Haplopelma longipies venom question

[Chris LXXIX]

Yes, unfortunately most people turn on youtube for advice how to act ariound T´s, that is very unfortunate....

OT moment.
Yes, indeed. But i mean something else, man. Something so "powerful" able to ruin our hobby, or to put our hobby under severe (that no one, sane hobbyst wants... well i hope at least) limitations.
There's the Internet, there's online Arachnid shops all over Europe. Germany (always a classic), Poland, Hungary etc
Those shops sell hot, really hot (not "hot" with the " like an OBT, i mean) spiders, and 99 out of 100 what prevail isn't experience, but cash.
That's very wrong IMO. You place the order, pay, they ship. End.
A bite from one of those could put someone into a severe situation, a fatality can not be excluded.
End of the hobby.

Lately a Poland man i know (in a virtual way) replaced ALL of his T's (bad move btw, T's are amazing) with Sicarius hahni, Hexathelidae of all sort, Phoneutria etc
Granted, he's skilled and with experience on his side. But not everyone is like him, a bite from those in the wrong nation, especially in those paranoid times, will trigger a "witch hunt" able to ruin completely an hobby (lawyers & politicians doesn't waste their time for make differences).
That's what i fear. And ban, actually, happens. I know well.

 

[Chris LXXIX]

I could tell you about several persons who are not qualified to own a cat, and much less a much more delicate animal as a T...

That's not the same, and you know that. Cats are "social accepted" (save if you are a black cat here in Italy among the wrong idiots) by the public. Spiders not.

 

[Pociemon]

OT moment.
Yes, indeed. But i mean something else, man. Something so "powerful" able to ruin our hobby, or to put our hobby under severe (that no one, sane hobbyst wants... well i hope at least) limitations.
There's the Internet, there's online Arachnid shops all over Europe. Germany (always a classic), Poland, Hungary etc
Those shops sell hot, really hot (not "hot" with the " like an OBT, i mean) spiders, and 99 out of 100 what prevail isn't experience, but cash.
That's very wrong IMO. You place the order, pay, they ship. End.
A bite from one of those could put someone into a severe situation, a fatality can not be excluded.
End of the hobby.

Lately a Poland man i know (in a virtual way) replaced ALL of his T's (bad move btw, T's are amazing) with Sicarius hahni, Hexathelidae of all sort, Phoneutria etc
Granted, he's skilled and with experience on his side. But not everyone is like him, a bite from those in the wrong nation, especially in those paranoid times, will trigger a "witch hunt" able to ruin completely an hobby (lawyers & politicians doesn't waste their time fpor make differences).
That's what i fear. And ban, actually, happens. I know well.

I understand completely peoples fear of this hobby to be banned, there is already bans in country, not that they make any sense, but they are there!
I keep sicarius and phoneutria fera primarely. Sicarius is actually easy to keep and difficult to get tagged by, but phoneutria is another matter, they are only for experienced keepers. But neither is as bad as people make them out to be! Their primary threat to the hobby is more that they are known to be dangerous and if an accident occur, they are very likely to wake up some "not needed" attention from authorithies. But we have to educate people and hope it will help.
In the meantime i just hop we can enjoy this hobby and dont walk around scared of what could happen!
I know i have recently criticized this forums approach to handling threads, but it is not done because i dislike anybody in here, but because i believe his issue is addressed very wrongly, thus not helping the hobby as hoped!

 

[Pociemon]

That's not the same, and you know that. Cats are "social accepted" (save if you are a black cat here in Italy among the wrong idiots) by the public. Spiders not.

I know that, but i dont accept that..... T´s should be the accepted animal;-)

 

[Chris LXXIX]

I understand completely peoples fear of this hobby to be banned, there is already bans in country, not that they make any sense, but they are there!
I keep sicarius and phoneutria fera primarely. Sicarius is actually easy to keep and difficult to get tagged by, but phoneutria is another matter, they are only for experienced keepers. But neither is as bad as people make them out to be! Their primary threat to the hobby is more that they are known to be dangerous and if an accdident occur, they are very likely to wake up some "not needed" attention from authorithies. But we have to educate people and hope it will help.
In the meantime i just hop we can njoy this hobby and dont walk around scared of what could happen!
I know i have brecently criticized this forums approach to handling threads, but it is not done because i dislike anybody in here, but because i believe his issue is addressed very wrongly, thus not helping the hobby as hoped!

Indeed, Sicarius hahni, just like Loxosceles rufescens are very "shy" spiders, not defensive at all. Only God know how many of those (Loxosceles rufescens i mean) we caught as childrens here in Lombardy cellars during summer days in the '80.
Yes, their venom isn't like genus Sicarius, but same family (Sicariidae) and very nasty as well.
Of course genus Phoneutria is (for speed, defensive behavior etc) on another planet.

Now the problem IMO isn't with skilled people like you, man, or others. But with those type of spiders combined with the Internet shops.

If "you", me, or others here can buy those... well... sadly, others (i mean those without the right experience) can, because at the end of the day money prevail when it comes to the Internet. Not for everyone, ok, there's sellers with a "ethic code", but in general that's how works.
I know EU online sellers that doesn't care at all about "experience": "You" order, they ship.

So, my point. Check how many escapes, T's injury, troubles, even bites we have here on Arachnoboards (in general, and in month/year basis) well, a bite from a Phoneutria nigriventer, escape (lol) of those... bites by Hexathelidae etc i mean, those can put the hobby at risk.
So, since lately, sadly, things go "viral" and i've noticed in YT (English mostly) young guys that are good maybe and i say maybe, for care about a Lasiodora parahybana with hots, i'm a bit concerned.

But my "struggle" (lol) isn't for me, because i already live in a nation that banned Arachnids (ALL Arachnids) prior, but for those who live in more, way more severe nations than Italy and thinks that "a Ban will never happen" and doesn't care much. Let's hope.

 

[Chris LXXIX]

I know that, but i dont accept that..... T´s should be the accepted animal;-)

Ah ah, i love cats. Seriously. But T's should be accepted without questions. Only evildoers hate T's.

 

[Pociemon]

Indeed, Sicarius hahni, just like Loxosceles rufescens are very "shy" spiders, not defensive at all. Only God know how many of those (Loxosceles rufescens i mean) we caught as childrens here in Lombardy cellars during summer days in the '80.
Yes, their venom isn't like genus Sicarius, but same family (Sicariidae) and very nasty as well.
Of course genus Phoneutria is (for speed, defensive behavior etc) on another planet.

Now the problem IMO isn't with skilled people like you, man, or others. But with those type of spiders combined with the Internet shops.

If "you", me, or others here can buy those... well... sadly, others (i mean those without the right experience) can, because at the end of the day money prevail when it comes to the Internet. Not for everyone, ok, there's sellers with a "ethic code", but in general that's how works.
I know EU online sellers that doesn't care at all about "experience": "You" order, they ship.

So, my point. Check how many escapes, T's injury, troubles, even bites we have here on Arachnoboards (in general, and in month/year basis) well, a bite from a Phoneutria nigriventer, escape (lol) of those... bites by Hexathelidae etc i mean, those can put the hobby at risk.
So, since lately, sadly, things go "viral" and i've noticed in YT (English mostly) young guys that are good maybe and i say maybe, for care about a Lasiodora parahybana with hots, i'm a bit concerned.

But my "struggle" (lol) isn't for me, because i already live in a nation that banned Arachnids (ALL Arachnids) prior, but for those who live in more, way more severe nations than Italy and thinks that "a Ban will never happen" and doesn't care much. Let's hope.

I agree. I know people in Your country who keep T´s, so i guess there is others aswell that dont agree with this ban and still keeps them, but i understand why you are "quiet" with it. But you have my sympathies, it sucks big time, so lets hope it ends here...

 

[Chris LXXIX]

I agree. I know people in Your country who keep T´s, so i guess there is others aswell that dont agree with this ban and still keeps them, but i understand why you are "quiet" with it. But you have my sympathies, it sucks big time, so lets hope it ends here...

There's an important thing to say. When the government leaded by Silvio Berlu$coni, in 2003, all of a sudden banned Arachnids... well, a lot of people, obviously, quit. Someone closed his/her business. There's no point in breeding, for instance, Chromatopelma cyaneopubescens (and, you know well, 0.1 are voracious male eaters) if "you" can't anymore sell those in the light of the sun.
Then the Arachno Community of Italy took a stand, and talked to the central (Roma) government authority, made a fair enough list (so no hots, no hots of all sort: spiders, scorpions, mygalomorphae in general) and, after years, we managed to have here in Italy authorized fairs were you can buy & trade T's and scorpions (again, no hots).
That's better than nothing but still today it's a very controversial topic. That, of course, sucks. But right or wrong, those things happens.
Politicians here care only 24/7 to fill money in their unfinished pockets

 

[johnny quango]

If you want to know a little bit more go to your local library or buy tarantulas of the world by francois teyssie there's a section in there where the author looks at about 20 or so different species and their vemon and the genetic structure. The author also contributes a small table of content that shows the amount of vemon (crude) released by electronic stimulation the results range from 8 microlitres to almost 60 microlitres all the species that were tested are female and it's full of the usual ow suspects

 

[JAFUENTES]

hey jafuentes
goto a science journal website or similar place where you get search , such as pubmed

type your spider genus + venom

then research on your own. I really hope you do not make another post with another species of Tarantula and venom questions.

you cant even pick the right one. you wrote longipes then you ask about minax venom. what the hell is going on?

Typo. My bad.

 

[JAFUENTES]

If you want to know a little bit more go to your local library or buy tarantulas of the world by francois teyssie there's a section in there where the author looks at about 20 or so different species and their vemon and the genetic structure. The author also contributes a small table of content that shows the amount of vemon (crude) released by electronic stimulation the results range from 8 microlitres to almost 60 microlitres all the species that were tested are female and it's full of the usual ow suspects

Thanks. I'll see to get that book.

 

[Pociemon]

There's an important thing to say. When the government leaded by Silvio Berlu$coni, in 2003, all of a sudden banned Arachnids... well, a lot of people, obviously, quit. Someone closed his/her business. There's no point in breeding, for instance, Chromatopelma cyaneopubescens (and, you know well, 0.1 are voracious male eaters) if "you" can't anymore sell those in the light of the sun.
Then the Arachno Community of Italy took a stand, and talked to the central (Roma) government authority, made a fair enough list (so no hots, no hots of all sort: spiders, scorpions, mygalomorphae in general) and, after years, we managed to have here in Italy authorized fairs were you can buy & trade T's and scorpions (again, no hots).
That's better than nothing but still today it's a very controversial topic. That, of course, sucks. But right or wrong, those things happens.
Politicians here care only 24/7 to fill money in their unfinished pockets

Well this sucks for you guys, i hope it changes for the better someday!

 

[Chris LXXIX]

Well this sucks for you guys, i hope it changes for the better someday!

In Italy? I doubt. And not only for the T's issue, but for everything. This nation is like a Lamborghini at full speed without brakes. For fix things here we need to (re)embrace the ancient blood of Augusto, Giulio Cesare, or a new revolution.
The GrandFather of my Mother did in his 40 the March on Roma, those were strong mans with a code of honor, angry after the WW1 events; now the average Italian Man/Lady are only a bunch of selfish & selfie, lazy, cowards, politically correct, drug lovers freaks.
Weak, and pathetics. No wonder our ancient values are going into the toilet like Niagara falls 24/7.

 

[Pociemon]

sad to hear it...

 

[Angel Minkov]

Very good theory. Best way to avoid needing to know about tarantula venom is to only keep species that are within your skill level, have secure caging, to use forceps/tongs for all cage maintenance, and not to handle or touch your spiders. People that do this don't seem to ask questions about venom.

Or maybe some people are just genuinely interested and like knowing scientific facts about their animals? Seems like a possibility to me

 

[jiacovazzi]

Or maybe some people are just genuinely interested and like knowing scientific facts about their animals? Seems like a possibility to me

Absolutely. As a scientist or keeper it's important to understand the venom's potential effects on the body if a bite should occur to yourself or you could instruct others on the best course of action if they are bit. Not every tarantula has the same venom effects and it will only serve you well to learn about it.

 

[Spidermolt]

I'm sorry that there is a lot of sarcasm on this website and i only read about half the replies until i just skipped to make my own. i don't know exactly how venomous this species is "especially since I've never been bitten by any tarantula" but i do know that all of the Haplopelma sp. carry potent venom so extreme caution should be taken when dealing with them.

 

[Pociemon]

I have collected haplopelma longipes in the wild and also kept them at my home. The local people who live together with them use them sometimes for dinner. But they tell me when the pickup goes bad and they get bitten, then they get very sick a few weeks with all sorts of problem, especcially to the stomach. Cramps are involved also.The bite should feel like you get boiling water injected. So they have respect for them, so be careful with them.

 

[ireleana]

I have looked up bite reports and every bit of information I could find on the venom of the species I have. I'm not sure about the original posters intent and all the other questions, but it doesn't hurt to know should you get bitten. I think it is important to know every aspect you can on any animal you keep. Things can go wrong even under the best of circumstances and no matter how careful you are. These are not domesticated animals and even then...Asking about venom or what to do if one gets on you, or your back etc a head of time, is trying to be informed and shouldn't imply lack of being able to have a certain species etc. Maybe I misunderstood some of the replies, and i'm sure some will misunderstand mine, so to avoid a backlash, i'll just apologize now lol.

I would imagine if one were to get tagged in a big vein or artery it could be really bad or possibly lead to death with a load of OW venom. Any info on that? The only OW I have is H. lividum. She is feisty but has locked herself away where she belongs lol! I wish there was more studies on the different species venom. Has there been a bite by all species or research done? If there has been, there is a serious lack of reporting done. Also I think a lot of people like the typical "I want this tarantula because it's cool and I can poke it for my friends to get it mad" don't realize how bad a bite can be from some species and that if they get loose and you have small children or other pets around, you better have a plan lol! Seriously they can be fatal to your furry friends, even the NW's.

 

[Poec54]

I understand completely peoples fear of this hobby to be banned, there is already bans in country, not that they make any sense, but they are there!
I keep sicarius and phoneutria fera primarely. Sicarius is actually easy to keep and difficult to get tagged by, but phoneutria is another matter, they are only for experienced keepers. Their primary threat to the hobby is more that they are known to be dangerous and if an accident occur, they are very likely to wake up some "not needed" attention from authorities.

Right. A serious bite by a Phoneutria (worse case scenario: a child bitten by an escaped one) could trigger widespread bans on a number of spiders, including tarantulas. Lawmakers and the general public lump them all together.