# Snake Tail Deformed....Genetic?



## The Juice (Mar 15, 2007)

I bought this snake last week at a repshow. It was originally $50 but they guy noticed it's tail was flawed so he sold it to me for $30. He said I shouldn't breed him because his tail flaw was genetic but I showed him to a friend who breeds snake & he said it doesn't look genetic. It looks like someone crammed him into a deli cup when he was a baby & his tail got caught under the lid?


----------



## Beardo (Mar 15, 2007)

It might be genetic....but it might not. The only way to know wuld be to breed him, and then if the trait shows up in any of his offspring, cull them to ensure you only pass on the healthiest genes possible.


----------



## Crotalus (Mar 18, 2007)

Why cull them? Its not a trait that will effect the longivity of the snake or othervise complicate things. The snake will still have a long happy snake life with a crooked tail.

Cull the abnormal color phases instead. That was done in the 80s when people were ashamed to get a abnormal color phase such as albino in a clutch. They killed them off and kept quiet about it. Now these snakes are inbred and inbred a little more. 
Time has changed but in this case not to the better.


----------



## bugmankeith (Mar 18, 2007)

Or just dont breed the snake and dont worry about it, like others said it wont affect it's life.


----------



## Beardo (Mar 19, 2007)

Crotalus said:


> Why cull them? Its not a trait that will effect the longivity of the snake or othervise complicate things. The snake will still have a long happy snake life with a crooked tail.
> 
> Cull the abnormal color phases instead. That was done in the 80s when people were ashamed to get a abnormal color phase such as albino in a clutch. They killed them off and kept quiet about it. Now these snakes are inbred and inbred a little more.
> Time has changed but in this case not to the better.



Say what? Why cull defective offspring? If you have to ask, then I'm not going to waste time in answering that question lol. 

And inbred? Corn Snakes are among the most genetically diverse herp species on the planet....inbreeding is not an issue when it comes to morphs and whatnot.


----------



## The Juice (Mar 19, 2007)

I contacted the guy who I bought him from & he said he contacted the breeder & the breeder said that the "Short Tailed" gene doesn't run in his blood line so he says he thinks that his tail may have got caught in a lid when it was young & I also found out he is het for sunkissed.


----------



## Crotalus (Mar 19, 2007)

DavidBeard said:


> Say what? Why cull defective offspring? If you have to ask, then I'm not going to waste time in answering that question lol.
> 
> And inbred? Corn Snakes are among the most genetically diverse herp species on the planet....inbreeding is not an issue when it comes to morphs and whatnot.


No im not asking. I gave you my point of view.
As I sad culling a defective snake which are doomed to die is one thing - to cull a beauty "error" is ridiculus.

Its not genetically diverse anymore when offspring is bred with parents.
Which is the case with many of the horrible abnormal color phases.


----------



## Taceas (Mar 19, 2007)

It could be genetic, it could be the result of an accident. No one may know for sure. Most people don't breed individuals like that because we don't know that the cause is and don't want it passed down. Its a better safe than sorry scenario.

Most spinal kinks can result from an incubation temperature that was too high and caused developmental issues while the embryo was forming. Even still most people choose not to breed them. Some kinks can interfere with breeding and egg laying, and as I stated before some might be genetic. Why risk it?

I personally have a corn snake I adopted that has a 90* bend in her tail, the breeder asked I never breed her and instead keep her as a pet, which is what I do. She was the only one in the clutch to have an issue. 

I cull non-feeding hatchlings and hatchlings with deformities if I can't place them in a pet-only home. I'd rather my king snake have a nice meal than have to worry about the possibility of them being bred and passing on genetics I can't be assured of. I don't trust people a lot of the time, and if I can't be assured that the snake will live a pet only life, it won't leave my home. It's called _breeder responsibility_. If I could have them surgically altered before placing them I would. Similar to what's done with some deformed purebreed puppies, but its not feasible with snakes right now. 

As for as the inbred and culling comments, all it truly shows is ignorance. Since when did people cull albinos? Back in the 70's and 80's people were striving for amelanistic corns and they were all the rage. If you don't like purple or pink cornsnakes, then don't buy them. They're no more inbred than yourself in a lot of cases.


----------



## The Juice (Mar 19, 2007)

I have no plans on breeding my corn but a local breeders seemed kind of interested in using him.


----------



## Crotalus (Mar 20, 2007)

Taceas said:


> As for as the inbred and culling comments, all it truly shows is ignorance. Since when did people cull albinos? Back in the 70's and 80's people were striving for amelanistic corns and they were all the rage. If you don't like purple or pink cornsnakes, then don't buy them. They're no more inbred than yourself in a lot of cases.


In Sweden. Which you might not have so much knowledge about am I right? The entire world is not US alone you know.
Please we all know most color phases* do some from selective inbreeding. Its just silly to deny it


*captive born snakes that is. Not the color phase as such


----------



## Beardo (Mar 20, 2007)

Most color phases come from wild caught adults, actually. The root of just about every morph was a genetic abberrancy in the wild gene pool.


----------



## Crotalus (Mar 20, 2007)

DavidBeard said:


> Most color phases come from wild caught adults, actually. The root of just about every morph was a genetic abberrancy in the wild gene pool.


Im not saying every morph is a creation of inbreeding. Not at all.
But that doesnt mean they dont breed the offspring back to the WC right?
I dont think we will agree on a single thing here so I just leave it to that.


----------



## mrbonzai211 (Mar 20, 2007)

That is definitely the aftermath of a broken tail. I'm 100% sure of that.


----------



## Crotalus (Mar 20, 2007)

mrbonzai211 said:


> That is definitely the aftermath of a broken tail. I'm 100% sure of that.


I would agree on that.


----------



## bugmankeith (Mar 20, 2007)

That is definitely the aftermath of a broken tail. I'm 100% sure of that.

Think a vet can fix it, or will it heal with time?


----------



## Crotalus (Mar 21, 2007)

bugmankeith said:


> That is definitely the aftermath of a broken tail. I'm 100% sure of that.
> 
> Think a vet can fix it, or will it heal with time?


Its healed now but crooked probably because of a fracture. Same with a human if we brake a bone and dont get it fixated, it heals but becomes crooked.


----------



## mrbonzai211 (Mar 21, 2007)

I don't think a vet could fix that, and even if they could, I wouldn't suggest it. Right now it shouldn't be causing him any pain and surgery would cause him MUCH pain. If he's happy, just leave him be.


----------



## bugmankeith (Mar 21, 2007)

It's amazing how tough they can be you know. At least it will have a good home now.


----------



## jr47 (Mar 23, 2007)

attached is a photo of a ball i use to have . i took it from an idiot neighbor i had that put a rat in the cage when it was 8 inches long. the tail is a result of that. it also lost an eye. looks to me that yours has been broken or slightly chewed on.


----------



## green_bottle_04 (Mar 27, 2007)

i HIGHLY doubt its genetic. probly, as you said, got closed in a deli cup, recklessly handled, etc. who knows. one way to find out...breed it. is it an okeetee by the way? it looks like it from the pic but couldnt tell for sure.


----------



## The Juice (Mar 27, 2007)

Yes it's an Okeetee het for sunkissed


----------

