Do tarantulas really "get used" to being handled?

[ragnarokxg]

Yeah, i have noticed that with mine. very often can pick her up and let her crawl around. but some times she just does not want to be messed with. but also, G. roseas are known for having mood swings.

Yeah I have a G. rosea that slapped me everytime I tried to hold it for a month. Now I can hold it no problem, except when she is hungry and she is one hell of a eater.

 

[DrVenom24]

tarantulas arent ment to be handled there ment to be looked at in my imo but allot of people handle there T.s pretty well and some T's seem enjoy i geuss u gotta find out if urs does 2

 

[BobGrill]

Interesting topic here. I really can't say though. My Rosie and Avic are really the only ones I handle right now. The avic is surprisingly calm and hasn't tried to jump at all yet. The Rosie kind of makes me nervous at times. She'll usually tolerate being held occasionally, but when I see her fangs unfolding, then I know it's time to put her back.

 

[Storm76]

Actually something interesting I've noticed with my avic is that she doesn't like being on bare skin at all, as soon as her foot touches it she'll turn the other way avoiding skin at all cost lol But if I offer her my arm (if I'm wearing a long sleeved shirt) then she'll walk onto the clothing no problem. She especially likes denim it seems, she'll sit on my jeans forever haha

Interesting maybe bare skin is too hot for her but with clothes is less hot surface but still warm. But having seen so many pics of bare hands holding T i wonder if it's a particular case or not.
Someone else experienced a preference of covered skin to bare skin?

I've made the experience that Avics in general seem to dislike the touch of human skin. It's probably because they instinctively feel it's "living" and not just some tree they're walking on? No idea, it's only an assumption, but often they act quite skittish once on your hand.

Aside that I follow the "hands-off" policy most of the time. Exceptions are when they run onto me, or the little E. sp. "red" that constantly want to go walking.

 

[grayzone]

no doubt they know that theyre on something living.
Aside from the warmth, they can likely feel our pulse, possibly even our blood flowing through our veins. Much the way mosquitoes and other spiders can... (well, i assume they can.. they certainly always seem to find a vein while snacking on humans at night)

 

[alpine]

I think it also has a lot to do with personality and wether or not they are more "outgoing" or "willing" to be handled in that way. Both of my Versicolors are very willing to walk out onto my hand as they are always trying to walk out of their enclosures. My other Ts show a propensity for running away as soon as they realize I am looking at them closely.

 

[Storm76]

I think it also has a lot to do with personality and wether or not they are more "outgoing" or "willing" to be handled in that way. Both of my Versicolors are very willing to walk out onto my hand as they are always trying to walk out of their enclosures. My other Ts show a propensity for running away as soon as they realize I am looking at them closely.

My couple here would love to, too. Only problem is that the sacmate of the one I handled isn't that nice at all

 

[ragnarokxg]

Loving this topic, I noticed with my new GBB slings they are skittish little boogers and will take off or kick hairs if you look at them wrong. My fiancees is more apt to just jet while mine will kick hairs the moment you try to touch it. I hope they calm down with me soon. As for my two A. azuraklaasi the one I haven't handled more let me handle it yesterday and he wanted to go exploring he didn't jet or anything. So I guess their personality has something to do with being handled or not.

 

[Litoria]

Arachnids have a keen sense of "taste" on the hairs all over their body, and they can even feel the patterns of your heartbeat. That's how they map their environment. Tarantulas will know exactly who they walk on. They can recognise you (if you handle them often) as secure/dangerous according to your reactions. Their memory will get better with age (good for hem xD). I had a male pulchripes, who even thought of my hands as a "mobile safety area" when a breeze or some other "strange" event startled him.

 

[Kazaam]

No, but they're docile enough to be handled sometimes.

 

[Storm76]

. Tarantulas will know exactly who they walk on. They can recognise you (if you handle them often) as secure/dangerous according to your reactions. Their memory will get better with age (good for hem xD).

Sorry, but I highly doubt that...

 

[Theist 17]

This all makes me wonder--could we breed for docility? If there are individuals with more docile behavior, could we inbreed that trait, similar to what was done with Siberian wolves recently? I know I'm analoguing mammalian domestication to invertebrate breeding, but it looks possible to an outsider.

 

[vespers]

Arachnids have a keen sense of "taste" on the hairs all over their body, and they can even feel the patterns of your heartbeat. That's how they map their environment. Tarantulas will know exactly who they walk on. They can recognise you (if you handle them often) as secure/dangerous according to your reactions. Their memory will get better with age (good for hem xD).

Tarantulas also wear a mask to protect their identity. They can sometimes be found living with their widowed aunt, and defending themselves and others from a flying goblin.

 

[ragnarokxg]

This all makes me wonder--could we breed for docility? If there are individuals with more docile behavior, could we inbreed that trait, similar to what was done with Siberian wolves recently? I know I'm analoguing mammalian domestication to invertebrate breeding, but it looks possible to an outsider.

I have wondered this also, but seeing that it is a personality trait and not just a behaviour it may not be possible. For example G. rosea are known for being docile but there are many stories on here that show that there are plenty of them that are mean and evil little boogers. If we knew when the trait developed or if it was always there then we could see about it, but there hasn't been much study on Theraphosidae to even try to guess.

One thought I had was that if the slings that seemed to cannibalize more often were more defensive/aggressive or would they be the more docile ones. This would require monitoring and marking slings for a while before separating the group and that would be difficult with the sheer number of slings some sacs develop. But that brings up another thought would these so called 'Alphas' be the ones that are more territorial and thus way more defensive?

 

[Shrike]

Arachnids have a keen sense of "taste" on the hairs all over their body, and they can even feel the patterns of your heartbeat. That's how they map their environment. Tarantulas will know exactly who they walk on. They can recognise you (if you handle them often) as secure/dangerous according to your reactions. Their memory will get better with age (good for hem xD).

"I said where'd you get your information from huh?"

Recognizing that there's a great deal we don't know about tarantulas, I think there's a bit of anthropomorphization going on in this thread. No doubt tarantulas are amazing in their capacity to perceive the world around them via physical stimuli. Regardless of our varied opinions on this subject, I know we all appreciate what perfect little biological machines they are. I can even buy into the concept of conditioning to a certain extent...but recognizing you? Distinguishing between individual humans, friend and foe? Understanding? What exactly is being understood?

When you handle a tarantula, to a large extent, I think you're simply fooling it. When the tables get turned and the stimuli communicate THREAT, the tarantula will flee for safety or you'll get bitten.

It seems like the majority of people that have reached some sort of "understanding" with their tarantula have done so with their Avicularia, or their B. albopilosum, or some other similarly placid species. How come you aren't bff with your Psalmos, H. macs, Poecis, or P. murinus? Personally, I think it's because, in addition to being more defensive species, they're simply tarantulas, and don't give flying hoot who or what is holding them.

 

[Tarac]

no doubt they know that theyre on something living.
Aside from the warmth, they can likely feel our pulse, possibly even our blood flowing through our veins. Much the way mosquitoes and other spiders can... (well, i assume they can.. they certainly always seem to find a vein while snacking on humans at night)

I agree, I expect they can tell you that you are warm, motile, etc.

Just a note- mosquitoes can follow carbon dioxide from the skin as well as other key attractants which are sometimes very host specific depending on the adaptations of the mosquito. Many detect lactic acid in addition to CO2 and those which are picky feeders will even be able to find you from pheromones. It was also just recently published that mosquitoes can detect blood-glucose levels which is why some people profess to be more "tasty" to a mosquito. Some people are like a slice of chocolate cake, others are chopped liver as far as the mosquito is concerned.

I suspect it is not likely a tarantula would not have these specific adaptations in common with a mosquito because they are relatively useless for a home-bound, ambush predator. These are tailored for a blood-seeking organism. More likely they can detect the slightest movements, such as the pulse and other very trace disturbances such as change in air currents and those types of things that would help an animal notice variable, typically ectothermic prey wandering nearby. Obviously as animals we share a lot of those same indicators of our vitality so it's completely expected for them to be able to use which ever set of those things that are useful to them in the wild to also identify us as being non-plant living beings.

I absolutely do not think they can at all "recognize" a specific person. That is a completely useless commitment of neurons to a very primitive and limited organism. They are not like parrots that need to be able to ID their mate in a flock, these are solitary animals that have no need to do anything in terms of "recognition" other than to rapidly identify if you are a threat, a meal or neither. Beyond that we are just anthropomorphizing, assuming that what we think is a change in their behavior (whether it is real or not) has anything to do with knowing us specifically rather than simply being conditioned to know that whatever type of thing we are is not going to harm them.

Can it appear that they recognize someone specific? Sure, if you overlook some details because you are thinking like a visually oriented animal and not like a tarantula. This is a common mistake people make when trying to find evidence of a tarantula being able to distinguish them specifically. It's easy to see how one could live in a house of two people and have one person not terrified of tarantulas and the other near-phobic, resulting in perceiving a false sense of recognition due to different reactions from the spider when being handled by either party. All kinds of subtle physiologic differences are responsible for the differentiation, such that the one person who is not scared can handle them and has conditioned them to be handled, while the other person has extra or different stimuli associated with them which are not familiar by default of being scared and not being involved in their conditioning.

Does it mean they can tell the two people apart in a crowd? Absolutely not. It means that people who are calm would be familiar stimulus, regardless of who they are, while people who have hearts racing, sweat on their skin, fast or startled movements, accelerated breathing, etc. would all be unfamiliar as they would be naturally disinclined to interact in the first place and so not afford the spider any chance to be conditioned to this new set of stimulus. So in fact it's more like they recognize us so little in the canonical sense that they cannot even tell both people dwelling in the house are in fact both people with no intention of harming them. This is simply because one sets off more of those alarm cues than the other, one seems more new and therefor more risky to be around than the other person.

Does that make sense? In essence, a tarantula is aware of a set of stimuli and through repeated experience, like most other animals, they can adjust to them once they are desensitized through repetition. It may allow them to distinguish between kinds of people in terms of subtle, relevant cues like movement and heart rate, but they have no use whatsoever for individual-specific recognition being the type of neurologically simple and solitary animals that they are.

 

[MarkmD]

Alot of interesting posts, I doubt they can ID you as we know their site is bad so a big nono, it's possible they may know you (over time) by the feeling of your skin or prints, can't say for sure of course, definitely not because they are (docile), mainly because it's up to the individual T's personality and it being aware of it's surroundings to how it reacts to new situations, however if they don't feel a threat or startled by your touch then they have a calm temperament but never docile, because every T can bite on any given moment with fue warnings before. it's even possible they learn in stages with a small memory of surfaces including handling, that's a long shot though.

We may never know how much they can learn or understand, as only they know, we could ask them, but will never get an answer, but They are smart.

 

[jecraque]

I don't handle mine, because I see no reason to do so. That being said, there have been a lot of claims made without much evidence, and I doubt there's relevant work being done at the moment in terms of the kinds and degrees of sensory input these things are capable of at all, much less how they would process/interpret that. As far as I know there have only been a handful of researchers looking at pheromones/chemical signals in any spiders, so there could be a lot to learn still.

Several years back, I bought a crested gecko (still have it) and my then-husband (got rid of it) would get pooped on every time he tried handling. I never did. While I used this as an opportunity to crack jokes about the gecko's excellent character judgment, we both looked into it and decided, very un-rigorously, that it was potentially a difference in temperature that caused the differential pooping-upon. My hands were always cold (women have higher core temps and my circulation is terrible); his were always warm, and an apparently inviting toilet. The moral of the story? I have no idea. It's tough to tell what animals perceive, I guess.

Interesting mosquito tidbits, though--I remember reading a paper years ago now that blood alcohol content was also an attractant to some mosquitoes.

 

[Storm76]

Does it mean they can tell the two people apart in a crowd? Absolutely not. It means that people who are calm would be familiar stimulus, regardless of who they are, while people who have hearts racing, sweat on their skin, fast or startled movements, accelerated breathing, etc. would all be unfamiliar as they would be naturally disinclined to interact in the first place and so not afford the spider any chance to be conditioned to this new set of stimulus. So in fact it's more like they recognize us so little in the canonical sense that they cannot even tell both people dwelling in the house are in fact both people with no intention of harming them. This is simply because one sets off more of those alarm cues than the other, one seems more new and therefor more risky to be around than the other person.

Personally I think this is spot-on. The magic word being "conditioning". On the other hand: It always makes me wonder why most of us (including myself) bring up the "size of brain" that tarantulas have and state "it's not possible" - but is there any scientific proof? It would probably take a large experiment to completely determine to a) which level they can be conditioned and b) how far the "learning" thing goes with them. I do realize that once you start keeping this awesome critters, you start to assume a certain "learning curve" with the specimens in your care, simply because it seems as it they "adjust" to situations, stimuli. But personally, I still think it's right that: Adjustment to stimuli experienced - yes that does suggest a small capability of learning, though.

 

[Tarac]

Personally I think this is spot-on. The magic word being "conditioning". On the other hand: It always makes me wonder why most of us (including myself) bring up the "size of brain" that tarantulas have and state "it's not possible" - but is there any scientific proof? It would probably take a large experiment to completely determine to a) which level they can be conditioned and b) how far the "learning" thing goes with them. I do realize that once you start keeping this awesome critters, you start to assume a certain "learning curve" with the specimens in your care, simply because it seems as it they "adjust" to situations, stimuli. But personally, I still think it's right that: Adjustment to stimuli experienced - yes that does suggest a small capability of learning, though.

Simple organization without the available complex associations between regions as we find in so-called "higher taxa" or even something like a cephalopod where cross-network responses are possible. Suggests a lack cognitive learning at the very least. If you have to more or less bilaterally arranged lines of neural pathways punctuated by ganglia you can expect only the adjacent ganglia to receive the stimulus in a useful time frame. Tarantulas exhibit nociceptive responses but cannot use other stored information from an organized neural center to apply other information when formulating the response as can animals which are considered to be sentient.

Learning has so many flavors that it can indeed be said that tarantulas can learn as all types of conditioning are learning. But cognitive learning is more than likely outside of their capacity. The hardware is so simple and vectorial that it's pretty much inconceivable that a tarantula is able to draw on information stored in another part of the body to help formulate a complex response to any stimulus. Evolution of course favors useful forms, form follows function and the form of a tarantulas neurological system is more or less linear, which doesn't allow for cross-network operations as it does in animals with a centralized control center. That's why brain size, or lack of a brain in this case, comes up. Implies that complex responses are impossible with this type of organization because the other parts of the network are effectively isolated from the source of the response signal. So the tarantula may get a stimulus to move that causes all the legs to move, but it will not be able to make a decision on whether it is warranted- use wind blowing as an example. A gust pops up, the tarantula starts to run when it strikes the hairs. Does it really have to? Maybe if the gust is from a predator breathing on it, but not if it is simply a gust of wind. The tarantula cannot qualify the stimulus, only respond to it. And it's not unexpected given the layout of the tarantula's neurological system.

There are some examples that muddy the waters, like bees and other social invertebrates, that do seem to fulfill some of the requirements for cognitive thought. But since we are talking about tarantulas which are solitary and having the limited neurological system they have, it is probably safe to assume that tarantulas are not sentient in the way that would be required to recognize one's owner and caretaker compared to any other similarly tarantula-friendly person.