Caring for large stag beetles / scarabs?

[Elytra and Antenna]

Wade - I don't think there's anything allowed across the border alive including lizards and Ts that doesn't require some paperwork. I'm sure if you bring in anything without paperwork it can easily be confiscated.

I only said that it's not surprising people versed in agricultural pests aren't familiar with inverts that are not plant pests.
Steven, there are thousands of texts on agricultural pests and you won't find those beetles listed in them.

 

[Dorcus]

Yea, in fact, the larvae of some species even help decompose rotting logs.

 

[BeetleExperienc]

But these are considered "plant pests" by APHIS. If you wanted to import this very same shipment legally, you would need the APHIS permit: "PPQ 526: Permit to Move Live Plant Pests". These would also have to be of a species included on your containment permit -and- would have to be on the list of species previously cleared for import to permitted individuals/institutions.

So, if these had been shipped legally, they would have to be checked against the permit held by the importer that would have been included with the shipment. To check what is crawling around inside a box against a list of species on a sheet of paper, someone over there would need to either:
a. know what they are looking at
b. have means at their disposal by which identification down to the species level could be ascertained.

If the APHIS individuals in question really did not know what they had, my guess is that: because these were not shipped legally they would not have been routed to the correct ports of entry.

 

[Elytra and Antenna]

Please look back. The issue is that aphis agents shouldn't be expected to know about insects that aren't listed as pests in any agricultural literature in existence. Your statement wrong or right has nothing to do with it.

 

[Elytra and Antenna]

I'm more surprised that APHIS didn't know what they were. The stag I can see, but the other three... at least down to the genus...?

See what I mean?

 

[Mr. Mordax]

Y'know, this thread was just to ask for some care information . . . and since that's been taken care of, there isn't any real need to say anything else here.

 

[BeetleExperienc]

So, you are telling me that APHIS does not consider these to be plant pests?

I am not saying by any means that the species in the photograph are anything close to being well known "plant pests" (Asian longhorns, Japanese beetles, etc) and never did. I don't really care what keeps "gardener joe" awake at night; we are talking about the importation, legal or otherwise, of any insect.

I am also not saying that these beetles, being imported illegally, went through the proper channels for identification.

Are these listed "in any agricultural literature in existence" as being plant pests? Probably not, I don't know. I know you know your stuff and trust you on this point. Do I agree that these beetles should be considered plant pests? No, I don't. What I am saying is that these, along with almost every other insect in existence, are considered by APHIS (the department in question) to fall under the umbrella term: Plant Pest.

What I was surprised about was the fact that these were not immediately destroyed, which I though would be SOP for illegally imported insects, and that, since they were not destroyed, identification down to genus or species was not attempted. My surprise was later negated in the very next post by IHeartMantids who said "...no idea how far they IDed them", so we could have left it at that....

There was also a lengthy and not posted internal dialogue I had about the amount of time it took me to ID three of them and my inability to conceive of someone not knowing right away what these were. This was soon thought through when I thought about me trying to ID some very common arachnids. This all took place before your post, BTW.

Can you leave me with my once having been surprised?

... and that APHIS would consider these to be plant pests?

(actually, I think the thing that did it was the "Roll Eyes" (sarcastic)" emoticon, Orin...!)

 

[BeetleExperienc]

LOL! Very Sorry IHeartMantids. Orin and I really do like each other. We have known each other for years and I have the utmost respect for him. I still "bug" him with bug questions from time to time.

This was all the apparent result of two, non related and unfortunately convergent "difficult work weeks" (plus that snappy little emoticon he posted).


... will continue off-board if needed