Breeding loan thoughts

[julesaussies]

Ok, let me get this straight. I spend say $25 to overnight ship my adult male to you. Lets say for what ever reason the mating doesn't work out. So then you expect me to send you $25 to ship the male back to me? Where would the 50/50 come into play?

You wouldn't have to pay $25 if you didn't want your male back. OR you could wait to see if the mating resulted in slings and get the male back with your 50% of the slings at the female owners expense. (That's where the 50/50 comes into play.) You get 50% of the resulting slings if breeding was successful. Personally, i would want my male back as soon as the female owner was finished with him so i would be happy to pay his return shipping back to me. At least that is how i feel about my B. smithi who should be molting any day now. i guess it just depends on how attached you are to the T.

From what i've read that seems to be the standard method. Personally, i would not have a problem with paying for a male T to be shipped to me and then the owner of the male only paying for his return. After all, i am getting to use him for my female so i feel i should make some contribution. Then if the male T owner wants him back they can pay for his return fare either right away or with any resulting slings. However, i imagine it doesn't matter what the arrangements are as long as both parties are in agreement before the breeding loan starts.

i have ZERO experience - this is just what i've read and my own personal thoughts. i am hoping to be entering my first breeding loan very soon for my N. chromatus female and then loaning out my male B. smithi with the same person if this is in fact his ultimate molt. i am really excited about it!!

 

[matthias]

http://www.tarantulaspiders.com/page/breeding-loans

well according to that
"If the male survives the breeding with this female, the keeper of the male will inform the keeper of the female if he wants the male back or just let him die of natural causes OR if they want to preserved body. In any case, the keeper of the female pays for shipping the male back."

This is what I've always done and had other breeders do for me. The male's owner pays shipping to the female, and the female's owner pays for the male to either come back or on to the next site.

I think it's irrelivant wether the mating was succesfull or not. If you agreed to send the male back then it doesn't matter if you ship him back to the owner or on to the next person. If you wanted to get snotty about it you could include a note to the next breeder that this male doesn't seem to want to breed.

So always remember to discuss this BEFORE you ship out a male, as everyone does it differently.

 

[sick4x4]

thats why the links are used as guides, since many of the dealers do breeding loans all of the time....really, its up to the individuals involved in the loan to create their own agreement but i do belive its fair if breeding is unsuccessful that the owner of the female cover the cost to either send the male back or on to the next female....this is why i only loan out my males to people i trust know what they are doing, otherwise i just sell my males out right...it eliminates all of the intangibles..but remember just because a male is sent out on a loan doesn't mean you will always get slings or the male back....its our hope he finds a gf thats into him and does what nature intended.....lol

 

[pronty]

This seems a bit tricky case but I'll try share my view.

When you receive a male for breeding, you are obliged to send it back if the owner of the male wants so, whether or not there was anything going on.

If the owner of the male have done two separate deals, then he/she is responsible for sending the male to the female owners.
That is unless there is a succesful hookup which is the purpose of the loan.

If there has been no deals made between the female owners, there should be no need for interaction between them. I mean, does any business ask their customers to deal with each others?

The person who wants something to be shipped, pays the shipping. If the owner of the male wants the male to be passed on BEFORE there has been a hookup, he/she should pay.

I'd say usually after a succesful hookup you won't need the male anymore so you are willing to pay the shipping to whomever because it's in benefit of the hobby.

If the owner of the male doesn't give any further instructions after sending the male, the male can be sent forward by the female owners expense, However all resulted slings from that male should be shared 50/50 with the owner of the male.

But in this case, I'd say the choices are:
1. wait until there is a hookup and return/pass on the male if he's alive and pay the shipping.
2. return the male to his owner and pay the shipping.
3. send the male to the 3rd party and let the male owner pay the shipping.


I think I got it all there thinking = hard :wall: ...male brain :?

 

[Varden]

Hm...well, okay, I guess I'm wrong. I've shipped males back with slings before, and I've shipped males independantly when the original owner asks for them back. In fact, I do go out of my way to return males that are sentimentally cherished by their owners. However, I do not think it's fair for me to pay shipping twice, once for the male and again for slings, and sorry, but I won't be doing it any time soon. I usually do ask what people want done with their males after I'm finished with them. The overwhelming majority leave them with me until the male dies, only a rare few ask for the males back, and fewer still wanted them shipped on to someone else. On the flip side, I've occassionally had to pay to have the male shipped to me, otherwise he'd have gone by way of that crap-shoot called Priority.

The only thing this thread has made me think about changing is that I will now label and freeze those males that die on my Retired Males shelf, and I'll ship those back with the slings or upon the female's molting.

 

[Drachenjager]

This confirms that both parties need to be clear on the terms of the arrangement before the male is shipped.

I would not send someone a male if they weren't prepared to pay to ship it on, or back to me.

Eric

I agree IF the male does breed the female. If he is unable to perform his duties then the breedign loan contract is done. This is why you have to trust whoever you send it out to. You are trusting that the male did or did not do his job, that a sac was or not produced, that the number of surving slings is correst...

 

[patrick86]

I've got to agree with Eric and every one I've been involved in has worked that way. I own the male I pay to ship it to the owner of the female. The owner of the female can pay to ship it back to me with hopefully half of the new slings or he can pay to ship it onto the next female. I've done it myself, it's just the way things are done.

Bottom line is to have everything worked out and agreed upon prior to doing any breeding loans.

 

[padkison]

Maybe a sticky on this thread. It lets people know the standard practice, possible differing viewpoints, and the points to be clear on in breeding loans :clap:

I've got to agree with Eric and every one I've been involved in has worked that way. I own the male I pay to ship it to the owner of the female. The owner of the female can pay to ship it back to me with hopefully half of the new slings or he can pay to ship it onto the next female. I've done it myself, it's just the way things are done.

Bottom line is to have everything worked out and agreed upon prior to doing any breeding loans.