Romanian field trips(very long post)

H. laoticus

Arachnoprince
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Not necessary. Lived there for over four years and the evidence was plentiful. Also, most just means 51% or more so this is rather vague but disturbing nonetheless.
You can say most of the people you've Met are like that, but don't say most of Asia is. There's about 4 billion people in Asia I believe, so you'd have to have met close to 2 billion to even generalize to Most. I believe it is necessary. It's like saying most Blacks are criminals or most Latinos are lazy. It's not true.
 

MaartenSFS

Arachnobaron
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You can say most of the people you've Met are like that, but don't say most of Asia is. There's about 4 billion people in Asia I believe, so you'd have to have met close to 2 billion to even generalize to Most. I believe it is necessary. It's like saying most Blacks are criminals or most Latinos are lazy. It's not true.
Have you been to Asia?? It's not a stereotype, it's a part of their culture. I'll most likely be moving back next year so it's not racism at all, just an unfortunate fact that I've pointed out. Does this mean every last one of them? No, but the percentage is high enough that I feel comfortable to use the word most. And it's not just the developing countries. The biggest markets for bushmeat are South Korea and Taiwan, both quite rich, and Japan and East China aren't far behind.
 

H. laoticus

Arachnoprince
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Have you been to Asia?? It's not a stereotype, it's a part of their culture. I'll most likely be moving back next year so it's not racism at all, just an unfortunate fact that I've pointed out. Does this mean every last one of them? No, but the percentage is high enough that I feel comfortable to use the word most. And it's not just the developing countries. The biggest markets for bushmeat are South Korea and Taiwan, both quite rich, and Japan and East China aren't far behind.
So you're telling me that based on the little percentage of people you've met you're going to say that the other 2 billion are just the same in thought processes? I didn't say it was racist or stereotypical, I am staying it is unwise at best to generalize to over 2 billion people. How is the percentage high enough to generalize to 2 billion? What is the percentage of people you've met compared to the total population in Asia? To automatically assume that it's a "fact" is absurd.
Do you realize that your sample of people is extremely low? You're also limited to location.
Your experiences have led your opinions to be clearly biased.

So from what I can see, you're basically saying that it is cultural for most Asians to 1) have no respect for nature and 2) have no respect for each other. It's cultural for them to disrespect one another? To destroy nature?
Additionally, the agendas of the big markets does not equal that of the people.
And yes, I've been to Asia. In order to use the word most, you have to know at least 2 billion people and that is something you can't do. You'd have to do a heck of a lot more testing to come close to that.

Let me put it this way: Let's say I go to a college and from my experiences, I see that most of the people I've met are drunks and party people. However, the percentage of people I've actually met is only 1% of the school's population. It would be foolish for me to then say that since I've met the 1% and they seem to be drunks and party people, then it's safe to say that 51% of them are like that too--when I haven't even met close to half the number of people attending the college! There are so many variables that I am limited to.

What you're doing is committing the Hasty Generalization fallacy.
A lot of the senseless crap that happens in the world is a result of this type of logic.
Sorry for this, LovePets, but it was something I felt needed defending.
 

MaartenSFS

Arachnobaron
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So you're telling me that based on the little percentage of people you've met you're going to say that the other 2 billion are just the same in thought processes? I didn't say it was racist or stereotypical, I am staying it is unwise at best to generalize to over 2 billion people. How is the percentage high enough to generalize to 2 billion? What is the percentage of people you've met compared to the total population in Asia? To automatically assume that it's a "fact" is absurd.
Do you realize that your sample of people is extremely low? You're also limited to location.
Your experiences have led your opinions to be clearly biased.

So from what I can see, you're basically saying that it is cultural for most Asians to 1) have no respect for nature and 2) have no respect for each other. It's cultural for them to disrespect one another? To destroy nature?
Additionally, the agendas of the big markets does not equal that of the people.
And yes, I've been to Asia. In order to use the word most, you have to know at least 2 billion people and that is something you can't do. You'd have to do a heck of a lot more testing to come close to that.

Let me put it this way: Let's say I go to a college and from my experiences, I see that most of the people I've met are drunks and party people. However, the percentage of people I've actually met is only 1% of the school's population. It would be foolish for me to then say that since I've met the 1% and they seem to be drunks and party people, then it's safe to say that 51% of them are like that too--when I haven't even met close to half the number of people attending the college! There are so many variables that I am limited to.

What you're doing is committing the Hasty Generalization fallacy.
A lot of the senseless crap that happens in the world is a result of this type of logic.
Sorry for this, LovePets, but it was something I felt needed defending.
I suppose you are entitled to your opinion, as am I. When I say that they have no respect for nature I mean that everything ends up on the menu, the forests are cleared/mountains mined with blind regard for the environment and the future of the local inhabitants (who, though foolish, are uneducated and taken advantage of).

When I make a generalisation like this I needn't meet every single individual but look at the bigger picture. The rate of extinctions, the amount of virgin forest remaining and the rate at which it is being cleared, the animals being offered in filled restaurants, etc. Asia is FAMOUS for wildlife consumption. I have seen a cat being roasted alive by a man in a market with a BLOWTORCH as it howled due to its flesh being smouldered off. When I queried another local she matter-of-factly told me that the more the animal suffers before it dies the better it will taste (because it released endorphines).

Do you really think that this would happen in a public place in most other areas of the world?? I think not. That being said, I love Asia (for other reasons) and plan to return ASAP and probably live there for the rest of my life. To end on a positive note, things have changed for the better in very recent years and "most" may soon decrease to "many" and then hopefully to some.

But whales and elephants are still being slaughtered by very rich, educated Japanese, Taiwanese, Koreans, and now Chinese. Why? It's part of their culture (And one of them is responsible for the Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombs it has been recently discovered). The next time you try to force your sociology lessons on someone please do your homework and actually go to the place you are preaching about. If you still feel the need to argue with me about a fact then please PM me and stop hijacking the thread.

O, and where are those photos? The autumn is fast approaching and the herps will retire for the winter.. :(

Edit: O, and the thing about not respecting other people is probably somewhat of an overstatement but, re-phrasing my statement, the value of life in these overpopulated and "traditional" places in the world is very low indeed. I could tell you about some of the shocking things (even for me and I have seen people being killed with swords) I have seen around Asia, but perhaps it's better for you to go see yourself. But, I went native there and I'm used to it already.. it has become home. I still don't associate with people that torch cats and fillet humans, though. >=D

O, and people that let "big markets" run rampant and still buy their products and keep them in existance are just as guilty as the markets themselves. That's why I never buy from companies like Wal-Mart.
 
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ZergFront

Arachnoprince
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I don't know about Northern Europe,but in Romania many people kill the herps from pleasure,or,if they see a snake they see "satan",and must kill it. :wall:
Sadly,this is the world we live in.:barf:
It is very sad how poorly educated people still are. :(

Those are some gorgeous animals to the OP. :clap::D
 

H. laoticus

Arachnoprince
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Wow, never thought it'd be brought back up or I'd have to answer, but here I am.

Maarten:

I don't agree with your generalizations because what large entities are able to accomplish and what they believe in does not equal the values of the majority of the continent's population. Hitler does not represent Germany, does he? The actions of the large corps get attention and unfortunately those who do try to fight back are overpowered and forgotten. The success of these companies does not mean that most of the people agree with them. They do not represent Asia. Those who don't believe what they do are simply overshadowed because large, powerful entities get the spotlight and are able to make dramatic changes--in this case, environmental damage.
Your cat story is weightless--I can talk about countless stories of inhumanity sprouting from pretty much every country.

Now that you put your focus up front, I can agree that the things you mentioned about whales, elephants and especially dolphins is one part of their culture. It's a shame that it's not sustainable living. However, when you take in the population, the political system, and all of that mess, it gets mind boggling. If you want the dolphin fisherman to stop, you have to provide him with another means of sustainable living or find some way to educate him to find another trade. However, that's costly and it leads to one obstacle after another. Who's going to do the job of helping him? It's a tough life for many of them. It's not as easy as pointing a finger and calling them bad people. Maybe it's best to ask "why" they do the things they do.

I am not trying to force any "sociology" lessons on you, merely letting you know that although there are detrimental cultural practices occurring, they reflect those practicing the culture or running the factories, not those caught in the same net because they're on the same continent.
But either way, let's have some empathy: if you had to work to provide for your family and to survive, what would you do if you were only provided and only knew of those things? It's great that you yourself have been educated, but what about those who aren't, who have not been and probably will never be given that opportunity?

I'm also not going to go so far as to judge a whole continent's "value of life," despite the horrid acts that may occur there. That just opens ugly doorways to measuring the values of one culture over another. Oh, and just to let you know, I was born in Asia. My entire family is from there and grew up there. That's my homeland and it is for the many Asian friends and relatives I have.

And no, I'm not going to make everyone guilty for the inhumanity committed by large corporations. When a family is dirt poor and can only afford to shop at Walmart, I'm not going to put them in the same boat as Walmart's corporate leaders. Not to mention when you're dirt poor, you're more often than not, uneducated. Uneducated = little or no knowledge on Walmart. Little or no knowledge on Walmart = who cares where I shop, I'm going to shop where I can get the best value for my buck. And oh, try guessing what Walmart's population is composed of, it's not very hard. When you're trying to survive, right and wrong come after a full belly.
 

LovePets

Arachnosquire
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First herps of the year:D:D
Habitat(13.03.2011)

Pelophylax ridibundus



??Rana temporaria??


Not a herp but I was very pleased to find it
Pipistrellus pipistrellus
 

GailC

Arachnoprince
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Beautiful pictures, I love the toads most of all. I'd love to see more of the Romanian country side, it looks lovely.
 

Jayvis

Arachnopeon
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Feb 27, 2011
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MaartenSFS:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rfgroup/4008496348/
how about this ? what do you think ? its one of the example showing people from western damage the nature " no offence here". This entire world, some of the people do treat the nature badly, agree that some of asian did, but not only asian. im asian too, i love nature.
 

Rue

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Feb 24, 2011
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Wow! Excellent photos! More diversity than I would have guess too! Good!
 

LovePets

Arachnosquire
Old Timer
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May 19, 2009
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24.03.2011
Habitat

Pelophylax ridibundus


Pelophylax kl. esculentus

Bufo bufo

Fringilla coelebs




25.03.2011
Habitat


Rana temporaria





Eggs




Lacerta agilis




Bufo bufo


Ichtyosaura alpestris

 

yakman

Arachnopeon
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Sep 1, 2008
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27
Looks like that pond is just about full to bursting with frogspawn.

Have any of your white storks turned up yet this spring?
 

LovePets

Arachnosquire
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Thank you!
@yakman
I don't know,I live at high altitude and here the storks never come.:confused:
 

LovePets

Arachnosquire
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May 19, 2009
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30.03.2011
Habitat

Lacerta agilis



Bombina variegata





Spot the toad :razz:
 

zonbonzovi

Creeping beneath you
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Oct 20, 2008
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The pupils on that Bombina variegata are unreal...haven't seen another toad with that feature before.
 

LovePets

Arachnosquire
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Yes,I know,they are amazing!
31.03.2011
Habitat

Bufo bufo







Bufo bufo in amplexus with pelophylax ridibundus

Pelophylax ridibundus and pelophylax kl. esculentus



Rana temporaria

 

Hudson Ensz

Arachnopeon
Joined
Feb 12, 2011
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Beautiful pictures, the lacerta viridis reminds me a lot of the Ameiva ameiva that are everywhere here in brazil. I love the snakes.
 
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