Substrate/barrier help

[dev0n]

I'm trying to redo my T's enclosures. I have a GBB and N. Chromatus. I plan to do a 70:30 topsoil: orchid moss mixture with a barrier separating from drainage (hydroballs or other).

My first question is does this mixture sounds good for both T's and second question is what's a cheap barrier that's safe for them? I need to be able to cut fit.

 

[viper69]

Why are you making this more complicated?

You don’t need hydro balls

 

[Ultum4Spiderz]

Why are you making this more complicated?

You don’t need hydro balls

Must be some new fad I’ve never used a drainage barrier except for plants and I don’t even do that anymore. Just like bioactive enclosures became popular out of nowhere??

 

[kingshockey]

a barrier for what purpose?

 

[Arachnophobphile]

I'm trying to redo my T's enclosures. I have a GBB and N. Chromatus. I plan to do a 70:30 topsoil: orchid moss mixture with a barrier separating from drainage (hydroballs or other).

My first question is does this mixture sounds good for both T's and second question is what's a cheap barrier that's safe for them? I need to be able to cut fit.

Hydro balls or the clay balls are not needed for tarantulas. I have an idea where you might of got that but that is not something that needs to be done. All that will do is leave water at the bottom of the enclosure instead of being absorbed by the substrate which leads to fungus for one and stagnation.

Terrestrial and fossorial T's do burrow downwards. They will not like the hydro balls when they encounter them at the bottom.

 

[KenD]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but even if drainage layers weren't unnecessary (or ill-advised) for Ts, the GBB would be one of the least likely candidates to require one.

 

[Smotzer]

Both the tarantulas aren’t ever going to need that much moisture to use a drainage layer

 

[mack1855]

Someone’s watching too many YT videos.
IMO, this is as stated, just a fad currently floating through the hobby.

 

[viper69]

Someone’s watching to many YT videos.
IMO,this is,as stated,just a fad currently floating through the hobby.

agreed, over the past few years there's been an increase in this "need", and there is no need for them to have them.

 

[dev0n]

I love how no one actually answered my question. Whether it's a fad or not nor my own reasons matter. I was just asking if my substrate mixture was suitable and what kind of barrier would be safe?

 

[kingshockey]

use all top soil orchid mix type dirt just wouldnt hold up good or be easy for a t to dig imo. as for the hydro balls why would you add somthing that prevents a t from digging to the bottom if it chose to?

 

[mack1855]

I love how no one actually answered my question. Whether it's a fad or not nor my own reasons matter. I was just asking if my substrate mixture was suitable and what kind of barrier would be safe?

Because most of us keepers don’t do this.
So we can’t advise you,it’s that simple.We don’t use barriers or a clay ball layer on the bottom of the enclosure.
Just to add,the substrate sounds fine.As long as you know it’s T safe.

 

[Gevo]

I love how no one actually answered my question. Whether it's a fad or not nor my own reasons matter. I was just asking if my substrate mixture was suitable and what kind of barrier would be safe?

I don’t know much about N. chromatus and its moisture needs, but orchid moss (which is usually just sphagnum moss) retains a lot of moisture, which probably isn’t good for your GBB in large amounts in a setup that sounds like it’s going to get a lot of water in it, as they prefer more arid conditions. I keep tons of tropical plants, and I use sphagnum moss very sparingly because when mixed with soil, it can make the soil swampy really fast and give your plants root rot. Even water-loving plants still like good drainage, so orchid moss/sphagnum moss is usually used either on top of the soil to help keep moisture in over well-draining soil, or it’s used with epiphytes like orchids to keep some moisture around their roots, but with lots and lots of ventilation as they’re hung out in the open and not potted in anything. I use small amounts of sphagnum moss in my B. hamorii and G. pulchra enclosures, but it’s a small amount, and mostly for decor on the surface so it’s not holding moisture throughout the substrate.

There are lots of videos about setting up bioactive enclosures, and I think there’s a specific aquarium mesh you can buy that’s like a mesh fabric with no sharp edges that you can cut to size.

 

[dev0n]

use all top soil orchid mix type dirt just wouldnt hold up good or be easy for a t to dig imo. as for the hydro balls why would you add somthing that prevents a t from digging to the bottom if it chose to?

Less than an inch depth out of a half-foot of substrate is negligible... thanks for the comment about the top soil, however, I thought that mixing moss actually provided a better medium for the dirt to hold. I break it up, it's not long strands when I mix it...

Because most of us keepers don’t do this.
So we can’t advise you,it’s that simple.We don’t use barriers or a clay ball layer on the bottom of the enclosure.
Just to add,the substrate sounds fine.As long as you know it’s T safe.

Okay, then don't give me irrelevant info. It's that simple. And by 'we,' you mean the tarantula community as a whole? You literally just said it's a fad floating around the hobby.

I don’t know much about N. chromatus and its moisture needs, but orchid moss (which is usually just sphagnum moss) retains a lot of moisture, which probably isn’t good for your GBB in large amounts in a setup that sounds like it’s going to get a lot of water in it, as they prefer more arid conditions. I keep tons of tropical plants, and I use sphagnum moss very sparingly because when mixed with soil, it can make the soil swampy really fast and give your plants root rot. Even water-loving plants still like good drainage, so orchid moss/sphagnum moss is usually used either on top of the soil to help keep moisture in over well-draining soil, or it’s used with epiphytes like orchids to keep some moisture around their roots, but with lots and lots of ventilation as they’re hung out in the open and not potted in anything. I use small amounts of sphagnum moss in my B. hamorii and G. pulchra enclosures, but it’s a small amount, and mostly for decor on the surface so it’s not holding moisture throughout the substrate.

There are lots of videos about setting up bioactive enclosures, and I think there’s a specific aquarium mesh you can buy that’s like a mesh fabric with no sharp edges that you can cut to size.

Thank you, this is very useful.

 

[Dorifto]

I'm trying to redo my T's enclosures. I have a GBB and N. Chromatus. I plan to do a 70:30 topsoil: orchid moss mixture with a barrier separating from drainage (hydroballs or other).

My first question is does this mixture sounds good for both T's and second question is what's a cheap barrier that's safe for them? I need to be able to cut fit.

Just use plain topsoil, peat and clay based one.

If for any reason you want to drain any possible excess of moisture, simply mix that topsoil with a bit of sand and use it like a first layer, then add more topsoil on top, nothing else. Using orchid moss or clay balls to drain or retain moisture, it only will cause you headaches. One because it weakens the substrate, making it more prone to collapses and two, the drained moisture gets trapped beneath, increasing chances of having mold or other pest outbreaks. Their use is intended for other type of setups and inhabitants, not for Ts.

Using the mentioned mix, never had any issues in my vivs, using clay balls.... No comment.

 

[cold blood]

I was just asking if my substrate mixture was suitable

Substrate is your choice, there are a myriad of things you can use, and you can mix any of them in any manner you want....sub is a keepers choice option, there really is no right or wrong.

what kind of barrier would be safe?

none...the idea of a drainage system is absurd, a barrier even more so. Youre greatly over-thinking the keeping of ts.

 

[dev0n]

Just use plain topsoil, peat and clay based one.

If for any reason you want to drain any possible excess of moisture, simply mix that topsoil with a bit of sand and use it like a first layer, then add more topsoil on top, nothing else. Using orchid moss or clay balls to drain or retain moisture, it only will cause you headaches. One because it weakens the substrate, making it more prone to collapses and two, the drained moisture gets trapped beneath, increasing chances of having mold or other pest outbreaks. Their use is intended for other type of setups and inhabitants, not for Ts.

Using the mentioned mix, never had any issues in my vivs, using clay balls.... No comment.

I did toy with the idea of sand so thank you for your feedback on that I think I will look into that more.

Substrate is your choice, there are a myriad of things you can use, and you can mix any of them in any manner you want....sub is a keepers choice option, there really is no right or wrong.

none...the idea of a drainage system is absurd, a barrier even more so. Youre greatly over-thinking the keeping of ts.

Thank you for your response, I value this boards' experience which is exactly why I've been bouncing any ideas here first to get other people's ideas. It seems like there is either lack of good information or an abundance of misinformation. Either way if something works well why fix it?

The connection I have made is that I've read what other keepers have 'felt' like which is that the more natural a setup that mimics T's own natural environments the "more docile" they tend to be which said keepers claim means their T's are more "happy and thriving."

The reason I wanted to make a bioactive was mainly to have fun with being more involved with my T's as building the setups has been a hobby myself but also the bioactives simply look way better to me. Now I'm no gardener or anything like that but my impression was the drainage is meant to prevent stagnant water creating a lot of mold but there are a lot of good fungi that do not harm T's likewise little mold isn't even that great deal of a concern so long there is plenty of ventilation and it's not out of control.

So I never truly expected to be doing this with the intent on making my T's happier so to speak although if claims were in anyway true it certainly wouldn't kill my T's plus I enjoy the extra chore, it keeps me busy. I just didn't appreciate the types of responses; I don't care about the headache.

 

[Arachnophobphile]

The connection I have made is that I've read what other keepers have 'felt' like which is that the more natural a setup that mimics T's own natural environments the "more docile" they tend to be which said keepers claim means their T's are more "happy and thriving."

You've made the wrong connection. We're not talking dogs and cats here.

Setting up a T's enclosure as close to their natural habitat in no ways makes a tarantula more docile or happy. It keeps them healthy for starters.

What helps a T to be less defensive is secure hiding spots AND setting the enclosure up correctly correlating to what type of T it is fossorial, terrestrial or arboreal.

It's not rocket science T's are the easiest animal to care for.

 

[Ultum4Spiderz]

The reason I wanted to make a bioactive was mainly to have fun with being more involved with my T's as building the setups has been a hobby myself but also the bioactives simply look way better to me. Now I'm no gardener or anything like that but my impression was the drainage is meant to prevent stagnant water creating a lot of mold but there are a lot of good fungi that do not harm T's likewise little mold isn't even that great deal of a concern so long there is plenty of ventilation and it's not out of control.

So I never truly expected to be doing this with the intent on making my T's happier so to speak although if claims were in anyway true it certainly wouldn't kill my T's plus I enjoy the extra chore, it keeps me busy. I just didn't appreciate the types of responses; I don't care about the headache.

plants are harder to care for I think then the Ts . I added one to a cage and it has not grown at all in 2 months . I may have to remove it .
plants don’t make them happy. They’re not frogs .

 

[dev0n]

You've made the wrong connection. We're not talking dogs and cats here.

Setting up a T's enclosure as close to their natural habitat in no ways makes a tarantula more docile or happy. It keeps them healthy for starters.

What helps a T to be less defensive is secure hiding spots AND setting the enclosure up correctly correlating to what type of T it is fossorial, terrestrial or arboreal.

It's not rocket science T's are the easiest animal to care for.

Well my connection was more or less based off a direct quote from collegiate researchers studying tarantula behavior. And, from an intuitive standpoint, your latter statement seems more important for sure

plants are harder to care for I think then the Ts . I added one to a cage and it has not grown at all in 2 months . I may have to remove it .
plants don’t make them happy. They’re not frogs .

I agree, however, I personally enjoy the upkeep. I've even been toying with planting a Brazilian Rain Tree to play with my bonsai hobby as well.

Before anyone says anything about roots and other possible complications don't mention it... I have a plan to experiment with. Trial and error here; I have a vision and I wanna see it through.