Need quick mantis advice - newbie

[Rtessy]

Hey guys! Need some fast advice if possible. I do insect taxidermy, typically on dead specimen, not hard to rehydrate them. One of my coworkers brought me a juvenile praying mantis they caught in a 2 oz cup (how??) and wanted to see if I wanted it. It's been there roughly two hours, but in a heated and humidified room because we actually work at an entomology lab. Despite this, I know very little about insects not in our care.

I was in the process of setting up an isopod container, and honestly I want to try and keep this lil one as a pet. Is it feasible? Will it eat fruit flies at this stage (little over 1" in body size)? What species (we are in Georgia if that helps). I'm leaning towards Chinese mantis but very unsure. Back is also brown, eyes are yellow/green.
I have a 54 quart plastic sweaterbox, a few plastic shoeboxes, and a 10 gallon standard auqarium. Will any of these work? What kind of substrate should I go for, will coconut husk work? What kind of humidity is needed, should I get a humidity gauge? Same questions for temp as humidity.

Ultimately, if this species is not suitable for captivity or a relative beginner (I've kept multiple colonies, mostly of feeder insects, but never singular insects) I will release him in a suitable area. Any and all advice appreciated, thank you!

 

[basin79]

The main thing is the enclosure needs to be at least 3x in height as the mantis is long for when they moult.

There will be loads of care threads on here but a twig/branch/something for the mantis to walk on. Some add mesh to the sides and roof of the enclosure to allow the mantis to easily walk on the sides/roof.

At 1inch fruit flies might be too small. They will eat prekilled food though if offered upto their mouth with tongs.

 

[Rtessy]

The main thing is the enclosure needs to be at least 3x in height as the mantis is long for when they moult.

There will be loads of care threads on here but a twig/branch/something for the mantis to walk on. Some add mesh to the sides and roof of the enclosure to allow the mantis to easily walk on the sides/roof.

At 1inch fruit flies might be too small. They will eat prekilled food though if offered upto their mouth with tongs.

Awesome thank you, I can do that!! I forgot to mention, in setting up for isopods I cut out large sections of the sweaterbox/shoeboxe lids and am in the process of putting in cheesecloth instead. I do have some pieces of mopani wood that are arthropod safe, but unfortunately won't be able to get to those until this weekend. Might pick more up.

What food do you recommend at this size? I've got 12" tweezers for feeding so I can definitely do prekilled food lol. I'm planning on leaving for PetSmart soon (sadly only local store that stocks live food). Adding mesh to the sides is a good idea, thanks! Also, would coconut husk work for substrate if they're not picky?

Arrg, due to the pandemic they only have crickets in right now and won't get more feeders till Thursday. I'll run and grab some, he's been captive for about 3 hours and pooped once, hopefully that means recently eaten. How long can they go without food?

 

[basin79]

Some state crickets causes issues in mantids. I've always used them though and a breeder here in the UK uses them. I used to feed my Hierodula and Rhombodera mantids crickets, morioworms and waxworms mainly.

When smaller it'd be crickets, mealworms and waxworms mainly.

Mantids also LOVE organic honey as a treat. I'd feed them honey a couple of days after moulting for a boost. You can use something like a plastic toothpick to offer it to them. Once you dap a tiny bit on their mouth they'll start to eat it.

I just used to use a few paper towels layered on the bottom as they're absorbent and easy to change. Mantids crap a lot.

 

[Rtessy]

Some state crickets causes issues in mantids. I've always used them though and a breeder here in the UK uses them. I used to feed my Hierodula and Rhombodera mantids crickets, morioworms and waxworms mainly.

When smaller it'd be crickets, mealworms and waxworms mainly.

Mantids also LOVE organic honey as a treat. I'd feed them honey a couple of days after moulting for a boost. You can use something like a plastic toothpick to offer it to them. Once you dap a tiny bit on their mouth they'll start to eat it.

I just used to use a few paper towels layered on the bottom as they're absorbent and easy to change. Mantids crap a lot.

Thank you so much! They actually did have waxworms, only large though, ugh, so I'll just cut them before feeding. Great to know about honey! We feed half the insects at the lab honey but it didn't even cross my mind. Grabbed crickets too, just in case

 

[basin79]

Thank you so much! They actually did have waxworms, only large though, ugh, so I'll just cut them before feeding. Great to know about honey! We feed half the insects at the lab honey but it didn't even cross my mind. Grabbed crickets too, just in case

If you crush the head of a waxworm I'd imagine the mantis will manage. There will be a yellow fluid when you do though. They also have 2 clear organs or structures inside them. They actually look and feel like plastic. That's normal.

 

[Rtessy]

Success with the waxworm! Poor little guy can only hold like 1/20th of the wax worm at a time. Vibing on the side cloth, he must really like your suggestion lol

Ah, didn't see your reply first. I'm used to freezing insects, just froze it and chopped it up. Will feed more later
So far I've fed 2/20 roughly of the wax worm, it was a massive one tho, like an inch and a half. They only had big wax worms and crickets in stock lol.

 

[Rtessy]

Took some pics, let me know if there needs to be more ventilation! The cheesecloth is pretty thick over the top. About half the sides have some mesh, underside of the lid all has mesh.

Haha also this little dude stole my tweezers on the first feeding attempt, grabbed on, and started running up real fast
Middle pic is just the dude vibin
And last pic is him eating part of a wax worm!

 

[InvertsandOi]

One thing I would add is that you can keep an eye on it's abdomen to determine if it needs to eat. Fat abdomen = good for now. Skinny abdomen = hungry mantis.

 

[Rtessy]

One thing I would add is that you can keep an eye on it's abdomen to determine if it needs to eat. Fat abdomen = good for now. Skinny abdomen = hungry mantis.

Good to know, thanks!

 

[Rtessy]

He hasn't really moved for the past couple hours, is this a warning sign of some sort? He is still hanging onto the side like in the pictures. The light isn't currently on, is he just sleeping? Thanks.

 

[MrGhostMantis]

First, that enclosure is much to large, I would downsize to a 32oz deli cup. Next, that appears to be a Stagmomantis conspurcata, what part of the US are you in? Next, get yourself some fruit flies from a petco as quick as you can or order some online, wax worms are too fatty to be a complete diet. I’ll get you a proper example of a fat and flat abdomen when I’m feeding my mantids tomorrow. They stand still for a long time, they aren’t the most active creatures but it’s great to watch them hunt. Don’t use crickets, they can carry bacteria and parasites that mantids aren’t designed to ward off. They are much more sensitive than spiders.

 

[Rtessy]

First, that enclosure is much to large, I would downsize to a 32oz deli cup. Next, that appears to be a Stagmomantis conspurcata, what part of the US are you in? Next, get yourself some fruit flies from a petco as quick as you can or order some online, wax worms are too fatty to be a complete diet. I’ll get you a proper example of a fat and flat abdomen when I’m feeding my mantids tomorrow. They stand still for a long time, they aren’t the most active creatures but it’s great to watch them hunt. Don’t use crickets, they can carry bacteria and parasites that mantids aren’t designed to ward off. They are much more sensitive than spiders.

What would downsizing do? He's from a significantly larger area than the tub, I don't trust myself to properly mist such a small space without misting him or overmisting. Is it for finding food properly?

From Georgia, I added it in the first post, but I know that was a bit of word vomit. I'm split between Carolina vs Chinese, I'm in a pretty big city and he was retrieved from a car so I'm leaning Chinese, just because Carolina seems to have mostly been knocked out of big cities by the invasive. If he ends up being native, he's going back to the ~wild~ lol. I've got a good section of the Greenway nearby, I'll release there. Well, as good as you'll get in the middle of a city. Better than a car at any rate.

Will do for fruit flies, none are in the area, they may potentially get some in on Thursday, but it may take till the weekend. For larger stages/potentially now, are blue bottle flies or green bottle flies better once fruit flies are outgrown? Or would you recommend a different type of food? Also how often do you feed, I've seen a LOT of conflicting information?
I'd love to see pics of hungry vs fed abdomen, thanks!!

 

[basin79]

What would downsizing do? He's from a significantly larger area than the tub, I don't trust myself to properly mist such a small space without misting him or overmisting. Is it for finding food properly?

From Georgia, I added it in the first post, but I know that was a bit of word vomit. I'm split between Carolina vs Chinese, I'm in a pretty big city and he was retrieved from a car so I'm leaning Chinese, just because Carolina seems to have mostly been knocked out of big cities by the invasive. If he ends up being native, he's going back to the ~wild~ lol. I've got a good section of the Greenway nearby, I'll release there. Well, as good as you'll get in the middle of a city. Better than a car at any rate.

Will do for fruit flies, none are in the area, they may potentially get some in on Thursday, but it may take till the weekend. For larger stages/potentially now, are blue bottle flies or green bottle flies better once fruit flies are outgrown? Or would you recommend a different type of food? Also how often do you feed, I've seen a LOT of conflicting information?
I'd love to see pics of hungry vs fed abdomen, thanks!!

Enclosure size for a mantis is just down to making sure they actually get the chance to catch their food. I always start nymphs in an adult enclosure because I actually stand there and wait until they catch their prey.

Blue/green bottles would work. If you can buy natural casters you can keep them in the fridge and just keep so many out to hatch. I used to buy them for jumping spiders. If the mantis is an inch long green bottles will be fine now.

For feeding you just literally need to look at their abdomen. After they've had a good meal you'll see it glump right up. Then over the next days you'll see it going thinner. So you feed again.

 

[MrGhostMantis]

Enclosure size for a mantis is just down to making sure they actually get the chance to catch their food. I always start nymphs in an adult enclosure because I actually stand there and wait until they catch their prey.

Blue/green bottles would work. If you can buy natural casters you can keep them in the fridge and just keep so many out to hatch. I used to buy them for jumping spiders. If the mantis is an inch long green bottles will be fine now.

For feeding you just literally need to look at their abdomen. After they've had a good meal you'll see it glump right up. Then over the next days you'll see it going thinner. So you feed again.

It looks a bit small for blue bottles, I would say house flies. The one reason I don’t start them in their adult enclosures is:

If they fall while molting, it’s gonna be game over every time.

 

[MrGhostMantis]

What would downsizing do? He's from a significantly larger area than the tub, I don't trust myself to properly mist such a small space without misting him or overmisting. Is it for finding food properly?

From Georgia, I added it in the first post, but I know that was a bit of word vomit. I'm split between Carolina vs Chinese, I'm in a pretty big city and he was retrieved from a car so I'm leaning Chinese, just because Carolina seems to have mostly been knocked out of big cities by the invasive. If he ends up being native, he's going back to the ~wild~ lol. I've got a good section of the Greenway nearby, I'll release there. Well, as good as you'll get in the middle of a city. Better than a car at any rate.

Will do for fruit flies, none are in the area, they may potentially get some in on Thursday, but it may take till the weekend. For larger stages/potentially now, are blue bottle flies or green bottle flies better once fruit flies are outgrown? Or would you recommend a different type of food? Also how often do you feed, I've seen a LOT of conflicting information?
I'd love to see pics of hungry vs fed abdomen, thanks!!

I would say it is definitely a S. conspurcata then. Chinese don’t get those colors and have an altogether different abdomen arch and thorax shape along with smaller heads.

 

[basin79]

It looks a bit small for blue bottles, I would say house flies. The one reason I don’t start them in their adult enclosures is:

If they fall while molting, it’s gonna be game over every time.

That's why I put if the mantis is an inch long green bottles would be ideal.

That's a fair point regarding a fall but any drop whilst moulting and if you're not there the mantis is likely to be buggered anyway.

 

[MrGhostMantis]

That's why I put if the mantis is an inch long green bottles would be ideal.

That's a fair point regarding a fall but any drop whilst moulting and if you're not there the mantis is likely to be buggered anyway.

I’ve found most falls happen when the mantids’ back legs are coming out, some mismolts are salvageable. Especially ones regarding legs which are most common.

 

[basin79]

I’ve found most falls happen when the mantids’ back legs are coming out, some mismolts are salvageable. Especially ones regarding legs which are most common.

Again though that's if you're there to help them. If they crumple and harden the poor buggers are knackered.

But if they do fall and don't harden too wrong then absolutely.

 

[MrGhostMantis]

That’s basically my point, the less space they have to fall, the less chance to completely crumple.