P. Murinus Dark form, DCF

[TheraMygale]

So, my dilemma lies in locality. Is there a difference in the dark colour form depending in localities?

I did some research, and some localities seemed to have darker results then others.

I currently have a Mikumi DCF. It is beautiful and living up to expectations. However, I am wondering if it is actualy the darkest colour form I can get?

Is this an actual colour form, or just hybridization?

I love my P. Murinus. I also an RCF. I am genuinely curious about the natural coloir forms. I read old threads of them being sold for 200$ usd. Time has passed and they were available for less. I am wondering if there is darker yet and possibly why? Is it a natural factor, or because of breeding.

 

[Brewser]

There are several factors that can affect the "Looks" of any Species
In this case different locations seem to be at play.
TCF - RCF - OCF - DCF - BCF
Kenya, Mozambique, Usambara, Mikumi, Botswana, Zimbabwe, Kigoma, Tete.
btw... Gotta Like P. Murinus , whatever Color Form?

 

[TheraMygale]

They are my chouchous. An affectionate word in french that means favorite. I thought my N. Color was my favorite, but my P. Murinus have taken the lead. The webbing is just a dream.

All my other Tarantulas are New Worlds that are living the nervous dream of becoming a rock. And I love rocks.

But my two P. Murinus are something else. And their evolution in my care is a gift from the Gods.

 

[Ultum4Spiderz]

So, my dilemma lies in locality. Is there a difference in the dark colour form depending in localities?

I did some research, and some localities seemed to have darker results then others.

I currently have a Mikumi DCF. It is beautiful and living up to expectations. However, I am wondering if it is actualy the darkest colour form I can get?

Is this an actual colour form, or just hybridization?

I love my P. Murinus. I also an RCF. I am genuinely curious about the natural coloir forms. I read old threads of them being sold for 200$ usd. Time has passed and they were available for less. I am wondering if there is darker yet and possibly why? Is it a natural factor, or because of breeding.

Any pics of your P. Murinus,?
On various species this has been discussed but why so many color forms exist I don’t know they just happen to be the same species but different color form location. I’m sure there’s a lot of threads just on this species.

 

[TheraMygale]

Well, this picture is not objective. Nore is from my DCF. It from my RCF, and it definitely portrays their personnality. Just resting there in their hamac…

I will try to take a picture of my DCF. It molted yesterday and is glowing. It needs to be rehomed but is thriving in their current homes. And it is hard to take worthy pics of where it is in.


The picture I chose says it all.

For the record, it was rehoused less then a week ago. And that is the magic it weaved.

 

[Wolfram1]

there is a fantastic post about the different colour forms on here somewhere and i highly reccomend Guy Tansley's bugsnstuff on youtube where they find P. murinus localities/colour forms in the wild

 

[Charliemum]

@Liquifin wasn't it you that made a vid n was talking about the different cf of the obt.....if it wasn't am sorry for tagging lol I watch alot of t channels on utube and it may not have been u

 

[PoisonFangs]

I got mine as a tiny little brown booger, truly I don't know what color will it turn into or if it does even. but can't get my eyes off of it when it is out of its turret.

 

[Charliemum]

I haven't kept them yet but the dcf is on my list for once my son is older. I have never been interested in the rcf but I really love the look of the dcf Mikumi I think they're called, very very pretty spiders .

 

[viper69]

So, my dilemma lies in locality. Is there a difference in the dark colour form depending in localities?

I did some research, and some localities seemed to have darker results then others.

I currently have a Mikumi DCF. It is beautiful and living up to expectations. However, I am wondering if it is actualy the darkest colour form I can get?

Is this an actual colour form, or just hybridization?

I love my P. Murinus. I also an RCF. I am genuinely curious about the natural coloir forms. I read old threads of them being sold for 200$ usd. Time has passed and they were available for less. I am wondering if there is darker yet and possibly why? Is it a natural factor, or because of breeding.

Good question

1. They are naturally occurring- they are NOT due to breeding!

2. Do not breed tarantulas from different localities! No one wants FrankenTs polluting the hobby. Hybrids do not serve the hobby at all

The reason for this is scientists are ALWAYS learning that a widely accepted species is actually 2 species or more due to GENETIC analysis. This recently happened with the anaconda and the orca for example. It happens frequently!

People want to know what they are buying is actually legitimate as best as possible.

No one wants to spend $$$$ on a diamond only to learn it’s cubic zirconia…

 

[TheraMygale]

I definitely want to get what i pay for and have no intentions of hybridizing anything.

I had found old posts about Pterinochilus murinus DCF Botswana/Zimbabwe. Those looked so dark! I love the constrat of dark against the pale in the articulations. They all have a little something special, be it RCF, DCF, TCF… but i really like the dark brown blackish on the OBT’s.

That was why I was curious. I wasnt sure if the DCF were truely something pure. There seems to be quite a few localities and they do not all seem be to available depending on where you get your spiders. And then you throw in BCF into the mix… i trust the place I am getting my spiders. But i can see how this could
be a problem with businesses that do not go the extra mile to make sure they well identify their stock.

I hope if i do get my hands on DCF Botswana, it will be the real thing.

 

[Tbone192]

The reason there are so many "breeds" of OBT ,P murinus, is because the different populations are genetically isolated. This has led to OBT becoming a sort of ring species, or at least analogous. Essentially most subspecies in the ring will be able to produce viable offspring but each subspecies also has a subspecies within the ring which they cannot effectively breed with. This is why breeding the various morphs is taken so seriously, don't want to mess up the genetics and have reproductively non-viable offspring or harmful mutations popping up.

Ring speciation is confusing and much of our understanding comes from amphibian studies. This definitely requires a dedicated team to figure out.

Absolutely addicted to this thread

Pterinochilus murinus Color Forms?

Hello all! I have been looking into P.murinus lately and I have heard of the color forms of the sp, and first off I know it's rare in the invert world, and I was wondering how do the color forms work on the genetic level? Are any dom to the other? Or are they a trait that involves lots of...

arachnoboards.com

 

[viper69]

I definitely want to get what i pay for and have no intentions of hybridizing anything.

I had found old posts about Pterinochilus murinus DCF Botswana/Zimbabwe. Those looked so dark! I love the constrat of dark against the pale in the articulations. They all have a little something special, be it RCF, DCF, TCF… but i really like the dark brown blackish on the OBT’s.

That was why I was curious. I wasnt sure if the DCF were truely something pure. There seems to be quite a few localities and they do not all seem be to available depending on where you get your spiders. And then you throw in BCF into the mix… i trust the place I am getting my spiders. But i can see how this could
be a problem with businesses that do not go the extra mile to make sure they well identify their stock.

I hope if i do get my hands on DCF Botswana, it will be the real thing.

All true

 

[AphonopelmaTX]

The reason for this is scientists are ALWAYS learning that a widely accepted species is actually 2 species or more due to GENETIC analysis. This recently happened with the anaconda and the orca for example. It happens frequently!

The opposite has also been shown to be true in the mygalomorphae when using genes from both nuclear and mitochondrial DNA. Using the CO1 gene from mtDNA in some species of Aphonopelma has shown different evolving lineages (different species), but using genes from nuDNA show the same one and thus a single species. I always felt like to sort out what Pterinochilus murinus actually is there would be a need for a full integrative approach to determine if it is a species complex. That is of course if all of these differently colored P. murinus circulating in the pet trade don't have some kind of striking difference in the morphology hidden somewhere on their bodies that no one has yet to check for.

 

[viper69]

The opposite has also been shown to be true in the mygalomorphae when using genes from both nuclear and mitochondrial DNA. Using the CO1 gene from mtDNA in some species of Aphonopelma has shown different evolving lineages (different species), but using genes from nuDNA show the same one and thus a single species. I always felt like to sort out what Pterinochilus murinus actually is there would be a need for a full integrative approach to determine if it is a species complex. That is of course if all of these differently colored P. murinus circulating in the pet trade don't have some kind of striking difference in the morphology hidden somewhere on their bodies that no one has yet to check for.

I agree a comprehensive approach is needed!

Here’s another recent example of a new species completely under our noses until genomics was involved. There’s a link to the PNAS paper in the link too.

Scientists Discover World's Largest Hummingbird Hiding in Plain Sight

Groundbreaking research has resulted in a surprising split of the species known as the Giant Hummingbird, and one of the birds just happens to be slightly bigger than the other.

www.audubon.org

While I can’t say if some locality Avics would be separate species or not, it would not surprise me if some are.

Hopefully scientists will examine these animals genetically.

 

[Tbone192]

Bird phylogeny is confusing already. What separates eagles, hawks, and kites? Size is one the main factors but there are eagle sized hawks and kite sized eagles!?!? At least genetics paints a pretty clear picture.

 

[TheraMygale]

I managed to get a few shots from my Mikumi DCF. At the moment it is already showing the rich colors.

Birds are easier for me to identify. Even between color forms. Even in flight, i can see differences between hawks and falcons just by their silhouette. And by sound, without seeing.

Spiders, are something else.

That whole locality changes things.

When you buy a P. Murinus and all is specified is DCF, then that can get confusing. And yes, we have a responsability to get as much info as possible from the seller. Is does go down to the genes.

In the end, this is where i am left in my researches: if DCF vs localities, have different shades. I love my Mikumi, and my RCF (oh hello rcf, where do you come from ).

I hope we will know enough in time. And perhaps have exact names that don’t change depending on where you buy them from.

 

[Tbone192]

I managed to get a few shots from my Mikumi DCF. At the moment it is already showing the rich colors.

Birds are easier for me to identify. Even between color forms. Even in flight, i can see differences between hawks and falcons just by their silhouette. And by sound, without seeing.

Spiders, are something else.

That whole locality changes things.

When you buy a P. Murinus and all is specified is DCF, then that can get confusing. And yes, we have a responsability to get as much info as possible from the seller. Is does go down to the genes.

In the end, this is where i am left in my researches: if DCF vs localities, have different shades. I love my Mikumi, and my RCF (oh hello rcf, where do you come from ).

I hope we will know enough in time. And perhaps have exact names that don’t change depending on where you buy them from.

Truly exquisite taste in OBT colour morphs my friend. I too currently have a very nearly mature female RCF and a 4" DCF - Mikumi, both are in my top 3 favourite looking spiders, as one entry ofc...

 

[Ultum4Spiderz]

Truly exquisite taste in OBT colour morphs my friend. I too currently have a very nearly mature female RCF and a 4" DCF - Mikumi, both are in my top 3 favourite looking spiders, as one entry ofc...

I wonder if specific color morphs live longer I had obt and they didn’t live too long. They were small enough to be dwarfs and 80% were males .

 

[TheraMygale]

My P. Murinus are getting very leggy at the moment. They both molted twice in the last two months. I am not going to assume they are males just yet. I will take notes of everything I can, molts, changes, behavior. I am obsessed with research and intend to document everything even if this is no lab and a captivity setting.

I will not be feeding them aggressively. I have no wish to accelerate their growth/shorten their lifespan.

I really enjoy their webbing. It is a work of art. They are active spiders that have big personnalities. When they hunt, it looks like a mini jaguar going in for the kill. If they werent so quick, maybe we might see them shaking their abdomen sideways