power feeding pros and cons?

[Randolph XX()]

pros : look fat anf grow fast
cons: shorter life plus easier to get injured, harder to moult
true???

 

[Anansi]

T's have evolved to eat as much food as they can when they can but they will stop when full...I dont know if theres any scientific data that says they live shorter lives if powerfed...There are too many confounding variables (i.e. captive bred or not, stress, care of T, etc...)...I feed them as much as I can when I have the time...But when you get a significant amount of t's, powerfeeding becomes a job that one doesnt care to entertain for very long...

pros-
some do grow faster
they look fatter/ more healthy

cons-
it can be time consuming

I dont think powerfeeding messes with the molt b/c i used to powerfeed and never had one T die due to a bad molt...

 

[Spider-man 2]

Not to mention you spend way more $$$ on feeders!

 

[Code Monkey]

T's have evolved to eat as much food as they can when they can but they will stop when full...I dont know if theres any scientific data that says they live shorter lives if powerfed...

Wrongo, there is a wealth of data on life forms that draw the correlation between metabolism and temporal lifespan. If increasing their metabolism didn't shorten their lifespan they'd be the first organism to not display this trend. No, no one has specifically shown this for tarantulas (and you never will see this data for tarantulas as such a study would never be funded) but it's been looked at across species thoughout the animal kingdom and it's a pretty damn consistent correlation.

Also, your analogy is sort of right, but way off in its conclusion. All animals have evolved to consume as much as possible and store the excesses, when stable captive scenarios occur this is rarely a good thing. Look at the obesity in America, the obesity with dogs and cats - an instinct that serves a life form well in the field will not necessarily serve it well in captivity.

 

[Catherine]

I know people recommend power feeding the bigger species as slings
(T. blondi etc) apparantly makes them bigger adults. I've never had two slings to do a comparision by. The flip side is, they grow and mature quicker than normal. I suppose it depends on what you have your spider for. If its just a pet, feed it normally, if you want a huge tarantula or want one thats sexually mature asap, then power feed.

 

[Nerri1029]

Wrongo, there is a wealth of data on life forms that draw the correlation between metabolism and temporal lifespan. If increasing their metabolism didn't shorten their lifespan they'd be the first organism to not display this trend. No, no one has specifically shown this for tarantulas (and you never will see this data for tarantulas as such a study would never be funded) but it's been looked at across species thoughout the animal kingdom and it's a pretty damn consistent correlation.

Also, your analogy is sort of right, but way off in its conclusion. All animals have evolved to consume as much as possible and store the excesses, when stable captive scenarios occur this is rarely a good thing. Look at the obesity in America, the obesity with dogs and cats - an instinct that serves a life form well in the field will not necessarily serve it well in captivity.

Have any of those studies been performed on Invertebrates???
I'm asking not arguing..


I have read one on mice who were fed the barest minimum of requirements and lived 1/3 longer life spans.. BUT metabolism in inverts must differ greatly from vertebrates esp warm blooded verts.. Just My Opinion

One way of looking at it is that the power fed T will always have enough reserves to draw on in situations that require it: ( molting, stress )

 

[Wade]

The problem is, we really don't know what a normal feeding regimine is for a wild tarantula. We can make logical assumptions, but we don't really know. How can we even properly define what "powerfeeding" is?

We can safely assume that North American tarantulas eat little or nothing during the colder months when the burrows are sealed, but what about during the rest of the time? During the rainy season in the southwest, the desert is often literally crawling with life. The tarantulas there may be eating way more than we'd ever suspect. Can we really say the typical 2-4 crickets a week we offer is an ideal diet? Feast or famine is more likeley the rule, months of nothing followed by moths of gorging. Tropical forrest species on the otherhand, may have an almost constant supply of food. Or maybe they don't, there's still seasonal variables even in the tropics. What does this mean for us?

There is a HUGE range between the bare minimum a tarantula needs to survive, and what could be considered powerfeeding. Yes, spiders fed more and kept at higher temperatures will grow faster and probably live a shorter lifespan than those fed less and kept cooler...but is this altogether bad? What if powerfed tarantulas reach a larger size and become better breeders, would this offset the shortened lifespan?

With the number of animals I have, this is all just fun speculation for me. I haven't got the time to "powerfeed" if I wanted to!

Wade

 

[SubZero.nl]

I was thinking, if the spider is eating, why would that be bad? I think a spider stops eating when it had enough.

Do you think they will eat too much in their natural habitat too? I can't believe there's such a thing as eating too much for a spider.

But I am just a newbie, this is just what i would guess.

 

[Wade]

When people say "you can't overfeed a spider" they're reffering to older myths that claimed that tarantulas could feed so much that they's burst. Most likley, this came from captive terrastrial spiders that had taken a fall inside their cages (unseen by their keepers) and ruptured their abdomens (this can be avoided by keeping the spider in a cage with limited height, btw). When the keeper discoverd the burst spider they just misdiagnosed the cause.

There are possible secondary problems that come from overfed spiders however. All terrastrial tarantulas are vunerable to injuries from falls, but the bigger and more bloated the abdomen, the greater the risk. Also, as someone stated, it may also cause molting difficulties.

Wade

 

[Washout]

I was thinking, if the spider is eating, why would that be bad? I think a spider stops eating when it had enough.

Do you think they will eat too much in their natural habitat too? I can't believe there's such a thing as eating too much for a spider.

But I am just a newbie, this is just what i would guess.

Well here is how I think of it for my G. Rosea. In their normal habitat they have a seasonal cycle. They live in the desert and probably don't have access to tons of food. So in the spring and summer they eat a fair amount, but then go dry for 6 months or more in the colder seasons when they hide in their burrow.

So when we put them in a tempature controlled situation and provide access to tons of food all year round they probably consume too much, they just don't need that much food. They would be trying to store up for a famine that never comes. So I decided to just feed 3-4 crickets every couple of weeks and call it good. I just don't see a reason to provide something like 10 crickets a week, even though it may eat that much.

 

[shogun804]

i think they eat when they want to all my T's have exhibited this behavior so far sometimes ill put food in and they want touch it....but other times they attack like its there last meal i think it all depends largely on what type of specie it is and how they have evoloved......

 

[TroyMcClureOG82]

"I feed them as much as I can when I have the time...But when you get a significant amount of t's, powerfeeding becomes a job that one doesnt care to entertain for very long..."

This coming from a guy who recently raised a Nhandu coloratovillosus from a
1/4" sling to nearly 3" in six months

BTW shane, that one molted in my care and is in premolt right now. Same goes for both the Phormictopus

 

[Code Monkey]

Have any of those studies been performed on invertebrates???
I'm asking not arguing..

All the time, although not for the reasons we would be concerned directly (as an example that goes on here in the department: crop pests and such are reared artificially in environmentally controlled chambers, the people studying the given species can tell you life cycle rates based on temperature/food intake pretty accurately). Invertebrates have either a fixed number of instars, or some relatively narrow range of instars, tarantulas falling into the second class. Measuring their lifespan in time isn't necessarily appropriate since their lifespan is a essentially a function of total instars. If you shorten the intermoult period, you are burning up those instars that much faster. In practice, concern for this doesn't probably amount to much (will it matter to you if your A. chalcodes sling only lives 23 years in captivity versus 32? Or you P. murinus only lives 6 years verus 8?). All the same, the principal does hold.

However, feeding is one of the lesser factors for determining metabolism, temperature is going to be much more critical.

 

[Pokie1]

T. food

When I first got my T., it ate everything I threw at it as fast as I put it in. It had been in a bad petstore (Petco) for a while. I was worried about overfeeding cuz it was going through crickets by the dozen. Then one day, the crickets were still there for a couple hours. Soon it was 1 or 2 per day then it stopped eating for a while all together. Mine has slowed way down now and I have not gotten any feeders for 2 weeks. It seems that it eats when it is hungry and stops when it is not. To make a long story short, I learned to quit worrying about how much/often it eats.

Pokie1

 

[SubZero.nl]

When I first got my T., it ate everything I threw at it as fast as I put it in. It had been in a bad petstore (Petco) for a while. I was worried about overfeeding cuz it was going through crickets by the dozen. Then one day, the crickets were still there for a couple hours. Soon it was 1 or 2 per day then it stopped eating for a while all together. Mine has slowed way down now and I have not gotten any feeders for 2 weeks. It seems that it eats when it is hungry and stops when it is not. To make a long story short, I learned to quit worrying about how much/often it eats.

Pokie1

Yesterday my T. ate 7 crickets, seemed i could fed all i had
But today it ate only 1, i gave her 3 more crickets, the crickets where dancing all around my T, but she didnt touch any of them.

So she's not eating all the time, only when she is hungry
Since i have this spider for a couple of days now, i guess it was stressed and not eating because of that. And yesterday she ate again, a lot. And now she just continous to eat when she wants to.

Damn, i hope you ppl understand me although i don't speak english that well

 

[Professor T]

Wrongo, there is a wealth of data on life forms that draw the correlation between metabolism and temporal lifespan. If increasing their metabolism didn't shorten their lifespan they'd be the first organism to not display this trend. No, no one has specifically shown this for tarantulas (and you never will see this data for tarantulas as such a study would never be funded) but it's been looked at across species thoughout the animal kingdom and it's a pretty damn consistent correlation.

If you can't attribute human characteristics to Ts, can someone explain to me how you can attribute other animal species' metabolism to Ts?

I'm confused. When humans smile they're happy. When the capuchin monkey smiles its pissed off! Now I'm suppose to believe when a boa is power fed it matures faster and its lifespan shortens; so if it works with vertebrates like boas, it correlates to Arthropods like Ts?

I must have been absent from invertebrate physiology class when they taught the lesson Arthopods metabolism works like other species throuhout the Kingdom Animalia.

Feed your T as much as it will eat if it makes you happy. Be careful if its abdomen swells like a balloon and it takes a fall, you could lose your T. Also, be careful no live prey is around when it molts.

 

[Pheonixx]

i cant really say i "powerfeed" i just feed a few crickets every couple of days and it's never the same T's on the same days. It is totally random except for the T's that are nudged up against the front of the enclosure like they are waiting on food...

 

[Code Monkey]

I must have been absent from invertebrate physiology class when they taught the lesson Arthopods metabolism works like other species throuhout the Kingdom Animalia.

I doubt you ever got near a physiology class. The principal isn't even covered in invertebrate physiology which focuses on real issues such as neurobiology (which we now know you know very little about), respiration, reproduction mechanisms, moulting and hormone cycles, digestions, etc. They don't much feel the need to explain to a twit what happens when he increases an invertebrates metabolism because it's assumed you picked up this basic physiological rule in your undergraduate comparative physiology class which explains the principle in great detail. The invertebrate focused classes consider it a patently obvious fact that lifespan is tied to instar number and that instar number is tied to metabolism.

Basically, you may think you're having fun, I think you're deliberately acting like a moron.

 

[Code Monkey]

I must have been absent from invertebrate physiology class when they taught the lesson Arthopods metabolism works like other species throuhout the Kingdom Animalia.

Also, to point out more of your implied semantic nitpicking, why would anyone telling about physiological rules of thumb in Kingdom Animalia feel the need to suddenly point out the arthropods specifically as any highschool bio student could tell you that arthropods are a member of Kingdom Animalia?

I never have much liked you in the sense that your self proclaimed professor hood appeared a lie and that you are one of these people who likes to go on with even more big words and technical terms than myself because it looks smart. However, you only need to be pulling out the $0.25 words where necessary, not in every discussion, and you certainly don't accomplish anything by nitpicking arguments over the tiniest turn of phrase in an explanation - even I find that sort of "debating" to be tiresome and trite.

Now, maybe you've sucked up one too many hits of acid in recent history and you're on one of those "We can't know anything!" trips. Maybe you just got bored and decided to poke my buttons. Maybe you're another one of the annoying undergrads who just claims to be a zoology professor. Frankly, I'm having a hard time believing anything about you any more. Honest to goodness zoology courses are rare, and I have a very hard time believing that someone qualified for one of the very competitive academic spots in such a field would be making the arguments you are.

I think you're a fraud and I'm tired of it.

 

[Professor T]

Also, to point out more of your implied semantic nitpicking, why would anyone telling about physiological rules of thumb in Kingdom Animalia feel the need to suddenly point out the arthropods specifically as any highschool bio student could tell you that arthropods are a member of Kingdom Animalia?

I knew you couldn't put me on virtual ignore mode.

I never said Arthropods weren't in the Kingdom Animalia. If you read carefully I said, "Arthropod species like other species in the Kingdom Animalia". That does not imply Arthropods aren't animals... but you misread.

You seem to find anyone that can match or surpass your knowledge tiresome.

I pointed out an error in your logic on another post that you have done with others 1,000's of times. You can dish it out BIG TIME, but you can't take it when the table is turned.

Nothing personal, like I've said before, I thoroghly enjoy your comments and opinion.

Something to consider is you might not always be right on everything.