Alternatives to Cork Bark in Amblypygids Enclosures

pannaking22

pannaking22

Arachnoemperor
Old Timer
Joined
Nov 25, 2011
Messages
4,227
I'm keeping all my Phrynus whitei on Styrofoam and I can happily report that two of them have successfully molted on it. The third doesn't look very far behind, so that should be happening soon.
 
B

BentleyOEB

Arachnopeon
Joined
Oct 17, 2018
Messages
4
Nick H said:
Speaking of giving them credit, last night I witnessed mine actually using his whip like a whip to herd his prey over to where he wanted it. The cricket was being especially difficult and wasn't moving much. When it did move it stayed away from the Styrofoam. The ambly knew where it was the whole time and eventually it started rapidly smacking the cricket, using it's whip like an actual whip, and making the cricket jump. It did that twice consecutively before the cricket finally jumped into range the third time, and was quickly snatched up. I've seen him do this before, but I wasn't sure if it was on purpose or if he was just feeling the prey and accidentally freaked it out. This time it was unmistakably deliberate. I'm sure many of you have seen this too, but I was impressed. These really are fascinating creatures.
Click to expand...
If I'm not mistaken, I was told that they have the primitive makings of a brain stem. So give them a few more million years and they may be ruling the planet after the era of the octopus. :)
 
pannaking22

pannaking22

Arachnoemperor
Old Timer
Joined
Nov 25, 2011
Messages
4,227
The Mantis Menagerie said:
Just to make sure I understand correctly, an amblypygid can successfully molt on a perfectly vertical piece of Styrofoam, right? I just purchased an adult female Damon medius, and I was looking at this setup: https://www.researchgate.net/public...dents_about_the_Ongoing_Sixth_Mass_Extinction. Does this plan sound good, @wizentrop?
Click to expand...
I have three Phrynus whitei that are being kept on vertical/near vertical pieces of Styrofoam and they're growing and molting without issue. I'll likely be switching my other amblypygids over to Styrofoam as they grow and need more space
 
wizentrop

wizentrop

to the rescue!
Old Timer
Joined
Apr 20, 2005
Messages
644
The Mantis Menagerie said:
Just to make sure I understand correctly, an amblypygid can successfully molt on a perfectly vertical piece of Styrofoam, right? I just purchased an adult female Damon medius, and I was looking at this setup: https://www.researchgate.net/public...dents_about_the_Ongoing_Sixth_Mass_Extinction. Does this plan sound good, @wizentrop?
Click to expand...
To answer your question, yes they can molt on a perfectly vertical surface.

As for the conference proceedings paper you attached here, I want to advise everyone to please be very careful with it because it is not peer-reviewed and probably only serves as a point for career advancement by the author. A quick glance at the references will serve as proof - the author does not cite anyone but himself as references (at the very least he should have mentioned previous works by Peter Weygoldt, the "father" of all current Amblypygi knowledge, and Orin McMonigle, who was the first to publish about their husbandry), this is non-scientific and unethical. This paper contains heaps of inaccuracies and mistakes, to name a few:
* Comparing Damon diadema to Heterophrynus batesii is like comparing oranges to apples. They are completely different animals that live in different conditions and don't even belong to the same family. Damon diadema are not a beginner species. They are easy to keep as adults, but can difficult as juveniles. Heterophrynus batesii are the opposite - easy as juveniles and problematic as adults.
* Male Heterophrynus have pedipalps that extend beyond the first set of walking legs. Adult females are exactly the same.
* According to the author's recommended setup, the foamboard sits in the middle of the enclosure with a gap at the top that allows the whip spider to move from one side of the board to the other side. Clever design, however feeder crickets will take refuge in that space, and make it harder for the amblypygid to catch them.
* The author makes a mention of molting problems in adult Heterophrynus but instead of addressing the cause and a possible solution, just dismisses the problem because they "have not had this issue". Not very informative for a paper. Also, misting is mentioned but nothing about the required humidity levels.
* Keeping the Heterophrynus babies with the mother after they molt is a big no-no if kept in a bucket-type enclosure. Not enough space, they will cannibalize.

I hate to say it, this paper is bad. You will find much more useful information here in the boards. And the people here are more responsive in case you have a question.
 
The Mantis Menagerie

The Mantis Menagerie

Arachnobaron
Joined
Aug 17, 2018
Messages
355
wizentrop said:
To answer your question, yes they can molt on a perfectly vertical surface.

As for the conference proceedings paper you attached here, I want to advise everyone to please be very careful with it because it is not peer-reviewed and probably only serves as a point for career advancement by the author. A quick glance at the references will serve as proof - the author does not cite anyone but himself as references (at the very least he should have mentioned previous works by Peter Weygoldt, the "father" of all current Amblypygi knowledge, and Orin McMonigle, who was the first to publish about their husbandry), this is non-scientific and unethical. This paper contains heaps of inaccuracies and mistakes, to name a few:
* Comparing Damon diadema to Heterophrynus batesii is like comparing oranges to apples. They are completely different animals that live in different conditions and don't even belong to the same family. Damon diadema are not a beginner species. They are easy to keep as adults, but can difficult as juveniles. Heterophrynus batesii are the opposite - easy as juveniles and problematic as adults.
* Male Heterophrynus have pedipalps that extend beyond the first set of walking legs. Adult females are exactly the same.
* According to the author's recommended setup, the foamboard sits in the middle of the enclosure with a gap at the top that allows the whip spider to move from one side of the board to the other side. Clever design, however feeder crickets will take refuge in that space, and make it harder for the amblypygid to catch them.
* The author makes a mention of molting problems in adult Heterophrynus but instead of addressing the cause and a possible solution, just dismisses the problem because they "have not had this issue". Not very informative for a paper. Also, misting is mentioned but nothing about the required humidity levels.
* Keeping the Heterophrynus babies with the mother after they molt is a big no-no if kept in a bucket-type enclosure. Not enough space, they will cannibalize.

I hate to say it, this paper is bad. You will find much more useful information here in the boards. And the people here are more responsive in case you have a question.
Click to expand...
Thank you for pointing out the major issues in this paper. I had figured since it was on the Research Gate site, it was a good resource. As far as the habitat goes, the major issue you mentioned (besides humidity) was the crickets being able to hide from the amblypygid. Do you have any suggestions on how to make sure the amblypygid gets enough food? I breed feeder roaches to feed most of my arthropods, so would the roaches behave differently?
 
pannaking22

pannaking22

Arachnoemperor
Old Timer
Joined
Nov 25, 2011
Messages
4,227
The Mantis Menagerie said:
Thank you for pointing out the major issues in this paper. I had figured since it was on the Research Gate site, it was a good resource. As far as the habitat goes, the major issue you mentioned (besides humidity) was the crickets being able to hide from the amblypygid. Do you have any suggestions on how to make sure the amblypygid gets enough food? I breed feeder roaches to feed most of my arthropods, so would the roaches behave differently?
Click to expand...
Overall yes, but it depends on the species of roach. Which roaches do you have? You'll want to avoid ones that will burrow because the amblypygids won't be able to access them then.
 
The Mantis Menagerie

The Mantis Menagerie

Arachnobaron
Joined
Aug 17, 2018
Messages
355
pannaking22 said:
Overall yes, but it depends on the species of roach. Which roaches do you have? You'll want to avoid ones that will burrow because the amblypygids won't be able to access them then.
Click to expand...
I have lobster roaches. They like dark places, but they don't seem to burrow in their enclosure. Since the amblypygid's enclosure will be dark, they shouldn't hide too much, right?
 
wizentrop

wizentrop

to the rescue!
Old Timer
Joined
Apr 20, 2005
Messages
644
Crickets are not too bad, but they do like to hide and chew stuff. So if uneaten, they can chew your styrofoam board or cork, and even worse - the amblypygid itself if it is molting. Roaches are good too, like @pannaking22 said it depends on the species. Lobsters are good feeders, but any "runner" species will do just fine. I like to use Simandoa as feeders (shhh, don't tell anyone!) they are very active and always trigger a response from the whip spiders.
 
pannaking22

pannaking22

Arachnoemperor
Old Timer
Joined
Nov 25, 2011
Messages
4,227
I use little Kenyans for the smaller amblypygids or while they're growing and switch to red runners/Gyna adults when they get big enough. I need to get a second small/medium feeder while I wait for my red runner colony to take off and take some of the pressure off the little Kenyans. I've been thinking about switching back to lobsters, but I had huge issues with them eating and climbing over the barriers I put in place so I eventually sold them. Pallid roaches are another good option and I believe redhead roaches are good too (both climb though). I can definitely see Simandoa being an excellent feeder, they're one of the more active roaches out there.
 
The Mantis Menagerie

The Mantis Menagerie

Arachnobaron
Joined
Aug 17, 2018
Messages
355
image.jpeg
Here is my new amblypygid tank. Does it look good (for the animal's health not for asthetic value since a bucket is not very pretty)? She seems to have a very good grip on the Styrofoam and is already starting to explore her environment with her antenniform legs.
 
wizentrop

wizentrop

to the rescue!
Old Timer
Joined
Apr 20, 2005
Messages
644
Looks alright to me, as long as the bucket retains some humidity inside. They really like sitting on styrofoam.
Is her mid-leg broken? She might regenerate it at some point.
 
pannaking22

pannaking22

Arachnoemperor
Old Timer
Joined
Nov 25, 2011
Messages
4,227
wizentrop said:
Maybe this will help to clarify things:


As you can see, a very minimalist custom-made setup. Ventilation is provided via a metal mesh on the right side of the lid.
By the way, the back wall here is not styrofoam. It is plastazote, high density foam. It does not work as well as styrofoam for all amblypygid species.
Click to expand...
Out of curiosity, what's the depth (front to back in the photo) of this container? It doesn't look all that deep, but the angle of the photo could be why I'm missing something. When molting, is the lateral width more important than the depth of the enclosure? I found a container that looks like it has potential, but it seemed a bit narrow. I need to hunt around for some pics of an amblypygid molting so I can get a better idea of the direction they go.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top