Pampho. Nigricolor or Platyomma?

[awiec]

The extent that there are in fact sp. that can be determined by color quite easily & others that can't.

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But virtually all male pamphs look the same, you can say oh well that one is a "little" pinker but individuals within the same species can have variation so as I said before, if the animal was labelled nigricolor then it's probably the hobby form of nigricolor.

 

[Ibzayalexander]

I totally agree in accordance to the pamphos in particular. However, generally speaking in regards to all spiders as you mentioned above, is a bit subject. I totally understand where you're coming from my friend.

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[Thistles]

http://i.imgur.com/s3ce6zC.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/rE191Ir.jpg
These are 2 shots of the same spider belonging to a friend of mine. He's supposedly a platyomma. Now I'd wonder if my buddy got himself a mislabeled nigricolor, but color is such a poor way to determine species. Unless there's some other reason to doubt, I think you probably have what you were told you have.

 

[Angel Minkov]

The extent that there are in fact sp. that can be determined by color quite easily & others that can't.

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Of course when you see a blue spider with yellow spots ventrally and a fractal-like pattern on the abdomen you can easily determine it and say it's a P. metallica when there is nothing that looks like it, but determining closely related species, which virtually look the same, by color is a horrible way to label species and that's usually how hybrids come to exist

 

[awiec]

Of course when you see a blue spider with yellow spots ventrally and a fractal-like pattern on the abdomen you can easily determine it and say it's a P. metallica when there is nothing that looks like it, but determining closely related species, which virtually look the same, by color is a horrible way to label species and that's usually how hybrids come to exist

Even some of the closely related pokies are a pain to tell apart and most of that genus is described, pamphs on the other hand don't have a lot of work done on them. I still think it's the hobby nigricolor as all the OP can go on is the word of the seller.

 

[Poec54]

Of course when you see a blue spider with yellow spots ventrally and a fractal-like pattern on the abdomen you can easily determine it and say it's a P. metallica when there is nothing that looks like it

There are other color phases of metallica besides blue, same goes for formosa, striata, and ornata which also have color variations. Besides, there's a number of blue species in the hobby now.

 

[Angel Minkov]

None of which have a fractal-like pattern on their abdomen or yellow spots on their legs ventrally There are leg bands to idenfity Pokies, as well as their carapace to an extent. What do you have to distinguish closely related Pamhobeteus males? Nothing.

And I've never heard of any color phases of P. metallica, nor color variations for any of the other species. From what I know, it's just a bunch of bull created by sellers who are trying to get out a bit more money from their Ts.

 

[Philth]

And I've never heard of any color phases of P. metallica, nor color variations for any of the other species. From what I know, it's just a bunch of bull created by sellers who are trying to get out a bit more money from their Ts.

although the black morph P. metallica are just older ones in the hobby, who knows if there are variations in the wild. Rick West use to have pics of a black morph and brown morph ( which to me looked like a rough wild one that needed to molt) on his site. Who knows what's out there though. Search for pics off white P. formosa Poecilotheria.com. StefanPhalagorn posted pics of a black P. striata on this site some years back. Leg patters can vary slightly as well as we see in P. vittata and P. ornata. So there's some weird things out there, I'd post links but I'm on my phone.

Later, Tom

 

[Poec54]

I've never heard of any color phases of P. metallica, nor color variations for any of the other species. From what I know, it's just a bunch of bull created by sellers who are trying to get out a bit more money from their Ts.

You're making some assumptions based on a lack of knowledge. There's a grey phase of metallica, a white phase of formosa, a black phase of striata. In the US I've only seen the dark blue phase of ornata, but there's another one common in Europe. Regalis is supposed to have 2 or 3 color variations, not surprising as it has the biggest range of any Poec.

 

[Angel Minkov]

You're making some assumptions based on a lack of knowledge. There's a grey phase of metallica, a white phase of formosa, a black phase of striata. In the US I've only seen the dark blue phase of ornata, but there's another one common in Europe. Regalis is supposed to have 2 or 3 color variations, not surprising as it has the biggest range of any Poec.

OH LOL The white phase formosa and black phase striata slipped my mind there. I've seen photos of them. Grey phase metallica sounds like P. metallica "black", though. Never heard of regalis color forms/phases so I can't comment on that. Supposedly, P. ornata blue exists, but I haven't seen solid evidence of that.

 

[Poec54]

OH LOL The white phase formosa and black phase striata slipped my mind there. I've seen photos of them. Grey phase metallica sounds like P. metallica "black", though. Never heard of regalis color forms/phases so I can't comment on that. Supposedly, P. ornata blue exists, but I haven't seen solid evidence of that.

There is a light grey phase of metallica, that's not due to age. There's a pic or two in the big German Poec book. I've only owned the dark blue ornata, I'd like to get the other colored one. I imagine that Poec populations have been in isolated pockets for hundreds or thousands of years (with continually shrinking forests from the ever-expanding human population). That may be where the color variations are coming from.

With striata and hanuma being similar, as are regalis and rajaei (the only two with belly bands), it may be that some of the Poec species may have split from each other fairly recently (in geological terms). Not everyone is convinced that subfusca and bara are the same species. Who knows, maybe there's more Poec species that will be discovered before they go extinct.

 

[Angel Minkov]

I'd like to own P. rajaei now that you mentioned it, but are they in the hobby at all, yet?

 

[Poec54]

I'd like to own P. rajaei now that you mentioned it, but are they in the hobby at all, yet?

The Sri Lankan government is doing their best to see that they never get exported or captive bred. However, at the same time they're doing nothing to prevent habit destruction, and rajaei may go extinct before we have a chance to save it. Great bureaucratic logic, huh?

 

[Philth]

We're getting off far from the original topic, and it might be worth splitting this into its own thread if a Mod see's this.

Supposedly, P. ornata blue exists, but I haven't seen solid evidence of that.

This was recently discussed on the AB Facebook page. P. ornata "Blue" or light phase as its sometimes referred to is a geographical variation, with a minor difference of the ventral leg banding of leg IV. These were collected in Ratnapura Sri Lanka and according to Andrew Smith, these are actually a closer match to the type specimen then the "normal" hobby P. ornata that were likely collected from Kitulgala. The "blue" tag is a bit of a stretch. At the time when they first appeared in the hobby Blue was a hot thing in the hobby with flashy spiders like P. metallica and L. violaceopes being all the rage demanding high price tags. It seemed like any new spider back then had the word "blue" attached to them in some way lol

There is a light grey phase of metallica, that's not due to age. There's a pic or two in the big German Poec book.

I'll don't remember that, but I'll take a look in the book when I get home. I haven't heard much on color forms of P. regalis either, are any links or references available for that?


The white P. formosa and the black P. straita seem to be solitary examples of these kinds of morphs so far. It's hard for me to believe that its something common out in the wild. It's also unclear if these morphs were from different areas, or just normal hobby stock spiders that were freaks of nature. From what I remember the P. striata was a normal hobby stock spider from normal parents. I don't know about the white P. formosa though, as those guys have collected in India and Sri Lanka.


Later, Tom