some OWs, where I will start with the more docile baboons (Ceratogyrous and Augocephalus) and a pokie or two.


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## Biollantefan54 (Jan 19, 2015)

I consider myself intermediate. I don't have a lot of experience with crazy defensive tarantulas but I am sure I would be fine with one. I have a S. dehaani that packs a punch and is quite fast and I have never came close to doing anything stupid with it. To each their own I guess lol.


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## Chainsaw Reptiles (Jan 19, 2015)

I Really Dun Wanna Be Cocky But I Feel Sorta Experianced After Keeping T's For 12 Years...


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## Tim Benzedrine (Jan 19, 2015)

I guess I'm a beginner level keeper. Maybe intellectually I am in intermediate territory, but that does not mean squat with out the practical experience to accompany it. I do have a couple tarantulas that I personally believe run towards the edge of intermediate level, but many would probably disagree.
Plus, after my B. smithi mishap yesterday, I demoted myself.

I am however a 12th level paladin with +4 armor of invincibility and a +2 Vorpal Sword of Incendiary Might.

(That one was for the resident geeks on the boards)

Reactions: Like 5


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## Poec54 (Jan 19, 2015)

Tfisher said:


> I would consider myself intermediate.. I have only collected T's for a little over a year



I don't think anyone's 'intermediate in a year, especially these days when almost everything for sale are slings.  Resources and research are no substitute for hands-on experience, and that takes years not months.

---------- Post added 01-19-2015 at 02:01 PM ----------




Chainsaw Reptil said:


> I Really Dun Wanna Be Cocky But I Feel Sorta Experianced After Keeping T's For 12 Years...


All depends on what you've been keeping.  One or roseas for 10 years doesn't put anyone in the intermediate level.


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## freedumbdclxvi (Jan 19, 2015)

I am a beginner with some species, intermediate with some and advanced with some.  I have enough experience to know I'll still be surprised, and I have enough experience to know there isn't an invert I couldn't keep.


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## Biollantefan54 (Jan 19, 2015)

Like I said above, I don't have a whole lot of hands on experience but I would feel comfortable handling most invertebrates. I am sure that I wouldn't do anything stupid, that's why I put myself in the intermediate category. Don't know if that makes sense though


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## vespers (Jan 19, 2015)

Chainsaw Reptil said:


> I Really Dun Wanna Be Cocky But I Feel Sorta Experianced After Keeping T's For 12 Years...


_You're only 15 years old,_ according to this post:
http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?101718-Introduce-Yourself&p=2347417#post2347417

You've been keeping tarantulas since you've been 3? Um...

..but here, you say you got your first T when you were 9 (you think):
http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/sho...od-Intermediate-species&p=2347118#post2347118

Perhaps you should get your facts straight/tell the truth before you even begin to think about being "cocky"...

Reactions: Like 4


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## Biollantefan54 (Jan 19, 2015)

I am 15 vespers, I have only be keeping for 3 years now. What's wrong with 15 year olds, hmmm? 

But yeah, how are you going to be bragging and then have like 3 different stories.


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## Angel Minkov (Jan 19, 2015)

Ive been keeping Ts since I was eleven. I own mostly pokies and I have never had problems with them, but theyre slings/juvies. My biggest is a 3" P. subfusca. I cannot really rank myself, seeing as Ive had no problems with any ts thus far, but I also kniw I have much to learn.   Maybe Im somewhere between beginner/intermediate.

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## awiec (Jan 19, 2015)

Poec54 said:


> I don't think anyone's 'intermediate in a year, especially these days when almost everything for sale are slings.  Resources and research are no substitute for hands-on experience, and that takes years not months.
> 
> ---------- Post added 01-19-2015 at 02:01 PM ----------
> 
> ...


Tarantulas is like driving a car, the more time you spend doing it/caring for them the longer you have had to develop the reflexes and learn to deal with various situations. Last time I rehoused my P.regalis she decided to try to take off on me but I successfully got the lid back on her cage before she could, if that were to happen 5 or 6 months earlier I would have had a pokie on the ceiling. I take it slow (or at least I think I do) but I also have the advantage of caring for true spiders for years, so those skills are what I bring to the table as oppose to other people. I suppose in most cases I am a beginner and I'm okay with that, I have something to look forward to as time goes on.

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## Syren (Jan 19, 2015)

I'm a rank beginner with my one little B. smithi sling, and I'll probably never aspire to being much more than that. There are a few others on my list that I would like to have, but I have no interest in gathering a large collection, or dealing with arboreals, or OW Ts. I enjoy reading the threads on this board, and the search function is definitely my friend when I have a question. I really enjoy watching my little guy hunt and grow, but it's unlikely that I will make the additional effort to gain the experience necessary to ascend levels.


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## ArborealKing (Jan 19, 2015)

I am a beginner for sure, as I have only been in the hobby for a few months and still have a lot to learn. The Ts I do have are often thought to be more 'advanced' species, but I don't think that changes my beginner status in the slightest.


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## IHeartTs (Jan 19, 2015)

Intermediate?  Idk. Haven't been in long (almost 2 years) but I have a lot of adults and juvies, including OWs that I have rehoused, chased etc. I buy crickets by the dozens just because they friggin stink and no room for a roach colony although that'll change soon. My biggest problem is that I worry way too much. If one acts a little abnormal my brain goes in crisis mode even though I know there's probably nothing wrong at all. Tons and tons of development has taken place in like the past 9 months due to being on the boards more and networking but im still polishing my skills. I have 3 new OW juvies and 2 NW slings I'm picking up next week. I'm sure that 3 inch female OBT will help my rehousing abilities.  Almost got it down pretty well. Almost.


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## Pociemon (Jan 19, 2015)

I am not a beginner anymore, i have been in the hobby with alot of T´s the last 10 years. But i miss my beginner days.....That was exciting to learn so many new things, scienfitic names, all about them, so many things! I am still learning, but at alot slower pace. I specialize in certain genera and not many can teach me much more than i already know, only when some new stuff from taxonomist is made public, or by some germans i know.  But the most exciting days was in the early days in the hobby for me.


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## miss moxie (Jan 19, 2015)

Poec54 said:


> Very true.  Some people develop the skills and confidence sooner than others.  Some are never ready for OBT's, nor should anyone feel they have to be.  There's beautiful species for every experience level.  People look for different things in the spiders they own.  Some want calm, slower moving species.  Others prefer them fast and feisty; most collectors are probably somewhere in between.


I was just thinking earlier today how there are still so many NW specimens I'd love to have. More Avicularia, Phormictopus, more Pamphobeteus, Cyriocosmus, the beautiful little O. diamantinensis and so on and so on. As I was thinking it over, I started to think about why people want to rush into OWs. Sure I've got a list of OWs I want to own, how could you not want to own a pokie? They're gorgeous. 

But with so many amazing NWs, why rush? Why feel pressured to moving onto OWs without being 100% confident you're ready for it and ready to accept the liabilities that come with owning potently venomed Ts. There are so many incredible NW options, and a lot of them don't turn into pet holes like quite a few OWs do.

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## BobGrill (Jan 19, 2015)

vespers said:


> _You're only 15 years old,_ according to this post:
> http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?101718-Introduce-Yourself&p=2347417#post2347417
> 
> You've been keeping tarantulas since you've been 3? Um...
> ...


I'm starting to suspect this guy is a troll.


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## miss moxie (Jan 19, 2015)

BobGrill said:


> I'm starting to suspect this guy is a troll.


Yeah and not the fun kind with spikey lime green hair.

Reactions: Like 2


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## eldondominicano (Jan 19, 2015)

I think experience comes in numbers. Number of years in hobby, number of years caring for OW and New T's, number of years in breeding. Number of T's you have; including per species etc.. I've got some years and still consider myself a padawan. Wisdom and experience isn't just bought. Its earned.

---------- Post added 01-19-2015 at 08:26 PM ----------

And I'm willing to do the time 

---------- Post added 01-19-2015 at 08:27 PM ----------




miss moxie said:


> Yeah and not the fun kind with spikey lime green hair.


LOL. I didnt know there was a type of troll that was fun to be around?..... ;p


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## awiec (Jan 19, 2015)

miss moxie said:


> I was just thinking earlier today how there are still so many NW specimens I'd love to have. More Avicularia, Phormictopus, more Pamphobeteus, Cyriocosmus, the beautiful little O. diamantinensis and so on and so on. As I was thinking it over, I started to think about why people want to rush into OWs. Sure I've got a list of OWs I want to own, how could you not want to own a pokie? They're gorgeous.
> 
> But with so many amazing NWs, why rush? Why feel pressured to moving onto OWs without being 100% confident you're ready for it and ready to accept the liabilities that come with owning potently venomed Ts. There are so many incredible NW options, and a lot of them don't turn into pet holes like quite a few OWs do.


I think a lot has to do with ignorance, there are so many species of tarantula and there are tons to choose from even with the small fraction in captivity. There are several genus like Thrixopelma, Euathlus and Paraphya that make much better introduction tarantulas than a rosea and many people starting out just don't know about them. I constantly look at what some of the top breeders have going on and they usually have the cool oddball stuff (Philth/Tom especially is a guy I follow around on here). Once you know whats out there then you can plan accordingly. Of course there are those people who argue "but what if the laddering species that someone has to go through to get to the species they want they aren't interested in?" well you don't know for sure until you own the spider to see if it's "boring"; I originally did not want my P.muticus freebie and dreaded taking care of it but it has grown on me and I really enjoy it now.

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## MrDave (Jan 19, 2015)

Definitely a beginner. Entered this hobby in Aug 2014, and have a few slings.


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## HungryGhost (Jan 19, 2015)

I'd say I'm intermediate and will be so for a while. I kept T's 15 or so years ago and got back into the hobby last year. I'm strictly NW with no plans of owning OW. maybe if I successfully bred a number of species over many years I'd consider bumping up advanced. Haven't bred anything yet but might try my first later this year.


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## BobGrill (Jan 19, 2015)

awiec said:


> I think a lot has to do with ignorance, there are so many species of tarantula and there are tons to choose from even with the small fraction in captivity. There are several genus like Thrixopelma, Euathlus and Paraphya that make much better introduction tarantulas than a rosea and many people starting out just don't know about them. I constantly look at what some of the top breeders have going on and they usually have the cool oddball stuff (Philth/Tom especially is a guy I follow around on here). Once you know whats out there then you can plan accordingly. Of course there are those people who argue "but what if the laddering species that someone has to go through to get to the species they want they aren't interested in?" well you don't know for sure until you own the spider to see if it's "boring"; I originally did not want my P.muticus freebie and dreaded taking care of it but it has grown on me and I really enjoy it now.


P.muticus freebie? Aren't those usually rather pricey?


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## catfishrod69 (Jan 19, 2015)

I guess i would fall under advanced.

When i first got in the hobby i skipped slings, and went straight to old world adults. One of my first packages had Pokies, H. lividum, S. calceatum, and others in it, all adults. Not long after being in the hobby i produced S. calceatum, my first species produced. From then ive grown a knack for pairing, breeding, raising, rehousing, learning the ways of tarantulas. I keep calm in all situations.

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## Poec54 (Jan 19, 2015)

catfishrod69 said:


> I guess i would fall under advanced.
> 
> When i first got in the hobby i skipped slings, and went straight to old world adults. One of my first packages had Pokies, H. lividum, S. calceatum, and others in it, all adults. Not long after being in the hobby i produced S. calceatum, my first species produced. From then ive grown a knack for pairing, breeding, raising, rehousing, learning the ways of tarantulas. I keep calm in all situations.


You qualify.  Some others I'm not so sure of.

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## TroyMcClureOG82 (Jan 19, 2015)

miss moxie said:


> Honestly I don't think number of specimens, particular species, or your view of yourself has much to do with intermediate and advanced keeping. Of course experience plays a huge part, but no two people are going to be the same. Someone could have NW Ts for five years and crash and burn with their first OW where someone picks up an OW one year after getting into the hobby and absolutely flourishes with it.
> 
> Some people will have better skill sets that give them an edge in this hobby. For example, people who work well in stressful situations. People who can stay calm in a crisis. It's important to have good reflexes and remain calm when you're in the middle of an OW rehouse.


This doesn't happen. Nobody crashes and burns with an old world after lots of new world experience. Number of species, specimens and years in the hobby is an EXCELLENT WAY to judge experience


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## TsunamiSpike (Jan 19, 2015)

Undoubtedly a beginner. Only been in the hobby for two months. Although i feel I've shown remarkable restraint in terms of buying Ts. Maybe because i want to make sure i can look after a small amount  of them before delving into higher counts. Either way I'm sure I'll remain at beginner for some time, but as long as that means I end up helping the hobby in whatever little way i can, i can live with that.

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## BobGrill (Jan 19, 2015)

I'd consider myself intermediate.


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## Poec54 (Jan 19, 2015)

TroyMcClureOG82 said:


> This doesn't happen. Nobody crashes and burns with an old world after lots of new world experience. Number of species, specimens and years in the hobby is an EXCELLENT WAY to judge experience


Not necessarily.  You can have a collection of Brachypelma and Aphonopelma for years and will be in for a wild ride with an OBT.  That's why I recommend people working their way up in stages.

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## TroyMcClureOG82 (Jan 19, 2015)

Poec54 said:


> Not necessarily.  You can have a collection of Brachypelma and Aphonopelma for years and will be in for a wild ride with an OBT.  That's why I recommend people working their way up in stages.


Getting bitten doesn't equate crashing and burning. If you kept Brachypelma and Aphonopelma alive for years, you'd have to try to kill the OBT. On a side note if you've been bitten recently go ahead and not click advanced


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## awiec (Jan 19, 2015)

BobGrill said:


> P.muticus freebie? Aren't those usually rather pricey?


I think they range between $20-50 for a 1 inch, I saw some in the classifieds for better prices, but yeah I got sent one after spending like $200; it was totally unexpected and I did not want it but I have seen them as freebies just cause they take forever to grow.


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## Ellenantula (Jan 19, 2015)

TroyMcClureOG82 said:


> If you kept Brachypelma and Aphonopelma alive for years, you'd have to try to kill the OBT.


thanks..........................


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## Poec54 (Jan 19, 2015)

awiec said:


> I think they range between $20-50 for a 1 inch, I saw some in the classifieds for better prices, but yeah I got sent one after spending like $200; it was totally unexpected and I did not want it but I have seen them as freebies just cause they take forever to grow.


They aren't that slow if kept warm and fed often.  Most of the complainers about slow growth keep the spiders on the cool side and feed them once every couple of weeks.


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## TroyMcClureOG82 (Jan 19, 2015)

Ellenantula said:


> thanks..........................


Sometimes animals die even when husbandry is correct. It just happens. Don't beat yourself up


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## Poec54 (Jan 19, 2015)

TroyMcClureOG82 said:


> Getting bitten doesn't equate crashing and burning. If you kept Brachypelma and Aphonopelma alive for years, you'd have to try to kill the OBT. On a side note if you've been bitten recently go ahead and not click advanced


The 'crash and burn' isn't about keeping an OBT alive.  It's about getting nailed and spending the night in an emergency room.


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## miss moxie (Jan 19, 2015)

TroyMcClureOG82 said:


> This doesn't happen. Nobody crashes and burns with an old world after lots of new world experience. Number of species, specimens and years in the hobby is an EXCELLENT WAY to judge experience


If you're the sort of person who doesn't like defensive Ts and come face to face with a hissing old world the size of a tea-saucer, venom dripping from their fangs-- you might not like what you see and throw in the towel. I didn't mean the OW necessarily was going to beat them up and take their lunch money. Some people just don't like 'angry' spiders and are content with their docile E. campestratus. Different strokes for different folks.

Also there is a difference between experience and skill level. Yes, all of those things are the only way to get experience. You can't get experience by flipping through books and scrolling through websites. But experience doesn't always equal skill.

For example I'm a much better driver than my friend. We live in similar climates, and both deal with snow. She cannot handle sliding, the thought of sliding-- usually has her mother drive her. Yes, a twenty something getting rides from mumsy. I on the other hand have no problem it. When I go into a slide I remain calm and correct it without issue. She's had her license four years longer than I have.

She has experience over me, but I have more skill.

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## TroyMcClureOG82 (Jan 19, 2015)

miss moxie said:


> If you're the sort of person who doesn't like defensive Ts and come face to face with a hissing old world the size of a tea-saucer, venom dripping from their fangs-- you might not like what you see and throw in the towel. I didn't mean the OW necessarily was going to beat them up and take their lunch money. Some people just don't like 'angry' spiders and are content with their docile E. campestratus. Different strokes for different folks.
> 
> Also there is a difference between experience and skill level. Yes, all of those things are the only way to get experience. You can't get experience by flipping through books and scrolling through websites. But experience doesn't always equal skill.
> 
> ...


Lololol lol @venom dripping from its fangs. You should try writing fantasy novels. Sure there is a difference between skill and experience but this ain't something you are born with God given talent at. You acquire skill by keeping a lot of spiders over a long period of time


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## freedumbdclxvi (Jan 19, 2015)

TroyMcClureOG82 said:


> Lololol lol @venom dripping from its fangs


Guess you've not seen a big pissed off H schmidti or hainanum or P muticus.  They'll raise up and you can see droplets.

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## miss moxie (Jan 19, 2015)

TroyMcClureOG82 said:


> Lololol lol @venom dripping from its fangs. You should try writing fantasy novels. Sure there is a difference between skill and experience but this ain't something you are born with God given talent at. You acquire skill by keeping a lot of spiders over a long period of time


Boy I'd feel worse about proving you wrong if you weren't acting like such a jerk. 

[video=youtube;lcgxXNEOVAU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcgxXNEOVAU[/video]

Let me dissect my opinion, since you seem to be having issues with it.



miss moxie said:


> Honestly_ I don't think number of specimens, particular species, or your view of yourself has much to do with intermediate and advanced keeping_. Of course experience plays a huge part, but no two people are going to be the same. Someone could have NW Ts for five years and crash and burn with their first OW where someone picks up an OW one year after getting into the hobby and absolutely flourishes with it.
> 
> Some people will have better skill sets that give them an edge in this hobby. For example, people who work well in stressful situations. People who can stay calm in a crisis. It's important to have good reflexes and remain calm when you're in the middle of an OW rehouse.


First of all, nowhere in there did I say that anyone was born with tarantula experience. I said that experience plays a huge part in developing intermediate and advanced skills. Skills does not equal experience, as you're ready to agree. 

Second, I only said that certain people have skill sets that give them an edge. I didn't say some people are born flawless tarantula gods or goddesses. Merely that certain personal skills can help a hobbyist truly flourish.

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## Poec54 (Jan 19, 2015)

miss moxie said:


> Some people just don't like 'angry' spiders and are content with their docile E. campestratus.


Our own Stan Schultz is one of them.  How he could not find cranky OW's appealing is beyond me.

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## Biollantefan54 (Jan 19, 2015)

I like a little attitude, calm and predictable gets boring!


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## miss moxie (Jan 19, 2015)

Poec54 said:


> Our own Stan Schultz is one of them.  How he could not find cranky OW's appealing is beyond me.


I've not had the pleasure yet. But I like when my NWs get cranky. Especially my Pamphobeteus juveniles, when they aim their butt at me. I like to imagine them thinking 'this is what I think of you'.


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## PanzoN88 (Jan 19, 2015)

I am still a beginner


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## Poec54 (Jan 19, 2015)

Biollantefan54 said:


> I like a little attitude, calm and predictable gets boring!


For me too; I used to have only Brachypelma and Aphonopelma for my first few years.  It was such a relief to finally see some spiders stand up and extend their fangs.  I knew I had found my destiny, my 'special purpose' as Navin R. Johnson called it.  But for some people, fast and defensive is too stressful for them to have to deal with on a regular basis (especially if they have children), and that's fine.  Plenty of species to choose from; get the ones that are a good fit.

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miss moxie said:


> I've not had the pleasure yet.


Only a matter of time, miss moxie.

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## advan (Jan 19, 2015)

freedumbdclxvi said:


> Guess you've not seen a big pissed off H schmidti or hainanum or P muticus.  They'll raise up and you can see droplets.


_Ephebopus_ always give me the pleasure.

Reactions: Like 8


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## miss moxie (Jan 19, 2015)

Poec54 said:


> ...and that's fine.  Plenty of species to choose from; get the ones that are a good fit.


Absolutely. No one should have to feel like they are a 'silly beginner' because they only want NWs and have never seen an OW nor do they ever want to. Beginner, intermediate, advanced-- this is all good to keep people from biting off more than they can chew. To label a tarantula intermediate or advanced means that you have to be sure you're ready for it before you pick it up. But no one should feel bad about themselves for never owning intermediate/advanced species. 

This is a hobby. The definition of hobby is an activity done regularly in one's leisure for _pleasure._ If it doesn't please someone to own anything other than Grammys and Brachys then that's just fine. It shouldn't be expected that you climb any higher on the ladder than you want to. That's why I find it a bit detrimental to focus on a person's skill level for anything other than determining if they are ready for a tarantula they want to buy.

I, on the other hand, am just going to send any mistake purchases to you to cover up the evidence! </conspiracy>

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## TroyMcClureOG82 (Jan 19, 2015)

miss moxie said:


> Boy I'd feel worse about proving you wrong if you weren't acting like such a jerk.
> 
> [video=youtube;lcgxXNEOVAU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcgxXNEOVAU[/video]
> 
> ...


I never said that you won't see venom from a spider what I said was you should write fantasy novels. You proved nobody wrong. As a matter of fact you further proved my point


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## miss moxie (Jan 19, 2015)

TroyMcClureOG82 said:


> I never said that you won't see venom from a spider what I said was you should write fantasy novels. You proved nobody wrong. As a matter of fact you further proved my point


I think the only thing you succeeded at was being really confusing and vague.

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## TroyMcClureOG82 (Jan 19, 2015)

advan said:


> _Ephebopus_ always give me the pleasure.


That's hardly dripping from it's fangs...if milking venom were only so easy


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## awiec (Jan 19, 2015)

Poec54 said:


> They aren't that slow if kept warm and fed often.  Most of the complainers about slow growth keep the spiders on the cool side and feed them once every couple of weeks.


I've gotten mine to grow close to an inch in the year I've had it due to the fact that I stuff it until it won't eat and I keep mine a little more moist than some are apt to. I originally kept it on a scare prey diet in the first place to delay its growth as I did not want the thing originally and wanted to pawn it off before it got mean. Now after spending time with it and other spiders, I feel more comfortable with keeping it and have created more favorable growth conditions. Some guy who claimed to keep them for 30 years was asking me why mine grew so fast and did not believe me but for the most part these grow slow for people it seems.


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## Poec54 (Jan 19, 2015)

awiec said:


> I've gotten mine to grow close to an inch in the year I've had it due to the fact that I stuff it until it won't eat and I keep mine a little more moist than some are apt to. I originally kept it on a scare prey diet in the first place to delay its growth as I did not want the thing originally and wanted to pawn it off before it got mean. Now after spending time with it and other spiders, I feel more comfortable with keeping it and have created more favorable growth conditions. Some guy who claimed to keep them for 30 years was asking me why mine grew so fast and did not believe me but for the most part these grow slow for people it seems.


I got a muticus sling almost a year ago that was just over 1", it's 3" now, and I'm not feeding it constantly.


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## cold blood (Jan 19, 2015)

Poec54 said:


> I knew I had found my destiny, my 'special purpose' as Navin R. Johnson called it.


Holy oop: that made me laugh.   One of the great comedies of all time!!  Best opening lines to a movie ever?



As for the question, I'd say somewhere between intermediate and advanced.   I took it real slow for a long time...beginner for a decade, easy. Then finally, when I was sure it was something I was going to enjoy for life I started shopping.  There was a time that I felt that I would lose interest as I got older....I didn't.   

I've always had an interest from my earliest age.   My father, may he rest in peace,  used to like to tell the story of the day he had friends over for coffee and I walked in the door with a few jars containing spiders when my dad yelled "get those things out of this house"....my response was very quick and serious "but dad, you let YOUR friends in the house" as I proceeded to the basement....his friends all got a kick out of that and would re-tell the story, even after I was an adult.

Anyway, I slowly amped it up and became so comfortable that it almost seemed natural.   A few years ago I decided to amp it up a bit, still with NW...knowing that there were qualities in OW that I really liked (burrowing, speed, incredible confidence), so I went yet a step further into arboreals (psalmopeous).   Once they started to grow it was over, everything about them was better, and something I actually had to pay real attention to again, and something I was drawn to pay attention to.   In the last year+ I have really expanded beyond what I ever thought I would.  My collection is about 1/2 OW, 1/2 NW...same for arboreal vs. terrestrial.   Also about 50/50 in terms of slings and juvies/adults.  I recently took yet another step by pairing.

I think my overly calm demeanor (I am actually even calmer under stress), my focus and need to understand behavior have all had a positive effect on my move up the ladder without a single issue to date.  But I never really take chances and tend to over-prepare for most situations, like re-housing.  I also am very patient, which means I never rush things with them.

I think in another year or 2, after I've had a successful breeding or two and I spend more time with larger OW t's as adults, I might change it all the way to advanced....close, but not quite yet.

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## miss moxie (Jan 19, 2015)

cold blood said:


> Holy oop: that made me laugh.   One of the great comedies of all time!!  Best opening lines to a movie ever?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You've got to love the stories parents keep telling into adulthood. Love and hate them while sort of rolling your eyes as they talk. Also is it just me or do they manage to repeat it nearly the exact same way each time? Like they rehearse it secretly without our knowing...

As I said before, I agree that a person with a calm demeanor will have an easier time in this hobby than someone anxious and quick to startle. Or someone who freezes up in the heat of the moment.

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best. A great motto to carry throughout life regardless of the situation.

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## freedumbdclxvi (Jan 19, 2015)

miss moxie said:


> As I said before, I agree that a person with a calm demeanor will have an easier time in this hobby than someone anxious and quick to startle. Or someone who freezes up in the heat of the moment.


Sometimes, freezing up "in the heat of the moment" is *exactly* what is required.


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## miss moxie (Jan 19, 2015)

freedumbdclxvi said:


> Sometimes, freezing up "in the heat of the moment" is *exactly* what is required.


I meant freezing up in panic rather than freezing because that's the appropriate response. But yes, no doubt about that.


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## IHeartTs (Jan 20, 2015)

freedumbdclxvi said:


> Sometimes, freezing up "in the heat of the moment" is *exactly* what is required.


Couldn't agree more. Ever seen Were the millers? Perfect time for freezing up. Lots and lots of freezing up. So much freezing up your NEIGHBORS teeth chatter.

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## Chainsaw Reptiles (Jan 20, 2015)

vespers said:


> _You're only 15 years old,_ according to this post:
> http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?101718-Introduce-Yourself&p=2347417#post2347417
> 
> You've been keeping tarantulas since you've been 3? Um...
> ...


                                I DId Get My First T When I Was 9 Then I Got My Second When I Was 11 On My Birthday (etc)


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## jigalojey (Jan 20, 2015)

Worked with nasty old worlds for years
Can maintain conditions for high demanding species
Successfully hatched sacs including ones from tough species down here.
I'd go with advanced I guess.

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## Ghost Dragon (Jan 20, 2015)

I would have to say intermediate for myself.  Starting my fourth year in the hobby, with 25+ T's and one _L. Hesperus_.  Have had ups & downs (lost my P. met sling a couple of days ago), but overall it's been a great experience.  Everyone is getting bigger & more colourful every week, it seems.


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## vespers (Jan 20, 2015)

Chainsaw Reptil said:


> I DId Get My First T When I Was 9 Then I Got My Second When I Was 11 On My Birthday (etc)


Then you obviously _do not have_ 12 years of experience keeping tarantulas if you're 15. That statement was a lie.

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## TsunamiSpike (Jan 20, 2015)

Chainsaw Reptil said:


> I DId Get My First T When I Was 9 Then I Got My Second When I Was 11 On My Birthday (etc)


Really? Cause according to that youtube comment you're 12 and been keeping them since 1 when your dad got into them (your words)

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## IHeartTs (Jan 20, 2015)

I can see it now-- next on MTV it's Keeping up with the Arachnoboardians.

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## MrsHaas (Jan 20, 2015)

advan said:


> _Ephebopus_ always give me the pleasure.


My ephebopus always drips at me!


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## Biollantefan54 (Jan 20, 2015)

Guys, guys. His age CLEARLY makes sense....if you don't think about it. 
(Amazing Ephebopus shot by the way!)

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## Sam_Peanuts (Jan 20, 2015)

I'd say I'm intermediate even though I have over 12 years of experience and have been keeping OBTs for almost all of that time.

I'm sure I'd have no problem dealing with any kinf of T, but money and other factors(like being in canada) kept me from keeping a wide variety of species and I've been very unlucky in finding mature males for my breeding projects(some would say lucky since I got a couple of near adult females for pretty cheap) so I don't consider myself advanced until I've dealt with a lot more species.

Now that those problems are mostly sorted, I sure do plan on expanding my collection quite a bit, especially towards old world since OBTs have been a favorite of mine and pokies are now affordable and I definitely want to put even more efforts in breeding(and, of course, now that I don't have an adult OBT female anymore, I was almost given a mature male when I went to buy a female for future breeding).


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## gypsy cola (Jan 21, 2015)

I've got a quite a lot of experience but I would consider myself Intermediate. Mostly because any thing that would be considered "advanced" I don't do anymore.

More of a casual hobby now. 
No more breeding, no more handling, no more enclosure sensitive species. 

only one spider I desire now. N. vulpines
I will occasionally do a breeding loan but only so I can get a couple of slings. Which I end up giving away to friends and family. 
I only charge someone if I'm hesitant about that individual. So they can "appreciate" that particular T.


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## LythSalicaria (Jan 21, 2015)

As of March I will have been in the hobby for a year, and in that time I've done exhaustive research on husbandry and care for individual species that I want to take on in the future. The most important thing I've learned is that you can collect as much theoretical knowledge as you want, it is definitely valuable, but it doesn't compare to hands-on experience. Based on that, I consider myself a beginner, and I will continue to identify myself as such until I've reached a few important milestones:

-successfully raising several Ts from slings to adulthood
-successfully breeding Ts that I have raised
-successfully incubating an egg-sac

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## skippydude (Jan 21, 2015)

LythSalicaria said:


> -successfully raising several Ts from slings to adulthood
> -successfully breeding Ts that I have raised
> -successfully incubating an egg-sac


I've accomplished all of these things and I am still 2 steps below beginner :sarcasm:

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## cold blood (Jan 21, 2015)

skippydude said:


> I've accomplished all of these things and I am still 2 steps below beginner :sarcasm:


One day you'll be ready...one day.:laugh:

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## bscheidt1020 (Jan 21, 2015)

Newbie. I have no adults. All of my spider friends are youngsters. I am seemingly unwilling to not raise my spiders from slings. I do think it has helped with some of my more dodgey characters to get used to them as they grow.


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