Am I About to Kill My Blondi With This Enclosure?

[Dorifto]

i believe an enclosure like yours allows a tarantula to thrive in captivity. The enclosure being on the large size, allows the tarantula to explore out of its burrow as it would in nature. It might, but probably not, make it to the enclosure walls.

Believe me, they use the whole enclosure, but in my case thankfully they don't climb the glass. Imho a lot of climbing issues can be solved using a bit of rational thinking, don't know why people don't spend s bit of their time observing how they behave to different stilulus, eg covering or modifying air entrances etc...

i think if someone had only one or two tarantulas, doing something like this is easier then it looks. Doing it for a 100, gets complicated and expensive. Especialy with different needs species. I would think someone would have a huge room in that case.

Most of Ts thrive in similar conditions so it can be scalable quite easily, even for the ones that thrive in different climatic conditions. Size wise, we don't need huge enclosures to provide them such spots, with enough gradients, just a bit of planning and the use of apropiate substrates. I believe this is the biggest and most ignored aspect of this hobby, how a simple choice of a good substrate can chance their behaviours and enclosures completely. I'm not entering in any debate on which one is best or worst, but imho every keeper should take their time choosing the best substrate for them, and adjust their husbandry based on this too.

 

[TheraMygale]

Believe me, they use the whole enclosure, but in my case thankfully they don't climb the glass. Imho a lot of climbing issues can be solved using a bit of rational thinking, don't know why people don't spend s bit of their time observing how they behave to different stilulus, eg covering or modifying air entrances etc...

Most of Ts thrive in similar conditions so it can be scalable quite easily, even for the ones that thrive in different climatic conditions. Size wise, we don't need huge enclosures to provide them such spots, with enough gradients, just a bit of planning and the use of apropiate substrates. I believe this is the biggest and most ignored aspect of this hobby, how a simple choice of a good substrate can chance their behaviours and enclosures completely. I'm not entering in any debate on which one is best or worst, but imho every keeper should take their time choosing the best substrate for them, and adjust their husbandry based on this too.

i dont have access to eurostyle eclosures aside of exoterra. I didnt want to buy them yet because of mesh top. I prefer the wovens from reptizoo.

I dont like buying something that requires too many changes when the price is high.

with all my modifiable enclosures, i put holes at sub level and top. But, its not in the same pattern as eurostyle and maybe thats why its not working.

i still wish i could purchase true eurostyle enclosures. I dont have many tarantulas. And i like buying “just what i need”. I dont plan on getting 100 tarantulas and i feel i have too many already. Its the fact each species requires certain sizes etc..

i understand it all, and i know its “easy”. But somethings easy for most require a lot of my concentration and i dont have that at the moment.

ever since i started working full time (even night shift), i dont have that much mind space for craftiness.

I might even end up getting exoterra because i dont like the store who sells reptizoo.

i agree about the sub. Its not always obvious to get what we need.

maybe you should start a thread with your ideas on substrate

 

[Dorifto]

i still wish i could purchase true eurostyle enclosures. I dont have many tarantulas. And i like buying “just what i need”. I dont plan on getting 100 tarantulas and i feel i have too many already. Its the fact each species requires certain sizes etc..

Better to build one yourself, long time ago tried to help a US member to get one... the prices were absurdingly high... Here for 30-60€ you can find decent tanks, there 300$...

You can achieve the same efficiency (air exchange) by modding a cheap fish tank, it's quite easy and pretty inexpensive, here at least, the only downside it will be the top door opening system. And they look awesome, @hardminder made one using this method.

 

[TheraMygale]

Better to build one yourself, long time ago tried to help a US member to get one... the prices were absurdingly high... Here for 30-60€ you can find decent tanks, there 300$...

You can achieve the same efficiency (air exchange) by modding a cheap fish tank, it's quite easy and pretty inexpensive, here at least, the only downside it will be the top door opening system. And they look awesome, @hardminder made one using this method.

oh definitelty. I aint ordering overseas. I meant to say i wish we had equal quality makers here

i think that member is private so i cant see all their posts. But i will sherlock them easily enough

i found them. I dont think they stayed long enough. I can see why they wouldnt though.

 

[AphonopelmaTX]

exactly. Its probably why most of us also recommend back on enclosure vs bottom.

this is where the geek/nerd side of enclosure building comes in. Mastering elements.

i believe an enclosure like yours allows a tarantula to thrive in captivity. The enclosure being on the large size, allows the tarantula to explore out of its burrow as it would in nature. It might, but probably not, make it to the enclosure walls.

in captivity, most of us cant provide huge enclosures and thats ok. But our small enclosures actualy increase climbing risks.

thats my opinion, and overall deduction after reading so much on the subject. To me, its pure logic. You are also providing all sorts of gradients, like weather.

i think if someone had only one or two tarantulas, doing something like this is easier then it looks. Doing it for a 100, gets complicated and expensive. Especialy with different needs species. I would think someone would have a huge room in that case.

It makes sense to intuit that a more natural looking enclosure that mimics what one perceives as close to a tarantula's natural habitat would be better than something more bare-bones, but that isn't the case. Tarantulas are a type of animal in which so few people understand how a particular species interacts with their environment that it would seem that people who are building naturalistic looking enclosures are guessing at what they need then later trying to explain why it works. The folly in this is that natural history of tarantula species is poor to non existent. The focus of housing tarantulas is to give them what they need to satisfy their instincts and to achieve biological homeostasis- nothing more, nothing less. The trick is understanding what those instincts are and how to best accommodate them.

Tarantulas by their very nature are nocturnal, sedentary, and reclusive. Under certain circumstances you will find wild tarantulas wandering about at various times of the day or year, but in general they stick close to home with the protection of whatever shelter they use. If your tarantulas are highly active, something is wrong; tarantulas are certainly not explorers. By the way, this is the behavior that makes them vulnerable to climate change but that can be a discussion for another day.

A large enclosure for a captive tarantula is definitely not necessary or in any way better or worse than smaller ones. These are not energetic gerbils that need a lot of space to run around in. If someone is doing their best to replicate a perception of a natural environment for a tarantula species with the intent of observing natural behavior, then the guideline for success would ultimately be one where you would never see the damn thing but for only during warm nights. Seasonal activity is next to impossible to replicate for many tarantula species, especially ones from regions of the world that experience winter. For those species, they seal up their burrows/ hides and go months without eating or drinking.

What people need to master- over their enclosure building skills- is their skill in problem solving and to better interpret tarantula behavior. People also need to get a grip on the fact tarantulas of many species have such a large tolerance to environmental conditions that experimentation to achieve a better understanding of their tarantulas is very possible without causing harm to their tarantulas. For example, you can flood a tarantula's burrow full of water and see what happens without causing harm or distress. You can withhold water for weeks with many species to find out how a tarantula copes with the drought, then see what happens when you suddenly flood the thing, all without causing harm. You can cool them down, or heat them up over time and see what happens. During a course of experiments I guarantee you will find there is no best way to house or care for them. One doesn't need to master the elements- at least not right away- it is more important to understand the tarantula first.

In summary, the behavioral and environmental ecology of tarantulas is poorly understood (if at all) by both those who keep them in captivity and in academia. With that in mind, it is tough to take anyone seriously who makes any claim they are keeping any tarantula species naturally. Even if so, a distinction between naturally as in you are seeing natural behavior, visually as in the enclosure looks like it should be a good representation of a tarantula's natural habitat, or maybe both.

 

[Dorifto]

It makes sense to intuit that a more natural looking enclosure that mimics what one perceives as close to a tarantula's natural habitat would be better than something more bare-bones, but that isn't the case. Tarantulas are a type of animal in which so few people understand how a particular species interacts with their environment that it would seem that people who are building naturalistic looking enclosures are guessing at what they need then later trying to explain why it works. The folly in this is that natural history of tarantula species is poor to non existent. The focus of housing tarantulas is to give them what they need to satisfy their instincts and to achieve biological homeostasis- nothing more, nothing less. The trick is understanding what those instincts are and how to best accommodate them.

Agree on this, naturalistic doesn't mean better, but in some cases they can offer some benefits, like in my case keeping the enclosure more "estable".

First of all anyone triying to mimic the nature in a enclosed setup will fail miserably, and here I'd like to clarify that when I said mimic was referring to offer some seasonal changes, not mimicking every single aspect of the climatic conditions present on each season. Said that, our enclosures naturalistic or not, never will behave the same neither even close to what nature does, from ventilation to moisture changes, so trying to mimic each aspect would be a total mistake, at least I see that this way, like I mentioned several times.

Now, if you ask me if I see diferences in behaviour from a plain setup to my planted tanks, I'd say yes, at least in my case, I have to say that I spent quite a long time dialing the setups, trying to give them what they prefer, and then offering different spots to fullfill any other posible needs. Personally I'd like to have a much bigger collection just to experiment a bit more on this subjet, but it's discarted for now... Anyway I'm not saying that we can't achieve same changes in "plain" setups, imho as it will always rely on the given conditions, regardless if it's a planted setup or not, but it adds a bit more dynamism.

I like planted setups because it adds some extra dynamism and helps me a bit with the husbandry like I mentioned before, plants growing, leaves decaying, crittes... etc and because I like to see how both Ts behave to any change in their setup. Eg, pulchra likes to keep the entrance tidy, so she webs any new leave or branch nearby, it's really nice, anyway I could have coped their needs without them easily, just by adjusting the husbandry.

What people need to master- over their enclosure building skills- is their skill in problem solving and to better interpret tarantula behavior. People also need to get a grip on the fact tarantulas of many species have such a large tolerance to environmental conditions that experimentation to achieve a better understanding of their tarantulas is very possible without causing harm to their tarantulas. For example, you can flood a tarantula's burrow full of water and see what happens without causing harm or distress. You can withhold water for weeks with many species to find out how a tarantula copes with the drought, then see what happens when you suddenly flood the thing, all without causing harm. You can cool them down, or heat them up over time and see what happens. During a course of experiments I guarantee you will find there is no best way to house or care for them. One doesn't need to master the elements- at least not right away- it is more important to understand the tarantula first.

Nailed it

 

[Alveus]

Semi-panicked I thought, "Should I have done that? Nah. Dave didn’t do that. Surely he has a good reason. And I’m not setting up for dart frogs.

I honestly don't know why they do this.
Dave isn't the only one who does this.
For a normal Tarantula enclosure it is useless, because they don't need that moist conditions as a amphibian.
Plain soil is enough for every tarantul enclosure. The watter collects on the bottom and spread trough the substrat due to the cappilary effect.

A drainagelayer wirhout a drain is more contra productive for a Tarantul enclosure. The water sink in to it and is separatet from the soil. In the worst case you have a dry surface and dead water on the botton.

From what i know, the only enclosures where you use a drainagelayer without a drain is for Darlingtonia sp. Those carnivorus plants like to stick their roots in to water under the soil.

 

[Dorifto]

I honestly don't know why they do this.
Dave isn't the only one who does this.
For a normal Tarantula enclosure it is useless, because they don't need that moist conditions as a amphibian.
Plain soil is enough for every tarantul enclosure. The watter collects on the bottom and spread trough the substrat due to the cappilary effect.

A drainagelayer wirhout a drain is more contra productive for a Tarantul enclosure. The water sink in to it and is separatet from the soil. In the worst case you have a dry surface and dead water on the botton.

From what i know, the only enclosures where you use a drainagelayer without a drain is for Darlingtonia sp. Those carnivorus plants like to stick their roots in to water under the soil.

Views.

A more elaborated enclosure could suggest you that is someone more expertise in the matter, so they simply follow the trend to gain more likes and views.

I have lost the count about how discussions I had with people defend such features just because some youtuber uses it... even if I had explained them the reasons why they are useless for our setups... You need them, for planted setups, you need if you want a bioactive setup, you need a carbon layer...

 

[TheraMygale]

It makes sense to intuit that a more natural looking enclosure that mimics what one perceives as close to a tarantula's natural habitat would be better than something more bare-bones, but that isn't the case. Tarantulas are a type of animal in which so few people understand how a particular species interacts with their environment that it would seem that people who are building naturalistic looking enclosures are guessing at what they need then later trying to explain why it works. The folly in this is that natural history of tarantula species is poor to non existent. The focus of housing tarantulas is to give them what they need to satisfy their instincts and to achieve biological homeostasis- nothing more, nothing less. The trick is understanding what those instincts are and how to best accommodate them.

Tarantulas by their very nature are nocturnal, sedentary, and reclusive. Under certain circumstances you will find wild tarantulas wandering about at various times of the day or year, but in general they stick close to home with the protection of whatever shelter they use. If your tarantulas are highly active, something is wrong; tarantulas are certainly not explorers. By the way, this is the behavior that makes them vulnerable to climate change but that can be a discussion for another day.

A large enclosure for a captive tarantula is definitely not necessary or in any way better or worse than smaller ones. These are not energetic gerbils that need a lot of space to run around in. If someone is doing their best to replicate a perception of a natural environment for a tarantula species with the intent of observing natural behavior, then the guideline for success would ultimately be one where you would never see the damn thing but for only during warm nights. Seasonal activity is next to impossible to replicate for many tarantula species, especially ones from regions of the world that experience winter. For those species, they seal up their burrows/ hides and go months without eating or drinking.

What people need to master- over their enclosure building skills- is their skill in problem solving and to better interpret tarantula behavior. People also need to get a grip on the fact tarantulas of many species have such a large tolerance to environmental conditions that experimentation to achieve a better understanding of their tarantulas is very possible without causing harm to their tarantulas. For example, you can flood a tarantula's burrow full of water and see what happens without causing harm or distress. You can withhold water for weeks with many species to find out how a tarantula copes with the drought, then see what happens when you suddenly flood the thing, all without causing harm. You can cool them down, or heat them up over time and see what happens. During a course of experiments I guarantee you will find there is no best way to house or care for them. One doesn't need to master the elements- at least not right away- it is more important to understand the tarantula first.

In summary, the behavioral and environmental ecology of tarantulas is poorly understood (if at all) by both those who keep them in captivity and in academia. With that in mind, it is tough to take anyone seriously who makes any claim they are keeping any tarantula species naturally. Even if so, a distinction between naturally as in you are seeing natural behavior, visually as in the enclosure looks like it should be a good representation of a tarantula's natural habitat, or maybe both.

I agree with everything. As much as i like the esthetic of a planted terrarium, all my tarantulas are housed in bare minimums.

the hides and substrate moisture is given according to general available knowledge.

even if i read up on their habitat, i couldnt mimic this here.

i do however, not adhere to the if we are comfortable, they are comfortable.

i will flood an enclosure here and then. And make sure their is moisture in sub even in my “dry” enclosures.

none of my tarantulas are on the move. Everyone is hidden all the time in general. They usualy come to the mouth of their burrow after dusk.

especialy when they could use a feeding.

 

[Alveus]

Views.

A more elaborated enclosure could suggest you that is someone more expertise in the matter, so they simply follow the trend to gain more likes and views.

That is a painfully logical explonation.
Would also explain this:

Tbh, I was dead set on doing the drainage layer simply because I thought it looked cool, lol.

And i think that many many youtuber don't know that this practice is useless or even dangerous. And just spread it because they also think, it is the way to go.
Could be worth it to open an own topic on that.