H.arizonensis with H.spadix

Kugellager

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I keep my H. arizonensis communally without any problems. Can
H.spadix be kept with the H.arizonensis or communally for that matter?
Has anyone tried this?

John
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skinheaddave

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I see no reason why H.spadix can't be kept communaly. Mixing species, though, is always an invitation for trouble. I have never personally kept any of the Iuridae, though, so perhaps someone could answer from personal experience?

Cheers,
Dave
 
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kugellager

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Thanks Dave,

I kind of figured they could since they are so closely related to H.arizonensis. Thats why i've asked. But I was not very sure you could mix them with other species. I do know that you can keep P. imperator with H. spinifer and and other Pandinids(?)as long as they are of similar size and are well fed. There are one or two other species that I know can be kept with different species. I don't recall the perticular species but I believe they were Buthids.

John
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Kugellager

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Thanks Dave,

I kind of figured they could since they are so closely related to H.arizonensis. Thats why i've asked. But I was not very sure you could mix them with other species. I do know that you can keep P. imperator with H. spinifer and and other Pandinids(?)as long as they are of similar size and are well fed. There are one or two other species that I know can be kept with different species. I don't recall the perticular species but I believe they were Buthids.

John
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skinheaddave

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John,

I'm afraid I'm going to have to modify my answer. To the average scorpion enthusiast who just wants to know whether they should throw two species in together, my answer is always going to be no. Yes, you can keep Pandinus and Heterometrus together in the conditions you mentioned, but I really wouldn't recommend it. Scorpions belonging to those communal species seem to have overridden their predatory tendancies, but the effect seems to be limited to the species (don't have a source for that offhand, but I have read it somewhere). If you keep similarily sized scorps together, however, the result of that "is this a predator? is this prey?" calculation they do within their few ganglia is likely to turn out "no" most of the time -- and scuffles will amost always end in a draw.

Now, to you I might modify my answer a bit. You seem to have a good idea of what you are doing and you obvioulsy are smart enough to figure things out. So, if you want to try putting your H.spadix and H.arizonensis together then be my guest. I would put only two stipuations on it:
1) Be prepared to loose one. There is always that chance -- even for multiple specimens of the same species.
2) Keep us updated on your experiences. I don't have two Hadrurus to put together, but I still want to know what the verdict is.

Cheers,
Dave
 

Kugellager

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I may try putting them together once I've made sure the H. spadix is well fed...the H. arizonensis are chubby...a little too well fed I'm afraid :rolleyes: They are also pretty mellow, as far as H. arizonensis goes, which may have to do with them being well fed.

If I do put them together I'll do it over a weekend where I'll have alot of time to watch them. I'll take good notes an report back what I find. I'll prob introduce them slowly by seperating off a corner of the larger tank for a few days to acclimate them to one another and then introduce them on opposite sides of the tank and see what happens. I'll definitely be ready to seperate them if it starts to go poorly.

I actually keep a little log book of most behaviors and any 'experimentation ' in enclosures, environmental, molting, births, feeding etc. I keep track of what seems to be successful as well as unsuccessful. It will prob be a few weeks before I try that though.

Anyway, thanks Dave for the input and insight...it does help.

John
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skinheaddave

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Glad to hear you keep a log. I think that far too few people document their animal's activities or their own.

With regards to things going poorly, do your H.arizonensis often "scrap?" Most communal scorpions will tussle now and again and it is quite likely the new guy in town may have to go through this -- especialy if he is of a different species. Knowing the difference between an potentialy fatal encounter and jockying for possition is exceedingly difficult. I suspect this is due, in part, to scorpions not knowing the difference themselves. Since they aren't social creatures, they don't have ritualized combat. Anyhow, now I'm just rambling. :rolleyes:

Cheers,
Dave
 

Kugellager

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I have never seen them fight at all...even when I had three in there...they even share the same scrape from time to time. When they are out and about at night and run into one another they either turn away or just run right over each other...thats what made me ask about the spadix in the first place. Never seen them fight over a crick either.

One less enclosure means more space for other enclosures and the ease of controlling the envorinment better with fewer tanks/lamps/etc.

John
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skinheaddave

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Sounds like you have a pretty stable setup there. Let us know how any experiments go.

Cheers,
Dave
 
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