# Small scale (really small) feeder roach setup



## scottyk (Dec 21, 2007)

My wife an I just had a baby. I traded off all of my OW tarantulas, and anything else with a dangerous bite. This was the bulk of my collection, and I am left with 6 NW T's until my son gets a bit older.

Would it be feasable to culture roaches in one of my, now empty 2.5 or 5 gallon tanks? Any recommendations on the best species or other considerations would be appreciated.

Just to keep the thread going in the direction I need, please note the following:

1- It's not about the money, it's about giving them nutritional variety, and enjoying the roaches as well. I'm aware that I could just go get crickets at the store at this scale.

2- I'm willing to devote extra time to keep the smaller container clean. I have a bunch of tanks, so I could probably go back and forth between two, and sterilize them on an alternating schedule.

3- They will be on a shelf over a 90 gallon fish tank, in an area that stays above 70 degrees and nicely humid year round.

Thanks in advance...
Scott


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## Talkenlate04 (Dec 21, 2007)

Sure it will work. You can do dubia roaches. To reproduce well they need some decent heat. So if you have a heat pad under their tank and they start to get too high in numbers take the heat away and they should stop reproducing as much. I think that would work with a few species of tropical roaches. And if you get to many at some point just sell/give them away. I give enough away now to keep my colony in check most of the time. They don't mind dirty ether. And temps in the 70's will keep them from exploding in population.


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## Xaranx (Dec 21, 2007)

If you wanna stay small scale, keep them at 70-75 and they wont breed as much as 85+


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## xhexdx (Dec 21, 2007)

Seems they've got this thread under control. ;P

Keep the temp in the 70's and they won't reproduce as much, if at all.  Lower 90's/upper 80's should keep them reproducing pretty well.

Congratulations on the birth of your son!  Mine is due at the end of March.


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## Stylopidae (Dec 21, 2007)

My entire collection is fed by a pair of roach colonies in 10 gallon tanks.

My lobster roaches are my primary feeders and I use a _Blaberus_ hybrid and _Blaptica dubia_ colony as a backup.


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## imjim (Dec 21, 2007)

Cheshire said:


> My entire collection is fed by a pair of roach colonies in 10 gallon tanks.
> 
> My lobster roaches are my primary feeders and I use a _Blaberus_ hybrid and _Blaptica dubia_ colony as a backup.


Blaberus hybrid - Tell us more?

http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=111304&page=2&highlight=Hybrid


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## Travis K (Dec 21, 2007)

imjim said:


> Blaberus hybrid - Tell us more?


I don't know the roach people might get really crazy if they hear about Hybrid Roaches?

LOL, ;P


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## Stylopidae (Dec 21, 2007)

imjim said:


> Blaberus hybrid - Tell us more?


The roaches I use are a cross between _B. discoidales_, _B. fusca_ and _B. craniifer_.

They were sent to me by someone who didn't want them (I think it might have been because they were hybrids...I've since forgotten who sent them to me) and are used for feeding purposes only.



Travis K said:


> I don't know the roach people might get really crazy if they hear about Hybrid Roaches?


Crosses like these are commonly used by breeders, but since they're kept as feeders and not kept for pets these aren't a huge deal because the people who keep roaches for the same reason folks keep tarantulas keep their lines seperate and put in more effort to make sure they're not buying halfbreed lines in the first place...although true _Blaberus craniifer_ is damn near impossible to find so even in the roach world, hybridizing does cause the major issues in terms of the preservation of natural species that people against hybridizing of tarantulas detest. Unfortunately for roaches, this crossed the point of no return many years ago in some of the stock that was originally imported from Europe. Most roach enthusiasts I've talked to openly despise hybridizing, but it's also to the point where there's nothing that can be done about it.

The comparison between the two really isn't accurate because roaches are kept less commonly as pets and more commonly as feeders.

There's also the 'replaceability' issue...roaches breed quickly so the lines can theoretically be seperated through selective breeding. I've begun to breed a wingless line of lobster roaches out of boredom with moderate success (presence of deformed wings is up by about 5% since the beginning of the project a year ago), so I can vouch for at least *some* experience on this matter. I'm just selecting as I feed, so I know this project *could* go faster. I just don't really care. Tarantula breeding takes more than food and a heatlamp, so fixing problems hybridizing causes in tarantulas could take 10-20 years just in the species that mature quickly and breed readily.


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## imjim (Dec 21, 2007)

As Curly would say  "You giving me the double talk"  ; )

"There will never be a reason for hybridizing that benefits the hobby. Never. The closest you will ever come is a shitty rationalization for your actions that is merely a transparent coverup for what you will percieve as your benefit."


http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=111304&page=2&highlight=Hybrid


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## Stylopidae (Dec 21, 2007)

imjim said:


> As Curly would say  "You giving me the double talk"
> 
> "There will never be a reason for hybridizing that benefits the hobby. Never. The closest you will ever come is a shitty rationalization for your actions that is merely a transparent coverup for what you will percieve as your benefit."
> 
> ...



Nope...if I were to sell them, that would make me a hypocrite. If I had been the one to put them together, that would make me a hypocrite. They were already at that point when they were _given_ to me (keyword there) and they are used as feeders. Nothing more.

If you search the FS/T forums, you will find that I have never tried to sell them, trade them or give them away.

http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/search.php?do=process

Hell, search all my posts:

http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/search.php?searchid=1072724

As far as I'm aware, the only roaches I've actually sent out from my collection are my lobster roaches.

I do not approve of the hybridizing of roaches, but since it's past the point of no return I am apathetic towards it. I also recognize that the hybridizing of roaches causes the same problems that the hybridizing of tarantulas does and I can point to many a roach keeper who is frusterated by the difficulty of finding true _B. craniifer_.

I would like to work to make sure that doesn't happen to the tarantula hobby. I admittedly haven't thought about my position until relatively recently but in the past 6-8 months, I have done extensive research into other animal breeding related hobbies and have found the same negative results across the board and this has solidified my beliefs. The fact that the hobby is increasing in variety so fast that I could order at least a dozen un-named species at this very moment is what makes me passionate about it.

I can use the roach hobby as a litmus test of sorts.

http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?p=1026378&highlight=Blaberus#post1026378

The uncertianty of roach lines is a major factor in what disinterests them as pets for me.

So again...where's the hypocrisy in my actions?

I mean, you took that quote out of context because I was talking about tarantulas and not roaches but the logic still holds true and my actions remain the same despite the differences I outlined earlier.


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## scottyk (Dec 21, 2007)

Thanks for all of the helpful replies!

xhexdx- Congradulations to you as well. My advice is to sleep a lot while you still can  

imjim- You asked for an explanation and received it. If you want to have a discourse on the morality of hybridizing roaches, please post in the appropriate section as opposed to hijacking this thread.

Does anyone know where I can pick up a 12 to 24 count starter colony without having to buy a 100 lot?


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## imjim (Dec 21, 2007)

scottyk said:


> Thanks for all of the helpful replies!
> 
> xhexdx- Congradulations to you as well. My advice is to sleep a lot while you still can
> 
> ...


Sorry, please accept my apology for the unintentional hijack. . .

I am also thinking of a small scale roach colony but was told to think a bit larger as I needed various sized feeders.

Here are some sites I've found.

http://www.blapticadubia.com/

http://www.blaberus.com/


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## scottyk (Dec 21, 2007)

No problem, and thanks for the links.

I found an Arachnoboard seller who is willing to send me two dozen Lobster roaches at a great price. If you're interested, his user name is RhettusMaximus, and he has an ad a page or two back in the for sale section...

Thanks again!
Scott


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## OldHag (Dec 21, 2007)

Lobsters can climb glass. So make sure you have an ESCAPE proof enclosure!!! 
I highly recommend B. dubia. Non climbers. Fast breeders. Fat and meaty. Babys small enough to feed to slings. Great eaters.  I have had MANY different types of roaches and dubia, in my opinion, are the best feeder out there.


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## scottyk (Dec 22, 2007)

Thanks OH. I haven't purchased the Lobsters yet. Doing some research first...


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## Theonenoonenos (Jan 3, 2008)

Im thinking or raising some B. Dubia. They seem to be the best. I currently only have 3 Ts, soon to be more, really getting into this hobby.

What i am concerned with is the numbers, i can buy 15 to start a colony and i can buy crickets untill i have a colony going, but with only 3 Ts (2 adults, 1 juv) is it worth roaches as i like raising Ts from juvs so i will have lots of small Ts for a while when i get my new ones. The shop 5 mins from my house sells a tub of about 25ish crickets for £1.50.

How many would be recommended to "idle" with, for example if i had 100 in a tub and just turn the temp up every so oftern to keep the numbers up. If that makes any sense?!?


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## Travis K (Jan 3, 2008)

*I'll have extra dubia soon*

Hey there, 
I'll have extra dubias soon if you are interested.


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## dtknow (Jan 3, 2008)

I would keep a group of breeders(say, 30 or so), and every few weeks take the old adults(particularly the males but you don't want anyone dying of old age) and any surplus and put them in another container that is not heated. Here they will wait until you feed them to your T.


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## scottyk (Jan 3, 2008)

Between the good suggestions and links I got here and my own research, it seems like the small scale idea is very viable using B. dubia. 

I have a small Sterlite tub all fixed up, and an order coming Tuesday from blapticadubia.com. I also pulled a spare heat mat and thermostat out of my herp supply drawer to help with temperature control.

I plan to experiment with different temps until I get the right production rate. I'll post pics as soon as I get it all set up, and will follow up with my results...


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## desertdweller (Jan 3, 2008)

scottyk said:


> Between the good suggestions and links I got here and my own research, it seems like the small scale idea is very viable using B. dubia.
> 
> I have a small Sterlite tub all fixed up, and an order coming Tuesday from blapticadubia.com. I also pulled a spare heat mat and thermostat out of my herp supply drawer to help with temperature control.
> 
> I plan to experiment with different temps until I get the right production rate. I'll post pics as soon as I get it all set up, and will follow up with my results...


Thanks ScottyK!  I was getting ready to post the exact same thread and you saved me the trouble, as well as putting my idea into words.  I'm going to be doing the same thing.
-Sydney


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## Annie3Ponies (Jan 3, 2008)

I have LOTS of dubias and only 4 T's, 2 of which are not big eaters (C. crawshayi - 1 roach every other month/ B boehmii - 1 roach every other week).  I don't know how to ship, but if you are ever near Philly, I will give you some.


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## scottyk (Jan 3, 2008)

desertdweller said:


> Thanks ScottyK!  I was getting ready to post the exact same thread and you saved me the trouble, as well as putting my idea into words.  I'm going to be doing the same thing.
> -Sydney


You're welcome! This site is the single greatest resource out there for those who have a serious interest in properly keeping tarantulas. Any small contribution I can make back to the data here is my pleasure. I will definitely follow up with the pics next week, and inform everyone on how it goes...

Annie- Thanks to you as well. Have you looked around to see if there is a local shop who might be interested in some of them? There is a good place near me that should give me some store credit for my extras as they don't have Dubia there. Even practically giving them away for a few cents each is better then buying crix.....


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## scottyk (Jan 3, 2008)

Travis K said:


> Hey there,
> I'll have extra dubias soon if you are interested.


Thanks to you as well Travis. I already have an order in that's shipping Monday. The offer is much appreciated though....


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## Travis K (Jan 3, 2008)

scottyk said:


> Thanks to you as well Travis. I already have an order in that's shipping Monday. The offer is much appreciated though....


you wont be disappointed, i love my B. Dubias, they are great!  And they save me a boat load of $money$


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## Theonenoonenos (Jan 3, 2008)

I have found a supplier but they are selling 15 mixed males & female that arent quite mature, how long roughly would it be to get a colony of about 50??


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