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Discussion in 'Other Spiders & Arachnids' started by Dean W, Dec 30, 2002.
I wholeheartedly agree!:?
I have been raising and breeding T's for 12 years now and hate to kill anything. I am also a hunter but I will not kill something unless I am going to eat it. But sometimes you have to think safety first. Why take the chance of having a sac of deadly spiders have the chance of doing harm to anyone if you don't know how to safely handle them. Remember you can't blame the animals if they bite you when we bring them into our lives, they are wild and only know survival. And then there is the question of if we shipped them who is to say something wouldn't of happened and they got out. Stranger things have happened we all know how reliable shipping is (ha ha ha). I shipped two boxs of T's out monday one to michagan which made it fine and one to california which we yet to find out where it is. I know the brazilian wanders would have done good somewhere but sometimes you got to ask yourself is it worth the chance. Let's keep the hobby safe so the goverment doesn't take it away, think of the story that could be read in the news if something were to happen and someone died. This is only my 2 cents not a bash on anyone so have a Happy New Year and may there be many good breedings in the hobby for 2003.
It can only be inferred that the knee-jerk remark was at least partially directed at me, being I was the unfortunate soul who suggested freezing the slings...
So, I take this time to justify my actions. Having the term "kneejerk" hanging about my neck isn't something I'm used to..
"Arachnid hobbyist keeps family of rare, higly deadly spiders while waiting to find an interested researcher to take them. Unknowing child becomes envenomated, dies hours later."
Nobel Peace Prize for scientific research,
or Darwin Award and headlines on tomorrow's NY Times?
When making a call between keeping my family and myself out of unreasonable harms way, vs. science, I'll choose my family. If I were single and lived alone, that might be a different story -- but everyone has their priorities, and they're usually quite circumstantial.
Sorry if I've offended anyone, but this is the world I live in, and while it may not match the real world, they haven't found the right combination of drugs to get me out of it..
Welcome aboard the board fellars.
I dont think im offended, at least, although i would go against killing them...
The best suggestion so far is to try and locate an interested keeper, interest group, science dept etc...im sure you can find one...also, Jacen did seem interested
Just try to leave killin them off the option list...or at least at the very bottom of it...
If the spiders are Phoneutria fera they cant survive out of captivity in the U.S. anyway, the environment is not right at all for these tropical spiders. Everybody keeps saying that they need to be destroyed like they are some kind of monster, thats complete crap...
I did what i thought was right at the time. I froze them for a few hours, however i did keep the dead baby slings. I didn't wanna kill them, i was complaining all new years to everyone about doing the wrong thing. I think i was beggining to annoy some people. The grocery store i got them from, (who were also the first people i contacted about them) said that people call them all the time, because of these spider eggs. So it is possible for me to aquire more. I would just go and root through all of the bananas.
What really threw me, was before when i thought they were harmless little T's, i had the container open so i could look at them..... ALOT. god only knows if one or two got out, so im a little paranoid, and i have my cat on lookout
If any of your are interested, i could poosibly go to the grocery store, and find another sac, and send it to those interested. Sending the eggsack would be alot safer, for you, and the spiders. Like i said before, this store said they get them alot, so im sure i could get at least one, in the next couple weeks or so.
i could also build an inclosure for em, with a small trap door for feeding, then i wouldn;t have to open it, and i could raise some, send some slings out, maybe some juvies along with a sac or 2.
Maybe they will become popular in the pet trade. Many people keep dangerous animals as pets right?
Any suggestions on a good way to house em? cuz i dont plan on moving them to another inclosure for a while.
Dean, I am also in calgary alberta. Nice to see another fellow calgarian on the forums.
Well, perhaps we should exchange contacts. it would be nice to have someone near by that i can talk spider stuff with, also someone to go to for help if i have T questions.
Sure, sounds good.
My e-mail is email@example.com
feel free to e-mail me whenever you want with questions or just to talk about spider stuff.
will do, and thanks.
yes, i had a really long talk with my mum, and even she regrets killing the poor things. It wasn't their fault they came to canada. They were just doing what they do after all, their only dangerous if your not careful. Your put your hand too close, its your own damn fault. No different then if u hit yourself in the head with a hammer. Normally having a hammer is safe, unless your not careful, or do something stupid.
We have decided (me and mum) to raise some more. Not too sure where to start tho. Anyone have a linkt o a care sheet on these things?
Should i put a website up? Should i charge for them? i need answers ppl :?
Personally, I wouldn't have killed them. There are several other options as far as dealing with a (possibly) dangerous sp.. There must be a biology center, a zoo, bug pavillion etc. who would've helped take responsibility for them. Of course if you weren't aware of those possibilities, it may have seemed that you only had the one option of extermination.
As far as keeping them effecting the hobby, it's not as if they were purchased as pets or distributed through the hobby as pets either. They hitched in on a bananna. If anyone should be worried (if they were wandering spiders that is) it should be the grocer selling the banannas. However, in order to keep the heat of a mishap off the hobbyists, I would strongly advise against sharing them with anyone other than a very experienced keeper/arachnologist, entomologist, biologist etc. (with credentials even). I wouldn't want to accept responsibility for someone else's ignorance (not to mean stupidity but rather lack of adequate knowledge) in the event of a mishap or even worse death.
No offense to you but being that you also lack the knowledge necessary in keeping this particular spider you are better off not having kept them as well regardless of how they were dispatched.
Several of us here are a little upset to hear they were exterminated (myself included) but those of us who were should consider the situation from the standpoint of someone very new to all this.
Yes, i am aware some people are upset they were destroyed, but that doesn't mean that i am not. I have never kept a Tarantula before. I dont know all that much, so i came here. All these ppl told me it was the brazillian wondering spider, and i panicked. So they told em to freeze them. And i did. Its not like i wanted to, or did it just for the sake of doing it. I didn't think i had many other options. I strongly regret doing what i did. :8o
And yes, i wasn't planning on sending them to just anyone. Only people who are experts when it comes to these things. People who i deem responsible. People who want to study them, and share their findings with everyone. Im not looking to make profit, i dont wanna spend a fortune keeping, and mailing these things everywhere either tho. Just wanted a little input, thats all.
Slow down Dean, my post was in full support of your decision. Maybe go back and read it a little more carefully.
I was also making a point to those who were upset, that your decision was (under the circumstances) very understandable. I meant no offense in any way.
Exactlly Being what we were given for info. they needed to be dead. Alot of us long term hobbiest would love to get our hands on something like that, free eggsac's come on what a gift to raise. But I would still not recomend someone who has no experience to try and raise something like the brazilian wander. If you have no idea where to start as to keeping them it would be very dangerous. If you make a good contact with someone that knows what they are doing and come across another one then it may work you have to have experience in shipping them also so there is alot to learn. Even we long term hobbiest learn everyday.
Well think I need to go to the grocery store for some milk and maybe some bananas.
with that being said I hope this has sparked an interest in our hobby for ya. Welcome to the world of spiders.
well, im reaing every refference i have at my disposal. And i looking into purchasing my G.Rosea as we speak. Is there anything that makes a nice starter spider, thats a little more interesting then redknees and chilean rose?
Im still going to get more BWS', and send some out. Whoever wants one, can have one. I wont deny anyone, unless you are deemed irresponsible, or unworthy in anyway. well, i hope you all enjoy these interesting additions to your collection.
Welcome to the hobby!
You may consider several Aphonopelma species or Brachypelma species as good starters. Also several Avicularia species (avicularia, metallica, urticans etc.) are good starter arboreal T's as well.
Back on the issue of the BWS, how exactly would you deem someone responsible enough to keep one. Outside of those with obvious credit to their experience of course. Unfortunately, you won't really likely know if someone's not fit to keep one until they have proven somehow that they aren't fit to keep them.
AGain, spreading them around is the point at which the hobby comes into jeopardy. Please, please keep that in mind.
Another important thing to consider is that even if the person you are sending them to is an expert, the many many people involved in the shipping chain are not. Lots of times, the shipping handlers are the worst people you could endow with such a dangerous animal. I'm almost to the point of pleading with you not to distribute these spiders. Especially under the pretense that "Whoever wants one, can have one. I wont deny anyone, unless you are deemed irresponsible, or unworthy in anyway". There is no failsafe way to make such a judgement. And believe me, if BWS's are what you're dealing with, you need to think on the level of "FAIL-SAFE" period. Again. I mean no offense whatsoever but I must point out that you are a (self proclaimed) beginner. That in mind, you aren't qualified in any way to judge who is responsible in that capacity.
oh, well i noticed i dont know that much, and i cant make a judgment whether someone is responsible or not, but i highly doubt someone would lie, or say they are experts, when thy re not. Its not like im giving away free money, these are highly venomous, highly dangerous spiders. And no on ein their right mind would ask for one (or some) unless they were absolutely sure and are completely confident with their knowledge and/or ability.
I was gonna send a few to: 2 highly experienced hobbiests, and 2 laboratories or a bio lab specializing in keeping/identifying a possibly hazardous species. Like i said before, i wasnt to have a proper ID first, then learn as much as we can, before i send them out to keep just cuz. Accidents are accidents, but not whe they happen to the ignorant, or the naive. Im still open to any ideas anyone has.
And as far as first spiders go...... Metalica is a good beginner? nice!, where cna i get one? what better to keep, male or female? or does differ per species?
If you go to the links section of this board, you'll find a great list of dealers. Also, the "Dealer Reviews" section is very useful in choosing who to buy from. Good luck with your first T! If you have any questions regarding a particular specie, most anyone here would be happy to help you out.
I would suggest a Brazilian Black (Grammostola pulchra) as a beginner spider. I do not believe there is a documented case of one of these biting anyone, and they grow to 6 inches and are jet velvetly black. A little more interesting than a rosehair or something. E-mail me or something and i can hook you up with care info, species reccomendation, and, in my opinion, the only person to buy spiders from in canada. Chris Maidens of Chris' Creepy Crawlies. I have had only good experiences dealing with him and his prices are reasonable. E-mail me at firstname.lastname@example.org with anything you would like to know and ill help you out.