Thrixopelma ockerti egg sack

[Dave]

I decided to turn this into a thread after responding to the latest T. ockerti thread because I'm hoping to get answers fairly quickly considering the situation. Here is what I wrote in the thread:


"I'm glad to see a thread on this subject. I have a female wrapping an egg sack right now. Because of the rarity of the species, I'm finding it difficult to find info on care of the egg sack.

Has anyone bred ockerti and would care to give info on the eggs? Gestation, temps, humidity, length of time before removing from the female, etc would be a great start and help.

btw, very interestingly enough I saw courtship behavior that I've never witnessed before in T's with ockerti!"

 

[captmarga]

I do not have this species... But here are some things I would research. Are there threads on similar species? How many eggs are in their sacs, what do people say about time period on those?

Keep the temp range the same, perhaps slightly warmer and more humid - but by that a couple of degrees. Nothing drastic.

If she appears to be caring for it, you could let it hatch out - you have just as much risk - fifty fifty - if you pull it and spoil it or if she ruins it.

I hope you get the answers to your questions.

Marga

 

[BrynWilliams]

did you breed this female yourself, or was it a wild caught already gravid situation?

I decided to turn this into a thread after responding to the latest T. ockerti thread because I'm hoping to get answers fairly quickly considering the situation. Here is what I wrote in the thread:


"I'm glad to see a thread on this subject. I have a female wrapping an egg sack right now. Because of the rarity of the species, I'm finding it difficult to find info on care of the egg sack.

Has anyone bred ockerti and would care to give info on the eggs? Gestation, temps, humidity, length of time before removing from the female, etc would be a great start and help.

btw, very interestingly enough I saw courtship behavior that I've never witnessed before in T's with ockerti!"

 

[Dave]

did you breed this female yourself, or was it a wild caught already gravid situation?

I bred her. I was fortunate enough to receive a mm on breeding loan.

 

[BrynWilliams]

would you be willing to write up a little bit about exactly what the conditions were, how the female was to the male etc etc. Just a summary of what went down.

I ask because several europeans have tried to pair this species with very limited success, in most cases finding the males or females too skittish to even get near each other.

It would be excellent to read for those trying to have similar success

Follows on from previous threads and links seen here:
http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=184555

 

[Dave]

Sure. Give me a day or so.

Meanwhile, any takers on egg info?

---------- Post added at 09:26 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:33 PM ----------

Ok, I was able to write it tonight. I decided to write it in Word for my personal documents, so here it is quoted. I hope this helps others' attempts at breeding.

Thrixopelma ockerti Breeding Account​

"For further reference, the mature male will be referred to as "M", and female as "F".


The F was kept in a shoe box sized opaque plastic container on fairly dry peat with a water bowl and hide made from a cut oat container to form a round, flat topped cave. She spent most of her time in the back wedged between the cave and wall of the enclosure in a sideways position, feet facing the wall.


In the days leading to the pairing, the F was heavily fed orange head roaches (Eublaberus prosticus) until the abdomen was noticeably larger. The M was also fed roaches once or twice to ensure strength. The M was temporarily kept in a square deli cup with no substrate. He was given a small amount of water every few days to drink (temporarily is stressed here, as this is only for short term breeding purposes, he will be returned to a more suitable enclosure soon). Both animals were kept in a quiet, low lit area.


A night was chosen for breeding that was quiet (for lack of others in the house) and the pairing was done at about 10pm est. The lighting was not overly bright.

Actual Account:​

The M's cage was placed in the F's cage, lid removed, and carefully tipped on its side. The F's legs were brushed with a fan brush and the M's also with the same brush. In the "commotion", the M placed the tarsus of leg one on the F's substrate. The F was out of sight of the M behind the cave. A period of approximately 20 minutes passed with neither spider moving. The F at this point drummed loudly on the cage wall, and was answered by movement from the M towards her. The M walked a few steps, vibrated legs one and one high in the air, waited for a response from the F, and repeated. The F's response was a soft drumming inaudible to the human ear. (Keep in mind they are completely out of sight of each other!)


This process lasted for quite some time with the M finding his way to the F. Either the M or the F also stridulated very softly, most likely being the M. Besides drumming initially and answering with soft drumming, the F stayed perfectly still. The M eventually made his way to the top of the cave within sight of the female. This was answered by the F moving towards the M.


Once the F was on top of the cave, inaudible communication continued and the F began to vibrate her body excitedly and pulsate her chelicerae in a vertical movement. She also bent upward in typical breeding pose BEFORE the M made contact. The M eventually made contact and hooked the F into breeding pose. He then used his pedipalps to brush the F's reproductive organ. This continued for a while until insertion was made. Insertion was very, very fast and was followed by the M running in the opposite direction!
Once the drive to mate was completed, the M reverted to being very nervous and fast, abdomen in the air and setae kicked, while being placed back into his container.


Others attempts were made to breed this pair, but the F responded to the M's leg waving by bobbing vertically, unlike anything done during the mating process, and the M answered by heading in the opposite direction! The communication was clear at this point!


The F was not disturbed after the successful pairing and was fed heavily and continued to gain weight until the eggs were laid approximately one month later.

Personal Notes:​

I believe the success of this pairing had a lot to do with the quiet environment in which they bred. Because of the general nervousness of the species, too much stimuli such as vibrations from talking or walking may be enough to shut down any attempts. Also, a low lit environment - for the female especially - may be one key to success in breeding. It seems all we have to do is create the puzzle around them and they will fall into place!"




Hope this helps.
-Dave

 

[BrynWilliams]

always useful, thanks a bunch for taking the time to do that

 

[Dave]

No problem.

So, does anyone have answers to the original questions?
It would be much appreciated as I need it now.

Thanks

 

[Dave]

I guess no one has info to share?

 

[ShadowBlade]

Okay, I don't know what you are really after.. The reason its hard to find anything online about care of the eggsack is cause realistically, there isn't much to record of merit. I'd care for them just as any other eggsack.

If you plan to remove the eggsack from the mother, atleast let her hold onto it for a month, then incubate the babies as normal.

-Sean

 

[Dave]

Fair enough, Sean.
Thanks for at least replying.

 

[fatich]

Hey Dave i ve searched some german forums,but i couldn't find any good information,it wasnt told what should be done after female makes an eggsac.

 

[Dave]

Thank you for trying fatich. It is hard to find on this species.

 

[fatich]

Thank you for trying fatich. It is hard to find on this species.

i know a turkish guy who breeded this specie in Germany,but he doesnt appear in our Turkish tarantula forum anymore,if i see him,i ll send a message about this specie

 

[dianedfisher]

Mike "Troll" Dame has some info on the ATS forum if you care to search for it. He left the sac with the mother and updated the information as time progressed. I'm too lazy to search for it and post the link. It was in 2010. As I recall it was titled 'Not a strawberry".
Diane

 

[Dave]

Thanks again, fatich.
dianedfisher, I will def look for it. Thanks. These both help.

FYI on the sack - so far the mother is doing well with it. I'm guessing with this species as long as I don't disturb her she won't eat it. lol