how to prevent Matriphagy?

invertebrateguy

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So I have 2 adult female black lace weavers and one subadult male.
I am planning to breed them but I don't want the whole eat the mother alive thing to happen
so does anyone know how to prevent matriphagy in black lace weavers? 2023-09-27-163407.jpg
 

Tbone192

Arachnobaron
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So I have 2 adult female black lace weavers and one subadult male.
I am planning to breed them but I don't want the whole eat the mother alive thing to happen
so does anyone know how to prevent matriphagy in black lace weavers? View attachment 456804
Since this is a behavior they evolved it may not be so simple. The female might still be "wired" to keep drumming until she perishes. I believe if you remove the mother from that enclosure about 24hrs after the slings hatch, she may survive. Swap her out with a similar sized prekill feeder. If you poke at it very gently with a brush or piece of grass every now and then. The young might sense it and move towards it thinking it is their mother.

The trick is that the mother lays unfertilized eggs for the slings to eat when they hatch, this satiates them for a little while. After the first day or so she starts to drum so her young know where she is. The slings know that mom=food and so they move towards her. Initially she will fend off the first couple of slings but this attracts more babies, and at some point she just lets them eat her.

Truly a horrific yet noble and creative way to care for their young. It's sweet that the mother is willing to sacrifice herself in order to increase the chances of her youngs survival, the slings are truly quite horrifying though. Can you be scared of babies? I know I am now.

Let us know how it goes
 

Tentacle Toast

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Since this is a behavior they evolved it may not be so simple. The female might still be "wired" to keep drumming until she perishes. I believe if you remove the mother from that enclosure about 24hrs after the slings hatch, she may survive. Swap her out with a similar sized prekill feeder. If you poke at it very gently with a brush or piece of grass every now and then. The young might sense it and move towards it thinking it is their mother.

The trick is that the mother lays unfertilized eggs for the slings to eat when they hatch, this satiates them for a little while. After the first day or so she starts to drum so her young know where she is. The slings know that mom=food and so they move towards her. Initially she will fend off the first couple of slings but this attracts more babies, and at some point she just lets them eat her.

Truly a horrific yet noble and creative way to care for their young. It's sweet that the mother is willing to sacrifice herself in order to increase the chances of her youngs survival, the slings are truly quite horrifying though. Can you be scared of babies? I know I am now.

Let us know how it goes
Beautiful.
 

invertebrateguy

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Since this is a behavior they evolved it may not be so simple. The female might still be "wired" to keep drumming until she perishes. I believe if you remove the mother from that enclosure about 24hrs after the slings hatch, she may survive. Swap her out with a similar sized prekill feeder. If you poke at it very gently with a brush or piece of grass every now and then. The young might sense it and move towards it thinking it is their mother.

The trick is that the mother lays unfertilized eggs for the slings to eat when they hatch, this satiates them for a little while. After the first day or so she starts to drum so her young know where she is. The slings know that mom=food and so they move towards her. Initially she will fend off the first couple of slings but this attracts more babies, and at some point she just lets them eat her.

Truly a horrific yet noble and creative way to care for their young. It's sweet that the mother is willing to sacrifice herself in order to increase the chances of her youngs survival, the slings are truly quite horrifying though. Can you be scared of babies? I know I am now.

Let us know how it goes
Thanks for the information I will try your advice. Also I am 90% sure that my black lace weavers are not mature yet. Some good news is that i have found some more in my backyard. Also, What feeder do you think i should try crickets, hornworms, or something else?
 

SpookySpooder

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Truly a horrific yet noble and creative way to care for their young. It's sweet that the mother is willing to sacrifice herself in order to increase the chances of her youngs survival
Other spiders wrap up a moth or cricket and leave it uneaten in the web, but hey, you do you.

Beautiful.
I heard human kids do the same thing. They just do it over 30 years and slowly to your finances.
 

Tbone192

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Thanks for the information I will try your advice. Also I am 90% sure that my black lace weavers are not mature yet. Some good news is that i have found some more in my backyard. Also, What feeder do you think i should try crickets, hornworms, or something else?
Those both seem like good options. As long as it is prekilled I don't think you should have any issues. Maybe avoid beetles and grasshoppers as they have very strong chitin armor. Beetle larvae should work great though. Try finding something plump and on the softer side. Just in case the slings have a hard time sinking their fangs into it.
 

invertebrateguy

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Those both seem like good options. As long as it is prekilled I don't think you should have any issues. Maybe avoid beetles and grasshoppers as they have very strong chitin armor. Beetle larvae should work great though. Try finding something plump and on the softer side. Just in case the slings have a hard time sinking their fangs into it.
something i found out that may be a problem is that when the mother is separated from her egg sack she will lay a second one i guess it may give me a second chance if the first one isn't good
 

Tbone192

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something i found out that may be a problem is that when the mother is separated from her egg sack she will lay a second one i guess it may give me a second chance if the first one isn't good
That makes sense. She may just be at a point in her life where her biology is telling her to produce offspring and perish. If she is removed about a day after the eggs hatch, I wonder if that would work? She may not lay another clutch as long as she is in the same enclosure as her young when they hatch. Keep us updated this is really interesting and cool.
 

invertebrateguy

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That makes sense. She may just be at a point in her life where her biology is telling her to produce offspring and perish. If she is removed about a day after the eggs hatch, I wonder if that would work? She may not lay another clutch as long as she is in the same enclosure as her young when they hatch. Keep us updated this is really interesting and cool.
I don’t know if she won’t or will lay a second clutch but from my information she most likely will lay another clutch.
one thing that I may try with the second clutch is I may try to make it so there not sub social but permanently social, but I don’t think that it would work to make them social Forever. but I will try
 

Ultum4Spiderz

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Since this is a behavior they evolved it may not be so simple. The female might still be "wired" to keep drumming until she perishes. I believe if you remove the mother from that enclosure about 24hrs after the slings hatch, she may survive. Swap her out with a similar sized prekill feeder. If you poke at it very gently with a brush or piece of grass every now and then. The young might sense it and move towards it thinking it is their mother.

The trick is that the mother lays unfertilized eggs for the slings to eat when they hatch, this satiates them for a little while. After the first day or so she starts to drum so her young know where she is. The slings know that mom=food and so they move towards her. Initially she will fend off the first couple of slings but this attracts more babies, and at some point she just lets them eat her.

Truly a horrific yet noble and creative way to care for their young. It's sweet that the mother is willing to sacrifice herself in order to increase the chances of her youngs survival, the slings are truly quite horrifying though. Can you be scared of babies? I know I am now.

Let us know how it goes
Crazy why some spiders do this , is there life span so short they instinctively become a meal for the baby’s?🤯🤯🤯
 

SpookySpooder

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Crazy why some spiders do this , is there life span so short they instinctively become a meal for the baby’s?🤯🤯🤯
It's an evolutionary strategy to ensure that babies have the best chance at survival.

Personally I think there are better methods, but I still think this is horrifically creative way of getting the job done.
 

Ultum4Spiderz

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It's an evolutionary strategy to ensure that babies have the best chance at survival.

Personally I think there are better methods, but I still think this is horrifically creative way of getting the job done.
Yeah I see a lot of species do it even some snake like amphibian. I guess it increases survival rates a good percentage.

 

Tbone192

Arachnobaron
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Yeah I see a lot of species do it even some snake like amphibian. I guess it increases survival rates a good percentage.

Caecilians are crazy, they only eat a special layer of skin which the mother produces specifically for them to eat. It's a clever strategy and the mother isn't killed in the process. Animals are great but also really weird!
 

The Snark

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The trick is that the mother lays unfertilized eggs for the slings to eat when they hatch, this satiates them for a little while. After the first day or so she starts to drum so her young know where she is. The slings know that mom=food and so they move towards her. Initially she will fend off the first couple of slings but this attracts more babies, and at some point she just lets them eat her.
I've heard of this referred to as the sacrificial lamb phenomenon. Darwin touched upon this. Survival of the species paramount over the individuals. Indeed, hard wired into various species.
 
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