Tarantula Eating While in Premolt

Ijk24

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So about a couple days ago a superworm burrowed into the substrate when I tried to feed my T and I look in her tank today and see that she dug it up and ate it but she's in premolt. Does this mean she's really not in premolt or was she just really hungry?
 

EulersK

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A few things here. Firstly, no, a spider can certainly be in premolt and still eat. You really shouldn't be offering food while it's in premolt, however. You especially shouldn't be feeding it meal worms while in premolt. Those things are actually larvae, not worms, and they have the full capability to kill a molting tarantula. The same can be said for crickets. If you insist on feeding meal worms, always crush the heads before dropping them in. Even if your spider isn't in premolt, the larvae can later emerge as a beetle and harm your tarantula.
 

EDED

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Why do you think she's in pre molt?
What's the species?
 

Ijk24

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A few things here. Firstly, no, a spider can certainly be in premolt and still eat. You really shouldn't be offering food while it's in premolt, however. You especially shouldn't be feeding it meal worms while in premolt. Those things are actually larvae, not worms, and they have the full capability to kill a molting tarantula. The same can be said for crickets. If you insist on feeding meal worms, always crush the heads before dropping them in. Even if your spider isn't in premolt, the larvae can later emerge as a beetle and harm your tarantula.
Okay thanks and I'll try the head crushing thing next time
 

Flexzone

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Generally T's refuse to eat when in premolt, But them still eating isn't unheard of. Like @EulersK mentioned no need to feed during premolt, Believe me your T notoriously genus grammostola won't starve. Just have a water-dish in there for if it's thirsty. Wait until she molts..then hardens to resume feeding.
 
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EDED

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Thank you for pic.
Never seen that sp
Very nice!

Yep she looks pre molt

I've never had my spiders eat dark abdomen. Very interesting

Try lateralis
They won't harm a T molting. Even a sling.
 

Ijk24

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Thank you for pic.
Never seen that sp
Very nice!

Yep she looks pre molt

I've never had my spiders eat dark abdomen. Very interesting

Try lateralis
They won't harm a T molting. Even a sling.
Okay thanks and have any idea of where I can get some?
 

truecreature

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There's someone in the classifieds here who's been advertising for them I think. If not there's Cape Cod Roaches on FaunaClassifieds but I don't know their rep
 

ErinM31

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Firstly, no, a spider can certainly be in premolt and still eat. You really shouldn't be offering food while it's in premolt, however.
I thought that fasting was one of the key features of being in premolt. Do you go by size and/or how dark their abdomen is (the latter doesn't apply to every species, such as Hapalopus sp. Columbia)? I thought that I should continue to offer food regularly to slings as long as they're eating it (so far I've only been offering pre-killed prey so no danger to them). I expect them to go into premolt once they're abdomen's visibly grown but I thought I should live it to the tarantula when to stop eating. What harm is there in offering food while a tarantula is in premolt (not counting something live left in with the tarantula which could harm it while molting)?

Today was the first time I found one of my Ephebopus murinus slings molted only a day or two after eating a (beheaded) mealworm. I THOUGHT the sling looked paler when I peeked in this morning before dashing off to work and when I came home, it was to find it's old molt at the curb, so to speak!
 
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cold blood

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@ErinM31, its not that its a harm, especially if its pre-killed...its just that doing so is basically pointless as the t has already gained all the food it requires to molt....if its a sling, it may eat in pre-molt, but its not likely.

You don't want to continue to feed a larger t in pre-molt for the same reasons, but with them they are putting less energy into growth, so all you are doing is adding excess weight to be carried over through the molt...leading to an obese t.

If you are not sure, pre-killed prey certainly isn't going to cause a problem as long as its removed in a few hours.
 

ErinM31

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@ErinM31, its not that its a harm, especially if its pre-killed...its just that doing so is basically pointless as the t has already gained all the food it requires to molt....if its a sling, it may eat in pre-molt, but its not likely.

You don't want to continue to feed a larger t in pre-molt for the same reasons, but with them they are putting less energy into growth, so all you are doing is adding excess weight to be carried over through the molt...leading to an obese t.

If you are not sure, pre-killed prey certainly isn't going to cause a problem as long as its removed in a few hours.
Good to know, thank you! :) I definitely feed my adult T's differently (watching their size rather than all they might care to eat), although it is hardly necessary with Euathlus sp. reds -- true to reputation, they are determined to eat less often than I feed them. :rolleyes: It is one of my Ephebopus murinus slings that is laser focused on becoming a full-size predator ASAP! Not only did it eat right up until molting, it wasted no time in making a well-webbed burrow from the starter I made in its enclosure while it's siblings took much longer to figure out what they were doing and now spend more energy on extraneous webbing (the last sling to build its burrow did so at the side of it's deli cup and then added a webbed tunnel nearly all the way around the circumference -- pretty funny when it was startled by something and ran the long way back to its burrow! :rofl: )
 
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Mauri

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Well I thought one of my slings is in pre-moult. So I didnt feed her for a few days then nothing so I found the smallest cricket I could and left it dead near her web. Since then it has been eaten.

At the moment am giving them both dead crickets and removing the next morning if not eaten. Will try again on Friday and see what happens. Am over the 2 weeks period since owning them and I know their first moult was around 4+ weeks ago. I'd say they are due a moult sooner than later.

But who knows. For a first time owner this is a constant source of stress.
 

ErinM31

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Well I thought one of my slings is in pre-moult. So I didnt feed her for a few days then nothing so I found the smallest cricket I could and left it dead near her web. Since then it has been eaten.

At the moment am giving them both dead crickets and removing the next morning if not eaten. Will try again on Friday and see what happens. Am over the 2 weeks period since owning them and I know their first moult was around 4+ weeks ago. I'd say they are due a moult sooner than later.

But who knows. For a first time owner this is a constant source of stress.
What species do you have? I really don't think you can go by any time table, but it does help alleviate worry if you know to expect a particular sling to be slow growing.

In my admittedly newbie, opinion, you have nothing at all to worry about -- your slings are eating and you're feeding pre-killed prey and removing it if uneaten which is exactly what you should be doing. When I first got my B. smithi sling, I thought they were in premolt because they didn't eat any of the live small crickets (probably weren't small enough but what I had), bean beetles, nor phoenix worms I offered it. It lost some weight before I switched to pre-killed crickets and mealworms; it ate and gained back the weight and then some before it stopped eating again, this timw with its abdomen large and dark and clearly in premolt. Still, it was another month before it molted. I was a bit anxious for it to molt (my Hapalopus sp. Columbia sling went into premolt around the same time but molted at least a week sooner) but know this is a slow growing species and it is doing just fine. :)
 

Mauri

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What species do you have? I really don't think you can go by any time table, but it does help alleviate worry if you know to expect a particular sling to be slow growing.

In my admittedly newbie, opinion, you have nothing at all to worry about -- your slings are eating and you're feeding pre-killed prey and removing it if uneaten which is exactly what you should be doing. When I first got my B. smithi sling, I thought they were in premolt because they didn't eat any of the live small crickets (probably weren't small enough but what I had), bean beetles, nor phoenix worms I offered it. It lost some weight before I switched to pre-killed crickets and mealworms; it ate and gained back the weight and then some before it stopped eating again, this timw with its abdomen large and dark and clearly in premolt. Still, it was another month before it molted. I was a bit anxious for it to molt (my Hapalopus sp. Columbia sling went into premolt around the same time but molted at least a week sooner) but know this is a slow growing species and it is doing just fine. :)
Yeah should have said they are avic sp amazonicas. And I was going on a guesstimate of around every 6 weeks (they were online around this time ago as 1st moult) but yeah from what I gather it's just as you say..

Reason being was the one got spooked several times and ran away...but perhaps this was the size of the cricket was trying to give him/her. Hard to tell with their abdomens because they are so hairy! They are def larger than the top part (forget the name) but I wouldnt say x2 larger perhaps x1.5.

So yeah am giving them 1 dead cricket now (a fair sized one) every 4 or so days. Well if it's not gone in the morning I'll remove it. (I stick it in around 6-7 pm while its still light).

p.s I now seem to be a cricket breeder...am sure I have more now than when I started!?! (and a rogue beetle..dont know what he's doing in there).
 

ErinM31

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Yeah should have said they are avic sp amazonicas. And I was going on a guesstimate of around every 6 weeks (they were online around this time ago as 1st moult) but yeah from what I gather it's just as you say..

Reason being was the one got spooked several times and ran away...but perhaps this was the size of the cricket was trying to give him/her. Hard to tell with their abdomens because they are so hairy! They are def larger than the top part (forget the name) but I wouldnt say x2 larger perhaps x1.5.

So yeah am giving them 1 dead cricket now (a fair sized one) every 4 or so days. Well if it's not gone in the morning I'll remove it. (I stick it in around 6-7 pm while its still light).
I know nothing about avics but assuming care should be similar to other slings, it sounds like you're doing things right although you might try feeding more often, if they will eat more often. It could be why they are taking a bit longer to molt again. I feed my slings a freshly killed cricket or mealworm (or portion of if the prey is big) two or three times a week, depending in part on how avidly they're eating, if they "seem hungry" to me, and admittedly, how busy I am -- nothing set or scientific, but so long as they're eating regularly (outside of premolt for those that choose to fast), growing, molting, and acting "normal" for each sling, I do not worry. For me, offering pre-killed prey eases my mind greatly as I don't have to worry about it hiding and me thinking it was eaten.

p.s I now seem to be a cricket breeder...am sure I have more now than when I started!?! (and a rogue beetle..dont know what he's doing in there).
That would take having adult crickets (you'll hear chirping) and place to lay eggs where they are kept moist enough to incubate and hatch and then you'll have teeny tiny crickets about which I've read take two months to mature (I feed tiny crickets to my dart frogs whenever I can get them). I don't keep my crickets on substrate but on a paper towel with a paper towel roll (both of which have to be changed regularly -- they are eating pooping machines) in a Kritter Keeper. And now you have a beetle... It sounds to me rather more like additional crickets and now a beetle are finding a way in, probably drawn to what your feeding your crickets. Where and in what are you keeping your crickets?
 

Mauri

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I know nothing about avics but assuming care should be similar to other slings, it sounds like you're doing things right although you might try feeding more often, if they will eat more often. It could be why they are taking a bit longer to molt again. I feed my slings a freshly killed cricket or mealworm (or portion of if the prey is big) two or three times a week, depending in part on how avidly they're eating, if they "seem hungry" to me, and admittedly, how busy I am -- nothing set or scientific, but so long as they're eating regularly (outside of premolt for those that choose to fast), growing, molting, and acting "normal" for each sling, I do not worry. For me, offering pre-killed prey eases my mind greatly as I don't have to worry about it hiding and me thinking it was eaten.



That would take having adult crickets (you'll hear chirping) and place to lay eggs where they are kept moist enough to incubate and hatch and then you'll have teeny tiny crickets about which I've read take two months to mature (I feed tiny crickets to my dart frogs whenever I can get them). I don't keep my crickets on substrate but on a paper towel with a paper towel roll (both of which have to be changed regularly -- they are eating pooping machines) in a Kritter Keeper. And now you have a beetle... It sounds to me rather more like additional crickets and now a beetle are finding a way in, probably drawn to what your feeding your crickets. Where and in what are you keeping your crickets?
In large tubs with holes nr the top. (way to high for them to crawl out). And kept in the bathroom and it's only one beetle so far so I think it came from the pet shop. I'll have words next week with the owner about this.

And there is no way additional crickets are getting in. I have seen some very small ones so perhaps they have bred. Am not 2 bothered because the longer they last is a bonus no?

Am feeding them on some bran and the odd slice of apple/orange/carrot. Changing their enclosure every three days. (and losing a few in the process which am putting on the bird table..by the way my ex worms were snaffled by a robin and 1 week later a baby robin was being fed by the mother/father. Quite early for Uk).

p.s UK and it's cold def no crickets outside nor I think do we ever get them. Grasshoppers yes...crickets not sure. Certainly the tubs havent been outside and the window completely shut. Only thing that did try and get in was a large daddy longlegs spider. We have quite a few in the house...actually they eat other spiders so these if spotted in my room are put outside.
 

ErinM31

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In large tubs with holes nr the top. (way to high for them to crawl out). And kept in the bathroom and it's only one beetle so far so I think it came from the pet shop. I'll have words next week with the owner about this.

And there is no way additional crickets are getting in. I have seen some very small ones so perhaps they have bred. Am not 2 bothered because the longer they last is a bonus no?

Am feeding them on some bran and the odd slice of apple/orange/carrot. Changing their enclosure every three days. (and losing a few in the process which am putting on the bird table..by the way my ex worms were snaffled by a robin and 1 week later a baby robin was being fed by the mother/father. Quite early for Uk).

p.s UK and it's cold def no crickets outside nor I think do we ever get them. Grasshoppers yes...crickets not sure. Certainly the tubs havent been outside and the window completely shut. Only thing that did try and get in was a large daddy longlegs spider. We have quite a few in the house...actually they eat other spiders so these if spotted in my room are put outside.
All sounds well then and yeah, sounds like they are breeding, which is definitely a bonus if you don't mind the chirping! I was imagining an enclosure sitting in a garage and here it is very warm out -- all sorts of bugs and life. The beetle may not be a bad thing -- now that you mention it, I have occassionally gotten larvae of some sort with my crickets, always the same type although I never found out what. Maybe they eat the dead ones? Regardless, I don't think it's a bad thing.
 

Mauri

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All sounds well then and yeah, sounds like they are breeding, which is definitely a bonus if you don't mind the chirping! I was imagining an enclosure sitting in a garage and here it is very warm out -- all sorts of bugs and life. The beetle may not be a bad thing -- now that you mention it, I have occassionally gotten larvae of some sort with my crickets, always the same type although I never found out what. Maybe they eat the dead ones? Regardless, I don't think it's a bad thing.
Oh they are silent ones...! I need a beetle expert. And yeah am cleaning out the dead crickets quite often or their moults?

Am avoiding any open windows...just in case something comes in. Which is a bit of a pain to keep the room warm and then not stuffy! (bathroom is ok because have tropical plants in there).

p.s a bit offtopic sorry OP. But turned into a nice chat about crickets!

p.p.s might get some of the chirpers for when have family/guests. Will give them a fright..plus the little ones will love it.
 

ErinM31

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Oh they are silent ones...! I need a beetle expert. And yeah am cleaning out the dead crickets quite often or their moults?

Am avoiding any open windows...just in case something comes in. Which is a bit of a pain to keep the room warm and then not stuffy! (bathroom is ok because have tropical plants in there).

p.s a bit offtopic sorry OP. But turned into a nice chat about crickets!

p.p.s might get some of the chirpers for when have family/guests. Will give them a fright..plus the little ones will love it.
Well that's odd... if you are indeed getting new crickets, perhaps the females had already mated before you bought them. Do you recognize adult crickets? They're the only ones with wings. The females have a long ovipositer on their rear and have smooth wings while the males of course lack an ovipositor and have ridged bumpy wings to chirp. (Forgive me if you already knew all that; better to make sure, I figure, and avoid unnecessary confusion.)

No reason to avoid opening windows! I didn't mean to make you paranoid about that. I didn't know where you kept the crickets (some people keep inverts outdoors, depending on where they live) and it was merely one hypothesis to explain multiple unexplained "additions" to the colony.

Hehe, some of the chirping is nice, other times quite too loud and shrill. It depends in part on the species and even more so on whether the male is calling for a mate or already has one close by and is serenading her. ;)
 
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