# Can A very docile scorpion and a mantis co exist?



## FortCooper1982 (May 31, 2010)

Iv'e got a 45 cm tall enclosure that house's a adult female budwing, the top is a mesh lid and she loves it, she never comes close to the floor even when i've put very large noisey crickets, iv'e had to feed either flying insects or locust that are bound to climb up to her area sooner or later, this works well.

 My flatrock scorpion has hardly ever moved since i got him and is getting to big for his tank, do u think if the scorpion has got his favourite hide they could live together.

 The only way there'd be a fight would be the mantis going for the scorp which i dont think she'd do due to the size difference, and the scorp never moves. Has anyone ever tried this? 

Many thanks, cooper


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## Malhavoc's (May 31, 2010)

While in the wild, scorpions and mantis do share habitate, there is no communalism instinct or behavior between these animals, so there would always be a *chance* of one getting munched, its up to you to risk it, are you so confident they would not interact, you know the animals better then anyone, but I find they move more then we think when we're not looking.


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## TomM (May 31, 2010)

Malhavoc's said:


> I find they move more then we think when we're not looking.


+1


Also, we're assuming they are kept in similar conditions (humidity, temperature, etc.).


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## Scoolman (May 31, 2010)

Bith are voracious preditors. The end result will, inevitably, be a single fat specimen. Which survives the confrontation is the only question to be asked.


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## H. laoticus (May 31, 2010)

since the mantis appears to stay at the top often, I would suggest putting in fake vines or branches, giving it a good amount of material to hang around in.  
However, mantis don't seem to fear anything and it just might square off with the scorpion.  I've seen something like this on youtube.


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## FortCooper1982 (Jun 1, 2010)

Also, we're assuming they are kept in similar conditions (humidity, temperature, etc.).[/QUOTE]

yeah very similar, quite dry and slightly humid, both are very hardy for there sp to


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## FortCooper1982 (Jun 1, 2010)

Just to give you a idea of the scale of the enclosure here a pic



The mantis is visable at the top homing in on a small locust and a eggsack to the left at the top that i'll be removing soon. She wouldn't hunt the crickets when they were at the bottom, i should know coz they drove me mad churping churping churping for days :wall: untill i managed to catch them and remove them


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## Malhavoc's (Jun 1, 2010)

Scorpions wander at night they move around looking for food, for mates, etc. this enclosure looks decent sized but what are the measurements? it looks as if the flat rock would be cramped in the bottum leading inetably to it climbing the decor up into the mantis area, again these are predators with nothing more then feeding responses to each other, if they encounter each other one will be killed, so you would have to find a way they can not under any means run into each other if you wish them both to survive long term


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## Falk (Jun 1, 2010)

You cant keep a "flat rock" as you call it in a humid enclosure.


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## FortCooper1982 (Jun 1, 2010)

Malhavoc, the measurements are in cm 30 x 30 x 45


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## FortCooper1982 (Jun 1, 2010)

Falk here is a picture of my Hadogenes paucidens setup that is not humid :clap: 

 Hadogenes paucidens like it dry and hot, but need a spray every now and then seeing as he has no water dish :clap: its not rocket science anyone can learn this on google in 2 mins, do you keep flat rocks ''oh sorry'' Hadogenes sp


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## Malhavoc's (Jun 1, 2010)

the picture is misleading its much bigger then I thought, however. there is still that *chance* even with a barrier, like say vasoline or something to keep the scorpion from climbing in the rare chance it did, there will also be the chance the mantis falls, or goes down this one time to check out the movement of the scorp. there will always be a *chance* of you loosing one specimen over the other, where it could of been avoided by keeping them apart.

I have not kept Hadogenes, so I can not comment on their behavior, but I have done a few mantis, and I do know how they can let curiousity get the best of them. and I'd hate for you to loose either animal.

My overal all opinion Risk>Reward. Don't do it.


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## Venari (Jun 1, 2010)

I've seen reports of _Vaejovis spinigerus_ scorpion co-existing with a trio of _Coleonyx variegatus_ geckos. Apparently they "slept" together, hunted separately, but never showed any signs of aggression towards eachother; once in a while they would approach eachother, but as soon as physical contact was made, they all went their separate ways.

It would be interesting to see what other kind of cross species cohabitation is possible. I say go for it.


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## Moltar (Jun 1, 2010)

I think that eventually the mantis will come down and try to eat the scorpion although it may be more than she can handle. They'll take on prey bigger than they are but prey with claws and stingers aren't really what a mantis is used to. 

Also, that enclosure isn't really right for a flat-rock so I'd just do them separate if it were my choice.


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## Bigboy (Jun 2, 2010)

Oh dear, this would be an interesting "journal" project.


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## cacoseraph (Jun 3, 2010)

what are the sizes?


if the scorp is at least twice as massive as the mantis i would say their is a reasonably chance the mantis would die of old age before the mixed it up



also, what temps are you keeping them at?  if the scorp is like 80*F or under it will not be very active, which might be a good thing






ftr, if they did fight and are evenly sized i would put money of the scorpion if it is warm.  it might just kinda sit there and get et if it is not warm enough, though


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## zonbonzovi (Jun 3, 2010)

Budwings are quite powerful for their size, but I'd be shocked if those mandibles could get through the scorpions "armor".  One pinch of the pedipalp and it would be all over.


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## GartenSpinnen (Jun 5, 2010)

I say... scorpion gets eaten.

A mantis can tear open a beetle like a can opener, I think that is exactly what it is going to do to the scorpion. Not to mention the mantis can fly, has much better eyesight, is faster in cooler temperatures, etc.

Slow moving docile scorpion in with the mantis is a bad idea... someone is going to get eaten. Then again, why put different predatorial animals in together? It is just going to at the very least cause them to be in a constant state of stress. It may even kill one or both of them due to stress issues from being housed together alone. Why risk it?

If you really want to do it, put a piece of screen separating the arboreal mantis with the terrestrial/burrowing scorpion. This way you can be assured that they will not feast on each other. 

Mantis are more bad ass than people give them credit for being... I have seen them take on some pretty big prey in the wild. I have also been bit by a large adult, and they can most certainly give you a bite!


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## MrMatt (Jun 10, 2010)

I believe they can co exist, much like crickets and roaches co exist with my scorpions, mantises and spiders. The real question is for how long and to what result. Remember, "given a long enough time line the survival rate for everyone drops to zero." Both being predators I think given the opportunity, they will see each other as prey and act accordingly. Just my opinion.


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