Cross breeding

[Shamrock]

I dont see a difference except in the carapace, though it could just be the lighting

 

[Exoskeleton Invertebrates]

Will play another game give me a minute.

 

[Exoskeleton Invertebrates]

Acanthoscurria geniculata - Photo #I

Photo #II

Photo #III

Photo #IV

Photo #V

Acanthoscurria sp. "Brocklehursti" Photo #VI
Which of these females is the original hobby Acanthoscurria geniculata and hobby Acanthoscurria brocklehursti?

 

[obie]

Almost but they are not. Hybrid is the top photo.

what is it bred with

 

[Shamrock]

If this was an exam i would fail

How do you tell?

 

[D Sherlod]

I am always amazed at the hybrid discussion. If it was not for cross breeding we would not have any of the current "pure bred" dog breeds. I'm not talking about the current designer breeds or mutts.
in farming livestock has been cross bred to get the best beef, or pork etc.

I'm in no way advocating cross breeding but it's nothing new and not always a bad thing when done properly.

 

[Exoskeleton Invertebrates]

Acanthoscurria geniculata - Photo #I - "Short Black Banding" on the patella, also side black markings not attached between the joint of the patella and femur. Overall thick white coloration which gives this species the common name as the "Giant White Knee".

Photo #II - Front black side marking a little bit bigger with a swoosh towards the bottom. And black side markings closer to the joint between the patella and femur.

Photo #III - Black side markings is thicker and longer. Black side markings extremely close to the joint between the patella and femur. Also her white coloration is not of a cream white compare to any of the other specimens

Photo #IV - Black side markings longer and the swoosh is more visible. Black side markings is extremely close between the patella and femur.

Photo #V - Unfortunately this is the only photo I have of her from the side view and I no longer have her in my possession. When freshly molted black side markings are longer and thicker. Black side markings are attached between the joint of the patella and femur.

Acanthoscurria sp. "Brocklehursti" - Photo #IV - This is the original hobby brocklehursti, black side markings are extremely thick and longer than any of the other variants. Black side markings is attached between the joint of the patella and the femur. As you can see the white coloration is very little/limited which the common name was given for this spider is the "Giant White Banded".


So I've explain a little bit of a description of all six specimens. So the question remains any of you who owns a geniculata or sp. "Brocklehursti" which variant do you actually have? Also with the revision the Acanthoscurria geniculata it has been stated that there is a wide range of this species. My question to that is which locality of each specimen is from? How do we know that this variants that is in the hobby has not been badly crossed through the years that we are seeing different characteristics by many several specimens.

My opinion both geniculata and sp. brocklehursti have been hybridized. I also believe that the specimen on photo #III may be from a different locality as well, but I don't know this for sure if it is, she just looks very different from the rest when it comes to her white color. Is not the same as the rest of them. Regardless if they are in fact that hobby brocklehursti is hobby geniculata why would anyone cross short banding with long banding and destroy the natural appearance that nature has selected them to be as.

Hope this helps..............

 

[Exoskeleton Invertebrates]

Hybrid sucks! It destroys the beauty of the spiders that we've seen and cherish so much.

 

[Andrea82]

I am always amazed at the hybrid discussion. If it was not for cross breeding we would not have any of the current "pure bred" dog breeds. I'm not talking about the current designer breeds or mutts.
in farming livestock has been cross bred to get the best beef, or pork etc.

I'm in no way advocating cross breeding but it's nothing new and not always a bad thing when done properly.

The difference is that we have no clue on how spider genetics work. If you breed one dog breed with another, it is roughly 50/50 divided characteristics. But from what i've gathered, this doesn't work the same with spiders. So if you breed one species to another, there is no telling if the desired traits will be dominant.
Also, with dog breeds, there often are 'originals' enough to practice with, without compromising the original breeds. Our resources for fresh bloodlines in spiders are very limited.

 

[Venom1080]

I am always amazed at the hybrid discussion. If it was not for cross breeding we would not have any of the current "pure bred" dog breeds. I'm not talking about the current designer breeds or mutts.
in farming livestock has been cross bred to get the best beef, or pork etc.

I'm in no way advocating cross breeding but it's nothing new and not always a bad thing when done properly.

hybrids are not, and never will be, a good thing.
no matter how responsible the breeder is, a few slings will probably end up in the hands of others, they might sell those to some one else, etc.
nature gave us plenty to work with, no need to mix it all together.

 

[boina]

I am always amazed at the hybrid discussion. If it was not for cross breeding we would not have any of the current "pure bred" dog breeds. I'm not talking about the current designer breeds or mutts.
in farming livestock has been cross bred to get the best beef, or pork etc.

I'm in no way advocating cross breeding but it's nothing new and not always a bad thing when done properly.

There is a difference you didn't consider: Dogs and most of all life stock have been bred for a purpose. Humankind wanted something specific and bred for it - meat, milk, hunting behaviour in dogs, etc. This was breeding with a purpose. By now the breeding we as humans do with dogs, cats, and life stock is completely perverted from my point of view: cats with short legs (Munchkins), dogs that can't breathe properly (Pugs)... and the list goes on. Sick color "morphs" in snakes come to mind, too. Should we do that just because someone thinks it's cute?
And for what possible purpose would we cross breed tarantulas? The only reason behind any cross breed is that someone thinks it interesting. What happens if you cross breed without a specific purpose is, you dilute the differences between tarantulas. Look at dogs: Google Paria dogs and look at the pics. A Paria dog is what happens when stray dogs interbreed without control or pupose. After a few generations they all look more or less the same. The same will happen if you start to interbreed different Brachypelmas. And in a purposeful breeding project, what would you go after: curly hair from the albos but red legs from the boehmeis? How'd you propose to get there?

And we don't even know about the different species in the wild! We don't know what is a species and what is a color form or a geographic variety in a lot of cases. We have no real clue even which species belong to the same genus, let alone family! And now someone breeds hybrids and makes even more of a mess, just because we can. Can we please sort out first what different species/genera we are dealing with in the first place?

 

[nicodimus22]

If it was not for cross breeding we would not have any of the current "pure bred" dog breeds.

All dogs are the same species, Canis lupus familiaris. No matter what characteristics you're trying to get, you're staying within that species to get them.

Cross breeding tarantulas is like breeding a dog with a wolf or coyote, and then passing the puppies off as 100% dog to unsuspecting owners.

 

[Exoskeleton Invertebrates]

All dogs are the same species, Canis lupus familiaris. No matter what characteristics you're trying to get, you're staying within that species to get them.

Cross breeding tarantulas is like breeding a dog with a wolf or coyote, and then passing the puppies off as 100% dog to unsuspecting owners.

Let's pretend that all tarantulas are the same species like dogs are and let's mate an arboreal species with terrestrial and see what we come up with

It is not our right to breed natural characteristics species with other different ones from different regions.

 

[D Sherlod]

Please remember... I said that I don't advocate cross breeding at all.

I just find the discussion interesting. If it's this forum or reptile forums it's usually the same discussion. I have never hybrid geckos which I bred for years and I will never hybrid tarantulas.

But I would not be surprised if some of the species we love so much are results of hybrids in nature.

 

[D Sherlod]

I just hope that we all agree with selective breeding.

I.e. breeding only the best available of the species with the best of the same species.
and not breeding poor quality specimans.

 

[Andrea82]

I just hope that we all agree with selective breeding.

I.e. breeding only the best available of the species with the best of the same species.
and not breeding poor quality specimans.

But how would one qualify which specimens are 'the best'? Coloration? Temperament? Speed? Who decides?

 

[D Sherlod]

But how would one qualify which specimens are 'the best'? Coloration? Temperament? Speed? Who decides?

All of those traits including size as is appropriate for each species. An example would be in larger species not breeding the runts. Or in dwarf species not breeding oversized specimans. Etc.

 

[Leila]

Let's pretend that all tarantulas are the same species like dogs are and let's mate an arboreal species with terrestrial and see what we come up with

It is not our right to breed natural characteristics species with other different ones from different regions.

That video just grossed me out...Someone take that person's tarantulas away. What the actual heck??

 

[nicodimus22]

That video just grossed me out...Someone take that person's tarantulas away. What the actual heck??

That actually doesn't bother me as much as all the ____ vs ____ videos on youtube where some sicko puts different species in an enclosed space and films them fighting to the death. No animal deserves that, and there is no excuse to do it.

 

[Leila]

That actually doesn't bother me as much as all the ____ vs ____ videos on youtube where some sicko puts different species in an enclosed space and films them fighting to the death. No animal deserves that, and there is no excuse to do it.

Oh, I HATE those! I could not tell you WHY I viewed one in the first place...Ugh. The video I partially watched was of two tarantulas in a bare enclosure. They clearly did not want to be around one another- no surprise there, right? So they both throw up threat postures then turn to leave the other's presence. One T left the enclosure. And what does the butthead man do??? He places the escaped T BACK into the enclosure- this is where I stopped the video- and makes them fight till one dies. I know the latter happened because I read some of the comments below the video.

Not ok. Not at all.