# Meanest looking beginner scorp



## Jaygnar (Oct 22, 2005)

I've recently purchased two Emps and I want to move up to something meaner. The emperors are realy active and fun to watch, but they don't use their stingers to kill their prey. I want to get a second species with a realy nasty temperment that stings its prey. I just don't want any species that'll send me to the hospital or the grave. I realy like species that have big fat tails. Before anybody jumps on me for not doing research, I've found info on venom toxicity and pics, but I  can't find much info on temperment or whether the scorpions kill with their stingers. Please suggest some species that fit the bill. 
Thanks.


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## Kugellager (Oct 22, 2005)

I would suggest moving up to either an H.arizonensis, H.spadix or S.mesaensis.  S.mesaensis probably has the most attitude of the larger 'safe' species...If a smaller species is ok then I would go with V.spinigerus... definitely the most attitude for the buck!

John
];')


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## TheNothing (Oct 22, 2005)

i second the notion of US natives as well as the Vaejovis spinigerus.  They're always in fight mode


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## Jaygnar (Oct 22, 2005)

Thanks for the suggestions. I'm realy leaning toward H. Spadix.  I love the look of them. Tell me, are they ill tempered? I sure hope so.    I think it's kind of funny how I realy like to handle T's but even with my easy going (but pinch happy) Emps, I have no desire whatsoever to touch them. They're awesome but totaly hands-off. Like a realy hot nun  .


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## ScorpDude (Oct 22, 2005)

Am I the only person who thinks he's getting this scorpion for all the wrong reasons?


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## Antares (Oct 22, 2005)

ScorpDude said:
			
		

> Am I the only person who thinks he's getting this scorpion for all the wrong reasons?


I personally don't think so, there is nothing wrong in deciding to buy a second scorp that has a different temper than his first one. I don't think it is wrong to like agressivity in a scorp, I mean they are predators, and I can understand it is fun to watch a H. spadix going for its prey. Moreover he had the good sense to ask for advice before buying anything, so for me there's nothing wrong with his attitude.


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## Stylopidae (Oct 22, 2005)

Jaygnar said:
			
		

> I realy like to handle T's but even with my easy going (but pinch happy) Emps, I have no desire whatsoever to touch them. They're awesome but totaly hands-off. Like a realy hot nun  .





			
				Jaygnar said:
			
		

> The emperors are realy active and fun to watch, but they don't use their stingers to kill their prey.



I'd say not. It seems like he observes them as the creatures they are and understands how easily stressed they are.

He even admits he didn't get them to handle them.

Go for either of the Hadrus species listed. They are large, good looking, agressive and easy to care for.


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## Jaygnar (Oct 22, 2005)

@-Scorpdude-Please explain yourself further. I'm not some kid or idiot. I'm not buying deathstalkers to play with. I'm an invertebrate enthusiast that wants to add variety to my collection. I respect my animals and provide them all with their appropriate habitats. I observe the highest levels of caution with my pets both for their safety and my own. The reason for me owning scorpions and tarantulas is because I find these animals interesting. I'm a hobbyist. I enjoy keeping aggressive species. Please enlighten me as to what the right reasons for keeping scorpions are. I thought that the right reason was because I am a responsible adult and I enjoy observing the interesting behaviors of the animals. That's my reasoning. Please don't take offense to any of this but that came off a little harsh.


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## Jaygnar (Oct 22, 2005)

Everyone else- Thanks for your advise, support and confidence.  Hopefully I can pick up a H. Spadix at Carolina Specialty Pets next friday, That will give me plenty of time to prep an enclosure and study up on caresheets. I'm giddy like a little schoolboy.


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## oblivion56 (Oct 22, 2005)

i vote for androctonus australis,they rock!also parabuthis transvaalicus,my faves for attitude!


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## Jaygnar (Oct 22, 2005)

@oblivion56- Those suggestions are both impressive animals but look at the LD50 values on them, and one is a squirter. They'd be great additions for a more experienced keeper but I know my limits. Thank's for the advice and feel free to offer any suggestions for anything aggressive, but I don't want anything HOT venomwise.


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## Kazuki (Oct 22, 2005)

actually, my 2 emps have quit a bit of temper too.

they fight all the time. they fight over same hiding spot even though i provided at least 3. one rushes into the hole, the other immediately rushes in flushes the other out, the one that got pushed runs back in n do the same. they can go at it for hrs. they like holding at least 2 to 3 crickets while feeding, 1 in mouth n 1 in each claw. and they always try to attack my twizzers when i try to reach in for cleaning, a couple times they don't even try pinching, stingers all the way... now one of my wooden sticks i used to adjust their enclosure is covered with little holes from their sting.

i never put my hand inside, not risking allergic reaction.


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## Jaygnar (Oct 22, 2005)

@Kazuki- Wow, I've read that if you keep your emps @ higher temps they become more aggressive. Just curious as to what temps you keep yours at. My Emps stay at about 88 daytime and I drop the tank to 80 at night. Mine have pinched at my tweezers when I remove their waterdish for refilling but their stingers never come into play. Also, do your emps ever kill their prey with their stingers? Just curious.


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## oblivion56 (Oct 22, 2005)

my Hottentotta trilineatus are kinda aggro and they sting prey like crazy!


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## Kazuki (Oct 22, 2005)

my temp is usually at 80-85... 89% humidity in average

i notice my emps start stinging whenever something bigger than them enters the enclosure, that would include my 12" long twizzers or my hand.. it stings when i throw in a dragon fly. actually my emp stung it so many times, it nearly cut its abdomen abort. they sting the bigger butterflies as well.

just last night they start trying to sting eachother in a fight.. but the deflected the stings with their claws as a shield... they get along sometimes, n sometimes they just can't stop fighting


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## Jaygnar (Oct 22, 2005)

@ oblivion56-Nice suggestion. Beautiful coloration on that species, and  they're available at my nearest real invert dealer. I just might have to get one of each, hottentotta trilineatus and H. spadix. Oh man, I can see it now, scorps are gonna be just as addictive as tarantulas.    I knew that I'd find a use for all that money I saved when I stopped using drugs 
@Kazuki- Thanks for the info. That's some interesting stuff.


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## Kazuki (Oct 22, 2005)

the weirdest experience i had with my emps is that once i try using that old wooden stick to move the water dish, then one of my emps grab hold of the stick. so i try to pull the stick back out, but it held on so tight it came up with the stick, then held on higher with the other claw n start moving up till it got its legs holding on to the stick, n tried to sting me... missed me by a cm. scary part is that the stick was the thickness of a chopstick

now both of my emps invented new ways of getting out of the tank too by grabbing hold of the thermometer and the hydrometer... they nearly escapped once if i didn't have my lid on


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## Jaygnar (Oct 22, 2005)

That's what I realy love about inverts. People who know nothing of them think they're dumb bugs, but then they show their ability to develop new behaviors and problem solve. That's when the fun realy starts. You're lucky to have such industrious Emps.


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## Jaygnar (Oct 22, 2005)

I've decided to hold off on the hottentotta.  I was reading about a person who had to be hospitalized after a sting. I will deffinately add this species to my collection in the future. But I think I'll wait untill I get more experience. Great suggestion and a future must-have.


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## Prymal (Oct 22, 2005)

Jaygnar-

I'd go with Hadrurus arizonensis (I have no experience with H. spadix) yet.
I've had both of my fems now for about 6 weeks and while the H. a. var. pallidus is calm and can be handled, the typical H. a. is highly-defensive and needs little provocation to stark jabbing at you with committment!
Also, they're beautiful scorps and very easy to care for! Good luck!

Luc


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## Jaygnar (Oct 22, 2005)

@ Barkscorpions- The H. arizonensis is right up there with the H. spadix in terms of fitting the bill of what I'm looking for. The only factor that has caused me to lean heavily towards spadix is the fact that an the only real invert dealer that I have the ability to visit in person has spadix and not arizonensis. The ability to hand select my specimen and transport it myself to my home, as well as not having to pay shipping (which is pretty much the price of another scorpion), all points to H. Spadix. They also have B. Jacksoni, though. I've read some interesting things about them that make them look like a good cantidate. What do you think about them?


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## FortCooper1982 (Oct 23, 2005)

Barkscorpions said:
			
		

> Jaygnar-
> 
> I'd go with Hadrurus arizonensis (I have no experience with H. spadix) yet.
> I've had both of my fems now for about 6 weeks and while the H. a. var. pallidus is calm and can be handled, the typical H. a. is highly-defensive and needs little provocation to stark jabbing at you with committment!
> ...



I'd agree!! H A was my second scorp following my emps, always stings and very active, also mine has never burrowed like my emps, sometimes don't see them for weeks! Heterometrus spinifer is also a very cool scorp, looks pretty much the same as a emp, use's it's stinger and has a bad attituide


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## Jaygnar (Oct 23, 2005)

I do like the looks of an H. Spinifer, but they look a little too similar to the emps I've got. At this point I'm trying to gain variety in looks as well as temperment. Thanks though. So far I'm definately either getting H. Spadix or H. arizonensis. Please keep the suggestions coming though. You guys are great!


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## parabuthus (Oct 23, 2005)

Hey Jaygnar,

As many others have stated, Hadrurus arizonensis is a great species to keep. They are typically aggressive and normally sting all their prey. They are also very active and dig extensive burrows.

A picture of my adult female...







A video (poor quality!) of the same female capturing and envenomating the prey...
http://www.scorpion-web.com/Video/HAvideo.avi


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## Mr.Scorpion (Oct 23, 2005)

Antares said:
			
		

> I personally don't think so, there is nothing wrong in deciding to buy a second scorp that has a different temper than his first one. I don't think it is wrong to like agressivity in a scorp, I mean they are predators, and I can understand it is fun to watch a H. spadix going for its prey. Moreover he had the good sense to ask for advice before buying anything, so for me there's nothing wrong with his attitude.


Exactly, if he wants it because he thinks scorpions that use stingers frequently are cool, then ok.  As long as he takes good care of it.


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## darkeye (Oct 23, 2005)

S.mesaensis.  IMHO, this is the way to go.  Mine jackahmmer their prey and have even eaten with the aculeus still jammed in!  I also agree that the Vaejovids are always looking for a fight...  

How about Opistophthalmus sp.?  I have O.glabifrons and O.wahlbergii and these things are just super.  I love to hear them stridulate when even barely disturbed!


Good luck on your decision!

Martin


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## Jaygnar (Oct 23, 2005)

@ Mr. Scorpion- Please understand that I am not the kind of person who would buy animal for my collection without caring for it properly. I simply would like to add species that offer different behaviors than those that I currently own.  My emps are impressive with their size and strength. They are everything that I had hoped they would be when I purchased them. I did a lot of background study before purchasing them and I had a suitable habitat ready for them long before I took the plunge and picked them up. They are currently thriving and in excellent condition. 
I am now interested in aquiring a species that exhibits a more aggressive temperment as well as dispatching prey through envenomation. I am still a novice to this hobby and as such, I know my place. That is why I have chosen to only keep species without medicly signifigant venom untill I feel comfortable and experienced enough to keep more venomous varieties.
Make no mistake, i will NOT take any species into my care that I do not have a proper environment for as well as proper levels of skill and caution.
@ darkeye- Thanks for the suggestions! I'm researching them now and they all seem to be good solid options.  :clap:


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## Jmadson13 (Oct 23, 2005)

I'd say H. spadix is definitely a mean looking scorp. It's appearance alone has made my friends keep their fingers out of the cage.


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## ReptileMan27 (Oct 24, 2005)

A desert hairy would be a good choice but you could also consider a B. jacksoni because they are very cool scorpions that are not considered dangerous or deadly but pack a punch so you need to be careful but its a good starter scorpion for getting into keeping more deadly stuff like deathstalkers etc.. H paucidens is also a really cool species but doesent use its stinger to kill its prey but only for defense. I am not a scorpion expert but was in the same boat you are in because I have kept Pandinus imperators for a few years now and have wanted to get some more species and couldnt decide on what to get and finally decided to get a B. jacksoni and a H pauciden and should be getting them in soon. I found that taking my time and asking alot of questions and reading as much care info and looking around was the best and I got a really good price on my scorpions . Good luck


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## Jaygnar (Oct 24, 2005)

Well, after the long deliberation, I've finaly made up my mind. I'd like to thank everybody who made suggestions and offered advice. After much study and consideration I have decided to get two B. Jacksoni and one H. Spadix. I'm anxious to know what you think of my choices. I think that both of these species are exactly what I'm after.  Opinions anyone?


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## Melmoth (Oct 24, 2005)

I'd go with Desert Hairy and B.Jacksonii


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## parabuthus (Oct 24, 2005)

I would have went with a Hadrurus to begin with. Then think about the buthid... goodluck though and enjoy. Two great species.


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## Jaygnar (Oct 24, 2005)

I was going that route but no arizonesis are available at my invert dealer (Carolina specialty pets). So I went with Spadix instead. Is there some reason why Arizonesis is preferable? I've read that they are both aggressive and kill by envenomation.


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## parabuthus (Oct 24, 2005)

Spadix and arizonensis are both Hadrurus genus. They are essentially the same scorp, both in appearance, behaviour and husbandry. Ofcourse spadix is dorsally much darker compared to arizonensis, which is the distinguishing aspect. 

In short, H. spadix is just as good a choice as H. arizonensis. Have fun.


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## Jaygnar (Oct 24, 2005)

@ Parabuthus- What would be the reason for waiting on the Jacksonii ? The comparisons that I've seen rate their speed and venom at the same levels as Spadix. Unless there's something I'm missing.
Also thanks for clarifying the Spadix-Arizonesis difference. I kinda suspected that, but was'nt sure


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## ReptileMan27 (Oct 24, 2005)

Jaygnar said:
			
		

> Well, after the long deliberation, I've finaly made up my mind. I'd like to thank everybody who made suggestions and offered advice. After much study and consideration I have decided to get two B. Jacksoni and one H. Spadix. I'm anxious to know what you think of my choices. I think that both of these species are exactly what I'm after.  Opinions anyone?


Great choices ,check out Carolina Specialty Pets,they have baby B. jacksoni for 12 bucks and I think they also have H. spadix. Good luck


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## Jaygnar (Oct 24, 2005)

@ ReptileMan27- look up- 4 posts ;P  lol


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## parabuthus (Oct 24, 2005)

Jaygnar said:
			
		

> @ Parabuthus- What would be the reason for waiting on the Jacksonii ? The comparisons that I've seen rate their speed and venom at the same levels as Spadix. Unless there's something I'm missing.
> Also thanks for clarifying the Spadix-Arizonesis difference. I kinda suspected that, but was'nt sure


B. jacksoni is a member of the Buthidae family. Despite what you may read online, as far as I know it's LD_50 value is unknown and from reading a sting report on this species it certainly packs a punch I think. 

I think it's venom would be far more potent than a Hadrurus for example, ofcourse that remains to be seen in writing, but I am sure most would agree the potential is there.

In my opinion, so far, it is a great scorp to keep and not really all that aggressive, but I think it is not the best choice for a first species. I'd get my footing first with other species, such as H. spadix, P. imperator, Heterometrus sp. and Opistophthalmus sp. Then I'd turn my attention to a buthid.

However if you have already purchased/ordered the scorpions and have your mind set on it, then it is entirely your decision. I am just offering some advice.

Goodluck.


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## Jaygnar (Oct 24, 2005)

I appreciate the advice and nothing is set in stone as of yet. These are not my first scorpions. I already keep a pair of P. Imperator. I wasn't able to find any LD50 info on the Jacksonii. I knew it was a Buthid but I didn't think it was signifigantly venomous. Thats why I love these forums. People with experience are the best info source.  I may drop the Jacksoni for now. It's not like they're hard to find. Thanks again.


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## parabuthus (Oct 24, 2005)

Well, if you are already keeping scorps (I thought this was your first buy, my bad) and you have a sensible head (which I think you have) then you will be absolutely fine. 

I am just outlining my thoughts, which are that people assume B. jacksoni has no potency, yet it is a medium sized Buthid with no LD_50 value in writing (that I can find) as of yet. And a sting report with a healthy adult male declares fast moving pain towards the chest. Not good as far as I can tell... they have slender chela, thickish cauda = no messing about.

BUT... as far as I can tell, they are pretty much a docile scorp typically, from what I read with other keepers and my own experience so far with the species.

Anyhow, you'll love H. spadix dude. Hadrurus are awesome scorps... in all respects. And if you get some Babycurus, I am sure you will love them too. They have a good appetite...


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## Jaygnar (Oct 24, 2005)

Yeah, I checked the bite/sting reports section of the boards and one of the reports said that they experienced pain that followed a vein and made their "heart hurt".  But they were feeding with their hands in the tank and it sounds like the scorp was feeling threatened. I think I will try Jacksoni. But I will be cautious in the extreme.  Thanks for the help.


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## Prymal (Oct 24, 2005)

Jaygnar-

In my personal opinion, you've made two great choices. Another very cool thing about jacksoni is that you can set-up a nice community of them in a small space as compared to that necessary for Pandinus spp.
The problem in choosing that "next" scorpion is that there's so many interesting species available that it's hard to commit to just a single choice. 
I don't have any experience with H. spadix yet (I have 2 coming in a week or so?) but have a nice group of B. jacksoni and will hopefully have some "kids" about by spring.
However, you'll definitely need to acquire at least 1 nice fem H. arizonensis. There's also those overlooked scorps that also make great additions to a collection:

Opisthacanthus asper & rugiceps
C. jonesii
I. politus
M. eupeus
M. martensii
P. gracilior
Uroctonus mordax
ANY Diplocentrus spp. (sadly under-represented in our hobby)
Any Anuroctonus spp/ssp.
etc., etc., etc...LOL!!!
And one day, the best of the lot...A. bicolor!!!

Good luck and best regards,
Luc


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## parabuthus (Oct 24, 2005)

Jaygnar said:
			
		

> Yeah, I checked the bite/sting reports section of the boards and one of the reports said that they experienced pain that followed a vein and made their "heart hurt".  But they were feeding with their hands in the tank and it sounds like the scorp was feeling threatened. I think I will try Jacksoni. But I will be cautious in the extreme.  Thanks for the help.


Have fun and be careful! And remember to post some pics when you get the scorps  .


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## Prymal (Oct 24, 2005)

Jaygnar-

The only suggestions I'd make in regards to keeping B. jacksoni is to make sure you have appropriate tools at hand - forceps in 7", 10" or 12" lengths (rbber-tipped or wrapped with surgical tape), several size wooden spoons with long handles and metal tongs. Keep a few 16 oz. clear plastic deli-cups with clear lids about for cage transfer and a few long-handled artist's brushed for herding them stubborn critters into the deli-cups! LOL
Always know the location of a scorp when you're feeding or working within and never assume that a scorp is not aware of a disturbance in its home - it knows you're there!

Good luck,
Luc


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## Jaygnar (Oct 24, 2005)

I'm gonna be super cautious with these new guys. And oh yes, there will be pics.

P.S> Thanks for the tool checklist. I've already got most of that stuff for my Emps, but the brushes are a good addition.


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## talon (Oct 24, 2005)

ScorpDude said:
			
		

> Am I the only person who thinks he's getting this scorpion for all the wrong reasons?


I agree. Scorpions are not toys and should be held in the highest respect. 

I don't mean to sound mean, but I think you should re-examine your reasons for keeping a scorpion, and I think you should get some more experience caring for Emperors first before moving onto a more venomous species.

This is just my opinion.


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## Fergrim (Oct 25, 2005)

talon said:
			
		

> I agree. Scorpions are not toys and should be held in the highest respect.
> 
> I don't mean to sound mean, but I think you should re-examine your reasons for keeping a scorpion, and I think you should get some more experience caring for Emperors first before moving onto a more venomous species.


I completely disagree with those sentiments, Talon, and Scorpdudes.  

Because it's the case that getting a scorpion as a killing machine isn't a good plan, it doesn't also make it the case that only buying one for the opposite extreme is sensible (desire to learn/study in a scientific manner.)

He's an amateur invert hobbyist, got one scorp that's as active as moss covered rock and uses a pretty docile method of apprehending prey... and now he wants something that will be more representative of an aggressive species.  Because all of us appreciate the raw beauty of the predatory prowess that a more aggressive scorp can display.

it's no big deal.  He should be getting this scorpion.  Woe be it to the person who tries to tell me I bought mine for the wrong reasons, and I went directly for a Transvaalicus after my Imperator.  Raised it from a spling, and then moved on to an Australis.  As long as you keep it responsibly, I don't think a person's specific way of expressing their enjoyment is something worth attacking.


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## ReptileMan27 (Oct 25, 2005)

I dont see anything wrong woth him wanting to get more scorpions. He doing his research and asking questions which is very responsible. A B, jacksoni is a great choice for second scorpion,if it was your first then no but as a second yes. The thing that I like also about B. jacksoni besides there beutiful is they are not dangerous or deadly but pack a punch so caution should be taken not to get stung and its a great species to help someone get the expereince to get into more deadly species .


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## Jaygnar (Oct 25, 2005)

@ Talon- I respect your opinion, but I have to admit I'm a little confused. Both yourself and Scorpdude have expressed you opinion that I need to reexamine my reasons for keeping a scorpion. When it happened with Scorpdude, I posted this-

@-Scorpdude-Please explain yourself further. I'm not some kid or idiot. I'm not buying deathstalkers to play with. I'm an invertebrate enthusiast that wants to add variety to my collection. I respect my animals and provide them all with their appropriate habitats. I observe the highest levels of caution with my pets both for their safety and my own. The reason for me owning scorpions and tarantulas is because I find these animals interesting. I'm a hobbyist. I enjoy keeping aggressive species. Please enlighten me as to what the right reasons for keeping scorpions are. I thought that the right reason was because I am a responsible adult and I enjoy observing the interesting behaviors of the animals. That's my reasoning. Please don't take offense to any of this but that came off a little harsh.
10-22-2005 06:04 PM

I recieved no response form him. Now you've stated your opinion and I hope you will have the courtesy to respond and back up your opinions. I'm not angry , it just gets under my skin when somebody spouts some cryptic line about "all the wrong reasons" and then refuses to clarify themselves. Please Respond. Thanks


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## parabuthus (Oct 25, 2005)

I think some of you guys are being way too harsh to this member. He never said _"my emps are boring as hell, I want something nasty that I can show off to my mates"_.

He said that he already had emps, *enjoyed* them for what they are, but now he wants to move onto a different species with different behavioural traits. Mainly a species that will envenomate it's prey on capture. Something I also wanted to observe as my interest in scorpions grew.

I'd say, lay off  .


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## FortCooper1982 (Oct 25, 2005)

Sounds like he's interested enough to me, and he's already explained his intentions! Don't you think we should incourge people to get into this hobby, and stop being so harsh!!!!


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## Jaygnar (Oct 25, 2005)

Thanks for the backup guys.    I guess that there are some people who just don't want me to have anymore scorps. I don't know WHY they have this attitude and they seem reluctant to explain themselves other than offering vague complaints about "The wrong reasons" and then refusing to respond to my questions. Oh well, I guess some people are like that. 
I got some mixed news from Caorlina specialty pets. They don't have any Spadix or Arizonesis in stock, but they do have B. Jacksoni.  I'm going to get at least one of those but I got a bonus today and I could afford to get another species. To my knowledge, they have everything on this list  so any suggestions?
(Opistophthalmus carinatus)
Hottentotta trilineatus)
Hottentotta polystictus
(Buthus arenicola) 
(Parabuthus liosoma)
(Opistophthalmus glabifrons) 
Scorpio maurus)

Some of these species are probably too hot, hav'nt had time to research them all. But let me know if you guys see any appropriate cantidates.


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## fscorpion (Oct 25, 2005)

Jaygnar said:
			
		

> Thanks for the backup guys.    I guess that there are some people who just don't want me to have anymore scorps.


Why do you say that, its not nice...I have read all the posts and I don't think there was nothing mean in those comments...someone just thought you might not be responsible to all of your scorpions and he deduced that when you said that your pandinus is not interesting anymore...also, you can have all the scorpions you want regardless what they think...no need for theatrical phrases...




			
				Jaygnar said:
			
		

> I don't know WHY they have this attitude and they seem reluctant to explain themselves other than offering vague complaints about "The wrong reasons" and then refusing to respond to my questions. Oh well, I guess some people are like that.


Like I said, you might have sounded irresponsible, don't make a fuss over that...



			
				Jaygnar said:
			
		

> I got some mixed news from Caorlina specialty pets. They don't have any Spadix or Arizonesis in stock, but they do have B. Jacksoni.  I'm going to get at least one of those but I got a bonus today and I could afford to get another species. To my knowledge, they have everything on this list  so any suggestions?
> (Opistophthalmus carinatus)
> Hottentotta trilineatus)
> Hottentotta polystictus
> ...


Opistophthalmus carinatus, Opistophthalmus glabifrons and Scorpio maurus (preferebly palmatus) are very nice scorpions...I am looking to find an Opistophtalmus, but its very hard...nice species, mild venom, I would say go for it....
Also, my opinion is to try every species that you might find interesting, I would include the Buthidae family, but you can exclude the pretty venomous species like the Androctonus and Leiurus if you don’t feel comfortable...I am saying this because they all have some kind of similar behavior, venomous or not...I have started with the Parabuthus Genus and didn't have problems...I keep them without a secure lid as they can't climb glass and there is no fear they will escape unless my room falls apart...so, if you got acquainted with one desert scorpion, you can keep them all...I still don't have a Pandinus and a Hadrurus and they are very high on my wish list even though they are mild venomous I find them very interesting and I can't wait to get some...just my opinion...


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## Jaygnar (Oct 25, 2005)

fscorpion said:
			
		

> Why do you say that, its not nice...I have read all the posts and I don't think there was nothing mean in those comments...someone just thought you might not be responsible to all of your scorpions and he deduced that when you said that your pandinus is not interesting anymore...also, you can have all the scorpions you want regardless what they think...no need for theatrical phrases...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If he was refering to me saying my emps weren't interesting, then i would understand. My only problem with that is............. I never said anything remotely like that.


Thank you for the suggestions though. I'm doing a little more background work on a couple of the species.


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## ReptileMan27 (Oct 25, 2005)

Just ignore them,I dont know what there problem is but theres nothing wrong with wanting more scorpions besides Pandinus imperator. Glad to see you check out Carolina Specialty Pets,they have a big selection and cheap prices. I sent the check out monday for my 2 scorpions and he should get it tommorow or the next day. B. jacksoni will be  a great addition to your growing collection. Good luck


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## Jaygnar (Oct 25, 2005)

Just curious, what did you get from CSP?


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## Prymal (Oct 25, 2005)

Fergrim-

My sentiments exactly. I, too, evolved from keeping large numbers of emperors right to P. transvaalicus, as my next scorp of choice. As long as a person is doing the appropriate pre-acquisition research (asking other more experience keepers and reviewing their suggestions, advice, etc.) and is responsible, I see nothing wrong with adding a bit of diversity to the collection.

Best Regards,
Luc


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## Prymal (Oct 25, 2005)

Jaygnar,

'Buthacus' arenicola are very nice and very easy to care for. The sting is a bit on the hurting side of pain but nothing to write home to mom about. Opistophthalmus spp. are all very nice. Some, such as O. wahlbergii (Kalahari var.) are extremely beautiful. The only problem with Opisto's is that they tend to be seclusive and remain concealed within their burrows. However, if you like large, powerful scorps, opisto's are the way to go! I'm not a great fan of the Hottentotta, Lychas, Tityus groups of scorps but I've kept a few Lychas spp. and a few trilineatus in the past, and they're nice scorps - just not my cup of tea. Hottentotta are easy to care for and can be very active.
All Parabuthus are nice and should be required additions to all collections. Parabuthus liosoma complex are incredible scorps and while they do possess potentially medically significant neurotoxic venom, they're easy to care for and easy to manage once they establish a retreat and become acclimated to their new home. As long as you possess and use the appropriate tools, they should prove of little challenge to your safety.
Other nice additions are any of the Mesobuthus spp. M. martensii are great. Commonly available, inexpensive, easy to care for, active and communal! M. eupeus is just plain beautiful! 
The primary factors that should effect your selection of scorps to add to your collection is interest and responsibility. Keep it interesting and fun and as long as you use a bit of good ol' common sense, you'll be fine. Good luck!

Luc


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## Jaygnar (Oct 25, 2005)

well, I just added an Opistophthalmus escritatus to my order. That make 1 B. jacksoni and 1 Opistophthalmus escritatus. I can't wait untill thursday when I go to pick them up.  Thanks for your advice everyone.


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## Prymal (Oct 25, 2005)

Jaygnar-

Well, if you like the Opisto's then, look around for O. wahlbergii 'Kalahari' variant. I acquired my last female specimen from Charles Black (Botar by Eights). They're a great deal unlike the typical wahlbergii form, being an eerie greenish-yellow in overall coloration. Awesome against a dark substrate! Best of luck!

Luc


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## Jaygnar (Oct 25, 2005)

Thanks for the tip, I'll keep those on my "soon to be aquired" list.


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## ReptileMan27 (Oct 26, 2005)

Jaygnar said:
			
		

> Just curious, what did you get from CSP?


I bought a baby B. jacksoni and a H. pauciden


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## Prymal (Oct 26, 2005)

Jaygnar-

Another cool thing about the wahlbergii 'Kalahari' is that unlike most opisto's, they are less retreat-oriented and thereby, tend to be outside of their burrows more often and for longer periods. On the other hand, I have several fem glabrifrons and wahlbergii 'commons' that I only see about 6-10 times a year outside their burrows!

Luc


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## Jaygnar (Oct 26, 2005)

@Reptileman27- I'm getting your baby Jacksonis' Mom.


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## ScorpDude (Oct 26, 2005)

Jaygnor said:
			
		

> I recieved no response form him.


Not been able to get on the pc, you know how it is sometimes.

Ok, lets look at your first post:

"I've recently purchased two Emps and I want to move up to something meaner. The emperors are realy active and fun to watch, but they don't use their stingers to kill their prey. I want to get a second species with a realy nasty temperment that stings its prey. I just don't want any species that'll send me to the hospital or the grave. I realy like species that have big fat tails. Before anybody jumps on me for not doing research, I've found info on venom toxicity and pics, but I can't find much info on temperment or whether the scorpions kill with their stingers. Please suggest some species that fit the bill. 
Thanks.
"

All you seem interested in is its ability to sting and be aggressive. You don't ask for one thats easy to care for, or good for beginners. You say you've done research, but the fact that you only researched venom toxicity and pictures (thats all you mentioned, so to me that says thats all you did). You haven't spent any time researching care information, just about how toxic venom is. I get the feeling this is going to be a "look what I've got" sort of pet, which is imo the wrong way to go about things. Sure, show it off, but don't get it to just show off. Thats only my opinion, i'm not saying its right, I'm not saying your wrong, its just how I feel.

On a lighter note, nice choice of scorps, 2 beauties there.

Good luck with them


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## Jaygnar (Oct 26, 2005)

@ScorpDude-I guess it was just a misunderstanding. When i begin the initial phase of "shopping" for a new invert, the first thing I look for are the traits I want. In this case those traits were an aggressive attitude and killing prey by envenomation. The reason why I only mentioned researching venom toxicity and pics is pecause the look and "heat" of the scorpion are two primary factors of my concern. But I was just using these factors to narrow down the huge list of possible choices. After getting a broad range of suggestions from others, I looked at everything I could find regarding those species that had been suggested. As I researched, many species were eliminated due to factors like ease of care, or not being good for beginners. I also was limited by what I could afford and what was available at Carolina Specialty Pets. After taking all these factors into consideration, I made my choices. 

I'm not getting this scorpion to show off. None of my friends seem to think very highly of invertebrates. When I showed my emperor scorps to my friends, the most common response was "Those are like big nasty roaches with stingers" I have tried unsucsessfully to defend my scorps and T's , but nobody I know other than the people I've met on the boards has any interest I know it's tragic but there's a good possability that nobody other than me is going to see these scorps at all, with the exception of my brother who I always give caresheets and medical info to in case something should happen, and the people that look at the pics I post on the boards. 

I'm sorry about not benig so clear in my first post, but sometimes I forget nobody  here realy knows me and I just assume its a given that I'm going to provide the safest and happiest life that I can for my animals. 

Also, I would have been happy to explain anything you had questions about. Next time please let me know what you're thinking if you are unsure of my motives. I mean I didn't realy know how to respond to " getting this scorpion for all the wrong reasons" so my first reaction was to become defensive.  

Anyway, its all water under the bridge as far as I'm concerned. No hard feelings on my end, and I respect the fact that if I was getting this scorp for stupid reasons, you would have called me on it.

                                                           Regards,  Jason


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## ReptileMan27 (Oct 26, 2005)

Jaygnar said:
			
		

> @Reptileman27- I'm getting your baby Jacksonis' Mom.


Nice he offered the mother to me but didnt want to pay 30 bucks for it and I figured it was older and didnt have as much in front of it as it has behind it lol. Good luck


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## LasidoraGT (Jan 14, 2008)

Kazuki said:


> my temp is usually at 80-85... 89% humidity in average
> 
> i notice my emps start stinging whenever something bigger than them enters the enclosure, that would include my 12" long twizzers or my hand.. it stings when i throw in a dragon fly. actually my emp stung it so many times, it nearly cut its abdomen abort. they sting the bigger butterflies as well.
> 
> just last night they start trying to sting eachother in a fight.. but the deflected the stings with their claws as a shield... they get along sometimes, n sometimes they just can't stop fighting


u feed em dragon flies  dragonflies are pretty, dnt feed it those
butterflies, same thing NOT COOL


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