A. Purpurae Sling Death Questions

[Whispersfromcat]

Hi guys,

Forward: My sling was unsexed but I'll use "she" for less confusion.

After moving Saffron to her new enclosure (the one you guys gave me a thumbs up on), she made a tunnel web on the back and didn't move from that spot. Every couple of days I dripped a few drops of water from a syringe so she could drink, figuring she was comfortable in that spot. I offered food on three different occasions, waiting about 5 days apart and tonight was the last night when I realized she was gone.

I had dry substrate, just her tiny water dish, plenty of room to hide, and great ventilation. She was my first T after having lost a MM and this is hitting me really hard. I noticed the last few days she was in weird positions (like half-sitting on her web). Nothing like molting, more like she had lost the energy in her legs.

What can I do differently next time? What should I be looking out for? I thought I was doing everything right and I'm afraid I made a fatal mistake.

Thank you,
Cat

 

[BoyFromLA]

Every couple of days I dripped a few drops of water from a syringe so she could drink

It was not necessary, you had the water dish in the enclosure.

Unless, what you meant was to fill up the water dish.

 

[Whispersfromcat]

It was not necessary, you had the water dish in the enclosure

She never moved to the water dish once. On one of the days I gave her a drop on her web she drank it all. When I noticed her behavior I was afraid she was dehydrated. Should I just let it be in the future?

 

[ccTroi]

i think this species has very few fit specimens from the sac. i had several die few years ago with identical set ups as versicolors. the versicolors survived.
don’t see anything wrong in ur setup for avics. i have a water dish on the substrate but i also notice they are reluctant to go down. when they are, i squirt water on their webbing and they always drink right away

 

[Whispersfromcat]

i think this species has very few fit specimens from the sac. i had several die few years ago with identical set ups as versicolors. the versicolors survived.
don’t see anything wrong in ur setup for avics. i have a water dish on the substrate but i also notice they are reluctant to go down. when they are, i squirt water on their webbing and they always drink right away

Thank you for your reply. It makes me feel a little better.

When I was doing research before I bought her, like every other post was about a Purpurae sling passing away. I really love the Avic species but I might go with a versicolor next round. I had hoped this might have gone differently.

 

[RezonantVoid]

Just out if curiosity, were you using cocofibre as substrate? A recent development/announcement from one of Australia's leading experts of Aussie tarantulas and their husbandry showed that some cocofibre products may release insecticidal compounds from the bark as it ages, and many keepers I've asked about this say, even taking the potential poisoning out of the equation, that cocofibre doesnt often suit most inverts they try it with. It's not with every single brand, which explains why alot of keepers swear by it after using it for years, but just a possibility I thought I'd mention

 

[Whispersfromcat]

Just out if curiosity, were you using cocofibre as substrate

This is really interesting to know. I had her on exo-terra coconut fiber but my other Ts are on the terra arachnea substrate from the biodude (no bugs, I just really like the substrate). I'd wanted to swap hers out but when I started noticing her health take a turn, I didn't want to stress her out.

I will do some more research on this before I set up another T. Thanks for your info.

 

[Poonjab]

Sometimes things like this just happen. Sounds like you were doing everything right. No need to get discouraged

 

[viper69]

Just out if curiosity, were you using cocofibre as substrate? A recent development/announcement from one of Australia's leading experts of Aussie tarantulas and their husbandry showed that some cocofibre products may release insecticidal compounds from the bark as it ages, and many keepers I've asked about this say, even taking the potential poisoning out of the equation, that cocofibre doesnt often suit most inverts they try it with. It's not with every single brand, which explains why alot of keepers swear by it after using it for years, but just a possibility I thought I'd mention

Would you link us up? This is news to me.

 

[RezonantVoid]

Would you link us up? This is news to me.

Honestly I wouldn't be able to find the original post, it was a few months ago on a super popular group. However, if I do find it, I will pop a share link up for you immediately.

I actually had the idea it could do this long before the announcement was made. There is one genus here (Selenotypus) well known to often starve itself to death when kept upon it. A few snail keepers from the US I spoke to on a discord server also said if they put snails on cocofibre, they eat less than half what they usually do and constantly try to climb the sides of the container. And interestingly enough on that same server, a small number of Avic keepers said their slings were behaving funny after being rehoused onto it from peat moss. So, no official papers on it yet, just alot of quite reputable sources vouching against it. If I find the original announcement made by Steve Nunn, I'll PM it to you

 

[Ian14]

Honestly I wouldn't be able to find the original post, it was a few months ago on a super popular group. However, if I do find it, I will pop a share link up for you immediately.

I actually had the idea it could do this long before the announcement was made. There is one genus here (Selenotypus) well known to often starve itself to death when kept upon it. A few snail keepers from the US I spoke to on a discord server also said if they put snails on cocofibre, they eat less than half what they usually do and constantly try to climb the sides of the container. And interestingly enough on that same server, a small number of Avic keepers said their slings were behaving funny after being rehoused onto it from peat moss. So, no official papers on it yet, just alot of quite reputable sources vouching against it. If I find the original announcement made by Steve Nunn, I'll PM it to you

That's very interesting, and equally concerning given that cocofibre seems to be the standard substrate advised for all inverts.
I personally haven't seen anything untoward, and I use cocofibre for all of mine, that said I've only been keeping for a little under 18 months so I don't have anything to compare to.
I would also be very interested to read the article/paper.

 

[RezonantVoid]

That's very interesting, and equally concerning given that cocofibre seems to be the standard substrate advised for all inverts.
I personally haven't seen anything untoward, and I use cocofibre for all of mine, that said I've only been keeping for a little under 18 months so I don't have anything to compare to.
I would also be very interested to read the article/paper.

No article/paper yet, but I believe 2 tarantula specialists are working on one for it pretty much as I type including Steven Nunn (the only person who can look at any of our brown T's and tell you the genus, species, sex and locality almost immediately)

 

[Ian14]

No article/paper yet, but I believe 2 tarantula specialists are working on one for it pretty much as I type including Steven Nunn (the only person who can look at any of our brown T's and tell you the genus, species, sex and locality almost immediately)

That will make very interesting reading I suspect.
Thanks for bringing this up.

 

[Kibosh]

I just lost mine this week as well. Didn't even own it for a week. Had it in a very stuffy vial at first, but moved it into one with a lot more ventilation on the advice of these boards.

Guess it was too little, too late as the next day it died. Weird thing is it just died sitting on it's cork bark in the exact same position it was when it was alive. No death curl or anything. Only way I knew it was dead was when I went to give it a drop of water it didn't react at all.

Very costly lesson to learn on a delicate species.

 

[Craig73]

Sorry for your loss. Sounds like you were doing things by the book and sometimes slings just don’t make it for whatever reason. Don’t let it discourage you, many of us have been there before and it can be devastating.

If you didn’t already, encourage hand washing before any type of interaction with feeders and enclosures to minimize any chemical exposure (i.e. cleaning agents, pesticides if you garden and the like, pet flea medications, etc).

 

[Whispersfromcat]

I just lost mine this week as well. Didn't even own it for a week. Had it in a very stuffy vial at first, but moved it into one with a lot more ventilation on the advice of these boards.

I'm so sorry for your loss as well. I had the same experience in terms of how she passed. She didn't death curl, just stayed in her web. For a bit I thought she may be in pre molt but the symptoms were just too different. I feel the "costly mistake" part to my bones right now. At over $100 for the sling, to watch it die in a month was difficult on all accounts.

Sorry for your loss. Sounds like you were doing things by the book and sometimes slings just don’t make it for whatever reason. Don’t let it discourage you, many of us have been there before and it can be devastating.

Thank you for the reply and for the encouragement. I'm also raising a p. Metallica, OBT, Brachy, and lapsi slings right now at the same time. The Brachy has been MIA for over a month but the others are doing fantastic. So, I'm trying not to beat myself up over it.

I make sure to wash my hands and my tweezers any time I go for freedings/rehousings/even water refills. Thank you for the advice

 

[viper69]

Honestly I wouldn't be able to find the original post, it was a few months ago on a super popular group. However, if I do find it, I will pop a share link up for you immediately.

I actually had the idea it could do this long before the announcement was made. There is one genus here (Selenotypus) well known to often starve itself to death when kept upon it. A few snail keepers from the US I spoke to on a discord server also said if they put snails on cocofibre, they eat less than half what they usually do and constantly try to climb the sides of the container. And interestingly enough on that same server, a small number of Avic keepers said their slings were behaving funny after being rehoused onto it from peat moss. So, no official papers on it yet, just alot of quite reputable sources vouching against it. If I find the original announcement made by Steve Nunn, I'll PM it to you

I had a feeling you were going to tell me this. UGH! This is really interesting if it's true, and concerning at the same time if true.We'd need some hard evidence on this one, sure has me curious!

No article/paper yet, but I believe 2 tarantula specialists are working on one for it pretty much as I type including Steven Nunn (the only person who can look at any of our brown T's and tell you the genus, species, sex and locality almost immediately)

Steve is great. I don't know him personally, but we've chatted every once in a while. He is knowledgeable without a doubt.

 

[Ian14]

So, I have some rehoused due. If coir is possible toxic to inverts, what should I be looking at?
I'm guessing a homemade mix of peat and sand?

 

[RezonantVoid]

So, I have some rehoused due. If coir is possible toxic to inverts, what should I be looking at?
I'm guessing a homemade mix of peat and sand?

Yep, that's what I've been using since starting and what most people down under are switching to. I prefer red desert sand since it blends in with the peat moss and doesn't leave white grains of it against the glass

 

[cold blood]

What can I do differently next time?

Not buy a purpurea. They are exceptionally slow growers, this keeps them in the fragile stage longer.....purpurea is easily the most difficult avic species to raise and there really isnt a close second, its the one Avic newer keepers should really avoid. JME

What should I be looking out for?

Any other species of avic.

If coir is possible toxic to inverts, what should I be looking at?

Its not toxic to tarantulas....we can say this without a doubt as hundreds of thousands of tarantulas have lived their lives on coco fiber without ANY issue.

Even if it is an insecticide...ts are not actually insects. But judging on the fact that things like phorid flies, roaches and burrowed away super and mealworms dont EVER seem to be effected, I can say I am extremely doubtful of any such claim.....its literally been the hobby staple substrate for over 40 years.....trust me, we would have noticed if it were toxic.....JMO.

A great option if you want to avoid it would be topsoil.