# PSA: Be aware that B. dubia CAN breed at room temperature.



## nicodimus22 (Sep 18, 2017)

I pulled my B. dubia container out this morning to give them fresh water, food, and baby carrots, and discovered that there are plenty of babies in there. I was surprised, as the hallway they are in is about 70F-77F degrees year round, and I've seen it stated all over the place that they needed higher temperatures to breed. I guess not!

While this is certainly not a tragedy or anything, what it means is that B. dubia CAN infest your home if they escape, so try really hard not to let any get away from you.

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1


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## SingaporeB (Sep 18, 2017)

Dubia can also live on in temperatures below 50 degrees for weeks. I left some in a container in my garage for almost a month in those temps and they just slowed down.

Reactions: Dislike 1 | Informative 1


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## Andee (Sep 18, 2017)

They can breed in higher 70's temps, though the breeding will be pathetic. Nothing infestation worthy. The reasons they cannot easily infest your home are many. There are three main ones. They are much pickier than you'd expect with what they eat. They don't breed well at temps below 75 and even above unless you his 82+ it won't be large amounts of breeding to hit infestation level, plus the babies need slightly increased humidity levels to survive without drying out. So they often bury in the frass etc to survive.

Reactions: Agree 3


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## chanda (Sep 18, 2017)

They are also far better at climbing plastic than I had been led to believe! One of the "selling points" so my husband would let me breed them as feeders was that they "don't climb" so wouldn't be escaping - yet escape they did. My kids found a few in their bedrooms and bathroom, which are directly across the hall from the "bug room." (A rehouse with a more secure lid and smaller ventilation holes took care of the problem - I hope!)

Reactions: Wow 1


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## Andee (Sep 18, 2017)

Younger nymphs definitely climb well, you want slick plastic for them. The rough colored plastic makes it easier for the nymphs to get a foot hold. There are slick colored or clear and then just put tape around the outside to black it out. But just so you guys know, male adults can fly. Idk who started the rumor they couldn't but they can. They aren't the best at it, but they can. They just never really do because they have no real desire to. They can't get much lift on their own easily. But once they are high enough they can easily FLY and not just GLIDE.


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## SingaporeB (Sep 18, 2017)

The blue Sterilite tubs sold at target are slick. I keep dubias in them and they can't climb. I also breed them at room temperature of about 75 degrees.

Reactions: Like 2 | Dislike 1 | Clarification Please 1


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## The Grym Reaper (Sep 18, 2017)

chanda said:


> They are also far better at climbing plastic than I had been led to believe!


Yeah, if the plastic has any tiny scratches in it then they can get a foothold to climb, I've not had any problems with my red runners getting out but the lid is pretty secure and I only really scrub the bottom of the tub when I clean them out (the walls get a quick gentle wipe down to prevent scratching).


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## The Grym Reaper (Sep 18, 2017)

Andee said:


> But just so you guys know, male adults can fly. Idk who started the rumor they couldn't but they can. They aren't the best at it, but they can. They just never really do because they have no real desire to. They can't get much lift on their own easily. But once they are high enough they can easily FLY and not just GLIDE.


Males aren't a problem though, they'll eventually die off if you don't catch them, it's gravid females that you don't want getting loose.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Andee (Sep 18, 2017)

yeah but generally I was saying to show there are a lot of weird and untrue facts about them.  and if your females are already gravid then they will give birth no matter the heat levels. They can't just not give birth. That's not the same as breeding at low heat levels. breeding at low heat levels doesn't happen often and a lot, because usually people keep heat on their bins, if they get out there won't be an infestation because of a bunch of other factors. You would be surprised at how good dubias are at huddling and creating their own heat levels in confined spaces. in a Dubia huddle sometimes the temps jump 5 degrees.

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1


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## Blue Jaye (Sep 18, 2017)

I've seen males fly. One of mine took flight out of the bin and flew directly into the trash can. It was hilarious.

Reactions: Like 2 | Funny 2


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## Andee (Sep 18, 2017)

I have noticed the males aren't always the smartest out of the colony XD

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Hisserdude (Sep 18, 2017)

Well yeah, they can definitely breed in the mid 70s, most people know that, they just don't breed as fast as they do when kept in the high 80s, and since most people are trying to make hundreds of them for feeders for their reptiles, it's generally advised that you keep them that warm. For just a few Ts, you should get enough to use as feeders by just keeping them at room temp though.

Also, they STILL can't infest the normal human home, because it is just way too dry for them, and they wouldn't be able to survive on just a few table scraps. Plus, females often abort oothecae without fruit in their diet. So really, the chances of them effectively infesting anything but a hut with a dirt floor is close to zero, there's a reason you don't hear about dubia infestations.

Reactions: Agree 3 | Informative 1


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## Hisserdude (Sep 18, 2017)

Andee said:


> and if your females are already gravid then they will give birth no matter the heat levels. They can't just not give birth.


Actually, if they are gravid, but are then subjected to temps way below their optimal breeding range, (like the low 70s or 60s), they can just abort their oothecae instead of giving birth.


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## Andee (Sep 19, 2017)

Hisserdude said:


> Actually, if they are gravid, but are then subjected to temps way below their optimal breeding range, (like the low 70s or 60s), they can just abort their oothecae instead of giving birth.


For some reason I always forget about the aborting thing. I have had it happen to one female... I think? She got really stressed. But it like never really happens with mine (because I breed mine for feeder for reptiles so they have a complete vegetation based diet and a dry food that I make myself, have heat, have a cleaner crew, are generally spoiled rotten) so I just... derp and forget. It does make sense though since low heat levels all of a sudden would cause stress on a pregnant mother. And they definitely prefer vegetation based diets. Females and sometimes if you feed low protein based vegetation diets the nymphs will sometimes go for animal protein

Reactions: Like 1


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## Hisserdude (Sep 19, 2017)

Andee said:


> For some reason I always forget about the aborting thing. I have had it happen to one female... I think? She got really stressed. But it like never really happens with mine (because I breed mine for feeder for reptiles so they have a complete vegetation based diet and a dry food that I make myself, have heat, have a cleaner crew, are generally spoiled rotten) so I just... derp and forget. It does make sense though since low heat levels all of a sudden would cause stress on a pregnant mother. And they definitely prefer vegetation based diets. Females and sometimes if you feed low protein based vegetation diets the nymphs will sometimes go for animal protein


Yeah, many roaches will abort ooths when kept too cool, I haven't had temperature related abortions in a long time, I still sometimes get abortions from some sensitive species for other reasons though, (lack of proper ventilation, overcrowding, forgot to feed them fruit, etc.).

I've switched over to chick feed BTW, no more animal proteins for my roaches, I'm also feeding lots of my species more fruits and veggies than I previously did, (partially because the chick feed I use is really expensive compared to most dog food). So far so good, not really noticing any difference at all though...


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## Andee (Sep 19, 2017)

Hisserdude said:


> Yeah, many roaches will abort ooths when kept too cool, I haven't had temperature related abortions in a long time, I still sometimes get abortions from some sensitive species for other reasons though, (lack of proper ventilation, overcrowding, forgot to feed them fruit, etc.).
> 
> I've switched over to chick feed BTW, no more animal proteins for my roaches, I'm also feeding lots of my species more fruits and veggies than I previously did, (partially because the chick feed I use is really expensive compared to most dog food). So far so good, not really noticing any difference at all though...


Idk if you are supposed to notice a difference, honestly you are giving them a more natural diet and they are thriving right? Less aborted ooths because of dietary change? I mean I think people worry about animal protein more than they need to, there are plenty of other ways to get protein without doing animal protein and in my opinion I think vegetation protein is easier to increase or decrease slowly, and animal protein is more easier absorbed (though with most tropical roaches I feel it's too easily absorbed and it's nutrient overload). Idk it will be interesting to see what you notice over time for sure. I think it's safe to do minimal amounts of animal protein with little side effects if any, but idk, there is so little like... 100% science out there compared to some things we have studied. I love inverts for that.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Hisserdude (Sep 19, 2017)

Andee said:


> Idk if you are supposed to notice a difference, honestly you are giving them a more natural diet and they are thriving right? Less aborted ooths because of dietary change? I mean I think people worry about animal protein more than they need to, there are plenty of other ways to get protein without doing animal protein and in my opinion I think vegetation protein is easier to increase or decrease slowly, and animal protein is more easier absorbed (though with most tropical roaches I feel it's too easily absorbed and it's nutrient overload). Idk it will be interesting to see what you notice over time for sure. I think it's safe to do minimal amounts of animal protein with little side effects if any, but idk, there is so little like... 100% science out there compared to some things we have studied. I love inverts for that.


Yes, most of my species are doing very well with the new diet so far.  I got very few abortions even when I was feeding them cat food instead of chick feed, I usually only got them with species that were overcrowded, or didn't have enough ventilation, so the change in diet hasn't affected much in that respect. 
Will let you know if anything changes, so far it seems like they really don't care what kind of protein they receive. (I'm definitely gonna stick with my plant based chick feed though, since I'm vegan and don't want to have to buy dog or cat food anymore).


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## VolkswagenBug (Sep 20, 2017)

Andee said:


> yeah but generally I was saying to show there are a lot of weird and untrue facts about them.  and if your females are already gravid then they will give birth no matter the heat levels. They can't just not give birth. That's not the same as breeding at low heat levels. breeding at low heat levels doesn't happen often and a lot, because usually people keep heat on their bins, if they get out there won't be an infestation because of a bunch of other factors. You would be surprised at how good dubias are at huddling and creating their own heat levels in confined spaces. in a Dubia huddle sometimes the temps jump 5 degrees.


Like Hisserdude said, they abort if it's too cold. I have experience with _B. discoidalis _doing so. It was stimulated by going from an average of 69 degrees F to 80. I'm not particularly worried that dubia would infest here. It's very dry and the temperatures fluctuate a lot from summer to winter.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## jezzy607 (Sep 20, 2017)

Just because a species of roach can breed at room temps, does NOT mean they are able to infest a home!!!!!!!!
If that was the case we would have hundreds of species infesting homes!! Different species have different behavior, niches, adaptations, and preferences regardless of what temps they can breed. Only a handful of species are adapted and/or have the behavior that allows them to live, breed, and flourish in our structures/homes...unless you live in a biodome or greenhouse!

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Trenor (Sep 21, 2017)

chanda said:


> They are also far better at climbing plastic than I had been led to believe! One of the "selling points" so my husband would let me breed them as feeders was that they "don't climb" so wouldn't be escaping - yet escape they did. My kids found a few in their bedrooms and bathroom, which are directly across the hall from the "bug room." (A rehouse with a more secure lid and smaller ventilation holes took care of the problem - I hope!)


The nymphs can climb pretty well. I use clear smooth plastic packing tape to make a ring around the top of my breeder bins. I makes a barrier about 2 inches wide they can't get past. The adults don't climb well and the males seem to do a flapping glide rather than real flying.

I've had a few get out over the years but not many. I find them dead and dry when they do.

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1 | Helpful 1


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## darkwishes (Jun 6, 2020)

nicodimus22 said:


> I pulled my B. dubia container out this morning to give them fresh water, food, and baby carrots, and discovered that there are plenty of babies in there. I was surprised, as the hallway they are in is about 70F-77F degrees year round, and I've seen it stated all over the place that they needed higher temperatures to breed. I guess not!
> 
> While this is certainly not a tragedy or anything, what it means is that B. dubia CAN infest your home if they escape, so try really hard not to let any get away from you.


same mine breeds at 70s


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