Is my tarantula sick?

[WhyamIlikethis]

Never this. I cannot think of a single instance where this would actually help a tarantula.

While in most cases I agree not to do this it did save my tarantula that was stuck in a molt
EDIT: I was reached out to by some one and had a really nice conversation with them (not sure if they want me to say who they are so I'll keep it anonymous unless they ask me to credit them) and it has come to my attention that I made my statement a little unclear and it is very easy for someone to misunderstand. so just for some clarification, I do not recommend the ICU method as pretty much anything that it does could be done in the original enclosure and (especially if it is in there because of a molt) can stress out or even harm the animal. If I was in the situation where my T was stuck in a molt now I would not use the ICU method again. this happened a while ago and the only information I was given on stuck molts was to use the ICU method and being a new tarantula keeper, I didn't question it. hope that this clears things up! and once again thank you to the person that reached out to me for being kind and respectful you're the kind of people I like to see in this hobby.

 

[slocoj91]

While in most cases I agree not to do this it did save my tarantula that was stuck in a molt

The ICU concept is over used and over referenced, being the optimum approach in very specific circumstances. Outside of that situation, there is no benefit that an ICU can provide which cannot be accomplished in the tarantula's usual enclosure. If this weren't the case then there would be a pretty major husbandry issue occurring across the hobby.

With that in mind, it's useful to consider how statements we make will be received - in this case you say the ICU saved your tarantula, who was stuck in a moult. How? I'm not trying to be difficult, mind, simply have you think about what you know of tarantula husbandry and how their bodies work - or learn some useful information on the topic. So what exactly about the ICU environment do you believe helped?

For reference, for the OP of this thread as well, the idea of using an ICU was recommended in The Tarantula Keeper's Guide - I believe from the first edition. By the third edition, the newest that has been published*, the ICU was for use in the event that the original enclosure of the tarantula is believed to be the cause of the issue. And rectifying the problem is not possible with the tarantula in situ. So the idea is to create a small safe place with 'optimal' conditions - quickly - to temporarily contain the individual and treat, aid, troubleshoot the issues where the suspected initial cause cannot continue to be a problem. Once they are believed to be stable the goal is to have an appropriate enclosure prepared in which they can continue to recover. I believe there's also a recommendation to have a 'spare' enclosure set up in a few sizes (if possible), which in theory minimises the need to use an ICU at all. The concept could also be useful if a moulting issue occurs in which a keeper decides they need to try to intervene - essentially a soft, moist environment where containing the tarantula is made easy and visibility of the parts involved is going to be better. But once any intervention is carried out they really want to go back to their familiar environment.

I'll leave this there though, as I mostly wanted to clarify the idea behind using an ICU, and that it's entirely intended - really - as a holding area or even 'catch-cup', but with additions that help to stabilise a tarantula in less than ideal health. Usually we cup from one enclosure and the tarantula is released straight into the pre-prepared new enclosure, in the event that that isn't possible the ICU idea helps to make sure that any time spent cupped isn't contributing to a problem.

* BUT which is now rather dated and so includes outdated information, with a considerable quantity of addenda noted by the author - which could be found, in the past, on the UofCalgary micro-site that the author hosted but this was down the last time I checked

 

[WhyamIlikethis]

The ICU concept is over used and over referenced, being the optimum approach in very specific circumstances. Outside of that situation, there is no benefit that an ICU can provide which cannot be accomplished in the tarantula's usual enclosure. If this weren't the case then there would be a pretty major husbandry issue occurring across the hobby.

With that in mind, it's useful to consider how statements we make will be received - in this case you say the ICU saved your tarantula, who was stuck in a moult. How? I'm not trying to be difficult, mind, simply have you think about what you know of tarantula husbandry and how their bodies work - or learn some useful information on the topic. So what exactly about the ICU environment do you believe helped?

For reference, for the OP of this thread as well, the idea of using an ICU was recommended in The Tarantula Keeper's Guide - I believe from the first edition. By the third edition, the newest that has been published*, the ICU was for use in the event that the original enclosure of the tarantula is believed to be the cause of the issue. And rectifying the problem is not possible with the tarantula in situ. So the idea is to create a small safe place with 'optimal' conditions - quickly - to temporarily contain the individual and treat, aid, troubleshoot the issues where the suspected initial cause cannot continue to be a problem. Once they are believed to be stable the goal is to have an appropriate enclosure prepared in which they can continue to recover. I believe there's also a recommendation to have a 'spare' enclosure set up in a few sizes (if possible), which in theory minimises the need to use an ICU at all. The concept could also be useful if a moulting issue occurs in which a keeper decides they need to try to intervene - essentially a soft, moist environment where containing the tarantula is made easy and visibility of the parts involved is going to be better. But once any intervention is carried out they really want to go back to their familiar environment.

I'll leave this there though, as I mostly wanted to clarify the idea behind using an ICU, and that it's entirely intended - really - as a holding area or even 'catch-cup', but with additions that help to stabilise a tarantula in less than ideal health. Usually we cup from one enclosure and the tarantula is released straight into the pre-prepared new enclosure, in the event that that isn't possible the ICU idea helps to make sure that any time spent cupped isn't contributing to a problem.

* BUT which is now rather dated and so includes outdated information, with a considerable quantity of addenda noted by the author - which could be found, in the past, on the UofCalgary micro-site that the author hosted but this was down the last time I checked

I personally do not think the ICU method should be used however there are a few reasons that it could be. for example, the reason I used the ICU method was due to the fact that I had gone on vacation for a week. I didn't bump up the humidity enough for the species which was a goliath bird eater of some sort. and I returned to find that she had molted and was stuck. I put her into a plastic shoe box enclosure for a few hours and after the molt had softened I took her out and let her pull off the skin (it was only on her legs) looking back I should have explained what it helped with and that it still wasn't something I recommended as someone could have easily interpreted as me saying it was safe. If it had happened to me now I would have just increased the humidity in the enclosure but this was what I was told to do. sorry for any miscommunication. I hope you have a good day

 

[WhyamIlikethis]

Also, I'm autistic and have a lot of trouble with my tone, how to say things, and what to say. Combined that with text and you have a recipe for disaster of misunderstandings.

 

[slocoj91]

I personally do not think the ICU method should be used however there are a few reasons that it could be. for example, the reason I used the ICU method was due to the fact that I had gone on vacation for a week. I didn't bump up the humidity enough for the species which was a goliath bird eater of some sort. and I returned to find that she had molted and was stuck. I put her into a plastic shoe box enclosure for a few hours and after the molt had softened I took her out and let her pull off the skin (it was only on her legs) looking back I should have explained what it helped with and that it still wasn't something I recommended as someone could have easily interpreted as me saying it was safe. If it had happened to me now I would have just increased the humidity in the enclosure but this was what I was told to do. sorry for any miscommunication. I hope you have a good day

Also, I'm autistic and have a lot of trouble with my tone, how to say things, and what to say. Combined that with text and you have a recipe for disaster of misunderstandings.

If it was recommended to you, I know there's only so much you feel you can check before taking action, and I understand why you did so in that instance. I appreciate the note re. not recommending their use, I'm just painfully aware of the way people often interpret things. So what you wrote would result in people thinking it couldn't hurt to try, because even though you don't recommend the use of an ICU *using an ICU was the sole reason your tarantula lived* (in their eyes, and most won't consider it circumstantially - i.e. that you didn't realise the same could be accomplished in the original enclosure). Some will take it to mean there's an implication that they aren't competent enough to utilise a certain method. Lot's of silliness, frankly. I mostly mentioned it because, and I suspect you may see this the same way, I prefer not to encourage over-eager keepers to relocate a tarantula into an environment that could do more harm than good - with the risk of that being the case appearing to increase exponentially with the magnitude of over-eagerness involved. End up with people trying to shift a napping tarantula who then bolts or strikes, or simply risking dropping a moulting spider. Which really is painful to think of in contrast to the keepers I've encountered - old and new - who insist a fall of several feet is no big deal for their overfed terrestrial, or "haven't ever had an issue"/"they never climb up there" when it comes to enclosures with those risky mesh tops.

Regarding the matter of whether increasing the humidity at the time of moulting helps or not - the jury is out. Most of what I've read from long time hobbyists focuses on hydration being the main factor, with scepticism regarding increased humidity at the time of the moult occurring. There's a lack of research, and of course in situations like your own there's no opportunity to see if the moult would have gone the exact same way had you not intervened. The areas that were stuck would be unlikely to have had the exuvia dry out, as they would still have had the moulting fluid in contact with the area in question. We don't know nearly enough about how all these processes work to be able to say with confidence that increasing the humidity during the moulting process actually helps. However, it is something to do, and sometimes as keepers we like to feel we might be doing something constructive. That's how I see it, anyway.

Oh, for what it's worth, I'm 'on the spectrum' too. Which means I can be blunt, sometimes read as 'harsh', without meaning to be. I did understand what you were saying in your post, I mostly wanted to warn that not everyone will read it the same. Mostly, the people who end up here panicking about something wrong with their tarantula will simply see 'an ICU saved my spider' and that will be that. I hate that that's the situation, but it is what it is!

 

[WhyamIlikethis]

and I suspect you may see this the same way

Yes, I absolutely agree!

 

[WhyamIlikethis]

Regarding the matter of whether increasing the humidity at the time of moulting helps or not - the jury is out

Oh! I never knew that. I thought it was just something people agreed with. I'll do some more research on it. also thank you for reaching out and responding nicely and taking the time to talk to me instead of just assuming what I meant.

 

[MariaLewisia]

I have to agree with old age. Poor thing. How is she today? Any improvement? Decline?

 

[AlmondEyedRooh]

I have to agree with old age. Poor thing. How is she today? Any improvement? Decline?

UPDATE: After this post, I have kept her at home. I was thinking maybe my classroom this year was too loud for her liking. She was doing a bit better and was more active as she was moving around in her enclosure. She would not eat but would still drink water. I noticed a few days ago (left her in this position as to not stress her out) she went into the corner of the enclosure and tucked herself in there. Finally, I decided to lightly tap her with a brush on her back abdomen and she responded by moving her legs… lethargically. I took her out and tried to drip some water directly into her mouth… but she is barely taking any of it in. Here are pictures of her now… I think she may be dying of old age as it hit the 4 year mark now and she hasn’t molted and I do not know her previous history.

Awww bless her see not only did you give her a home but she was an ambassador too if she taught your students . She may have had an unknown start but now she was loved and will be remembered by not only you but all those people that she taught too .
Keep us updated please I hope I am wrong and she is just dehydrated... I will be keeping my fingers crossed for both of you.

Hi! I just posted an update about Tomoe Gozen (my GBB girl). She’s still alive and kicking but much much muuuuuch slower. I think you may be right; she looks in good health but is just slowing down significantly.

 

[Charliemum]

Hi! I just posted an update about Tomoe Gozen (my GBB girl). She’s still alive and kicking but much much muuuuuch slower. I think you may be right; she looks in good health but is just slowing down significantly.

I just read it , I am glad she is no longer in the curl and that will live out her life with someone that cares so much for her. I think after her unknown start and then being a busy ambassador she will appreciate the peaceful environment. Thank you for updating us on her progress, people often don't and we are left wondering, it's good to know we helped even if it was only a little or even just to help with understanding the situation you found yourselves in, it's why ab is here, so we can help these magnificent creatures

 

[AlmondEyedRooh]

I just read it , I am glad she is no longer in the curl and that will live out her life with someone that cares so much for her. I think after her unknown start and then being a busy ambassador she will appreciate the peaceful environment. Thank you for updating us on her progress, people often don't and we are left wondering, it's good to know we helped even if it was only a little or even just to help with understanding the situation you found yourselves in, it's why ab is here, so we can help these magnificent creatures

Thank you for caring and your kindness. I really appreciate it.

 

[Charliemum]

Thank you for caring and your kindness. I really appreciate it.

You are very welcome

 

[cold blood]

I took her out and tried to drip some water directly into her mouth… but she is barely taking any of it in

ts drink very slowly....its almost imperceptible.