# Found this in B. dubia enclosure



## kman (Sep 27, 2008)

Trying to get a B. dubia colony started. Only have 16 atm. 12 girls and 4 boys. A week ago I found something weird in with their egg cartons. I thought it was maybe something from an apple I gave them so I cleaned it and thought nothing of it. Today I cleaned out again and I found the same thing again. I have no idea what this is. It's not squishy like a maggot or anything. It's kind of waxy of that makes any sense. Does anyone have an idea what this is? The penny is the same size as a US one.


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## moose35 (Sep 27, 2008)

ooth   or eggcase



                  moose


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## bliss (Sep 27, 2008)

LOL

that's a dubia eggcase.  i agree with moose.  


click:
http://www.goldenphoenixexotica.com/hissxtrd.jpg
(in the pic it's a hisser, not a dubia, but either way, that's what their eggcases look like)

--dan--


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## kman (Sep 27, 2008)

Woah I thought they gave live birth? So what does it mean if I find this stuff?


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## 8Pat (Sep 27, 2008)

Means you gonna be the proud owner of baby roaches!

By the way, what did you do with the first eggcases you found?  Threw them away?   Might as well take a look in the garbage!!

Cheers!
8Pat


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## radicaldementia (Sep 27, 2008)

Dubias give live birth, if they are dropping their eggcases prematurely, it probably means something went wrong.  What temp/humidity are you keeping them and what/how often are you feeding them?  That eggcase is clearly only partial and is damaged, no babies will hatch from that.

Species that give live birth, like dubias and hissers (both of which I have large colonies) often vent their eggcases like in that picture, but they don't drop them.  The babies hatch inside the mother.


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## kman (Sep 27, 2008)

They are kept at 85F or so and the room is 60 degrees humidity. They are kept in a 12x8x8 rubbermaid with egg crates. I hotglued a large container in the corner that is kept full of water at all times for humidity. They have a dish with food (I've fed them oranges, apples, plumbs, squash, carrots, watermelon and oats.) that I change daily and they have those blue water gells. There is only ventillation at the top (do they like lots of vent or not?). They all look fat and happy. I do lift the crates like once a day to check on them. Is this causing this dropping of eggsacks? I obviously want this to be sucessful so any advice is appreciated.

Thanks for reading.


P.S. Also just so I understand this right. They have these eggsacks inside their abdomens and the young hatch inside them from these eggsacks? They occasionaly "push" them out to air them and pull them back inside??


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## Warren Bautista (Sep 27, 2008)

exac-attack-aly


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## Anthony Straus (Sep 28, 2008)

So if you have egg cases in the bottom of your Dubia's its a BAD thing?

I've seen 3-4 of these over the last few weeks, can to much protein cause dropped cases?


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## Talkenlate04 (Sep 28, 2008)

Live birth?:?   I have watched them push the case all the way out, then stand over it while it hatches. That counts as live birth 
I really don't know if that counts that is why I am asking.


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## Aurelia (Sep 28, 2008)

Maybe someone saw them coming out from underneath the mother and thought she was giving live birth. :? I dunno...


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## Talkenlate04 (Sep 28, 2008)

Watching dubia hatch reminds me of when mantid ooths hatch out. It just sits there for a few minutes then it becomes so alive with movement its awesome to watch.


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## Tuwin (Sep 28, 2008)

Never seen them give birth. I just notice new baby's running around. Every site i have seen say they give live birth but i have no idea


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## Hedorah99 (Sep 28, 2008)

Talkenlate04 said:


> Live birth?:?   I have watched them push the case all the way out, then stand over it while it hatches. That counts as live birth
> I really don't know if that counts that is why I am asking.


They aren't laying an egg sac and letting it hatch on its own, so its not technically live birth, but since they hold onto the egg case and take care of its considered a form of live birth. Sharks and some snakes like boa constrictors do this as well, they basically hold onto the eggs inside them, but they are not directly connected to the mom like a placental mammal. So they "give birth" to live animals, or as in the dubias case drop an eggsac seconds prior to hatching.

http://www.fishbase.org/Glossary/Glossary.cfm?TermEnglish=ovoviviparous


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## Talkenlate04 (Sep 28, 2008)

It specifies animals in that link, is that mainly for animals? Or just living things in general? 



> The young hatch inside the mother's uterus from their thin egg capsule, and are usually born shortly afterwards.


And this is reversed it seems with dubia as well. The egg capsule is pushed out of the females body, then it hatches not the other way around. 

I guess I see the point though, 99% of the gestation period is taking place inside the female not outside qualifying it to be called a “live” birth. Makes sense.


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## Xaranx (Sep 28, 2008)

As was mentioned already, dubia's don't lay their eggs so if you found one of those, it was aborted for some reason or another.  It could have been the stress from shipping if you just got them, could also be the stress from messing with them everyday, I have to recommend you don't do that for a while, it will slow down your reproduction and make it even longer til you can use it as a feeder colony.  

I doubt too much protein would cause this issue.  They are roaches though, and do like it dark and quiet.


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