It is a bill. Actually they aren't going to give permits to breed anything on either list. Everything will also be put on the nonmailing list except natives. If this law passes all we can keep are native U.S. animals and probably dogs, cats and farming animals.
The Bill To Ban Our Hobby Is Here!
- Thread starter ThomasH
- Start date
Debating is what I'm doing, thank you. I was just pointing out that this wasn't your field of experience for such strong opinions. You are permitted to post and I am permitted to reply. Monocles and Spitter prices aren't cheap after you put in air cost. They usually aren't easily obtainable in your area unless you're in PA. They used to also be obtainable in Florida and Texas but they were legislated. It costs $109+ box charge for hot shipments and you must go to the air port to get them. Most dealers won't ship or they must hear your voice and question you before shipping. So it would be about 209+ gas costs depending on how far the airport is. Not cheap or easily obtainable for me.
TBH
- Joined
- Jul 16, 2008
- Messages
- 971
its amazing!
everyone that doesn't agree with you is evidentially uneducated
everyone that doesn't agree with you is evidentially uneducated
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2008
- Messages
- 66
I assume that you keep insisting that I'm uneduated because of my previous thread where I said I had no experience with hots. Well, the point of that post was to help me find out where to get experience, which I am happy to say I did, two weekends ago. I got to go with a guy while he looked for rattlesnakes (we did encounter a few). Crotalus atrox, in case you were wondering. After that I went to his house where he let me work with his collection, very supervised of course. So I am happy to report that I have now personally hooked 8 western diamondbacks, of various sizes, a few being over 4 ft. Which is like .0000001 of the amount I would like to work with before I feel comfortable, but it's a start. There a quite a few deaths on record for that species, some even after anti-venom was given, so please don't tell me that western diamondbacks don't count. They are also known to be quite defensive, and readily strike. I didn't do anything more than put them from one container to another, but I had a good time and gained a TON of respect for hots. So no, I am not totally uneducated. And just in case you didn't know, repeatedly telling people that they are uneducated, and telling them to stop posting, is not debating, it's called FLAMING. I hope you can learn to be respectful while you disagree, because the way you are carrying on is making you appear childish. If you wanted to draw attention to your thread, this was the wrong way to do it.
-Ally
-Ally
im against it as much as everyone else, but my question is, why is it that if the government is so worried about stuff like immigration, terrorism, the war in iraq, the economy, etc, why are they wasting there time making a bill against animal keepers instead of spending that time to make laws regarding the bigger things?
it doesnt seem to make sense if you ask me. maybe im just not seeing the big picture though. :?
it doesnt seem to make sense if you ask me. maybe im just not seeing the big picture though. :?
- Joined
- Jul 16, 2008
- Messages
- 971
its just to distract people from those major problems and "realize" that the government is actually helping
ah now i see now. i didnt think of thatits just to distract people from those major problems and "realize" that the government is actually helping
- Joined
- Jan 11, 2004
- Messages
- 630
Moderator's Note
Ok everyone, simmer down.
Let me make this crystal clear. The ONLY one who can tell someone to stop posting anywhere on this site is a moderator. And seeing as you are most certainly NOT a moderator, BoaConstrictor, then YOU need to stop trying to act like one, or you will be the one that will be told to stop posting .....
EVERYONE is entitled to their opinion. It does NOT mean the are not educated. You are extremely insulting and my tolerance level is diminishing quickly. I suggest you get yourself in check swiftly.
Debby
Ok everyone, simmer down.
Let me make this crystal clear. The ONLY one who can tell someone to stop posting anywhere on this site is a moderator. And seeing as you are most certainly NOT a moderator, BoaConstrictor, then YOU need to stop trying to act like one, or you will be the one that will be told to stop posting .....
EVERYONE is entitled to their opinion. It does NOT mean the are not educated. You are extremely insulting and my tolerance level is diminishing quickly. I suggest you get yourself in check swiftly.
Debby
I'm not going to say atox's don't count. I didn't say any snake doesn't count. All I'm saying is that I think the thousand hour rule is messed up. I agree that keeping tabs on hot owners and what exotics they have is good. I just don't think you need to work a thousand hours for it.
TBH
- Joined
- May 2, 2005
- Messages
- 1,863
If you want to continue this thread with intelligent discourse into the pro's and or con's of this bill, feel free. Anything else other than that will result in infraction or suspension and the thread will be closed. This is the last warning.
While I am personally opposed to a few genera of arachnid ever reaching the invertebrate hobby, the bill seems to have the potential for far more negative things to come than positives. I went through the bill and cited the specific problems that I can see(other than the broad topic of the lists), please feel free to add your own input.
- Sec 3.a.1: Would keep new/undescribed species from entering the hobby.
- Sec 3.a.11: Basically a blank check for bans/regulations.
- Sec 3.d: California and ferrets are a perfect example of how laws can be passed on half-assed data.
- Sec 5.a.2: Allows for the formal ban of importation of all invertebrates covered in the plant pest act.
- Sec 6.a.6: Makes the breeding, selling, trading, or buying of banned animals already in possession a crime.
- Sec 8.a: Allows for the permits and or fines to be prohibitively expensive for the average person.
- Sec 3.a.1: Would keep new/undescribed species from entering the hobby.
- Sec 3.a.11: Basically a blank check for bans/regulations.
- Sec 3.d: California and ferrets are a perfect example of how laws can be passed on half-assed data.
- Sec 5.a.2: Allows for the formal ban of importation of all invertebrates covered in the plant pest act.
- Sec 6.a.6: Makes the breeding, selling, trading, or buying of banned animals already in possession a crime.
- Sec 8.a: Allows for the permits and or fines to be prohibitively expensive for the average person.
- Joined
- Nov 27, 2005
- Messages
- 792
Just a quick note..
If you are interested in the many changing rules/regulations about pet ownership, I would suggest joining this group: Pet Industry Joint Advisory Council.
This organization keeps it's members up to date on what's going on in the pet trade. A lot of the information is really useful. It's only $35 for hobbyists to join and have access to the whole site plus their newsletter.
I keep quite a few different animals and it's important to me to know what's going on. I don't like being surprised when California adds a few new animals on the list of illegal pets like they did this year
If you are interested in the many changing rules/regulations about pet ownership, I would suggest joining this group: Pet Industry Joint Advisory Council.
This organization keeps it's members up to date on what's going on in the pet trade. A lot of the information is really useful. It's only $35 for hobbyists to join and have access to the whole site plus their newsletter.
I keep quite a few different animals and it's important to me to know what's going on. I don't like being surprised when California adds a few new animals on the list of illegal pets like they did this year
- Joined
- Mar 1, 2008
- Messages
- 644
There are many reasons why I think this bill is bad, but one big reason is the list of current exotics that are to be banned isn't made yet. This bill is an open book to ban all exotics period. Don't expect some government official or politician to care about your hobby, they will eventually ban all exotics and this bill will help them do it. Anyone who supports this bill is supporting a ghost. Make a solid list of banned animals rather than a phantom list to be created later. If you value your hobby get active in defeating this bill.
Put up or stand aside
Okay folks let's get organized now.
Andrew Wyatt who helped to found the North Carolina Association of Reptile Keepers and defeat similar legislation in that state has started a United States group to fight this one.
Let's get behind this one and get something done by supporting a proven winner.
http://usark.org/
Okay folks let's get organized now.
Andrew Wyatt who helped to found the North Carolina Association of Reptile Keepers and defeat similar legislation in that state has started a United States group to fight this one.
Let's get behind this one and get something done by supporting a proven winner.
http://usark.org/
Good one, but I am with Rexano. I'll still check it out though. Rexano isn't just reptiles. It is about a person's choice of pet no matter what it is.
TBH
- Joined
- Jun 24, 2008
- Messages
- 95
Even though i am a canadian i will be joining PIJAC usa soon as well as USARK to help in this major battle to keep all of our pets no matter what they are we must band together in this challange or we will certainly lose. there is simular legislation going on here in BC, Canada.
Yes! The law only regulates the United States not Canada. Most captive inverts come from the U.S. people in Canada's hobby will most definitely see much less availability, more wild caughts and way higher prices. You should act on this regulation too.
TBH