# When borax doesn't work...



## Draiman (Jun 10, 2009)

I've had a pretty bad ant infestation in and around my _P. formosa_'s tank for the past week (*there is nothing in the tank for the ants to eat, no leftover food, no food boluses, nothing. I have no idea why they stream in*). I've tried everything, from detergent powder + sugar in solution to honey + detergent powder to crushed cinnamon. Eventually I headed out to buy some commercial bait. The label on the box said it's supposedly a "very effective" ant and cockroach killer (ingredients are cypermethrin, borax, white sugar and soybean powder). Apparently not. I sprinkled some of it on the floor where the ants normally appear, and I expected them to swarm around and devour the bait. What I saw surprised me - only one or two of the ants stopped by to check it out; the rest simply walked past and straight into my formosa's tank, completely undistracted by the bait lying just a few centimeters away. I continued to watch them, and it became exceedingly clear that the ants simply were not attracted to the bait. And this morning I got up to see the ants invading my female _Nephila antipodiana_'s tank to feast on the remnants of a cricket carcass. What the hell. So much for being "very effective".

Any ideas as to what else I can do?

_*I certainly thought of making a moat, but I have nothing large enough to fit a large glass tank. A moat would also attract mosquitoes, particularly since I'm in a tropical area._

Oh btw - the ants are tiny, about 3 millimeters long and amber-orange in color. They constantly annoy the formosa, so much so that I see her using her legs to brush them off her abdomen at times. She is in premolt and laid down a thick molt mat two days ago. I am sure that if she molts anytime soon, the ants will kill her in the process.


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## Julia (Jun 10, 2009)

Ick....  Ants are a pain, aren't they?  

So how large is this large glass tank?  You said you had nothing big enough to put it in to construct a moat...  Depending on how large the tank is, you could always run over to your local home & garden store and pick up one of those thin plastic trays that are used to go under potted plants (so they don't leak water and dirt everywhere).  I've seen those trays come in a variety of sizes, including large sizes, and they aren't too expensive.  

As far as mosquitoes, aren't mosquitoes attracted to *warm* stagnant water?  Just make sure your moat is filled with ice water.   

Good luck with this problem, however you can figure out how to handle it!


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## Dave (Jun 10, 2009)

Is she inside the house or outside? 

Ants go crazy over Terro liquid ant killer.


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## Shrike (Jun 10, 2009)

The Tarantula Keeper's Guide describes a method for avoiding ant infestations.  Basically, the method entails raising your enclosure slightly on supports.  Each "leg" is located within a small reservoir that you can fill with oil or some other deterrent.


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## Draiman (Jun 10, 2009)

Julia said:


> Ick....  Ants are a pain, aren't they?
> 
> So how large is this large glass tank?  You said you had nothing big enough to put it in to construct a moat...  Depending on how large the tank is, you could always run over to your local home & garden store and pick up one of those thin plastic trays that are used to go under potted plants (so they don't leak water and dirt everywhere).  I've seen those trays come in a variety of sizes, including large sizes, and they aren't too expensive.
> 
> ...


Thanks.  

The tank is 40cm long and 25 or 30cm wide, so yeah I guess there should be a suitably-sized tray for it. I really should have thought of that before posting this thread. :wall: 



mking said:


> The Tarantula Keeper's Guide describes a method for avoiding ant infestations.  Basically, the method entails raising your enclosure slightly on supports.  Each "leg" is located within a small reservoir that you can fill with oil or some other deterrent.


Yeah, that's similar to the moat idea. A little too complex for me though...



Dave said:


> Is she inside the house or outside?
> 
> Ants go crazy over Terro liquid ant killer.


Inside. I'm not in the US so I wouldn't know about Terro, but I'll try looking for liquid bait. Thanks for the suggestion.


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## gecko_keeper/KBfauna (Jun 10, 2009)

Dave said:


> Is she inside the house or outside?
> 
> Ants go crazy over Terro liquid ant killer.


This stuff works very well!


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## Shrike (Jun 10, 2009)

Draiman said:


> Yeah, that's similar to the moat idea. A little too complex for me though...


I know what you mean.  I'm just a little leery of chemical control methods because of the potential danger for the T.  How fast acting are some of the bait options?  Would there be any danger of the ants moving portions of the bait inside the T's enclosure?


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## cacoseraph (Jun 10, 2009)

some ants like sugar and some like protein and some like both


try mixing borax powder with peanut butter or bacon grease and then mixing that goop onto toilet paper.  



also, iirc boric acid has a kill window that is days long... the ants won't drop dead right away.


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## Draiman (Jun 10, 2009)

mking said:


> How fast acting are some of the bait options?  Would there be any danger of the ants moving portions of the bait inside the T's enclosure?


I have no real idea as to how quickly the bait kills. I don't think the ants would do that, since their nest isn't inside the enclosure. In any case, the bait has to be consumed to be harmful (please correct me if I'm wrong), and it is unlikely at best that the tiny bait granules would be ingested by a 6" spider.



cacoseraph said:


> try mixing borax powder with peanut butter or bacon grease and then mixing that goop onto toilet paper.


Thanks, I'll try that.



cacoseraph said:


> boric acid has a kill window that is days long... the ants won't drop dead right away.


Yeah, I know. But the ants were/are not even interested in the stuff.


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## Spyder 1.0 (Jun 10, 2009)

For my roach bin, in-order to control white soil mite infestations, (which i had before) I use a layer of rolled Duct-tape. The tape stays sticky for a long time and is sticky enough to trap any insects that try to cross it. Just cut a long piece of tape and roll the two width ends together overlapping a few mm's then apply it to the base of the tank. Or the top, whichever you choose. 

The only downside is possible tape marks afterward after a prolonged period of use.

It works for me.


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## reverendsterlin (Jun 10, 2009)

the easy moat is to place a brick in a pan under each leg or each corner of the enclosure and the fill the pans with water. A few drops of bleach in the pans once a week will prevent any mosquito larve from appearing.


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## codykrr (Jun 10, 2009)

what does the "iirc" mean in iirc boric acid


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## Sarcastro (Jun 10, 2009)

ants are almost impossible to get rid of with out chemicals...if you just don't want them inside the T's enclosure mix peppermint oil and Vaseline together  and rub it around the out side bottom of the enclosure  it works wonders around doors and windows too...but if you want to get rid of the completely id suggest find out where there coming in and seal it up and spray the out side of the house.


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## kupo969 (Jun 10, 2009)

Did you wipe down the tank? They make a chemical scent trail and allow other ants to follow the scent.

THEN try the powders and baits and what-not.


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## presurcukr (Jun 11, 2009)

use equal or sweet&low they both will kill the ants dead just keep it away from the T


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## Dave (Jun 11, 2009)

presurcukr said:


> use equal or sweet&low they both will kill the ants dead just keep it away from the T


  Just imagine what they do to a human body...


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## the nature boy (Jun 11, 2009)

Draiman said:


> I've had a pretty bad ant infestation in and around my _P. formosa_'s tank for the past week (*there is nothing in the tank for the ants to eat, no leftover food, no food boluses, nothing. I have no idea why they stream in*). I've tried everything, from detergent powder + sugar in solution to honey + detergent powder to crushed cinnamon. Eventually I headed out to buy some commercial bait. The label on the box said it's supposedly a "very effective" ant and cockroach killer (ingredients are cypermethrin, borax, white sugar and soybean powder). Apparently not. I sprinkled some of it on the floor where the ants normally appear, and I expected them to swarm around and devour the bait. What I saw surprised me - only one or two of the ants stopped by to check it out; the rest simply walked past and straight into my formosa's tank, completely undistracted by the bait lying just a few centimeters away. I continued to watch them, and it became exceedingly clear that the ants simply were not attracted to the bait. And this morning I got up to see the ants invading my female _Nephila antipodiana_'s tank to feast on the remnants of a cricket carcass. What the hell. So much for being "very effective".
> 
> Any ideas as to what else I can do?
> 
> ...



I'd stick the enclosure (or the substrate if the enclosure is too big) in the microwave and enjoy watching the ants die an excruciatingly painful death.


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## arachyd (Jun 11, 2009)

I've been battling ants recently myself. They were in every room of the house. You have to be careful not just because an ant can carry poisonous bait to your T and the T may eat it (not likely) but because if the ant has ingested the bait the T could ingest a poisoned ant. A cricket could also eat a poisoned ant and pass the poison to your T when it feeds. We tried obliterating the ant trails with alcohol, bleach and even vinegar. We used ant traps and baits. This is the first time none of those methods worked. The ants were happily invading the microwave and suffered no obvious ill effects from a minute or two on high power. What finally worked was a perimeter spray outside the house foundation and the window frames with Ortho Home Defense Max. I took a risk using pesticides but the darn things were even biting me while I sat at the pc and I felt there was a real danger of them attacking my Ts.


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