Brown Recluse Bite?

[Chris LXXIX]

Can I have a coconut for every staph/strep/leptospirosis loaded puncture wound and attributed to a spider bite?

No, but a well ripe Durian, yes

 

[NYAN]

@Pernicious
We have several arachnology experts in the NW area, Rod Crawford especially. He regularly takes the university of Washington Entomology students on collecting trips. No recluse has ever been found in the area. So you have some sleuthing to do, finding out where and how. They hitchhike in clothing and bedding. That's a clue. The Burke Museum would very likely want to know about your errant spider.

Where Recluse are found: http://www.burkemuseum.org/blog/myth-brown-recluses-bite-everywhere

Rod Crawfords page: http://staff.washington.edu/tiso/

Thank you for mentioning Rod Crawford.

 

[Pernicious]

Hey i wanna say thank you to NYAN
And the snark for education me and anyone following this subject..and yes i prob owe a coconut as well.....i talked with my wife this morning and i had twisted the memory of what happend.. so not easy to say but wrong!! I love this community and value the knowledge here and take it very seriously.. that said i was sincere in my post just wrong.
The facts are in my case. I was definitely bit by a spider on my kneecap.i did kill it and did honestly believe it to be a brown recluse
It blistered immediately and i lanced it in under ten min.. then 24 hours later my knee was inflamed and i was in the e.r .the doctor said recluse as well so i believed him also the fact that i had a bite that was tunneling under my kneecap
I got a pic from my wife the pic is of the bite location about 30 hours later she said
Just thought id share that as a way of clearing any confusion i created!
Once again sorry about that but did want to get the real story of what happened out as i am being honest and hate looking stupid .lol

 

[The Snark]

It blistered immediately and i lanced it in under ten min.. then 24 hours later my knee was inflamed and i was in the e.r .the doctor said recluse as well so i believed him also the fact that i had a bite that was tunneling under my kneecap

Well I'm drawing a complete blank. The only animals that I am aware of that can cause immediate blistering are certain molluscs along the lines of the cone shell, and certain physaliidae like the Portuguese man o' war. I don't believe even Atrax and Co. or Phoneutria cause edema anywhere near that time frame. I recall reading the infant bitten by Phoneutria did develop lesions prior to death in about a half hours time frame. We need an expert toxicologist to figure it.

As for the image, that's an angry puncture wound that's been scrubbed with Betadyne. The injury is typical of certain bacteria, esp gram neg as the Pasteurella family. I'm sure there are toxins that could cause such a wound as well.
What is odd is spider bites nearly always are diffused in the dermal layers. There is almost no such diffusion in that picture. It's more like a dog or cat bite.

 

[NYAN]

In Richard Vetter’s spider page, he references a Missouri doctor, I believe, who specializes in brown recluse bites. Maybe consider contacting him to see what he thinks? I’m less familiar with actual bite progressions than the actual spider and their venom. The circumstance still are very unlikely. Since you actually report knowing a spider bit you, it makes this more interesting. I wonder if the spider bite could’ve become infected or whatever caused this was introduced that way.

 

[Chris LXXIX]

Ain't a doctor but I'm somewhat fascinated by Loxoscelism.

I mean, we don't know (if I'm not wrong this is still issue of research at Pavia city San Matteo Hospital, in regards of Loxosceles rufescens*) why not exactly always after a bite, Loxoscelism happens.

So what exactly triggers the Loxoscelism infection in someone bitten while another person, bitten as well, do not present such a thing at all and therefore he/she only experience the average, quite harmless, little red spidey-bite dots?

This isn't about the so called "brown recluse" venom, IMO, for that that venom per se isn't big deal if the infection doesn't occur.
Here key detail is Loxoscelism that not always occur, as we know, but said random post bite infection is... well, triggered a la hit and miss?

An enzyme present into the spider but why such enzyme doesn't affect, therefore, every bitten person but, instead, seems that prefer to 'punish' or 'forgive' in a pure casual way?

Now this is interesting

*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mediterranean_recluse_spider

 

[myrmecophile]

After seeing the pictures my first thought was a meloid.

 

[The Snark]

So what exactly triggers the Loxoscelism infection in someone bitten while another person, bitten as well, do not present such a thing

Simple MOI. When talking micrograms of venom components person A may receive an exponential amount more venom on what amount to the point of a sharp needle compared to person B. Then profusion takes over. Area bitten having poor localized circulation and/or a thicker dermal layer can easily isolate the venom rendering it ineffective. Venoms must interact with biological functions in order to produce certain effects.

Also, from what I understand, spiders don't have sophisticated venom injection methods. They more or less drool the venom. Even the honeybee far outclasses the average spider with a hypodermic arrangement with a muscle bundle and neuron package independent of the rest of the animal.
An excellent example of this is the pholcid. It doesn't latch on for a moment, drooling venom into the wound. Instead it takes nips, often several dozen, in order to subdue the prey. Compare to Atrax that agitated in threat mode often has droplets of venom accumulate on the tip of the chelicerae.

After seeing the pictures my first thought was a meloid.

That's a good call I hadn't thought of. Terpenes in animals are bizarre, taking a common naturally occurring chemical and turning it into a weapon.