dog cruelty

[8ball]

I think it's wrong, I put myself from their point of view even though they're dog's they feel pain too, Imagine if we were the pet's and we we're getting our ear's clipped.

 

[8ball]

About the nutering well, I think dog's we're doing just fine before they were pet's so I just say leave them how they are. But this isn't my world to run.

 

[padkison]

This thread reminds me of the time I bred my springer spaniel. This breed has a cropped tail. It is a hunting dog and a full tail has long hair that would become a nasty mess in the field.

Anyway, we had no vet in our town in AK which we had to fly into because of no roads. I read up on the cropping procedure. You either had to do it in the 1st day or two or wait for several weeks. I snipped the tails with scissors and used cornstarch to staunch bleeding (not much). Unpleasant.

 

[~Abyss~]

About the nutering well, I think dog's we're doing just fine before they were pet's so I just say leave them how they are. But this isn't my world to run.

well dogs (like humans) feel pain, (that's how we train them) but i would compare ear cropping to ear piercing in humans when done in babies no problem (same goes for circumcisions). I read in a book my teacher has (i'll get the tittle for you guys tommorow) that pups have very little nerves around the ear or none at all. they do a pinching technique in where the human pinches firmly the ear to get a reaction from the dog of no reaction occurs no anastetic is needed. But the procedure in adult dogs is done with anastetics of course. Just giving some info.

 

[Ryan C.]

Ear cropping is not comparable to ear piercing at all.

When you get your ear pierced you get a small hole in your ear, That if the piercing is taken out will heal in a pretty short amount of time.

On the other hand if I were to chop off the tops of my ears I wouldn't be growing them back.

 

[~Abyss~]

True but im comparing it to the fact that the dog or person would forget all about it and not mind it at all. I also wouldnt choose the words "choped off" there surgicaly removed. On a side note i was wrong about the nerves. They check for cartilage theres no nerves to talk about but rather the fastest healing cartilage according to what shape you want to crop the ears. Sorry for the misunderstanding

 

[Ryan C.]

I dont think I would forget all about having close to half of my ears gone.

 

[JungleGuts]

all i know is that on our boxers(were on our second) we leave all the ears natural. we also let him keep is "pride" if ya know what i mean

 

[~Abyss~]

sure it's achoice personally if had a boxer male i would do both crop and dock just because i like having a dog that would warn of intruders but a female i would leave her natural because I love the looks of a naturally beatiful bitch. And Ryan you would forget the ears trust me you would forget. That is untill you look in the mirror

 

[JungleGuts]

ya i doubt before a dog goes to sleep it night it thinks to itself, "i wish i had my normal ears." But im for the natural look myself anyway

 

[~Abyss~]

I aggree some dogs do look better naturally in fact MOST dogs but i do think some look better with what I consider minor alterations. In Boxers i think males onlu look better because the female is better looking naturally

 

[JungleGuts]

it the cropped ears on a male boxer does make it look pretty good!

 

[MSFT Charmed 1]

To Crop Or Not To Crop

I DO NOT believe that cropping does any harm, but neither do I think it is a necessary evil. The whole cropping/docking thing has come about as a "fashion statement" To suit people's whims.

I do not think it can be compared with spaying and/or neutering however. In the respect of causing pain . .. Any kind of surgery no matter how minor causes pain. heck even suturing a wound causes pain because of nerve endings.

But I believe that ANY Cat/ or DOG that does not meet good conformation and temperament standards SHOULD BE SPAYED/NEUTERED. For one thing there are ENOUGH unwanted animals on this planet which come about from PLANNED breedings (Be it for the right or wrong reasons) that we do not need to compound the problem by NOT spaying or neutering.

Secondly unspayed/neutered animals are generally happier and calmer. Take the hormones out of the equation and BINGO . . . instant calm! (MOSTLY)

But from personal experience the Dog/cat/horse that has undergone spaying/neutering/ or guelding under my care has come out a happier and healthier animal.

 

[Varden]

I can understand ear docking, since floppy ears make the ideal swamp grounds for painful ear infections in dog breeds that have them. I don't consider either to be cruelty though if done by a professional vet. I had both done on my female's puppies, and I shelled out big bucks for the anesthetic.

It's no more cruel that circumcision in human babies.

 

[~Abyss~]

I DO NOT believe that cropping does any harm, but neither do I think it is a necessary evil. The whole cropping/docking thing has come about as a "fashion statement" To suit people's whims.

I do not think it can be compared with spaying and/or neutering however. In the respect of causing pain . .. Any kind of surgery no matter how minor causes pain. heck even suturing a wound causes pain because of nerve endings.

But I believe that ANY Cat/ or DOG that does not meet good conformation and temperament standards SHOULD BE SPAYED/NEUTERED. For one thing there are ENOUGH unwanted animals on this planet which come about from PLANNED breedings (Be it for the right or wrong reasons) that we do not need to compound the problem by NOT spaying or neutering.

Secondly unspayed/neutered animals are generally happier and calmer. Take the hormones out of the equation and BINGO . . . instant calm! (MOSTLY)

But from personal experience the Dog/cat/horse that has undergone spaying/neutering/ or guelding under my care has come out a happier and healthier animal.

I think if you want a calm(by neutering) dog is only to suit human whims as well isn't it ? Just asking

 

[~Abyss~]

Tought I would end this thread would a little comedy and some REAL dog crueltyhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNJYoSS5dC4

 

[L_mactans]

I used to work at a vet clinic, and every docking/cropping/ and even dew claw removals were done in the safest most humane way possible. Puppies were playing the same afternoon as if all were fine in the world. I personally don't feel it is cruel.
As with spaying and neutering, although not 100% necessary, I feel that it IS better for the animal. I loved in Panama for 2 1/2 years in a small town. I owned dogs, cats, chickens and iguana. My male cat was neutered but my male dog was not. The difference between the 2 was so apparant. The male dog would literally starve itself if there were any female in heat for miles, as would every other dog there. Even though I gave it regular meals and vaccinations, the drive to mate was much stronger than the drive to eat. Whereas the cat was the healthiest cat in the whole town. Same treatment but health wise the neutered animal was in much better physical condition. I am very much an advocate for spaying and neutering.
Kelly (L_mac)

 

[thisgal]

Gah. Of course spaying and neutering is done to make owning a pet easier. That's the point. In exchange for the food, water, shelter, walks, runs, haircuts, baths, and just plain love we are expected to give our pets, we want them to behave. I highly doubt they realise what they're missing, and besides the general behaviour reason to neuter, there are sometimes other reasons as well. Yeah, some people are irresponsible when it comes to containing their pets. What if my unspayed dog is out the yard (restrained by our invisible fence) and the neighbours' dog strolls up and has his way with her? If she's already spayed, the decision of what to do with the puppies will not have to be made.

..Or if I get an adorable puppy from the pound, and of course, no one can be sure what breeds he has in him....but the dominant breed is one that is so full of energy and aggression that the only way to keep him under control is through neutering and routine obedience training?

Cats, on the other hand, are not restrained like dogs are. Cats tend to run free during the day, returning home at night. Do the math, or deal with a litter.

This is a matter of personal choice. Evaluate the pet's behaviour and environment and make the decision based on the conclusions you reach. As long as ALL surgeries are professionally done, there's no problem here.


And then there's the docking/cropping deal. Personally, I doubt I'd ever do either one, but I'm not gonna get mad at my neighbour because he's gotten his pit bull's tail docked.

An example of both circumstances: My sister has a 3 month old baby. The boyfriend has a 5 year old female pit bull. The dog is energetic, to say the least. She was spayed during my sister's pregnancy to calm her down around the baby. Success so far. Then there's her tail.... this thing is like a whip. She's given black eyes with the thing. They have no intention of docking it that I know of, but doesn't that sound like a good idea?

 

[~Abyss~]

I have no problem with the whole neutering thing i just dont need to with my dog he's fine i guess there arent any bitches anywhere near where I live. Most dogs aroung my block are males except for the exception of a female German Shepard but shes way the hell over the next block

 

[pitbulllady]

Gah. Of course spaying and neutering is done to make owning a pet easier. That's the point. In exchange for the food, water, shelter, walks, runs, haircuts, baths, and just plain love we are expected to give our pets, we want them to behave. I highly doubt they realise what they're missing, and besides the general behaviour reason to neuter, there are sometimes other reasons as well. Yeah, some people are irresponsible when it comes to containing their pets. What if my unspayed dog is out the yard (restrained by our invisible fence) and the neighbours' dog strolls up and has his way with her? If she's already spayed, the decision of what to do with the puppies will not have to be made.

..Or if I get an adorable puppy from the pound, and of course, no one can be sure what breeds he has in him....but the dominant breed is one that is so full of energy and aggression that the only way to keep him under control is through neutering and routine obedience training?

Cats, on the other hand, are not restrained like dogs are. Cats tend to run free during the day, returning home at night. Do the math, or deal with a litter.

This is a matter of personal choice. Evaluate the pet's behaviour and environment and make the decision based on the conclusions you reach. As long as ALL surgeries are professionally done, there's no problem here.


And then there's the docking/cropping deal. Personally, I doubt I'd ever do either one, but I'm not gonna get mad at my neighbour because he's gotten his pit bull's tail docked.

An example of both circumstances: My sister has a 3 month old baby. The boyfriend has a 5 year old female pit bull. The dog is energetic, to say the least. She was spayed during my sister's pregnancy to calm her down around the baby. Success so far. Then there's her tail.... this thing is like a whip. She's given black eyes with the thing. They have no intention of docking it that I know of, but doesn't that sound like a good idea?

Pit Bulls are NOT one of the breeds that are usually docked, unless it really is for medical reasons. Sometimes one of these(and other breeds)will be such enthusiastic waggers that they literally will beat the hide off their tails banging them against things, especially if they're kept indoors. The tail cannot heal since the dog is constantly re-injuring it, so it gets infected, the dog starts licking and chewing it, and it winds up having to be docked. HOWEVER, in every breed standard for the American Pit Bull Terrier, a docked tail is a disqualification from show competition, and in some registeries, will result in revoked registration unless it can be proven that it was done for medical purposes. The head and body type of the Pit Bull are dominant physical characteristics, and you can get a dog with very similar head and body structure to a Pit Bull that has absolutely no Pit Bull ancestry at all, just by crossing breeds, but their tail is a bit unique, and hard to replicate, PLUS even people who do not fight their dogs take into consideration that the tail is used for balance while fighting and an indicator of whether the dog is likely to "cur"(give up and quit). I can still see the point, though, of docking any long-tailed breed that lives indoors; if you think a Pit Bull's tail is bad, try living with a 115-pound Catahoula indoors whose tail is as long as a Pit Bull's entire body! Getting hit with that is like having someone beat you, with all their strength, using a three-foot piece of garden hose! I had a Catahoula crack open a 75-gallon aquarium with her tail once-and yes, it was full of water and fish. That pretty much turned me off of EVER keeping fish or anything else than had to live in water.

pitbulllady