I Want Everyone's Input On This!!!

massmorels

Arachnobaron
Old Timer
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Mar 3, 2007
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336
Hey folks.. Im looking for thoughts, concerns, and opinions.. good and/or bad.

I just got ahold of 9 Poecilotheria fasciata slings (about 1 in.) and I have a juvenile female (3.5-4 in.). Instead of selling off these slings I am considering starting a colony of all 9 in a 20 gal. long stood upright. The purpose of this is to finally have some good research of a closely documented, and photographed, breeding colony of a Poecilotheria species. I know that there will be a few males that will be prematured compared to the females. Which is where the large female I have comes into play. However, I have mated sub-adult female Avis with mature males and had immediate success.
Heres a few questions Im pondering on that you guys can help me with..

Should I do this project, or sell the slings for $25ea. or 5 for $100, or a combination of both?

If I do this project, should I go ahead and put all 9 slings together in this tank to grow up communally or keep them individualized? (pokies are a communal sp.)

If I start a colony, do I include the larger female with them or breed her seperately on the side?

When sex is determined in the colony, do I seperate the males to better monitor the mating attempts.. or let them do it as they please?

should I turn one of my spare rooms into a "jungle environment" with a fogger and humidifier.. and just let all the fasciatas run it and go wild in there.. and never go in there unless its to let a bunch of mice go as food? ~that's be sweet!~

THANKS AHEAD OF TIME FOR ANY INPUT YOU MAY HAVE!!! And feel free to ask any questions of your own if you have any...

THE COLONY SETUP - thinking of using an upright 100 gallon tank instead..


 

green_bottle_04

Arachnobaron
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i say go for the colony. but dont put that bigger female in with the slings. just start a colony with all slings.
 

Alice

Arachnoangel
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i'd say: sell them or keep them individually. because:

1. if you keep them together, there is a 99% chance of cannibalism, even if every sling is offered a hide of it's own. yes, even with pokies. i know a few people who tried it, and none of them succeeded keeping them together for several years without losing some to their brethren's appetite. a waste of beautiful ts in my opinion.

2. the tank is too big for the slings and too small once they are adults. you'll have to keep it literally swarmed with pinheads if you want the slings to find their food, thus risking the crix attacking molting specimen.

3. the bigger female will most certainly eat the slings. i see no chance of successfully introducing her into a tank with much smaller specimen.

4. it is very probable that the males will mature before the females. as you cannot control the amount of food every sling gets in a communal tank, it is very likely that you will get no or very few sacs from this setup. i know that sometimes quite small females are able to produce sacs, but ime pokie males mature VERY fast. and btw, all females capable of reproduction are adults ;) - 'adult' is a matter of sexual maturity, not of size (in biology at least).

hope i could help and state my reasons understandably. my english is a bit bad :eek:
 

DrAce

Arachnodemon
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I say they're your spiders, you decide. But I'd personally be reluctant to include the older bigger female in with the spiderlings; there may be an increased risk of predation by the older female on the little ones.

If it were me, I'd keep them all separately.
 

Lorgakor

Arachnomom
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I agree, do not put the female in there, she will most likely eat all of the slings. Are all the slings sac mates? From what I understand, siblings will do better communally than unrelated slings. With pokies, it is quite possible that the males and females will mature at a similar speed. A 20 gallon may be too large to start with, they seem to do better when actually sharing hiding spaces as opposed to each having their own. When they each have their own space they are more likely to view a passing sibling as a meal rather than a tank mate.

I haven't done this myself so I'm only going by what I've read and from what I've been told by a pokie breeder in the UK. Good luck with it!:)
 

massmorels

Arachnobaron
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of course Im going to decide in the end.. I just want to hear other's opinions and take into consideration the issues that I have not yet thought of.
I agree, the large female is a bad introduction and will be mated on the side.
And, Im not too hip on the idea of trying to move 9 sub-adult pokies from one tank to another. Perhaps a larger tank with only one tall hide..
thank you everyone for your input thus far.. your English was fine, no worries.

I could sell you 5 for $100 and do this project with 4 I suppose.. but then theres less chance of a probable mating trio..
 

Mina

Arachnoking
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Well, keeping in mind they are yours to do with as you choose, I will answer becasue you asked for opinions.
I wouldn't do it. Period.
I'm not comfortable with any risk to the life of any T. I know, I'm strange. But my T's are my kids and I care about all of them, I couldn't put them at any kind of risk beyond the possibility of SSD (sudden sling death) which we can't control anyway.
Bad time to ask anyway MM. I lost a A. avic sling this week.
 

massmorels

Arachnobaron
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sorry to hear that Mina.. but with every death, comes birth. Males get eaten by the females alot of the time just to procreate. Its the natural cycle of life.. but with that one death, comes the birth of 80 slings. So, I guess the real question is,"Is it worth it?" He's going to die very soon anyways.. why not use that death to create life?
 

Alice

Arachnoangel
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i think mina was talking about the chance of the slings/juvies/subadults cannibalizing each other. ;)
and believe it or not, even with siblings and any setup you choose there is a risk of cannibalism. a friend of mine for example had three regalis together for over a year. then, suddenly, one of the two females decided to eat the other, smaller one - even though they were from the same sac and he provided lots of food.
 

phil jones

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my head says sale them $$$ / my heart says have a go at it / in the end its your decision what do i know lol --- phil
 

massmorels

Arachnobaron
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I know she was referring to cannabilism.. this isnt my first breeding attempt. I had a colony of Avi avis from sling to adult. in the end I had 1 female and 2 males.. she produced 2 successful sacs before being eaten my one of the males. many times the sacs are just so large and unmanageable some cannabilism needs to be allowed to get the slings down to a reasonable number. I myself have never needed to resort to this, but many of the online dealers/breeders most of you buy your Ts from have.
 

Scott C.

Arachnofloater
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Do it up. Keep track. Take pics. Post findings..... I'd be interested in your posts.

As for opinion.... I wouldn't do a cohab project with pokies.
 

monitormonster

Arachnoknight
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Mar 12, 2007
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I would just sell the babies....

There is already plenty of folks out there who have tried this to some extent and have all experienced significant cannibalism. IMO, it's not worth it
 

KJE

Arachnoangel
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I wouldn't do it! I have only heard about bad experiences with it.

I have a friend that had 2 A. avics together. The male grew faster than the female and ended up eating the female because she was smaller than him.

Not to mention the headache of transferring them to a bigger enclosure as they grow and doing maintenance.
 

cheetah13mo

Arachnoking
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I wouldn't do it either. Although it would be an intersting read to see what happens, The majority of T's are not communal nor could they be and so this experiment would be extremely limited. In my opinion the info, though interesting, would not be of much use.
 

green_bottle_04

Arachnobaron
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we all know there will be loses due to cannibalism. that is part of establishing a colony. but eventually the colony DOES become established. there are tons of reports of cannibalism in the beginning but the colony still thrives,eventually breeds, etc. yes, without a doubt loses will be experienced but its totally worth it IMO, but then again i dont get attached to my spiders. to me they are just bugs and i keep them for various reasons includeing visual apprearance, studying, etc. etc. think about it...seeing a tank full of adult poecilotheria faciata, metallica, subfucha, ornata, etc. would be an incredible sight...even those who arent for it cannot say that it wouldnt be an amazing thing to see.
 

massmorels

Arachnobaron
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Im not talking about "most Ts".. Im talking about Poecilotheria fasciatas which ARE indeed communal.

pics from - http://www.poeci.info/bilder.htm




and it took less time than I thought.. Ive decided.
4 will live communally in a 2.5 to 5 gallon tank until they need to be moved into larger quarters. 5 will remain individualized for sale and/or side mating. 5 for $100 btw.. I will document and photograph every molt, sperm web, and mating attempt I can. And in the end.. I will have documented proof of what happens in both scenerios, good and bad.
Thanks everyone for your input.. keep it coming, because I plan to.
 
Last edited:

Mina

Arachnoking
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i think mina was talking about the chance of the slings/juvies/subadults cannibalizing each other. ;)
and believe it or not, even with siblings and any setup you choose there is a risk of cannibalism. a friend of mine for example had three regalis together for over a year. then, suddenly, one of the two females decided to eat the other, smaller one - even though they were from the same sac and he provided lots of food.
Alice is right, MM. That is what I meant. I agree with you on your other point. I knew when I sent my GBB male out he wouldn't be coming back, it was painful, he was my favorite T. I'm not sorry though. He died doing what he wanted to do. If I had kept him here he would have lived a few months longer, true, but for what? So he could wander around and around his viv, searching for something he would never find? Yes, I wanted and still hope for babies, but I know he was much happier than if he hadn't had the chance to breed.
Thanks so much for the sympathy.
 

TJPotter

Arachnopeon
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Feb 1, 2007
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Why not focus on breeding the female, and use some slings from her sac?

Just an idea...:)

T
 
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