My little quartertard.

[Corranthe]

I am going to offer a dissenting opinion at this point. I feel really bad for the little guy, but nature has made a choice here. His deformities got worse and not better since the last molt, which I think tells us that this is nature’s way of saying that something went wrong, and to keep him from breeding (and therefore creating more abnormal slings) nature is working to take him out of the picture and I don’t think it is smart for us to try too hard to fight that.

I'm sorry Ryan, but it looks like it is a choice between watching him slowly starve to death or speeding up the process in some way.

 

[Lucara]

Sometimes you have to make things worse before you can make them better. For all we know its fixed the things inside while deforming the things outside a bit more.
Honestly I have no idea what I would do but if the lil' guy is just going to starve to death, theres no reason to keep him alive.

 

[arachyd]

As long as he is able to move about he has some energy reserves. He has a nice, big abdomen. Maybe he can survive until another molt or 2. As far as removing him from the gene pool, I still think it is not a genetic deformity but rather an injury and probably would not be passed to any offspring he might have. I think you should give him until the next molt before doing anything or until he starts to lose the ability to walk about and explore due to lack of energy, whichever comes first.

 

[Talkenlate04]

As long as he is able to move about he has some energy reserves. He has a nice, big abdomen. Maybe he can survive until another molt or 2. As far as removing him from the gene pool, I still think it is not a genetic deformity but rather an injury and probably would not be passed to any offspring he might have. I think you should give him until the next molt before doing anything or until he starts to lose the ability to walk about and explore due to lack of energy, whichever comes first.

I would almost agree with you, but I just can't for some reason. There is no way at all this was just an injury. This is a deformity. And on top of it he has never ever eaten before. And from the looks of it he will never eat in his whole life.

Ill get some pictures up soon. It will make more sense when you see it.

 

[Talkenlate04]

And here he is.

It was hard to get good shots. He has a high energy level ill give him that. The underside shot was the hardest to get because he can't really hang to well on the sides of things. But you will see what I mean when I say he can't eat.

 

[jen650s]

Wow! it doesn't even look as if he has a mouth

 

[Truff135]

Hmm, looking at it, I can't see how that will improve within the next molt or two. I think my vote goes to putting it down gently. It's much better than letting him starve in the hopes that he'll fix himself. If he were to even make it that far, molting will probably just become more and more difficult. Tough decision to make but I don't think curiosity on our part is in his best interest.

 

[funnylori]

It's one of those things you don't want to look at, but can't help but stare...

His pedipalp is coming out of the chelicera... So bizzar. I'd almost want to see what he could do... But there is very little chance that he could actually form normal parts with that large of a disfigurement. Poor thing, I had high hopes for him before...

 

[Talkenlate04]

I am torn. I know if I don't put him down he will just starve. There is 0 hope.

 

[Snipes]

So neat but so sad Ryan. I think i see a fang on the first pic. Can you give roach guts there? Geez, is it even hooked up to the stomach?

 

[Cocoa-Jin]

I hate to say it, but I think it should be put down before it gets too bad...let it hang around until its lack of feeding begins a downward spiral.

It looks like it has no mouth parts and the condition appears to be getting worse. I wouldnt expect it to improve since it looks like the differiented cells have mixed together. Unless you can get those cells to migrate back to their proper locations, they may just get more and more mixed up as they divide and grow in numbers.

It almost looks like someone "stirred the pot" of cells as it was developing in the egg.

 

[Sabatta]

If you mist his vial does he drink? Because if he is able to suck up water, you may be able to sustain him by preparing little 'soup' dishes.

 

[DrAce]

Let us not forget all the other required 'bits' going through that part of his body. It's likely that there is digestive tract problems, possibly nervous problems.

I'm changing my vote. This does look genetic. Pedipalps coming from other body parts suggests Hox gene interferance, or similar, in my opinion. I didn't realise that they were still being patterned at this stage in life.

I doubt that he's going to pull through. But I am reluctant to say 'put him down'.

 

[arachyd]

I still say wait. If he is active and has energy who knows but he may have a successful molt. Something's working if he's growing and moving. Does he seem coordinated? Since they can go through long periods of time without eating he isn't suffering by not eating.

 

[Talkenlate04]

I still say wait. If he is active and has energy who knows but he may have a successful molt. Something's working if he's growing and moving. Does he seem coordinated? Since they can go through long periods of time without eating he isn't suffering by not eating.

Yes but you keep forgetting that he has NEVER eaten before. He is just now at what would be his first feeding instar. So he has already done what he could on the yoke in the egg. But now he has to eat to keep going, without food it's all over.

 

[GailC]

I'd put him down, nothing good will come from keeping him alive any longer. I had really hoped he would make it

 

[DrAce]

Yes but you keep forgetting that he has NEVER eaten before. He is just now at what would be his first feeding instar. So he has already done what he could on the yoke in the egg. But now he has to eat to keep going, without food it's all over.

He's really not going to recover. What you are seeing is the confused development of body segments... which is usually a really bad sign. Check out 'Hox Genes' in wikipedia (I think they're listed under homeobox genes).

It's a genetic deformity which is unlikely to get better. I'm actually surprised that it's showing up so late.

 

[Talkenlate04]

So 1st instar maybe even at the egg with legs stage as well is late for something like this to show up?

 

[Rochelle]

I've been watching this sad thread for some time, but since other, more qualified people have been also keeping up with it; I haven't chimed in.
I have a question, though.
Since it is looking like it is, indeed, as genetic deformity; what are the chances of it being caused by inbreeding? (not that I'm saying Ryan would knowingly do that ).
Could this be a legitimate factor?

 

[DrAce]

So 1st instar maybe even at the egg with legs stage as well is late for something like this to show up?

Honestly, mate, I can't tell you. I don't know enough about spider development to really be able to say. I just think it's remarkable.

There's another hypothesis which could explain it... there could be a developing 'lump' in there... think unborn twin, or part of one. I know this happens in higher animals, but I really don't know what the chances of this happening in spiders are.

I should also add that my Hox gene hypothesis is just a guess, and I'm not a geneticist... just a chemist placed in a molecular biology world. I do know that this is the sort of thing that could result.

I have a colleague here who studies 'Sonic Hedgehog' genes (and I'm not making that name up) which control left-right development. I wonder if she has some input...

I've been watching this sad thread for some time, but since other, more qualified people have been also keeping up with it; I haven't chimed in.
I have a question, though.
Since it is looking like it is, indeed, as genetic deformity; what are the chances of it being caused by inbreeding? (not that I'm saying Ryan would knowingly do that ).
Could this be a legitimate factor?

It's unlikely. I'd expect there to be more than one of them. These things just happen.