# Sasquatch or big foot debate



## friendttyy (Jun 13, 2013)

Do you guys think that bigfoot exists. This is a hot debate topic around the word and I want to knownif you believe the exist and some reasons to support your answers. I say they do as there was a 16 sec documentary film.


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 13, 2013)

No, there is no evidence it exists.

Absence of evidence is, in fact, evidence of absence. Every single claim has been debunked.


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## freedumbdclxvi (Jun 13, 2013)

No, I do not think they do.


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## Pterror (Jun 13, 2013)

I live on Vancouver Island, which is also home to the most Sasquatch sightings/reports in the world. several investigations are done here on regular basis, that come up with nothing, the most solid belief is that Native indian shaman were sent into the wilderness for decades to learn survival skills, learn medicinal skills with plants, and other organisms, and of coarse "Be one with the nature gods", It is told that this sort of practice still goes on, and that they do wear furs for warmth and protection for the elements, so what people could actually be seeing out here is this. Indians in animal skins playing shaman...

Reactions: Like 2


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## freedumbdclxvi (Jun 13, 2013)

That is a pretty good explanation.


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 13, 2013)

freedumbdclxvi said:


> That is a pretty good explanation.


+1, I agree.

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Pterror said:


> I live on Vancouver Island, which is also home to the most Sasquatch sightings/reports in the world. several investigations are done here on regular basis, that come up with nothing, the most solid belief is that Native indian shaman were sent into the wilderness for decades to learn survival skills, learn medicinal skills with plants, and other organisms, and of coarse "Be one with the nature gods", It is told that this sort of practice still goes on, and that they do wear furs for warmth and protection for the elements, so what people could actually be seeing out here is this. Indians in animal skins playing shaman...


Bravo!  I like this post.


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## PerfectCircle (Jun 13, 2013)

I'd like to think they're real, but odds are no . I've heard you'd need to have thousands and thousands of them to maintain a population. Its fun to hear and see the "proof" though !!    
Sent from my RM-820_nam_att_100 using Board Express


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## ShredderEmp (Jun 13, 2013)

I believe very well that they are real, but I'm not going to explain why because much of it is just my opinion.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 13, 2013)

ShredderEmp said:


> I believe very well that they are real, but I'm not going to explain why because much of it is just my opinion.


Let's see it, even if it is opinion.

I'm guessing you believe in the lochness monster too


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## The Snark (Jun 13, 2013)

Pterror said:


> I live on Vancouver Island, which is also home to the most Sasquatch sightings/reports in the world. several investigations are done here on regular basis, that come up with nothing, the most solid belief is that Native indian shaman were sent into the wilderness for decades to learn survival skills, learn medicinal skills with plants, and other organisms, and of coarse "Be one with the nature gods", It is told that this sort of practice still goes on, and that they do wear furs for warmth and protection for the elements, so what people could actually be seeing out here is this. Indians in animal skins playing shaman...


_*Playing*_ shaman? Quests or sojourns would be a better way of putting it.


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 13, 2013)

The Snark said:


> _*Playing*_ shaman?


Lol:laugh:


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## ShredderEmp (Jun 13, 2013)

Marc Spider said:


> Let's see it, even if it is opinion.
> 
> I'm guessing you believe in the lochness monster too


Actually, no, I don't.


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 13, 2013)

ShredderEmp said:


> Actually, no, I don't.


So are you going to explain about why you believe "bigfoot" is real? Even if it is opinion, I would still like to see it.

---------- Post added 06-13-2013 at 07:28 PM ----------




friendttyy said:


> Do you guys think that bigfoot exists. This is a hot debate topic around the word and I want to knownif you believe the exist and some reasons to support your answers. I say they do as there was a 16 sec documentary film.


Where is the link to the sixteen second documentary film?

I guess I am going to have to find it...:sarcasm:


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## Introvertebrate (Jun 13, 2013)

ShredderEmp said:


> Actually, no, I don't.


How 'bout ESP, UFOs, or the Bermuda Triangle?

Reactions: Like 1


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## ShredderEmp (Jun 13, 2013)

Marc Spider said:


> So are you going to explain about why you believe "bigfoot" is real? Even if it is opinion, I would still like to see it.


Well, the shaman theory doesn't hold up in the summer first of all. Second, Canada, Australia, Indonesia, and other countries also have similar animals. The Yowie, Orang Pendek, Bigfoot, and Yeti, are all very similar in their descriptions.. Why would different countries across the world have similar, constant, descriptions? Also, the native americans have legends and drawings in caves of them. Hair samples have been tested by professionals and have been found not to match any other animals. Footprints have been found to not be made by humans as the stride length and gait cannot be performed by humans. While some TV shows like Monster Quest are not good documentaries, some shows are, but they are not very popular, and so don't air that often. Yes, people do fake photos, videos, and other such evidence, but there is also real stuff too.

Also, I don't believe in UFOs, monsters, ghosts, ESP, and I never thought about the Bermuda Triangle much, so for now, no, and it will probably stay that way until I see good evidence.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 13, 2013)

ShredderEmp said:


> Well, the shaman theory doesn't hold up in the summer first of all. Second, Canada, Australia, Indonesia, and other countries also have similar animals. The Yowie, Orang Pendek, Bigfoot, and Yeti, are all very similar in their descriptions.. Why would different countries across the world have similar, constant, descriptions? Also, the native americans have legends and drawings in caves of them. Hair samples have been tested by professionals and have been found not to match any other animals. Footprints have been found to not be made by humans as the stride length and gait cannot be performed by humans. While some TV shows like Monster Quest are not good documentaries, some shows are, but they are not very popular, and so don't air that often. Yes, people do fake photos, videos, and other such evidence, but there is also real stuff too.


Real stuff, huh? :sarcasm:


So, here's the amusing thing about Bigfoot.

1.) Seen in many countries by many different people.
2.) The sightings all started around the same time.
3.) There is no independent evidence (footprints, hair, bones)
4.) Every single video/picture is blurry (notice the same effect with every UFO picture/video ever, too)


There is also this: "Magician and costume maker Phillip Morris says he is the one who sold the famous Bigfoot suit to Roger Patterson. He says that Patterson used the suit to fake the most famous Bigfoot video ever shot."

[video=youtube;h2lh1IA2U90]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2lh1IA2U90[/video]

^Scientists at Stanford proved that the walk is human. One scientist even called it, "a slam dunk".

---------- Post added 06-13-2013 at 08:02 PM ----------

Google "Best Evidence: Bigfoot Gait Analysis"

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ShredderEmp said:


> I believe very well that they are real, but I'm not going to explain why because much of it is just my opinion.


ShredderEmp, here's the other problem with the idea of "bigfoot". Exceptionally large mammals that seem to hide like ninjas, that also have exceptionally small populations, to the point they're impossible to spot on anything but crappy 1980s camera tech. Especially with all the enthusiasts and big game hunters after them. Also, they never once get caught in a trap. American hunters laying bear traps for two centuries, and not one of these thing ends up in it. American hunters were numerous, ruthless, and extremely skilled. Any one of them would have become famous and rich if they bagged a big foot.


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## advan (Jun 13, 2013)

Squatch is real. When I was younger he stayed with my family for a bit.

[YOUTUBE]28zXvk9kBBc[/YOUTUBE]

(I'm the kid with the glasses )

Reactions: Like 5


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## windscorpions1 (Jun 13, 2013)

I say if bigfoot is real it is just a very rare unidentified animal but that is a very, very, big if. Far as UFO' s go I am not sure I think there has to be life on some distant planet somewhere but I doubt they are UFOs. But ghosts on the other hand I do believe in (about half my family does too) although I am a bit skeptical on the subject.


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 13, 2013)

windscorpions1 said:


> But ghosts on the other hand I do believe in (about half my family does too) although I am a bit skeptical on the subject.


Don't get me started on ghosts


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## AzJohn (Jun 13, 2013)

oops I thought I was quoting some one.

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---------- Post added 06-13-2013 at 05:57 PM ----------




Marc Spider said:


> Let's see it, even if it is opinion.
> 
> I'm guessing you believe in the lochness monster too


Why be such an ass. It's his opinion deal with it.


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 13, 2013)

AzJohn said:


> Why be such an ass. It's his opinion deal with it.


It was a joke, not to be taken seriously. Notice the smiley face. By the way, I am dealing with it, I just shared my opinion. In case you haven't realized this thread's title "bigfoot debate".


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## Philth (Jun 13, 2013)

friendttyy said:


> Do you guys think that bigfoot exists. This is a hot debate topic around the word and I want to knownif you believe the exist and some reasons to support your answers. I say they do as there was a 16 sec documentary film.


A 16 sec documentary is what sold you on this ? lol

Later, Tom

Reactions: Like 3


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## ShredderEmp (Jun 13, 2013)

Marc, if you go to the channel of the person who uploaded that, the about says that he is in a film crew. Who says the video could not have been faked?


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 13, 2013)

ShredderEmp said:


> Marc, if you go to the channel of the person who uploaded that, the about says that he is in a film crew. Who says the video could not have been faked?


There's a lot more, Google "Best Evidence: Bigfoot Gait Analysis"


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## The Snark (Jun 13, 2013)

May I gently suggest the Not So Spineless Wonders forum attempt to stay within the bounds set by acceptable scientific facts? I realize there is lots of circumstantial evidence of this person/creature/whatever, but the qualified scientists have not, to the best of my knowledge, weighed in. Without the backing of such credibility we are asking for endless inconclusive and potentially disparaging debates.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 14, 2013)

The Snark said:


> May I gently suggest the Not So Spineless Wonders forum attempt to stay within the bounds set by acceptable scientific facts? I realize there is lots of circumstantial evidence of this person/creature/whatever, but the qualified scientists have not, to the best of my knowledge, weighed in. Without the backing of such credibility we are asking for endless inconclusive and potentially disparaging debates.


I don't believe there is any evidence of the this creature's existence at all.


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## sugarsandz (Jun 14, 2013)

Everyone knows that the only way to see a Sasquatch is to leave out an open bag of jerky and wait in a hunting blind for it to show itself. Then you have to pull a prank on it, that's the law of nature. 

Seriously though, I'd love to believe in the Samsquanch but I'm leaning toward it being not real but rather over imagination or a lot of hoaxing or both. Who knows though. . .


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 14, 2013)

sugarsandz said:


> Everyone knows that the only way to see a Sasquatch is to leave out an open bag of jerky and wait in a hunting blind for it to show itself. Then you have to pull a prank on it, that's the law of nature.


[video=youtube;k8W9U0qhLz8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8W9U0qhLz8[/video]


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## sugarsandz (Jun 14, 2013)

Marc Spider said:


> [video=youtube;k8W9U0qhLz8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8W9U0qhLz8[/video]


See PROOF!


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## ~Abyss~ (Jun 14, 2013)

I think a small population of a species of bipedal ape isn't so farfetched. Apes are amazing creatures and if such a small population does exist it might be difficult to really track down especially in the miles and miles of forest in north america. However, there really hasn't been any credible evidence. The most recent DNA evidence by that one Dr whos name escapes me at the moment hasn't been peer reviewed yet. And she also won't reveal where she found the dna sample. All other "proof" has been debunked (sorry shredder marc made some good points) so without any credible evidence I would have to say that I do not believe a big foot excist. If future evidence proves otherwise then, I'll change my position but there just isn't enough evidence out there.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Pterror (Jun 14, 2013)

Thanks guys! Just remember, hater's always gonna hate. Trust in what you believe... if anyone here on Vancouver island want's to go on a sasquatch hunt, and make a crappy documentary with me... lemme know, I'll make it happen, know all the areas. my website - www.scottsfiles.com


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 14, 2013)

Pterror said:


> Thanks guys! Just remember, hater's always gonna hate. Trust in what you believe... if anyone here on Vancouver island want's to go on a sasquatch hunt, and make a crappy documentary with me... lemme know, I'll make it happen, know all the areas. my website - www.scottsfiles.com


:laugh: LOL


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## Munch (Jun 15, 2013)

There is no "real" cordum quote evidence that they are real, but there is no evidence they are not real. If you think about it not even half the ocean has been discovered. EXAMPLE blue whales are the biggest animal ever discovered....but there could be something 10 times as big as a blue whale that hasn't been discovered.


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## Xander505 (Jun 15, 2013)

Truthfully, I believe they exist. Every country has they're own stories of encountering such animals and most of them closely resemble eachother from how individuals describe them. They even date back to as far as cavemen encountering them and fighting against them for food and territory in cave paintings.
My mother also told me about a group of bigfoot like creatures that lived near her farming village, in the mountains of Vietnam. Appearantly they were between 5' 11"-6', with dark chestnut brown fur.
She also told me the group of "gorilla people" would often dig up yams, white raddish, sweet potatoes, taro roots and long string peas from neighboring fields at night. She further explained, from what she noticed was that the female (pretty sure you guys can guess how she knew it was a female...) of the group of creatures was the alpha. She ended the story, by saying they disappeared once the Vietnam war started and she never saw them afterwards.
Until proven 100% that these "bigfoots" don't exist, I believe they do because I can't really say they don't.

Reactions: Like 1


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## friendttyy (Jun 15, 2013)

Marc Spider said:


> So are you going to explain about why you believe "bigfoot" is real? Even if it is opinion, I would still like to see it.
> 
> ---------- Post added 06-13-2013 at 07:28 PM ----------
> 
> ...


i will get it for you guys[video=youtube;IJjUt2sXo5o]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IJjUt2sXo5o[/video]please tell me if the video is there.


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 15, 2013)

friendttyy said:


> i will get it for you guys[video=youtube;IJjUt2sXo5o]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IJjUt2sXo5o[/video]please tell me if the video is there.



This is the video I explained about. They've done studies and scientists agree it's human. The maker of the suit even said he sold it to Patterson.

---------- Post added 06-15-2013 at 06:11 AM ----------




Xander505 said:


> Truthfully, I believe they exist. Every country has they're own stories of encountering such animals and most of them closely resemble eachother from how individuals describe them. They even date back to as far as cavemen encountering them and fighting against them for food and territory in cave paintings.
> My mother also told me about a group of bigfoot like creatures that lived near her farming village, in the mountains of Vietnam. Appearantly they were between 5' 11"-6', with dark chestnut brown fur.
> She also told me the group of "gorilla people" would often dig up yams, white raddish, sweet potatoes, taro roots and long string peas from neighboring fields at night. She further explained, from what she noticed was that the female (pretty sure you guys can guess how she knew it was a female...) of the group of creatures was the alpha. She ended the story, by saying they disappeared once the Vietnam war started and she never saw them afterwards.
> Until proven 100% that these "bigfoots" don't exist, I believe they do because I can't really say they don't.


Again, how do you know those people did not over exaggerate about those stories? Most people back then would describe something unusual a lot more than it is. There are many old wives tales, example once people believed a certain predatory fish had powers to suck the life out of you. :sarcasm::laugh: That is just an example, there are MANY more.


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## friendttyy (Jun 15, 2013)

Marc Spider said:


> This is the video I explained about. They've done studies and scientists agree it's human. The maker of the suit even said he sold it to Patterson.
> 
> ---------- Post added 06-15-2013 at 06:11 AM ----------
> 
> ...


they sold suites?OH thanks


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## ShredderEmp (Jun 15, 2013)

Marc Spider said:


> This is the video I explained about. They've done studies and scientists agree it's human. The maker of the suit even said he sold it to Patterson.
> 
> Again, how do you know those people did not over exaggerate about those stories? Most people back then would describe something unusual a lot more than it is. There are many old wives tales, example once people believed a certain predatory fish had powers to suck the life out of you. :sarcasm::laugh: That is just an example, there are MANY more.


I've also seen scientists say that it wasn't human as there was no way that a human would be able to navigate that terrain in a big gorilla suit. 

Also, there are fish like that. Lampreys for example suck blood from fish and even humans sometimes.

@Xander: that sounds a lot like the Orang Pendek. People say they behave very similar to that.


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## LV-426 (Jun 15, 2013)

I believe....that's all what matters to me.


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## The Snark (Jun 15, 2013)

I've wondered if they could be certain somethings natives, usually shaman and occasionally warriors facing their trials, encounter. The random intrusion into this world thing.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 15, 2013)

ShredderEmp said:


> I've also seen scientists say that it wasn't human as there was no way that a human would be able to navigate that terrain in a big gorilla suit.
> 
> Also, there are fish like that. Lampreys for example suck blood from fish and even humans sometimes.
> 
> @Xander: that sounds a lot like the Orang Pendek. People say they behave very similar to that.


Sorry for the late response, I was moving today.

I said fish that suck the ''life'' out of you, not blood. To be more specific ''souls'' it was on river monsters.

You mentioned you also seen scientists say that the bigfoot in that video couldn't be a human? Uh let's see the proof. I've showed mine, (Google "Best Evidence: Bigfoot Gait Analysis") <-- They have real scientists in that video.


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## ShredderEmp (Jun 15, 2013)

[YOUTUBE]3FhPbSbGo8I[/YOUTUBE]


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 15, 2013)

ShredderEmp said:


> [YOUTUBE]3FhPbSbGo8I[/YOUTUBE]


Funny, both of the biologists have been writing books about sasquatches even before they've done the interview in this video. They seem to specialize in this.


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## ShredderEmp (Jun 15, 2013)

Marc Spider said:


> Funny, both of the biologists have been writing books about sasquatches even before they've done the interview in this video. They seem to specialize in this.


All that means is that the interview was done after they had been researching. They can easily have analyzed it before and done it again for the TV program.


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## 2bears (Jun 15, 2013)

Playing Shaman.....A Shaman is a very serious matter in native Ameican culture....no one "plays"Shaman it would be disrespectful and is not a matter taken lightly.
I like the debate and subject matter but maybe consider how you say things before its made public.
2Bears
Cherokee Tribal Elder.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 15, 2013)

http://videos.howstuffworks.com/discovery/30761-best-evidence-bigfoot-gait-analysis-video.htm

For the ones that ^^ haven't seen it.


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## ShredderEmp (Jun 15, 2013)

2bears said:


> Playing Shaman.....A Shaman is a very serious matter in native Ameican culture....no one "plays"Shaman it would be disrespectful and is not a matter taken lightly.
> I like the debate and subject matter but maybe consider how you say things before its made public.
> 2Bears
> Cherokee Tribal Elder.


Do the Cherokee have legends/stories/evidence of big foot or something like it?


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## Galapoheros (Jun 15, 2013)

Could be that the pics of Bigfoot only "look" blurry, but maybe Bigfoots are just blurry, could be they have evolved to fool people with pictures.  OK, solved that problem.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 15, 2013)

Galapoheros said:


> Could be that the pics of Bigfoot only "look" blurry, but maybe Bigfoots are just blurry, could be they have evolved to fool people with pictures.  OK, solved that problem.


:laugh: ...


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## The Snark (Jun 16, 2013)

ShredderEmp said:


> Do the Cherokee have legends/stories/evidence of big foot or something like it?


Hey Tsalagi, now you put your foot in it, I can hardly wait to see how you handle it. :sarcasm:


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## friendttyy (Jun 16, 2013)

if people sold the costumes to those guys should they not be sued


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## jgerou85 (Jun 16, 2013)

I think there are lots of things out there that we do not know about . It is definately plausable to think it exists.


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 16, 2013)

jgerou85 said:


> I think there are lots of things out there that we do not know about . It is definately plausable to think it exists.


"Here's the other problem with the idea of "bigfoot". Exceptionally large mammals that seem to hide like ninjas, that also have exceptionally small populations, to the point they're impossible to spot on anything but crappy 1980s camera tech. Especially with all the enthusiasts and big game hunters after them. Also, they never once get caught in a trap. American hunters laying bear traps for two centuries, and not one of these thing ends up in it. American hunters were numerous, ruthless, and extremely skilled. Any one of them would have become famous and rich if they bagged a big foot."

Copy and pasted my earlier post^.


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## Remingtonsteel (Jun 16, 2013)

Well it may be a case of (if it exists),dying out before we can or could discover it,think until the 1920s the giant panda was thought to be a myth(like Bigfoot),now that is has been confirmed discovered they are critically endangered ,the case may be the same with "Bigfoot",but in may opinions they don't exist there is only few photos and even littler footage with also tiny traces of physical evidence to support its existence and as Marc spider said ,an absence of evidence is evidence of absence


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## jgerou85 (Jun 16, 2013)

They just found a new human size species of ape or monkey last year. They also found a new species of 30 foot whale.  there are places that people dont frequent. Lots of alaska is still untouched. Here in michigan, I can drive up to the u p and in about 75 miles there are no people anywhere for miles and miles. If you were dropped in 20 miles from a road  by helicopter , it could be a month before you were seen again. A great habitat for somthing like that to hide. All im saying is people think they have an airtight grasp on this world, knowing all there is to know and everything that walks the earth. In reality nothing could be farther from the truth.


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## friendttyy (Jun 16, 2013)

i think they exist as it would be kind of selfish to think we are the only intelligent life on earth.


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 16, 2013)

friendttyy said:


> i think they exist as it would be kind of selfish to think we are the only intelligent life on earth.


Who said humans were the only intelligent life on earth?

Chimpanzees have better memories than us.

[video=youtube;zJAH4ZJBiN8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJAH4ZJBiN8[/video]


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## freedumbdclxvi (Jun 16, 2013)

friendttyy said:


> i think they exist as it would be kind of selfish to think we are the only intelligent life on earth.


Mice and dolphins are both smarter than humans.


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 16, 2013)

freedumbdclxvi said:


> Mice/*rats* and dolphins are both smarter than humans.


Fixed...


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## freedumbdclxvi (Jun 16, 2013)

Marc Spider said:


> Fixed...


Nah, it was right.   Don't Panic.


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## Munch (Jun 17, 2013)

That chimp was awesome...any who maybe bigfoot are just humans living in nature like they should.


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## ~Abyss~ (Jun 17, 2013)

A r bit off topic, but I'm done with this debate anyways. It's hard for my mind to comprehend the people on here who admit theres no evidence and still believe. Even that post where they say they'll believe it until it's unproven it doesn't work that way. What is there to disprove? Jeez I have a headache.


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## friendttyy (Jun 17, 2013)

~Abyss~ said:


> A r bit off topic, but I'm done with this debate anyways. It's hard for my mind to comprehend the people on here who admit theres no evidence and still believe. Even that post where they say they'll believe it until it's unproven it doesn't work that way. What is there to disprove? Jeez I have a headache.


panado helps with head aches


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## The Snark (Jun 17, 2013)

~Abyss~ said:


> A r bit off topic, but I'm done with this debate anyways. It's hard for my mind to comprehend the people on here who admit theres no evidence and still believe. Even that post where they say they'll believe it until it's unproven it doesn't work that way. What is there to disprove? Jeez I have a headache.


Certain religions, which count over 1/2 the worlds population, are basically devoid of scientific facts or 'evidence'. Suggested reading: Mass hysteria aka collective obsessional behavior.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 18, 2013)

~Abyss~ said:


> It's hard for my mind to comprehend the people on here who admit theres no evidence and still believe.


Ah, I really like this sentence. This might be my new signature, who knows.

Reactions: Like 1


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## The Snark (Jun 18, 2013)

~Abyss~ said:


> It's hard for my mind to comprehend the people on here who admit theres no evidence and still believe.


Actually, it's very easy to comprehend (take in the meaning of) this. What is difficult is comprehending the comprehending. The third iteration is probably an irrational number and the fourth, a black hole. Where were we? (IE, you can comprehend the irrational but the result is rationalized irrationality which can only be irrationally rationalized. Get it?)


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## friendttyy (Jun 18, 2013)

Some of my friends say (that i do think is a good reason why 'bigfoot' is not evidentally proven to exist)"They do probably exist but are rarely seen because they are afraid of light and prefer a darker place to stay and does not like to be disturbed."Any thoughts or opinions on this?


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## LV-426 (Jun 18, 2013)

I think Sasquatch is rarely seen and hasn't been discovered because it doesn't want to be discovered. I read somewhere that the smartest animal in the world is the one that hasn't been found. Humans destroy everything it's a sad fact.


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## Rhodin (Jun 19, 2013)

Marc Spider said:


> Who said humans were the only intelligent life on earth?
> 
> Chimpanzees have better memories than us.
> 
> [video=youtube;zJAH4ZJBiN8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJAH4ZJBiN8[/video]


" Ayumu had many sessions of practice on their task before terminal performances were measured; their human subjects had none. The present report shows that when two humans are given practice in the Inoue and Matsuzawa (2007) memory task, their accuracy levels match those of Ayumu."


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## friendttyy (Jun 19, 2013)

Of all the animals that lived on earth *tears* only 10% exists today


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## goodoldneon (Jun 19, 2013)

Wait? What? There's a debate?


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 20, 2013)

friendttyy said:


> Of all the animals that lived on earth *tears* only 10% exists today


Welcome to life, the survival game.


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## friendttyy (Jun 20, 2013)

Marc Spider said:


> Welcome to life, the survival game.


True humans destroy everything and on the average of 17 species of animals becoming exitinct every year, what will my kids ever get to see.


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## freedumbdclxvi (Jun 20, 2013)

friendttyy said:


> Of all the animals that lived on earth *tears* only 10% exists today


You do realize the biggest percentage of extinct species occurred before humanity came on the scene, right?  I know humans are messing things up for the planet, but,  how you worded it, it sounds as if you are saying people caused that 90+% extinction.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Tarantula155 (Jun 20, 2013)

friendttyy said:


> what will my kids ever get to see.


New technology, a whole new advancement in human history.

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## Arachtion (Jun 20, 2013)

ShredderEmp said:


> Well, the shaman theory doesn't hold up in the summer first of all. Second, Canada, Australia, Indonesia, and other countries also have similar animals. The Yowie, Orang Pendek, Bigfoot, and Yeti, are all very similar in their descriptions.. Why would different countries across the world have similar, constant, descriptions? Also, the native americans have legends and drawings in caves of them. Hair samples have been tested by professionals and have been found not to match any other animals. Footprints have been found to not be made by humans as the stride length and gait cannot be performed by humans. While some TV shows like Monster Quest are not good documentaries, some shows are, but they are not very popular, and so don't air that often. Yes, people do fake photos, videos, and other such evidence, but there is also real stuff too.
> 
> Also, I don't believe in UFOs, monsters, ghosts, ESP, and I never thought about the Bermuda Triangle much, so for now, no, and it will probably stay that way until I see good evidence.


Psychedelic mushrooms grow on most continents, ayahuasca vines in the amazon, peyoti cacti...


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## cantthinkofone (Jun 20, 2013)

Honestly I believe in the fact that there MAY be an unidentified creature out there. As for ufos I believe. It would make the human race ignorant to believe that we are alone. As for ghosts I highly believe. I was supposed to have a brother and a sister. I was supposed to die... But they died and somehow I lived. When I was a child I would constantly see things and one time I even told my mother the boy was in the room (just me and her too) when we moved into our current house we found out an elderly lady had died here. I saw her (sware to the god I believe in!) and my dog did too. My parents heard noises and they are constantly waken by loud knocks. In a picture of my dog a face can be faintly seen! We ha the house blessed and now its gone. It was enough to convince.


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## ~Abyss~ (Jun 20, 2013)

There's no evidence for life outside our own little world. That being said we know what it takes to have a suitable enviromenet for life and given the number of galaxies it's very likely that there is some sort of ET. But for an intelligent life to travel lightyears just to float around our atmosphere without actually making contact seems unlikely to me. Don't get me wrong I beleive UFO's are real I'm just saying there not neccesarilly alien space crafts. I highly skeptical of your ghost claim, the idea of "living" after death is horrendous to me. Even if claims of heaven are horrible, eternity anywhere is hell. And to think that the "souls" of a person would just stay wandering around a house only to be able to knock on a door or create a faint image of a shadow until someone comes with their magic scented oils and magic water say a few words and there gone forever is a very ludicrous claim.


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## cantthinkofone (Jun 20, 2013)

No she was trying to protect what was hers. And they didn't use those oils. The magic crap is bogus. Being highly religious we just ha our pastor come in and say some prayers. She had a crap ton of roses and they were torn down in repairs and such. Only two exist. She started doing stuff when we tore one down. Since we have planted some more and the pastor came in. As for ufos I believe they could be sourveying our planet just like we send "ufos" to sourvey other planets.


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## ShredderEmp (Jun 20, 2013)

freedumbdclxvi said:


> You do realize the biggest percentage of extinct species occurred before humanity came on the scene, right?  I know humans are messing things up for the planet, but,  how you worded it, it sounds as if you are saying people caused that 90+% extinction.


Animals have existed longer than humans have. More time and natural selection, yes, but no one can deny that humans are a major cause, even if they might not be the largest.


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## ~Abyss~ (Jun 20, 2013)

cantthinkofone said:


> And they didn't use those oils. The magic crap is bogus. Being highly religious we just ha our pastor come in and say some prayers.


What makes prayer less bogus?

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## Tarantula155 (Jun 20, 2013)

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~Abyss~ said:


> What makes prayer less bogus?


:laugh::laugh: +1

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cantthinkofone said:


> Honestly I believe in the fact that there MAY be an unidentified creature out there. As for ufos I believe. It would make the human race ignorant to believe that we are alone. As for ghosts I highly believe. I was supposed to have a brother and a sister. I was supposed to die... But they died and somehow I lived. When I was a child I would constantly see things and one time I even told my mother the boy was in the room (just me and her too) when we moved into our current house we found out an elderly lady had died here. I saw her (sware to the god I believe in!) and my dog did too. My parents heard noises and they are constantly waken by loud knocks. In a picture of my dog a face can be faintly seen! We ha the house blessed and now its gone. It was enough to convince.


cantthinkofone, that happens. It doesn't require a spiritual entity. Humans have flawed perception because humans aren't perfect creatures. The ability to hallucinate, even with relatively mild stimuli, is well established.

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## lilmissmuffet (Jun 20, 2013)

My mother was a forester for many years. She currently teaches dendrochronology, forest stand dynamics, fire ecology, taxonomy and invasive species at a very prestigious university. This woman is incredibly science minded and she and her colleagues have logged hundreds of hours in the field (we're talking deep forest here). We used to live in the Pacific Northwest and knew very reputable, skeptical scientists with PhD's and lots of experience who swear up and down they've seen it with their own eyes....


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## cantthinkofone (Jun 20, 2013)

I have my beliefs you have yours. I respect yours but, Marc spider, it appears you have no respect for mine and others. Maybe prayers are bogus. Maybe there is no god. But what I believe should be respected just as I respect your disbelief of what appears to be everything. I am not new to the forums and have been a frequent user for a year +

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## Tarantula155 (Jun 20, 2013)

cantthinkofone said:


> I have my beliefs you have yours. I respect yours but, Marc spider, it appears you have no respect for mine and others. Maybe prayers are bogus. Maybe there is no god. But what I believe should be respected just as I respect your disbelief of what appears to be everything. I am not new to the forums and have been a frequent user for a year +


Just because I don't believe in your belief, that doesn't mean I do not respect it. I respect everyone's belief, even if I am debating about it. As expected because this thread's title "bigfoot 'debate".


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## ~Abyss~ (Jun 21, 2013)

cantthinkofone said:


> I have my beliefs you have yours. I respect yours but, Marc spider, it appears you have no respect for mine and others. Maybe prayers are bogus. Maybe there is no god. But what I believe should be respected just as I respect your disbelief of what appears to be everything. I am not new to the forums and have been a frequent user for a year +


People should be respected, not beliefs. Beliefs, especially those without evidence should be questioned.

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## Smokehound714 (Jun 21, 2013)

Until i can be presented with tangible proof that involves no hoax, i'll always be opposed to the following arguments:

 #1- Humans walked alongside dinosaurs.. No evidence exists to support this, so far every argument supporting this has been littered with well-known hoaxes, and a general ignorance of the fact that even prehistoric cave-paintings from several spots worldwide actually depict their animals very accurately., compare a legit cave painting with a stupid stone with a horrendous 5-min dinosaur etching on a stone, you'll seldom see one depicting accurate anatomy, if at all.   When you attempt to discuss this, people throw in the "Tail like a cedar" description of Behemoth in JOB, which was hilariously mistranslated.  I dunno if it's okay to type the literal translation of the book of job, because it's kinda explicit.

  Let's just say that "tail" was erect and its erm..  "roots" bulged with vigor.  :laughing:

 #2-  The earth is less than 6,000 years old.  LOLWUT.  come on.  go visit the grand canyon.


   I'm quite surprised people need to discover things like this, when real amazing new species are discovered to this day, many of them very VERY strange.

  Dinosaurs did walk with us, you know.. Chickens, and ducks, and ostriches.


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## friendttyy (Jun 21, 2013)

Smokehound714 said:


> Until i can be presented with tangible proof that involves no hoax, i'll always be opposed to the following arguments:
> 
> #1- Humans walked alongside dinosaurs.. No evidence exists to support this, so far every argument supporting this has been littered with well-known hoaxes, and a general ignorance of the fact that even prehistoric cave-paintings from several spots worldwide actually depict their animals very accurately., compare a legit cave painting with a stupid stone with a horrendous 5-min dinosaur etching on a stone, you'll seldom see one depicting accurate anatomy, if at all.   When you attempt to discuss this, people throw in the "Tail like a cedar" description of Behemoth in JOB, which was hilariously mistranslated.  I dunno if it's okay to type the literal translation of the book of job, because it's kinda explicit.
> 
> ...


for #1 I walked with dinosaurs before.(Crocodiles)#The earth is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay over 6000 years old.


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## The Snark (Jun 21, 2013)

My ex and I had purchased a 5 acre chunk of property on the N coast of Calif. I refrained from mentioning it until she brought up that the area of the property near the gate was 'dark'. I told her it was.
A couple of months living in there our 3 yr old son started getting woken up around 22:00 hrs. One or two nights a week he came to our room, very frightened. Over a period of a month the instances increased to every night and he was in terror each night. His room was the closest to the dark area of the property.
My wife asked me to become involved which I cannot directly do. However both her and I did some historical research and contacted the local indian (Yurok) tribe which had lived on and around our property. We were told of a nasty situation that had happened about 100 years previously. Two native brothers and the elder brothers wife lived on the property along with the couples child. The younger brother was partly debilitated and by reports, resentful of his brother's marriage and family. The situation came down to a mess. The elder brother, his wife and their child were found bludgeoned to death. The younger brother disappeared for a few weeks then apparently drowned himself. The home/camp of the family had been in the dark place, a stand of spruce, on our property.
My wife requested the local shaman to intervene in some way. The shaman said she could force -it- to leave but it was up to us to close the corners.
I invoked my own shaman, a warrior, asking him for his own intervention. Immediately, within 24 hours, I was given 2 visions. The first was our property but the tall rock promontory the house was on was just a slight rise. Instead of temperate rainforest it was steaming tropical jungle. The next AM I saw the entity on our deck. 
I was called down to the dark place and sitting in the center of the spruce stand, among dank damp needles and mosses was a clean rounded stone about twice the size of a mans fist. I contacted the shaman and she asked the elders. They reported the weapon used to murder the family was suspected to be a stone sewn into a deer skin bag. A not too unusual weapon around those parts.
I evicted the stone from the property and disposed of it then undertook the ritual closing the corners. The shaman and a warrior came that afternoon and performed the spirit walk and undertook the eviction of the entity. It was an uncomfortable 3 hours.

Conclusions. We deduced the entity, which had lived in that area since prehistoric times had influenced the younger brother. It assaulting our child every evening was a very palpable example of it's power. 

To the point. I'm involved, obviously, in traditional native rituals. I'm a neutral in certain matters thus my inability to directly intervene. My use is what we call a witness. What I saw on the deck was an intrusion into this world. As beings of that nature it is ephemeral but can on occasion become visible for a variety of reasons. I've seen a number of them under different circumstances. This one's manifested appearance was a dark grey shaggy humanoid. Very stooped yet close to 6 foot tall. It's 'body' was very powerfully built.

So I offer one version of bigfoot that undoubtedly has been noticed from time to time. By no means the answer to all the sightings. I would also suggest it be kept in mind that the origin word for Sasquatch is........ and comes from..........

There are more things on heaven and earth Horatio...


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## ~Abyss~ (Jun 21, 2013)

The Snark said:


> Conclusions. We deduced the entity, which had lived in that area since prehistoric times had influenced the younger brother. It assaulting our child every evening was a very palpable example of it's power.


How did you arrive to this conclusion? What is the evidence behind this claim?

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## cantthinkofone (Jun 21, 2013)

~Abyss~ said:


> People should be respected, not beliefs. Beliefs, especially those without evidence should be questioned.


in saying that you are stating that no one is entitled to a belief. a belief is just that. BELIEF is something you believe and hence rarely have evidence


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## ~Abyss~ (Jun 22, 2013)

cantthinkofone said:


> in saying that you are stating that no one is entitled to a belief. a belief is just that. BELIEF is something you believe and hence rarely have evidence


I disagree most of what we believe is backed by evidence. Do you believe the sun will there tomorrow? You and everyone else is entitled to their beliefs. But when your beliefs are absurd, I execute my right to point that out. Someone can believe the world flat, or an invisible Cyclops watches us at night, or a fat guy travels all over the world delivering presents. None of those beliefs are based on evidence I don't have to respect them.

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## The Snark (Jun 22, 2013)

"You must remember that one man's god may be another man's fairy tale. But both gods and fairy tales have their place in this world." -Gerald Durrell- The Mockery Bird

The greatest paradox possible is the pedant exploring the universe. All facts must be accurate, proven and precise while the exploration of the universe requires accepting the greatest leaps of the imagination ever known, the big bang, which is and will always remain unprovable conjecture that defies all known laws of science.


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## friendttyy (Jun 23, 2013)

The Snark said:


> "You must remember that one man's god may be another man's fairy tale. But both gods and fairy tales have their place in this world." -Gerald Durrell- The Mockery Bird
> 
> The greatest paradox possible is the pedant exploring the universe. All facts must be accurate, proven and precise while the exploration of the universe requires accepting the greatest leaps of the imagination ever known, the big bang, which is and will always remain unprovable conjecture that defies all known laws of science.


True the big bang which,is said to be the reason of the galaxies can never proven as there can be no evidence unless some smart person onvents a time machine. I respect everyones belief unless its something like Tarantulas eat humans.

---------- Post added 06-23-2013 at 08:05 AM ----------




The Snark said:


> "You must remember that one man's god may be another man's fairy tale. But both gods and fairy tales have their place in this world." -Gerald Durrell- The Mockery Bird
> 
> The greatest paradox possible is the pedant exploring the universe. All facts must be accurate, proven and precise while the exploration of the universe requires accepting the greatest leaps of the imagination ever known, the big bang, which is and will always remain unprovable conjecture that defies all known laws of science.


True the big bang which,is said to be the reason of the galaxies can never proven as there can be no evidence unless some smart person onvents a time machine. I respect everyones belief unless its something like Tarantulas eat humans. THAT WAS A EXAMPLE

---------- Post added 06-23-2013 at 08:12 AM ----------




The Snark said:


> "You must remember that one man's god may be another man's fairy tale. But both gods and fairy tales have their place in this world." -Gerald Durrell- The Mockery Bird
> 
> The greatest paradox possible is the pedant exploring the universe. All facts must be accurate, proven and precise while the exploration of the universe requires accepting the greatest leaps of the imagination ever known, the big bang, which is and will always remain unprovable conjecture that defies all known laws of science.


True the big bang which,is said to be the reason of the galaxies can never proven as there can be no evidence unless some smart person onvents a time machine. I respect everyones belief unless its something like Tarantulas eat humans.


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