Ethics of taking scorpions from the wild

[Nephaleim]

Hello!
Im currently dealing with a bit of a morality issue.
Ever since I was a little kid I would take numerous creatures(insects and arthropods) from my backyard(we can call it the 'wild' since it's outside), to keep as pets. I love observing these creatures and taking care of them, seeing how they grow etc.
Since I was a little kid I was never bothered much with the morality of it because 'they are just bugs and don't feel emotions like we do and there are a lot of them, one taken from the wild is no big loss for the population'. So now I've started to think whether or not it's actually fine.
In a few weeks I'm going on a little excursion, and that excursion happens to be in an area where there are native Euscorpions sp. Where I live there aren't any scorpions around and since I always wanted one (I kept a bunch of protoscorpions too) I was planning to take my free time to find a scorpion and keep it as a pet. I even have a seasoned terrarium which is fairly big for a small animal like that. I also have a T and feeding it won't be an issue.
I posted a question in a Facebook group where I could find these scorpions and I was immediately met with rather toxic answers such as 'I hope you don't find any '
I understand the importance of leaving nature alone and not bothering local populations because some animals have gone extinct because of human intervention, but is it really such a terrible thing to take a single scorpion?
Like, you could say some person found a scorpion on their night walk and they killed it, or a cat found and ate the scorpion. The loss would be the same.
And the question is: to take one or not to take one? There aren't any people around me selling these other than Heterometrus sp and they are fairly expensive.
Please don't bash me and be respectful. I'm only trying to understand some things.

 

[scolopendra277]

well, it depends on how many you take. Taking one or two will not impact wild populations very much, especially if the scorpion is young. Taking heaps, however, is not great for local populations. I do this from time to time if I find an interesting centipede or something. it definitely saves a lot of money!

 

[Nephaleim]

well, it depends on how many you take. Taking one or two will not impact wild populations very much, especially if the scorpion is young. Taking heaps, however, is not great for local populations. I do this from time to time if I find an interesting centipede or something. it definitely saves a lot of money!

NO NO NO!
Definetly not more than two!
And I though it would be better to take a baby, since it would get used to captivity a lot better.

 

[Joey Spijkers]

The scorpion hobby is largely dominated by wild caught specimens. Anyone keeping wild caught scorpions, but calling you out for catching them, is a huge hypocrite.

Don’t get me wrong, I am against commercially wild caught animals. Almost all my scorpions are captive bred. However, I see a big difference between a few self-caught specimens, and a species that’s being commercially mass-collected for the hobby. In my opinion, the impact of one person taking a few individuals is not big. Unless it’s a species that is already vulnerable or has a small range, which is not the case with most Euscorpius species. Just make sure you’re informed on it.

Also, we need to take animals out of the wild to establish them in captivity. So you could take one or two, but you could also take enough to attempt breeding, and then release part of them back where you found them, maybe sell a few scorplings for the hobby. Just don’t take more than you need.

 

[Edan bandoot]

Do research on threatened or endangered bugs in the area and don't touch those ones

 

[Nephaleim]

The scorpion hobby is largely dominated by wild caught specimens. Anyone keeping wild caught scorpions, but calling you out for catching them, is a huge hypocrite.

Don’t get me wrong, I am against commercially wild caught animals. Almost all my scorpions are captive bred. However, I see a big difference between a few self-caught specimens, and a species that’s being commercially mass-collected for the hobby. In my opinion, the impact of one person taking a few individuals is not big. Unless it’s a species that is already vulnerable or has a small range, which is not the case with most Euscorpius species. Just make sure you’re informed on it.

Also, we need to take animals out of the wild to establish them in captivity. So you could take one or two, but you could also take enough to attempt breeding, and then release part of them back where you found them, maybe sell a few scorplings for the hobby. Just don’t take more than you need.

I've heard there are euscorps nearly under every rock, and that they are humorous and all over the place.
Glad to see someone finally agreeing with me.

 

[Joey Spijkers]

I've heard there are euscorps nearly under every rock, and that they are humorous and all over the place.
Glad to see someone finally agreeing with me.

That’s how Euscorpius sp. are in most areas. You won’t have any impact on the population if you do it responsibly.

 

[Doodlebird]

I disagree with company's/large sellers collecting them, but I think it's fine for a personal project. I personally believe that they live a better life in captivity, because a good keeper will keep them safe and not stressed, and they have all the resources that they need to thrive.

 

[Deathvyper6819]

I mean like you said, as long as they’re not an endangered species and taking a few wouldn’t impact their hold in the wild I wouldn’t say there’s an issue with an individual catching a couple especially if the plan is to breed them for fellow hobbyists. Isn’t that how it all started after all?

 

[Chris LXXIX]

Speaking in general, frankly for me this is a non issue unless:

1) You are doing a WC "tour" into a protected reserve.

or

2) The species in question is a protected one (like the arachnids covered by CITES, for instance) or in danger.

After all, except for the above, 'you' are simply taking a scorpion from point A to point B, and assuming 'you' can provide the proper, legit care, well... no big deal for the bugger.

There's a lot of double standards about this issue in the hobby, and frankly I don't get why. The vast majority of centipedes in the market were, and still are, WC, but no one give a damn, while with T's is very often a 'OMG!'.

 

[Joey Spijkers]

There's a lot of double standards about this issue in the hobby, and frankly I don't get why. The vast majority of centipedes in the market were, and still are, WC, but no one give a damn, while with T's is very often a 'OMG!'.

Centipedes are apparently difficult to sex/breed (can’t speak from experience though) and the centipede hobby is very small, so there isn’t really another option for now. It’s not necessarily that no one gives a damn.

The tarantula hobby is very big and dominated by CB, so there is no reason for WC (exept new/rare species or new blood for breeders). If there is no benefit to it, then why would you?

 

[Chris LXXIX]

Centipedes are apparently difficult to sex (can’t speak from experience though)

Fixed
It's not easy to sex centipedes, indeed. Definitely not easy like sexing T's is.

and the centipede hobby is very small, so there isn’t really another option for now. It’s not necessarily that no one gives a damn.

The centipedes hobby was historically small if compared to T's one, but following the trend of those last years my opinion is that turned little by little a bit bigger. Of course, still nowhere near like T's.

A lot of centipedes arrive gravid (since the specimens are pure WC and basically almost no one bother to sex said specimens before the sale, it's normal) so you can anyway (providing the offering of the right care and set up) end with a succesfull bunch of little pedelings within some time. That's what happened to me. And I traded those pedelings. They were and remain WC pedelings, absolutely. Still, circa 30 S. subspinipes that wasn't taken straight from Vietnam etc

I don't get why this doesn't occur with a more frequency, since as said, a lot of 0.1 arrive gravid... That would be a good starting point

The tarantula hobby is very big and dominated by CB, so there is no reason for WC (exept new/rare species or new blood for breeders). If there is no benefit to it, then why would you?

My point about the WC practice of T's was at 360°... I always consider in my judgement the reasons behind, the person/s etc so I'm against the WC for profit, obviously. But if someone, don't know, lives nearby a certain, not protected T's area and we are talking about the random WC of one, not endangered species, then it's ok. No ethics or moral nor danger to consider: That Theraphosidae simply won the lottery, since will live comfy and without natural predators around

 

[Joey Spijkers]

Yeah, I think in that case, I agree. There is a huge difference between WC for commercial purposes and 1 specimen taken from your backyard in an area where they are abundant.

I wish there was more captive breeding being done with centipedes. It is one of the reasons I never got one yet. Might have to give it a try myself someday.

 

[scolopendra277]

I think scolopendra morsitans are easier to sex, and therefore breed. you can tell from the terminal legs, I think. I would assume they would, not be too difficult to establish captive-bred as some other centipede species.

 

[Georges Simp Pierre]

You could always catch a smaller one and release it when its mature