ugh, I give up

[lilmoonrabbit]

over a month ago, I did totally re-did my G. rosea's enclosure. Taking a page out of Fran's book, I used some excavator clay to make a cool burrow, I took all the substrate out and re-baked it to make it super dry, DOUBLED the existing ventilation, gave her a smaller water dish to reduce the humidity further. To add visual interest, I put in a piece of grape vine, which was listed as VERY MOLD RESISTANT and useful in humid enclosures.

I go to do some cage maintenance today... and she has MOLD. Ugly, green spots of mold all over the piece of grapevine. There is also a white substance, that also looks like mold... on the excavating clay. Seriously, CLAY can mold?

I just don't understand it. I have done everything I can think of to make her enclosure mold resistant. And, it's WINTER. It's so dry that my hands are cracking...

The mold hasn't been around long. I check on her every day, and this is the first time I am noticing it. She doesn't seem affected by it, but I have moved her to a tupperware until I can figure out what to do about this.

So, here are my questions:
a. What am I doing wrong?

b. Is there anything I can use to kill the mold, which won't hurt her? The grape vine is partially buried in excavator clay, so removing it will be a major PITA... but if it needs to be done, obviously I will do it. But, if there's something I could just mist her cage with, or something, that would be awesome.

c. What other steps can I take to make her enclosure more mold resistant?

I honestly feel like I just can't do anything right with this simple G. rosea. How can I ever expect to own any more Ts???

 

[BrettG]

The white stuff of the clay could just be poop.Just pitch the vine,and make sure the substrate is still dry. Do NOT overthink the enclosure. It will just lead to more issues.Just give him/her a really simple hide,like half of a plastic cup or something really simple.

 

[DDaake]

IME, grapevine always molds in humid environment. And yes your LPS will usually tell you it will not mold. Mine did and I wasted the $10 on a nice looking peice. I've never used clay so I cannot comment on that. D

 

[Julia]

Is the grapevine real or fake? If it's real, replace it with a fake one. Also, I don't think that clay can mold. I'd guess that the white spots you're seeing are tarantula poo.

<Edit> By "fake" grapevine, I mean made with some other material besides wood....plastic, maybe.

 

[natebugman]

My two cents:

Get rid of the grape vine. That stuff molds if you look at it funny. Try cork bark. Maybe not as pretty, but is really mold resistant. As for clay, I don't know much about it. Are you sure the white stuff is not poop? For my hides, I just use those little half log hides you can get at the pet shops. Never had any problem with mold on them especially with a dry cage like a G. rosea.

 

[lilmoonrabbit]

Thanks guys...

yeah, I don't know how people make nice enclosures... because I give up.

I decided just to rip everything out. Turns out, the clay is still damp... hence the moisture. So, I am scrapping that..

well, now I know how I am spending my afternoon off.

I guess it's back to the old beer cup hide.

EDIT- the white stuff isn't poop. I have seen plenty of that, lol. This is tiny tiny little white speckles everywhere. There's also some white hairy spots.

If I use the same substrate, and just re-bake it at 275 for a 1/2 hour or so, that should be enough to kill existing spores, right? I really don't want to have to make another batch of substrate.

EDIT AGAIN- just ripped the grapevine out... and omg, it was absolutely COVERED in mold on the underside. Mold of like, 4 different colors.... so gross.

Do I need to be taking any health precautions here? Could this mold be potentially dangerous, or is it fine as long as I don't go licking it, lol?

 

[evicton]

My experience with grapevine is its evil and will mold no matter what you do.
I tried it some for hermit crabs and an avic sling and it ended up in the garbage. I don't have much exp with clay so I got nothing to add there. I do know though that as dry a rosea needs to be kept mold shouldn't be an issue so it has to be coming from someplace.

 

[evicton]

Thanks guys...

yeah, I don't know how people make nice enclosures... because I give up.

I decided just to rip everything out. Turns out, the clay is still damp... hence the moisture. So, I am scrapping that..

well, now I know how I am spending my afternoon off.

I guess it's back to the old beer cup hide.

Have you considered using half a cocunut as a hide, I use them in a few enclosures when I'm not using cork bark and have yet to have mold issues.

 

[Fran]

Hey

Well, The clay has worked really good for the hide/cave of my Smithis.

There are several things to take into consideration (I told you! If any questions, I'm an e mail away )

1: You need to be patient. The clay might take days to completely dry out.

2: You need to use as little clay as you can, making sure the cave is strong enough. When you have the shape desired, help to dry it with a hair drier.


If dry enough, I think is pretty mych impossible to get mold on it...The cage should be around 50% of humidity

 

[jb7741]

I went to using only plastic/fake plants. Try for very little wood.

 

[Moltar]

When people say to keep a G. rosea dry they mean it. If your substrate has enough moisture in it to cause any mold at all it is too wet I have 3 G rosea and they live on bone dry soil. I'll overflow their water dish a bit maybe once a month and in the very dryest parts of the winter I may give one end of the cage a bit of a soak.

Yes, grape vine can be a nuisance with its moldiness but it shouldn't be a problem in any Aphonopelma, Brachypelma, Grammostola, etc type dry enclosure. If you were to post some pics of the enclosure maybe someone can tell you what's going wrong.

 

[lilmoonrabbit]

The substrate itself was bone dry... It looks like the clay just didn't dry enough when I put in the vine. The vine was in contact with the clay. The moisture from the clay got to the vine, and the vine became covered in mold.

The moldy vine is now in the trash, along with the majority of the clay. What little clay was left, I crushed it, and it is now drying with the substrate in the oven.

BTW... how hot/long do I need to bake that substrate to make sure it's safe?

Fran- I think I just used too much clay. Even though it felt dry to the touch, it must have still been damp. It's too bad... for the time I had it, it was a pretty enclosure. But, I am too tired of ripping apart enclosures to try it again.

Live and learn I guess.

It's not like my girl really has a preference for a pretty/plain enclosure. And while I would like it to be pretty, I have made enough blunders to say that I'll settle for plain if it means no more issues like this.

I felt so guilty. She had put down so much beautiful webbing, all over her enclosure, and I had to tear it all out. I don't want to have to do that again, so I am going to make this enclosure as basic as possible, and just be done with it.

 

[BrettG]

275 for 20-30 minutes will do the trick

 

[Moltar]

Don't feel too bad. Actually if she had put down a large amount of webbing in a short time she may not have liked the feel of what she was walking on anyway. Possibly she could detect the moisture from the clay.

Do yourself a favor and make the next enclosure as simple as possible. Substrate that has been given plenty of time to dry, a hide like a clay pot or a cup and a water dish. No wood, no fancy clay, none of that. All that additional stuff is for your benefit anyway, not the spider.

Most of my enclosures are fairly simple affairs. I do use wood in them sometimes but I've never been one to do live plants, multiple tiers, clay forms, etc. All 60+ of my T's are fine with it. They continue to grow and thrive despite not living in a luxurious arachno-condo.

 

[Fran]

I did this pretty fast in Paint, for you to see as an example of how I did mine, its pretty simple but I just wanted to do it fast so you get the idea.
I think it looks a little better than a big ole tank with a bunch of dirt and a plastic cup:

First, in the empty tank, mold the clay in the form desired, to make the cave:

Then dry it out, and it should look like that, dry and hollow inside, of course.

Then add the substrate desired, and the rest of the decorations, water dish...and your lucky tatantula

 

[lilmoonrabbit]

Fran, thank you for the drawings. I definitely used too much clay... because nothing was hollow except her hide, which I carved out with a cup. Everything else was solid. I used the blowdryer on it until it was dry to the touch... but obviously it was still a little too damp. I figured, since I had so much ventilation and the sub was so dry, it would just dry in a day or two. But, obviously, that was a grave miscalculation.

 

[ghordy]

So is this about the 4th time you redid the enclosure in as many months?

 

[redsaw]

You didnt need to trash the grape vine, scrub it clean and bake it in the oven to dry it out then its like new again. Just make sure the substrate is dry when putting it back in the tank.

 

[lilmoonrabbit]

You didnt need to trash the grape vine, scrub it clean and bake it in the oven to dry it out then its like new again. Just make sure the substrate is dry when putting it back in the tank.

scrub it with what? I am afraid of releasing all that mold into the air.

And ghordy, yes- this is the 4th edition. The first one had to be scraped because I didn't put enough substrate in, so the gap between the lid and the sub was too wide. Then, the hide I made was too heavy, and my T was digging under it. I didn't want a spider pancake. That time, I just removed the hide, and replaced it with a beer cup. Then, I decided to go for a nicer looking version after seeing Fran's B. smithi set-up. However, I guess I misunderstood how he did it, and that combined with my poor judgement regarding drying time caused this problem.

Trust me... I want nothing more at this point, than for this to be the final product. I am sooo sick and tired of baking ecoearth.

 

[Stan Schultz]

over a month ago, I did totally re-did my G. rosea's enclosure. ...
So, here are my questions:
a. What am I doing wrong?

b. Is there anything I can use to kill the mold, which won't hurt her? The grape vine is partially buried in excavator clay, so removing it will be a major PITA... but if it needs to be done, obviously I will do it. But, if there's something I could just mist her cage with, or something, that would be awesome.

c. What other steps can I take to make her enclosure more mold resistant?

I honestly feel like I just can't do anything right with this simple G. rosea. How can I ever expect to own any more Ts???

First, read http://www.ucalgary.ca/~schultz/stansrant.html.

Then, read http://www.ucalgary.ca/~schultz/roses.html.

You need to understand that you're not keeping your rose in a natural setting. There is no way on God's green Earth that you can even hope to begin to do so. Life in a cage in your home is an absolutely, completely, totally artificial existence. Compare it to living on the International Space Station rather than a nice comfy swamp or desert (or even your living room) on Mother Earth.

Forget trying to recreate nature and start concentrating on keeping your tarantula alive.