# List of Pamphobeteus species in the hobby



## xenesthis (Nov 29, 2018)

Pamphobeteus cf. antinous Arana Polita or “Chicken Spider”

Pamphobeteus cf. antinous (Pucallpa, Peru) “Big Black”

Pamphobeteus cf. "insignis" (HOBBY) - has xmas pattern in spiderlings

Pamphobeteus sp. “aquatica” (Colombia)

Pamphobeteus sp. “arenillas”

Pamphobteus sp. “borealis”

Pamphobeteus sp. “Calli Hills”

Pamphobeteus sp. “cascada”

Pamphobeteus sp. “conani”

Pamphobteus sp. “costa” (Ecuador’s coastal province of Manabi)

Pamphobeteus sp. “cupreus”

Pamphobeteus sp. “duran”

Pamphobeteus sp. "Ecuadorian Golden Flame Birdeater" (type II) or South Ecuador type II, Rarely offered!

Pamphobeteus sp. “esmeraldas”

Pamphobeteus verdolaga = same as = Pamphobeteus Sp. antioquia = “Paisa” (Colombia)

Pamphobeteus sp. “hexa”

Pamphobeteus sp. “flamminfera” (Ecuador)

Pamphobeteus sp. “magna”

Pamphobeteus sp. “mascara”(Ecuador, near Manabi)

Pamphobeteus sp. “machala” (Ecuador)

Pamphobeteus sp. “manabi”

Pamphobeteus sp. “montana” (Colombia)

Pamphobeteus sp. “playtomma”

Pamphobeteus sp. “penta”

Pamphobeteus sp. “Pucallpa” (Peru)

Pamphobeteus sp. “rabioso”

Pamphobeteus sp. “rios caldas”

Pamphobeteus sp. “rio urubamba”

Pamphobeteus sp. “Santo Domingo Goliath”

Pamphobeteus sp. “solaris” (Peru)

Pamphobeteus sp. “tigris”

Pamphobeteus sp. “urubamba” 

Pamphobeteus sp. “ultima”

Pamphobeteus sp. “volcano”

Pamphobeteus sp. “wuschig”

Pamphobeteus angusti (Ecuador)

Pamphobeteus crassifemur (Brazil)

Pamphobeteus ferox (Colombia)

Pamphobeteus fortis (dark form/Colombia)

Pamphobteus fortis (light form/ Satipo, Peru)

Pamphobeteus grandis (Brazil)

Pamphobeteus insignis (Colombia) - no xmas pattern in the spiderlings

Pamphobeteus ornatus (Colombia/Panama)

Pamphobeteus nigricolor (Ecuador/Colombia/Brazil)

Pamphobeteus petersi (Ecuador/Peru) “Peruvian Giant Backfire Birdeater"

Pamphobeteus ultramarinus (Ecuador)

Pamphobeteus vespertinus (Ecuador)
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ADD any known Pamphobeteus species to this list and post a good pic if you have one. Thanks!

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## KezyGLA (Nov 30, 2018)

From my notes-

Here’s a list of Pamphobeteus available in the hobby - some are extremely rare, some have been unavailable for some years now - I’ve categorised them into their locations in the wild.




Ecuador -


Pamphobeteus spec  Platyomma

Pamphobeteus spec Machala

Pamphobeteus spec Duran

Pamphobeteus spec Magna

Pamphobeteus spec Manabi

Pamphobeteus spec Santo Domingo (small)

Pamphobeteus Ultramarinus

Pamphobeteus spec Goliath

Pamphobeteus spec Vespertinus

Pamphobeteus spec nigricolor

Pamphobeteus spec Tigris

Pamphobeteus spec Esmeraldas

Pamphobeteus Augusti

Pamphobeteus spec Costa

Pamphobeteus spec Cascada

Pamphobeteus spec Flammifera

Pamphobeteus spec Mascara

Pamphobeteus Orientalis

Pamphobeteus spec ‘North Ecuador’

Pamphobeteus spec South Ecuador II

Pamphobeteus spec Volcano


Peru -


Pamphobeteus cf Antinous (Big Black)

Pamphobeteus cf Antinous (Purple Earth)

Pamphobeteus cf Antinous (Lightning Blue)

Pamphobeteus cf Antinous (Iquitos)

Pamphobeteus cf Rio Urubamba

Pamphobeteus cf Rio Itaya

Pamphobeteus cf Pucallpa

Pamphobeteus cf Arana Polita

Pamphobeteus spec Wuschig

Pamphobeteus spec Petersi

Pamphobeteus spec Huallaga

Pamphobeteus spec Selva

Pamphobeteus spec ‘SJ’


Colombia -


Pamphobeteus spec Solaris

Pamphobeteus spec Cupreus

Pamphobeteus Insignis

Pamphobeteus nigricolor

Pamphobeteus affinis nigricolor II

Pamphobeteus Ferox

Pamphobeteus Fortis

Pamphobeteus Ornatus (Rio Dagua - Panama)

Pamphobeteus spec Antioquia

Pamphobeteus spec Aquatica

Pamphobeteus spec Borealis

Pamphobeteus spec Caldas

Pamphobeteus spec Conani

Pamphobeteus spec Hexa

Pamphobeteus spec Montana

Pamphobeteus spec Paisa

Pamphobeteus spec Penta

Pamphobeteus spec ‘Q’

Pamphobeteus spec ‘SF’

Pamphobeteus spec Ultima


Bolivia -


Pamphobeteus Antinous.


Brazil -


Pamphobeteus  Crassifemur

Pamphobeteus Grandis


I don’t think any will breach the 10 inch leg span.

Reactions: Like 4 | Informative 1


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## c.h.esteban (Nov 30, 2018)

i´m afraid your *"Pamphobteus fortis (light form/ Satipo, Peru)" *is just a ghost, which appeared later in another country under another new pet trade name.



xenesthis said:


> Pamphobeteus verdolaga = same as = Pamphobeteus Sp. antioquia = “Paisa”


is this a guess or is there any reliable source?

bye


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## boina (Nov 30, 2018)

You know what? I've just decided I'm not getting any more Pamphos. This is just absolute chaos!

I mean, I wanted a big black spider, so I got 'antinous'. Turns out whatever I got stayed moderately big (around 7", if even that), never grew and died 3 years later (WC).

Then I wanted a spider where the female retained some color, so I got insignis. Turns out what I got is cf. insignis and my AF is now a plain brown spider... (and pretty 'small', around 6.5")

Further I've got a 'nigricolor' - and I have no clue which of the nigricolor forms that is, but it's my biggest Pamph at 7"+

And the 'vespertinus', which, according to Kezy's list is cf. vespertinus and they are tiny, less than 6".

Oh, and I forgot the petersi, another plain brown spider that 's pretty small (6").

All in all the Pamphos I got have not lived up to their reputation of being these really large spiders.

Reactions: Agree 4 | Informative 1


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## Venom1080 (Nov 30, 2018)

And people wonder why I've never owned a Pampho.. I like knowing what I have, and hobby Pamphobeteus are a mess. Cool genus, but nothing special.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 5


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## antinous (Nov 30, 2018)

Venom1080 said:


> And people wonder why I've never owned a Pampho.. I like knowing what I have, and hobby Pamphobeteus are a mess. Cool genus, but nothing special.


get outta here

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 3


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## The Grym Reaper (Nov 30, 2018)

I have the "Big Black" Peruvian antinous and I'll probably get an sp. 'solaris' when they're much cheaper but I don't really care for the genus otherwise.

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## xenesthis (Nov 30, 2018)

Boina,

> This is just absolute chaos!

I agree that the genus needs revising BADLY.

>I mean, I wanted a big black spider, so I got 'antinous'. Turns out whatever I got stayed moderately big (around 7", if even that), never grew and died 3 years later (WC).

Sorry, not sure what you bought, but real P. antinous average around 7.75"-8.5" inches and can go 9.5".

>Then I wanted a spider where the female retained some color, so I got insignis. Turns out what I got is cf. insignis and my AF is now a plain brown spider... (and pretty >'small', around 6.5")

yeah, I'll agree on that one. I've had the REAL Colombian P. insignis. The females are very stocky and get to around 8". The mature males are very colorful. I've had a few of this species. The REAL P. insignis spiderlings lack a xmas tree pattern on their abdomens. This 2018 Europ import of P. cf. "insignis" are NOT the same and some speculate they are P. sp. "machala" instead.

> Further I've got a 'nigricolor' - and I have no clue which of the nigricolor forms that is, but it's my biggest Pamph at 7"+

Not sure what that was, but P. nigricolor from Colombia can get to 8.75" and are very stocky. I have had many get to that size before.

>And the 'vespertinus', which, according to Kezy's list is cf. vespertinus and they are tiny, less than 6".

I wouldn't call 6" "tiny", but I'll agree the real P. vespertinus are not the largest in the genus. I've had them get to around 7". They have slender leg compared to the other Pamphos and are super high-strung and fairly aggressive.

>Oh, and I forgot the petersi, another plain brown spider that 's pretty small (6").

For the real P. peters, I respectfully disagree. I have some females that are over 8.5" now. Post molt, the bright red abdomens and black body/legs are beautiful. 

>All in all the Pamphos I got have not lived up to their reputation of being these really large spiders.

I'm sorry that you have been getting some unimpressive spiders. I've been keeping Pamphobeteus since the early '90s and I would disagree. They are large 7" to 10" tarantulas that have a couple of females with nice color and all of the mature males are stunning. Great display spiders that are active, eat frequently and on big prey and are very impressive with their large leg spans.

Reactions: Like 3 | Agree 3 | Helpful 1


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## xenesthis (Nov 30, 2018)

>i´m afraid your *"Pamphobteus fortis (light form/ Satipo, Peru)" *is just a ghost, which appeared later in another country under another new pet trade name.

Not true.
See: http://birdspiders.com/gallery/inde...s-Ausserer-1875-female-light-form-Satipo-Peru

>Pamphobeteus verdolaga = same as = Pamphobeteus Sp. antioquia = “Paisa”
>is this a guess or is there any reliable source?

Same area with online pics that match all three names. My "good" guess for right now. This is a really cool Pamphobeteus being from a montane habitat, with greenish carapace and femurs. It is very different-looking from other Pamphobeteus spp.


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## xenesthis (Nov 30, 2018)

> I don’t think any will breach the 10 inch leg span.

I've personally had the following sizes of Pamphobeteus spp.
P. sp. "Santo  Domingo Goliath", 9.5"
P. antinous (SE Peru) 9.25"
P. nigricolor (Colombia) 9"
P. sp. "North Ecuador", 9"
P. sp. "platyomma", 9"
P. ornatus (Colombia) 8.75"
P. insignis (Colombia) no xmas tree pattern in the slings 8.75"
P. pedersi 8.5"


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## c.h.esteban (Dec 1, 2018)

> Same area with online pics that match all three names. My "good" guess for right now. This is a really cool Pamphobeteus being from a montane habitat, with greenish carapace and femurs. It is very different-looking from other Pamphobeteus spp.


dont know what area with online pics do you mean.
i know only the localities where sp ANTIOQUIA and sp PAISA was found an how the spermatheca´s looks like in different stages / sizes. thats makes me carefull with such statments in public.

CLICK



> Not true.
> See: http://birdspiders.com/gallery/inde...s-Ausserer-1875-female-light-form-Satipo-Peru


i know the page and the pic.
time will tell.


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## xenesthis (Dec 1, 2018)

@c.h.esteban: With your spermatheca pics, sure, I'd go with P. sp. "Paisa" and "Antioquia" are different. What about comparing "Paisa" to Pamphobeteus verdolaga though? Thanks for your input and pics for clarification.


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## c.h.esteban (Dec 6, 2018)

xenesthis said:


> What about comparing "Paisa" to Pamphobeteus verdolaga though?


it´s the same result, because these "ANTIOQUIA" spermathecae, i had showed above, fits into the description of P. verdolaga

_*"...Females have spermathecae with a wide base and very short seminal oval receptacles, curved toward the center (Fig. 9)...."*_ ( Cifuentes et al. (2016))


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## xenesthis (Dec 6, 2018)

@c.h.esteban, so you are saying Pamphobeteus sp. "ANTIOQUIA" is the same as P. verdolaga, but P. sp. "PAISA" is a totally separate species, correct? What will be interesting is when they revise this genus, it will be a debate between the "lumpers" and "splitters". I bet the revision goes towards the "lumper" taxonomic revision and 1/2 of this list of Pamphobeteus spp. are parked under a few species like P. nigricolor and P. vespertinus.


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## AphonopelmaTX (Dec 7, 2018)

Question for you all.  Are the exporters of these Pamphobeteus species actually providing the location of where they were collected?  How do you all know for sure that the countries or the more specific localities are where they were collected and not just where they were exported from?


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## c.h.esteban (Dec 9, 2018)

xenesthis said:


> @c.h.esteban, so you are saying Pamphobeteus sp. "ANTIOQUIA" is the same as P. verdolaga, but P. sp. "PAISA" is a totally separate species, correct?


no.
i have just show differences and similarities in females. which explain why i have concerns with statements like " Pamphobeteus verdolaga = same as = Pamphobeteus Sp. antioquia = “Paisa” " .

maybe, when we include further characters (not only spermathecae) and more specimens from a greater area, we come to the result that these differences in spermathecae are a intraspecific variance.
if you have a look into the revison of the north american Apohonopelma, which inculdes also DNA, you can see which variances are possible and how great the distribution of a species can be.



AphonopelmaTX said:


> Question for you all.  Are the exporters of these Pamphobeteus species actually providing the location of where they were collected?  How do you all know for sure that the countries or the more specific localities are where they were collected and not just where they were exported from?


very interesting question.

i can only talk for myself.
if i say "i know" i dont use exporters / seller data. otherwise i talk usually abot pet-trade or hobby material.

bye


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## SonsofArachne (Dec 10, 2018)

I've narrowed the my "want list" for Pamphos done to 3. Three that I can actually afford without saving for months anyway, and even these are pretty expensive

Pamphobeteus antinous - I like black T's'.

Pamphobeteus mascara - brown with black femurs looks cool

Pamphobeteus platyomma - actually hoping for a male. If fact that's what I don't like about Pamphos - in general the males are better looking than the females.


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## antinous (Dec 10, 2018)

SonsofArachne said:


> I've narrowed the my "want list" for Pamphos done to 3. Three that I can actually afford without saving for months anyway, and even these are pretty expensive
> 
> Pamphobeteus antinous - I like black T's'.
> 
> ...


Females look beautiful in their own right tbh, esp. the P. sp. 'mascara' out of the ones you've listed. Stays the nice brown and black haha.

Also, just a side note, the bottom two should have ‘sp.’ before the second part of the name. And it should be Pamphobeteus cf. antinous as the true antinous is unlikely to be in the US hobby (pretty rare in the European hobby from what I’ve heard). Not trying to be nitpicky, I've just seen a lot of mislabels recently aha


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## SonsofArachne (Dec 10, 2018)

antinous said:


> Also, just a side note, the bottom two should have ‘sp.’ before the second part of the name. And it should be Pamphobeteus cf. antinous as the true antinous is unlikely to be in the US hobby (pretty rare in the European hobby from what I’ve heard). Not trying to be nitpicky, I've just seen a lot of mislabels recently aha


Yeah I get it, but those are the names most of the dealer's sell them under, so that's what I was going with.


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## kevinlowl (Dec 11, 2018)

Pamphobeteus is probably the most confusing genus, so many of them look the same to me, like machala and platyomma. At least with Poecilotheria they make look similar but you can still tell the difference between them.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## xenesthis (Nov 9, 2019)

Any new Pamphobeteus species introduced to our hobby lately?


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## SonsofArachne (Nov 11, 2019)

SonsofArachne said:


> I've narrowed the my "want list" for Pamphos done to 3. Three that I can actually afford without saving for months anyway, and even these are pretty expensive
> 
> Pamphobeteus antinous - I like black T's'.
> 
> ...


Since I made this post I have now acquired these slings: 3x Pamphobeteus antinous, 3x Pamphobeteus sp mascara, 3x Pamphobeteus sp. Goliath (Santo Domingo), plus 1 each Pamphobeteus sp. flammifera and Pamphobeteus sp cascada that I received as freebies. Never did get the platyomma, and have no plans to do so at this point. Of the slings the Pamphobeteus sp cascada is the prettiest; in addition to the normal red abdomen with black Christmas tree they also have sky blue legs - too bad they lose all this as adults.

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## xenesthis (Nov 11, 2019)

Nice! I'm a fan of costa, cascada, and mascara right now.


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## antinous (Nov 11, 2019)

Pamphobeteus sp. ‘chinche’ (Colombia)
Pamphobeteus sp. ‘manganegra’ (Ecuador)


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## xenesthis (Nov 11, 2019)

> Pamphobeteus sp. ‘manganegra’ (Ecuador)

Any pics or more info about this species? Thanks.


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## antinous (Nov 11, 2019)

xenesthis said:


> > Pamphobeteus sp. ‘manganegra’ (Ecuador)
> 
> Any pics or more info about this species? Thanks.


I don’t have any photos on hand, forgot the name of the guy who found it in Ecuador. Doesn’t stand out compared to the other Ecuadorian species though, not sure if it’s in the US either.

Reactions: Informative 1


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