# T sitting in her water dish--pls help newbie!



## missghie (Feb 9, 2011)

Hi again everyone,

I'm back with more worries about my 2.5" avic.  Sha hasn't eaten, has stopped webbing completely, and doesn't climb at all--she's been very listless, though she does move around a bit.  I think her abdomen may be thin(?--how to tell)--it's not round, it's shaped like an almond.

I've been keeping her enclosure sprayed and have soaked a corner of the substrate for her--as advised.  But now she's sitting in her water bowl--which is a clean soda pop cap, butt first with her pedipalps hanging over the edge?  Is this ok?  Should I continue to assume that she's just doing her thing and will be ok?  Or should I put her in an icu?

Update: she crawled out just as I finished posting the above.

Thanks for your advice.

G

---------- Post added at 09:24 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:33 PM ----------

she's on her back now!  Not moving at all, but I guess she's finally molting!  Hurray!

---------- Post added at 09:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:24 PM ----------

wait--she flipped back over--I'm so confused!!!


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## killy (Feb 9, 2011)

I'm going to keep up with your story because your avic situation and mine are somewhat similar ...

Meanwhile, I can tell you that the water-sitting thing has proven several times in the past to be the pre-cursor to a molt, and guess what?  Caveman, my pulchra, is doing that very thing as I write - hold on, let me see if I can get a quick shot ... 







We'll see ....


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## missghie (Feb 9, 2011)

she's upside down feet up inside her water bowl now, flailing about!  Molting?  Drowning?  Help!

---------- Post added at 10:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:37 PM ----------

now she's very very still!  I'm afraid to even blow on her!

I just found my baby avic upside down legs up in her water bowl.  First she was flailing about, then still.  I took her out and left her upside down--she'd move her legs a little when I blew on them.  Now she's still upside down and not moving at all!


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## captmarga (Feb 9, 2011)

Upside down is usually molting.  The process takes hours for some.  Do not disturb her further... just observe.  Hope she isn't more stressed by the move.  

Good luck, 

Marga


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## missghie (Feb 9, 2011)

thanks for your reassurance.  is it normal for them to be so absolutely still?

---------- Post added at 11:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:19 PM ----------

wt<edit>--she flipped rightside up again!  I just put her in the ICU.  she was totally limp, but seems to be alive.


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## Mez (Feb 9, 2011)

It's probably aborted the moult because you messed with it. Was it trying to moult in the water dish? If so what is the humidity?


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## gmrpnk21 (Feb 9, 2011)

Why did you take it out!?!?!? You may have overstressed it by moving it and BLOWING ON IT! Tarantulas rarely die upside down, and if they are in that position, it's for a reason. If the humidity is too low, it may have been in the water dish to assist with the molt. How big is the T?


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## webbedone (Feb 9, 2011)

She is molting ! Dont disturb her she will be just fine, after she completes her molt make sure she has a fresh full water bowl to drink and give her some privacy for next few days

leave it be and dont disturb its molting and knows what its doing!


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## Projecht13 (Feb 9, 2011)

If it aborted the molt because you moved it, it will likely die.. Never never touch, mess with or blow on a molting tarantula. Hope it pulls through but it's doubtful.


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## winwin (Feb 9, 2011)

A little reseach would've been better before buying...

Reactions: Like 1 | Dislike 1


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## Chris_Skeleton (Feb 9, 2011)

winwin said:


> A little reseach would've been better before buying...


+1, and in the OPs other threads, there were plenty of people that told her that if it's on its back it's molting.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Dreadlock Wolf (Feb 9, 2011)

Chris_Skeleton said:


> +1, and in the OPs other threads, there were plenty of people that told her that if it's on its back it's molting.


:wall:
Their is just no telling some people...


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## Chris_Skeleton (Feb 9, 2011)

To the OP, will you please search "molting" and read up on all you can. I would recommend not messing with your spider or even buying another _until_ you read up on the molting process. Just leave it alone and hope for the best. 

Good luck.


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## Great Basin Ben (Feb 9, 2011)

Projecht13 said:


> If it aborted the molt because you moved it, it will likely die.. Never never touch, mess with or blow on a molting tarantula. Hope it pulls through but it's doubtful.


This seems to be a quite common mistake that novice T owners are guilty of. (_MYSELF INCLUDED_):wall: When I received my first T, and it flipped onto it's back, I flipped it back over (3) times!, essentially ending it's life prematurally. It's a VERY sad lesson to have to learn in such a Hard Way, but you'll likely NEVER make the same mistake twice. 

Consider this a valuable learning experience, and try to grow from it, and certainly not beat yourself up from it. Also, as recommended to me, by MANY of the folks here: Go out and buy the LATEST copy of The Tarantula Keeper's Guide, by Schultz and Schultz. *Read it cover to cover SEVERAL times*, and you'll soon see that many of the questions, and concerns that you have, are addressed at length in the book, as well as behavioral questions that may arise. It will become your most valuable tool in Tarantula keeping.

After reading, you probably would have deduced that it's listlessness was likely because it was in pre-molt, also it's lack of appetite. You will also read in there several times, that RARELY if ever, are Tarantulas on their backs, dead. 99% or the time, it means that they are molting. And as you'll soon read too, ANY disturbance during a molt, is usually a HORRIBLE idea... 

I'm terribly sorry to hear about your situation, and truly hope it pulls through. If not, I've heard the best therapy for the loss of a Tarantula, is to go out , and buy (2) more to replace it!

Best of luck,
Ben.

---------- Post added at 10:11 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:05 AM ----------

I just noticed that you are from the Bay Area. You should check out the San Francisco Bay Area Tarantula Society. It's a group of folks in your neck of the woods, that regulalry meets, and do Field Trips for California Inverts. 

Here's their link. You can join their Forum, and maybe even meet folks in a neighborhhod not to far from where you actually live, that share a love for Tarantulas!

http://www.sfbats.org/


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## jbm150 (Feb 9, 2011)

Any update?  Did it ever molt?  

It can be tough, molting is a nervewracking process.  Where it sets up shop, its probably the most comfortable place for it.  You have to trust that it knows what it's doing.  I still get nervous through molts and especially after when they Ts are hardening up.  They often contort themselves into odd positions or even look like they go into death curls, drives me nuts.  You just have to leave them alone and let 'em work themselves out.  

I hope your T made it through ok.....


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## missghie (Feb 9, 2011)

I know I screwed up and feel awful.  I knew being on her back was a sign of molting, and had done a lot of online research, but I just freaked out cuz she was upside down and lifeless in her water bowl.  after i took her out she flipped back over and I put her in ICU--she was moving around a little in there last night, but now I''m pretty sure she's dead/dying--crumpled up in a semi-death curl.  I'm going to follow everyone's advice and not dispose of her till she smells bad.  I'm sad.


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## jbm150 (Feb 9, 2011)

I'm sorry, thats too bad.  Thats a tough lesson to learn


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## Ictinike (Feb 9, 2011)

missghie said:


> I know I screwed up and feel awful.  I knew being on her back was a sign of molting, and had done a lot of online research, but I just freaked out cuz she was upside down and lifeless in her water bowl.  after i took her out she flipped back over and I put her in ICU--she was moving around a little in there last night, but now I''m pretty sure she's dead/dying--crumpled up in a semi-death curl.  I'm going to follow everyone's advice and not dispose of her till she smells bad.  I'm sad.


Everyone makes mistakes but what makes us human is the ability to learn from them.  Use this to motivate you to have another and do all you can to make sure your not put into a situation where you don't have an answer.

Your not the first nor will you be the last to have reacted as such.  The next time now you know and it will be a much better experience.  Also remind yourself if any questions do come up that these creatures have been doing it "their" way for millions of years most likely and what we think may look odd or out of the ordinary may just be something they've always done but you've never seen.  In those situations the first thing to do is not to react to swiftly and come here and post the dilemma or read up on some articles/web.  If you find out later that something like the situation you went through is perfectly normal than your in the clear because you didn't react.  I can honestly say more than not a swift reaction to a situation such as yours, that may seem alien at first, causes more problems over the average than just sitting back and trying to figure it out without interaction.

In a similar situation I personally went through my new GBB was molting and appeared it had ruptured it's carapace during the molt and was leaking fluid.  While I didn't quickly react, opting to take some pictures and come and post here, the T ended up dying but not because of anything I had done but merely a consequence that can and does happen from time to time.  Once I understood that it was nothing I did actively or passively it was easier to digest less I went and tried to remedy the situation not knowing if had indeed been my interaction that caused the outcome. 

In the end you will have a pet die either by complications of some sort or old age but what you can actively do is again learn all you can and prevent those situations where your direct actions, or lack there of, caused the complication.

Best of luck to you and don't let this hold you back.  Press forward with a new T and new reading!

Cheers,


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## missghie (Feb 10, 2011)

Thanks for your advice--I definitely learned a lot!  I'll def read TKG before I get another T, and I think I'll wait till summer since it'll be hot here and I won't have to worry about the de-humidifying effects of using the heater in the winter--I really did do my best to keep her humidity up!  And I also learned to leave her be and let them do their own natural thing, I'm just an observer.  

I just checked her in the ICU for the first time, and she's still, rightside up, and partially molted--I can't tell if she's alive, I'll leave her in there for at least another day. Maybe she'll still make it somehow?


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## killy (Feb 10, 2011)

missghie said:


> I just checked her in the ICU for the first time, and she's still, rightside up, and partially molted--I can't tell if she's alive, I'll leave her in there for at least another day. Maybe she'll still make it somehow?


Check out the multitude of threads about molting - and the multitudes of photos of Ts in various stages of undress - and see if your T's present condition looks like any of them ... sounds good, from what you're describing, and if your avic can actually throw a serious molt after everything you've put her through, well for gosh sakes can you blame her for taking it a little slow this time around? ...  - from everything I've read, dead spiders don't molt.  And dying Ts don't bother trying ... What doesn't kill her will make her stronger, and you a little wiser!  I sure hope everything turns out okay - let us know


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## missghie (Feb 10, 2011)

Thanks, I hope you're right!

I did read through the sticky molting posts beforehand (guess I'm not a very good study:?), but my browswer has trouble opening pics from a lot of the older posts.  Anyhow, her carapace has come off, that's about all I can really tell about her molt.  And her legs are sorta splayed out to her sides.  She looks like a limp doll.  I'll just be patient and see what happens, cross my fingers, and definitely have learned a good lesson from this!

I have another question:  some say that it's good to keep the icu in a dark, warm place.  I've been keeping her in the warmest spot in my apt, which is in front of the wall heater in my living room, which has a western exposure and huge windows with blinds that don't block all the sunlight. Do I leave her as is even though it's not dark, do I try to put some fabric over the container, or do I put her in the closet where it's not warm at all?

Thanks again.


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## killy (Feb 10, 2011)

missghie said:


> ...her carapace has come off, that's about all I can really tell about her molt.  And her legs are sorta splayed out to her sides.  She looks like a limp doll. ...


Well, those are the classic characteristics of the early stages of the molt process ... is she right-side up or on her back?  Not that it matters, necessarily, but most been-there-done-that tarantulas agree that "on her back" would be the preferred way to do it. 

As for the ICU question, I'd go for the "leaving her alone" option, as long as the ICU is not in direct sunlight - warmth is a good thing, when it comes to molts, and I've had many a T molt in daylight conditions and do just fine.


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## Great Basin Ben (Feb 10, 2011)

*Don't beat yourself up about this*

Here's what happened to me not more than 6 months ago.
http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=194605

 It is a completely understandable reaction, for your new pet to have your FULL attention, and for you to want to do as much as you can to help them. I continue to remind myself NOW, that 450+ MILLION YEARS of evolution hasn't gotten them this far, for nothin'! They almost ALWAYS know what they're doing, we just need to sometimes "sit back" and let it happen. It can be hard too, especially if you're a complete animal lover, and used to "having" to nuture your other pets. I'm sure your next spider experience will be an altogether different one, and I wish you MUCH LUCK!


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## missghie (Feb 10, 2011)

She passed.  There's a creek surrounded by redwood trees next to my house, I'll lay her to rest there--RIP Aretha, sorry I didn't care for you better.

Ben--I read your thread--very similar case to mine, and I definitely learned the same hard lesson you did--to be patient, let nature do it's think, and to not panic.  Probably a good lesson in general.  It's good to hear that you've have had success with Ts since then.  I'd still like to own a tarantula, but like I said, I think I'll wait till the weather gets warmer.  I'm sure I won't make the same mistakes and will do a better job caring for the next one.

Everyone else, thank you very much for your input and advice.  I sincerely appreciate it.  This was a hard lesson to learn, and I truly appreciate everyone's support.   

G


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