Giant African Land Snails questions and info?

[SandDeku]

I'm actually curious. Some people say it's illegal to keep giant snails in the usa; while others say its just illegal to bring them in from another country.

I know they're invasive in warm places. But say in a temperate region like nj? Would it be legal to own one there? I'd like to see actual hardcore evidence and such where it says you cannot? Because I been fascinated by em for years and I like snails-- but I always wanted a larger species like that. I just wanted to keep one or three of them. The enclosure would be with a tight fitting lid. As I wouldn't want them out and about-- my dog would make it into a chew toy.

I know their care-- they're very darn basic and simple even an idiot could keep one(not an insult to anyone-- just saying they're that easy). I know all about their care, I just want to know more information about them that I may not know. And where I could I buy one legally if it IS 100%-LEGAL- to own one?

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On the sad fact they may be illegal.

Is there a LEGAL species of snails or slugs SIMILAR to giant african snails in the term of size and girth?

 

[SkyeSpider]

I have a close friend who's a snail expert. Here's what she had to say:

"They are pretty ubiquitously illegal, and part of the reason is that they carry a parasite that can cause meningitis. Same way some turtles can carry salmonella. Also, there have already been invasive issues with the species in Florida-they even eat stucco off of houses for the calcium.

"Unless the person lives in a climate with very cold temperatures that would kill the snails, I wouldn't recommend getting them. I only bred illegal invasive species when I was living in the high elevation desert, which had both aridity (less than 10% humidity) and cold temperatures under 40 degrees in the winter. Plus, those snails were aquatic. "

 

[SandDeku]

I have a close friend who's a snail expert. Here's what she had to say:

"They are pretty ubiquitously illegal, and part of the reason is that they carry a parasite that can cause meningitis. Same way some turtles can carry salmonella. Also, there have already been invasive issues with the species in Florida-they even eat stucco off of houses for the calcium.

"Unless the person lives in a climate with very cold temperatures that would kill the snails, I wouldn't recommend getting them. I only bred illegal invasive species when I was living in the high elevation desert, which had both aridity (less than 10% humidity) and cold temperatures under 40 degrees in the winter. Plus, those snails were aquatic. "

Is there a species of snail or slug that grows to substantial large size that are legal to keep?

 

[spydrhunter1]

Good luck getting any species of snails or slugs even shipped between states. You could try for a Aphis-USDA PPQ526 permit, but they are scrutinized closely. If approved expect periodic home visits.

 

[Galapoheros]

imo, the meningitis issue is a scare tactic, the snails have to come in contact with it after all. Even then, I read you have to eat the snail, and also it has to not be cooked well. People eat them in other countries often so, the meningitis thing, I'm not buying that one http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/wordofmouth/2009/jul/03/african-land-snails-video . I think they are just trying to push the publics scare button, getting the public to dislike the snail, so they won't be imported, so people will report where they see them asap, ..because we don't want meningitis now do we?! http://www.listserv.uga.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind1111b&L=conch-l&P=1488 They will tell this to students in the field, even so called "experts", anything to spread fear that motivates people from being interested in the snails. The true reason is legit imo, they are plant eaters. I just don't like the scare tactic route, if that's what it is.

 

[Tarac]

imo, the meningitis issue is a scare tactic, the snails have to come in contact with it after all. Even then, I read you have to eat the snail, and also it has to not be cooked well. People eat them in other countries often so, the meningitis thing, I'm not buying that one http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/wordofmouth/2009/jul/03/african-land-snails-video . I think they are just trying to push the publics scare button, getting the public to dislike the snail, so they won't be imported, so people will report where they see them asap, ..because we don't want meningitis now do we?! http://www.listserv.uga.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind1111b&L=conch-l&P=1488 They will tell this to students in the field, even so called "experts", anything to spread fear that motivates people from being interested in the snails. The true reason is legit imo, they are plant eaters. I just don't like the scare tactic route, if that's what it is.

People do eat them in other countries and it is very costly- I have seen the effects myself in Haiti where the snails are often eaten and the fluids remaining inside the shell are drunk. It happens here as well especially in the Miami-Dade area where there is a large Haitian immigrant population. It is not a scare tactic. It's ironic that you call them so called "experts" in a sarcastic way and yet you are offering your "opinion" about the potentially life threatening danger as though you are more informed than they are. The two main pathogens (Aeromonas hydrophila and the Rat Lungworm) are not restricted only to the snail, the snail just happens to be a frequent carrier and the main route of entry into the US. So the main concern in this regard is that the pathogens will become prevalent in native snail and mammal populations, which in turn will lead to more frequent infections.

www.ashdin.com/journals/jnp/N100503.pdf

Please be more responsible with the "opinions" you are disseminating.

 

[Travis K]

I have kept large slugs before and they were such a mess I wouldn't want to bother with anything else. I have seen pics of these snails and slime excrete is probably in epic proportions. How would one keep such a creature and keep it's enclosure looking nice?

 

[Galapoheros]

People do eat them in other countries and it is very costly- I have seen the effects myself in Haiti where the snails are often eaten and the fluids remaining inside the shell are drunk. It happens here as well especially in the Miami-Dade area where there is a large Haitian immigrant population. It is not a scare tactic. It's ironic that you call them so called "experts" in a sarcastic way and yet you are offering your "opinion" about the potentially life threatening danger as though you are more informed than they are. The two main pathogens (Aeromonas hydrophila and the Rat Lungworm) are not restricted only to the snail, the snail just happens to be a frequent carrier and the main route of entry into the US. So the main concern in this regard is that the pathogens will become prevalent in native snail and mammal populations, which in turn will lead to more frequent infections.

www.ashdin.com/journals/jnp/N100503.pdf

Please be more responsible with the "opinions" you are disseminating.

They drink the raw fluid?!, that's gross. OK so that worked, the info you found makes my opinion less strong in my own head, I was fast to be skeptical yet I do still have some skepticism. I still have doubts about the validity of the degree of fear and concern having to do with the parasite. Maybe it's been in the US for 1000s of years, who knows, and we are not a raw food eating culture as in Haiti, Thailand, etc. Less than 30 cases in 4 years in Hawaii, seems very low in a relative way. It's not good of course, and in that pdf it states deaths are possible but rare, that most fully recover in 2 weeks. I understand "better safe than sorry" though. Why is isn't the common garden snail that can carry the same parasite just as well targeted with this fear(?) they can be as invasive at times, just don't eat snails, cook food. The info you found was good, however I still have the same opinion, but to a lesser degree.

 

[SandDeku]

They drink the raw fluid?!, that's gross. OK so that worked, the info you found makes my opinion less strong in my own head, I was fast to be skeptical yet I do still have some skepticism. I still have doubts about the validity of the degree of fear and concern having to do with the parasite. Maybe it's been in the US for 1000s of years, who knows, and we are not a raw food eating culture as in Haiti, Thailand, etc. Less than 30 cases in 4 years in Hawaii, seems very low in a relative way. It's not good of course, and in that pdf it states deaths are possible but rare, that most fully recover in 2 weeks. I understand "better safe than sorry" though. Why is isn't the common garden snail that can carry the same parasite just as well targeted with this fear(?) they can be as invasive at times, just don't eat snails, cook food. The info you found was good, however I still have the same opinion, but to a lesser degree.

I'm not so sure on his information(neither positive or negative). But I DO know ONE thing on his comment. IT IS true that people in haiti do or maybe USED to eat live snails. Because my grandma came from haiti. I'm puertorican, and I do know that in puertorico alot of people eat some weird stuff. Did you know that even know they eat fried iguanas? You know those at the petstores? They were overrunning the place so they decided to eat em.

 

[Galapoheros]

Oh yeah there are things eaten in other countries that would seem very bizarre to Americans. Of course it's a cultural thing only, what foods are weird is mostly opinion also. Many people eat grubs, centipedes, grasshoppers, ants, etc. and raw things Americans are taught would be disgusting. I'd bet that the sanitary conditions in these countries that have the most problems are poor also. It's why I have the opinion that meningitis and snails is not so scary, the garden snail and other mollusks are able to carry the parasite, I've seen 100s of large garden snails on the sides of houses, some years almost none. Is it only the case that it's common for people to eat the African Snail under poor conditions in these other countries that it's being so associated with the parasite scare here in the US, while the common garden snail may be just as infected? How many garden snails are infected compared to the African snail, has this been studied? Maybe it has. Something keeps the parasite in check obviously. For one there is not such a high rat population in the US, we take care of it when it's a problem. It's just not in our culture to eat a lot of snails so I see an angle that there may be no difference between the threat of the African snail compared to some other native snails as far as this meningitis threat goes as long as they're not eaten uncooked. I'd like to read a study if somebody has it. I like to question some claims, double check them, especially coming from government because it has been known to use scare tactics to motivate, in a way like a parent telling their kids all snakes are poisonous. I would need more info to make me afraid of the meningitis issue, esp looking at a ratio of infected native snails compared to African snails in the US. What if it were discovered that native snails were more commonly infected than the African snails loose in the US? That it's only an issue because they are eaten more often in other countries? See, I don't know, I have an open mind though, open to more info if somebody has it. Yes I'm still considering it a scare tactic at this point, my opinion.

 

[Alejandro45]

Ahhh I remember this....When they were around here there slime would dry and peel paint on houses.

 

[SandDeku]

Ahhh I remember this....When they were around here there slime would dry and peel paint on houses.

Lucky you. >___>;;; I always wanted one; it's not like I'm going to stick that thing up my butt(pardon my language), or eat it or something....

I do own turtles too! Guess what? Did you know there's a rumor all turtles carry salmonellae? (pardon my language)BULL-SHAT. Turtles DO NOT carry salmonella more than a bird does, or more can another person could. If you keep it in clean water-- there should be no reason for that type of illness to occur.. and further more owning one and finding out it caught salmonella would be so embarrassing the person should just re-home his/her own turtle/reptile/etc and give up entirely since that would be because the person did not give the animal proper care. EVEN basic care. Let alone optimal care.

My turtles are checked by vets 3 times a year. For "check ups" and the such. Since believe it or not. Turtles are very well at hiding illness. For an animal that shows illness; becomes target to others.

I just want to be able to own something "big" but that doesn't consume A LOT of space compared to my reptiles and interests me. I'm not sure my "tenants" would be okay with my having a tarantula in the building or a scorpion or even a centipede. The most I'd get away with are: Beetles, Beetle like roaches(I can pass off the giant hissers as one, same with giant litter bugs), millipedes, slugs or snails, mantids, butterflies, moths, etc. Problem with that is. Hissers are short lived at most 2-3 years(so I read on a few sites), butterflies def. shorter lifespan likewise with the moths and mantids, litterbugs are expensive as the dickens and I'm not sure that if I bought one ill ever see it. I hear they like to burrow extensively and are like hidden pets. Vinegaroons I'm not so sure about them. I like the nymphs of cicadas but they don't do much and wouldn't thrive in captivity. I do like those large katydids but they seem and look frail as heck and short lived.

Lifespan is a deal for me because say it can live 2 years. But when I get the animal; it's already ONE year old. That means I cannot fully enjoy it for not even less than a year. Especially when they charge a lot for something that will die in a couple of given months. :/

It's a battle because I don't have much time and my turtles are kept in our basement; but that's a complicated story. I like to keep things neat down there. I wanted at least a decent terrarium and one 7gallon aquarium in my living quarters.

Long story short. I have been trying to do some research but I'm not even sure where to start looking except asking here since I know you guys have 3x more knowledge than I could regarding insects, and mollusks. Which is why I seek to sponge out some knowledge for my own interest.

 

[ScarecrowGirl]

You could do Ivory millipedes, the ones I lived with were non stop out all the time, those giant snails sound pretty cool to though, what about mantises? Or a communal darkling beetle set up? So far as disease carrying goes, I've blatantly licked both wild and captive lizards and snakes in the face of those who say 'wash your hands before you get salmonella!' and I've had a 2 frogs jump into my mouth before(separate instances) and I haven't gotten salmonella yet. I'm not saying it doesn't happen or to go out and lick animals to prove other wise, but hey sometimes there's more to it than not washing your hands.

 

[Scythemantis]

I always wanted one too, or to even SEE one. I can't believe a terrestrial mollusk so large even exists, it's like a fantasy creature. Part of me hopes that their recent re-appearance here in Florida *won't* be successfully countered. This state is made up mostly of invasive species anyway, and who cares if they chew people's stucco? Invertebrates > Human civilization any day.

Sadly, the biggest land snail you can legally keep is whatever lives in your state. I'm lucky to have some here that grow two inches.

 

[SandDeku]

You could do Ivory millipedes, the ones I lived with were non stop out all the time, those giant snails sound pretty cool to though, what about mantises? Or a communal darkling beetle set up? So far as disease carrying goes, I've blatantly licked both wild and captive lizards and snakes in the face of those who say 'wash your hands before you get salmonella!' and I've had a 2 frogs jump into my mouth before(separate instances) and I haven't gotten salmonella yet. I'm not saying it doesn't happen or to go out and lick animals to prove other wise, but hey sometimes there's more to it than not washing your hands.

Mantids don't last long at all and I'd have to be buying a supply of them every couple months.... Darkling beetles are small and I'm strongly near sighted... Ivory millies sound cool but would be a last resort thing. :<

I kinda just wanted something that was a decent size, can go in a small to medium sized terrarium. Is active enough that it won't be a pet rock 24/7... It doesn't have to be speedy gonzales or something... just interesting... Fairly long lived. Anything that lives over a year is preferred. But I'd LOVE if it lived atleast over 2 years.

---------- Post added 08-07-2012 at 10:44 PM ----------

I always wanted one too, or to even SEE one. I can't believe a terrestrial mollusk so large even exists, it's like a fantasy creature. Part of me hopes that their recent re-appearance here in Florida *won't* be successfully countered. This state is made up mostly of invasive species anyway, and who cares if they chew people's stucco? Invertebrates > Human civilization any day.

Sadly, the biggest land snail you can legally keep is whatever lives in your state. I'm lucky to have some here that grow two inches.

Damn. I don't have any big species of any kind of insect in my state. Except wolf spiders. But I think its too late to find them and that would be the only spider I'd keep so far....(hidden from tenants though).

---------- Post added 08-07-2012 at 10:53 PM ----------

P.s. For the look of a spider. I actually prefer slightly big and bulky but nothing over 3inches long and nothing less than half an inch. I like these :

http://www.qm.qld.gov.au/Find+out+a...ers/missulena-bradleyi-2.jpg?w=300&h=313&as=1

Though these are burrowing and would rarely be seen. Though i'm not very spider savvy and I think most if not all are short lived. I don't think there's a spider for me thats bulky(and bald), long lived, easy to look at, and care for.

If I had to buy it, i'd have to buy it incognito. I don't want the package to say "LIVE INSECT" or "LIVE ANIMAL" in it. And I'd probably prefer a bunch of slings so I can acquire a young female. I would love one that I could even bring on a dorm room someday.

 

[Aviara]

You sound rather picky about your invertebrate choices! I can tell you first-hand, I've had experience with native species of snail in Texas, and these guys were only maybe an inch long. They were extremely messy, went through organic lettuce, carrots and other veggie treats like crazy, and humidity had to be crazy high to keep them from going "dormant" in their shells. While it was cute to watch them crawl around and pig out on food, they were a pain to keep at the same time. The slime also had a peculiar smell when it got onto the coconut coir I kept them on, which was almost unpleasant when you opened their enclosure. I can only imagine how awful the African Giants would be - the mess would seem to negate any enjoyment, even putting aside the aforementioned health issues.
What about some other options for invertebrates? You said no big spiders, nothing too small, and nothing that does not live a long time. What about cockroaches? Madagascar hissers make interesting pets and are pretty sizeable, but are slow-moving little tanks and can be held. I've heard people say that they have a lot of personality, although I haven't kept them. There are other slightly smaller "display" roach species, some of which can fly or climb glass, but others cannot. I know the retailer "Bugs in Cyberspace" has a large assortment of roaches - and when I ordered from them, their package did not say anything like "LIVE INSECTS".
Others have mentioned millipedes - I love my millies, but at least the species I have owned hide most of the day. You have to wake up in the middle of the night to have a chance at seeing them out "partying". Nevertheless, they can be fun to hold and interact with. Unfortunately, many species, especially the larger ones, are expensive. My favorite, the African Giant (A. gigas), is no longer widely available because of export bans, so small juveniles usually cost $60-100 each.
What about scorpions? Some of the larger species are not as fast and "scary", such as the emperor or Asian forest scorpion. I currently have a wolf spider, and she is FAST. Honestly many of my tarantulas are more maneagable than she is, simply because of how speedy and aggressive she is. I feel comfortable handling many docile tarantula species, as well as all my other invertebrates except my grumpy Pandinus imperator, but I won't put my hand in her enclosure!

 

[SandDeku]

You sound rather picky about your invertebrate choices! I can tell you first-hand, I've had experience with native species of snail in Texas, and these guys were only maybe an inch long. They were extremely messy, went through organic lettuce, carrots and other veggie treats like crazy, and humidity had to be crazy high to keep them from going "dormant" in their shells. While it was cute to watch them crawl around and pig out on food, they were a pain to keep at the same time. The slime also had a peculiar smell when it got onto the coconut coir I kept them on, which was almost unpleasant when you opened their enclosure. I can only imagine how awful the African Giants would be - the mess would seem to negate any enjoyment, even putting aside the aforementioned health issues.
What about some other options for invertebrates? You said no big spiders, nothing too small, and nothing that does not live a long time. What about cockroaches? Madagascar hissers make interesting pets and are pretty sizeable, but are slow-moving little tanks and can be held. I've heard people say that they have a lot of personality, although I haven't kept them. There are other slightly smaller "display" roach species, some of which can fly or climb glass, but others cannot. I know the retailer "Bugs in Cyberspace" has a large assortment of roaches - and when I ordered from them, their package did not say anything like "LIVE INSECTS".
Others have mentioned millipedes - I love my millies, but at least the species I have owned hide most of the day. You have to wake up in the middle of the night to have a chance at seeing them out "partying". Nevertheless, they can be fun to hold and interact with. Unfortunately, many species, especially the larger ones, are expensive. My favorite, the African Giant (A. gigas), is no longer widely available because of export bans, so small juveniles usually cost $60-100 each.
What about scorpions? Some of the larger species are not as fast and "scary", such as the emperor or Asian forest scorpion. I currently have a wolf spider, and she is FAST. Honestly many of my tarantulas are more maneagable than she is, simply because of how speedy and aggressive she is. I feel comfortable handling many docile tarantula species, as well as all my other invertebrates except my grumpy Pandinus imperator, but I won't put my hand in her enclosure!

To be honest unless it was a roach, or a millipede or anything without stingers or fangs. I wouldn't hold it. I'm extremely cautious. Not fearful; just cautious. I've handled toxic snakes because I'm used to snakes. But not anything spider like. I do like how they look though and their antics. That's why I love wolf spiders. They're territorial, pissy as heck, and quite the hunter. They're small and not scary to me. A large tarantula crawling up on me I wouldn't feel comfortable. I'm not afraid just; cautious about some of them. I like scorpions; not so sure on the tenants. I'd have to hide it. Secondly aren't scorpion pet rocks?

I thought millipedes were active when you misted their tanks and themselves. I do like large centipedes but I hear they hide a lot and some can kill you. I wouldn't want something lethal or too fast for my hands. Though I'd be wearing gloves and be hearding it towards a cup to transport it when needed. But I doubt pedes are manageable.

I like dwarf tarantulas but nothing over 3inches and nothing under 2inches. lol. I'm extremely demanding because I think that if I'm going to pay over 20 bucks for something I should atleast be able to be picky on it. Though... for the record. I'm quite selective in general.

 

[ScarecrowGirl]

The little Euathlus sp. fit right perfect in that range, calm, slow moving, over 2 but under 3 in.

Centis should only kill you if you allergic, I got bit by my Tigerlegs centipede (S. subspinipes de haani) and didn't die. But my hand swelled up like no bodies business and it hurt pretty bad. But if you house them right they are only hidden while molting, mine are pretty content sitting out most the day so long as its not too bright, not that your getting one, just putting my .02 on the centipedes though.

 

[SandDeku]

The little Euathlus sp. fit right perfect in that range, calm, slow moving, over 2 but under 3 in.

Centis should only kill you if you allergic, I got bit by my Tigerlegs centipede (S. subspinipes de haani) and didn't die. But my hand swelled up like no bodies business and it hurt pretty bad. But if you house them right they are only hidden while molting, mine are pretty content sitting out most the day so long as its not too bright, not that your getting one, just putting my .02 on the centipedes though.

Aren't the euathlus the ones you can house in groups too? I do like the yellow euathlus.

 

[Arianji]

If you are still wanting something molluscy have you considered aquatic snail species? All the fun of the big land snails, but not constantly cleaning up slime trails, and you can put other stuff with them. I have a pomocae maculata, (scientific name for big nasty apple snail) and these boys get HUGE. My snail's shell is about the size of a golfball, and he's still growing. I keep in a 10 gallon guppy breeder tank with some bamboo shrimp. They all get along great, and the snail is so fun to observe scooting around the tank.