# Do Ts Recognize?



## Skull Kid (Oct 25, 2011)

Hey everyone! I've been thinking about this lately;perhaps a bit too deeply at that..do tarantulas recognize? Say, example, their owner? I've heard of some Ts that are sweethearts to their owners but are defensive around others that are not..I know they have feelings, but from what I know, they aren't a very..(I want to say loving, but that's probably not the right word) arachnid at all..at least to their babies (Not all, perhaps!). What is your thoughts on the matter? It's just something that's been my hot topic, nothing major.


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## Sage (Oct 25, 2011)

It's really strange but I've gotten into the habit of talking every time I take off the lid to feed my Chilean rose.  Just say a 'hey there buddy'  like any stereotypical female around her pets and he thinks twice before scurrying off to hide.  So maybe he's learned to connect the sound of my voice + lid being removed = food?  A shot in the dark I know but hey it made me think.  c:


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## Shell (Oct 25, 2011)

No, I do not believe that tarantulas can learn to recognize us, or be tamed etc etc. They just do not possess the brain or thought capacity to do this. An inverts brain is very simple compared to that of mammals, or even reptiles.


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## Hobo (Oct 25, 2011)

Ts, U betta recognize!!!

Reactions: Like 3 | Funny 3


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## Skull Kid (Oct 25, 2011)

@Sage: I do the same with my rosie. Sometimes I end up talking to her, too, like saying, "Hey sweetheart, how are you?" or "You're so cute, I swear." or "I love you, silly spider!" It's probably abnormal or even inhuman to some people, but I don't care! :]

@Shell: I was thinking along those lines, too, but it's fun to think that they can..LOL

@Hobo: You win the internet.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Sage (Oct 25, 2011)

I laughed.  Good job Hobo.

I know I do that too as weird as it sounds.  But whenever the lid pops off and then I talk?  I swear he waits for crickets.  Any other time he's probably like 'please just be quiet'.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Louis Winthorpe III (Oct 25, 2011)

Sounds like a Pavlovian response to me. When I had a lateralis colony, they would all come crawling out of their tubes because they knew they were about to be fed.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Sage (Oct 25, 2011)

Pavlov's dogs, good stuff!  But yeah same concept.  Doesn't mean I'm loved, just means I remind something of food.  Better than nothin!  ;D

Reactions: Like 1


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## Amoeba (Oct 25, 2011)

Here is some good reading pertaining to this: http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?108108-Do-tarantula-s-have-brains


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## synyster (Oct 25, 2011)

Mothra said:


> Hey everyone! I've been thinking about this lately;perhaps a bit too deeply at that..do tarantulas recognize?


No



Mothra said:


> Say, example, their owner?


No



Mothra said:


> I've heard of some Ts that are sweethearts to their owners but are defensive around others that are not..


No



Mothra said:


> I know they have feelings,


Sorry, but no



Mothra said:


> but from what I know, they aren't a very..(I want to say loving, but that's probably not the right word) arachnid at all..at least to their babies (Not all, perhaps!).


They will eat their offspring if left too long together



Mothra said:


> What is your thoughts on the matter?


Spiders do not recognize or have feelings



Mothra said:


> It's just something that's been my hot topic, nothing major.


Glad I could help

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## Skull Kid (Oct 26, 2011)

@synyster: So stress isn't a feeling? I found the response hopelessly smart-alec, mate. 8/ Kinda made me feel stupid.

@Amoeba: On the other hand, thanks for the thread, it really helped!

Reactions: Like 2


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## Popsmoke63B (Oct 26, 2011)

It's ok to make believe or even entertain the thought. My Ts offer me the chance to care for, and learn alot. It's a fun and theraputic hobby for me. The fact is, that they don't have the brain capacity for compassion (for lack of better choice of a word). I love my Ts though, and that's all that counts! It's fun to have an imagination every once in a while too!

Reactions: Like 2


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## Shell (Oct 26, 2011)

Stress to us, is a feeling. An animal, especially an invert is not going to feel stress the same way we do, so still not a "feeling" but a reaction to something possibly threatening in their environment. There's quite a big difference.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## synyster (Oct 26, 2011)

Mothra said:


> @synyster: So stress isn't a feeling? I found the response hopelessly smart-alec, mate. 8/ Kinda made me feel stupid


Shell quoted about the stress factor and did it pretty well so I don't need to elaborate.

As for the original reply, it wasn't intended or oriented in a way to make you feel stupid but more in a humorous way of pointing out that they do not possess intelligence or recognition of humans, and were clearly my thoughts about the question. But sorry if you did feel stupid. As for smart-alec, I don't quite know what that means but I guess it's somewhere along the lines of your post. 

Your the one who asked for our thoughts in your post, and don't appreciate the way I gave mine. Don't blame me...


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## synyster (Oct 26, 2011)

*Msg double posted*


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## Skull Kid (Oct 26, 2011)

@Popsmoke: Exactly my thoughts, mate!

@Shell: I never quite thought of it like that, thanks for the brainfood :]

@synyster: I apologize, it's just a bit hard to tell via internet, and plus, I haven't felt all that well lately anyway..I thank you for clarifying, though.


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## synyster (Oct 26, 2011)

Mothra said:


> @synyster: I apologize, it's just a bit hard to tell via internet, and plus, I haven't felt all that well lately anyway..I thank you for clarifying, though.


No biggie

Reactions: Like 1


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## Shell (Oct 26, 2011)

Mothra said:


> @Shell: I never quite thought of it like that, thanks for the brainfood :]


Glad I could help.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Walk Alone (Oct 26, 2011)

I believe that tarantulas can relate the opening of a lid with receiving prey.  For example, some will come out of their burrows knowing that food is on the way as opposed to running to their burrows when they are startled.

But as far as who is actually providing the food - they have no clue.  In fact, I'm pretty sure my cats dont either.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Shell (Oct 26, 2011)

Walk Alone said:


> I believe that tarantulas can relate the opening of a lid with receiving prey.  For example, some will come out of their burrows knowing that food is on the way as opposed to running to their burrows when they are startled.
> 
> But as far as who is actually providing the food - they have no clue.  In fact, I'm pretty sure my cats dont either.


I don't personally believe that it means they are associating the opening of the lid with food, more that they feel the vibrations of their territory being disturbed and are coming to "check it out." Some are just more bold than others, so instead of hiding, they respond to the vibrations/disturbance differently. Just my opinion.

Reactions: Agree 3


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## jim777 (Oct 26, 2011)

Fun thread. My fish go nuts when I walk into the room with their tanks, because they know I'm the one who feeds them and they recognize me. They ignore my daughters and just keep living their fishy days when they walk in the room though. But when I walk in, it's 'Everyone to the top left of the tank!" I don't get anything remotely similar from the T's, but that's fine. The fish are happy to see me, I'm happy to see the T's, it all works out in the end


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## goodoldneon (Oct 26, 2011)

Well, given the fact that my B smithi has not taken a meal while in my custody – which, we’re up to three months now – I’m beginning to suspect that she has decided, as have I (going on 20 years now),my wife and our five year old daughter, to become a vegetarian. Which, if true, bespeaks a degree of compassion unheard of within the arachnid community. Rather than like, eat stuff, as they evolved to do (in fact, one of the only things they do when they’re pretty much not doing anything else) , she runs and/or backs away from anything that resembles, smells or “feels” like “meat” – in this case, crickets or superworms. 

If her hunger strike continues, I’m going to plan B, a big fat Greek salad.


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## skar (Oct 26, 2011)

My tarantula waved hi to me then reached for a hug. I said no !! You don't have feelings this poll said so .
Strange.. as I closed the lid there was a drop of liquid on it's eye.

Reactions: Like 1


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## boxofsorrows (Oct 26, 2011)

skar said:


> My tarantula waved hi to me then reached for a hug. I said no !! You don't have feelings this poll said so .
> Strange.. as I closed the lid there was a drop of liquid on it's eye.


LOL!  
Funny, I was actually watching this thread a couple of times today expecting someone to comment about their OBT coming out looking for a hug...

Of course spiders don't have feelings, but it's only the males, insensitive pigs, that's why most of the females get so moody after mating...


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## ijmccollum (Oct 26, 2011)

skar said:


> My tarantula waved hi to me then reached for a hug. I said no !! You don't have feelings this poll said so .
> Strange.. as I closed the lid there was a drop of liquid on it's eye.


double "LOL"!


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## BlackVenom (Oct 27, 2011)

Visually recognize something, no I doubt. Now becoming familiar with certain vibrations and associating those vibrations with certain things like food, predators, etc. is unknown really. Now in my opinion yes, I think they can. It would be really cool to see someone start a scientific study on this.


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## vickywild (Oct 27, 2011)

Hobo said:


> Ts, U betta recognize!!!


Dude. I'm sat in English because I've finished my assignment. Thanks for the big giant laugh that just came out of my mouth.


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## thruthetrees (Oct 27, 2011)

Some of mine seem to recognize when it is feeding time... One in particular, when I open the lid comes out of the burrow, to the edge of the deli and waits for the food to drop...  I believe it recognizes that every time the lid opens, food arrives. When I move the deli, it doesn't come out (I have to move it to open it...) so I really think it recognizes the difference between meal time and just getting moved. That one is a 1/2" B. vagans sling. 

I also *think* that my very first T, a 4" female P. irminia knows when *I* am spying on her... She comes a bit out of her web (just so I can see her first legs and palps and, eyes... and I swear, she is glaring at me like, "What are YOU looking at!!" I am the only one that seems to happen with when looking at her enclosure. 

Maybe they can recognize people's energy or auras (probably going to get a lotta flack for that mention...) but who knows what Ts can, or cannot perceive... Just my thoughts...


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## zonbonzovi (Oct 27, 2011)

Yeah you know the name of the game.  Warning, gratuitous use of bad grammar(and language):

[YOUTUBE]SgRVhvcdMoc[/YOUTUBE]

Reactions: Like 1


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## natebugman (Oct 27, 2011)

Shell said:


> An inverts brain is very simple compared to that of mammals, or even reptiles.


While I can't say that my tarantulas are rocket scientists, I can't say for sure what they do and don't know or understand. I do know they don't usually listen to what I tell them not to do, but maybe it's because they don't like the crickets I feed them or maybe it's because they don't have ears. This being said, you can't blame it on the "simplicity" of the invertebrate brain. Octopi (marine invertebrates) are intelligent enough to use tools, something that only some primates, certain birds, and dolphins have been shown to do. Cephalopod intelligence has been demonstrated in several other ways. Read this little article:http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/graphics/20100725_octopusGraphic/ or do a google search.


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## Shell (Oct 27, 2011)

natebugman said:


> While I can't say that my tarantulas are rocket scientists, I can't say for sure what they do and don't know or understand. I do know they don't usually listen to what I tell them not to do, but maybe it's because they don't like the crickets I feed them or maybe it's because they don't have ears. This being said, you can't blame it on the "simplicity" of the invertebrate brain. Octopi (marine invertebrates) are intelligent enough to use tools, something that only some primates, certain birds, and dolphins have been shown to do. Cephalopod intelligence has been demonstrated in several other ways. Read this little article:http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/graphics/20100725_octopusGraphic/ or do a google search.


I have read articles about it, but using tools is a far cry from recognizing, feeling etc. Not to mention, the Octopus is the only know invertabrate to exhibit this trait (at this time of course.) In general, an inverts brain is simple, yes, one type of invert does something that others don't, but to me, it's just not a valid enough argument. Combine the simplicty of the brain with general known tarantula behavior and I still stand by what I said.

But thanks for the reminder, the octopus is quite fascinating and its an interesting article to read.

Reactions: Like 1


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## High_Rolling_T (Oct 28, 2011)

Shell said:


> I have read articles about it, but using tools is a far cry from recognizing, feeling etc. Not to mention, the Octopus is the only know invertabrate to exhibit this trait (at this time of course.) In general, an inverts brain is simple, yes, one type of invert does something that others don't, but to me, it's just not a valid enough argument.


This is true.  That is equivalent of saying, look how smart human brains are; now extrapolate this to conclude that all invertebrates are of similar intelligence of humans.

Also, octopus rock.  They can learn quickly.  For example, if you place food in a jar and drop it in with them, it doesn't take them many attempts to figure out how to open the jar to get their food.  Not only do they figure this out, but the remember it for all consecutive tries!  There was a really good documentary on octopi, octopi learning, and octopi lives I watched a few years ago.  I don't remember which of the channels played it, but if I have some spare time, I'll try and find it somewhere online for everyone else.


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## Simon83 (Oct 28, 2011)

I dont know about recognising a specific person but I think they probably recognise patterns...usually when I got in from work my rose hair would come out of her hiding as she expected to be fed. Of course when it didn't happen she'd go back into her burrow, grumbling that I was a tease 

Oh and I totally talk to my t's...just things like 'hey baby'...'what are you doing?'


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## Shell (Oct 28, 2011)

High_Rolling_T said:


> There was a really good documentary on octopi, octopi learning, and octopi lives I watched a few years ago.  I don't remember which of the channels played it, but if I have some spare time, I'll try and find it somewhere online for everyone else.


I would love to see that if you can find it! My son has autism and ocean animals are his very favorite thing in the world, I know he would love to watch it with me.


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## pnshmntMMA (Oct 28, 2011)

Don't give them too much credit. They possess no smarts at all, pure instinct. No happy no sad, no recognition. Pure unadulterated ancient instinct.


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## High_Rolling_T (Oct 28, 2011)

Shell said:


> I would love to see that if you can find it! My son has autism and ocean animals are his very favorite thing in the world, I know he would love to watch it with me.


I'll give it a better looking for then! 



pnshmntMMA said:


> Don't give them too much credit. They possess no smarts at all, pure instinct. No happy no sad, no recognition. Pure unadulterated ancient instinct.


Bingo.

Quick Edit:
Shell,

I did a quick look and the top two documentaries regarding octopi are:
The Ultimate Guide: Octopus (Discovery Channel from 1998)
Aliens of the Deep Sea (CBC-TV)

As far as the one I saw, it was quite awhile ago and most likely the Discovery Channel one.  I don't know if you use torrents, but it appears there are some torrents for it out there.  Hopefully this helps!


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## catfishrod69 (Oct 28, 2011)

i watched a thing on tv about a octopus....they had him in one tank, and a crab or clam in a  jar in the next tank...the octopus climbed in the next tank unscrewed the jar, and food....also seen a big beauty playing with her light up ball...it would be awesome to own one that doesnt get big, and is brightly colored...


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## High_Rolling_T (Oct 28, 2011)

catfishrod69 said:


> i watched a thing on tv about a octopus....they had him in one tank, and a crab or clam in a  jar in the next tank...the octopus climbed in the next tank unscrewed the jar, and food....also seen a big beauty playing with her light up ball...it would be awesome to own one that doesnt get big, and is brightly colored...


That sounds familiar to what I watched, however that was quite awhile ago.  As far as changing color, all octopi can change color and patterns to the extreme.  Amazing creatures


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## Shell (Oct 28, 2011)

High_Rolling_T said:


> Quick Edit:
> Shell,
> 
> I did a quick look and the top two documentaries regarding octopi are:
> ...


Thanks  I'll see what I can find.


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## synyster (Oct 28, 2011)

Shell said:


> I would love to see that if you can find it! My son has autism and ocean animals are his very favorite thing in the world, I know he would love to watch it with me.


I'll search for one I saw too. I remember watching an episode where they would lock an octopus in a square tank, with two holes that connected tubes to the exit, or food. One of the holes would of course be too small for the octopus to get through and the other would be just ok. Now on the first attempt, the octopus would test the holes and eventually find the right one and escape, which took it a bit of time. But on several new attemps, it would go straight to the right hole and get through in a matter of seconds, proving they had memory. I'll search for it, but I'm pretty sure it's one of the same shows mentioned above


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## Shell (Oct 28, 2011)

synyster said:


> I'll search for one I saw too. I remember watching an episode where they would lock an octopus in a square tank, with two holes that connected tubes to the exit, or food. One of the holes would of course be too small for the octopus to get through and the other would be just ok. Now on the first attempt, the octopus would test the holes and eventually find the right one and escape, which took it a bit of time. But on several new attemps, it would go straight to the right hole and get through in a matter of seconds, proving they had memory. I'll search for it, but I'm pretty sure it's one of the same shows mentioned above


Very cool, thanks


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## catfishrod69 (Oct 28, 2011)

could have been the same thing..was a while ago..years...yeah they are gorgeous critters..a purple one with crazy designs would be cool....





High_Rolling_T said:


> That sounds familiar to what I watched, however that was quite awhile ago.  As far as changing color, all octopi can change color and patterns to the extreme.  Amazing creatures


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## BCscorp (Oct 28, 2011)

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20428-brainless-box-jellyfish-know-which-way-is-up.html


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## wonderfvl (Oct 29, 2011)

I said 'yes'.  But not to facial recognition.  I've had a few T's crawl on top of their fake leaf hides and attempt to "push" on their cage lids.  I'm sure some recognize that as a way out.  I have holes drilled on all four sides and top of the plexiglass cage, but the G. pulchra & G. aureostraita will just attempt to "push" the top open and not the sides.  If the T's sees the four sides as immovable but the lid as the way out, is that a form of recognition?  IDK....


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## High_Rolling_T (Oct 29, 2011)

BCscorp said:


> http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20428-brainless-box-jellyfish-know-which-way-is-up.html


Haha, I caught like 10 min of a documentary on box jellyfish the other night!  They did an experiment by submerging different color tubes in an empty tank with a box jelly.  The jelly would intentionally avoid the black tubes but couldn't tell white tubes were in its path.  I think it could also detect red and green tubes to lesser degrees.  Which is amazing since they have no visual receptors yet can clearly see shapes or dark color.


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## BCscorp (Oct 29, 2011)

^ I was looking for that vid but couldn't find it. They avoid the squid coloured tubes too iirc.
Anyways, I posted the link to show that there may be something more going on than what their physiology may suggest.


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## boxofsorrows (Oct 29, 2011)

Box jelly colour avoidance http://jeb.biologists.org/content/210/20/3616.full


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## Donny (Aug 6, 2013)

*Rosies*

I have 2 females, and one likes to be up, and gentle, the other tho doesn't, tries to run away... These are GOD'S creatures made for us. We, ...as humans are given Dominion over all creatures big or small, and yes, i believe they can feel and recognize. Donny


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## JadeWilliamson (Aug 6, 2013)

Donny said:


> I have 2 females, and one likes to be up, and gentle, the other tho doesn't, tries to run away... These are GOD'S creatures made for us. We, ...as humans are given Dominion over all creatures big or small, and yes, i believe they can feel and recognize. Donny


Do you have proof?

Reactions: Like 1


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## goodoldneon (Aug 6, 2013)

So much for science - empirical evidence, etc.

Reactions: Like 2


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## CakeLore (Aug 6, 2013)

I'm not willing to make a claim either way but it would not surprise me if they could learn to associate their owner's voice or the lid being removed with food via classical conditioning. Again this is only speculation and I wouldn't stake a claim without a controlled study.


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## Shrike (Aug 6, 2013)

Donny said:


> I have 2 females, and one likes to be up, and gentle, the other tho doesn't, tries to run away... These are GOD'S creatures made for us. We, ...as humans are given Dominion over all creatures big or small, and yes, i believe they can feel and recognize. Donny


Do you believe in time travel?  I do.  Here we are in good old 2011.  The temporal displacement occurred exactly 1:57 pm and zero seconds!

Reactions: Like 1


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## Will240393 (Aug 6, 2013)

No i believe they cannot my corn snake on the other hand has learned to recognise me and will come out of his hide to meet me on his feeding day.

---------- Post added 08-06-2013 at 08:14 PM ----------




Donny said:


> I have 2 females, and one likes to be up, and gentle, the other tho doesn't, tries to run away... These are GOD'S creatures made for us. We, ...as humans are given Dominion over all creatures big or small, and yes, i believe they can feel and recognize. Donny[/QUOTE
> 
> I'm guessing science means nothing to you?.


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## hearsemadam (Aug 6, 2013)

I believe that they can be conditioned.

All of mine can be viewed plastered to the fronts of their enclosures once I open the doors of the cabinet I keep them in.  Not one or two, but more than 20 do this.  Ive raised them all from tiny slings, so they are used to the feeding routine.  I find it cute.


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## vespers (Aug 6, 2013)

Donny said:


> I have 2 females, and one likes to be up, and gentle, the other tho doesn't, tries to run away... These are GOD'S creatures made for us. We, ...as humans are given Dominion over all creatures big or small, and yes, i believe they can feel and recognize. Donny


Let an OW species bite you and deliver some venom, then ask "god" why he made that spider just for you...

Reactions: Like 1


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## Equinox (Aug 6, 2013)

Spiders definitely do learn, they are not just pure instinct machines.
For example, I had a superworm bury itself in one of my spiders tubs. It emerged as an adult beetle. The spider attacked it the first time it walked past as a hardened adult, however could not get his fangs through the hard exterior. It dropped it. Next time it walked past it had another go, but again to no avail. I was slightly concerned about my siders fangs/breakage but it was fine.
Now this beetle has tarantula immunity. it can walk rings around my T and it doesn't look twice at it. So I did a little experiment.
I took the beetle out, and put a cricket in there.
The second the cricket walked past, BAM it picked it up without hesitation. 2 days later I put the beetle back in there. Amazingly the spider must have learnt the difference between the vibrations/visuals of a cricket and a beetle, as again the spider didn't move a muscle, even when the beetle started investigating one of the spiders legs.
I then put another cricket in there, just to check it wasn't anything to do with not being hungry etc....and again it took the cricket straight away.
This beetle has since been removed as I didn't want it pestering the spider. But goes to show, they definitely do learn from memory/past experiences as appose to purely acting on instinct.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Poec54 (Aug 6, 2013)

vespers said:


> Let an OW species bite you and deliver some venom, then ask "god" why he made that spider just for you...


Good example, we agree on something.  T's may be able to learn by developing a conditioned response to a certain set of stimulae, especially when food is involved (same way other animals learn), but T's do not recognize individual humans, nor form bonds with them.   These are simple-minded invertebrates, the vast majority of species are solitary and cannibalistic.  There's no room for friendships or love in their world; they don't go thru life looking for companionship.  As far as being 'God's creatures', let's keep that out of this.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## Equinox (Aug 6, 2013)

Poec54 said:


> Good example, we agree on something.  T's may be able to learn by developing a conditioned response to a certain set of stimulae, especially when food is involved (same way other animals learn), but T's do not recognize individual humans, nor form bonds with them.   These are simple-minded invertebrates, the vast majority of species are solitary and cannibalistic.  There's no room for friendships or love in their world; they don't go thru life looking for companionship.  As far as being 'God's creatures', let's keep that out of this.


+1. They have no need for recognition. Only social animals have been proven to need this sort of ability. Apart for 'recognising certain vibrations' eg beetles compared to crickets, and males tapping/vibrations compared to pray. They have no need for it.
And the thought that a spider has good enough eyesight to distinguish facial features from one human to another is ridiculous...

---------- Post added 08-06-2013 at 10:49 PM ----------

It is also for this reason that I haven't answered the poll.
When you say 'recognise'..you need to be more specific? If you mean 'recognise food'...then yes... if you mean 'recognise which type of boeing is flying over their enclosure'...then no...no they can;t

Reactions: Like 1


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## CakeLore (Aug 6, 2013)

Equinox said:


> Spiders definitely do learn, they are not just pure instinct machines.
> For example, I had a superworm bury itself in one of my spiders tubs. It emerged as an adult beetle. The spider attacked it the first time it walked past as a hardened adult, however could not get his fangs through the hard exterior. It dropped it. Next time it walked past it had another go, but again to no avail. I was slightly concerned about my siders fangs/breakage but it was fine.
> Now this beetle has tarantula immunity. it can walk rings around my T and it doesn't look twice at it. So I did a little experiment.
> I took the beetle out, and put a cricket in there.
> ...


I find this interesting as it does imply that the spider learned the beetle wasn't available as prey. If you still have the beetle you should try this with any other Ts you might have.

Reactions: Agree 1


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