How potent is a Black Widow's venom????

[Venom]

@Venom:

An article taken from wikipedia, I do not know if it's 100% true or not; someone else might post on this as well.

"P. nigriventer venom contains a potent neurotoxin, known as PhTx3, which acts as a broad-spectrum calcium channel blocker that inhibits glutamate release, calcium uptake and also glutamate uptake in neural synapses. At deadly concentrations, this neurotoxin causes loss of muscle control and breathing problems, resulting in paralysis and eventual asphyxiation. In addition, the venom causes intense pain and inflammation following an attack due to an excitatory effect the venom has on the serotonin 5-HT4 receptors of sensory nerves. This sensory nerve stimulation causes a release of neuropeptides such as substance P which triggers inflammation and pain. [4]

Aside from causing intense pain, the venom of the spider can also cause priapism in humans. Erections resulting from the bite are uncomfortable, can last for many hours and can lead to impotence. A component of the venom (Tx2-6) is being studied for use in erectile dysfunction treatments.[5]

The amount of Phoneutria nigriventer venom necessary to kill a 20 g mouse has been shown to be only 0.006 mg intravenously and 0.0134 mg subcutaneously as compared to 0.110 mg and 0.2 mg respectively for Latrodectus mactans (Black Widow).[6] This ranks Phoneutria venom among the most deadly found in spiders".

Ricardo

Thanks Toolrick!

But, that isn't in mg/ kg...hence, it would require math to convert to standard units, which I just hadn't done.


Widowman...were those subcutaneous LD50's? I'll have to look at those links when I have more time ( bed time now.) Thank you for those though.

-Venom.

 

[Tim Benzedrine]

LD-50, Kilograms, Blah, blah, blah! All you need to know about the black widow is right here.

[YOUTUBE]EfTX6dw3pRI[/YOUTUBE]

Very probably not the first time this was posted and probably not the last.



Slithers back to the Watering Hole

 

[Widowman10]

Widowman...were those subcutaneous LD50's? I'll have to look at those links when I have more time ( bed time now.) Thank you for those though.

-Venom.

no, they were the ESV values. subcutneous values were a little higher (as expected).

 

[Widowman10]

bump for info

thought i'd bump this up with some info i stumbled across the other day while reading some research papers. this is old, and not thorough by any means, but still can be useful. at least this is some hard evidence and not just speculation. JSloan, not sure if you've come across this, but you might find it interesting, who knows. anyway:

The bites of Latrodectus geometricus are less toxic than those of L. mactans. Finlayson determined the minimum lethal dose of geometricus for mice (weighing 18G), guinea-pigs (weighing 350G), and rabbits (weighing 1,600G).

Mouse------------- geo: 0.6mg ________ mac: .05mg
Guinea-pig--------- geo: 2.0mg ________ mac: .50mg
Rabbit------------- geo: 12.0mg ________ mac: 3.0mg

so i guess these are like "LD100" values but whatever

(taken from Latrodectism in South Africa by F. Zumpt)

 

[jsloan]

No, I hadn't seen that. Thanks!

 

[Venom]

Again, thank you Widowman. Good stuff! :clap: