Arana Polita - Chicken Spider Diary

[Pyropiscus]

It looks amazing so far, I can't wait to see the finished product! I also love the fact that this species is finally making it's way into the hobby.

On the topic of identification, here's a link to a thread about this species on the BTS site that discusses this issue in great detail:
http://www.thebts.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=2454&highlight=chicken+spiders

 

[AbraxasComplex]

Here is a picture of the painted background. This was the best picture I could get with out washing out the colour and depth too much. I also just noticed the front glass wasn't clean and has a few pieces of fluff on it. I'll try to get a better photograph soon.

 

[Terry D]

Sick setup!

AbraxasComplex,

Your finished backdrop/ruins are awesome!

Any new updates on the spiders........behavior, etc? Not insinuating, but it would be understandable if new information/notes were being withheld for the time being. I, no doubt along with many others, would like to hear more on the species, how they're adapting, etc.

Thanks,

Terry

 

[robd]

Awesome!!!!!! This is like the most exciting thread in Arachnoboards history!!! As far as I'm concerned, it is anyway.

Question though.

Those two protruding caves... are they part of the original block of styrofoam or did you cut them and reattach?

 

[AbraxasComplex]

Yep, I did cut them out and reattach them. This way I can have access to the caves if I need to remove a chicken spider or want to if a female is guarding an eggsac.


As for behavior, not much more to add except all of them I can find cuddling in compressed spots. I have a huge burrow for them and the group of 4 crammed themselves into a hollow spot underneath a piece of driftwood.

Also the babies are prone to burrowing themselves completely in small groups. No entrance or exit, just a thin layer of dirt on top. I freaked one day when I could only find 7 of the 19 babies. I lightly dug around, and found 3 groups just under the soil surface. All 19 were safe and healthy.

 

[forrestpengra]

VERY VERY impressed!!!

You should do a tutorial on how exactly you did that start to finish. Earlier in the thread you said you were going to use grout, but one of the later posts you mention paint? Eitherway I'm SUPER impressed and would like to copy you

When are you moving them into their new mansion?

 

[Jilly1337]

That looks awesome!!! I can imagine how cool it will look with a thriving colony of various sized arana pollito running around.

I cant wait for more updates. Their behavior fascinates me. Thanks for keeping up with this thread.

 

[nexen]

This is the most exciting thing I've ever seen on arachnoboards. Seriously, seriously glad you are sharing this with us. Thanks so much.

One day I hope to have a colony of these guys. They are absolutely stunning Ts.

 

[AbraxasComplex]

VERY VERY impressed!!!

You should do a tutorial on how exactly you did that start to finish. Earlier in the thread you said you were going to use grout, but one of the later posts you mention paint? Eitherway I'm SUPER impressed and would like to copy you

When are you moving them into their new mansion?

I use grout, but you end up painting the styrofoam with grout.

I will put together a step by step in a bit. I have two other projects I'm starting this week so I will take more pictures.


And thanks for the comments everyone.


Oh and the grout has to cure for 3 weeks, then I plant it, test it out with some feeder bugs and go from there. So about a month till they move in.

 

[sharpfang]

You could name them All after Autobots

Fantastic job so far........I can't wait 2 C final set-up! - Jason

 

[nexen]

Quick question: how active are the colonies? From what I've read on the other thread they are very active indeed. Can you confirm or refute this?

 

[AbraxasComplex]

Quick question: how active are the colonies? From what I've read on the other thread they are very active indeed. Can you confirm or refute this?

Well since they are in there opaque containers I can't seem them wandering around. When I have opened the container there is usually one or two out and about, usually at or around the entrance of the main burrow.

 

[KenTheBugGuy]

I

Sorry if I missed this in the thread but how do you tell the "chicken spider" from an antonious...it just looks so similiar. I am wondering if I might have some mixed in possibly....has there been some taxonomy done on them to tell the difference?

 

[AbraxasComplex]

Sorry if I missed this in the thread but how do you tell the "chicken spider" from an antonious...it just looks so similiar. I am wondering if I might have some mixed in possibly....has there been some taxonomy done on them to tell the difference?

So far that's what I'm trying to figure out. I had a macro photo shoot done, but the photographer hasn't sent the photos. :wall:

As for some indicators the urticating hairs are quite different. I have horrendous allergic reactions to P.antinous lasting for almost a week, while with the chicken spiders I do not react at all.

 

[robd]

Sorry if I missed this in the thread but how do you tell the "chicken spider" from an antonious...it just looks so similiar. I am wondering if I might have some mixed in possibly....has there been some taxonomy done on them to tell the difference?

There has been some taxonomy, though I guess unofficial since this T is still regarded as "Pamphobeteus sp. chicken spider", to tell the difference. Back in 2007 actually. Pyropiscus highlighted this thread a few posts back. Check it out:

http://www.thebts.co.uk/forums/showt...hicken+spiders

At post #52, I believe, you start to see people start to question what the differences are and wondering if P antinous is actually the elusive "chicken spider" after all. Todd Gearhart actually jumped into this and questioned the same thing around post #80. I'll go ahead and just copy/paste the main discussion about this in itself:

I have long been a Pamphobeteus collector since the early 1990's and have kept, bred and seen many different species in this genus. I have to side with Rick West for now and say this "Chicken Spider" is most probably a geographical variant of P. antinous. If I remember right in a communication exchange I had with him in the late '90s, he mentioned that the P. antinous in S.E. Peru (specifically the Madre de Dios region) was much bigger than the P. antinous of central-eastern and NE Peru (Iquitos region), and he also said the mature males are a real steel blue" coloration in their femurs than the northern variant which tends to be more purple-blueish. I have seen thousands of the Pullcapa, Peru and Iquitos, Peru P. antinous. They tend to be very nervous, high-strung and do not do well in confined areas. They averaged 8" in older females with males maturing at 5.5"-7.5" legspans. They were also very slender-legged similar to P. vespertinus.

These "Chicken Spiders" from S.E. Peru have the typical P. antinous look: jet black to gray to brown (pre-molt) with the rear half of the abdomen possessing fiery red to reddish-brown hairs. The only two appearance differences that I see are they are more thick-legged and get a littler larger in size. As for the communal behavior, that might exist in the whole genus. I suspect many Pamphobeteus breeders have not experimented with trying to keep them long-term communally due to their high value and the fact that they dont' have 600-2000 spiderlings like some genera.

In summary, I put for the idea that this S.E. Peruvian Pamphobeteus is most probably a southern variant of P. antinous and not a distintct species until a theraphosid taxonomist can study them and determine if they are indeed a new species in the genus. It's an ole argument between the "lumpers" and "splitters". I go with the lumpers. Lastly, I think more Pamphobeteus breeders should experiment with raising the young up communally and see if other species in the genus are like these "chicken spiders". For now, I would list the spider under the following name:

Pamphobeteus sp. "Tambopata" (poss. variant of P. antinous) and to p** everybody off with common names useage, we can call it "Giant Black Sloth-eating Spider".

Todd

Craig Bellamy's response one post after illustrates the differences quite well:

Hi Todd,

Thanks for your comments. Well, here goes. In my humble opinion, it is definitely not a P.antinous variant and here are my reasons why

1) Nobody here has reared from nymph to adult and further bred a CS.
I have.

2) few here have even visited Tambopata and seen one.
I have.

3) We all know that it is bad practice to identify a T but by an image alone, no matter how experienced you are.

4) No one to my knowledge has seen a male CS.
I have and bred one too.

taken from Manu national park (not my image so can not confirm it is the CS male though looks similar to mind...again means little unless in the flesh)

5) The communal habits of P.antinous are non-existent compared to those of the CS. Try it yourself, oh and goodluck! There are many many pictures of CS spiderlings in the wild in large gatherings, yet I have never seen P.antinous pictures like this and there are a lot more P.antinous pictures.

6) The difference in adults side by side are astounding, I wish I had an adult P.antinous here to show you. The P.a is fairly hairy and slender as you say. Much darker in colour, being black/grey.

The CS is much chunkier like a crab, especially the femur of the fourth legs. In fact all femurs are chunky. The carapace is wider in proportion too. The CS is a lot less hairy which gives it a silky appearance and with lovely rusty coloured hairs on the rear of the abdomen and on the chelicerae as well as lightly all over and the under section of the cephalothorax. Images in the forest that have little light make the spider look black, but in fact the spider is a rusty/dark grey and lighter before a moult. See my pictures below.

7) Last but not least, The P.antinious spiderling shares absolutely no resemblance in colour, shape and character to that of a CS.

If everyone here had the privilege of looking after this wonderful species, you'd know, these are no ordinary T's. We have something very special here. I say, don't listen to anyone, go see for yourself. Martin and I are insistent that these are completely unique.

Incidentally, while nosing around on flickr after posting my photos I found this

http://www.flickr.com/map/?&user_id=...0&map_type=hyb

Click on 34, then scroll the thumbnails to 12 of 34.
Recognize the brown tarantula in the middle? a T.blondi? can't be? in Madre De Dios? worth querying...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sequella/424152855/

Regards
Craig

All pictures contained on this thread are copyright 2007 Craig Bellamy. Hopefully I'm not violating any rules by quoting them.

- Rob

 

[robd]

Almost forgot, Abraxas... would you say that the chicken spiders you currently have resemble the ones the Craig Bellamy had? I would've just edited my last post, but I don't want this question to get caught up in it.

 

[AbraxasComplex]

To be honest his photographs in that topic ended up having a more brown tinge to them. Only one of my juveniles has that colouration. I'm not sure if it is just the camera or the flash washing out specific colours or if his selection had a visibly dominant trait of brown while mine are mainly black.

As for babies I agree with him on this. My supplier offered me P.antinous babies. I asked for photos and if he kept them with the mother. He responded that he removed them once the mother began chasing them out and consuming some.

If you see from the following photos, P.antinous have red rumps when they are spiderlings, while the chicken spider remains a dull greyish/brown with no red rumps. I have various spiderlings of different sizes and none have red hairs. Only subadults and adults have the red. I even have a large juvenile that is a brown shade with no red.

Pamphobeteus antinous spiderling

Chicken Spider spiderlings

 

[joshuai]

could it be a Pamphobeteus crassifemur Bertani, Fukushima & Silva, 2008 here is a good read

http://www.mapress.com/zootaxa/2008/f/zt01826p058.pdf

 

[Falk]

Very interesting

 

[MaximusMeridus]

Yes indeed interesting, noticed someone was talking about me

The spiderlings/juveniles or P.antinuous do have red hairs on the abdomen, but you will notice it is all over the abdomen unlike the Chicken spider which has faint red hairs on the urticating area only.

Naturally from breed to breed you will have differing degrees of colouring, which is normal in not only T's but all animal species, so we have to be careful not to be black and white about this.

Incidentally this is entirely new area, but diet, temperature and other unknown factors have an effect on the length and colour of T's hair. I have tested this out with a T.blondi over many years and through diets and temperatures noticed fluctuating lengths and colours of T hairs. Has anyone else noticed this?

example. adult blondi. rusty red skeleton short hairs to dark brown with medium hairs to light brown with long hairs to dark brown with very long hairs. Duration between moults were different and diets were different.

Craig Bellamy