# Chilean Rose Hair Dessert Substrate?



## Legato1243 (Nov 14, 2006)

All the recommended substrates on the Internet are all ways Vermiculite or soil, But I read in a book that a dessert setup is just fine for a Grammostola Rosea, like 50/50 Sand and gravel. Is soil or vermiculite the way to go, or is a dessert set up fine for a Chilean Rose hair. If a dessert setup is ok, what is the best sand and gravel to use to make a dessert substrate and what kind of dessert plants can you put in the cage to make it look better?? Responses Appreciated!!


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## Nerri1029 (Nov 14, 2006)

You will find many suggested reasons for why sand isn't used or not recommended for T's if you search these boards.
But I have no hard proof, other than the fact that many, many people keep their rosea on peat or soil or similar stuff.

I mix in varying amounts of the Walnut Shell into my cocofiber and peat mix to get different soil types. I also add varying amounts of cactus potting soil.

frankly a rosea will be happy on most substrates as long as it's dry.. 

this thread is should be read by everyone:
http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=5292


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## elyanalyous (Nov 14, 2006)

i wouldn't put sand and gravel in with my rosea if i were you. the sand is a great breeding house of bacteria and molds if it gets wet, and that particular sub mix will possibly scratch the underside of the poor t. Not to mention, if it were to climb and fall, the substrate would not be able to cushen it.

i just use plain potting soil or peat moss. as for plants, you can use fake ones (best idea becasue of how dry they like it) or pothos would work, but keep it planted in the pot so you can remove it if it dies. when your shopping for a plant, look for womething that

1. needs little water
2. needs little light
3. doesn't have thorns/spikes (like cactus)
4. doesn't take the tank over complelty


another thing to keep in mind is if there is a plant in there, your t might have a hard time finding crickets (lots of hiding places)

i say to keep them off of sand, becasue when i got mine thats what she was on. her tank stank from the bacteria in the sand.


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## Drachenjager (Nov 14, 2006)

dry peat moss is what i use and my rosea seems to be quite content on it. she didnt appreciate it when it was still moist tho


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## GartenSpinnen (Nov 14, 2006)

Many people can say this and that about sand but let me tell you something i have witnessed with Ts on sand, the local petstore has housed many tarantulas on sand since i have been going in there in the last 3 months and they have housed many on other substrates. All the Ts that they have had on sand have died and all the Ts on other substrates have all lived. I dont know the specifics of why not to keep them on dry sand, but what i do know is after witnessing this i would not do it! Some people say that bark substrate is no good, but i mix it with peat and coco fiber and it works great.


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## Amanda (Nov 14, 2006)

I use Schultz Cactus and Succulent Mix.  It contains reed-sedge peat, sphagnum peat moss, perlite, and washed sand.  It has all the benefits of peat, but it packs better and is much less dusty.  If I feel like it after I set up the tank, I sprinkle a BIT of play sand on the surface of the substrate, and sometimes a few pieces here and there of aquarium gravel.  This way, your T has a good soft, but solid substrate, and you can control its aesthetic appearance.  This potting mix is also perfect for any plants you should choose to include in your desert setup... very convenient.  You'll find that nearly all desert succulents die without tons of sunlight tho.


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## elyanalyous (Nov 14, 2006)

i think the reason t's die when kept on sand is it is unforgiving, they fall and slplit, they sufforcate (remember thier lungs are on the bottom!) but i like the suggestion that amanda put forward...where do you get it btw? i think i want to try it next time i rehouse.


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## krtrman (Nov 14, 2006)

i would stay away from sand. a lot of different critters can get respiratory infections from the fine dust that gets stirred up from sand. if you are looking to kind of mix up the substrate for a specific look, try corn cob bedding. i use it for some of my scorps, spiders, and my crabs. (yes I have crabs. go ahead and snicker.) i always mix it though and wait before putting your critters in as it does have some dust but usually only when i pour it from the bag. i like the way it looks when mixed. it makes for a good substrate. just stay away from its use in moisture sensitive individuals as it tends to smell bad when wet and may allow the growth of bacteria if constantly wet. (i cannot backup this statement as i have no personal experience. just an educated guess. especially if you feed any  items like pinkies or the sort.) I hope that this helps.


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## ancientscout (Nov 14, 2006)

_Grammostola Rosea_ originates from a rather large area from Costa Rica to Honduras which technically would be considered tropical, but _G.Rosea_ for the most part lives in areas considered scrubland, or scrub brush mostly. Just setup and keep these dry. They don't need moisture in the form of humidity anyway. Almost all species with a few exceptions can be kept dry and should be.


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## tarangela2 (Nov 14, 2006)

*No Sand*

my experience with sand was the crickets laid eggs and then i had like a thousand babies which the T did not appreciate at all. 

i have a g. rosea  use a 50/50 mix of regular potting soil and crushed walnut shells (lizard litter at the pet store) works well, looks nice, easy to clean up, no smell, and the T can burrow as well in it as anything else.


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## Amanda (Nov 15, 2006)

elyanalyous said:


> i think the reason t's die when kept on sand is it is unforgiving, they fall and slplit, they sufforcate (remember thier lungs are on the bottom!) but i like the suggestion that amanda put forward...where do you get it btw? i think i want to try it next time i rehouse.


I love it!

I've found it in the Walmart garden department, but Schultz is a pretty well-known brand, so I'm sure other places must carry it.  Here's a link to the spot on the company webpage.  You can atleast see what the packaging looks like.  I've been able to get it in really small bags, which is great since rehousing doesn't happen all that often.  The small bags I've gotten have always been under $2.00.

http://www.schultz.com/ProductCategories/Soilsamendments/CactusSoil/


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## Nerri1029 (Nov 15, 2006)

Amanda said:


> I love it!
> 
> I've found it in the Walmart garden department, but Schultz is a pretty well-known brand, so I'm sure other places must carry it.  Here's a link to the spot on the company webpage.  You can atleast see what the packaging looks like.  I've been able to get it in really small bags, which is great since rehousing doesn't happen all that often.  The small bags I've gotten have always been under $2.00.
> 
> http://www.schultz.com/ProductCategories/Soilsamendments/CactusSoil/


Yup that's the stuff..
I add it to my cocofiber... 
I realize all that mixing is probably overkill.. but hey it makes me happy. :-D


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## Becky (Nov 15, 2006)

My T's are on 100% coconut fibre. I love this substrate..prefer it to vermiculite and peat.. i also use sphagnum moss in there aswell  all of my T's do fine on it


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## Scott C. (Nov 15, 2006)

Legato1243 said:


> All the recommended substrates on the Internet are all ways Vermiculite or soil, But I read in a book that a dessert setup is just fine for a Grammostola Rosea, like 50/50 Sand and gravel. Is soil or vermiculite the way to go, or is a dessert set up fine for a Chilean Rose hair. If a dessert setup is ok, what is the best sand and gravel to use to make a dessert substrate and what kind of dessert plants can you put in the cage to make it look better?? Responses Appreciated!!


I mix sand,peat, and pebbles for desert sp.. My rosea *seems* more comfortable than she ever has before. She burrows. She doesn't roam. She eats more regularly. She has become more hostile to intrusion. All these things tell me that sand is fine. We aren't talking beach here, just a substrate that more closely resembles a desert than a flower box......... As for plants, just use dry grasses. It looks good, natural, and doesn't require water. Just an opinion folks.


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## Alice (Nov 15, 2006)

i agree - a peat or soil mix in which the rosea can burrow and which will make a fall less dangerous is the way to go. sand just gets in the lungs and doesn't allow the spider to dig a burrow if she wishes to.


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## ancientscout (Nov 15, 2006)

Scott C. is right on. Sand can act as a binder in soil and thus be supportive when it comes to burrow construction. I didn't want to get into recommendations here but here is how I build a desert substrate which works very well. If you imagine that the total 100% substrate is divided into fifths it is mixed like this-
Two fifths are of Organic Potting Soil such as All Organic Black Gold Potting Soil.

One fifth is a 50/50 mixture of pea gravel and fine pumice, which can be obtained from any sand and gravel facility in your area. For the small amount you would need they may even give you some for free. I usually keep a  pre-mixed five gallon bucket mixture around with some in it for future uses. 

One fifth of fine sherded garden bark for texture and a more natural appearance.

One fifth of Canadian Peat Moss. [Not the fiber block stuff.]

Lastly to this I throw in a few hands full of sand. This depends on the size of the enclosure and other factors. For a standard shoebox size container it might consist of say 3-4 hands full of sand. I also sprinkle some sand on the final substrate surface for a natural appearance as well. Not much, just so you get a good feel for desert topsoil.

Mix this all up well and it produces a very nice desert substrate. Keep captives dry [no misting] on this. Lastly to this I usually add some river rocks of various sizes. The reason I use these as they are almost always round and smooth and of great size variation, and require only sun sterilization for use. This makes for a great setup.


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## Scott C. (Nov 15, 2006)

Alice said:


> i agree - a peat or soil mix in which the rosea can burrow and which will make a fall less dangerous is the way to go. sand just gets in the lungs and doesn't allow the spider to dig a burrow if she wishes to.


This sentiment always throws me. Peat dust is finer than any sand will ever be. If sand clogs the lungs, why not the dust from peat that is abundant with any disturbance? Moist peat doesn't have this problem, but dry peat, like what you'd probably have in a desert set up, surely would....


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## spinneret (Nov 15, 2006)

*rosea subs*

I have 3 rosea 2 pink and 1 grey, one of them is over 20 yrs old it was given to me about a month ago by a local pet shop owner and believe it or not the T was living on stones since i was 5 i'm now 28, so i think they must be pretty hardy and if the temperature is right they will survive with adequate water supplied, but now i have it i have changed the substrate to coconut fibre and within a few days it had made a little burrow under its much loved log that i was advised to take with me by the pet shop owner. I think surely the rosea is the hardiest species in the tarantula world...;P


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## ancientscout (Nov 15, 2006)

Scott C. What I may have failed to mention above was that of course when I mix the potting soil with the peat moss I always moisten it to begin with to a degree. Then I allow it to dry in the sun for a short period of time so it is just cool to the touch and dust free, then use it. 
The other thing is everyone on this post can go around and around about substrates, dust, this and that without ever getting anywhere. Fact is, I make yearly trips to the Arizona deserts which I've done for the last 30 years. The substrate down there is comprised of various sizes of aggregates, plenty of sand, dirt of various degrees of types, and anything else that blows in or around. If it were an issue then why would Aphonopelma chalcodes and it's varients dig into river banks, hillsides, and everywhere else? I think that common play sand, or construction sand may be a problem in an enclosed habitat but lets remember that common sense has to prevail here. Sand makes an excellent binder to soil and helps retain burrows if proper combinations are used. I've been Keep tarantulas for 36 years and never had a problem with this type of substrate mixture.


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## Heatherbear (Apr 20, 2009)

I'm new to tarantulas,we put the same substrate that the pet store had in the cage there ,the "repti-sand" in her cage. We've only had her for a week,should we change the substrate,she's already made a small web near the water dish,I don't want to stress her out. any advice would be great


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## Mushroom Spore (Apr 20, 2009)

If you've only had her for a week, she isn't nearly settled in yet. Better to change it now than wait, let her settle in, and then change it and make her settle in all over again.


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## hotguy92 (Apr 20, 2009)

*rose*

ok what about humidity they need some    dont they?


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## Mushroom Spore (Apr 20, 2009)

hotguy92 said:


> ok what about humidity they need some    dont they?


G. rosea needs no additional humidity whatsoever, it just upsets them. If it rains outside and the basic humidity in the air goes up they won't care, but don't do anything to raise the humidity in the tank - dampness and poor ventilation is bad.


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## Heatherbear (Apr 21, 2009)

thanks! we are going to use drier bed-a-beast and maybe mix it with a little organic potting soil. Does Walmart sell organic potting soil?


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## wedge07 (Apr 22, 2009)

ancientscout said:


> _Grammostola Rosea_ originates from a rather large area from Costa Rica to Honduras which technically would be considered tropical, but _G.Rosea_ for the most part lives in areas considered scrubland, or scrub brush mostly. Just setup and keep these dry. They don't need moisture in the form of humidity anyway. Almost all species with a few exceptions can be kept dry and should be.


G. rosea are more commonly found North of the Atacama desert in Chile.  It is true they have been found in the places you have mentioned but their true origin is Chile.  The specimens found elsewhere may have been introduced during export from Chile.  It is very interesting that they can live in such vastly different climates though.


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