Really confusing behavior post shipping

[JulianH1001]

Hey y'all,

One of the spiders I ordered last week is probably terminal, and for the life of me I can't figure out what's wrong with it. I'm like 99% certain she won't survive - I'd just like to understand why.


When I received the box, I thought she was DOA. Classic death curl, no responsiveness. Just to be sure, we put her upside down (in case of a molt-in-transit situation) in a temporary enclosure, and let her be for a day. The only movement I observed during this time was slight spasming of a leg or two. The next day she was still on her back, legs curled. I checked in more invasively this time, since it didn't appear to be a molt. When I dropped water on her fangs, she moved them and drank. Over the next few days she uncurled more and more, but is still on her back and not righting herself at all. She still drinks quite voraciously when water is dripped. She wiggles her abdomen back and forth and occasionally slightly moves legs, but the fangs seem to be the most reliably mobile part of her body. I even sprayed water onto her abdomen via syringe and rubbed it with a wet q-tip in case of impaction, and she actually shot out what looks to be a normal amount of feces, so that doesn't seem to be it.

She was shipped with another tarantula, a significantly smaller one (1.5-2in, she is 3~ish), which survived fine, so I don't see how chemicals could have gotten to her and not the other. The dealer is reputable, and both were packed excellently. Does it sound like she just got a major internal injury in transit bouncing around by chance? I haven't been able to bring myself to euthanize her while she's still clearly alive but I don't want her to "suffer", to the degree that arachnids even can. It's clearly not a molt at this point, and I've never heard of someone keeping what is essentially a paralyzed tarantula alive until its next molt, if it's even possible for her to do so.

I've attached some pictures. Does anyone have any thoughts or experiences with something like this?

EDIT: Oh, and I can't believe I forgot to include this info, but we received her last Thursday, so she's almost been like this for an entire week.

 

[Tarantulafeets]

I'm guessing the species is P irminia?

Looks like you should just keep doing what you are doing currently, hopefully it can rehydrate and get back to normal. Keep dripping water onto its fangs, and wait to see how it turns out.

 

[JulianH1001]

I'm guessing the species is P irminia?

Looks like you should just keep doing what you are doing currently, hopefully it can rehydrate and get back to normal. Keep dripping water onto its fangs, and wait to see how it turns out.

Yes, she's an irmina. I planned to keep it up, I've just never heard of a situation like this where a spider this seemingly far gone has improved. I'm obviously hoping for a miracle, but it feels so grim.

 

[starlight_kitsune]

Did you contact the vendor you got them from when you thought they were DOA initially? They might be willing to work with you if the sling doesn't make it, but most require you to contact them about any problems at arrival.

Impaction is much rarer than some would lead people to believe so I don't think anymore spraying their abdomen or q-tips there are going to help. Keeping them hydrated by dripping water on their fangs like you've been doing is probably the best bet for now. Do you have them in a regular enclosure at the moment, or are they in something with those paper towels pictured out of curiosity?

 

[JulianH1001]

Did you contact the vendor you got them from when you thought they were DOA initially? They might be willing to work with you if the sling doesn't make it, but most require you to contact them about any problems at arrival.

Impaction is much rarer than some would lead people to believe so I don't think anymore spraying their abdomen or q-tips there are going to help. Keeping them hydrated by dripping water on their fangs like you've been doing is probably the best bet for now. Do you have them in a regular enclosure at the moment, or are they in something with those paper towels pictured out of curiosity?

Vendor has been contacted and all monetary issues are taken care of - they were very understanding and flexible.

Yeah, I definitely don't think it's impaction, especially after she defecated. She's in a temporary critter keeper enclosure with a paper towel under her on the substrate, and a water dish in case she gets the strength to right herself and walk to it. Should I set her rightside up with her fangs in a shallower dish perhaps?

 

[coolnweird]

I haven't been able to bring myself to euthanize her while she's still clearly alive but I don't want her to "suffer", to the degree that arachnids even can. It's clearly not a molt at this point, and I've never heard of someone keeping what is essentially a paralyzed tarantula alive until its next molt, if it's even possible for her to do so.

These all deal with predatory wasp stings, but they show that tarantulas can be cared for through a period of paralysis and then recover mobility after the next molt. Best of luck, thank you for doing everything you can for this little darling!

Anything on a tarantulas stung by a tarantula wasp?

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[JulianH1001]

These all deal with predatory wasp stings, but they show that tarantulas can be cared for through a period of paralysis and then recover mobility after the next molt. Best of luck, thank you for doing everything you can for this little darling!

Anything on a tarantulas stung by a tarantula wasp?

i have one that was stung a month ago it’s a baby and it’s starting to walk I just don’t know anything about spiders it’s probably not going to make but thought I’d try it does walk but every day I find it on its back. I’m not sure how long it can go with out food I do give it drops of water I’m...

arachnoboards.com

Can a tarantula that are paralyzes by a peopsis wasp "wake up"

Let say that a adult tarantula get paralyzed but the egg from the Pepsis wasp is never laid, say you saw the wasp dragging the spider and you chasing the wasp away and took care of the spider, providing it with water by drip it into the spiders mouth (if it could drink?) Woukd the spider...

arachnoboards.com

wasp stung tarantula

On August 27, 2019, I found a tarantula in my driveway that had been stung by a tarantula hawk wasp and was paralyzed. I caught it and cared for it giving it water by a tiny syringe. (It’s been a rescued class pet for two classrooms, hoping we can eventually set it free again. *goals*) It began...

arachnoboards.com

7 Rescued from tarantula hawk... Help!

Okay I have seven (yep, 7) tarantulas who were stung by tarantula Hawks on September 9th. They were seen being dragged across the road and were taken in. So now I have these little guys who no doubt we'll need some nutritional support while the paralytics wear off (hopefully). I'm happy to post...

arachnoboards.com

Thank you, this gives me some degree of hope, even if the circumstances are obviously very different.

 

[cold blood]

Curious, did it come from a cold area? Was there a heat pad in with the box?

 

[JulianH1001]

Curious, did it come from a cold area? Was there a heat pad in with the box?

It came from California to Louisiana with no heat pack, two days shipping. I don't believe temperatures dropped lower than 50 in transit though.

 

[cold blood]

It came from California to Louisiana with no heat pack, two days shipping. I don't believe temperatures dropped lower than 50 in transit though.

well if it came overnight it was definitely colder....Temps up at cruising altitude in a plane cargo area can get really cold. Not saying this is the cause, just throwing out some speculation.

 

[JulianH1001]

Thank you for the info. I'm actually not sure if fedex's two-day is done through plane or purely truck, so that's definitely possible.

 

[cold blood]

Thank you for the info. I'm actually not sure if fedex's two-day is done through plane or purely truck, so that's definitely possible.

either way good luck...I hope it pulls through.

 

[dragonfire1577]

I'd suspect trauma from package being handled roughly or cold damage. I've had beetles come in dragging their faces and acting oddly with cold damage before, almost like they were semi paralyzed. The eventually declined and died, but never ate or drank.

 

[darkness975]

It came from California to Louisiana with no heat pack, two days shipping. I don't believe temperatures dropped lower than 50 in transit though.

Cold damage would be my guess. The fact that it is drinking is good though. Keep that up and hope.

 

[JulianH1001]

Hey y'all,

I wanted to give an update post here to show some of what's been going on.


She's still pretty much the same on her end, drinking well daily but still not flipping herself over and moving at all. I've been placing her mouth into a water dish (with book lungs well above, of course) to see if she just wants to drink a ton, and noticed some interesting behavior. She's webbing the side of the dish while drinking. This and pedipalp+fang movement are the most movement we've seen from her - legs still are very weak. I've attached a video for those interested.

I've also noticed her abdomen looks very strange, now that I can see it from the top. It looks squished or deformed. Could be impaction of course, but we all know how rare that is. Plus, I've seen her defecate twice, and there's no fecal residue near her anus that I've seen. Could she have been squished somehow during packing/shipping, and have internal damage from it that's debilitating yet not fatal...? She's been with me for over three weeks now, so I'm shocked she hasn't died while still remaining this injured. I've attached a photo of the abdomen as well.

Finally - advice on feeding her if this goes long-term somehow? I've offered a squished roach to her fangs while she's upside down, and she didn't seem interested. Should we make a roach/water slurry and let her drink that? I'm so at a loss with all this, and any help is appreciated.

-Julian

 

[NMTs]

I think her abdomen is swollen on one side, rather than squished. See how the black marking on the opposite side (left side looking at the pic) is solid and dark, whereas the marking on the right side is washed out? Think of the writing on a balloon that starts to disappear the more it is inflated... Maybe she had a rupture of some sort that didn't actually break the exoskeleton and she's got internal bleeding? Don't know what to do about it, but that's what it looks like to me.

 

[JulianH1001]

I think her abdomen is swollen on one side, rather than squished. See how the black marking on the opposite side (left side looking at the pic) is solid and dark, whereas the marking on the right side is washed out? Think of the writing on a balloon that starts to disappear the more it is inflated... Maybe she had a rupture of some sort that didn't actually break the exoskeleton and she's got internal bleeding? Don't know what to do about it, but that's what it looks like to me.

I definitely see what you mean. I'm not desperate enough to try and drain it myself since she's still alive and kicking for the time being, but if anyone has seen any posts about someone performing this kind of "surgery" on a tarantula, I'd love to see them.

 

[coolnweird]

I think your best bet is feeding her bug slurry until she can molt and hopefully repair the damage. The fact that she can pass waste is a really good sign in my opinion!

 

[JulianH1001]

I think your best bet is feeding her bug slurry until she can molt and hopefully repair the damage. The fact that she can pass waste is a really good sign in my opinion!

Thank you. Hopefully she takes to that as well as she has the water. Hopefully she's close to a molt - her abdomen is quite large for an arboreal species, lump regardless.

-Julian

 

[NMTs]

Hopefully recovers fully, then you're likely to have the most docile and cooperative Venezuelan sun tiger on the planet (at least for a little while, until she remembers she's supposed to be ornery). I'm guessing that all the webbing she's doing in the water dish is just instinctively supporting herself in a kind of precarious position. It does look like she's got decent mobility of the abdomen, though. Good luck with her!