Possible Mould?

[Dorifto]

how is the case closed when people are presenting wholly illogical argumentation which is, at this point, entirely unsubstantiated?

it is a biological fact that mold will die when exposed to heat which is at or above 140F - boiling water averages 212F in temp, greatly exceeding the minimum threshold to kill mold - logic would dictate then, that by using boiling water, for example, that you will kill virtually all mold and spores present by creating such harsh conditions that it can not continue to live in

That would work if you live in a stirilized bubble, but you live in the woorld, with air currents, storms, forests, annoying people etc.

Boil it, set it on fire, nuke it, because few seconds later it's going to be full of spores.

 

[Smotzer]

then post it - the above is fallacious argumentation (argumentum ab auctoritate) and what’s been presented thus far is purely conjecture - it does not make any sense to suggest that by putting mold in conditions which objectively kill mold that that the mold will in turn, not die, and spread

I have posted exactly what I know and have learned about biologic culturing. You are selectively reading and entirely missing the point. Its kinda mute at this point as we have laid out in short and long strings of sentences the science behind "sterilizing" in the home in layman's terms, and you are stuck on the use of heat to kill, and not what happens the second that heat is gone in your home

@YungRasputin this is mean as education no one is attacking you, if you are taking it that way. Purely educational

 

[Wolfram1]

@Shrao

yes and there is no one right way of keeping spiders ether, hopefully our little argument can be helpful in making up your mind on how you want to deal with your mold "problem"

 

[viper69]

That’s mold- spot cleaning is helpful.

 

[PMetallicaFreak]

Hello would like to preface by saying I am a new to the Tarantula hobby so any advice is greatly appreciated! About 2 weeks ago a close friend of mine had to move and he couldn't take his Aphonopelma Seemanni Stripe Knee with him and he asked if I would like to take care of him(her? Idk yet) and after he gifted it to me I tried to do as much research on the species and how it should be kept. He gave the T to me in a tank way to big for the size it is and so I went to my exotic pet store and purchased a non mesh vented critter keeper type enclosure and some bricks of Coconut fiber and Husks. After letting the bricks settle and mixing in the husks I packed it down then let it dry out so it has some solid soil to burrow around in, I rehoused the T into the new enclosure and it's been a few days now and I'm beginning to notice what looks like a white fuzz grow along the cork bark and I would like to know if this is a cause for concern or if it's something that can be easily fixed like relocating the T so I can clean/remove it. I'm not sure if moving the T around so much is bad for the thing or not and I just want what's best for the little guy. Like I said any help and criticism is appreciated because I am brand new to all of this.

looks like mold, you could do nothing, or you could do what I do. scoop out that little piece, place dry sub onto it, and don't wet that side for some time. explain your watering behaviors to me.

 

[spideyspinneret78]

Just scoop the moldy parts out, and let the enclosure dry out for a little while. If you can, add more ventilation holes into the sides of the enclosure so that moisture and air don't sit stagnant, which encourages mold growth.

 

[YungRasputin]

yes but were does that get you? i get that not anyone likes to have a "bioactive" enclosure and the term/fad annoys me to no end anyway but i base my care on the spider not on the substrate, i dont want to have it bone dry just to prevent mold when i feel like the spider may need some moisture

I didn’t say anything about keeping the substrate dry - i was talking about drying out the enclosure thoroughly before re-adding clean substrate to the enclosure

I have posted exactly what I know and have learned about biologic culturing. You are selectively reading and entirely missing the point. Its kinda mute at this point as we have laid out in short and long strings of sentences the science behind "sterilizing" in the home in layman's terms, and you are stuck on the use of heat to kill, and not what happens the second that heat is gone in your home

all that’s been stated thus far is that heat would kill some mold spores and not others, and by removing ‘competition’ this would lead to mold spread throughout the enclosure - which is interesting insomuch as it seems contingent on the idea that extreme heat must turn some mold spores into extremophiles while killing others and/or that dead mold spores can pass through water, vinegar, or other liquids and then do a zombie shuffle to parts of the cleaned enclosure so they can later spread

 

[Wolfram1]

nooo, the mold spores are in the air! some can even start growing on camera lenses if there is the slightest bit of moisture and dust particles as food.

since coco fibre is organic it makes for a good substrate for fungi and other decomposing agents like bacteria. Once sterilised it doesnt change the fact that it can be deconstructed by these organisms and since spider enclosures tend to fulfill all the requirements they need as well like not beeing exposed to UV-light, contain higher humidity, etc. its the perfect place to live for these organisms.

Schmotzer & co. have explained it much better than me and i dont understand how you can just reject any of his detailed explanations

are u doing something wrong, no, do we want to change how you do things, no, but you seem to be ignoring common sense
i know people who struggle with the thought of germs and while their fear forces them to wash their hands excessively and they are intelligent persons they are not afraid of all the bacteria on their own skin or in the air, it makes no sense but good for them because otherwise they would have to go crazy

do you react more strongly than others to the idea of germs? it might explain your reactions to this....
or maybe you simply have made good experiences with your way of doing things but your arguments make no sense to me

contingent on the idea that extreme heat must turn some mold spores into extremophiles while killing others and/or that dead mold spores can pass through water, vinegar, or other liquids and then do a zombie shuffle to parts of the cleaned enclosure so they can later spread

nobody implied that!!!!

 

[YungRasputin]

nooo, the mold spores are in the air! some can even start growing on camera lenses if there is the slightest bit of moisture and dust particles as food.

true

since coco fibre is organic it makes for a good substrate for fungi and other decomposing agents like bacteria. Once sterilised it doesnt change the fact that it can be deconstructed by these organisms and since spider enclosures tend to fulfill all the requirements they need as well like not beeing exposed to UV-light, contain higher humidity, etc. its the perfect place to live for these organisms.

can’t relate - my enclosures aren’t bioactive and i think even with moisture dependent husbandry it’s easy to find a balance which would meet the specimen’s environmental requirements without creating conditions which lead to mold growth

Schmotzer & co. have explained it much better than me and i dont understand how you can just reject any of his detailed explanations

I am not rejecting what they’re saying outright in some contrarian way - i just v much disagree and what is being said genuinely doesn’t make sense to me; I don’t think i’m being attacked and i don’t think debates are a bad thing

watching debates, for example, has been instrumental in my learning of philosophy and politics - i would assume the same could be said of arachnid keeping

are u doing something wrong, no, do we want to change how you do things, no, but you seem to be ignoring common sense

ja i don’t see how

i know people who struggle with the thought of germs and while their fear forces them to wash their hands excessively and they are intelligent persons they are not afraid of all the bacteria on their own skin or in the air, it makes no sense but good for them because otherwise they would have to go crazy

I am cognizant of the fact that terrariums (bioactive or otherwise) are living, breathing things much in the same way that aquariums are and that not all bacteria/germs are harmful, visible, etc - to the same token, i’m not a mycologist and have no true way of determining what is and what is not harmful mold or fungi

which is why even tho I’ve not had this problem what I posted is how I would respond and the techniques I’ve talked about are how “sterilize” the natural décor i use in my enclosures and how i prep new enclosures before use

and another thing - i am using “sterilize” in an informal, non-clinical sense - i get that (much to my dismay) i can’t sterilize things to lab standards within the limitations of my spider room/home

do you react more strongly than others to the idea of germs? it might explain your reactions to this....

not that i have to disclose this however i do have (diagnosed) acute OCD and am quite particular about these things, yes

or maybe you simply have made good experiences with your way of doing things but your arguments make no sense to me

I have had success with what I’ve suggested but to be v clear here, I’m not stuck in my ways or resistant to change - I’m just the sort that will debate something until it makes sense to me and my arguments have been thoroughly decimated to the point of necessitating concession

 

[Wolfram1]

maybe i should just tell you about my experiences instead i feel like there might be a misunderstanding there.

before i got my spiders and before i found ABs i was browsing a lot of videos about spiders, terrarium setups etc. and since i have always been the type of person that likes to understand why something works i tried to watch as many videos about those topics as possible and make up my own mind. I naturally gravitated more towards content creators like Tom Moran and others i dont remember who are less sensational.

When i finaly felt ready and got my spiderlings, i thought spiders would be very fragile and i baked the leaves and bark i added before putting them in and within a few days they were moldy, back then i thought i might have killed my spiders and instantly removed them, i tried it again several times and each time they would start to mold. So one day after talking to a new friend who has kept hundreds of different invertebrates i tried adding them non-sterilised, still slightly wet from the forest and suddenly they didnt mold!

I have made a lot of experiences that seem to confirm this and it is consistent with other examples where microorganisms play a part. Like people being weakened after taking anibiotics until their microbiota have recovered etc. etc.

 

[Dorifto]

I'm going to leave one last question in the air...

How do you sterilize a T?

 

[spideyspinneret78]

I'm going to leave a question in the air...

How do you sterilize a T?

Easy..... put 'em in the autoclave!

 

[Dorifto]

Easy..... put 'em in the autoclave!

Without killing it

 

[The Grym Reaper]

Yes, it's mould, mould is a non-issue. If the sight of it bothers you then either pick it out, dry out the enclosure/improve ventilation, or just let it die off of it's own accord once it uses up any nutrients within its immediate vicinity. It's no threat to your tarantula and absolutely not worth gutting the entire enclosure and nuking everything for.

Also, sterilising anything that you put in your enclosures is a bloody waste of time/effort because the first thing to come into contact with it (most probably mites or mould spores because they're everywhere) gets to reproduce completely unchecked.

 

[Stardust1986]

how is the case closed when people are presenting wholly illogical argumentation which is, at this point, entirely unsubstantiated?

it is a biological fact that mold will die when exposed to heat which is at or above 140F - boiling water averages 212F in temp, greatly exceeding the minimum threshold to kill mold - logic would dictate then, that by using boiling water, for example, that you will kill virtually all mold and spores present by creating such harsh conditions that it can not continue to live in

You cannot escape mold, bacteria, and spores, it's all around us. Only half of our cells are human, the other half are bacteria. We cant escape the fact we live in a microbial world, we, and all living things are apart of this. It's not bad to sterilize, but microbes are all around us, you can kill it..but its only temporary, it will come back. Spring tails eat mold, I recommend their natural help : )

 

[YungRasputin]

You cannot escape mold, bacteria, and spores, it's all around us. Only half of our cells are human, the other half are bacteria. We cant escape the fact we live in a microbial world, we, and all living things are apart of this. It's not bad to sterilize, but microbes are all around us, you can kill it..but its only temporary, it will come back. Spring tails eat mold, I recommend their natural help : )

ja i am aware of such things however i am also aware of how to take care of mold problems as well - i’ll make a bet, if i ever have a mold issue i’ll try it your way and then we’ll see

 

[Stardust1986]

ja i am aware of such things however i am also aware of how to take care of mold problems as well - i’ll make a bet, if i ever have a mold issue i’ll try it your way and then we’ll see

I suppose it's best to try everything, and be open to all ideas, you should do what feels right, I'm not an expert on bacteria. I have learned recently that we live in a microbial world, and were always exposed, but certain conditions allow it to take hold, I must say, I'm quite convinced sterilizing anything doesnt prevent a reoccurring issue with mold and fungi

 

[YungRasputin]

I suppose it's best to try everything, and be open to all ideas, you should do what feels right, I'm not an expert on bacteria. I have learned recently that we live in a microbial world, and were always exposed, but certain conditions allow it to take hold, I must say, I'm quite convinced sterilizing anything doesnt prevent a reoccurring issue with mold and fungi

I will say, in addition to arachnids, I do have a beta fish and I’m aware of things like beneficial bacteria and so on - I’ve just been talking about how to make things terrarium safe and get rid of mold - i’m not saying that if you do X, Y, and Z you will get rid of all life in an enclosure or some such thing - that’s taking my points to an absurdity I feel

 

[AlbaArachnids92]

The debate here is the second you 'sterilize' anything, it is 'sterile' until it comes into contact with ANYTHING at all, so a fraction of a second. Mould spores are in the air, touch your new shiny 'sterile' surface and find no competition for resources.
You've now created a perfect ground to multiply.

I can hand on heart say as a new keeper, I dumped countless enclosures of sub, 'sterilized' every last inch of the enclosure (almost exactly as you describe) and voila! New mould.......

Spot cleaning major breakouts is your best bet. The rest will work it's own way out as long as you allow it to dry out a bit.

 

[Stardust1986]

I will say, in addition to arachnids, I do have a beta fish and I’m aware of things like beneficial bacteria and so on - I’ve just been talking about how to make things terrarium safe and get rid of mold - i’m not saying that if you do X, Y, and Z you will get rid of all life in an enclosure or some such thing - that’s taking my points to an absurdity I feel

I dont know how fish experiencesthe microbial world different in water than things on land, it's a different ecosystem. Cleaning is good for our homes, and it's good for Ts, but I guess the idea is to be mindful of this microbial enviorment and reoccurring problems with the microbial world we're all apart of, springtails and isopods help, but I guess the message is, we cant really truly sterilize the enviorment, trust your judment