Ceratogyrus questions and observations

[Formerphobe]

I'm relatively new to the Ceratogyrus genus. I have two ~3.0 inch dls C. darlingi that I've raised over the past year from ~1.0". Both have been showing prominent horns for the past few molt cycles. Both are in the habit of shredding or not even giving up their exuvia so I have no idea what sex they are. (I have flunked Ventral Sexing 101 on more than one occasion, so I won't even go there...) It's my understanding that the bigger the horn, the more likely it is to be female. Correct?

I've also had 3 C. marshalli for about 7 months, all currently ~2+ inches. If I look really hard, I can pretend I see horns... Do darlingi and marshalli develop their horns at comparable instars? Do I revisit the marshalli in a few more molts, or should I assume that all are boy spiders?

I've also noticed that both of these species seem to be easily conditioned, or very nosy. I rarely see them out if I look in during the day or peek in at night with a flashlight. (Yes, I am one of those keepers...) But, let me move their enclosures, or take off the lids, and they're all peeking out of their burrows to see what's for dinner, or what's going on. Perhaps preparation for being defensive? I don't recall a threat pose from any of them.

Right before this photo was taken, the burrow entrance had a plug in it. By the time I moved enclosure from shelf to bed, I saw this:

Rarely do they turn down a meal. Horn very visible on this C. darlingi trying to stuff his/her roach down the hole.


C. marshalli. Horn?.?.?

 

[Ceratogyrus]

Marshalli develop their horns after darlingi do, with brachycephalus showing a horn at 2nd instar already!
All of my Ceratogyrus have great appetites and I never have hassles feeding them. The only Ceratogyrus species I often get threat poses from is marshalli. The rest are pretty chilled, with brachycephalus being real kittens that I would handle with no second guesses.

Edit: actually looking now, some of my marshalli show horns as early as darlingi. The marshalli pictured below is maybe one moult bigger than the darlingi (6cm) with the brachycephalus maybe slightly under 5cm.

 

[Formerphobe]

Thank you! (Gonna have to get me a couple of C. brachycephalus.)
And the females have bigger horns that the males in all three species?

 

[Alltheworld601]

I'm digging that brachycephalus too. That's awesome that they get them so early.

I had a C. darlingi for a while. It was actually really laid back. From talking to other keepers, I get the impression that this genus doesn't generally live up to its "angry baboon" expectations. Love the picture of yours peeking out of the hole. It looks to me like she's just curious as to whether or not the movement means food. My kid was a great eater as well.

 

[Ceratogyrus]

Thank you! (Gonna have to get me a couple of C. brachycephalus.)
And the females have bigger horns that the males in all three species?

Correct.
In marshalli the male has a really small horn. I will post some pics of marshalli and brachycephalus MM a bit later (Off to go play some golf )

 

[fatich]

Here is my mature male Ceratogyrus marshalli :



and female :

 

[Ceratogyrus]

Totally forgot to post...
C.marshalli MM



C.brachycephalus MM



---------- Post added 10-01-2013 at 12:38 PM ----------

Here is a comparison for you from a few of my specimens...
I tried to get the sizes as close as possible to what you were talking about.
Unfortunately these are unsexed, so suppose the comparison could be a little pointless, but here goes anyway...

 

[McGuiverstein]

From talking to other keepers, I get the impression that this genus doesn't generally live up to its "angry baboon" expectations

Would you please inform my 3" darlingi girl of this? Just rehoused her minutes ago and she's grown an attitude that would make some OBTs jealous. She was slapping, biting, and running around like the earth was falling out underneath her. Quite a fun experience.

 

[Formerphobe]

Would you please inform my 3" darlingi girl of this? Just rehoused her minutes ago and she's grown an attitude that would make some OBTs jealous. She was slapping, biting, and running around like the earth was falling out underneath her. Quite a fun experience.

Oh, my... My C. darlingi have been completely docile thus far, and easily rehoused. But, so have my OBTs...

 

[McGuiverstein]

Yeah, not sure why she was so unpleasant. But hey, I'm taking the good with the bad. She's very frequently out and about, and she's been kind enough to burrow against the side in both the enclosures I've had her in. Actually all but one of my darlingi are frequently out.. Wonder if that means they're all going to be unpleasant haha. One of the two slings I have was giving me threat displays at ~.5" so I'm thinking probably so. My 4" OBT only gave me one big display once he was already in his new enclosure, and my two irminia are almost always out. I'm starting to think many of my spiders are anomalies haha.

 

[Formerphobe]

Yeah, not sure why she was so unpleasant. But hey, I'm taking the good with the bad. She's very frequently out and about, and she's been kind enough to burrow against the side in both the enclosures I've had her in. Actually all but one of my darlingi are frequently out.. Wonder if that means they're all going to be unpleasant haha. One of the two slings I have was giving me threat displays at ~.5" so I'm thinking probably so. My 4" OBT only gave me one big display once he was already in his new enclosure, and my two irminia are almost always out. I'm starting to think many of my spiders are anomalies haha.

My first OBT led me a merry chase at initial unpacking when he was all of about 0.5" and that was the only attitude he ever gave me. OBT #2 never gave me a bit of 'tude. When I packed him to go off to meet the girls I had to dig him out. He was huddled in a tight little ball deep in his webbed labyrinth - amazing feat for a spider with nearly a six inch leg span. It's crazy how tiny they can make themselves. OBT #3, ~5.0 inch female is also a hider not a fighter.

The OBT I have to sneak up on to get a peek at her. The C. darlingi and marshalli, I rattle their enclosures and they come out to see what's up. LOL

 

[McGuiverstein]

Haha sounds like you have some pretty mellow OBTs.

Haha moving the container is all I have to do to get the girl I just rehoused and all of my C. fimbriatus slings to come up and say hi. That's what happened initially when I got the darlingi's enclosure out tonight, but the second I started scooting sub, she was up and bobbing. Maybe she was just trying to get me to do the wave. That's it, she's just a baseball fan X)

 

[Formerphobe]

Update:
One of the C. darlingi, with it's very prominent horn, is now a ~3.5 - 4.0" mature male. 'Boxing gloves' and tibial hooks as prominent now as his horn.

Of the three ~3.0" C. marshalli, each with their tiny little button 'horns', that I assumed all males - one has been molt sexed male and still has a little button horn, #2 has been molt sexed female and has grown a noticeable horn in one molt. #3 is still in hiding and its mauled exuvium is soaking...

Can some one please send my horned baboons the chapter they are supposed to read on gender and foveal horns?

 

[McGuiverstein]

Interesting.... Evidently the pronounced horn isn't quite as indicative of gender as I'd previously understood.. Hmm. I'm interested to see if this is also true with my two younger darlingi's as they age.

 

[Formerphobe]

Last exuvium is just too mutilated to be sure, but I'm leaning toward male. Once the spider comes out of hiding, I can compare horns to its brother's and sister's.

 

[viper69]

I'm relatively new to the Ceratogyrus genus. I have two ~3.0 inch dls C. darlingi that I've raised over the past year from ~1.0". Both have been showing prominent horns for the past few molt cycles. Both are in the habit of shredding or not even giving up their exuvia so I have no idea what sex they are. (I have flunked Ventral Sexing 101 on more than one occasion, so I won't even go there...) It's my understanding that the bigger the horn, the more likely it is to be female. Correct?

I've also had 3 C. marshalli for about 7 months, all currently ~2+ inches. If I look really hard, I can pretend I see horns... Do darlingi and marshalli develop their horns at comparable instars? Do I revisit the marshalli in a few more molts, or should I assume that all are boy spiders?

I've also noticed that both of these species seem to be easily conditioned, or very nosy. I rarely see them out if I look in during the day or peek in at night with a flashlight. (Yes, I am one of those keepers...) But, let me move their enclosures, or take off the lids, and they're all peeking out of their burrows to see what's for dinner, or what's going on. Perhaps preparation for being defensive? I don't recall a threat pose from any of them.

My Marshalli is much younger than yours. It comes out during the morning/early evening and hangs out on the tower it built up which is right against the lid. Fortunately for now it runs down the towers hole it dug when I open the lid!

Curious, how deep is the substrate for your Marshalli ? I'd like to avoid my T being up against the lid so it can't easily escape. Nice pics!

 

[Formerphobe]

My Marshalli is much younger than yours. It comes out during the morning/early evening and hangs out on the tower it built up which is right against the lid. Fortunately for now it runs down the towers hole it dug when I open the lid!

Curious, how deep is the substrate for your Marshalli ? I'd like to avoid my T being up against the lid so it can't easily escape. Nice pics!

Well, they're due to be rehoused. When I put them in their current enclosures (~5.0" tall) , they were ~0.75" and had 3" of substrate. They've all rearranged so that part of the substrate and sections of their tunnels are up against the lid. To date, they've all run back down their burrows whenever I open the lids. IME, most spiders will retreat to something familiar rather than bolt for the unfamiliar. But, there are always exceptions...

 

[viper69]

Well, they're due to be rehoused. When I put them in their current enclosures (~5.0" tall) , they were ~0.75" and had 3" of substrate. They've all rearranged so that part of the substrate and sections of their tunnels are up against the lid. To date, they've all run back down their burrows whenever I open the lids. IME, most spiders will retreat to something familiar rather than bolt for the unfamiliar. But, there are always exceptions...

That's more than what I gave mine. My sling is prob about .5. I THOUGHT I gave him enough, here's the link, you can see his legs haha http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?256329-What-an-industrious-builder!!

In a few hours he built this tower of substrate against the cork bark, np, the opening is literally only enough space for its body and crix to move around.

 

[Formerphobe]

Cool! My A. enzendamis are my turret builders. C. marshalli and C. darlingi all raised the entire level of the substrate as high as they could.

 

[viper69]

Cool! My A. enzendamis are my turret builders. C. marshalli and C. darlingi all raised the entire level of the substrate as high as they could.

Glad it's not just me. But not cool, makes opening the deli cup TRICKY. Man, I don't understand why they do build up. Strangest of all my burrowers in that regard. I'm going to have to ask Cerato on here.