pinktoe in deathcurl a few days after molt, with hemolymph oozing

[PiperUriija]

Emergency:

My pinktoe molted and everything was FINE. she was crawling around just fine. I picked up her molt: it was all there except for the molted abdomen. I could not find the molted abdomen anywhere in the cage. then a few days after her molt, I find her suddenly in the deathcurl with hemolymph (spider blood) oozing out of some of her leg joints and I thought she was dead. I picked her up and called Petco, who surprisingly had information. She suggested that she might be molting AGAIN to shed her abdomen!!! No research has EVER suggested that spiders can molt TWICE in a few days. this is apparently very RARE but why would no websites or any research ive done ever evwn indicate, hint, or prepare me for this? and someone said to put superglue on the hemolymph. idk what to do so i put her back into her cage AFTER picking her up because i thought she was DEAD until she moved! but still in deathcurl. my thought is that she molted everything but her abdomen, and then some how she tore her legs a bit, a few days later, letting the blood seep out (idk how that would even happen) and then decides to molt her abdomen (laying on her back) but her hemolymph is leaking out, causing her legs to retract into the death curl but shes not dead. but i am NOT a spider expert, and this is so rare and beyond my expertise.. I don't want to hurt her. I probably already did just by picking her up. I need a spider expert, someone who has experience with this but apparently they don't exist so someone please help

 

[tonypace2009]

Do you have pictures of the abdomen and leg joints? You can use corn starch or flower to clot the bleeding. I don't think super glue on leg joints is a good idea.Tarantulas can usually cast a leg if need be but if several legs have a lot of damage I don't know. Is the molt of abdamon stuck over book lungs? Pictures would help.My first line of thought is to make sure booklungs are clear and stop the bleeding.

 

[Chris11]

Never have i seen that but it could be a number of things. The spider couldve just had a bad molt (pictures are very necessary when asking a qyestion like this btw). What type of envlosure and conditions was it kept in by you? Petsmart tarantulas are not kept the best IME and it couldve been issues stemming from their hisbandry. Super glue SHOULD NEVER be used unless its a minimal bleeding injury that the spider obviously cant deal with on its own. Maybe pour a little water in the substrate right in front of it and move its water dish right next to it. And lastly, im not trying to sound geriatric, but clean up the language, this is a public forum that anybody can view. I HOPE THE VERY BEST FOR YOUR SPIDER!!!!

 

[Chris11]

And a spider will never molt within even a few weeks post molt... they just arent ready. She was trying to dislodge her abdomen which may resulted in her injuries.

 

[Chris LXXIX]

I picked her up and called Petco, who surprisingly had information.

ah ah

Post a pic if you can btw.

 

[lalberts9310]

The reason you never heard of or seen supporting evidence regarding the information petco gave you is probably because it's false? That's the 1st thing you need to refrain from, is taking advice from a petstore, as most petstore employees has little to zero experience regarding inverts.

My 1st thought when I read your post is that the abdominal part of the molt is still stuck, covering the booklungs. So a picture would definitely be helpful if you could provide one. The 2nd thing is your T is leaking haemolymph, and is in a deathcurl, and it recently molted. A T loses a lot of fluids during a molt, thus why a water supply should always be provided, especially during the molting process. Does it have a waterdish? A deathcurl usually is an indication of dehydration, and then leaking haemolymph would make matters worse if the T is in fact dehydrated. What you can do, is turn the T upside down on it's back, and using a syringe or eyedropper, place a water droplet onto it's mouthparts. Or you can place its mouthparts into the waterdish.

 

[cold blood]

Petco's information was a bald faced lie...NEVER NEVER NEVER EVER go to a pet store for advice.

How big is the t in question?

My guess is that the t had a fall post molt.

Not being able to find the abdomen part is completely normal, when you do see it, its generally just a little piece of "skin".

My suggestion would be to make sure the t has a full water dish and maybe even dampen the sub...aside from that, its just a waiting game. Last year I knocked over a few chromatus sling enclosures, one was in bad shape, missing 4 legs, another mangled and leaking hemolymph from the body....I did nothing aside from leaving it be and keeping the sub damp....molted a month later and its still going fine and nearly 4" now.

Pics would certainly help.

 

[PiperUriija]

Do you have pictures of the abdomen and leg joints? You can use corn starch or flower to clot the bleeding. I don't think super glue on leg joints is a good idea.Tarantulas can usually cast a leg if need be but if several legs have a lot of damage I don't know. Is the molt of abdamon stuck over book lungs? Pictures would help.My first line of thought is to make sure booklungs are clear and stop the bleeding.

Do you have pictures of the abdomen and leg joints? You can use corn starch or flower to clot the bleeding. I don't think super glue on leg joints is a good idea.Tarantulas can usually cast a leg if need be but if several legs have a lot of damage I don't know. Is the molt of abdamon stuck over book lungs? Pictures would help.My first line of thought is to make sure booklungs are clear and stop the bleeding.

I do not have pictures. I should have taken pics when I first opened the lid. I thought she was dead because I have NEVER heard of a spider molting twice. So in stead of picking her up, I should have just taken a picture. It seems like I have to be a super experienced T expert just to keep them alive. I with there were an emergency T hotline I could call.

I did get in touch with someone at an animal hosptial that said I should just put her back in and leave her alone for about 4 days and she will molt her abdomen. But because I picked her up, I think I <edit> up. It's been about 3 days now and she literally hasn't moved at all :/

 

[PiperUriija]

Never have i seen that but it could be a number of things. The spider couldve just had a bad molt (pictures are very necessary when asking a qyestion like this btw). What type of envlosure and conditions was it kept in by you? Petsmart tarantulas are not kept the best IME and it couldve been issues stemming from their hisbandry. Super glue SHOULD NEVER be used unless its a minimal bleeding injury that the spider obviously cant deal with on its own. Maybe pour a little water in the substrate right in front of it and move its water dish right next to it. And lastly, im not trying to sound geriatric, but clean up the language, this is a public forum that anybody can view. I HOPE THE VERY BEST FOR YOUR SPIDER!!!!

I don't think it was a bad molt, just because she molted fine the first time and was walking around like everything was normal for a few days. are bad molts common? I had a rose hair that died during a molt. And i'm the kind of person that does a plethora of research on a critter before purchasing it, and I continue research all throughout my care. I was doing everything I was supposed to be doing and more. I don't believe her enclosure was bad. I kept her in a tall enclosure with plenty of holes- the same ones I found at a LOCAL pet store who has a lot of T's. He gave me great advice. I monitored the humidity and temperature daily, and i never give her tap water. there was always a water dish with fresh water in it. I would make sure there was even water on the walls (when I sprayed the cage) for her to drink off of. I tried keeping it a stress-free environment at all times. I am very attentive when it comes to my T's, or any pet for that matter. Also I bought her from a local pet store in Colorado a few months ago, not PetSmart or Petco, so I know she was taken care of. So i don't know what I did wrong.She is still on her back and hasn't moved. I'm guessing she's gone. this is just super frustrating. And what language are you referring to?

 

[PiperUriija]

The reason you never heard of or seen supporting evidence regarding the information petco gave you is probably because it's false? That's the 1st thing you need to refrain from, is taking advice from a petstore, as most petstore employees has little to zero experience regarding inverts.

My 1st thought when I read your post is that the abdominal part of the molt is still stuck, covering the booklungs. So a picture would definitely be helpful if you could provide one. The 2nd thing is your T is leaking haemolymph, and is in a deathcurl, and it recently molted. A T loses a lot of fluids during a molt, thus why a water supply should always be provided, especially during the molting process. Does it have a waterdish? A deathcurl usually is an indication of dehydration, and then leaking haemolymph would make matters worse if the T is in fact dehydrated. What you can do, is turn the T upside down on it's back, and using a syringe or eyedropper, place a water droplet onto it's mouthparts. Or you can place its mouthparts into the waterdish.

You seem to really know your stuff. I am 100% new to this site, is it possible to send you a message directly? and how? That makes sense that the abdominal molt might be stuck and covering her booklungs. I can't get a picture at the moment because her enclosuore is tall and round at the top and she's way down in there. I was very adamant when it came to supplying her with water, but i don't know how much water she was actually drinking, if at all. I supplied her with a waterdish with fresh water daily, and rocks at the bottom so her or crickets couldn't drown. I even sprayed her tank often so she could drink the water droplets from the side of the enclosure. Because she is an Arboreal spider, she probably didn't take a trip to the ground often. I did not know that a deathcurl is a sign of dehydration. that is odd because I supplied her with water, so why would she not drink it? I did do research though, that suggested I let her tank completely "dry out" in between misting so that bacteria doesn't grow with the constant humidity. I did that about ever 3 or so mistings, because I know that she needs constant humidity. So that was confusing. I did keep her on her back. I was going to do the water droplet thing but then we talked to the other lady who recommended that I just put her back and leave her be, to finish her molt. It could have been a thousand different things. I wonder if these things happen often. Thanks for the info

 

[PiperUriija]

Petco's information was a bald faced lie...NEVER NEVER NEVER EVER go to a pet store for advice.

How big is the t in question?

My guess is that the t had a fall post molt.

Not being able to find the abdomen part is completely normal, when you do see it, its generally just a little piece of "skin".

My suggestion would be to make sure the t has a full water dish and maybe even dampen the sub...aside from that, its just a waiting game. Last year I knocked over a few chromatus sling enclosures, one was in bad shape, missing 4 legs, another mangled and leaking hemolymph from the body....I did nothing aside from leaving it be and keeping the sub damp....molted a month later and its still going fine and nearly 4" now.

Pics would certainly help.

She's fairly small. about half of her grown adult size. And this was an emergency so i didn't know what else to do- if you have a spidey doc emergency number, please, let me know. and I was purposely avoiding taking her out for about a month pre-molt, and did not touch her after the molt, so i'm not sure how she could have fallen. is that normal in Arboreal species? and yeah there was a little flap of skin, maybe that was her abdomen. Thanks for clarifying that. and yes she had a full water dish but the substrate kept drying- a lot. I could never keep it moist for some reason. But I am in Texas so the humidity part is pretty difficult.

 

[Chris11]

I don't think it was a bad molt, just because she molted fine the first time and was walking around like everything was normal for a few days. are bad molts common? I had a rose hair that died during a molt. And i'm the kind of person that does a plethora of research on a critter before purchasing it, and I continue research all throughout my care. I was doing everything I was supposed to be doing and more. I don't believe her enclosure was bad. I kept her in a tall enclosure with plenty of holes- the same ones I found at a LOCAL pet store who has a lot of T's. He gave me great advice. I monitored the humidity and temperature daily, and i never give her tap water. there was always a water dish with fresh water in it. I would make sure there was even water on the walls (when I sprayed the cage) for her to drink off of. I tried keeping it a stress-free environment at all times. I am very attentive when it comes to my T's, or any pet for that matter. Also I bought her from a local pet store in Colorado a few months ago, not PetSmart or Petco, so I know she was taken care of. So i don't know what I did wrong.She is still on her back and hasn't moved. I'm guessing she's gone. this is just super frustrating. And what language are you referring to?

I honestly dont know about the language i reread your post and there was nothing but i couldve swore it was littered with words not acceptable for children... ive been known to get a little inwbriated too much so i appologize if it was never there. I really dont know. lol
Btw, dont woryy about temp and humidity. Stuffy, humid cages kill avics very quickly, they should have dry substrate.

 

[BobBarley]

I don't think it was a bad molt, just because she molted fine the first time and was walking around like everything was normal for a few days. are bad molts common? I had a rose hair that died during a molt. And i'm the kind of person that does a plethora of research on a critter before purchasing it, and I continue research all throughout my care. I was doing everything I was supposed to be doing and more. I don't believe her enclosure was bad. I kept her in a tall enclosure with plenty of holes- the same ones I found at a LOCAL pet store who has a lot of T's. He gave me great advice. I monitored the humidity and temperature daily, and i never give her tap water. there was always a water dish with fresh water in it. I would make sure there was even water on the walls (when I sprayed the cage) for her to drink off of. I tried keeping it a stress-free environment at all times. I am very attentive when it comes to my T's, or any pet for that matter. Also I bought her from a local pet store in Colorado a few months ago, not PetSmart or Petco, so I know she was taken care of. So i don't know what I did wrong.She is still on her back and hasn't moved. I'm guessing she's gone. this is just super frustrating. And what language are you referring to?

So, you might not believe us, but it's the truth. Most of us on here don't worry about humidity much at all. Dry substrate with A LOT of cross ventilation (ventilation on the sides) and a full water dish is fine. I stagnant air caused by too much humidity might have been the problem for your Avic. There's another thread on here created perhaps about a month ago with almost the same scenario. Avic died a little after what seemed to be an ok molt. I'll post a link when I find it.

EDIT: Here it is: http://arachnoboards.com/threads/bad-molt-crippled-pink-toe.280424/

And trust me there are many more threads like this, where the owners of their t's find out that they have been killing the t with not enough ventilation and too much stuffy, humid air.

 

[lalberts9310]

Avics can succumb to husbandry errors quite easily, moist stuffy cages often being a culprit. Avics should be kept on dry substrate with proper cross-ventilation (vents on the side). Anyone that told you it's molting again, was telling you a lie. They need quite some time to form a new exo before they can molt, which doesn't happen in a few days. And If it's in a deathcurl, it's definitely not trying to molt again. It's dieing. Also, another thing, tarantulas can't drown in a waterbowl. They are covered in water resistant setae. They float on water, the setae prevents them from breaking water tension. Molting problems can be quite common, and sometimes it just happens for no apparent reason. The best place to seek advice is from hobyists and experienced keepers themselves, as petshop employees have no experience, and you rarely (if ever) will find a vet that specialises in inverts. You also mentioned monitoring humidity? Making me think you had a hygrometer in the enclosure. Which is a total waste and usually causes more harm than good. As keepers tend to mist and moist the cage till the hygrometer shows the desired number. Hygrometers are very inaccurate, especially the ones you get from petstores. And they tend to get stuck on a specific number. Then the humidity in the enclosure might actually be higher than the hygrometer shows. No tarantula requires number specific humidity. A large waterbowl would have provided your avic with the humidity it needed. And excessive misting is also not a good idea. You can lightly mist once or twice a week on the webbing for drinking purposes, but other than that, no misting is required.

Remember that not every tarantula specie is kept the same, some are kept bone dry, others should be kept moist all the time, and others in between. Some are kept with more ventilation, others with less. You don't have to be a tarantula expert to keep tarantulas. All of us started out keeping Ts with zero experience, it's not difficult. You just need to do research in the right places. Avoid online care sheets as well, the care sheets on avics focusses a lot on humidity, but fail to mention how important cross-ventilation is. So if you ever have any more questions, just search these forums or ask. There's tons of old threads that will potentially answer any question you might have, and a lot of experienced hobbyists that's willing to help. The only place you'll need experience is if you want to keep intermediate or advanced tarantula species.

And regarding how you can PM me, just click on my profile and click start a conversation.