vermiculite

[MizM]

Ok, now I've got a question too. Is vermiculite generally "better" than "Bed-a-Beast"? I'm asking this because when I orginally got my Rosea, I had ONLY verm. in her enclosure and the Rosea would "cling" to the glass most of the time. Whenenver she tried to walk around on the verm., she would quickly go up the glass again. Once I took the verm. out and replaced it with bed-a-beast she completely stopped climbing up the glass.
Thanks in advance. :?

Did you keep the verm moist? Every g. rosea I have ever owned hates to get their little toes wet!! Now they all have a "pet rock", a flat stone to stand on if I happen to spill their water dish on their substrate. There is no reason to wet a g. roseas substrate anyway, and they are SO prissy about their widdle feeties!!

 

[Socrates]

The vermiculate was actually dry when I added the Rosea. But now that I'm thinking about it, perhaps I didn't "Pat" it down hard enough for her because each time she "tried" to walk on it you could see her "sinking in". :? I still have an unopened bag of vermiculite, and perhaps I should use that in combination with peat moss when I set up my NEW TANK for my upcoming "Acan. Geniculata"???? From what I've read the Genies like it more humid than the Roseas, and perhaps the verm. combined with the peat moss will hold the humidity better ??
For "looking good" purposed I have to say though that I like the bed-a-beast better. I"m not crazy about the light color of the verm. Or perhaps 100% peat moss would be even better????

 

[MizM]

While there are substrates that should be strictly avoided, each alternative you have listed would be a great solution. The only problem with substrate choice is that we each have our own preferences, and substrate discussions could go on for DAYS!!

I started with 100% verm, and continue to use it with my slings as it holds moisture and doesn't encourage mold. I just re-did all my adults enclosures with 50% peat/50% verm. It looks nice and holds moisture well FOR THOSE SPECIES THAT NEED IT.

Keep in mind that humidity is highly over-emphasized! Not only is high humidity not needed in most cases, it can encourage mold growth, parasites, and lots of other problems!!

 

[Code Monkey]

Coir, Peat, and Vermiculite

Is vermiculite generally "better" than "Bed-a-Beast"?

All three of the popular substrates have their fan sections. I've used all three but steered away from coir for the most part because of some bad experiences I had using it with geckos in the past. Based upon the many positive reports I've seen on this board I'm giving it a bit of a second chance with some Ts I rehoused last weekend.

I've got Ts on 100% verm, 100% peat, 100% coir, potting soil, and mixtures of peat and verm, and I'm going to play around with coir and peat as a mixture the next time somebody gets rehoused (not only will you not find 100% agreement with the hobby crowd in general, you may never make up your own mind 100% - I've been playing with subs for years). Of those, I find 100% vermiculite to be the least favorite of mine or the Ts. Coir I'm still undecided on, and peat has the issue of being violently opposed to absorbing any water and even when you keep everybody essentially dry, a little water absorbtion never hurt anything when you're filling water dishes. The best performing mixture overall I've used is the peat/verm mix but I'm curious if peat and coir will have similar properties.

 

[da_illest]

Ok, now I've got a question too. Is vermiculite generally "better" than "Bed-a-Beast"? I'm asking this because when I orginally got my Rosea, I had ONLY verm. in her enclosure and the Rosea would "cling" to the glass most of the time. Whenenver she tried to walk around on the verm., she would quickly go up the glass again. Once I took the verm. out and replaced it with bed-a-beast she completely stopped climbing up the glass.
Thanks in advance. :?

here's my suggestion to you, this is what i always do and have had no problems what so ever yet..
for terrestrials, use straight peat moss with a little bit of vermiculite mixed in to the mix but some terrestrials like my straight horned baboon i've found only burrow in straight peat moss and with vermiculite mixed in it stays clinging on the walls..
for aroboreals, use straight vermiculite as they don't hang around much on the floor..

i say this because i find terrestrials don't feel comfy walking around on straight verm as it moves all over the place when they walk or run at a cricket.. arboreals don't hang out on the ground much and vermiculite has the advantage over peat moss in that it holds moisture better with much less chance of mold, which most arboreals need... it's tried and proven.. also always keep all substrate for ALL t's DRY.. if the species requires high humidity just keep the water dish full at all time and if you like cover some of the lid to keep humidity up in the enclosure...

this is how i keep all my t's and haven't had one problem yet.. except when my rosie spilled water all over the peat moss substrate and caused some SERIOUS mold to happen...

 

[Chris V]

OK, time to stir it up. When I first got my G Rosea I had her in a tank with some type of reptile substrate that looked like rocks (not knowing any better at the time). Shortly after discovering this site I switched to bed-a-beast. She still clung to the glass and hung from the lid, constantly falling to the substrate. I tried vermiculite and peat mix, still with no luck. She just didn't like it. Then a friend of mine at the exotic pet store suggested some type of reptile substrate that has bits of wood in it. Now I know this going to stir up some contraversy but I kidd you not, she has yet to climb the walls or hang from the lid since. This is the only T that has this substrate but like you said what ever works.

 

[da_illest]

OK, time to stir it up. When I first got my G Rosea I had her in a tank with some type of reptile substrate that looked like rocks (not knowing any better at the time). Shortly after discovering this site I switched to bed-a-beast. She still clung to the glass and hung from the lid, constantly falling to the substrate. I tried vermiculite and peat mix, still with no luck. She just didn't like it. Then a friend of mine at the exotic pet store suggested some type of reptile substrate that has bits of wood in it. Now I know this going to stir up some contraversy but I kidd you not, she has yet to climb the walls or hang from the lid since. This is the only T that has this substrate but like you said what ever works.

that's why i mentioned some terrestrials like my c. marshalli won't burrow into peat with vermiculite but will burrow into straight peat moss.. it's really up to them what they wanna be on and what not.. keep in mind that your substrate could slowly be killing your rosehair and that the reason your rosehair was clinging on the wall and lid is not nessecarly that they don't like the substrate but it could be a male who likes to roam or could just be exploring adjusting to the home once you put the new substrate in..

i say you put it on straight peat moss that's dry, if you keep your wood stuff moist it could be that it's trying to escape the humidity.. also, i NEVER moisten the substrate at all when first putting it into an enclosure as i see no need for that plus it dries up eventually.. so yea, just put it on peat at a high level so the fall won't hurt it and let it climb and fall until it learns it's lesson..

 

[MizM]

Coir

Chip, this is a new word for me... what is it?

 

[Code Monkey]

Chip, this is a new word for me... what is it?

It's what bed a beast is, shredded coconut husks, properly known as coir.

 

[Code Monkey]

No stir since wood is not the devil

OK, time to stir it up... Then a friend of mine at the exotic pet store suggested some type of reptile substrate that has bits of wood in it. Now I know this going to stir up some contraversy but I kidd you not, she has yet to climb the walls or hang from the lid since. This is the only T that has this substrate but like you said what ever works.

A lot of people seem to be under the impression that wood products are bad, period, and this is simply not true.

Connifers (pines, cedar, etc.) when living are impregnated with defensive chemicals such as turpenes. These chemicals are aromatic (become gaseous readily) and serve a couple of purposes for a tree injured by insects. One, the chemicals attract parasitoid wasps which target the injurious insects and, two, the chemicals themselves can negatively affect moulting by the insect larvae feeding within the tree.

It is this ability to negatively inhibit or otherwise impact moulting that causes us invert hobbyists to avoid them with our pets. This, while sound practice of the 'better safe than sorry' school of thought, is unknown to be necessary as it's never been demonstrated with arachnids.

However, even we assume that connifer based wood defensive chemicals affect arachnids, it is ONLY connifer type wood products that could have any dangerous effects at all. Plus, since these chemicals are aromatic, if fully mulched, even connifer based woods are completely harmless.

So, for future reference, don't listen to anyone telling you that wood is dangerous unless they can qualify why that wood product is dangerous. Read the components in mixes and use your head.

 

[NorthwestInverts]

i have vermiculite by Schultz

"Schultz" vermiculite and peat are both good. Your safe.

 

[MizM]

It's what bed a beast is, shredded coconut husks, properly known as coir.

Ahh, oui! Merci monseur! (Well, it SOUNDS French!!)

 

[da_illest]

"Schultz" vermiculite and peat are both good. Your safe.

i use STRICTLY and ONLY shultz everything and my t's love it! i was just wondering before if the verm would harm me, not the t.. but now i know so i'm cool and will continue to buy it since they have it at my nearest walmart..

 

[Wade]

Some of you posted your T's burrow pix and I noticed that the vermiculite is a dull sandy color with cubic shape almost like small pebbles. The vermiculite I got in gardener's store looks grainier and with a golden shine... is the gold chemically safe for T's?

Horticultural vermiculite comes in different grades...a course grade (visible chunks) and a fine grade (more grannular) and probabably grades in between as well. Same stuff, both are generally OK, although I've heard things about the finer grade caking around the mouth of spiderlings. Apparently, this happens less when it's mixed worth other stuff (peat, etc). That last bit (about the caking) is secondhand, as I have used both types with no problems.

Wade