Selling tarantulas in a safe way

[Vinny2915]

I don't really know how to start this so to save time I'll give point form info to my question.

Question:
When selling tarantulas does it make sense to have a buyer sign a waiver before buying tarantulas from you?
Reason:
Some tarantulas have reasonably strong venom and although noone has died it does not mean that noone will. New world species also have urticating hairs that can damaged eyes and if breathed in cause issues (those of which I'm unqualified/ignorant to). I am under the impression that someone could sue sue you for damages in these cases if they really wanted to and a waiver would allow a 'legal pass' so to speak.
Further question(s):
1. Will it need to be notarized to be recognized by law
2. If selling where these types of animals are prohibited should I also make them sign to say they do not live in this region and are just purchasing here (because word of mouth doesn't hold up in court)
3. I want to eventually breed scorpions (I love trading for species and I am really getting into scorpions, specifically buthidae so I am looking to trade scorplings/ sell and use the money for other species, before people pop in, this has already been discussed I don't want to breed them for cash I want to to trade and get more species without destroying my bank account). So with this said, being "hots" that I am into is this a good idea.
4. How would this work for shipping? I was having them fax a copy of their signed waiver to me.

NOTE* This is just an idea for me that I believed would be good and save myself from legal issues. If it is flat out brainless and moronic please say so I don't end up making waivers down the road (when some of my specimens are grown up) just to have waisted my time, my effort, the buyers patience, and paper (trees die for this and so I don't take it lightly).

 

[cold blood]

When selling tarantulas does it make sense to have a buyer sign a waiver before buying tarantulas from you?

I have never heard of anyone ever having to or asking to sign anything with regards to sales.....Just don't sell to minors without their parent present and consenting.

If selling where these types of animals are prohibited should I also make them sign to say they do not live in this region and are just purchasing here (because word of mouth doesn't hold up in court)

If its not legal to sell them where you are, you can't sell them, nothing you have people sign can over-ride the laws. Having them sign something to make it look legal is just fraud and wouldn't hold up against law enforcement. But if its legal where you are selling them, it shouldn't be an issue for you.

 

[Vinny2915]

Alright, thanks. *Idea thrown in the trash where it clearly belongs*.

 

[MikeyD]

If you want to caution people then use a disclaimer. Simply write up a blurb about known risks and post it on a website if you have one or include in email correspondence.
All you have to do is imform people of the risks. This is why hot beverages are labeled as such but no one has to make you sign a waver before you enjoy your coffee.

 

[Nightstalker47]

They are currently banned in Toronto. You cant sell them legally there, one way or another...anything venomous is strictly prohibited, that includes inverts.

Just don't get caught man, you'll be doing us all a huge disservice. Starting threads like this on the boards makes you ripe for the taking. Black market plus live (venomous)animals is what gets things put on the radar for everyone, they may start cracking down hard on individuals like yourself if people don't take the laws seriously.

Whoever you sell too should know exactly what they are getting themselves into. Which isn't good for business or reputation. My honest advice, move if your serious and truly want to get into the tarantula breeding business.

 

[EulersK]

The main point is something already brought up - don't sell to minors. Period.

 

[Nightstalker47]

The main point is something already brought up - don't sell to minors. Period.

Actually, its selling to Toronto residents, period.

 

[EulersK]

Actually, its selling to Toronto residents, period.

I'm not up to par on the Canadian legal system. I'm more of an expert on bird law.

But seriously, as cold blood brought up, having someone sign something doesn't get rid of local regulations. If anything, it shows the courts that you knew it was illegal and did it anyway.

 

[Nightstalker47]

But seriously, as cold blood brought up, having someone sign something doesn't get rid of local regulations. If anything, it shows the courts that you knew it was illegal and did it anyway.

Spot on, selling to minors would just be the icing on the cake, and give them incentive to ban far and wide...couldn't make the prosecutors life any easier.

 

[Tim Benzedrine]

Actually, its selling to Toronto residents, period.

Which brings up a question. as a seller, is one expected to know the laws for all places? Using Toronto as an example, Tarantulas are illegal there. But they are not illegal throughout the province of Ontario, are they? I cannot imagine a seller being able to know the law for all municipalities within every state, province, etc...
Maybe that is what is expected, though.

 

[Greasylake]

Wait is it illegal to sell to people under 18? I've never heard that before.

 

[Chris LXXIX]

Unfortunately, Vinny my man, you live in Canada and not in your ancestral land called Italia (Italy)

When we were brats, an helluva of time ago (most likely 10/11 years) newspaper vendors (ain't sure if this is the correct English term, but anyway) sold to us comic porn and porn magazines (explicit, uh) like nothing.

The same for T's, the non written average 'rule' was 14, at least, but oh well I wasn't 14

Still, no OW's even if I had the money, because the breeder wasn't an idiot therefore OW spiders + unexperienced 12/13 years keepers + bites/escapes = bad news, no matter the money.

 

[cold blood]

Which brings up a question. as a seller, is one expected to know the laws for all places?

No, just their own. If my area has a ban on pitbulls, someone across the state isn't responsible for my purchase of one, that would be on the buyer to know and follow their laws.

Wait is it illegal to sell to people under 18? I've never heard that before

No, its just not a good idea with venomous animals.

 

[Vinny2915]

Don't worry guys I wouldn't be out here selling a P.ornata or something to a minor unless they were a really mature 16 or 17 (mind you these are few and far between). I wouldn't except for the fact that I got into this hobby when I myself was but a youngling and it sprouted a huge interest so I wouldn't want to stop someone from that. But no anyone. For the most part I ask questions and what not to them to make sure they know what they are doing (regardless of age), unless I see them on Facebook or the boards with actually good information (again few and far between when it comes to Canada because our "community" is a lot smaller than in the us". And yeah I get that prohibited situation yet no one selling tarantulas here has run into issues (been doing it for years some of them). I just think and see that police have better things to do in Toronto then kick down your door because you have some tarantulas. With that said if you had venomous snakes and we're selling them then you may get cops on you.

 

[spookyvibes]

Don't worry guys I wouldn't be out here selling a P.ornata or something to a minor unless they were a really mature 16 or 17 (mind you these are few and far between).

I really would avoid selling to minors in general, no matter how mature they seem.

 

[PanzoN88]

While I have no direct comment to the topic, just giving my opinion on how I would approach sales.

A. No sales to minors (as already stated above)

B. If it's illegal in your area, best to give up on breeding and selling.

C. I would only sell to knowledgeable members who are respected here on the forums.

 

[Vinny2915]

Fair enough in my area I can give up any idea of breeding or selling but I would never give up the hobby, I am not following a law stating what I can have in my own home (within reason). But I will follow it in regards to selling and breeding that is understandable.
I'm just wondering though is it that common that minors even think to buy these types of animals? I always thought minors as in young people would be begging there parents for a dog or something. Haha have your kid come home "mommy, mommy I want an A.mauritanicus can you get it for me pleeaaseee?" Even thinking of some kid doing that sends fear into me because I'm sure some parents out here would buy it not even thinking to research it.

 

[Chris LXXIX]

I'm just wondering though is it that common that minors even think to buy these types of animals? I always thought minors as in young people would be begging there parents for a dog or something. Haha have your kid come home "mommy, mommy I want an A.mauritanicus can you get it for me pleeaaseee?"

What? Only a fool would say something like that to his/her parents even if I have to point out that, waaay back then, when the Internet didn't existed, chances of success were higher because:

• Parent/s: "No! I have already told you that a dog is a No!"
• Son: "But dad, I only want a little A.mauritanicus. I mean, A.mauritanicus, and please note that said name is written in scientific Italic "
• Parent/s (in a no Internet era): "Ah... isn't a dog or a destroying furnitures cat, then?"

*Parent/s talking each other*:

"Our son is of best, he doesn't bother us asking for a cumbersome dog or a scratchy cat like our neighbour brats, he only wants something called A.mauritanicus, has to be an animal needed for his science course lesson, for sure , are you proud, wife? Let's give him the money for such an harmless, innocent animal"

 

[Vinny2915]

@Chris LXXIX your comments literally give me life.

 

[Vinny2915]

@Ultum4Spiderz I agree wholeheartedly. I do want to leave Toronto not just for that but the cost of living is ridiculous, it is congested, people always getting shot up by opps on non gang streets. It is getting too much for me but all the best universities are in the GTA. I heard University of British Columbia is amazing too but i also heard it is just as expensive out there as well.