Thoughts on this video? (Tarantula Training)

[TheraMygale]

Whenever I read “eh”, I hear it like “meh” minus the “m”…like the sound a teenager makes when you ask them if they like something, but “ey” is like “hey” and “vey”! To me at least. ;-)

Eh is like the Alphabet A.

so ask a question and add an A at the end when youre trying to prove something.

sounds so much better, A?

 

[IntermittentSygnal]

Eh is like the Alphabet A.

so ask a question and add an A at the end when youre trying to prove something.

sounds so much better, A?

Sounds like a very Canadian thing to say.

 

[Gevo]

Sounds like a very Canadian thing to say.

Yeah, no, for sure, Bud!

 

[IntermittentSygnal]

Yeah, no, for sure, Bud!

I’m more of a yeah, no, totally person myself, but then again I am an import and not a native
The first time I read about Californians saying “yeah, no” and “no, yeah”, I thought, I don’t say that! Me later that same day: “Yeah, no, I totally get what you’re saying.”

 

[kingshockey]

its the earthquakes we live with

 

[Spifdar]

You know what, i didnt see the video. Maybe there was no link or it didnt work for me.

i just read it all and i saw “negative”. That was it for me.

didnt read the posts after.

i wouldnt watch anything that had negative reinforcement.

Just to reassure that the spiders aren't being abused, and as a matter of interest (because I stumbled upon these videos myself), negative does not mean bad in terms of animal psychology. Negative means "a lack of" in this context! So (unless my education's slipped a bit since college):

Positive Reward: Application of something the animal enjoys (ex. food, praise)
Negative Reward: Removal of something that annoys (etc.) the animal (ex. REMOVAL of unwanted touch, heat, electric shock)
Positive Punishment: (THIS is the "bad" one) - Application of something that annoys (etc.) the animal (ex. ADDITION of unwanted touch, heat, electric shock)
Negative Punishment: Witholding of a reward (ex. NO food/praise)

The long story short is that with a negative reward in these videos, the trainer stops touching the animal; with negative punishment they simply do not offer a reward. They're not in any way harming or abusing the animals. VERY TL;DR: tarantula does the right behavior -> tarantula gets food reward.

My own take on these videos as a whole is that their knowledge of the science (both general animal behavior/training & spider intelligence/biology in particular) is very good, their grasp on terminology is excellent and they're fluently bilingual (German), so I assume well-educated. But some of the conclusions being drawn are questionable in this one-on-one setting, and would need a lot of truly scientific experiments to prove. It doesn't seem to bother the spiders, though, and some of the vids--for example, explaining how tarantulas can or cannot bite--are interesting, at least.

The concept of target training a T is fascinating on its own, as in this video!

 

[Arachnophobphile]

I came across this video in my YouTube recommended today that I thought was very interesting. It depicts a keeper trying to teach his tarantula, Elvis, to mimic desired behavior via "negative punishment." The keeper withholds food from the T during feeding until it displays the desired behaviors. What do we think of this as a concept? As intelligent as T's are, and their ability to understand and replicate patterns; do you think that this is worthwhile? I for one still think this is unnecessary, as domestication of tarantulas is virtually impossible at their current biological state, as well as difficult as they act mainly on instinct.

What are you guys' thoughts on this? I am very open to interpretation along with learning what may be going on behind the scenes.

Video here.

Ahhh the ole "Stupidtube"

This is what happens when you have a free open source system where anyone can upload videos. While there are a lot of good things to watch like movies there is an equal amount of stupid people uploading their videos of that person being moronic. That's putting it mildly to the words I really want to use.

That video you watched is mild compared to the things I've seen others do like free handling a wild caught H. maculata.

 

[Tbone192]

Eh is like the Alphabet A.

so ask a question and add an A at the end when youre trying to prove something.

sounds so much better, A?

This is the Canadian way, eh bud.

Just got my moose groomed this morning but when I got back there was a polar bear slumbering on my snowmobile, I was just aboot flabbergasted, so I just rode my moose home to the igloo. Really get to take in all the colours and sights at that speed, eh.

 

[Matt Man]

its the earthquakes we live with

Like Hawaii, living in paradise always has a dark side

 

[AphonopelmaTX]

Just to reassure that the spiders aren't being abused, and as a matter of interest (because I stumbled upon these videos myself), negative does not mean bad in terms of animal psychology. Negative means "a lack of" in this context! So (unless my education's slipped a bit since college):

Positive Reward: Application of something the animal enjoys (ex. food, praise)
Negative Reward: Removal of something that annoys (etc.) the animal (ex. REMOVAL of unwanted touch, heat, electric shock)
Positive Punishment: (THIS is the "bad" one) - Application of something that annoys (etc.) the animal (ex. ADDITION of unwanted touch, heat, electric shock)
Negative Punishment: Witholding of a reward (ex. NO food/praise)

The long story short is that with a negative reward in these videos, the trainer stops touching the animal; with negative punishment they simply do not offer a reward. They're not in any way harming or abusing the animals. VERY TL;DR: tarantula does the right behavior -> tarantula gets food reward.

My own take on these videos as a whole is that their knowledge of the science (both general animal behavior/training & spider intelligence/biology in particular) is very good, their grasp on terminology is excellent and they're fluently bilingual (German), so I assume well-educated. But some of the conclusions being drawn are questionable in this one-on-one setting, and would need a lot of truly scientific experiments to prove. It doesn't seem to bother the spiders, though, and some of the vids--for example, explaining how tarantulas can or cannot bite--are interesting, at least.

The concept of target training a T is fascinating on its own, as in this video!

Your education has not slipped at all. I completed a college level general psychology course last year and negative and positive reinforcement was taught exactly as you describe it. Blew my mind, because like everyone else I thought positive reinforcement meant to reward and negative reinforcement meant to punish which was wrong.

 

[TheraMygale]

Just to reassure that the spiders aren't being abused, and as a matter of interest (because I stumbled upon these videos myself), negative does not mean bad in terms of animal psychology. Negative means "a lack of" in this context! So (unless my education's slipped a bit since college):

Positive Reward: Application of something the animal enjoys (ex. food, praise)
Negative Reward: Removal of something that annoys (etc.) the animal (ex. REMOVAL of unwanted touch, heat, electric shock)
Positive Punishment: (THIS is the "bad" one) - Application of something that annoys (etc.) the animal (ex. ADDITION of unwanted touch, heat, electric shock)
Negative Punishment: Witholding of a reward (ex. NO food/praise)

The long story short is that with a negative reward in these videos, the trainer stops touching the animal; with negative punishment they simply do not offer a reward. They're not in any way harming or abusing the animals. VERY TL;DR: tarantula does the right behavior -> tarantula gets food reward.

My own take on these videos as a whole is that their knowledge of the science (both general animal behavior/training & spider intelligence/biology in particular) is very good, their grasp on terminology is excellent and they're fluently bilingual (German), so I assume well-educated. But some of the conclusions being drawn are questionable in this one-on-one setting, and would need a lot of truly scientific experiments to prove. It doesn't seem to bother the spiders, though, and some of the vids--for example, explaining how tarantulas can or cannot bite--are interesting, at least.

The concept of target training a T is fascinating on its own, as in this video!

One thing is for sure, i would love the possibility to actualy teach a tarantula thing or t. Like the exchanges we have with cats and dogs.

i know its not possible. But i sure would not mind if it ever turned out they can learn more then we think they can.

 

[LucN]

One thing is for sure, i would love the possibility to actualy teach a tarantula thing or t. Like the exchanges we have with cats and dogs.

i know its not possible. But i sure would not mind if it ever turned out they can learn more then we think they can.

At the very least, the command "Stay" seems to work... most of the time

 

[Spifdar]

I do find the entire subject interesting, because our knowledge of invertebrate intelligence is so, so lacking. For example, if I remember right, cephalopod brains are--just like tarantulas' brains--clusters of ganglia that are widely distributed throughout the body. As with cephalopods, a lot of those 'mini brains' are in the arms/legs. Yet they're some of the smartest creatures on Earth! Ants, with TEENSY tiny brains and a very limited number of neurons, pass the mirror test (which on its own has some debate, but to me the experiment looked well done). While I'm not sure on this person's conclusion that tarantula legs actually have individual learning, I DO think they've successfully taught them to move to a target, which in and of itself could be so, so useful for husbandry reasons. Target training is really common among even the, uh, less intelligent reptiles (lookin' at you, snakes) to get them to food, out of harm's way or to move them for a feeding.

 

[The Spider House]

How righteous would it be if you could train them to drum along to guitar riffs?

I had a MM avic juriensis drum to "in the air tonight" from Phil Collins.

User - The Spider House's Tarantula Pictures

Caribena versicolor slings (L1) all removed and separated from incubator (146 in total with only 1 not making it to L1) Also see ad if you want to grab some. (UK only!) https://arachnoboards.com/classifieds/caribena-versicolor-spiderlings-for-sale.2111/

arachnoboards.com

 

[Tentacle Toast]

I had a MM avic juriensis drum to "in the air tonight" from Phil Collins.

User - The Spider House's Tarantula Pictures

Caribena versicolor slings (L1) all removed and separated from incubator (146 in total with only 1 not making it to L1) Also see ad if you want to grab some. (UK only!) https://arachnoboards.com/classifieds/caribena-versicolor-spiderlings-for-sale.2111/

arachnoboards.com

HA! They're a romantic lot, those juriensis fellas...still trying to figure out how mine got the rose petals

 

[The Spider House]

HA! They're a romantic lot, those juriensis fellas...still trying to figure out how mine got the rose petals

And the box of Chocs!