Can tarantulas eat meat(meat meant for human consumption)

[TLSizzle]

My main concern is would the T even recognize the meat as food?
Stops being a "could they" debate and more so "would they"?

 

[TheHound]

.........and yet I've read reports suggesting that certain invertebrates do far better on artificial diets than on what they eat in the wild and have evolved to eat. How does that fit into your view of the world?

Well, a second-hand internet forum vague reference to "reports" doesn't exactly shatter my supposition that animals do best on what they've evolved to eat, let alone the rather more grandiose and somewhat less pertinent matter of my "view of the world". Of course, being an empirical fellow, if I saw said reports and ascertained that they themselves had a degree of reliability and ideally weren't just anecdotal, then I would happily adjust my view.

So far, however, you have yourself acknowledged that there is no conclusive proof and that your own contributions are speculation, so I can't say I'm massively optimistic on that front.

 

[Introvertebrate]

You gonna share sources on these reports you've seen so the rest of us can evaluate the validity of the claims? Or maybe an example? I keep an open mind but I'm hard pressed to believe that deviating far off from the natural diet is in an animals best interest in most cases.

I never saved the link. Entomologists use artificial diets to raise pest species in captivity in order to figure out ways of killing them. According to the report I read, some species, let's say gypsy moth larvae, grew faster and larger on the artificial diet than on their natural host plant. It takes a lot of energy to chew and break down aspen and willow leaves. Additionally, a particular tree may not meet the larvae's optimal nutritional needs. With an artificial diet, you can precisely tailor the ingredients to the larvae's needs, and break it down to a consistency that's easy to eat. Kind of like the Repashy Bug Burger that my roaches seem to love.

Now would a piece of chicken meat all of a tarantula's nutritional requirements? Probably not. But maybe if you mixed some chicken and all the other needed ingredients and gave the whole thing kind of a gel consistency, you might have something to work with. Of course, triggering a predator's feeding response is another story entirely.

 

[Introvertebrate]

Well, a second-hand internet forum vague reference to "reports" doesn't exactly shatter my supposition that animals do best on what they've evolved to eat, let alone the rather more grandiose and somewhat less pertinent matter of my "view of the world". Of course, being an empirical fellow, if I saw said reports and ascertained that they themselves had a degree of reliability and ideally weren't just anecdotal, then I would happily adjust my view.

So far, however, you have yourself acknowledged that there is no conclusive proof and that your own contributions are speculation, so I can't say I'm massively optimistic on that front.

Believe what you like. It makes perfect sense to me that you would take the more simplistic "natural is better" view of the world. I bet they love you when you pay top dollar for "organic" produce at the local farmer's market.

 

[aprilmayjunebugs]

There's a thread about this somewhere, by a well respected member here if I remember correctly, who has done this.

I was wrong, this is what I was thinking of

Tarantulas Eating Vegetables or Fruit?

Tonight, I put a baby carrot in the enclosure of my Brachypelma emilia to lure out the dubia roach that was hiding. After Petra finished with the roach, I looked in the enclosure and noticed that she had the carrot in her mouth. I was sure she'd drop the carrot once she figured out it was not...

arachnoboards.com

Here's a thread from not long ago on this subject

Tarantulas Eating Raw Meat?

I've been looking though this site looking for interesting feeders for T's when I noticed photos of people feeding their tarantulas beef...Is this safe?

arachnoboards.com

I recall another member who acquired a tarantula that had previously been fed exclusively ham cubes.

This thread is making me hungry.

 

[TheHound]

Believe what you like. It makes perfect sense to me that you would take the more simplistic "natural is better" view of the world. I bet they love you when you pay top dollar for "organic" produce at the local farmer's market.

Organic produce is food not grown using anti-pesticides and man-made fertilisers, which is an entirely different thing from an animal eating a totally different food from what it has evolved to eat and digest. The comparison is therefore both spurious and ridiculous, and your accusation of my thinking of being simplistic is rendered somewhat ironic by it.

Furthermore, there's zero reliable evidence that organic produce is better than non-organic, so no, I don't buy it. Such a view being entirely in keeping with not believing that cow and pig meat are not as good for tarantulas as food that they actually eat in the wild, without seeing reliable evidence to the contrary. Evidence which you have been invited to post by me and at least one other but have so far not done, in favour of vague and snarky posts.

As I have said, I am willing to adjust my views based on evidence, but at the outset I think most people would agree it is a reasonable starting point to assume that food that tarantulas eat is best for tarantulas. It's hardly a view I'm emotionally attached to (much as you seem to fail to grasp otherwise) but I wouldn't feed my Ts anything else without evidence that it's not a bad idea to do so. If you think that's a bad approach then you are effectively arguing against empiricism, which is heavily risible.

 

[TechnoGeek]

Yes they can, and while I wouldn't feed them that as a staple, it's a good bit of protein for them every couple weeks.

Yeah, tarantulas obviously don't eat chicken, turkey, or beef in the wild, but they also don't eat mealworms, wax worms, or roaches that live on a different continent. Like it or not, almost nothing that you're feeding them is "natural" in the sense that they eat it in the wild. They're opportunistic predators, meaning if something runs into them, and they feel it's not too big for them to overpower, they'll eat it. So long as it's fresh and parasite free there's no harm.

 

[TechnoGeek]

My main concern is would the T even recognize the meat as food?

Most of mine do:







In my experience, chicken and turkey is the easiest for them to digest, so that's what I usually feed when I feed them vertebrates. I don't feed mice, live or F/T cause the mess is far uglier.

 

[TheHound]

I never saved the link. Entomologists use artificial diets to raise pest species in captivity in order to figure out ways of killing them. According to the report I read, some species, let's say gypsy moth larvae, grew faster and larger on the artificial diet than on their natural host plant. It takes a lot of energy to chew and break down aspen and willow leaves. Additionally, a particular tree may not meet the larvae's optimal nutritional needs. With an artificial diet, you can precisely tailor the ingredients to the larvae's needs, and break it down to a consistency that's easy to eat. Kind of like the Repashy Bug Burger that my roaches seem to love.

Now would a piece of chicken meat all of a tarantula's nutritional requirements? Probably not. But maybe if you mixed some chicken and all the other needed ingredients and gave the whole thing kind of a gel consistency, you might have something to work with. Of course, triggering a predator's feeding response is another story entirely.

Yes they can, and while I wouldn't feed them that as a staple, it's a good bit of protein for them every couple weeks.

Yeah, tarantulas obviously don't eat chicken, turkey, or beef in the wild, but they also don't eat mealworms, wax worms, or roaches that live on a different continent. Like it or not, almost nothing that you're feeding them is "natural" in the sense that they eat it in the wild. They're opportunistic predators, meaning if something runs into them, and they feel it's not too big for them to overpower, they'll eat it. So long as it's fresh and parasite free there's no harm.

Leaving aside the absence of solid evidence, this is some interesting thinking and food for thought (parden the pun). It's true that not all feeders used are necessarily things the T encounters in the wild and that's a good point.

One other thing I'd take into account with human meat though, is that it can get pumped with a lot of crud, unlike (as far as I'm aware) the mealworms, superworms etc that get bred for pets. Particularly American meat - one controversial aspect of Brexit was that we would lose the food protections of the EU, which are of a far higher standard than in the US, and the UK could end up with a lot of stuff from over the Atlantic with questionable contents (chlorinated chicken being an oft-used example). I don't know for sure what potential harm there could be for tarantulas with that, but it could be a factor.

 

[Introvertebrate]

Leaving aside the absence of solid evidence, this is some interesting thinking and food for thought (parden the pun). It's true that not all feeders used are necessarily things the T encounters in the wild and that's a good point.

One other thing I'd take into account with human meat though, is that it can get pumped with a lot of crud, unlike (as far as I'm aware) the mealworms, superworms etc that get bred for pets. Particularly American meat - one controversial aspect of Brexit was that we would lose the food protections of the EU, which are of a far higher standard than in the US, and the UK could end up with a lot of stuff from over the Atlantic with questionable contents (chlorinated chicken being an oft-used example). I don't know for sure what potential harm there could be for tarantulas with that, but it could be a factor.

Well, when you guys take back your American colonies you can implement whatever meat standards you want.

 

[Ultum4Spiderz]

Well, when you guys take back your American colonies you can implement whatever meat standards you want.

Is there some nutritional value in mice/raw meat that they can’t get from roaches?

 

[Introvertebrate]

Is there some nutritional value in mice/raw meat that they can’t get from roaches?

That's not the point. We're trying to determine if they'll thrive without the feeder hassle.

 

[Ultum4Spiderz]

That's not the point. We're trying to determine if they'll thrive without the feeder hassle.

Hmm someone would have to use it as staple feeder then and log the results. Feeders are a real pain to raise. Especially mealworms/supers.

 

[TechnoGeek]

Leaving aside the absence of solid evidence, this is some interesting thinking and food for thought (parden the pun). It's true that not all feeders used are necessarily things the T encounters in the wild and that's a good point.

One other thing I'd take into account with human meat though, is that it can get pumped with a lot of crud, unlike (as far as I'm aware) the mealworms, superworms etc that get bred for pets. Particularly American meat - one controversial aspect of Brexit was that we would lose the food protections of the EU, which are of a far higher standard than in the US, and the UK could end up with a lot of stuff from over the Atlantic with questionable contents (chlorinated chicken being an oft-used example). I don't know for sure what potential harm there could be for tarantulas with that, but it could be a factor.

What I'm saying is, it's not the end of the world. I definitely would not recommend making it a staple as I mentioned, but I wouldn't say it's particularly harmful if done once a month or so. You don't have to do it, they'll be perfectly healthy and happy without it, but I've been doing it for years and I can't say I see any harm in it.

Plus Ts eat more vertebrates than we previously thought. Hell even some true spiders have developed certain adaptations to help them catch vertebrates. I'll post an academic article that mentions this shortly.

If I had to mention a reason that's not necessarily academically proven but stemming from common sense or logic if you may, it would be that tarantulas aren't specialists, and so it wouldn't make much sense for them to develop a digestive system that's adapted to digesting one kind of prey only. Certain animals are specialists (like some lizards that specialize in hunting snails, and certain snakes that specialize in hunting frogs and toads) but tarantulas are generalists. They seem to do very well on almost any kind of nontoxic prey that they can overpower; for example H gigas hunts fish, T blondi has been recorded killing and consuming Fer-de-lance snakes, and there's a T vagans population that were released in Florida and they seem to be doing even better than their wild counterparts living in their native range (as they seem to be growing bigger on avg) and they must be eating things that they shouldn't normally encounter in their native habitat.

Just my 0.02. In the end, and as always, I wouldn't tell people to copy anything that I do.

 

[TechnoGeek]

Is there some nutritional value in mice/raw meat that they can’t get from roaches?

Probably not. Actually, baby mice are higher in fat and lower in protein than most feeder insects (provided you gut load them properly).

Chicken breast and ground turkey on the other hand, are very high in protein and rather low in fat so they might be a better idea than rodents. Plus, feeding rodents is usually more messy, and if they're live rodents it's even dangerous (for the T).

 

[Ultum4Spiderz]

What I'm saying is, it's not the end of the world. I definitely would not recommend making it a staple as I mentioned, but I wouldn't say it's particularly harmful if done once a month or so. You don't have to do it, they'll be perfectly healthy and happy without it, but I've been doing it for years and I can't say I see any harm in it.

Plus Ts eat more vertebrates than we previously thought. Hell even some true spiders have developed certain adaptations to help them catch vertebrates. I'll post an academic article that mentions this shortly.

If I had to mention a reason that's not necessarily academically proven but stemming from common sense or logic if you may, it would be that tarantulas aren't specialists, and so it wouldn't make much sense for them to develop a digestive system that's adapted to digesting one kind of prey only. Certain animals are specialists (like some lizards that specialize in hunting snails, and certain snakes that specialize in hunting frogs and toads) but tarantulas are generalists. They seem to do very well on almost any kind of nontoxic prey that they can overpower; for example H gigas hunts fish, and there's a T vagans population that were released in Florida and they seem to be doing even better than their wild counterparts living in their native range (as they seem to be growing bigger on avg) and they must be eating things that they shouldn't normally encounter in their native habitat.

Just my 0.02. In the end, and as always, I wouldn't tell people to copy anything that I do.

Yeah we know they eat mice although a huge rat or mouse could be considered a big threat to smaller Ts. Do Ts reach a higher max size fed meat and rodents ?? Is that why people like me who feed roaches 90%-96 of the time have smaller Ts than people feeding them occasionally mice. 5-10% Mealworms and superworms are my go to for variety.

Probably not. Actually, baby mice are higher in fat and lower in protein than most feeder insects (provided you gut load them properly).

Chicken breast and ground turkey on the other hand, are very high in protein and rather low in fat so they might be a better idea than rodents. Plus, feeding rodents is usually more messy, and if they're live rodents it's even dangerous (for the T).

I was just wondering if they or dangerous fuzzy mice help a t come closer to its max size than roaches. But roaches cheaper and plentiful than mice I don’t see any reason to go and buy mice. Plus some roaches get close to hopper mouse size. The small rodents that die without the mom in a few days, yes I fed one off last year. No plan of doing it again .. it’s not a snake or reptile calcium doesn’t help tarantulas. Maybe my collection is just smaller because I don’t power feed. My l klugi I had 9 years and it’s still 2-3 molts from adult size holy cow it’s 6-7”.
I could get red runners but they cost more than dubia!
orange roach the size of a hoper mouse.

 

[HooahArmy]

Hey, speaking of meat and Ts, I would like to bring up an interesting case here. I have a pal, Chanthay, who raises Ts in Thailand. Feeders are a bit hard to come by where she lives, but fish are very plentiful. She catches these little minnows in a jar and offers them up as feeders. The flapping of the fish catches the Ts attention, and after feeding, the Ts roll the bones and scales into a corner of their enclosure. In the years I saw her in the US, she did the same with feeder goldfish and minnows. I'm not sure how ideal fish are as feeders, but the Ts didn't complain and the idea certainly caught my attention!

 

[Ultum4Spiderz]

Hey, speaking of meat and Ts, I would like to bring up an interesting case here. I have a pal, Chanthay, who raises Ts in Thailand. Feeders are a bit hard to come by where she lives, but fish are very plentiful. She catches these little minnows in a jar and offers them up as feeders. The flapping of the fish catches the Ts attention, and after feeding, the Ts roll the bones and scales into a corner of their enclosure. In the years I saw her in the US, she did the same with feeder goldfish and minnows. I'm not sure how ideal fish are as feeders, but the Ts didn't complain and the idea certainly caught my attention!

interesting story !!
I recal some guy on here many years ago fed His h gigas fish, even gave it a swimming area.
I don’t feed mice anymore because I’m worried the high calcium could kill a t not too mention razer sharp teeth, But that would be considered feeding them meat. if I recal the op fed his Ts mice before I’ve only did so 3 times ever. I see it a long shot a 7/8”+ tarantula getting killed by a live mouse but hey it’s just not a safe feeder??? Why risk our pets for feeding something snakes eat daily.
Feeding them fish that’s unique!! I’ve never bought feeder fish for my Ts because I’m worried the fish will die uneaten or it just never crossed my mind as a possibility.

 

[DustyD]

My fading memory recalls a tarantula keeping book from the early 1980s or late 70s that mentioned that some keepers had successfully fed uncooked ground beef to tarantulas. So this idea has been around for a bit, but it still is interesting to talk about it. I think hamburger and perhaps other meat can come with fillers

 

[Pana Lemontzis]

interesting story !!
I recal some guy on here many years ago fed His h gigas fish, even gave it a swimming area.
I don’t feed mice anymore because I’m worried the high calcium could kill a t not too mention razer sharp teeth, But that would be considered feeding them meat. if I recal the op fed his Ts mice before I’ve only did so 3 times ever. I see it a long shot a 7/8”+ tarantula getting killed by a live mouse but hey it’s just not a safe feeder??? Why risk our pets for feeding something snakes eat daily.
Feeding them fish that’s unique!! I’ve never bought feeder fish for my Ts because I’m worried the fish will die uneaten or it just never crossed my mind as a possibility.

Big white mouse attacked the T back, but was a futile attack. for whatever reason the video wouldnt post so i put the screenshot. I feed them big ass mice but rarley.