# What is the second biggest pede???



## jayer10 (Oct 23, 2006)

I know the scolopendra gigantea is the biggest, but which is considered the second biggest? Is it the mau chau or the haitian giant? I want to puchase the second biggest, since i can't find the gigantea anywhere. Can anyone help me out with this?


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## CopperInMyVeins (Oct 23, 2006)

Probably another South American species that would be extremely hard to get, there are a few pretty different looking centipedes that are referred to as either S. gigantea or S. galapagoensis.  The latter are usually greenish black with striped legs, and get huge, not in the trade much though, at least not in the US.


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## sick4x4 (Oct 23, 2006)

http://www.tarantulaspiders.com/pages/centipedegallery.htm heres a  link that should help you out


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## CopperInMyVeins (Oct 23, 2006)

Funny enough I was just browsing that page without seeing you post it here, really interesting, so many species on there that I want to see more of.


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## sick4x4 (Oct 23, 2006)

yeah i know im waiting till he starts getting a few!!! i had to pass on a S.g and im still kicking myself for it...it was 10" just the price was to much!!!:wall:  now the price doesnt seem that high lol!!!! i probably would of paid more>>>>>>>>


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## jayer10 (Oct 24, 2006)

which one (that is affordable) is the second biggest? not including those viridicornis or galapagoensis species. I know those get huge. Viridicornis is my fav. Wish i could get one of those but i know that will never happen.:8o


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## Blackrose (Oct 24, 2006)

Hi

You ask about the second biggest pede, but what about the biggest?
Do you know for 100% that gigantea is the biggest?

Regards
           Andi


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## jayer10 (Oct 24, 2006)

well, that's what everybody says. I don't know that for sure. I heard that rumor about the galapagoensis thought. 16-20?? "  or something like that. Just looking for something that big and not tooo expensive and rare.


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## Steven (Oct 24, 2006)

mmmm,

hard to tell,... as size can vary much in the same specie.

I think "officially" Sc.heros is on the second place right after gigantea
then Sc.subspinipes dehaani and then Sc.alternans,... "officially" i said 

(according to Attems' Scolopendromorpha keys 1932)


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## Steven (Oct 24, 2006)

Blackrose said:


> Do you know for 100% that gigantea is the biggest?


Attems stated gigantea to be the biggest scolopendra spec. (265 mm BL)
a more up-to-date publication say 300 mm but the table with records on different locations (in the same publication) the total BL of specimen found is between 140mm and 240mm, Sc.galapagoensis between 130mm and 200mm

ref.
(Shelley, R. M. and S.B. Kiser, 2000. Neotype designation and a diagnostic account for the centipede, Scolopendra gigantea L. 1758, with an account of S. galapagoensis Bollman 1889. Tropical Zoology 13: 159-170, 2000)


I think if all people who are claiming to have seen or have a 350mm  Sc.gigantea should post a picture of it next to a ruler 
(same goes for other spec. too  )

ow yeah,... measuring a Scolopendrid goes from headplate
without the antennae to the last tergite without the ultimate legs !
= BodyLength = BL


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## Nlneff (Oct 24, 2006)

They always shrink when a ruler shows up.

Seriously, I imagine its not possible to know for sure which is biggest, there is probably a lot of overlap in size, some may have smaller average sizes, bigger maximum sizes, geographic variations etc.  I think the best you can do is check the reported sizes in the literature (with a grain of salt) and say one is more likely to be bigger etc.

They are all way too big for me.


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## jayer10 (Oct 24, 2006)

i was hoping that the mau chau would come in second, but i guess not. what the biggest mau chau has anyone ever heard of? and how thick?


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## jayer10 (Oct 24, 2006)

i would've never guessed that heros would be in second.


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## Steven (Oct 24, 2006)

jayer10 said:


> i was hoping that the mau chau would come in second, but i guess not. what the biggest mau chau has anyone ever heard of? and how thick?


a big sc.subspinipes dehaani is bigger then a small gigantea or a medium heros (if that helps ya out  ) 

why don't ya just look out for a specie with nice coloration ?
instead of buying them for their size ? :?


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## jayer10 (Oct 24, 2006)

i like the big size for some reason, althought i do like certain ones because of color (like the malaysian bronze). i wonder how big those get.


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## scolomonster (Oct 24, 2006)

mau chau is the second biggest (not including all those others rarities). Heros is big also mostly skinny though not in thickness


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## 236260 (Oct 24, 2006)

Steven said:


> why don't ya just look out for a specie with nice coloration ?
> instead of buying them for their size ? :?


I get it. There are a number of unique features I would like to have in my collection, and impressive size is among them. That said, Steven, I have never coveted an animal more than the red and blue pede you posted here:

http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=69192&highlight=red+blue

I'd rather have that than a fire breathing dragon.


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## jayer10 (Oct 24, 2006)

236260 said:


> I get it. There are a number of unique features I would like to have in my collection, and impressive size is among them. That said, Steven, I have never coveted an animal more than the red and blue pede you posted here:
> 
> http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=69192&highlight=red+blue
> 
> I'd rather have that than a fire breathing dragon.


I couldn't have said it any better. Impressive size is my #1 priority for the moment. I would like some other ones also later on though.


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## Galapoheros (Oct 24, 2006)

Sc heros can get pretty large.  I've posted this pic before.  But here it is again because your eyes are easier to believe than words.  It's an S h castaneiceps that is 24 cm head to tergite.  I've looked around allot, the big ones are hard for me to come by.  I showed this pede to someone here and he said, "yea that's pretty big.  I've seen bigger ones at....."  I wonder if there is a "giant" gene floating around in the species or if it's environmental or what:? .  The big ones are kind of rare, ...to me anyway.  I read about an old theory someone had about there being many subspecies.  From what I read, there were so many subtle differences in his collected specimens, that he just gave up trying to prove it.  I read something like that years ago.


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## scolomonster (Oct 24, 2006)

that's an amazing picture, that is a gigantea right? one of the most amazing pictures i've seen yet! very nice


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## Galapoheros (Oct 24, 2006)

It's a Scolopendra heros castaneiceps found in S. Austin Tx.  They can turn brown like that when they get older.


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## sick4x4 (Oct 24, 2006)

very nice i haven't seen one get that size very impressive


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## scolomonster (Oct 24, 2006)

Hmmm, i was wondering cuz most don't look like that. I thought it was gigantea at first. You seem to know a lot, do most pedes get close to that thickness?


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## scolomonster (Oct 24, 2006)

would a mau chau get about that thick?


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## Galapoheros (Oct 24, 2006)

scolomonster said:


> Hmmm, i was wondering cuz most don't look like that. I thought it was gigantea at first. You seem to know a lot, do most pedes get close to that thickness?


No, I don't know a whole lot.  They are just interesting to me and I mostly pay attention to the local species.  I don't read a lot of scientific data about them.  But I do watch them a lot.  I saw my first one somebody caught with snake tongs in 1985 on a field trip and I couldn't believe the school was going to kill it as a specimen .  But that's what the field trip was for.  I knew I had to get some after that:drool: .  When I'd get a collection going, I'd get mites and the centipedes would slowly die.  Then I found this site and learned about mite control.  So my pede world is going ok now.  I have read that, in general, pedes will widen as their length growth slows.  I know what you mean, most don't look like the one in the pic.  I'm hoping to get babies next year to see what they look like.  That would be interesting.


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## spinnekop (Oct 25, 2006)

jayer10 said:


> I know the scolopendra gigantea is the biggest, but which is considered the second biggest? Is it the mau chau or the haitian giant? I want to puchase the second biggest, since i can't find the gigantea anywhere. Can anyone help me out with this?


I am sorry but I am not convinced that S gigantea is the biggest.
Some years ago I had a presumed S galapagoensis with bodylenght of 13'' (330mm). (well, at least I know for sure it was not a gigantea. The animals body was black, black/white banded legs and red antenae. Very alike to the pic on this thread http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=7850 ). She died short after het latest molt. I still have the skin. As requested by Steven yesterday  I will post a pic tomorrow. Ofcourse, the skin size is not the same as the true animal but it will give an idea.


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## scolomonster (Oct 25, 2006)

i think the one your talking about is a scolopendra viridicornis. i've heard they don't get as big as gigantea but they sure look bigger.


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## spinnekop (Oct 26, 2006)

scolomonster said:


> i think the one your talking about is a scolopendra viridicornis. i've heard they don't get as big as gigantea but they sure look bigger.


Haha, don't get as big as gigantea??? Well, here's a surprise for you then.
This is the picture I promised.
I apologize for the bad quality. I don't have a hi-tech digital camera.
Anyway, the pic shows the skin (which shrunk a bit during drying) and unfortunately it's already damaged (eaten) by very little beetles. It's about 10 years old and I couldn't prevent these critters from eating the skin. Nevertheless it still gives an idea of the size of the centipede. The ruler measures a body of 315mm (12,5") which is a lot bigger then a big gigantea! The life animal was even a bit bigger (as I said.. 330mm !)


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## CopperInMyVeins (Oct 26, 2006)

Well, someone put their money where their mouth is.


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## Steven (Oct 26, 2006)

spinnekop said:


> Haha, don't get as big as gigantea??? Well, here's a surprise for you then.


Now only the question raises,...
what if yours was a rare colorform of Sc.gigantea ?  
If the Id of it was based on colors only, we have a problem no ?     

Geert,... please bring along that skin next SIT-meeting :} 
i really would love to see it in "life"  

that must have been a really impressive Scolopendrid alive  
:worship: :worship: :worship:


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## scolomonster (Oct 26, 2006)

spinnekop said:


> Haha, don't get as big as gigantea??? Well, here's a surprise for you then.
> This is the picture I promised.
> I apologize for the bad quality. I don't have a hi-tech digital camera.
> Anyway, the pic shows the skin (which shrunk a bit during drying) and unfortunately it's already damaged (eaten) by very little beetles. It's about 10 years old and I couldn't prevent these critters from eating the skin. Nevertheless it still gives an idea of the size of the centipede. The ruler measures a body of 315mm (12,5") which is a lot bigger then a big gigantea! The life animal was even a bit bigger (as I said.. 330mm !)


Looks to me like your is a gigantea and not viridicornis. Your link shows a picture of a Viridicornis.


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## spinnekop (Oct 26, 2006)

scolomonster said:


> Looks to me like your is a gigantea and not viridicornis. Your link shows a picture of a Viridicornis.


Yes but it only looks that way. I think any big Scolopendra skin is reddish. I assure you, the pede was completely black and looking a lot like the link I mentioned. If for sure that's a viridicornis, well, then this is a skin of a viridicornis then. I only presumed it's a galapagoensis because I couldn't believe that viridicornis could get that big.
Maybe Steven van determine the skin  when I send it? :?

To Steven: A black color form of gigantea??? That's the same as discovering a UFO in your back yard. I don't think black gigantea's exist. Anyway, I will give you the skin. I hope you can identify the specie then.


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## scolomonster (Oct 26, 2006)

Oh, i missed the part where you said it was black before, sry. I thought that was the original color. To me galapoensis and viridicornis look the same. Probably the sames species, just found in different parts of S. america. Very excellent picture though. I can only imagine how big it was when it was alive. I bet you were devestated when it died huh? Do you have any pictures of it when it was alive?


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## Steven (Oct 26, 2006)

scolomonster said:


> to me galapoensis and viridicornis look the same. Probably the sames species, just found in different parts of S. america.


maybe you should read *this topic* i once started


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## Steven (Oct 26, 2006)

spinnekop said:


> To Steven: A black color form of gigantea??? That's the same as discovering a UFO in your back yard. I don't think black gigantea's exist. Anyway, I will give you the skin. I hope you can identify the specie then.


Many of my gigantea have really black parts on their body,... so tmo totally black gigantea's wouldn't be such a discovery  

ID based on an old skin is really hard,... are some parts of the ultimate legs still in tact ?


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## Galapoheros (Oct 26, 2006)

spinnekop said:


> Haha, don't get as big as gigantea??? Well, here's a surprise for you then.
> This is the picture I promised.
> I apologize for the bad quality. I don't have a hi-tech digital camera.
> Anyway, the pic shows the skin (which shrunk a bit during drying) and unfortunately it's already damaged (eaten) by very little beetles. It's about 10 years old and I couldn't prevent these critters from eating the skin. Nevertheless it still gives an idea of the size of the centipede. The ruler measures a body of 315mm (12,5") which is a lot bigger then a big gigantea! The life animal was even a bit bigger (as I said.. 330mm !)


Thanks for that pic!  My brain can't imagine seeing that thing alive.  I'm glad that viridicornis vs. galapagoensis thread was brought up again too.  I was looking for that the other day.  Also, the pics we see are only a few examples of the size these things can reach.  There has got to be some real monsters out of the millions of wild ones in the jungles we don't see.


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## spinnekop (Oct 27, 2006)

scolomonster said:


> Oh, i missed the part where you said it was black before, sry. I thought that was the original color. To me galapoensis and viridicornis look the same. Probably the sames species, just found in different parts of S. america. Very excellent picture though. I can only imagine how big it was when it was alive. I bet you were devestated when it died huh? Do you have any pictures of it when it was alive?


Yes I was devastated when it died. I tried to preserve the specimen but while drying it schrunk and deformed. On top of that, it started to rot and injections with formaldehyde didn't help. Later I 've seen prety good preserved scolopendra on fairs but I still don't know how they do it.
Anyway, the skin is all I have now.
I am so gratefull to Steven to open the treath "Viridicornis vs galapagoensis" again. The last tergite of the skin is still intact and it does not have this Mediakiel as explained by Steven. Also, as for what I remember from the life specimen, the antennae were even a bit brighter colored black/red then shown in Steven's picture.
So, its more likely a galapagoensis then viridicornis then.
However, this still doesn't prove which is the biggest specie since adult sizes vary a lot and it's always possible that individuals of any specie reach an unusual big size.
By the way, I did take a picture of the living animal but I didn't had a digital camera at that time and for my reflex camera it was too dark inside and the pic failed. It's very unclear but I try to find it back and scan it and post it here. Maybe it can give an idea... ?


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## Steven (Oct 27, 2006)

Hey Geert
thanx for checking it

I'm getting more and more convinced on the occurence of dark colorforms of gigantea's (another reason to never judge on colors/size to ID a Scolopendrid)
i've just recently seen some pictures of what's most likely the black form of gigantea with striped legs (overall look really resembles galapagoensis)

Do you remember the collection data of yours ?



*edit
PS: ik heb je zonet een mail gestuurd Geert


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## spinnekop (Oct 27, 2006)

```
I'm getting more and more convinced on the occurence of dark colorforms of gigantea's (another reason to never judge on colors/size to ID a Scolopendrid)
i've just recently seen some pictures of what's most likely the black form of gigantea with striped legs (overall look really resembles galapagoensis)
```
Waaw, black gigantea ?!!! That's fantastic. Can you show pics? I will take back my words now :clap: 
But now I have a serious problem.... How do I know it's not a galapagoensis but gigantea? The rear legs are destroyed by beetles... :8o


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## Steven (Dec 5, 2006)

@spinnekop (Geert) ,..
i'll post the answer in here to share it with the other members,...
yours was 99% sure a Gigantea  i've examined the skin and only the amount of smooth antennae segments was the missing key to gigantea (antennae were destroyed as Geert posted earlier,...) but with its 30cm Bl lenght i'm quite sure it was the black colorform of Sc.gigantea, so it was probarly from North-East Venezuela

(i'll post some pictures later this week)


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## spinnekop (Dec 5, 2006)

SUPER ! Thank you for your update Steven :clap: 

I will never doubt a true expert's decision :worship: 
I am convinced now it's gigantea. I am also thrilled that BLACK gigantea seem to exist (cause the centipede's color was as black as black could be). Only the skin after molt looked reddish.
I notice the pic I posted earlier disapeared :?  I try to post it again.

I can't wait to see your pictures of the black gigantea's.


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## erm1981 (Dec 15, 2006)

Check out this giant black .  I couldnt believe the size of this thing on this video i found on you tube. 

scolopendra viridicornis 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3APJA0EedSE


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