# Beginner old world T?



## jdoolittle761 (May 28, 2017)

Thinking of either a Pterinochilus murinus or Cyriopagopus lividus. Any suggestions are appreciated. I was also thinking about getting a scorpion like the heterometrus.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## WeightedAbyss75 (May 28, 2017)

Both of those are VERY defensive T's that are not afraid to bolt or bite, given the opporitunity. For a starter OW, you may want to think about an A. enzendami or a Ceratogyrus species. They tend to be a little more calm than the ones you mentioned, and are also pretty cool  If you do decide to go with an OBT, which is the one I started with, just be *extremely* careful. Take all precautions with any OW. Btw, what T's have you owned NW wise? It may be in your best interest to work with a fast or defensive NW with less potent venom. All I can say is be very careful with OW, they can be a hand-full and can out you in the hospital

Reactions: Agree 2 | Helpful 1


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## Nightstalker47 (May 28, 2017)

jdoolittle761 said:


> Thinking of either a Pterinochilus murinus or Cyriopagopus lividus. Any suggestions are appreciated. I was also thinking about getting a scorpion like the heterometrus.


I wouldn't consider those beginner OW species, I could recommend A.ezendami or something out of the Ceratogyrus genus. Although it isn't an OW, P.cambridgei make for an excellent T to bridge over to OW, if you can handle that you should be fine to try out some other stuff. The other two OW species you mentioned are super defensive and among the most feisty OW species available, they pack a punch venom wise and can be quite difficult to work with.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Helpful 1 | Love 1


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## jdoolittle761 (May 28, 2017)

I have had my LP for 6 months and I'm looking for another T. I have no desire to hold poke or prod and tarantula unless it has escaped.


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## Andrea82 (May 28, 2017)

Nope, those species are NOT beginner OW species. 

E.pachypus, A.ezendami, Ceratogyrus are beginner OW species.

Reactions: Agree 4 | Helpful 1


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## jdoolittle761 (May 28, 2017)

So both of you have suggested an a ezendami I will look more into that. I understand the dangers of an old world and I think I can handle it. Like I said I don't intend to bother them other than to change substrate which is the only time I can see them attempting to escape or to bite

*edit* all 3 of you

Reactions: Like 2


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## Nightstalker47 (May 28, 2017)

jdoolittle761 said:


> I have had my LP for 6 months and I'm looking for another T. I have no desire to hold poke or prod and tarantula unless it has escaped.


Of course, but 6 months with an LP won't prepare you for a super defensive OW with potent venom. Stick to NW for now...

I'd try the P.cambridgei first, they are awesome Ts and should warm you up for a future OW species, they aren't as venomous but can still be quite a handful. Why go for an OW so early? If you've only worked with L.parahybana you need to experience some arboreal speed and tendencies before you take the plunge to OW spiders.

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 2


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## basin79 (May 28, 2017)

Idiothele mira. Absolutely stunning little T's and if they're out and about (they're trap door tarantulas) they'd sooner run back to the safety of their burrow.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 3


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## Moakmeister (May 28, 2017)

Try the Pelinobius muticus. Huge, thick back legs, and although they are highly defensive, they don't run, instead they just sit in the same spot and hiss.

Reactions: Agree 3


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## jdoolittle761 (May 28, 2017)

Nightstalker47 you're right I should just go for a faster nw t instead of running in blind with ow

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 3 | Award 2


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## Andrea82 (May 28, 2017)

Moakmeister said:


> Try the Pelinobius muticus. Huge, thick back legs, and although they are highly defensive, they don't run, instead they just sit in the same spot and hiss.


They do run. Towards you. 
Unless a sling, I wouldn't recommend the Queen yet after only owning an Lp for six months. 



jdoolittle761 said:


> So both of you have suggested an a ezendami I will look more into that. I understand the dangers of an old world and I think I can handle it. Like I said I don't intend to bother them other than to change substrate which is the only time I can see them attempting to escape or to bite
> 
> *edit* all 3 of you


Well, no. It can try to bite and escape EVERY time you open the enclosure to be honest.


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## Andrea82 (May 28, 2017)

jdoolittle761 said:


> Nightstalker47 you're right I should just go for a faster nw t instead of running in blind with ow


If you want some practice with a defensive and or fast terrestrial species instead of a Psalmopoeus, a Phormictopus species or Ephebopus species are options, although they may already be a little over your head if you have only a Lp for practice...

Reactions: Agree 1


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## jdoolittle761 (May 28, 2017)

So besides the p cambridgei are there any other nw ts that can help me gain more experience with tendencies and speed of ow


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## jdoolittle761 (May 28, 2017)

Andrea82 said:


> If you want some practice with a defensive and or fast terrestrial species instead of a Psalmopoeus, a Phormictopus species or Ephebopus species are options, although they may already be a little over your head if you have only a Lp for practice...


My lp isn't too calm she's flicked hairs at me just for opening her cage to change water and tries to attack anything that moves


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## jdoolittle761 (May 28, 2017)

I  suppose you're right though hair flicking is nothing compared to an ow


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## Walker253 (May 28, 2017)

There are several OW's that are a more suitable choice than the P murinus or C lividus. Granted, they about the best looking imo, but  the chances of being overwhelmed are there. C darlingi, C marshalli, P muticus are some good possible choices.  P lugardi and E pachypus are good if you can find them. They are a bit less common in the US.

As far as speedy NW's, other than Psalmopoeus, Tapinauchenius species are lightning fast. As far as a fossorial NW, look at Ephebopus. Maybe an E murinus would be a good choice. It's quick and acts very OW.


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## mack1855 (May 28, 2017)

You have a whole lineup of very cool NW,s you haven't looked into.


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## basin79 (May 28, 2017)

jdoolittle761 said:


> I  suppose you're right though hair flicking is nothing compared to an ow


Get a spider YOU want rather than one you think you need.

I do know my opinion on OW tarantulas isn't really liked but they're tarantulas. They are not a gaboon viper. They're not a black mamba or bush master.

If you've gone 6 months without incident there's absolutely no need to think you'll get nailed by an OW.

Commonsense, 12" tongs, a catch up. If you make an hole directly over the water dish and another away from it large enough to put a cricket through you don't even need to open the lid if the T isn't hiding away.

Personally (and yes I do have experience now but did have to start somewhere) I'd sooner get a threat posture off one of my OW's than a face full of hairs off one of my NW's.

EDIT
I'd also like to add that OW's aren't the end game. They're just tarantulas. I get tarantulas I like the look of.

Reactions: Like 4 | Agree 4 | Disagree 2


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## Venom1080 (May 28, 2017)

Terrestrial baboons are the best starter OW. Asians are another level.

Reactions: Agree 4


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## JoshDM020 (May 28, 2017)

Id like to comment on the bit about changing substrate. The only time you need to do that is if you have a serious infestation of mites or some other "parasite" like that. Or if you're rehousing. Substrate doesnt go bad. If you clean out boli and poop on a regular basis, substrate has been commonly known to last decades.

Reactions: Like 3 | Sad 1


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## Walker253 (May 28, 2017)

Venom1080 said:


> Terrestrial baboons are the best starter OW. Asians are another level.


The C lividus (H lividum) is a whole new level of insanity. I got 2 a couple weeks ago, my first. Even the half inch sling is possessed, lol. My LP was one of my first, that did nothing to get me ready. 
If the OP would have just said OBT, I could have said maybe and here's how. The lividus changes the dynamic and says to me at least the original idea was looks based.


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## viper69 (May 28, 2017)

jdoolittle761 said:


> Thinking of either...


What were you thinking???



Best OW beginners are Ceratogyrus, then I mira., M. balfouri are good too.

Best transitional species would be from the Psalmo genus.

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Walker253 (May 28, 2017)

viper69 said:


> What were you thinking???
> 
> Best OW beginners are Ceratogyrus, then I mira.
> 
> Best transitional species would be from the Psalmo genus.


It's funny on the surface, but is a serious question as well

Don't know where the extra quote  came from

Reactions: Like 1


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## viper69 (May 28, 2017)

jdoolittle761 said:


> My lp isn't too calm she's flicked hairs at me just for opening her cage to change water and tries to attack anything that moves



My boehmei and emilia do this all the time, and are far more easier to deal with than a OW species all things being equal.


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## viper69 (May 28, 2017)

Walker253 said:


> It's funny on the surface, but is a serious question as well
> 
> Don't know where the extra quote  came from



Indeed. The extra came after I added in info to help the OP. I wanted to say a few other things too hahah.


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## viper69 (May 28, 2017)

jdoolittle761 said:


> So besides the p cambridgei are there any other nw ts that can help me gain more experience with tendencies and speed of ow



Speed - sure, more potent venom than Psalmo, none.

Speed- Tapis are regarded as the fastest Ts out there

Anything out of the Ephebopus genus is lightning on land, HIGHLY nervous.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Stella Maris (May 28, 2017)

basin79 said:


> Idiothele mira. Absolutely stunning little T's and if they're out and about (they're trap door tarantulas) they'd sooner run back to the safety of their burrow.


My I. mira sling, Scooter, got rehoused recently. I dug a little pre-made burrow for him and less than a day later, he has made that burrow his hiding place! I love how adorable he is!

I second the fact that Idiothele mira and Ceratogyrus darlingi make great beginner OW species. I have both and they are great baboon spiders!

Reactions: Like 1


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## Hoshnobobo (May 28, 2017)

I bought a big collection of Ts a few weeks back that includes a 4"+ Cyriopagopus lividus. I did not like the enclosure it was in and decided to rehouse, I opened the lid and touched a paint brush to the webbing just inside the enclosure, I burst out and ran up my arm holding the lid of the enclosure, up the center of my face and down my back then fell on the floor. I was super lucky not to get bit but I would not recommend this species to anyone as a starter. I have 2 Obts that as long as long as I'm smart about it are pretty easy to deal with.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 3


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## Hoshnobobo (May 28, 2017)

I have been impressed with how calm the King Baboons have been during feeding and maintenance, they ALL suck during rehousing Though, I just prefer new worlds in general


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## Ungoliant (May 28, 2017)

Nightstalker47 said:


> I'd try the P.cambridgei first, they are awesome Ts and should warm you up for a future OW species, they aren't as venomous but can still be quite a handful.


_Psalmopoeus_ are dangerous. You might get one and like it so much you never even want an OW.

Reactions: Funny 5


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## basin79 (May 28, 2017)

Ungoliant said:


> _Psalmopoeus_ are dangerous. You might get them and like them so much you never even want an OW.


How could you possibly not want a H.mac?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Venom1080 (May 28, 2017)

basin79 said:


> My Heteropoda lunula puts my p
> 
> 
> How could you possibly not want a H.mac?


Because they hide all the time. Even in my collection, I rarely see mine out.

Reactions: Award 1


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## basin79 (May 28, 2017)

Venom1080 said:


> Because they hide all the time. Even in my collection, I rarely see mine out.


I see my lass out almost every night. She's either on her cork bark or on the door.

That typed a tarantula that hides isn't a valid reason to not want one.


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## GreyPsyche (May 28, 2017)

Oh, man...

H Maculata and C Lividus are such beauties. Top two on my wish list...


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## Venom1080 (May 28, 2017)

basin79 said:


> I see my lass out almost every night. She's either on her cork bark or on the door.
> 
> That typed a tarantula that hides isn't a valid reason to not want one.


Yes it is, I like spiders I can see. I see my girl out a few times a week as well. Might just have to get her a new cage. Regardless, i never want another. One female is more than enough.
@GreyPsyche  what? I love Heteroscodra. One is enough for me though.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Disagree 1


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## Jason B (May 28, 2017)

In my experience obts aren't really as bad as their name would leave you to believe Cyriopagopus lividus though, honestly if they spent more time out of their burrows and more time posing for pictures could easily be a blue bitey thing. I read one time on a forum  there were two species whos defensiveness could result in chase you down the hallway and they were Cyriopagopus lividus and Stromatopelma calceatum. Of course I don't really believe those stories..but,  I would never recommend Cyriopagopus lividus as an introduction to ow Ts. They can be easy to deal with because their fossorial but they carry some serious attitude.

Reactions: Optimistic 1


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## BishopiMaster (May 28, 2017)

Jason B said:


> In my experience obts aren't really as bad as their name would leave you to believe Cyriopagopus lividus though, honestly if they spent more time out of their burrows and more time posing for pictures could easily be a blue bitey thing. I read one time on a forum  there were two species whos defensiveness could result in chase you down the hallway and they were Cyriopagopus lividus and Stromatopelma calceatum. Of course I don't really believe those stories..but,  I would never recommend Cyriopagopus lividus as an introduction to ow Ts. They can be easy to deal with because their fossorial but they carry some serious attitude.


At least note that stromatopelma calceatum is among the hottest of the t's


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## GreyPsyche (May 28, 2017)

Venom1080 said:


> Yes it is, I like spiders I can see. I see my girl out a few times a week as well. Might just have to get her a new cage. Regardless, i never want another. One female is more than enough.
> @GreyPsyche  what? I love Heteroscodra. One is enough for me though.


One is never enough!
I'm kidding, I don't mind if I can't see a T very often cause it makes it worth while when I do especially a H. Mac, I don't know why but I LOVE the look of a female H Mac...WOW.

But I disagreed with what you said about being able to see them, it really makes it worth it in an annoying but suspenseful sort of way when you finally do get a sighting.

I think I stated it above but I love the difference survival tactics that different OWs use from web curtains to camouflage. It's just another perspective I guess.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## kevinlowl (May 28, 2017)

Nightstalker47 said:


> I'd try the P.cambridgei firs


But they're ugly

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Venom1080 (May 28, 2017)

kevinlowl said:


> But they're ugly


 they get better with size.


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## Jason B (May 28, 2017)

BishopiMaster said:


> At least note that stromatopelma calceatum is among the hottest of the t's


And there speed is nothing to sniff at either, I have two slings prolly half an inch housed in 32 oz delis and have witnessed a startled one jump from one side of the deli to the next and proceeded to do a few laps. It challenging just to follow them with your eyes let alone try to react.


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## kevinlowl (May 28, 2017)

Venom1080 said:


> they get better with size.


I guess grey is a cool color


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## Python (May 29, 2017)

Mileage may vary but out of all the lividus I've had over the years, and I've had quite a few, I didn't consider any of them to be particularly troublesome. I had the one escape artist, but I've never had a close call with one and I went straight from rosies to lividus. 
Back then, the only thing available to me were adults, there were no slings in my neck of the woods so all I've ever had experience with were adults, most likely wild caught. They were all pet holes anyway. Deep substrate and they tunnel to the bottom and they stay there. The only time I ever saw most of them was when they came up to the surface to eat and that was rarely. Most of the time the crickets I put in ran straight down the hole, never to be seen or heard from again. It's not that hard to avoid being attacked by a hole in the ground. Just stay away from the hole. The only time to worry is during a transfer or some other situation where you need to get the thing out of the hole and even then mine only stood their ground and bit anything that got within range. They never tried to climb or leap at my throat or anything. 
That said, they are fast and grumpy so caution is definitely warranted but with a bit of care I don't see a problem with them being a first OW.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## cold blood (May 29, 2017)

jdoolittle761 said:


> So besides the p cambridgei are there any other nw ts that can help me gain more experience with tendencies and speed of ow


T. ockerti













ockerti



__ cold blood
__ May 28, 2017
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						young female T. ockerti
					



Nhandu sp.












Nhandu



__ cold blood
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						freshly molted N. coloratovillsus
					
















Resized952017040395213537



__ cold blood
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						2" tripeppii
					
















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__ cold blood
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P. cancerides...nasty disposition












20170419_000909



__ cold blood
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						P. cancerides
					




Pamphobetus sp.












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__ cold blood
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						nigricolor.

Gotta love Pamphs!!
					




P. irminia












20170421_224427



__ cold blood
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						AF irminia
					
















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__ cold blood
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						irminia
					






kevinlowl said:


> But they're ugly


I find P. cambridgei to be one of the better looking spiders.  Green is the rarest T color...calm disposition, ravenous eaters, fast growers, and great display spiders as they grow.  Probably my overall favorite species...and they're cheap, so there's no reason not to own several.












Psalmopoeus cambridgei



__ cold blood
__ Mar 11, 2017
__ 7
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cambridgei
psalmopoeus
psalmopoeus cambridgei
trinidad chevron tarantula




						cam...the camster..the caminator, the cam-meister...Dr. Camenstein...Cam-a-lama-ding-dong...mass...
					
















Resized952017030395145946



__ cold blood
__ Mar 3, 2017
__ 3



						cam dumpster
					




As for an entry OW, I like the A. ezendami as well...fast, but also not difficult to work with...can be defensive, but generally, they're not.  Plus they look great.












Resized952017030795222820



__ cold blood
__ Mar 8, 2017
__ 3

Reactions: Like 5 | Agree 2 | Award 1


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## Ungoliant (May 29, 2017)

kevinlowl said:


> But they're ugly


I like the fluffy legs and olive-tinged coloring of the adult _Psalmopoeus cambridgei_. Moreover, interesting behavior can, in my opinion, compensate for less vibrant coloring.


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## GreyPsyche (May 29, 2017)

My gf has a P Cam sling, I think I've seen it twice in a blur, it does have awesome behavior though. I can see the legs sticking out right now for the first time in a month or more.


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## Andrea82 (May 29, 2017)

GreyPsyche said:


> My gf has a P Cam sling, I think I've seen it twice in a blur, it does have awesome behavior though. I can see the legs sticking out right now for the first time in a month or more.


They become more visible as they grow bigger . 
It is one of those species that has to be seen irl to appreciate it. Pictures don't do it justice at all.

Reactions: Agree 4


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## basin79 (May 29, 2017)

Venom1080 said:


> Yes it is, I like spiders I can see. I see my girl out a few times a week as well. Might just have to get her a new cage. Regardless, i never want another. One female is more than enough.
> @GreyPsyche  what? I love Heteroscodra. One is enough for me though.


Aye I understand your point. I love my lass but wouldn't want more than 1.

Reactions: Like 1


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## EulersK (May 29, 2017)

cold blood said:


> Nhandu sp.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


No joke. N. coloratovillosus and P. cancerides are hands down the most willing to bite out of my collection, easily beating out the likes of H. maculata and P. sp. "Black". And for large spiders, they're not exactly slow either.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Vermis (May 29, 2017)

My first Ts were actually a pair of P. cambridgei slings. I won't deny there were a couple of teleportation incidents, but they were generally calm and I grew and bred them without too much trouble. Ditto when I eventually got an OBT and a pokie, though the former was definitely more prickly. (Would be odd if it wasn't) I don't know if or why I got lucky, but they had room and decent hides in their tubs, and I had 12" tweezers and a healthy respect - partly a result of buying them as slings. I got to witness the speed or aggression when they were still relatively small and harmless.
I'd say that I don't expect my experience to match anyone else (especially after reading the bite reports here) but also that my old world Ts were some of my favourites. If I'm getting back into keeping, I'm going for an OBT first. 



cold blood said:


> I find P. cambridgei to be one of the better looking spiders.  Green is the rarest T color...calm disposition, ravenous eaters, fast growers, and great display spiders as they grow.  Probably my overall favorite species...and they're cheap, so there's no reason not to own several.


That! Don't forget the orange toes.


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## Python (May 29, 2017)

I think the closest calls I've ever had came from a P. irminia and an OBT. Those are the only two I've ever had that actually came after me. They were both super fast and had no problem climbing things to get to me. Those were the only two though. I've had other ones that weren't nearly as aggressive in their defense as these two were. In fact, it was one of the things that made me fall in love with irminias in the first place (aside from the velvety black and those awesome lightning bolts). One of my favorites.


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## Nightstalker47 (May 29, 2017)

kevinlowl said:


> But they're ugly


Not at all, they are very attractive looking spiders, for their price/coolness ratio you can't go wrong. You need to rethink your life lol  
http://arachnoboards.com/gallery/p-cambridgei.40990/

http://arachnoboards.com/gallery/p-cambridgei.40841/

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1 | Love 1


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## kevinlowl (May 29, 2017)

Nightstalker47 said:


> Not at all, they are very attractive looking spiders, for their price/coolness ratio you can't go wrong. You need to rethink your life lol
> http://arachnoboards.com/gallery/p-cambridgei.40990/
> 
> http://arachnoboards.com/gallery/p-cambridgei.40841/


Now your pictures really brings out their beauty. Good job with those shots. I want to see one IRL.


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## The Grym Reaper (May 29, 2017)

jdoolittle761 said:


> My lp isn't too calm she's flicked hairs at me just for opening her cage to change water and tries to attack anything that moves


Mine kicks hairs like it's her one job in life and bolts from anything that isn't food.



Ungoliant said:


> _Psalmopoeus_ are dangerous. You might get one and like it so much you never even want an OW.


Hahaha, I love my Psalmos although, to be fair, there aren't that many OW species that I'm interested in owning anyway.



basin79 said:


> How could you possibly not want a H.mac?


That's a long way off for me.



jdoolittle761 said:


> So besides the p cambridgei are there any other nw ts that can help me gain more experience with tendencies and speed of ow


Any Psalmopoeus sp. - Fast, can be defensive & have more potent venom than other NW (but nowhere near as potent as OW venom).
Any Nhandu sp. - Fast & can be defensive.
Any Ephebopus sp. - Stupidly fast & can be defensive.
Any Phormictopus sp. - Fast & extremely bad-tempered.
Any Tapinauchenius sp. - See Psalmopoeus, swap "fast" for "teleporters".
Any Pamphobeteus sp. - Fast & can be defensive.

Try any of those for a bit, if you can keep any of them without incident then you're well on your way to getting an OW.

Reactions: Like 2 | Helpful 1


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## Andrea82 (May 29, 2017)

A word if caution for the Tapinauchenius though....this genus is considered the fastest of the Theraphosidae family. Faster than any OW too. 
Luckily, they have weaker venom, and are, aside from T.gigas, generally not defensive. 
But I would not recommend this genus as a second T after a L.parahybana. 
I'm quick to support intentions if keeping and breeding them, I absolutely love them, and they are beautiful with their velvety colours, but not as a second T. A member of this genus can do laps around your L.parahybana with only four legs and still being a bolt.


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## BishopiMaster (May 29, 2017)

The best beginner old world t, which mirrors old world t's, is p. cambridgei or p irminia, definitely


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## GreyPsyche (May 29, 2017)

Andrea82 said:


> They become more visible as they grow bigger .
> It is one of those species that has to be seen irl to appreciate it. Pictures don't do it justice at all.


I've learned that pictures RARELY do Ts any justice at all.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Jason B (May 29, 2017)

GreyPsyche said:


> I've learned that pictures RARELY do Ts any justice at all.


Exception to this would be P. Metallica who often look better in pictures then they do under a more natural light.

Reactions: Sad 1


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## wonderfvl (Jun 25, 2017)

basin79 said:


> Get a spider YOU want rather than one you think you need.


1+ on this.

I began with Grammostola & Brachys & L para. After 12 months or so, I got 5 obt slings.  Loved them.  Best advice I had when doing a cage change or packing them up to ship is doing it in the bath tub with your catch cup.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Kelvin Lee (Jun 25, 2017)

My very first T was an OBT. Thought it was so cute just sitting there minding her own business. Got home, wanted to transfer her to a new house. A bleeding hand, spilled substrate and ripped-out electrical trunking later, she was... happily relocated. Learnt to respect OW tarantulas a lot more from that day on. That was 12 years ago, I still keep OBTs now

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## IamKrush (Jul 15, 2017)

jdoolittle761 said:


> Thinking of either a Pterinochilus murinus or Cyriopagopus lividus. Any suggestions are appreciated. I was also thinking about getting a scorpion like the heterometrus.


I. Mira. It will run if anything.


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